# 3d shoot participation



## slowbowin12 (Apr 14, 2008)

I shoot with people who help set up courses and I dont have a problem with it. I know these people well enough and trust them and I dont feel they have an advantage if theyre not ranging targets. It would be kind of hard to get people to set up a 30 target course if they were not into 3d around here.If youre good enough at judging yardage it shouldnt matter any way.:wink:


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## can-am500girl (Jan 26, 2008)

these people set the target up and rangefindered it before it was shot. and then took home trophies for already knowing yardages?? no skill there.


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## slowbowin12 (Apr 14, 2008)

If they are ranging Id say no that aint cool.:thumbs_do


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## hrtlnd164 (Mar 22, 2008)

Our club's policy was that if you set it up you could shoot but not turn in a score. We did range find occasion targets so as not to exeed max yardages for classes.


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## can-am500girl (Jan 26, 2008)

thats what this particular group did. but then they turned in there score cards and took trophies home.....so uncool in my book but whatever makes em feel good about winning, i played fair and thats what makes me sleep at night.


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## ultramax (Feb 6, 2005)

We have a guy not far from here who is famous for that.


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## cameron (Sep 15, 2005)

I will honestly say, that I have no advantage on my home course after setting it up. I do not use a rangefinder either.


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## whoa (Apr 5, 2004)

If they use a range finder then it is not fare if they are shooting for trophys , when I sit my course if I have a question on a certain target I get my wife to range find it if it's from the stake I shoot from and I will do the stake she shoots from if there is a question there, and since we are the only ones running the course we don't shoot together so there is no discussion of yardages


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## Backlash (Feb 18, 2008)

If you are going to punish someone for helping setting up a 3D course by not letting them compete, who are you going to get to help set up the course? A drunk off the street?


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## dw'struth (Mar 14, 2008)

I voted yes, it is fine to help with the course. As long as they are not the one setting yardages.


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## dw'struth (Mar 14, 2008)

backlash said:


> if You Are Going To Punish Someone For Helping Setting Up A 3d Course By Not Letting Them Compete, Who Are You Going To Get To Help Set Up The Course? A Drunk Off The Street?


+1


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## rocklock (Mar 13, 2007)

They would however know the exact distances right??


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## PSE ROGUE (Jan 19, 2008)

as long as they didnt hold the rangefinder im cool with it


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## Greg Ingalls (Jul 22, 2007)

No range finders.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Your question/poll should have been more specific .

Our club sets 40 targets per event. 5 to 6 people broken down into 2 groups set stakes and targets. We don't use range finders. Help is short and hard to find and we will continue to let target setters shoot for awards so long as no no range finding is performed.


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

*Question*

Is it right to punish the ones that do all the work and set up the ranges?

Several club members should help set the courses.


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## bow47man (Jun 2, 2006)

*setting up a course*

our archery club has about 25 members and only a few show up to help with the course setup. one member will set the stakes the next day or so and he never shoots for score. :darkbeer:mick


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

Good luck on getting anyone to come work if they can not compete. It is hard enough to get volunteers as it is, to tell them thanks for the help, but you can not compete will just kill the few workers that each club has.

When I was the club prez we had the same 4 or 5 guys every shoot doing all the work. We did not carry rangefinders to set the course. All of the guys were experienced enough to know when stakes were over max yardages without range finders.


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## Elf Friend (Mar 1, 2003)

If we where to ban these people that worked hard setting up a course then what? Say because you shoot league here every Tuesday night you know the range and therefor not allowed to shoot for a score. I set up leagues and week-end shoots. There is no way I could remember all the yardages even if I had ranged them (which I did not do). I think the person shooting there every week has the better advantage.


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## owl (May 28, 2004)

All I know is when I help set a course, I am much more tired and sore than when I don't. If that is an advantage, so be it.


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## CutTheLoop (Dec 26, 2007)

rocklock said:


> They would however know the exact distances right??



If they can memorize the ranges of 30 or more targets, even starting from a random stake... I'd say they deserved a trophy for that.

