# A Lesson in Plungers



## Kickapoo (Jun 15, 2007)

From what I've seen, don't bother with the Beiter... a $35 Shibuya DX is one of the best values in plungers and is one of the most reliable ones out there today.


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

+1 for what Kickapoo said - love my Shibuya DX plunger and it's a lot less money than the Beiter. I have no doubt that the Beiter is superior in some fashion, but to me it's not worth the extra money for the small marginal improvement.


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## LittleJP (Nov 4, 2012)

Is it very solid? That is my primary concern. The one I have has to be periodically tightened.


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

Like the Beiter, the Shibuya plunger has a provision for tightening with a wrench. If I recall correctly the wrench is available separately.

The available metal tip on the DX plunger is more durable compared to the stock white Teflon tip.

If you plan to stay in this sport in a serious manner for any length of time it's likely you'll eventually get a Beiter plunger. It can be as simple as set and forget or it can accommodate any manner of tweaks you might want down the road. So pay now or pay later...


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## Acehero (Nov 2, 2007)

The Shibuya is excellent for the money and once set properly wont budge by itself.


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## Blades (Jun 25, 2012)

If you tighten any plunger down correctly, it should stay just fine. 

I have built into my assembly routine, a step where I check my rest and plunger. It helps to make sure there are no problems, and that way i know if I have a bad shot, it cant be blamed on the equipment. I would recommend you build it into your routine as well.


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## chrstphr (Nov 23, 2005)

I shoot the AAE master micro plunger. It is a good bit less than the Beiter ad works just as well. I think they are about $75.00. 


Chris


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## LittleJP (Nov 4, 2012)

>--gt--> said:


> Like the Beiter, the Shibuya plunger has a provision for tightening with a wrench. If I recall correctly the wrench is available separately.
> 
> The available metal tip on the DX plunger is more durable compared to the stock white Teflon tip.
> 
> If you plan to stay in this sport in a serious manner for any length of time it's likely you'll eventually get a Beiter plunger. It can be as simple as set and forget or it can accommodate any manner of tweaks you might want down the road. So pay now or pay later...


I believe I will shell out for a Beiter. I've been in archery for 10 years in various styles, and I believe I will stay in this style for quite some time.




Blades said:


> If you tighten any plunger down correctly, it should stay just fine.
> 
> I have built into my assembly routine, a step where I check my rest and plunger. It helps to make sure there are no problems, and that way i know if I have a bad shot, it cant be blamed on the equipment. I would recommend you build it into your routine as well.


I shall start doing so. This is not an experience I wish to repeat.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

>--gt--> said:


> Like the Beiter, the Shibuya plunger has a provision for tightening with a wrench. If I recall correctly the wrench is available separately.
> 
> The available metal tip on the DX plunger is more durable compared to the stock white Teflon tip.
> 
> If you plan to stay in this sport in a serious manner for any length of time it's likely you'll eventually get a Beiter plunger. It can be as simple as set and forget or it can accommodate any manner of tweaks you might want down the road. So pay now or pay later...


Excellent advice. 

Only two plungers I recommend are the DX or Beiter. I've been enjoying the same two Beiter plungers since 2004, without a single issue. Besides the adjustability and durability, the Beiters come with a ton of extra supplies and wrenches. Like a good sight, they are a "one and done" purchase for this sport.

John


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## lksseven (Mar 21, 2010)

Beiter.


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## Jim C (Oct 15, 2002)

all three of us use beiters. I have spent a lot buying a bunch of them but they have never failed us. They are essential gear for Liz who shoots bare bow. I have owned just about everything else-stuff I don't use goes on the many bows my students are using. Shibuyas are good but not as durable as say the cavalier. the knock against the AAE/Cavalier is its hard to really crank it down. Those do come loose. The expensive AAE micro click is overly large IMHO. Some of the spigarelli buttons are really good. I like the WW top of the line as well. Cartels are a mixed bag. THe copy of the beiter wasn't bad. Others break easily. The WW/chinese made SFs we have had good luck with

I have beiters on all my bows though. Fortunately I can afford the best but in the long run its cheaper. Its like sure loc or shibuya sights. I have a bunch of 10-13 year old surelocs. Still going strong


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

> Cartels are a mixed bag. THe copy of the beiter wasn't bad


I had two Cartel copies of the Beiters on my bows at the '04 trials, so yea, I'd say they aren't bad - if you can find them. Take all the Beiter guts, but are softer aluminum and not made to the same spec's. My wife's bow is wearing one right now. I'm not willing to spend more than $25 on a plunger for a bow that gets shot less than 50 times/week.

