# How to Get to Next Level?



## r49740 (Dec 7, 2006)

Any advice on how to get to the next level? I have been shooting Vegas targets lately due to a league I am in. For the league I am a 442 shooter(450 round) and usually average only about 11 or 12 x's.

I shot a practice round by myself and shot a 445(which is my highest by 1) and 25 x's(which my previous high was 17).

So what can I do to keep getting better besides practicing. I practice in my basement about 3 nights a week. One night on shoot with my eyes closed trying to work on the release. One night I shoot eyes open and just work on my bow arm after the shot(I have a tendency to peek a bit). And the third night I will draw aim until I cant anymore, and then let down and repeat.

I have felt since I have gotten the bow that the draw length is a bit too long for me and I don't feel as though I hold steady enough because of that. I ordered new strings and cables yesterday and was told that Hoyts 28" is actually 28 3/16". So I am having the strings made without the 3/16". Will that difference be noticable?

Thanks for the help.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

Who told you that they are long....I shot nothing but Hoyts for 10 years until this year...

With a little twisting of the strings/cables there is no reason that you can't get your draw to 28". Ordering shorter strings and cables is not what you need...you need to set the bow to YOUR draw. 3/16" is nothing...twist it down to your draw.


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## tjandy (Jun 10, 2005)

Brown Hornet said:


> Who told you that they are long....I shot nothing but Hoyts for 10 years until this year...
> 
> With a little twisting of the strings/cables there is no reason that you can't get your draw to 28". Ordering shorter strings and cables is not what you need...you need to set the bow to YOUR draw. 3/16" is nothing...twist it down to your draw.


How about the original question BH, I would like to hear what you have to say. 5 spot league I am a 297-298 average and would like to get to the 299 - 300 level this year. Shot my first 300 last year and never repeated it. :sad:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

tjandy said:


> How about the original question BH, I would like to hear what you have to say. 5 spot league I am a 297-298 average and would like to get to the 299 - 300 level this year. Shot my first 300 last year and never repeated it. :sad:


Stop trying to shoot a 300...worry ONLY about your X count. I have said it before and I will say it again....I would rather shoot a 299 55-59X's then a 300 40X round anyday of the week. Everyone misses once in a while even the best in the world....but if you are shooting 40X's you missed 20 times.

The level he is at is different then where you are therefore your goals and approach will be different. 

To many people worry about score....when they should be worrying about making a good shot 60 times (or however many arrows the round requires). There is nothing you can do about that one in the blue so move on.

But sometimes the problems of getting to the next stop on your list are equipment, form or shot technique.

Once I got my form and execution down a few years ago my scores jumped from 295-300 30-40x rounds to 300 55-58X rounds over night (not really over night but when the light came on it was a couple weeks). 

Now I am trying to find the light switch again  But I am getting close.:wink:


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## tjandy (Jun 10, 2005)

Brown Hornet said:


> Stop trying to shoot a 300...worry ONLY about your X count. I have said it before and I will say it again....I would rather shoot a 299 55-59X's then a 300 40X round anyday of the week. Everyone misses once in a while even the best in the world....but if you are shooting 40X's you missed 20 times.
> 
> The level he is at is different then where you are therefore your goals and approach will be different.
> 
> ...


Did you have a coach to help you with the technique, I think mine is good, but I bet it is not??????????


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

tjandy said:


> Did you have a coach to help you with the technique, I think mine is good, but I bet it is not??????????


No...not really. I have a knack for being able to pick up changes very fast. I knew who to talk to and they got me there without seeing them.:wink:


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

Brown Hornet said:


> Stop trying to shoot a 300...worry ONLY about your X count. I have said it before and I will say it again....I would rather shoot a 299 55-59X's then a 300 40X round anyday of the week. Everyone misses once in a while even the best in the world....but if you are shooting 40X's you missed 20 times.
> 
> The level he is at is different then where you are therefore your goals and approach will be different.
> 
> ...


The switch is behind your eyes and infront of the back of your noggin' :wink::tongue:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

JAVI said:


> The switch is behind your eyes and infront of the back of your noggin' :wink::tongue:


I know...but it isn't 100% comfortable yet.:wink:


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## r49740 (Dec 7, 2006)

Thanks for the responses. Some of this probably belongs in a the tuning forum. But when you twist the strings or cable to shorten the draw length, it brings the cams out of tune in which you have to turn back. Unless I have done it completely wrong, which I assume I have, I haven't been able to get it. 