If I'm setting up a range in 102* heat(like last week here) yer darned skippy I'm shooting it, and competing. We have enough trouble in the past getting help to put on a shoot. This year has been great, I can imagine those numbers would drop substantially if we banned them from shooting & competing.

We do however; have one guy do the actual ranging. But he's a pro and only shoots our course for fun anyway.

But we're not about to punish the stake pounders.


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## KCC (Aug 27, 2007)

*Range*

Our club has about 100 members, but usually we have 5 to 7 setup. Our open shooters set the stakes for all classes under them and some one from another class sets theres. Most open shooters do not take trophies and use the shoot as practice.
We have started using a rangefinder just to make sure we are not squeezing the targets in. We had a issue with the open shooters because the targets were not stretched far enough out.
I believe if you set up you should have a chance at a trophy otherwise you will not have anyone setting up and then no shoots.


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## mathewdbl_lung (Mar 17, 2008)

I've helped set up a 40 target 3d course before and I did not know the exact yardage. As a matter of fact, I missed completly on a target across the water. LOL


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## hutchies (Jun 8, 2005)

Daniel Boone said:


> Is it right to punish the ones that do all the work and set up the ranges?
> 
> Several club members should help set the courses.





No, It is not right.............and NO, I don't setup any courses. I know there are cases where it does happen where people do cheat but guys if they are gonna cheat then they are going to find one way or another. I've shot with a guy here locally that will hold his bow up and look at the pins to help him with the distance. He uses his pin gaps.


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## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

We use an old guy that is a member of our club to set the stakes. He doesn't remember what he just did let alone remember the stake distances.

Really though, we have 2 people from different classes set stake. That way no one sets the stake from which they are gonna shoot. It's the only way to get it done. I will never tell someone from my club that they can not shoot because they set stakes. We wouldn't have any members and therefore wouldn't have a course to set.


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## NY911 (Dec 12, 2004)

NO shooting for the money/trophy (any class!)


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## Bronion30 (Jul 9, 2005)

I would have to say if they just set up the targets and stakes and didn't double check the yardages then it would be ok. The only person that shouldn't be allowed to shoot is the one rangefinding to make sure the stakes are within the class yardages.


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## Ohio_3Der (Jul 19, 2002)

*Yes*

People belong to a club because it's close to their house. 

People like to shoot the tournament that is close to their house.

People belong to a club, because it's close to their house.

Without letting the people that live close to the club shoot the course, you won't have a course for very long. 

Basically, at our club, we have one guy that checks all the stakes with a range finder, and that person never shoots for score. All the other guys/gals that help shoot the course for a score, but they haven't checked any targets with a rangefinder.


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## longbowdude (Jun 9, 2005)

Yes I think its ok at smaller local shoots. No I dont think its ok at large official championships.


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## huntindoc (Feb 8, 2006)

FOBsKILL said:


> If they can memorize the ranges of 30 or more targets, even starting from a random stake... I'd say they deserved a trophy for that.
> 
> If I'm setting up a range in 102* heat(like last week here) yer darned skippy I'm shooting it, and competing. We have enough trouble in the past getting help to put on a shoot. This year has been great, I can imagine those numbers would drop substantially if we banned them from shooting & competing.
> 
> ...


Exactly! Must be a MENSA member if he can remember all of that. Heck I Can shoot a course and immediately start over and not remember which pin I used.

hd


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## lakertaker40 (Feb 8, 2005)

Setups! Like most posts If we had to ask the people who Put a half of a days hard work in to the setup not to shoot  You would be seting up alone I am one of the people who set up and shoot the course. At the end of the day Ill give my reward for shooting well, To a youngster and congards on a great shoot. Its just the fun and hanging out with the guys for 5-6 hrs for the setups. And we dont range targets wile setting up. 

[If it was'nt for us archers we would'nt have 3-D shoots to attend.]


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## Twinsfan (Aug 9, 2007)

i would say no. they helped set it up and know all the distances i dont think they should be a ble to shoot for a score.


