# please lord



## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

well my bro calls me and ask me if i wanted to go to arizona with him. but i alredy made plans so i said no.
well he just called me and he arrowed a GIANT muley he said about a 180.
im not going to say how far it was, but it was aways. but he got a complete pass through and the arrow is drenched in blood and he followed the trail for 5 yards and blood EVERYWERE. so he backed out so he dosent push him.
and he is going to follow the trail in the morning.
dangit if i could drive i would be gone right now but i cant so i have to wait for the call in the morning


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## joelpresmyk8 (Jan 21, 2010)

nice! make sure to pst pics


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## buglebuster (Feb 18, 2009)

Neat! Well mornings come and gone, what news came with the phone call?


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

well i got the phone call when i came out of church and my brother said no bueno.
he tracked the deer for 250 yards and its gushing blood and he said the wierdest thing the blood just stoped like he said he had a puddle and then no blood.
i was like d#[email protected] are u serious he was like ya. and he was still doing circles trying to find blood nothing.
well i guess it happens to everybody. and if it hasent its either u dont hunt or u dont shoot.
so im sorry for getting u guys all excited for nothing 
but he is staying positive and still going at it.
heres one 2 u bro:darkbeer:


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

well that sucks...sounds like it clogged up after the shot......did he tell you how far the shot was?? Not to bash or anything but i remember a thread you had made before and talking about shooting at deer along ways away, Maybe he will learn from this experience.......Tell him good luck though!!! Hopefully he gets another shot at a buck this season!!


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## BowBoy78 (Aug 17, 2009)

dad shot a little buck this year and he was right below his stand perfect shot throught the heart arrow was stuck below him. the buck ran right under my stand and died. when dad came over to my stand when the night was over we fliped him over and he had a big fat plug pluging the exit. we tracked it back to the stand and the only blood we found was within a foot of the arrow


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## Ignition kid (Oct 7, 2008)

That's too bad, it happend to every bowhunter that actually shoots at one. for example, this weekend (Friday evening) I shot a hog with my bow quartering away and I got a little excited since i hadn't drawn back on a hog since September 26th, 2009 (opening morning) and I shot it too low, my entrance was low and since i was in a treestand I knew my exit was really low, we followed the blood trail for about 100 yards through breyers and stuff and then we lost blood like that! I was really mad at myselk for that but you know what it happens to every bowhunter that has shot an animal and if it hasn't happened it will, and the other thing that made me feel better is that my arrow went clean through him so I got it back in one piece.


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

well talked to him again and he seen some good bucks no shots.
he comes home tommarow morning. and yes i know the distance and i perfer not to post it cause out west 70 to 80 yard shots are very comman and most people flip out saying that un ethicall but when u shoot that every day you become very comfotable shooting that far. i will say it was over 80 yards


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

if he can make the shot all power to him, but at 80+yds the KE loss can be a bit.


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

N7709K said:


> if he can make the shot all power to him, but at 80+yds the KE loss can be a bit.


i agree with the ke but like i said it still blew right threw the deer.
and but i go 3/4 way on softball at 80.
by the way his bow shoots 333 so he has plenty of speed.
so at 333 i think he has plenty of ke.


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

Probably about 80ft/lbs. The deer is dead, just how far from the last blood is the question


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## buglebuster (Feb 18, 2009)

Something else to consider...i'm not trying to bash your brother, but an arrow can get super bloody and give a good trail through a leg shot or somthing. And a pass-through at that range is more likely if so. But its just a possibility.


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

buglebuster said:


> Something else to consider...i'm not trying to bash your brother, but an arrow can get super bloody and give a good trail through a leg shot or somthing. And a pass-through at that range is more likely if so. But its just a possibility.


but he saw the arrow. and said it looked like a good hit.
and if he did hit it in the leg the deer would have dropped for just a a couple of seconds and he could have got another arrow into it.


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

cali hunter said:


> but he saw the arrow. and said it looked like a good hit.
> and if he did hit it in the leg the deer would have dropped for just a a couple of seconds and he could have got another arrow into it.


