# LDA Aluminum vs Carbon?



## AT_X_HUNTER (Aug 10, 2005)

The first question that comes to mind is, how were the 2613's shooting for you? If you can shoot the big shafts well then you shouldn't have a problem shooting carbon either. It's difficult for me to make any suggestions for you because I haven't had a 24.5" DL since...... well, we won't go there.:embara: 

The CXL's are a good arrow and they fit the NAA standards too. I am toying with a couple sets of them now. The nice thing about them is they can use 2213 components (like G-nock bushings and points). The best thing to do is shoot some if anyone you know has any you can use for a day or two. Try shooting groups at 40 yards and see which ones group best.

In your case I would probably lean towards the CXL's or something like them. I think you have a wider range of components to make the arrow fly the way you are wanting. Plus they are definately lighter and faster. They may not be as big as the 26's but if you can get them to fly and group better the scores will be the same or better and you will have more confidence in your equipment.


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## riley1131 (Sep 11, 2008)

I tried what you are talking about although the x7s I was using were splined decent 4 my bow 2312s with 200 nibs and i compared to to fatboys splined simlar im not through tring to get them to work better but so far I havent benn able to get the carbons to be as cosistent at 20 yards they are a lot faster but less forgiving im going to use them for 3d though.


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## mtmedic (Sep 20, 2004)

I switched over to the Gold Tip 30x pros last year from the 2613s just to see how they would do and in hopes that I could keep them around longer. I am a little rough on the aluminums as well and it always stuck in the back of my mind as to whether they were straight or not (I think too much and shoot too little):wink:. I followed GTs recommendations and cut these a 1/4" past my rest glued in some 150 grn tips and went to work. This is supposed to be the recipe for success. They flew very well out of my Constitution right away with minimal tuning but I can tell you they are stiff. I also shot the X-Cutters and they didn't group as well for some reason. I will be shooting an S4 this year and I hope they shoot well and if not it is back to the 2613s until something better comes along. I am the only one around here shooting them so I just have my experiences to share. I was shooting them at 50# with a 28.75"dl.


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## AT_X_HUNTER (Aug 10, 2005)

A couple years ago I was shooting GT 30X's with 150 gr. points. They shot great. Then I changed bows. Same DL, same #'s, rest, sight, everything the same. Those arrows would not shoot good groups. I tried some of my friends X-Jammers and instantly I noticed a huge difference. I have since gone through 4 or 5 dozen different sets of X-Jammers to find the right combo (making adjustments in length and point weight) untill I came to my current configuration. Finding the right arrow can be a real pain in the butt, and expensive.


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## jarheadhunter (Jan 9, 2007)

One of my shooting buddies bought 6 CXLs for 3D. He could not get them to tune for anything. We couldn't figure out if it was the weight forward or what. They wouldn't group and he couldn't score very well at all with them. He has 2 Fatboy's from last year that he would bring with him. After about 15-18 targets he would start shooting with the Fatboy's. I'm not pushing one brand over another. Just want you to know he couldn't get them to tune. :teeth:


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## mtmedic (Sep 20, 2004)

AT_X_HUNTER said:


> A couple years ago I was shooting GT 30X's with 150 gr. points. They shot great. Then I changed bows. Same DL, same #'s, rest, sight, everything the same. Those arrows would not shoot good groups. I tried some of my friends X-Jammers and instantly I noticed a huge difference. I have since gone through 4 or 5 dozen different sets of X-Jammers to find the right combo (making adjustments in length and point weight) untill I came to my current configuration. Finding the right arrow can be a real pain in the butt, and expensive.


I didn't need to hear that... :wink:


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## michigan ken (Mar 25, 2007)

*carbon*

I shot the x jammers last year 30" long with blazers with a total weight of 520 gr. The flew great and were very durrable. I shot the cxl 250's for 3D this summer and they flew great but they damaged very easy due to other arrow hits. I am planning on shooting the CXL's in doors this year to comply with NAA shoots, and so far the are shooting great for spots. I would not suggest shooting a single face target.
Good Luck