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## 3-D Quest (Jan 26, 2007)

*No Problem.*

Each member present should take turns setting stakes as the group puts out the next target. And a rangefinder should be used as not to exceed each stakes max distance.​So what if you would know a couple of the distances? At least you were there to help, which is a major plus. Good help is hard to find when there isalot of hard work to be done.​If you'll watch and listen during or after a shoot, it's always the ones that never show, for one reason or another doing the complaining. My response is always to tell them we all would be glad to see you at the next work party and give us the benefit of your vast and expanded knowledge. That will usually quiet them down or get the excuse flowing.:wink:​


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## welder1 (Jan 25, 2008)

What's the odds of them remembering more than a few targets? I know I couldn't. Levi Morgan came and shot our club's shoot Sunday and shot 22up on a 20 target course. He kicked everybody's hiney including the guys that set up the course! Back to the problem, If an average shooter wins after setting up the range, obviously you have problems. In our club, it's the same guys you have to beat whether they've seen the course or not.


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## mjgonehunting (Mar 5, 2007)

I know I couldn't remember the ranges of all 30 targets correctly!
As someone said above,usually there are several groups setting up anyhow,so no one person is likeley to know ranges at every target.
It's a GAME guys,NOT a professional paid event.LIGHTEN UP AN HAVE FUN!


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## 3Daddict (Oct 19, 2004)

when ever i help set up a shoot,which i absolutely enjoy,and i'm gonna shoot it, i just donate my score. i feel i have an unfair advantage. even tho i dont set up the stakes, i just feel i shouldn't place.


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## coloradodave (Oct 1, 2005)

If it's such a problem, then let everyone use rangefinders. Problem solved. Everyone is on equal footing. You still have to make the shot even though you know the distance.


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## mocheese (Dec 19, 2003)

*Around home*

You better let the guys shoot who are setting the targets or you won't have too many shoots to go to. It's not easy getting help setting targets. We set a 30 target course every week, we have 4 range captains who are resposible for having the targets set and they are lucky to get a few people to help them. We have about 75 members at our club. It's funny how some people have time to shoot every day but some reason can't spare a couple hours on a day when a little work is involved. I do agree that they shouldn't have rangefinders. Occasionally you get one a little streched out but we have approximate max yardage anyways.


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## McDawg (Feb 22, 2005)

*3d shoot*

As long as they only set the targets and not the stakes. It is not a problem at our club.:wink:


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## jedicazador (Jun 20, 2008)

I never shot 3D, however I have competed in other shooting sports. I would like to shoot 3D, and if I volunteered to help set up, I sure would be upset if I couldn't shoot cause someone thought I was going to cheat, I dont know I'm a pretty honest person, I wouldn't want to have a trophy hanging around my house that I didn't earn. It would just leave a sour taste in my mouth. I couldnt be proud of a trophy I didnt earn.


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## WhitBri (Jan 30, 2007)

I've helped set up my home course many times. We don't officially range find the targets. Honestly I think the guys we have helping are so worried about getting the course set up they aren't out there memorizing ranges or pacing distances so I don't have a problem with it. I guess the guys we have set up are more hardcore bowhunters and not the trophy shooters anyway. The good shots come in and take the trophies at our shoots.


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## Bowtech531 (Apr 2, 2008)

they can shoot but , not for Money or Trophey. That would be like betting on the final score when the game was over already IMHO.


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## Bowtech531 (Apr 2, 2008)

I response to my own comments let me elaborate a little more. I know that most of us a good people that only like to shoot to get better or stay at the level we are at. We would die before we cheated ourselves or our fellows archers and friends. Well not everyone is created equal and there are the ones that have to always be on top no matter how they do it.

We did catch one such person at one of our clubs marking the yardage down on his hand in a secret code of his own. well if that is what he calls winning then I guess I will always be a looser.

So that is how I feel about it.


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## MOvenatic (May 20, 2006)

I help out as much as I can at our club setting up the 3D course. I don't remember all 36 target ranges. I do remember a few, but even those I screw up. Sometimes we have enough help that everyone is spread out setting up targets so that you aren't setting every single target. The list that we have with the yardages on them are also a guideline. We don't always go by that depending on the lay of the land. 

Plus it's usually the hunter class guys that set it up, so we make sure the open class stakes are more difficult.