A couple things to remember also cali hunter......At range's pushing over 80 yards like you had said, a deer hit in the leg will never drop, will simply just run like a 3 legged deer, even at 20 yards it wont drop......And trying to shoot a squirming deer at 100 yards with a bow sounds tricky to me!!!IMO.......I would think if your brother said it looked like a good shot it is dead somewhere.....tell him to start carrying hydrogen-peroxide with him, anything that looks like blood at all just dump some on it and it will start fizzing a whole bunch.....I have found a few big game animals useing this tecnique, anyways my .02


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

muzzyhunter17 said:


> A couple things to remember also cali hunter......At range's pushing over 80 yards like you had said, a deer hit in the leg will never drop, will simply just run like a 3 legged deer, even at 20 yards it wont drop......And trying to shoot a squirming deer at 100 yards with a bow sounds tricky to me!!!IMO.......I would think if your brother said it looked like a good shot it is dead somewhere.....tell him to start carrying hydrogen-peroxide with him, anything that looks like blood at all just dump some on it and it will start fizzing a whole bunch.....I have found a few big game animals useing this tecnique, anyways my .02


The last deer I shot was hit in the leg. My dad and I tracked it for over 5miles and it left a steady bloodtrail til we stopped for the night. The deer went 100yds and bedded right away. If they are hit in a major artery or vein, they can't run very long before they have to stop.


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

N7709K said:


> The last deer I shot was hit in the leg. My dad and I tracked it for over 5miles and it left a steady bloodtrail til we stopped for the night. The deer went 100yds and bedded right away. If they are hit in a major artery or vein, they can't run very long before they have to stop.


Yea I meant drop in the spot.....You can kill them that way, But that's not what I meant....and if it was hit in a artery they usually go less than 200 yards as they bleed out quick.


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

muzzyhunter17 said:


> Yea I meant drop in the spot.....You can kill them that way, But that's not what I meant....and if it was hit in a artery they usually go less than 200 yards as they bleed out quick.


They don't drop. The one that I hit was on a dead out run and barely slowed down.

If you hit the should or spine they drop, but not in the leg


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## buglebuster (Feb 18, 2009)

N7709K said:


> They don't drop. The one that I hit was on a dead out run and barely slowed down.
> 
> If you hit the should or spine they drop, but not in the leg


In my experiences, Id have to agree with you, I shot an elk through the leg, and it hiked a non-stop 3-mile loop and ended up in the same exact spot with his cows.


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

ok well i went to my bros house today. and i saw the arrow my self and after it got all dried up and there is still a ton of blood. and he told me that the blood trail was ridiculous there was not just specks there was puddles. he said he got to a spot where you could tell he was standing cause the puddle was ginourmous and he said he walked 3 yards from that puddle and deer tracks were there. so those does he was with meet back up with him and those does wont let him bed expessually if she was hot. and from that spot there was no more blood from there on. so im 99.99% positive those does meet back up with him and he didnt get to bed down to die.


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

N7709K said:


> They don't drop. The one that I hit was on a dead out run and barely slowed down.
> 
> If you hit the should or spine they drop, but not in the leg


Yes this is what I have been saying, for the last 3 post's haha....He had said if it was shot in the leg it would drop so he could shoot it again......I said they will never drop with a leg shot......


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## HuntLions_94 (Feb 20, 2008)

cali hunter said:


> ok well i went to my bros house today. and i saw the arrow my self and after it got all dried up and there is still a ton of blood. and he told me that the blood trail was ridiculous there was not just specks there was puddles. he said he got to a spot where you could tell he was standing cause the puddle was ginourmous and he said he walked 3 yards from that puddle and deer tracks were there. so those does he was with meet back up with him and those does wont let him bed expessually if she was hot. and from that spot there was no more blood from there on. so im 99.99% positive those does meet back up with him and he didnt get to bed down to die.


Don't ever give up just cuz blood trail stops, to many people do that and in AZ and we dont have the deer population to be doing that. I know people that have shot deer and they dont bleed at all. What we do is back out get on a high point and glass, try to glass the buck up if you can't do that just walk around and around miles around. I mean the bucks dead its not like the whole in him just healed up and he lived.


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

HuntLions_94 said:


> Don't ever give up just cuz blood trail stops, to many people do that and in AZ and we dont have the deer population to be doing that. I know people that have shot deer and they dont bleed at all. What we do is back out get on a high point and glass, try to glass the buck up if you can't do that just walk around and around miles around. I mean the bucks dead its not like the whole in him just healed up and he lived.


he didnt give up. he searched all of sunday, i literally mean all of sunday.
and where he was hunting there was no high spot to glass. and he searched for crow and coyotes there was nothing.
and for all of you who say if you shoot an animal in the leg it wont drop i have to disagree.i shot a pig in the right front leg and he dropped in his TRACKS. and he tried to get up and it couldnt so i was able to get another arrow into him and made a perfect heart shot. you guys are all saying that the animal that you guys shot in the leg didnt drop. ok i understand. but just cause your animal dosent drop that dosent mean every animal is like that. so you guys have to keep that in mind also


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

Where in the leg?