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## MissMary49 (Dec 8, 2005)

ive had a lot of people tell me at 20yds spine isnt much of an issue and reccomend my 2613.. i just feel that the reason i started with them is because i suck and i wouldnt beable to tell the diff. now that ive shot for a few years i thought maybe i can change to something better.. but people still saying my 2613s. and that i wont be able to find anything spined correctly. i know the CXLs come in the 150s, and that would be closer to spine for me. but if spine isnt as much of an issue, and i would like to fly faster (from slugs to snails) maybe i shouldnt sacrafice diamiter with the CXLs and just go for a fatty carbon?:wacko: 
maybe i need to walk away take a breath! lol


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## itchyfinger (Jun 14, 2007)

MM....I think you will find that the fat carbons are just as stiff as the alloys. I had a set of Victory Xringers and muuuuuuuuuch preferred the X7's. I had them in 2214 in proper spine. Then I got some 2712's after messing up 2 of the 2214's. The 27's made my bow feel better (they weighed 700gs ) and my point of impact was basically the same as the 2214's. BUT if I were to choice a fatty carbon I would definately pick up the linejammers or Xjammers from CE. You can get some really heavy adjustable points for those and still pick up a few FPS over the 26's or 27's.


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## riley1131 (Sep 11, 2008)

If your looking for a little more speed I would try the fatboys you could get them to spline better 4 u and still get around 50 or 60 fps faster than you are now by my figures that will put u around 200 fps. This might work well for you being that you are still going to be shooting pretty slow. Id say buy a few of them and try em out. It wont be hard to sell them as their going to be long to get them splined decent 4 u. Hell buy a half dozen fatboy 500s or beman 9.3s and if you dont like em ill buy them from you for $15 less than new going price. Then you can tell us your results. Thanks Riley. Oh yea cut the shafts 30 put 3" gateways on them and a 150 grain nibb and they will still be pretty stiff but should shoot pretty well.


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## riley1131 (Sep 11, 2008)

riley1131 said:


> If your looking for a little more speed I would try the fatboys you could get them to spline better 4 u and still get around 50 or 60 fps faster than you are now by my figures that will put u around 200 fps. This might work well for you being that you are still going to be shooting pretty slow. Id say buy a few of them and try em out. It wont be hard to sell them as their going to be long to get them splined decent 4 u. Hell buy a half dozen fatboy 500s or beman 9.3s and if you dont like em ill buy them from you for $15 less than new going price. Then you can tell us your results. Thanks Riley. Oh yea cut the shafts 30 put 3" gateways on them and a 150 grain nibb and they will still be pretty stiff but should shoot pretty well.


nuts&bolts
Instead of cutting to 30 right off the bat try this.Pick an arrow, any arrow,
and follow John Dudley's advice
for long range FITA arrows,
but with his advice concepts modified 
for indoor shooting....

Start with your favorite raw arrow shaft
FULL LENGTH
and install your points and
install your vanes/feathers.

1) shoot a full game
and do this for a month (my advice)
and record your average scores.

This helps negate the "new piece of equipment" syndrome.

2) whack off the vanes and cut off 1/2-inch
and refletch, and then shoot these 5 test arrows
and shoot for a month,
and record your average scores over 30 days.

Yup, a full 30 days.

3) whack off the vanes on a full length arrows
and cut a full 1-inch off the raw shaft,
and fletch up these test arrows.

Record your average score for 30 days.


Now,
you have average scores
for a full length set of arrows,
and
for a set of arrows 1/2-inch shorter than full length
and
for a set of arrow 1-inch shorter than full length.

IF your average scores are improving,
then
take the longer set of 5 arrows
and whack off another 1-inch.

Now,
you have 5 arrows that are 1-inch shorter than full length

and

you have 5 arrows that are 1.5-inches shorter
than full length.


You get the idea.

If shorter arrows work better than longer arrows,
take the longest set of 5 arrows,
and whack off another full inch.


This way,
you have a set of 1/2-inch longer test arrows
and
you have a set of 1/2-inch shorter test arrows.


Your two sets of 5 arrows
are always 1/2-inch apart in test length,
and you will have average test scores over 30 days.


Does this take a really long time
to figure out the best length?

Yup.


Does this give you unbeatable results
which apply to YOU and YOUR BOW...

Yup.

Only real world testing way to figure out
what works best for YOU and YOUR BOW.


