# Guessing Yardages



## abcarrow (Feb 3, 2006)

I shot a 3D course today, after the first round which consist of 15 targets I realized that I had not extended my sight, as a result I was high on every target with the exception of a few that I had underestimated. That round netted me 110 out of 150 points, then in the secound round I shot a 131 out of 150, and probably would have done better, but I was pretty flustered because of my first round. What a dumb mistake, I wish I could shoot the round over but its done. I would like to hear about your mistakes, and if anyone has a sure fire way to guess yardages I would like to hear what they are.

abcarrow


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## Justin17 (May 4, 2006)

My favorite way to judge yardage is to find a 20 yard mark then double it for a 40 yard mark and go from there. Other ways include finding marks for every 10 yards, and finding the half way point between you and your target and estimate that mark and double it.


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## SA_Rob (Mar 16, 2007)

*it's still a guess*



abcarrow said:


> I would like to hear about your mistakes, and if anyone has a sure fire way to guess yardages I would like to hear what they are.
> 
> abcarrow


Although I am only a green horn in the world of 3-d ... the experience of my mistakes might help you in the never ending quest to understand distances. As a rifle hunter, I use the football field rule. Being able to vision these 100 yard distances stacked end for end has given me very good success in the world of "he who makes the biggest boom wins." 

When I began shooting seriously last June, I thought I had to completely re-think the way I needed to judge distance. After weeks of frustration of being restricted to a small indoor range, I decided to use the same principal as my rifle but on a much smaller scale. I figured that if spending hours and hours looking at 100 yard tagets with my rifle would allow me to quickly judge large amounts of distance, the same thing must be true with archery.

I began by measuring out a 20, 30, 40, 50, and 60 yard range in my shelter belt. Rather than just shooting for the sake of setting my pins, I paid very close attention to the 20 yard target in particular. Seeing that distance over and over, and over and over, and over.... you get the idea... has really been the basis for the way I now judge distances. Practice... Practice... Practice

While shooting at playing cards pinned to a Block was extremely helpful, buying an actual 3-D target was far and away the best training tool I now have.


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## kjharnde (Mar 23, 2007)

*Guessing Yardage*

I am pretty new to shooting, but I really enjoy it -- especially 3D. At first, I was just finding what I thought 20 yards was, and trying to guess how much closer/farther it was than that; I found it wasn't very accurate, and my scores weren't great. My husband suggested that I "park cars". I find I am able to visualize the number of cars I can park, bumper to bumper, between me and the target. Each car is 5 yards, and this has improved my scores enormously. I usually park from the target in, then from me to the target, and then I cut the distance in half and do it again, just to check. It's helped!:wink:


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## jhart75609 (Nov 8, 2005)

I use the 20 yard "thing", usually judging off trees. I find I can get pretty close out to about 40 yards that way. After that the range gets more critical, and I'm not as good. I don't actually put a number on the yardage either. I shoot hunter (pins) and when I "call the yardage" I don't call it 32, I call that 30 pin high. 35 is splitting the pins. 38 would be 40 yard pin low, so would 39. I think it just makes it a little easier instead of putting a number on it just thinking of where to hold.

Does that make sense, or is my mind the only one that works that way?


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## tazhunter0 (Jun 21, 2006)

I didn't set my sight back out this weekend at Paris shoot on Sunday! Felt like a complete idiot for doing it but I learned a very good lesson, "Always shoot the bag targets before going out in the morning to shoot!!" I had fun anyways and thats the main thing. 
TAZ


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## Macker (Mar 22, 2007)

I shot my first 3d course about 2 weeks ago. Going in I thought I was going to be poor at judging yardage but I really surprised myself. Here is my conclusion: I have a spot where I can shoot out to 80 yards, and I shoot in 20 yard increments. I shoot alot!! I strongly believe that all the practice has enabled me to envision those distances. Practice, practice, and practice will help with your yardage judging. Also, some people go into the woods and guess yardage and then verify with a range finder.


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## abcarrow (Feb 3, 2006)

All of you have very good methods at getting your Yardages, and the conclusion is that it takes practice, trial and error etc. I guess that I'm probably looking for the perfect way to find the distance from point A---------->to point B. I've even went as far as asking my old College Physics Professor who seemed to have an answer to everything except guessing yardages. If anyone has other opinions on this I'm still looking for Ideas, to solve the equation (point A + point B = distance).

