# Please help a string building Noob



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

Okay so I followed Automan26's thread about making a jig/stretcher and made a pretty decent 2 post jig. Here's a 10" practice string on it.







I made a little jig so I know when I'm at 100 and 300lbs for measuring and serving.

I made my first complete set of string and cables two days ago for an old bow of mine out of 452x with .014 Halo and .021 62xs. I read a lot and followed Griv's guide to finishing the end loops which I like a lot. I'm happy with how they look and I learned a lot about using my jig in the process. Here's a pic of my first end serving.







I got to shoot them in yesterday and after 60 shots, I'm still getting significant peep rotation. I didn't expectmy first set to be rock solid after 10 shots or so but was hoping that they wouldn't suck either. Here's my process:
1. Set my jig to the desired length using Automan26's formula which he very kindly provided.
2. Lay out my bundles keeping good tension on the spool (I have a tensioner in the works but haven't finished it yet.)
3. Finish the end loops like Griv using the tag ends to wrap the loops. 
4. Twist to length and measure at 100lbs
5. Tension to 300lbs and let sit for a few minutes then using a piece of left over string material, burnish the string. 
6. Serve and let sit for a while. (The string sat for 3 hours while I went and ran some errands but the cables only got 1 hour at 300lbs.)
7. Install on the bow.

If any of you have any advice or are willing to share your tips on how to make a more solid set, I would be very greatful to hear it. I know I'll only get better but If I can learn from some of the best in the business it hopefully will save me wasting a lot of material. Thanks in advance!:darkbeer:


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## BowBaker1640 (Aug 6, 2010)

check out the thread stretching bowstring while fabricating and go to post #14. That should help you out


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## jhunter13 (Oct 16, 2009)

Which way did you serve your string? Make sure you are serving in the right direction. This will cause peep rotation very easily.


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

Thanks for the reply guys. I do serve with the twist so that shouldn't be a problem. I'll check out that thread and post. Thanks for the tip.


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

BowBaker1640, I can't find a thread on string stretching using the title you gave me. Could you copy the link to the thread and post it on here for me?


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

yup, make sure you're wrapping the serving in the same direction the string is twisted.....so serving the string would "tighten" the twists as you wrap the serving. also, when laying up the string strands, try to wind them onto the jig as evenly in tension, as you can, and then put the laid up, but untwisted bundle of string material under 2 or 3 hundred pounds of tension, over night before twisting it and starting your serving. that lets the individual strands equalize the lay up tension. basically each step in building, as you progress through lay-up, to twisting, to serving and finished string, should be set under equalizing tension, before doing the next step. that is the safest way to arrive at a good finished string, that won't twist when you are hand building and hand serving.. if you don't do this, when you twist up the string and the strands haven't had a chance to equalize in tension, the individual strands will have differing tensions within the twisted bundle and rotate all the time under the pressure of shooting, because some strands will be taking more load than others in the twisted bundle. well made strings don't twist because, all the individual strands take an equal amount of the strain and if they don't start out equal right from the beginning of the build, they won't fix themselves after the twisting and serving (especially the loop serving) is done.....that loop serving essentially locks the entire string bundle into whatever tensions the individual strands are at, when the loops are served. so it is extremely important to put the freshly laid up bundle under a good amount of tension (250 to 300 pounds) for several hours, before twisting. it also helps to burnish the untwisted bundle from post to post, while under tension. this helps the individual strands move around and establish equilibrium within the laid-up, but untwisted bundle, for a good start.


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

Would "stretching" the untwisted bundles before finishing the end loops help to equalize the strands or would that just cause slipping and mess up the length?


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

what little the string might get longer from the tensions equalizing is miniscule and can be compensated for during installation and tuning, by twisting the finished string/cables as part of the normal requirements of tuning a newly installed rig, as long as the string was built with consideration for the correct twists per length of finished string was adhered to.


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## marc_groleau (Aug 18, 2007)

Sometimes a center serving, wound too tight can cause rotation even on a soundly made string. Be careful of that.


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## Flame-Tamer (Mar 1, 2009)

I believe that a few mins of strect time is not enough. BCY recommends at least 30 mins..


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## Richard Doolin (Nov 29, 2008)

posted for bowbaker1640 to help out huntinsker.
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=523006


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## flag (Oct 4, 2009)

i do all of my strectching before serving and i check for rotation before serving so i know if something went wrong i know where it happened


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## BowBaker1640 (Aug 6, 2010)

flag said:


> i do all of my strectching before serving and i check for rotation before serving so i know if something went wrong i know where it happened


and that's what it says in that thread I spoke of and that's what I do


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

Thank you guys. Richard Doolin and BowBaker1640 that's exactly what I was looking for. Thanks for pointing that post out. After doing some more reading on it, I realized that I may have served too tighly and I didn't give the string a recovery time. I just put it up to tension, served, measured and put it on the bow. I may just scrap that string and start a new. Thanks again!