Second part, outside of not thinking about score and you picking up shooting flaws easily, what do you guys do to help get to the next level? Any aiming, holding, drawing, etc drills that you do that helps?


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

Learn to never shoot a shot that isn't prefect in every detail...:wink:


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## tjandy (Jun 10, 2005)

JAVI said:


> Learn to never shoot a shot that isn't prefect in every detail...:wink:


What I think he is saying, let down as often as you need, until you feel everything is right. This is the only time you should be releasing an arrow.:thumb: This is an aspect that I have a very difficult time with. I hardly ever let down. Soemthing I need to work on. :wink:


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## tjandy (Jun 10, 2005)

Brown Hornet said:


> No...not really. I have a knack for being able to pick up changes very fast. I knew who to talk to and they got me there without seeing them.:wink:


Talk to me!!!!!!!! :wink:


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## supernova (Oct 3, 2005)

Another suggestion would be to video record yourself, then find someone to analysis what you're doing.


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## tjandy (Jun 10, 2005)

supernova said:


> Another suggestion would be to video record yourself, then find someone to analysis what you're doing.


I actually have thought of that. I may try that this weekend, if the camcorder still works. :thumb:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

tjandy said:


> Talk to me!!!!!!!! :wink:


How you doin'...


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## tjandy (Jun 10, 2005)

Brown Hornet said:


> How you doin'...


Good and you? Merry Christmas. :thumb::darkbeer:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

tjandy said:


> Good and you? Merry Christmas. :thumb::darkbeer:


A little out of it today...damn Thurs football and work the next morning don't mix.ukey:


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## tjandy (Jun 10, 2005)

Brown Hornet said:


> A little out of it today...damn Thurs football and work the next morning don't mix.ukey:


Well then I am doing much better than you. Got up, went to the club, did my archery workout this morning and now I am at work, feeling pretty good.


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## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

JAVI said:


> The switch is behind your eyes and infront of the back of your noggin' :wink::tongue:


I've often thought that a partial labotomy would lead to higher scores. Just take that portion of my brain that gets in the way of shooting.


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

Bobmuley said:


> I've often thought that a partial labotomy would lead to higher scores. Just take that portion of my brain that gets in the way of shooting.


It takes time to learn but one can program the brain with a series of auto responses. Some call it subconscious, but I prefer to call it auto response to a controlled stimulus. 

Similar to how you respond to an itch… you don’t plan each move necessary to scratch you just do it, even if you’re actively involved in complex mental exercises.


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## Jeff Heeg (Nov 24, 2005)

I’m not even sure one should focus on x counts because in time this to becomes a barrier once the 300 game is a norm, even at times we tend to apply goals and pressure against our selves which in turn can work for or against you. The ultimate goal one should focus on would be to have completed a clean shot, one that felt rock solid and went off just as desired, if this is repeated shot after shot the scores will reflect from this, also the mind set is concentrating on the feel of that perfect shot versus point standing and scores. 
Blind bale shooting with your eyes closed has helped many, but yet to some as soon as they end up focusing on the X or any other type of target that their aiming at they tend to momentarily freeze up, tense up or start to panic somewhat because of the timing has just been altered.
One method that tends to work well, is to shoot every other arrow into the back stop while the other is shot at a target, at first your arrow that is fired into the bare backstop will go off perfect and then the arrow that is shot at the target tends to take longer to go off if you apply this practice you will find in time that the arrow shot at the target will be as smooth and shot in the same fashion as the blank backstop area. Thus bringing together the fact of being able to complete a perfect shot while having to aim at a small target and doing so repetitively.

Good Luck :wink:


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## supernova (Oct 3, 2005)

Glad to see you posting in this section Jeff. Next time bring Blindbat and Renee with you..............The cheeseheads can take over this forum

Mr. Button and TJ have already been posting here.

Sometime after Christmas I want to get together with you and Adam to switch out bows.

Talk to you soon

Rick H.


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## archery_madam (Oct 25, 2007)

Supernova, here I am! LOL! Stumbled upon it with a search of my name, ironically.