Thanks for your help

Any other stupid things you've done will be good to, remember that we are human.

abcarrow


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## elkkiller#4 (Mar 19, 2007)

To get really good at judging distances you have to look at the target and the size it looks at diffrent yardages, out west at these shoot you have targets that are across canyons and over hills where there is nothing but air between you and the target, when there is ground and is flat to rolling then ground judging is the best way, but when you have a shot with no ground, you better have a back up plan, after shooting lots of shoots in my archery career sometimes I waulk up to a target and its like someone is holding up a sign saying 52 yards because of the size of the target and the depth perception your brain uses.


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## BowmanJay (Jan 1, 2007)

Practice is the right choice but also a properly setup bow is also. This is probably the only post you will ever see from me here endorsing speed, but if you are shooting the fastest you can with still being accurate, it will help those mis-judged shots. I am not too good at distance judging but I know that my arrow speed will give me some extra room if I goof in guessing....


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## frost_reaver (Aug 17, 2006)

I agree about getting 3-D targets for practice. Using the ground to judge yardage is a good starting point but you should have at least a couple of ways of judging yardage. There are simply times when you can't use the ground. If you learn to judge yardage by the size of the target, you'll be better off in the long run. The only down side is it requires LOTS of practice.


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## LastCall (Mar 18, 2005)

I use the 20 yard rule, but I am not as accurate with it. I pretty much look at the target, try to figure out how big it is and guess the yardage.

I use both, but I am more accurate when I just look at it and guess?

:cocktail: LastCall:cocktail:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

There is no sure fire way to judge yardage...if it was it wouldn't part of 3D it would all be marked.:wink: 

But you just need to practice doing it. What ever way you decide you like to do it....practice it. Go for a walk with the family and judge, walk the dog and judge, walking from the car to the store, in the store.....everywhere you go judge yardage.:wink: 

I got to the point where I only use other methods (finding 20 and then 10 and so on or finding the half way point) when I get stuck because of terrain. The rest of the time I just look at the target or something by the target and get my yardage that way. If you do it enough....you will know what yardage you are looking at looks like. Shooting A TON of marked yardage (spots) helps. The distance of the targets will start to jump out at you. 

I can usually (when I am practicing) look at say a 43 yd deer and know it because I know what 40 looks like to me....then my eyes tell me that it is just a bit more...and I will usually get within a yard or so....:wink: 

but it takes practice.....


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## rudeman (Jan 25, 2006)

*Field Archery?*

I've started shooting a little field archery. The yardages are known so I think it's helping with my yardage judgement for 3D. I know, I won't be shooting 80 yard shots in 3D, but shooting from about 60 yards in in the field "should" help??!?


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## primitiveweapon (Mar 20, 2007)

I'm just not good at judging yardages in general.....which is really odd because I play alot of golf and am a 1 handicap, BUT, I always use yardage markers and my rangefinder.

I shot my first 3D course over the weekend. Luckily, I have a flat shooting bow and the targets were 20-35yds. I don't have much drop at all from 20-30yds and not much more at 35yds. Most of my poor shots were due to elevation changes.


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## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

I shoot in the Bow Novice calss and have done a bunch of practice in the back yard on my 3D target. I have trees marking 20, 30, and 40 yards even though I am capped at 30 yards. Just seeing the targets over and over has helped a bunch. 

Since I am using the fixed pin sight I typically use the lower yardage pin and aim high. I tend to guess short, so this helps plus our association shoots low 12's on Sundays. If I miss the yardage by a yard or two I can still get a 12.:wink: 

I also urge speed. A flat shooting bow helps make up for mistakes. My Apex-7 ranges from 278-282 depending on the chronograph at 59#. Gotta love it.


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## abcarrow (Feb 3, 2006)

Lets see what we've gathered so far (Point A + Point B = Getting yardage by target size, Faster Bows, learning 20, 30, 40 yardages, and Practice). When shooting I do focus on the target size, but as a tool to get my yardage. I really can't say that I ever tried, and most the 3d targets I shoot are different sizes, so the task of learning what every target looks like out to 60yds seems enormous. I currently shoot out to 60yds, and my passion for Feild Archery is driving me to shoot farther. However, in our area there is no Feild Archery shoots that I'm aware of. I have two Darton Mavericks set up almost Idenical, Draw length 28.5, Draw weight 60lbs 316 gr Easton fatboy 500's, which shoot out at 294 & 295 respectively, so speed is not an issue. That leaves practice learning 20, 30, & 40yd marks, but if anyone has more ideas on how to get yardages please let me know.

point A + point = ?????

abcarrow


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## cath8r (Jan 17, 2003)