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## BowBaker1640 (Aug 6, 2010)

don't do that. if you carefully cut the serving you can undo it and restretch and let it recover then reserve it


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## jmann28 (Nov 22, 2010)

Serving too tight will cause peep rotation. Take a two inch piece of serving material and put it in the middle of the string before you start twisting (you should do this anyways to make putting in your peep simple). Place it as close to where the peep is going to be to. Pull the material out strait and use it as a flag indicator. As you serve, you'll be able to tell of your serving too tight because you can see the flags rotating. A tiny little bit of movement is ok. But if its rotating a quarter rotation, or half a rotation, you're serving too tightly. 

Another way to tell, is with the flag indicator. Pull the ends tight, and as you back down the poundage, does it move? Or stay straight? Straight = good! 

I started in December making strings but feel I've got my system down and end up with great strings and ZERO rotation. 

Calculate post settings.
Lay up string with as equal tension as possible, use tag ends to finish loops.
Put two 12inch pieces of material in between the two colors, or half way on a solid color.
Move to stretcher, bring to 175lbs. 
Burnish individual colors.
Put half the twists in on one end. 
Use the 12 inch material to pull from center to end of string to ensure the material is laying up evenly.
Put remaining half of twists in on other end. I usually end up around 300lbs at this point.
Take the scrap material and pull from end to center to ensure bundles are laying up evenly again.
Increase to 400lbs. Keep increasing to 400 as it stretches, only have to increase two times or so. Let stretch at 400 until it doesn't lose a pound for one hour.
Back down to 100, let sit 10 mins to recover, put in or take out any twists to get proper length.
Back down to 30 lbs and start end serving.
Crank up to 350, let sit until it stops losing poundage at 350. 
Serve.

Great strings every time!


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

Sounds like a plan. I will try to fix this string and see what happens. jmann28, thanks for jumping in with that "flag" idea. Makes perfect sense and will come in handy.


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## BowBaker1640 (Aug 6, 2010)

when you go to cut the serving very carefully "shave" it until you get thru it


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

Thanks for all the tips and advice. I took the serving off that string and re-served with less tension and and allowed a relaxing period before putting it on the bow. I shot it in today and in 20 shots there was no more rotation! I couldn't be happier that my first set is a keeper. Thanks again!


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## K.G.K. (Jun 27, 2011)

Huntinsker said:


> Okay so I followed Automan26's thread about making a jig/stretcher and made a pretty decent 2 post jig. Here's a 10" practice string on it.
> View attachment 1629241
> 
> I made a little jig so I know when I'm at 100 and 300lbs for measuring and serving.
> ...


Your jig looks good. I too built this jig and have had really good success with it. 

When I install the strings, I shoot the bow 50-75 times before installing the peep. This allows the string to settle in. I have not had any peep twist in any of my strings so far and have close to 1000 shots on my current strings. I build mine similar as you. Everyone has their own way and most advise is worth listening to. Trial and error will be a good resource for you.


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## K.G.K. (Jun 27, 2011)

I'm also curious on the little jig you made to establish 100 and 300#. Could you share? Thanks,


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

K.G.K. said:


> I'm also curious on the little jig you made to establish 100 and 300#. Could you share? Thanks,


Right now it's pretty crude. I hooked a scale up to the jig and started cranking it down until it got to 100lbs of weight. I then used a piece of cardboard to stick between the back of the 1/2" thick steel and the washer that's compressing the spring and cut it to that length. Then I cranked it down farther to 300lbs and cut a notch in the cardboard for that length. That's really all my "jig" is at this point. I'm going to add a more permanent indicator but I haven't had much time to work on it. Right now the cardboard piece is working well. I can put it between the post and washer and it will stay in place. If it falls out while the string is stretching, that means that it has lost some poundage and I need to crank it back up until it just holds the "jig" again. Simple but most of the time, simpler is better.


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## lc12 (Jul 30, 2009)

Huntinsker said:


> Right now it's pretty crude. I hooked a scale up to the jig and started cranking it down until it got to 100lbs of weight. I then used a piece of cardboard to stick between the back of the 1/2" thick steel and the washer that's compressing the spring and cut it to that length. Then I cranked it down farther to 300lbs and cut a notch in the cardboard for that length. That's really all my "jig" is at this point. I'm going to add a more permanent indicator but I haven't had much time to work on it. Right now the cardboard piece is working well. I can put it between the post and washer and it will stay in place. If it falls out while the string is stretching, that means that it has lost some poundage and I need to crank it back up until it just holds the "jig" again. Simple but most of the time, simpler is better.


