# Bowtech Equalizer



## KBacon (Nov 13, 2003)

Where's the pics?


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

I'll bet that they don't want the competition to see this system too soon


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## PABowhntr (Oct 2, 2002)

Without even seeing the specs you can chalk me up for a Constitution with the Equalizer cam system. I just loooooovvvvveee trying new gear!!


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## 500 fps (Oct 13, 2002)

and if it's a Bowtech dual....you know it's gonna be fast!


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## Jerry/NJ (Jan 17, 2003)

PABowhntr said:


> *Without even seeing the specs you can chalk me up for a Constitution with the Equalizer cam system. I just loooooovvvvveee trying new gear!! *


I know you do Frank, and I do too ! I didnt want a new bow this year but it sounds as tho I will be looking closely at this one.


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## x-ring-1 (Oct 31, 2002)

*interesting...*

We sell them in our shop and have not received any info but it sounds like a great system if it works!! could be a fun year!!!!!


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## TimMTP (Dec 4, 2002)

I'm not seeing any of these press releases on their website...


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## La Crosse (Sep 20, 2004)

X-ring-1,

It definitely works.


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## SPECTRE (Aug 20, 2003)

This is going to be interesting.... 


Can't wait to play


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## Olink (Jan 10, 2003)

Dual cables? So does that mean it has 4 cables total? Do they route through the cable slide, connect to the riser, or is it some sort of shoot-thru system? Anybody want to make a guess????


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## JeramyK (Jul 27, 2004)

TimMTP said:


> *I'm not seeing any of these press releases on their website... *


They are posted now.


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## jmac_or (Dec 30, 2003)

Sounds kinda like a hybrid, where the cams are slaved together via the control cable. I am interested to see what these look like.

John


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## Jungle (Aug 1, 2004)

> A typical shooter’s peak strength comes at the front of the draw and gradually tapers until rollover. The Binary Cam System is designed to match this strength.


Ouch!!! 

Jungle.


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## Trushot_archer (Dec 19, 2002)

All other cam systems out the window??

This Equalizer covering the bases on all the 2005 lineup or are there still Dually options??


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## nontypical (Jan 4, 2004)

what is the let off? Sounds like a one cam at each end, where the power cable ends in the center position of the cam instead of a split yoke to the limbs. Very interesting idea.


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## La Crosse (Sep 20, 2004)

Jungle,

I've seen your thoughts and reasoning on your Moon Bow post that lead to your "ouch" comment above.

However, if you (or anyone) pull against a strain gage at brace distances of 6" to 30", then plot the results, you'll find that Bowtech's statement is correct ("A typical shooter’s peak strength comes at the front of the draw and gradually tapers until rollover. The Binary Cam System is designed to match this strength.").

At least wait until you've tried the Equalizer system before you knock it. I can tell by your posts that you know of what you speak, and for that reason, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.


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## Jungle (Aug 1, 2004)

La Crosse,

I love cams, and the excitement in hearing of a new one! I’ll quote Duggaboy – A man’s mind is like a parachute…it works better when it’s open.

I’m anxious to see them.

Jungle


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## pdq 5oh (Sep 7, 2002)

Kelly, the Black Knight will still be around.


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

I can't wait to see this new cam system From the description, I have an idea what it might be like. Not a dual cam but yet it sounds like there is a "cam" on each end. If it's what I think it is and how it works, it might just make everything else obsolete I hope it's patented, maybe BowTech can liscence it's use on other manufacture's bows. If it's going to be available on 4 different bows, it must be good!!


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## La Crosse (Sep 20, 2004)

Walks with a gimp,

Patent pending.


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

What will be the axle lengths of the bows it will be avaliable on? Will they all be short or will there be a 37"+ model?


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## La Crosse (Sep 20, 2004)

Check out the Bowtech 2005 sneak peek post.

At least one will be 40" axle to axle.


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## nontypical (Jan 4, 2004)

Calling this a "2 cam" isn't completely accuarate is it? I got a good look at it and it's a little more than a "2 cam". 

Like a boat motor only this one has both types.

Still like to know the let off.


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## 500 fps (Oct 13, 2002)

Since the Equalizer is going to be offered on 4 models (I think that's what I read) I predict they wiil have the 40" spot version, a fast version, a short version, and a middle of the road all around hunting version. Can't wait to find out though.


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## pdq 5oh (Sep 7, 2002)

I'm hoping for a mid length hunting bow (33-35"), and a longer 3D bow (38-40"). A nice short bow for use in a blind would be nice, too.


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## Trushot_archer (Dec 19, 2002)

Thanks Phil...

Come on November 1st!


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## KBacon (Nov 13, 2003)

5 days and counting...


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## nontypical (Jan 4, 2004)

I guess the patent that I was reviewing, though it sounds like this system, may not actually be Bowtech's. Will wait and see.