A couple of little ideas to help you 'season' a yardage guess:
1. Look at the feet of the target. If you see the rebars holding the target above the ground, it may look farther away, but it is closer.
2. If you are going to count using the ground, try counting from the animals feet to you. I like that way better than me to the animal.
3. If you get to shoot at your own 3D targets at home, get used to what ranges you can identify the score lines or certain detailed features.
4. See at what range you can no longer make out the detail of an arrow in a 3D target. ( a pro shooter let me in on that one). 
4. When alot of people shoot a bow at home they shoot at 20 yards. Pick a range like 30 or 35 for most of your shooting. That is pretty close to the average 3D distance. You will get used to seeing it and recognizing it on the range.
5. If you can see the ground try to spread your feet as far apart as the animal, if possible. Picture a line from the animals left foot to your right foot and vice versa. Where they intersect is half way. 
6. Pick a spot between you and the target that you have a good idea of the distance. Imagine yourself standing there and figure how the target is from there. 

You can do all of these under a minute if you work at it.


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## 3rdplace (Jan 3, 2004)

This was something I wrote to help some of my students/customers. Maybe it will help some. I plan on adding quite a bit to it in the future but for now this is a basic article.

YARDAGE ESTIMATION
By Michael Marlow



Consistent yardage estimation in 3-D archery is perhaps the single most important part of the game, yet the least practiced. Most archers enjoy shooting the bow because of the dynamic feeling of accomplishment when they hit a dot the size of a Quarter at 40 yards. They spend hours honing their form by relentlessly pounding the practice target with hundreds of arrows. But when the time comes for yardage practice they only spend a few minutes because it’s not as exciting as shooting at and hitting that dot. To be successful at the 3-D game an archer must sacrifice some of the excitement of shooting and spend as much time or more practicing yardage estimation. 

Every archer needs a starting point to judge from. I like starting at 20 yards and counting in five-yard increments along the ground to the target. This works well on flat ground but creates problems in hilly terrain because you see more ground from an elevated shooting position which will make the target appear farther away. On ranges that are sloping downhill from the shooter stake it is better to reference your yardage off of trees horizontally along your line of sight. I find one that is close to 20 and start estimating to the next tree from there. 

The easiest way to find a starting point is to use a distance that is already familiar to you. This can be the length of your house or the distance from your parking place to the door of your house. For example, if your house is 54 feet long you know that is 18 yards. When you are at the stake visualize where your house would end if you were standing at the opposite end. This gives you a point to start from that is already fixed into your psyche and you didn’t even know it. Another way of ingraining a starting point is to exclusively shoot at a target at a known distance. Set a target at 25 or 30 yards and practice only from that distance. After a while you will be able to picture where your practice target would be compared to where the tournament target is.

After you find your starting spot find a way that is comfortable to estimate the remaining distance. Use five or ten yard increments from where your starting point is to the target or count back from the target to where your beginning point is. 

Many shooters use the halfway method. They find the point that is halfway between you and the target, reference it to the known distance you already know and then double it. An easy way to find the midpoint is to spread your feet apart the same distance as the target’s feet are spaced. Then visualize a line from your right foot to the targets left foot and a line from your left foot to the targets right foot. Where the lines intersect should be the halfway point between you and the target. If you use this method try to get within a half yard with your estimate so that when you double it you don’t double a mistake in your estimate. 

Probably the best, and most expensive, way to learn how to learn to judge yardage is to use “head yardage.” This is simply memorizing the targets at different distances. Since this method takes terrain out of the equation it is probably the most consistent way to estimate. This is why it is an expensive way to learn since you need to own all the targets that you will shoot or have access to them. An inexpensive way to get the full benefit of this technique is to cut life-sized replicas from cardboard and set them at known distances. Use distances you normally see in a tournament. 

The methods listed above are primary ways to estimate yardage. Don’t forget to use other tools that help in your judging. Learn the distances you can clearly see the twelve, ten and eight rings. Use this to estimate the farthest possible distance the target can be from you. If you can clearly see the twelve at 15 yards and the ten at 22 yards and the eight at 30 yards then you can reasonably estimate a range that the target falls between. An example would be a target set at 25 yards you would be able to see the eight ring clearly but not the ten. So you would know the target is between 22 and 30 yards. You will need to practice this in varying shades of light. The brighter it is the better you can see the scoring rings. 

Know yourself and how you judge; what I mean is know how you judge in the open in relationship to thick tight ranges. In the open I tend to judge three yards short. In a tunnel situation I will judge two yards long. If the target is partially hidden behind a tree I will judge two yards long. Learn your tendencies and compensate for them on the range. 