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## Elf Friend (Mar 1, 2003)

OK, everyone has their opinion on this and I respect that but I have to ask. How many of you that said NO have ever set up a course?


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## lakertaker40 (Feb 8, 2005)

Sure wish we could get the people who said NO to help out at the clubs in my town. The yardage is the last thing on our minds when your getting chewed up by deer flys and other flying insects. C"Mon down 

Its not rilly an unfair advantage to setting up some one elts sets up the stake that I shoot from.


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## Greg Ingalls (Jul 22, 2007)

I have helped set up are clubs course. None of us shoot for score but all of us enjoy are hard work and shoot the course. This poll seems to be about 50% right now. To me that says it all. Why make half the peaple coming to your shoot mad. If you make peaple mad they won't come to your clubs shoot and spend money. I don't see what the big deal is. Go kick butt on another clubs course if your that good. Why would anybody want to win the course they set up.


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## GR5150 (Feb 11, 2006)

I used to be a range captain for the Abilene Bowhunters, if I set a course and new I was going to be shooting the same course, I would have someone on our safety comittee set the stakes for me. Took away any questions of me knowing the yardages. They still have to make the shot, setting the course or not. JMO


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## possum trapper (Nov 24, 2005)

can-am500girl said:


> these people set the target up and rangefindered it before it was shot. and then took home trophies for already knowing yardages?? no skill there.


So you are saying that everyone that knows the yardage will win the shoot???A little fyi they have marked yardage tournaments and from what I have seen not everyone shoots perfect.I thank the people who set up the courses its hard work with NO payback its for the club most of the time.R U worried about a $5 trophy or something?????


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## kidnutso (Aug 29, 2004)

Shoot, if they all have memories like mine, they would forget the distances by the next day anyway. 

I would think it would depend on the level of the shoot. Local shoots, what's the big deal? Championship type shoots...yeah...no trophies or awards for them.


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## Sniper1 (Jun 27, 2007)

Spoon13 said:


> We use an old guy that is a member of our club to set the stakes. He doesn't remember what he just did let alone remember the stake distances.


I think I met that guy!

I was going down the street and I saw this very old man sitting on a Bus Stop bench crying. I stopped, naturally, because I am a sensitive and caring person, sat beside him, and asked what was wrong that had the Gentleman so upset. He replied "I have a beautiful young wife 21 years old. She loves me so much! She cleans the house, cooks delicious meals of all my favorites, makes the most wonderful and satisfying love to me 5 times a day, and still manages to run a business that will net over $6,000,000 this year, which she gives to me. I have never been happier in my life. She's the most wonderful thing that any man could ever wish for!"

I was confused, so I asked "What's the problem? Sounds like you have a life that's great. Why are you crying?"

To which the old man replied "*Because I forgot where I live!"*

I set up the course for our club for over 3 years now. I use a lazer to make sure stakes don't exceed IBO ranges. I don't turn in a score. If anybody wants to spend 60 -80 hours a month on a 3D course clearing lanes, cutting weeds and grass, clearing poison ivy, huge rose bushes, pulling and cutting vines, burning brush after dragging it out of the woods, hauling targets, cutting fallen logs, hammering stakes, and doing a hundred other tasks to give shooters a excellent experience, feel free to take over. Some Clubs around here that give out little plaques have a Rangefinder Class, We don't post scores, because we don't have anybody willing to handle that. Wish we did. I haven't been able to shoot my bow since last Nov, because every time I go to the club I am working to get ready for the next shoot. Then on shoot day, I work registration, or the Novelty, or a hundred other things, after spending at least 10 - 11 hours the day before setting it up to my demanding standards. 
I have such a unfair advantage, even with my aches from my 3rd dose of Lyme disease in 4 years, that I got at the club.

It's more of a problem with jerks giong out alone or with friends, and using a rangefinder to "Win" money. And how do you prove "Magic Pencils"?


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## RNT (Feb 28, 2007)

In our group a couple of guys go out and stake everything and then the next goup go out and set up. The first group who do the staking do not get to compete. They shoot but cannot win.


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