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

I don't believe you can view patent pendings.


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## PABowhntr (Oct 2, 2002)

> Sounds like a one cam at each end, where the power cable ends in the center position of the cam instead of a split yoke to the limbs.


I tend to agree with nontypical. That is what it sounds like to me as well. If that is the case then I wonder how it would compare to a typical hybrid system in terms of tuning, etc....


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## Guest (Oct 28, 2004)

*Tuning*

From my inquiries. Set up nock level. Will paper tune with virtually any spine arrow. level nock travel, very little side to side nock travel. Speeds still good, actual results may end up better on some bows than what advertised speeds will be. Don't expect a 350 fps, but it will be good speed. Think it will require tighter tolerances on limb deflection weight.

Don't think cam will be modular, but will be a 1/2 inch adjustment capability. (up or down, I don't know). Draw stop on bottom cam. As soon as I know exactly which model is which, I have asked my dealer to order a 28/70 on a 33 to 35 inch bow.

Unfortunately, I will be out of town next Monday on business trip, then leave for Elk hunt in Colo. the evening I return. So you all may see details before I do.


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

> Will paper tune with virtually any spine arrow.


Spine doesn't effect paper tune on a compound bow with release aid anyway, grip torque does so this is an irrelevent feature. I get bullet holes now with any spine arrow with my Hoyt right now.

Looking forward to playing with one of these new cams however.


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## quickdrawkinker (Feb 13, 2004)

A Bowtech rep told me that the company has been working on a new bow for the last couple of years that will be released this year that has an IBO of 414!!!!!!!!!!!! He didn't know if it will have the new cam system or not--has anybody else heard of this bow????


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

*Quote from an un named source;*

We originally had two draw stops, but
when one stops you can't even begin to move the bottom cam. You can draw
the bow at the bottom or top of the string and both cams draw exactly
the same in rotation.  Sounds very,,, straight and level nock travel to me


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## Ausie-guy (Dec 7, 2002)

Ok walks what else did this unnamed source tell you.

Sounds even more interesting, come on the 1st I have money burning a hole in my pocket


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## Guest (Oct 28, 2004)

*Well, let me tell you*

" we hear stories about how something is going to be a shooter. Guess we will have to wait and see for ourselves."

If it is a very accurate shooting system, Then I am really hoping it will compensate for my bluring eyesite and punchy trigger finger.

LOL

Aussie Guy - I figured you had all the scoop since I thought you were on their staff. Anything you can share. 

My stuff is all second hand, but makes some sense.


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

*Begging and Pleading helps!!!*

Here's all I found out!!! Quote;
We took a 60# limb on top a 70# limb on
the bottom, readjusted the nock and it shot a perfect hole through paper
bare shafting.


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## Guest (Oct 28, 2004)

*Matt/pa needs to share more stuff with us*

He started all the quessing, etc.


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## Rangeball (Sep 30, 2003)

I imagine Matt is about to EXPLODE and has a whole bunch of info ready to cut and paste at 12:01 am 11-1-04...


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## Matt / PA (Feb 21, 2003)

I'm still here........

"Walks With a Gimp's" "Unnamed source" has some pretty good info.....who's tree did you shake for that info?

A little more about the cam system before someone has a stroke.

It works like two single cams (and looks like it too). It has one draw
stop (only needs one) and the two cams are hooked together and work
similar to a block and tackle. "Walks W/ a Gimp" is correct about the variations in limb deflection in testing.
Also for example..... If you take five twists out of one cable on a
conventional dual cam you change the point of impact dramatically (which
would simulate what would happen if a cable stretched in the heat). With
this new system you would have to work hard to screw it up.
Multiple arrows were shot with a mess of wrong spines, tip weights, you name it, they all shot like a
dream. 
It picks up weight quickly for the first five inches and then breaks
over and rolls off smoothly to the back,(Draw cycle is complimentary to the natural power of your body when drawing a bow.......use the big back muscles early and then fade as you get into the smaller shoulder muscles as you rotate) and the valley is like that of a single. It looks and hooks up like
two single cams (it doesn't have a split harness on either end). The
cams are symmetrical and look like a right hand version on the bottom
and a left hand version on top (right handed bow), except there is only 
one draw stop post on the top cam. It is also correct that you can draw
the bow from the bottom or top of the string and both cams will draw exactly the same in rotation.
If a cable stretches it would have to stretch
beyond what any material out there does to change the point of impact. 
It is an unreal forgiving design with respect to tuning, draws great and works like a dream......It's gonna be the center of a lot of talk for 2005 and I would guess well beyond.

All for now. Boy I sure hope Pat picks up the slack on this while I'm gone........won't be around a computer until next Sunday the 7th on a bowhunting trip.
Can you imagine if I'm the only source of info!
 You'll all be in the loony bin til' I get back.