Use what you have to judge with. A few years ago I was shooting the Second Leg of the IBO Southern Triple Crown and was confronted with a wolf target at 45 yards. The target was set over a rolling hill, which obstructed about half the ground to the target. I could only see the wolf from the belly up. The trail was cut through open pines and had a generous amount of sagebrush growing underneath which worked to my advantage. When the trail was cut there was a perfect wall of grass on both sides. Since I couldn’t see the ground I used the wall of grass to count my yardage on and hung a ten. I have also used my chair to get a better view of the ground in the same situation. By standing on the seat you can gain another 15 inches in height. 

Take note of the light. If the Sun is behind you and shining on the target the target will appear closer because you see more detail. If the Sun is behind the target you will find the opposite to be true since the part facing you will be in the shade. 

Most importantly listen to your subconscious. If that little voice keeps telling you something is wrong with your number, take a little extra time and maybe use a different style of estimating to check your number. Use some of the checks described above and nail that ten ring.


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## Southwind (Jul 12, 2005)

I always like playing a little game with my buddies during down times when hunting. I will pick an object and have everyone guess the distance and then shoot it with the lazer. It is amazing how a lot of people think they are close only to be humbled by the true reading. Judging distance is the basis for 3D and hunting alike and as already said probably the least practiced.

Something that stuck with me was an interview with Chuck Adams about this very thing. He says everyday as he goes to the store or whatever he is doing he picks everyday objects and guesses the distance and then steps it out. He says that this constant practice has really paid off for him.


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## SA_Rob (Mar 16, 2007)

*easy distance practice*

So I've been thinking about this, and talking with the other guys at the shop about it since this was originally posted. Something that we came up with originally started as a drinking game *i know i know -- drinking and shooting should not mix..... but* with buddies during hunting camp. Try and get your hands on a Rhinehart Target. A 9" round ball should run you about 25 bucks, or the larger 18-1 is about 120... each of these targets has a rope handle which allows you to throw/roll the target. Each throw will give you a different yardage, so you will become more accustomed to learning how to judge distances.

best of luck


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## chefcoz (May 1, 2006)

I like this one. Sounds like a good idea. I set my yard up in 10 yard sections out to 40 yards. Then I just shoot at different areas in between and judge my shot. It helps me out big time.

Chef



SA_Rob said:


> So I've been thinking about this, and talking with the other guys at the shop about it since this was originally posted. Something that we came up with originally started as a drinking game *i know i know -- drinking and shooting should not mix..... but* with buddies during hunting camp. Try and get your hands on a Rhinehart Target. A 9" round ball should run you about 25 bucks, or the larger 18-1 is about 120... each of these targets has a rope handle which allows you to throw/roll the target. Each throw will give you a different yardage, so you will become more accustomed to learning how to judge distances.
> 
> best of luck


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## abcarrow (Feb 3, 2006)

This gets more interesting by the minute, I personally am getting alot of good ideas from all the people responding. The new idea for getting yardage is paying attention to DETAIL. I think along with paying more attention to DETAIL, we should Include knowing what our bows shoot at 30yds when were standing say at 35yds for example. Maybe you can use your twenty yard pin out to 26yds, 40yd pin out to 43yds, follow me. Anyways I've got some good info from all of you, and by all means keep it coming.

abcarrow


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## tdarst (Oct 10, 2005)

I have mine set up 20,30,40,50,60. 10 yards is a dead on 20 pin 15 hits 3/4 high with the 20. If the target is more than 20 but less than 30 use the 20 at the top of the 10 ring and let it fall. If you cant lock on to the top use the 30 at the bottom. same holds true for the rest of the pens. Also try to find a spot on the target to lock on to like another arrow or a hole just something to get you steady. I also shoot at the head of a golf tee out to 80 yards that will really get your pins dead on, and let you know if your RD axis is set. I have shot more than a hand full of 300+ scores NOT bragging but this is what works for me. Don't forget go for 10's and let the arrows fall into the 12 you will get a lot more of them that way.


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## jhart75609 (Nov 8, 2005)

One other thing I do, that may help. I set my 20 yard pin indoors at 20 yards. My bow is fast enough a couple of feet wouldn't matter, but the rest of my pins are set to MY steps. I don't own a laser, so when I am estimating, or practicing the only thing I have to check myself with are my steps. I think I come pretty close to actual yardages when I step it, but I know there is a little difference. I realize you can't do this if you shoot known distances too, but I think it helps me.