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## kgoold (Aug 12, 2008)

if your shooting indoors speed doesnt matter the slower the more forgiving it could be(more time to stabalize) i whould say the x7 are probabely your beast choice if there not grouping good for you cut them a 1/2 in and then shoot if they still dont group cut another 1/2 in until they group. Good luck


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## SERBIANSHARK (Nov 15, 2006)

*?*

Is there currently an all carbon arrow, just as big as the 2712's ????


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## introverted (Jan 2, 2009)

riley1131 said:


> If your looking for a little more speed I would try the fatboys you could get them to*spline*


SPINE NOT SPLINE

caps lock ftw


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## itchyfinger (Jun 14, 2007)

SERBIANSHARK said:


> Is there currently an all carbon arrow, just as big as the 2712's ????


Carbon Express, Victory and Gold Tip make arrows in 27 series. :wink:


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## SERBIANSHARK (Nov 15, 2006)

*?*

If looking at the arrows of the shootoff archers last year in Vegas....what arrows were used by the majority of them. Anyone at Vegas last year?


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## introverted (Jan 2, 2009)

itchyfinger said:


> Carbon Express, Victory and Gold Tip make arrows in 27 series. :wink:


i've heard that carbon express makes one, but have yet to see it advertised online

i haven't heard that victory and gold tip make one

just the 26 diameter ones, a.k.a. .406"

and i can't find anything that supports that online, anyone have any documentation on these? i'm really interested in them, and the spine and available components


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## vanguard (Oct 23, 2005)

*triple X*

I belive gold tip has one out same as a 2712 its called the Triple X


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

Goldtip and CE both have 27 dia shafts out this year. And GT came out with a lighter 30x. Food for thought there.


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## mtmedic (Sep 20, 2004)

Here is a little info from Taylor at GT. He told me they are reworking the website and it should be done in a week or two.

"Triple X shafts should start showing up at shops and
distributors this week, we're shipping them now. They are a 27/64
diameter, a .140 spine, and they weight 9.4 gpi. Should be
paper-punching machines!"


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## Kstigall (Feb 24, 2004)

I've been shooting Carbon Expresses X-Jammer -27's for a couple of weeks. 
I bought them from Lancaster Archery Supply.

Many were shooting them this past weekend at the Lancaster Classic.


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## introverted (Jan 2, 2009)

i know one of carbon expresses pro staffers, he's got the linejammer 27's, they're still not on any websites though 

they look cool though!

found some on http://www.bowhunterssuperstore.com/arrow-shafts-carbon-express-c-520_580.html

they're 144.90 a doz

i wonder if i can get a deal!

anyone know the specs on the gold tip or the victory? .190 pretty darned stiff


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## mtmedic (Sep 20, 2004)

Here is the info I got on the new GT Triple X shafts from GT:

They are a 27/64diameter, a .140 spine, and they weight 9.4 gpi. 

I can't guarantee this will stick around as the last time I posted this info my post was deleted.


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## introverted (Jan 2, 2009)

nah it wasn't, i just didn't see it!

i can now!


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## mtmedic (Sep 20, 2004)

introverted said:


> nah it wasn't, i just didn't see it!
> 
> i can now!


That is so weird... I looked for that post five minutes yesterday and it wasn't there. I thought it was deleted although I couldn't see why. Now this morning it is right there. I swear I haven't been drinking but I think I just might go start. :tongue::tongue:


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## 60X (Nov 8, 2002)

I switched from 2613's to large carbon arrows a few years ago by accident. I got a good deal on some line jammers and was just gonna resale them. I tried them and noticed how much more forgiving they were. They were so quick out of the bow. I went back and forth and it was no doubt for my setups. This year I tried the 2712's because I hard so much about them. I shot some good rounds and some not so good rounds. I went back to my linejammers and haven't shot many 9's in practice since. The 27's weight 677 and my linejammers weigh 350. I just got some x jammer 27's to try tomorrow and I'm hoping they're just as good. They weigh 477 though but have 210gr points. If I can get some 120's that would put them lighter but we'll play and see.


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## Kstigall (Feb 24, 2004)

The X-Jammer -27's have a .295 spine and are about 8.6+/- GPI (can't remember) but they are very light.


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## introverted (Jan 2, 2009)

i've heard a lot about how you shouldn't cut them more than a half inch from the rest, i just can't see that working, do the x jammer 27's have weight forward? i'm only shooting like 47lbs indoors, i'm not even sure they'd work out


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