John


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## Blades (Jun 25, 2012)

The cartel I had broke after 3 months.... but then again it was only $9. 

I use the AAE Master plunger. Not a click one, but is solid and mine stays locked down nicely.


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## DK Lieu (Apr 6, 2011)

Most of our club members use either the Shibuya DX or the Beiter (if they have the money). I personally like and use the Shibuya DX, but I don't fiddle with my plunger adjustments much. I might adjust my plunger once every several months, when I am tuning. I usually just set it and forget it. There are two pieces of equipment that I would not recommend. One is the Cartel Super Plunger: http://www.lancasterarchery.com/cartel-super-cushion-plunger.html . We bought around a dozen of these for the club a couple of years ago. It's no longer in production, but there might be a few odd ones popping up on the used market. Keep away from it. The barrel is made of aluminum, and not good aluminum at that. The threads are poorly machined and the barrel is thin-walled. When we tried to install them on our bows, they got jammed halfway into the plunger holes. Then, being aluminum threads in both the plunger and the bow (high coefficient of friction, poor wear properties, easily deformed), we had a difficult time getting them back out. We could actually see the plunger barrel deform as we torqued it. We still have those plungers in our stock, because we didn't want to sell them and give someone else the same problems. The second one to avoid is the W&W/SF Premium Plunger: http://www.lancasterarchery.com/w-w-sebastian-flute-premium-cushion-plunger.html . On most plungers, the button that makes contact with the arrow is made of plastic. On the W&W/SF Premium, the button is made of coated aluminum. If the coating remains intact, the performance is fine. But once the coating wears off, the aluminum is exposed. Un-lubricated aluminum has a very high coefficient of friction. When placed in contact with another aluminum surface, such as an aluminum arrow, the coefficient of friction is greater than one, and the wear properties are very poor. Eventually, the button will be worn down, exposing even more aluminum, and the aluminum arrows will be very badly scored. This happened to a couple of our club members before we discovered it. The W&W/SF Premium button comes free with the W&W/SF Forged Plus riser which is a popular riser in out club: http://www.lancasterarchery.com/w-w-sebastian-flute-forged-plus-25-recurve-riser.html . It's tempting to just use it because it came free. We now recommend that this plunger be replaced as soon as possible.


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## agillator (Sep 11, 2011)

Regarding the OP's problem, I don't know of any plunger easier to accidentally change the tension on than the Beiter. Its easy changeability is also its virtue, particularly in the context of tuning. If you know your plunger setting it is easy to recover it since the Beiter has a scale printed on its barrel. 

For a plunger less likely to be accidentally changed you are better off with the Shibuya DX or other robust sensibly tipped plunger that requires a wrench for reset.

We have and use both.


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## LittleJP (Nov 4, 2012)

I've actually found that I have a Shibuya DX lying around in my case. I'll stick it onto my indoor setup and use the Bieter for my outdoors. I tend to shoot many distances recreationally, and writing down plunger settings is a breeze compared to the many many distance markings I have noted.

Thanks for all the help.


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

agillator said:


> Regarding the OP's problem, I don't know of any plunger easier to accidentally change the tension on than the Beiter.
> 
> For a plunger less likely to be accidentally changed you are better off with the Shibuya DX or other robust sensibly tipped plunger that requires a wrench for reset.


Perhaps you are unaware of the function of this feature on the Beiter plunger? (Give it a quarter turn and see what happens)


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## azl (Mar 4, 2012)

>--gt--> said:


> Perhaps you are unaware of the function of this feature on the Beiter plunger? (Give it a quarter turn and see what happens)


How does one get a gold plated plunger with their name engraved on it?