All the ones that I have seen shot in the leg and shoulder have never dropped, even heart shot ones, they all have ran


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

N7709K said:


> Where in the leg?
> 
> All the ones that I have seen shot in the leg and shoulder have never dropped, even heart shot ones, they all have ran


right in the joint.where the part of the humerous and ulna would meet


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

N7709K said:


> Where in the leg?
> 
> All the ones that I have seen shot in the leg and shoulder have never dropped, even heart shot ones, they all have ran


right in the joint. were the humerous and ulna would meet


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

cali hunter said:


> right in the joint. were the humerous and ulna would meet


I really hope you are just kidding, unless you go through both legs and it cant move because both legs are broken, Maybe the pig you shot had other problem's.....Well animals here anyways will never drop with a leg shot......Its just like a deer getting hit by a car and breaking a leg, will run off until it dies from internal injuries.......But once again its IMO


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## HuntLions_94 (Feb 20, 2008)

cali hunter said:


> he didnt give up. he searched all of sunday, i literally mean all of sunday.
> and where he was hunting there was no high spot to glass. and he searched for crow and coyotes there was nothing.
> and for all of you who say if you shoot an animal in the leg it wont drop i have to disagree.i shot a pig in the right front leg and he dropped in his TRACKS. and he tried to get up and it couldnt so i was able to get another arrow into him and made a perfect heart shot. you guys are all saying that the animal that you guys shot in the leg didnt drop. ok i understand. but just cause your animal dosent drop that dosent mean every animal is like that. so you guys have to keep that in mind also


Ok thanks for clearing that up for me. But you gotta understand we don't have deer in AZ like they have back east and places. I have seen people shoot at animals with bows and rifles, "oh didn't hit it" so they just walk away. When your shooting 500+ yards with a rifle you need to go at least LOOK for blood lol. When I shot my elk I hit it 6 out of 8 times at 550 yards with a 257 weatherby mag. 4 out of 6 where all in the goodie box the others where in the neck and butt. When I shot my deer in montana It blew a hole in it that I could fit my fist through, and I gotta big fist. Just wanted to put that out there that elk are tough animals.


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

HuntLions_94 said:


> Ok thanks for clearing that up for me. But you gotta understand we don't have deer in AZ like they have back east and places. I have seen people shoot at animals with bows and rifles, "oh didn't hit it" so they just walk away. When your shooting 500+ yards with a rifle you need to go at least LOOK for blood lol. When I shot my elk I hit it 6 out of 8 times at 550 yards with a 257 weatherby mag. 4 out of 6 where all in the goodie box the others where in the neck and butt. When I shot my deer in montana It blew a hole in it that I could fit my fist through, and I gotta big fist. Just wanted to put that out there that elk are tough animals.


Now im sure I am going to look like a basher........anyways what are you doing shooting an elk with a .257 caliber at 550 yards????....Elk are tough animals like you said and the .257 is made for Range not penatration....It doesent suprise me that you had to shoot it 6 times but If it was me I woulden't shoot past 200 yards on a elk with that caliber.....I guess if you killed it though more power to you.


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

HuntLions_94 said:


> Don't ever give up just cuz blood trail stops, to many people do that and in AZ and we dont have the deer population to be doing that. I know people that have shot deer and they dont bleed at all. What we do is back out get on a high point and glass, try to glass the buck up if you can't do that just walk around and around miles around. I mean the bucks dead its not like the whole in him just healed up and he lived.