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## Nock Hunter (Aug 12, 2004)

Nooooooooo........come back we need more


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## Jerry/NJ (Jan 17, 2003)

I can see it now. I will end up with one of these bows, I just know it


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## deerheaven (Apr 27, 2003)

Jerry"s quote:I can see it now. I will end up with one of these bows, I just know it 


If there shipping November 1,Jerry consider mines on the way


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## MQ1 (Feb 25, 2003)

I will definately be getting a BowTech. Not sure which one. I will be a shooting for a shop this year and BowTech will be the weapon of choice.


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## La Crosse (Sep 20, 2004)

Matt,

Just for the record, walks with a gimp didn't get it from me.


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## Tur-bow (Oct 4, 2002)

I will more than likely be getting one of the long ATA ones. Cant wait.


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## scottland (Oct 29, 2004)

WOW! That new cam system sounds pretty spicy.
Put those on a 33-35" ATA bow, would make an awsome hunting setup.

If those cams perform as said, that is just one less thing to have to worry about when hunting, where murphy's law seems to always be in affect.


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## PABowhntr (Oct 2, 2002)

> I can see it now. I will end up with one of these bows, I just know it


Join the club. 

A nice, nifty little hunting bow and a second, longer one, for 3D.


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## x-ring-1 (Oct 31, 2002)

*Ouch*

That's what I'm going to be saying when my wife puts the smack down on me when I show up with one of these!!!!!!!


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## PJBinMI (Oct 31, 2003)

any IDEA on speed yet from these and is the speed rating going to be correct? 
Patrick


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## Double Lung 'Em (Dec 19, 2002)

*Unofficial*

PBJinMI here are some unofficial specs & speeds

There is a 37.5" 7.25"brace clocked at 323fps
There is a 33.75 7" brace at 328fps
There is a 40.25" 8.25"brace at 308fps (it has a 30" riser)
There is a 31.875" 7.5" brace at 313fps
These are all with the new binary cam system

I'm leaning towards the first one, something about that 30" riser says bend me please.


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## nontypical (Jan 4, 2004)

Are any of these on VFT configurations? Thanks.


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## PJBinMI (Oct 31, 2003)

Interesting, not the speeds I was hoping for. They arn't much if any faster than what I have. They'll have to shoot good to win me over. I'm a 27.5 draw so I loose alot with the draw length. And the VFT they have now is as fast as any of those without the hassel of some double cam set up ???

Patrick


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## scottland (Oct 29, 2004)

PJBinMI said:


> *Interesting, not the speeds I was hoping for. *


How much more speed are you looking for?
I mean if those are close to the actual specs, 

~330fps ~34" ATA ~7" brace height, all with a smooth drawing ultra-forgiving cam setup, what more in a hunting setup could you ask for.

You're pretty much seeing a plateau as far as bow speeds are concerned. Even with today's ultra-effcient cam setups, you can only get as much energy out as the amount of energy you put in.


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## PJBinMI (Oct 31, 2003)

Well first of all. 
Your doing well IF your bowtech does factory speed. And the 330 is at 70 lbs 30" draw. I want 300+ for a 27.5 draw. figuring the old BK night would do it , I was hoping the new ones would with the added bennifit of a higher Brace hieght!!! 
With those posted speeds by the time you add to the string and shorten the length, they won't be any faster than anything else you can buy.
Thats what I want

Patrick


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## PJBinMI (Oct 31, 2003)

Well first of all. 
Your doing well IF your bowtech does factory speed. And the 330 is at 70 lbs 30" draw. I want 300+ for a 27.5 draw. figuring the old BK night would do it , I was hoping the new ones would with the added bennifit of a higher Brace hieght!!! 
With those posted speeds by the time you add to the string and shorten the length, they won't be any faster than anything else you can buy.
Thats what I want

Patrick


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## shooting3d (Jan 12, 2004)

*2205*

you think all of you guys are ready.I cant wait. I check this post out all the time,but i do know this the mid-end of Nov. i will be getting 1-2 of these bows.And i heard of all the same things everybody else has but they say it is going to be a awesome line up boys


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## pdq 5oh (Sep 7, 2002)

PJBinMi


> Your doing well IF your bowtech does factory speed.


That hasn't been a problem for me. My P40 Dually chrono'd 311 at 58#, 29", 306 gr arrow. Hush kit, loop, and peep. All of the others I've had were within the speeds stated on the BCs. All those 05 bows, with 7" or more brace, are still faster than nearly all other bows with less brace height.


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## La Crosse (Sep 20, 2004)

First of all, Bowtech doesn't overstate their speeds. They test each bow and annotate the tested speed on the birth certificate. I know this for a fact; I've seen it done.

However, the tested speed doesn't include string silencers, nocking point, etc. Also, their Black Knight type dual cam is particular about setup when it comes to speed. If you twist your cables or string and the rotation of the cams is affected, speed is lost.