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## agillator (Sep 11, 2011)

>--gt--> said:


> Perhaps you are unaware of the function of this feature on the Beiter plunger? (Give it a quarter turn and see what happens)


Point taken, but I generally don't lock mine down for a couple of reasons other than ignorance. The obvious one is that I don't have to pull out a wrench to adjust it. The slightly less obvious one is that if it is knocked while on the riser I would rather lose (and later recover) the setting than have the barrel torqued in a direction other than the plunger axis. I'm no ballerina. But then I'm not competing with anyone other than myself at present either.


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## Seattlepop (Dec 8, 2003)

agillator said:


> Regarding the OP's problem, I don't know of any plunger easier to *accidentally change the tension on than the Beiter.* Its easy changeability is also its virtue, particularly in the context of tuning. If you know your plunger setting it is easy to recover it since the Beiter has a scale printed on its barrel.
> 
> For a plunger less likely to be accidentally changed you are better off with the Shibuya DX or other robust sensibly tipped plunger that requires a wrench for reset.
> 
> We have and use both.


You must be joking. The Beiter has a lock down screw and the screw has a lock down nut. Literally impossible for it to "accidentally change". Plus, the lock down screw can be set so the tension adjustment clicks as you turn the barrel. In 10 years I have never had one slip. 










I owned two DX's and as plunger buttons they work fine, but I sold them after I bought Beiters. If, as noted, you spend any time tuning, there is no comparison in either ease of use or durability and precision.








Let's compare: Look at the DX and you will see two tiny screws in the body and an allen screw at the end. The front screw locks down the barrel which rotates as one of two tension adjustments. Loosen the screw, turn the barrel, tighten screw. If you don’t tighten the tiny screw it will work its way out and be lost forever in the grass. The second spring tension adjustment is the end allen screw. To adjust it you have to loosen the rear tiny screw, adjust the allen screw, tighten the tiny lock down screw. I suppose the barrel adjustment may be for large adjustments and the allen screw smaller adjustments, but why? And how much difference does either make? Can you remember how much you turned the barrel and then the allen screw and in what direction several test ends ago? 

There are no scales or gauges to tell you what your setting is or how much you turned it up or down. Keeping track over an afternoon of tuning is uh, challenging. To know what your setting is you would have to bottom out the barrel and then count rotations out. Same with the allen screw. Wait, how many turns was that? Was that a 1/8 turn up or down last time...? etc. 








The Beiter has two scales for tracking and noting your settings. You get three springs of varying tension and replacement plunger buttons, not that you will likely need one. The barrel rotates and provides consistent, even tension. But by far the best feature for tuning is that you can set the lock screw so the barrel turns with very solid clicks and it will never move from where you put it, and then lock the screw with the lock nut. No tiny little screws to mess with using a tiny allen wrench that I have difficulty holding on to.

The Beiter does have one shortfall, imho, and that is the change in diameter between the barrel threaded section and the bow insert threads. In certain applications, you need to use one of two collars, one wider than the other. I forget which one comes stock and which has to be purchased separately? Do you get both now? 

FWIW, with the middle spring and the gauge set on 5, the Beiter takes around 600 grams before the button begins to budge. Five rotations out (weaker) it takes around 250 grams, or 70 grams per rotation. Rough numbers from just pushing down on an Ohaus triple beam scale. I usually set it around 450 grams and tune to it, then fine tune. 

BeiterBeiterBeiter.... 

Edited for: gold engraved - how cool is that!


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

azl said:


> How does one get a gold plated plunger with their name engraved on it?


I'm not sure, but I was certainly deeply honored to receive it personally from Werner.


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## atjurhs (Oct 19, 2011)

I really like my AAE Gold Micro Plunger, it's easy to adjust, comes with several springs, and has rock solid quality construction. It's always maintained the same springiness, and after one wrapping of teflon tape around the threads it's never come loose in the riser. I'll definitely by another one.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

azl said:


> How does one get a gold plated plunger with their name engraved on it?


Thankfully, for the rest of us, the standard, non-engraved Beiter still works just as good. 

George, you are truly spoiled. LOL!


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## azl (Mar 4, 2012)

limbwalker said:


> Thankfully, for the rest of us, the standard, non-engraved Beiter still works just as good.