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## BK Artworks (Nov 7, 2005)

tdarst said:


> I also shoot at the head of a golf tee out to 80 yards that will really get your pins dead on


Do you have bionic eye's or what???


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## tdarst (Oct 10, 2005)

No I dont. And yes it is a tiny dot, and I dident say I could hit it every time. It just gives you some thing tiny to lock onto. My friend has to put 3 together so he can see them.


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## tdarst (Oct 10, 2005)

The golf tee trick will also tell you if your 3rd axis is off or not. At 20 and 30 you may be dead on at 80 you may be wayyyy off.


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## SA_Rob (Mar 16, 2007)

*Golf tee trick*



tdarst said:


> No I dont. And yes it is a tiny dot, and I dident say I could hit it every time. It just gives you some thing tiny to lock onto. My friend has to put 3 together so he can see them.


we also use the golf tee... but not to any further than 20 yards. at home, I use playing cards. at 20, 30, and 40 yards I aim for the aces. for yardages beyond that, it doesn't matter what the card is. if I can put an arrow into each of the three cards on my target (held on by golf tees interestingly enough) at 50, 60, and 70 yards... I figure that it is good enough to get me into most 10 rings, and definately good enough to get good shot placement on any game animal. at ranges beyond 70 yards, i have to use an 8" pie plate so that the target isn't covered by my pins. *note to self and others... some of the new Spot Hogg sights are available with .09 pins YAY!!!*


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## abcarrow (Feb 3, 2006)

Hey Guys

I'm 50 yrs old now, and I wish that I had eyes like you all, I can shoot pins back to 60yds, and my scope out to 80yds, but never at a golf tee . However, I do remember the old days in the mid to late seventys when I could lock my pin on the 80yd spot without any blurs. The eye sight isn't what it was 30+years ago, but my heart is still there,and thats what counts, to me anyways. Does anyone have more Idea's on guessing yardages, if so please share.

abcarrow


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

abcarrow said:


> Hey Guys
> 
> I'm 50 yrs old now, and I wish that I had eyes like you all, I can shoot pins back to 60yds, and my scope out to 80yds, but never at a golf tee . However, I do remember the old days in the mid to late seventys when I could lock my pin on the 80yd spot without any blurs. The eye sight isn't what it was 30+years ago, but my heart is still there,and thats what counts, to me anyways. Does anyone have more Idea's on guessing yardages, if so please share.
> 
> abcarrow



There aren't any tricks to coming up with yardage. The only way to get good a guessing yardage is to practice doing it. It is just like anything else I can tell you how to shoot a bow.....but you have to practice doing it to get good at it.:wink:


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## kkromer (Sep 14, 2004)

I use everyone of the tools that people have listed here, but one that kind of goes along with the multi-sided rhinehart target, I use a soccer ball. Kick it and judge it, kick it, judge it. For those of us that don't have the targets it allows us to have a mental picture of what it looks like at different yardages, and apply that at the tournament range. Make sure you go to different places to kick and judge, so you can have the mental picture in different terran. Also judge some of the trees, clumps of grass etc while using the ball. Another great practice tool while judging is to do 10 yard increment walk-ups after you judge. For example you judge the distance to the ball as 44 - walk till you think you're at 40, range, move till you you're right on 40. Then do the same at 30 and 20. I'll do it at 50 as well when the ball happens to go further. It helps solidify how those even distances look.

It comes down to being willing to work. 

The other suggestion that I have is make sure that your eyes are balanced. If your eyes are different - say one is 20/20 one is 20/40 it's tough to tell if a target is 35 or 45. I just got glasses and it seems to have really helped me tremendously.

Good luck


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## asa3dpro (Dec 31, 2002)

*Judging Yardage*

The advice I can tell you is buy a rangfinder and some targets. I have 15 and the lanes I have are at least 65 yards if not more. i judge yardage bu just walking down the lane until I find a good spot. Judge it and it usually just comes to me from the size of the animal and the amount of ground between it and me. To check myself I find 20 which comes very easy from shooting indoors.Step to the side and look from 20 to the animal which usually confirms my first judge. it's really hard to say all I know is that I usually judge a minimum of 2 hrs per day and 4 at the most. I really don't agree with the shooting a ton of arrows from 20-80 yards. Yes, you need to check your marks but if you work on your form and shoot some endurance shooting like a couple of 5 spot games every other day or Vegas targets and spend as much time with the rangefinder you will increase your score. Before I had my targets I use to take my kids to the park and judge trees or whatever I could just to get better.


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