I kind of did the same thing to "calibrate" my jig, but instead of a cardboard "gauge" I just measure from the face of my jig body to the edge of the string post.
When I put a scale on my jig I found that 1/4" of travel equaled 100 lbs. 7/16" = 200 lbs, etc.
The one thing I found out is that when twisting my strings tension would be ADDED so I had to remember to BACK OFF of the nut a little when twisting to keep the tension even throughout the twisting process.


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## K.G.K. (Jun 27, 2011)

Huntinsker said:


> Right now it's pretty crude. I hooked a scale up to the jig and started cranking it down until it got to 100lbs of weight. I then used a piece of cardboard to stick between the back of the 1/2" thick steel and the washer that's compressing the spring and cut it to that length. Then I cranked it down farther to 300lbs and cut a notch in the cardboard for that length. That's really all my "jig" is at this point. I'm going to add a more permanent indicator but I haven't had much time to work on it. Right now the cardboard piece is working well. I can put it between the post and washer and it will stay in place. If it falls out while the string is stretching, that means that it has lost some poundage and I need to crank it back up until it just holds the "jig" again. Simple but most of the time, simpler is better.


What compression spring are you using...or, where did you get it? I'm not sure that mine compresses to 300#. I have set the 100# mark which is about 1/3 of the compressed spring. My scale only reads up to 150lbs. However, once the spring is fully compressed, I can still tighten the nut way beyond the spring's tension still stretching the string, so I am confident I am beyond 300#. Just curious.


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

K.G.K. said:


> What compression spring are you using...or, where did you get it? I'm not sure that mine compresses to 300#. I have set the 100# mark which is about 1/3 of the compressed spring. My scale only reads up to 150lbs. However, once the spring is fully compressed, I can still tighten the nut way beyond the spring's tension still stretching the string, so I am confident I am beyond 300#. Just curious.


I got this one from McMaster Carr. Part Number: 9573K81 Medium Load Chrome-Silicon Steel Die Spring 1.5" Hole, .75" Rod, 2" L, .135" X .345" for $8.34. When the spring is compressed 29/32" (between 7/8" and 15/16") I'm at 100# and when it's compressed 3/8" it's at 300#. It works great and I like that I don't need a huge amount of adjustment to get to 300#.


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## K.G.K. (Jun 27, 2011)

Huntinsker said:


> I got this one from McMaster Carr. Part Number: 9573K81 Medium Load Chrome-Silicon Steel Die Spring 1.5" Hole, .75" Rod, 2" L, .135" X .345" for $8.34. When the spring is compressed 29/32" (between 7/8" and 15/16") I'm at 100# and when it's compressed 3/8" it's at 300#. It works great and I like that I don't need a huge amount of adjustment to get to 300#.


Thank you!


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## K.G.K. (Jun 27, 2011)

Huntinsker said:


> Okay so I followed Automan26's thread about making a jig/stretcher and made a pretty decent 2 post jig. Here's a 10" practice string on it.
> View attachment 1629241
> 
> I made a little jig so I know when I'm at 100 and 300lbs for measuring and serving.
> ...


I like the modifications you have made from the original plans. What is the metal spacer between the brackets? I have found that raising the posts would help a lot with serving as you get closer to the posts due to obstruction from the nut holding the bracket to the unistrut. Is there any other reason that you did that? Nice job, Thanks,


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

K.G.K. said:


> I like the modifications you have made from the original plans. What is the metal spacer between the brackets? I have found that raising the posts would help a lot with serving as you get closer to the posts due to obstruction from the nut holding the bracket to the unistrut. Is there any other reason that you did that? Nice job, Thanks,


Sorry I haven't posted back. I didn't see your last post until now. I used 1/2" thick by 1.5" wide and 7 inches long cold rolled flat stock steel to get my posts higher above the superstrut. It works great and is even stronger than just the brackets alone. I wanted it higher because it would be easier to work with and I've made my own version of the NW Spinner and needed it to be higher in order to use it to do my serving.


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## redyak3 (Nov 5, 2011)

K.G.K. said:


> I like the modifications you have made from the original plans. What is the metal spacer between the brackets? I have found that raising the posts would help a lot with serving as you get closer to the posts due to obstruction from the nut holding the bracket to the unistrut. Is there any other reason that you did that? Nice job, Thanks,


I just finished my El-cheapo-delux and like the mods as well. Might have to do something along those lines. I need to order some materials to get started and have been digging through all the threads. My head is swimming a little bit, but I'm sure it'll all make sense when I start building. Thanks for all the info sharing!


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