Yes, but the standard, non-engraved Beiter doesn't look as good. One piece of advice I will always follow is if you can't shoot good, at least look good. Looking good is a lot easier for me than shooting good.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Can't argue with that!

Won't be long and I'll be looking for some shiny bling to distract onlookers as well. 

John


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## vtnam007 (Jul 25, 2012)

Take a look at the Arco Spigarelli Secure button 2 plunger. I have both the first and second generation and find them no different. I also have a beiter plunger. Honestly, I find the arco better in tuning and build quality over the beiter. If you remove the red button, its pretty much impossible to turn. There are no tools required for adjusting. Beiter has alot of tips and extras that is definitely a plus but it is alot more expensive than the arco.

http://www.lancasterarchery.com/spigarelli-secur-button.html


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## elarock (Nov 15, 2012)

^ Spigarelli Securbutton2 is only $75 (shipped) from Alternternative. 
http://alternativess.com/cgi-bin/htmlos.cgi/004777.5.7838930265219815559


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

vtnam007 said:


> Take a look at the Arco Spigarelli Secure button 2 plunger. I have both the first and second generation and find them no different. I also have a beiter plunger. Honestly, I find the arco better in tuning and build quality over the beiter. If you remove the red button, its pretty much impossible to turn. There are no tools required for adjusting. Beiter has alot of tips and extras that is definitely a plus but it is alot more expensive than the arco.
> 
> http://www.lancasterarchery.com/spigarelli-secur-button.html


I personally prefer the Spig to the Beiter for barebow use. The scale is much easier to read and there is really no way you can bump it. I just wish they had better ends for the button, not sold on the material of the standard ones.

-Grant


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## Shellylhf (Aug 4, 2012)

You may save some money with a Decut plunger, it's a copy of beiter for 1/4 the price of Beiter, Decut use the same spare parts as Beiter,i have used it for several months now and still going strong. It's china made but the quality is good.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

just go for the beiter...you won't regret it!


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## TER (Jul 5, 2003)

From 1999 to 2003 I use a Shibuya DX. It was just fine, great value for the very low price. Then I got a Beiter. It is the best and I won't go back. Even (especially) when I'm tuning, I want to spent as much of my precious range time as possible shooting. With the Beiter there is very little messing around with allen keys. That saves time, more time for shooting. Every adjustment on the Shibuya DX requires messing with allen keys. The Shibuya DX is fantastic value for the money; it should cost much more. But the Beiter is just the best. Copies of the Beiter are junk. Don't waste your time and money on junk, unless money is nothing to you.


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## TwilightSea (Apr 16, 2012)

I currently have the Shibuya plunger, but I wonder if the springs they gave me are still too stiff for my setup. Currently have #22 limbs, so I'm really not sure if I should use their lightest spring and try to loosen it up, or use a ball-point pen spring, if it's not too long. Suggestions?


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## lksseven (Mar 21, 2010)

Regarding the Decut I used for several months 3 years ago: poor quality, and tedious to adjust. I punted it.

The Beiter is exquisite in its design and execution.


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## vtnam007 (Jul 25, 2012)

Twilightsea,

Use the lightest spring for that poundage. I've tuned another student's bow and that spring works perfect. Just turn the hex thread that is on the back all the way out if you find it still stiff.

Grant,

I too have the same complaint with the spig plungers. I also do not like the tip, but it is still a great plunger.


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## TwilightSea (Apr 16, 2012)

Are you referring to the springs it comes in VT, or a ballpoint pen spring?

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


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## vtnam007 (Jul 25, 2012)

The lightest spring in the package with the DX plunger.


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## gma (Aug 22, 2012)

The Shibuya is suuuuuuper smoooooooth. Even smoother that the Beiter. But I agree, the tool-less adjustability, graduation, and included accessories with the Beiter make it superior. It's nice to know that if things ever change, I can get the plunger back to 7.4 - the same position, every time, quickly, accurately, no doubt in my mind.


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## TwilightSea (Apr 16, 2012)

Aha... maybe one day I will upgrade to a Beiter plunger..... one day...

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


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