# Ontario 3D Crossbow speed rule - OAA Board decision



## Stash (Jun 1, 2002)

In a previous thread (OAA Rules Draft) there was some discussion about the speed rule for Crossbows in OAA shoots. I felt the 300 fps rule needed to be changed to something higher, so accordingly I wrote to Adam Thomas, OAA President, the following e-mail:



> Adam:
> 
> I would like the OAA to revise the projected rule regarding a maximum speed for 3D crossbows from 300 FPS to 350 FPS. As was mentioned on the ArcheryTalk thread, a speed limit of 300 for today's common production crossbows is unreasonable. I am presenting my request as per the guidelines from the OAA website, prior to Dec. 14:
> 
> ...



I just received his reply:



> Hi Stan,
> 
> After careful consideration the Board has decided to leave the speed
> restriction for crossbows at 300 fps. Your arguments were very convincing
> ...


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## Grey Eagle (May 23, 2002)

Despite what some might think. A good deal of thought, research, discussion, and debate went on within the board over this item.

At the end of the day some limit had to be set, and regardless of what that limit was, it wouldn't please everyone. Though I believe the decision is prudent and justified.

Cheers


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## Guest (Dec 23, 2007)

Kinda thought that might happen, IBO has a weight limit of 180lbs I think but we don't. It takes a lot of work to get a Stryker under 300 but it is possible.

growing pains are comming


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## Reed (Jun 18, 2002)

Don't know the Ont rules, but do you have a speed cap on compounds? Many setups generate higher speeds than the cap for the Xbow. 

Reed


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## ZarkSniper (Aug 12, 2003)

You took a 405 fps Stryker and got it to shoot under 300? Considering you have to shoot their half moon adapters in the back of the arrows, what arrows were you shooting? A 2219 won't do it, it just got an Exomax down to 304 with a 125gr point.




Sean McKenty said:


> Kinda thought that might happen, IBO has a weight limit of 180lbs I think but we don't. It takes a lot of work to get a Stryker under 300 but it is possible.
> 
> growing pains are comming


Maybe there was alot of thought put into the ruling...i don't fully inderstand it though. What is the safety difference in my shooting 330fps with my compound or a crossbow exactly?


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## H.M. Murdock (Nov 13, 2005)

ZarkSniper said:


> You took a 405 fps Stryker and got it to shoot under 300? Considering you have to shoot their half moon adapters in the back of the arrows, what arrows were you shooting? A 2219 won't do it, it just got an Exomax down to 304 with a 125gr point.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you have 1100 gr bolt the stryker will shoot 262 ft per sec. It will be hitting the target with 168 ft lbs. The arrow was a 2216 with a fiberglass fish arrow insert


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## Reed (Jun 18, 2002)

H.M. Murdock said:


> If you have 1100 gr bolt the stryker will shoot 262 ft per sec. It will be hitting the target with 168 ft lbs. The arrow was a 2216 with a fiberglass fish arrow insert



that could be the main concern. that is a lot on wump into the target, hate to see the damage that it could do.

Reed


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## Guest (Dec 23, 2007)

None really it just goes in alittle deeper, around 2 inch at 5yrds from the test we did on sight.


With several bows now claiming 350 IBO, I thuoght that Stans proposal was valid, but with the hopla of following IBO rules I suspected it might have a rough go at first.

Right now the FCA doesn't follow IBO to any degree of accuracy so I suspect that if the FCA decides to keep having differences between IBO rules and FCA 3-D rules the OAA might just bypass the FCA again. 

The OAA membership seems to want IBO rules for 3-D so I think eventually we will get them but we will try the FCA route first.


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## Stash (Jun 1, 2002)

I didn't really want to get into this, but the reasoning I'm hearing from the Board doesn't make sense to me. I don't personally shoot a crossbow, so please don't think I'm arguing on my own behalf. I do however sell lots and lots of crossbows in my line of work, and it is extremely difficult to convince the vast majority of the buyers of these crossbows to consider participation in the OAA when the bow I just sold them is illegal. Seems to me that the OAA should be including these people rather than excluding them.

I would also like to acknowledge that I am fully aware that the proper place for this discussion would have been at the AGM, but I was unable to attend to present my arguments. However, the opportunity to discuss the Rules draft was presented, so I used that opportunity to express my opinion.

So, that being said, can anyone from the Board please specifically address these questions:

1 - Why is a Bowtech 70# compound bow shooting a 350 grain arrow at 330 fps safer than an Excalibur 200# crossbow shooting a 350 grain arrow at 330 fps?

2 - What greater damage is done to a target by a crossbow shooting a 350 grain 22-series shaft at 330 fps compared to a compound shooting a 350 grain 25-series shaft (X-Cutter, for example) at 330 fps?

3 - How exactly will limiting crossbows to 300 fps in the OAA help convince the FCA to include them?


I would presume that the Board would have had some solid factual basis for establishing the limite of 300 for crossbows. Statistics on crossbow vs compound bow accidents at 3D shoots worldwide? Specific conditions set out by our insurance company? Data on penetration tests? A report on discussions between OAA Board members and FCA Board members where it was clear that the OAA had a leading role in setting an example for the other provincial associations to follow? 



> Despite what some might think. A good deal of thought, research, discussion, and debate went on within the board over this item.


I don't have trouble believing that, as Dennis said, a good deal of thought, discussion, and debate went on, but I would be interested in what exactly the "research" consisted of.


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## Reed (Jun 18, 2002)

Sean McKenty said:


> None really it just goes in alittle deeper, around 2 inch at 5yrds from the test we did on sight.
> 
> 
> With several bows now claiming 350 IBO, I thuoght that Stans proposal was valid, but with the hopla of following IBO rules I suspected it might have a rough go at first.
> ...


I expected that it would be more. 

Reed


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## Guest (Dec 24, 2007)

The stryker seemed to drop off really fast when loaded up. I only had my x-bow to compare with at the chrono. 

The stryker went 405 fps with a 425gr bolt
my Horton went 295 fps with the same bolt
a 110 fps difference

The stryker went 262 fps with the 1100gr bolt
my Horton went 237 fps with the 1100 gr bolt
a 25 fps difference.

certainly not what I expected to see.

with the 2008 prospects comming out from Parker/PSE/Horton with some real barn burnners I think Stans proposal will have to be revisited very soon


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