Unless maybe it wasen't a Fatal hit.:wink:


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

HuntLions_94 said:


> Ok thanks for clearing that up for me. But you gotta understand we don't have deer in AZ like they have back east and places. I have seen people shoot at animals with bows and rifles, "oh didn't hit it" so they just walk away. When your shooting 500+ yards with a rifle you need to go at least LOOK for blood lol. When I shot my elk I hit it 6 out of 8 times at 550 yards with a 257 weatherby mag. 4 out of 6 where all in the goodie box the others where in the neck and butt. When I shot my deer in montana It blew a hole in it that I could fit my fist through, and I gotta big fist. Just wanted to put that out there that elk are tough animals.


i agree there are not no where near as many deer in the west as there is out east. ya i have seen guys shoot forkies and leave them cause they wanted something bigger. so they just shot it for fun. that is ridiculous there will be no deer left for the next generation if people do this crap. and congrats on the elk. and yes 550 yards is pushing it for some people. but if you practice all the time it is not. people say 80 yards is pushing for archery but i shoot 80 yards everyday and i personally think its easy. so for you guys who say that is unethicall keep it to your self, just because you think it is to far, that dosent mean we think it is to far. we all have different shooting abilites nobody is the same. so you cant judge on peoples shots just by your shooting ability.
sorry for the rambling but how big was your elk


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## HuntLions_94 (Feb 20, 2008)

muzzyhunter17 said:


> Now im sure I am going to look like a basher........anyways what are you doing shooting an elk with a .257 caliber at 550 yards????....Elk are tough animals like you said and the .257 is made for Range not penatration....It doesent suprise me that you had to shoot it 6 times but If it was me I woulden't shoot past 200 yards on a elk with that caliber.....I guess if you killed it though more power to you.


Did you miss the part about my muley in montana that I shot running at 350 yards and the exit hole was the size of my fist? I took pics of my fist in the exit hole if I need to post them I will. They are crappy and taken with my phone. Anyway back to the .257 cal is to small to elk hunt with. Not trying to come off like a jerk but here goes nothing. You must have no experience with the .257 WEATHERBY round. It is moving the bullet 3500-3700 FPS it is a great round I will also post pics of how big the case is. As far as the range goes I can hit a chest sized plate at 811 yards with a .308.


From left the right (.243, .308, .257 Weatherby mag, .30-378 Weatherby mag)











.243 is smaller one .257 Weatherby is bigger one with silver primer.









My bull, he is a nice 6x6 He had a point coming out between his first and second that was broke or he would be a 7x6.


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

cali hunter said:


> i agree there are not no where near as many deer in the west as there is out east. ya i have seen guys shoot forkies and leave them cause they wanted something bigger. so they just shot it for fun. that is ridiculous there will be no deer left for the next generation if people do this crap. and congrats on the elk. and yes 550 yards is pushing it for some people. but if you practice all the time it is not. people say 80 yards is pushing for archery but i shoot 80 yards everyday and i personally think its easy. so for you guys who say that is unethicall keep it to your self, just because you think it is to far, that dosent mean we think it is to far. we all have different shooting abilites nobody is the same. so you cant judge on peoples shots just by your shooting ability.
> sorry for the rambling but how big was your elk


Lets just say we both have a LOT of years to live cali hunter, We dont know much about archery at all, heak on the main forum you have 30-70 year old guys argueing about long shots and such......I would say I am not good at that range unless I have been shooting that far for years and years..........or wounded animals will start to appear more and more often....


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

*hmm*



HuntLions_94 said:


> Did you miss the part about my muley in montana that I shot running at 350 yards and the exit hole was the size of my fist? I took pics of my fist in the exit hole if I need to post them I will. They are crappy and taken with my phone. Anyway back to the .257 cal is to small to elk hunt with. Not trying to come off like a jerk but here goes nothing. You must have no experience with the .257 WEATHERBY round. It is moving the bullet 3500-3700 FPS it is a great round I will also post pics of how big the case is. As far as the range goes I can hit a chest sized plate at 811 yards with a .308.
> 
> 
> From left the right (.243, .308, .257 Weatherby mag, .30-378 Weatherby mag)
> ...



normally people would not advise a .25 for elk or especially moose. However, that 257 weatherby is one hell of a screamer. It packs more energy than a 7mm remington magnum, so who is to say what exact caliber, be it 30, 28, 25, or what, as long as you get your projectile into the vitals and have got plenty of energy left to do serious damage.......Looking at the picture I see why you are shooting a low caliber rifle.......

In that aspect, a light weight bullet in combination with the 257 weatherby will work extremely poorly, while a 257 weatherby with a heavy-for-caliber will certainly give good results.
............You would be suprised at how much I know about Rifle's....and Using that caliber at THAT RANGE is just rediculous IMO........And yes I guess I missed you shooting a running muley at 350 yards........maybe you ca be a pro. shooter......Send a letter and video to Midway USA and we will see....