I agree with Jeff H. I've been alternating shooting at a face and shooting at nothing (the bale or a blank spot of the face) when practicing my indoor game. After a month or so of practicing this way, I only need to shoot the blank spot once in a while to remind myself of the feel of the great shot. It's helped my consistency tremendously. I've always known my focus should be on a good feeling shot and not the score, but until I started focusing my practice sessions this way, I couldn't focus my mind in the correct place. I could never entirely focus on blank-baling or my sessions would be very short. This new practice routine is a good compromise for me.

The key (and my goal) is making every shot feel the same. You'll be doing that and one day your score with sneak up on you and suprise you like it has me!


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## supernova (Oct 3, 2005)

archery_madam said:


> Supernova, here I am! LOL! Stumbled upon it with a search of my name, ironically.


Glad to see you joined the Party:darkbeer: I forgot your new username:embara: As you can see, I'm keeping the Nova name even though I'm no longer shooting the Merlins.:wink:


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## jarlicker (Jul 29, 2002)

All of what has been writen already has worked well for me.
Remember I am a just a Joe. That shoots pretty good.

What continues to amaze about most mid level archers are two things

*I always ask people when they are having problems do you know what a good shot is.* 
Most people do not know what it takes for them to make a good shot. 
I suggest that you sit down and write down what a good shot is. 
Dont leave out any details. 
Now start with building up your shot to get to that point.
Work at making it repeatable. 
You must concentrate each time on these details. 
Most people think they can do several things at one time. 
I find most can not. Do one step at a time, do it in the same order each time. 
When something does not feel or seem correct start over. 
Develope a positive mental check list. 
Once you can get yourself shooting several good shots in an end. keep working at it.
Remember you are not looking to have the world most perfect shot. You need to just have a good reatable shot. Expecting total perfection each and every time is unrealistic and leads to negativity.
Stay positive, learn to be relaxed, stay focus and you must have fun.
Dont put undo pressure on yourself.

I look at each arrow and each game as just another one of a zillion I have shot and am going to shoot in my life. Just have fun.

I read a article by Mike Leiter which helped me out a lot.
He was discussing shooting back tension release.
Now keep in mind Mike is one of the all time great target archers in the world.
He was talking about the futility in try to shoot perfect shots during a Field archery round. He stated that on on a good day he would average only like 20 - 25 good strong shots in a round.Which is 112 shots. The type of shot that he new the second the shot happened the arrow was going to the x ring. Usually there was a lot less great shots in a round, the thing was his scores were always excellent. His reasoning was he new he did not need to have perfect shots each and every time for the arrow to hit where he aimed it. That just a good shot worked just has well most of the time. He was amazed at how often a poor shot found its mark. The key is that he always just kept trying to shoot the same shot each and every time. Trying to repeat the feel of those perfect ones. Knowing and accepting the fact that the 20 to 25 really good shots in a round was about as well as he could ever do. He never beat himself up cause every shot was not perfect in his own mind. In reality it truelly was though. The scores proved it.

Once you build your shot to where you want it now come the second thing

*Why when an archery makes a poor shot or has a bad game do they try to fix something.* 
They go and do major changes to their form or equipment?
The fix to their problem is stated right above in the written check list they made for them selfs. While you are still building up your shot working on form items work on one thing at a time. Stick to your checklist (Shot sequence).
When you find positive changes you made adjust your check list accordingly.
When shooting for score stick to your game plan. Your checklist. Shoot one arrow at a time. Forget about the score. Simplify your goals, one good arrow, two good arrows, an end of good arrows, two ends of good arrows, then three and so on.

I try to have a positive mind set at all times. I have even started to loosen up not shooting at a target face, because until I am loose I can not expect myself to shoot good shots. I dont want to look at my target face with holes not in the center. I dont want to teach myself it is o/k to shoot a not so good shot at the target face. I just blank bale about 5 to ten shots. Then I am ready to go. When I shoot at the target I am all business.


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## sharkred7 (Jul 19, 2005)

Brown Hornet said:


> Stop trying to shoot a 300...worry ONLY about your X count. I have said it before and I will say it again....I would rather shoot a 299 55-59X's then a 300 40X round anyday of the week. Everyone misses once in a while even the best in the world....but if you are shooting 40X's you missed 20 times.
> 
> The level he is at is different then where you are therefore your goals and approach will be different.
> 
> ...


This is the technique I use also. To shoot the next level past the one I am on. 60X to shoot 300's and 60 INSIDE/OUT X's to shoot 60 X's. 
Plus I can feel better about the 59X 299 I shot last week:tongue:
John


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