# Pins Covering the Bullseye



## goathollow (Jun 18, 2008)

I have been a bow hunter for about 28 years so I am a bit embarassed to just now be asking this question.

Many years ago my father taught me to sight in a rifle (with open sights) so it is hitting about an or two high. His theory was/is that you can't hit what you can't see so you hold the front sight just below the spot you are trying to hit. With a paper target the top of the front bead would be touching the bottom bullseye (assuming the target is at your zero range). I have always subscribed to this philosophy and I'm not a half bad rifle shot.

However, my bows have always been sighted in to cover the spot I'm trying to hit. Even at 20 yds the pin is large enought to cover the x ring and most of the bullseye on a paper 5 spot target. The problem, of course, gets worse at longer ranges. How does one keep the pin centered on the x ring if you can't see it.

I am thinking about changing the pins on my bow to match the sighting philosophy I use when shooting a rifle. (By the way, I see the two as similar because they both have front and rear sights.) Before I change things up and try it I thought I would seek the advice of some of you that are likely more knowlegable than I.


Thanks in advance for your help.


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## caskins269 (Jul 31, 2008)

What size pins are you using?


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## goathollow (Jun 18, 2008)

pins are .019


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## caskins269 (Jul 31, 2008)

All I can really tell you is I use .010 pins. I have used these pins the last 5 years in the IBO shoots. There is still times when my pin is starbursting with the bright sun light that I have to bring my pin over the x area several times before I start to squeeze my trigger. I have already used black velcro strips to tame down the starbursting effect and then I relie on my LP light. 

If you have a friend or buddy that shots the 0.10 pins, maybe he or she will let you borrow them to try them out. The other problem with the 010 is there will be times when you can't see the fiber optics.


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## kwood (Oct 4, 2011)

Let me preface this post with the fact that I am NOT an Archery Coach 
- sorry I'm not REALLY trying to break the rules here....BUT

This topic struck my interest because I have been reading this book by Bernie Pellerite (Idiot Proof Archery) Where he suggests something quite the opposite of going to a smaller pin for the problem you are describing. 

He suggests using a sight that has a CIRCLE on it, such that when you aim, the circle fits "loosely around the bulls-eye." Bernie says that it helps you see the bulls-eye without feeling like your sights are wobbling all around. 

I have NOT tried this, and honestly I haven't really seen such a thing in real life, but I'm wondering if anyone has, or what the opinions are of coaches here on that philosophy? 

I would imagine this would be mostly useful for target shooting -- but who knows.


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## goathollow (Jun 18, 2008)

Ttt


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## da white shoe (Mar 10, 2009)

I've tried sighting in my bow to hit just above the pin and it worked very well for spots. Back then, I shot with one eye closed and it really helped me see the exact spot I wanted to hit. I really can't think of a downside to sighting in like this, but maybe somebody will tell us about one... or two. :wink: 

Nowdays, I only shoot spots to sight in my bow. After some years of trial and error, I decided that, for me, keeping one eye closed could be a disadvantage for hunting. I've since trained myself to shoot with both eyes open. When doing it this way.... with the eyes *I've* got at least, I focus on the spot I want to hit with both eyes and the pin appears as more of a halograph over the spot. My peep-side eye is very dominant though, so it probably won't work that well for everyone.

It doesn't sound like you're having any problems while hunting.


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## subconsciously (Aug 22, 2009)

Here is a thought.....if your pin is supposed to be in your secondary vision (according to many), how can you focus on the "x" and the "pin" if they are in 2 different places?...That is why I sight in with the pin covering where I want to hit. I can focus on the "x" with my pin in my secondary vison.

I know if the pin and the x are not lined up...it is hard for me to process the shot. Just a thought.


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## tpcowfish (Aug 11, 2008)

subconsciously said:


> Here is a thought.....if your pin is supposed to be in your secondary vision (according to many), how can you focus on the "x" and the "pin" if they are in 2 different places?...That is why I sight in with the pin covering where I want to hit. I can focus on the "x" with my pin in my secondary vison.
> 
> I know if the pin and the x are not lined up...it is hard for me to process the shot. Just a thought.


This sounds correct to me, But i'm not a pro either


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## da white shoe (Mar 10, 2009)

subconsciously said:


> Here is a thought.....if your pin is supposed to be in your secondary vision (according to many), how can you focus on the "x" and the "pin" if they are in 2 different places?...That is why I sight in with the pin covering where I want to hit. I can focus on the "x" with my pin in my secondary vison.
> 
> I know if the pin and the x are not lined up...it is hard for me to process the shot. Just a thought.



Exactly right... BUT, you have to keep both eyes open or the pin covers the spot completely. With both eyes open, you can clearly see the spot with your non-peep eye and, because your eyes are focused downrange at the target, the pin appears somewhat blurry.


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## sweet old bill (Apr 21, 2003)

I have the same issue as you. I use a bigger .029 pin and a slider sight, in close you put the piin on the center of the target and you can see were it will hit, as you go out in distance the pin covers up the center of the target face. But once I am there I forget the pin and just look at the center of the target and squeeze off the release and the arrow seems to go there most times. I do see the mfg of sights are making the new 4 pin sights in the top pin is .029, 2nd pin .019 and the last two pins are .010 that great but for us older archers that small .010 I sure can not see....


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## Ray Ray (Aug 1, 2005)

I'm not a coach either,but teach archery at Women in the Outdoors & youth field day. I think that aiming at the X & not watching your pin is better because the X isn't moving or floating around. Watching the pin can lead to Target panic thru the shoot now mind set. You know shoot befor it moves off the X. 

I tell people it's like riding your bike. You don't watch the front tire, you look down the road at where your going(your Target). Your subconscious keeps you going straight, at least till you take your eyes off the target.


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## AJ the TP Guru (Jul 29, 2011)

Ray Ray said:


> I'm not a coach either,but teach archery at Women in the Outdoors & youth field day. I think that aiming at the X & not watching your pin is better because the X isn't moving or floating around. Watching the pin can lead to Target panic thru the shoot now mind set. You know shoot befor it moves off the X.
> 
> I tell people it's like riding your bike. You don't watch the front tire, you look down the road at where your going(your Target). Your subconscious keeps you going straight, at least till you take your eyes off the target.


Agree with Ray Ray.

.019 pins are pretty standard; they shouldn't be your problem. But I don't see any problem with sighting in above the x, either. After all, much of the time your target (especially when hunting) will be somewhere between pins.


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