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

HuntLions_94 said:


> Did you miss the part about my muley in montana that I shot running at 350 yards and the exit hole was the size of my fist? I took pics of my fist in the exit hole if I need to post them I will. They are crappy and taken with my phone. Anyway back to the .257 cal is to small to elk hunt with. Not trying to come off like a jerk but here goes nothing. You must have no experience with the .257 WEATHERBY round. It is moving the bullet 3500-3700 FPS it is a great round I will also post pics of how big the case is. As far as the range goes I can hit a chest sized plate at 811 yards with a .308.
> 
> 
> From left the right (.243, .308, .257 Weatherby mag, .30-378 Weatherby mag)
> ...





Yes that is true inless you are usening the 115 grain head that is made for big game.....It shoots about 3300 FPS...or you have the 85 grain which is made for predator's shooting at 3800 FPS.........eitherway...


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## x-force hunter (Apr 10, 2009)

Maybe there was a reason that you had to hit 6 times?


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## buglebuster (Feb 18, 2009)

Hutlions 94, that sure is a powerful bow you shoot! :tongue:


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## HuntLions_94 (Feb 20, 2008)

All go back to snipershide.com :wink:


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

HuntLions_94 said:


> All go back to snipershide.com :wink:


I looked and im not sure what you want me to see there?


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

I personally wouldn't hunt big game with anything smaller than a 270. I prefer a 30cal though. 

There is just too much of the option of wounding the animal with a small projectile. I'm not saying that you need to use a large caliber but, IMO, a larger cal in needed for large game.

For those that will say the results speak for themselves, I have a very dear friend that shot and killed a moose with a pellet gun. Just because it works, doesn't mean it is what you should use


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

N7709K said:


> I personally wouldn't hunt big game with anything smaller than a 270. I prefer a 30cal though.
> 
> There is just too much of the option of wounding the animal with a small projectile. I'm not saying that you need to use a large caliber but, IMO, a larger cal in needed for large game.
> 
> For those that will say the results speak for themselves, I have a very dear friend that shot and killed a moose with a pellet gun. Just because it works, doesn't mean it is what you should use


i agree but i know a guy who has shot and killed giant mule deer with a 223. with one shot. killing an animal all has to do with shot placement, any caliber can kill an animal but the shot placement is everything. and somebody shooting a moose with a pellet gun thats crazy cool. i have to say congrats on that one. were did he shoot it at


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

He managed to put a pellet through the eye and into the brain


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## joelpresmyk8 (Jan 21, 2010)

HuntLions_94 said:


> Ok thanks for clearing that up for me. But you gotta understand we don't have deer in AZ like they have back east and places. I have seen people shoot at animals with bows and rifles, "oh didn't hit it" so they just walk away. When your shooting 500+ yards with a rifle you need to go at least LOOK for blood lol. When I shot my elk I hit it 6 out of 8 times at 550 yards with a 257 weatherby mag. 4 out of 6 where all in the goodie box the others where in the neck and butt. When I shot my deer in montana It blew a hole in it that I could fit my fist through, and I gotta big fist. Just wanted to put that out there that elk are tough animals.




yeah you definatly shouldnt be using that for an elk especially at 550 yards. why do you think it took so many shots


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## joelpresmyk8 (Jan 21, 2010)

and if you dont believe me go to weatherbys website and ask them if they reccommend shooting a bull elk with that caliber.


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

N7709K said:


> He managed to put a pellet through the eye and into the brain


NOW that would be Awesome!!!!! Hahaha I could brag the rest of my life!!


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## muzzyhunter17 (Mar 4, 2007)

cali hunter said:


> i agree but i know a guy who has shot and killed giant mule deer with a 223. with one shot. killing an animal all has to do with shot placement, any caliber can kill an animal but the shot placement is everything. and somebody shooting a moose with a pellet gun thats crazy cool. i have to say congrats on that one. were did he shoot it at


Yea I know people who use a .223 for deer, I have also seen a deer hit in the rib and the bullet just exploded not even going into the vitals.......He shot it again on the run in the spine on accident, Yea it is all about the placement...........The only thing I was trying to say is at 550 yards that caliber is a bit small.


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## cali hunter (Oct 31, 2009)

i would just stop hunting cause i could never top killing a moose with a pellet gubn


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