With the Equalizer, I would venture that any disparity between the tested speed and what you might find could be less or perhaps, nonexistent. There's a couple of reasons for this:
1) The Equalizer isn't as critical in terms of cam rotation, and the cam rotation is much less likely to change since the whole system is very stable.
2) Previously, Bowtech was pushing the limits of what could be done with a conventional dual cam, and posted speeds were right at the high end. With an Equalizer system shooting in the 325-330 neighborhood with a 7" brace height, the system isn't anywhere near its limits. In short, it's as fast as they want it to be. If they weren't at all concerned about smooth, 370 wouldn't be difficult to achieve.

As a sidenote, high let-off is easy with the Equalizer. It is actually a simple matter to design more than 100% letoff into it-why anyone would want to, I don't know, but it can be done.

Anyway, I've shot a version of the Equalizer quite a bit, and it's for real. What is striking is the perfect arrow flight, the unbelievable forgiveness, and the way it settles in steady at full draw.

Spot shooters know what it feels like to release and immediately know that they've thrown an arrow 2" to the left. With this new system, they'll be surprised to find that the arrow only landed 1" to the left. It's that forgiving.

Anyway, enough rambling. Can't wait to see it hit the market.


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## shooting3d (Jan 12, 2004)

*LaCrosse*

amen to that cant wait to see everybodies/mine new line up


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## FallFever (Mar 8, 2003)

How do you design in more than 100% let-off ?? You would be holding negative poundage!!!

(X)


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

PJBinMI said:


> *Interesting, not the speeds I was hoping for. They arn't much if any faster than what I have. They'll have to shoot good to win me over. I'm a 27.5 draw so I loose alot with the draw length. And the VFT they have now is as fast as any of those without the hassel of some double cam set up ???
> 
> Patrick *


 Keep in mind that this is a brand new cam system and not many people have even seen it yet. I'm sure that in time, it will be tweeked to maximun speed as it evolves into the future. Or maybe it will be tweeked to maximum forgivness and comfort, which ever the public shows the demand for. Time will tell, but it sure sounds like the real deal in nock travel, accuracy and speed and quiet operation


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

Sorry, I forgot to add that thinking about the previous comment about "stiff draw cycle for the first 5 or 6 inches of draw", there might not be as much speed loss at shorter draw lengths as conventional single and dual cam systems have shown. We'll just have to wait and see what she does


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## PJBinMI (Oct 31, 2003)

thx guys,

I'm not trying to bash here. 
I DO shoot bowtech for a local shop and we've had mixed results is all. Maybe its our inexperience not the bows!??
And I'm very excited to see the new bows. IF they are as forgiving as you say AND fast I sure they will be a winner.
As a short draw length shooter I am always looking for a bow that is less sensitive to loosing speed as the length is shortened.
Can't wait here either!!!
And for the record mine now is a04 Patroit at 27.5" draw at 5 grains 66lbs and crono's @ 290, just always looking for more.
god I can't wait lol

La Crosse, when you were shooting was anyone shooting at 27 -28" draw any idea what the speeds were?

Patrick


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## SilentElk (Oct 6, 2004)

(X)-terminator said:


> *How do you design in more than 100% let-off ?? You would be holding negative poundage!!!
> 
> (X) *


Interesting thought. I would guess if something had over 100% letoff you would have to push the string forward to hold it back? 105% letoff on a 60 lbs bow = 3.0 lbs forward push needed? Doesnt seem right somehow


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## old_rogue (Oct 1, 2004)

*First of all, "Bowtech doesn't overstate their speeds"*

but they do understate there draw lengths....
i have owned 2 new bowtecs this year and both drew over an inch longer then the mod spec.....(both bows were in spec as far as axel to axel length and brace go, even took off the strings and measured them..they were correct)

don't get me wronge, i love there bows.......but i've found this to be true, you think the speed your getting is at one draw length but your actually drawing considerably more...

great product
looking forward to seeing the new lineup


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## La Crosse (Sep 20, 2004)

Okay, here's what happens when you get over 100% letoff.

First, the instant the cam rotates past the 100% letoff point, the string goes limp. The cams continue to rotate (quickly, I might add) until they come back to "only" 100% letoff. The shooter is left standing there with a limp string and a bow with cams that are rotated as if at full draw. The only way to "uncock" the bow, is to put it in a press, or, if you have a lot of guts and not a lot of brains, you could reach up and push a cam forward. It's kind of scary, really.


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## Trushot_archer (Dec 19, 2002)

> There is a 33.75 7" brace at 328fps


OK Which one is that so I know what I need to start begging the wife for?


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

I'm with ya!!!! The 33.75 for hunting and the 37.something for 3D's!!! 
Shot this guy about 3 hours ago with my Justice Sure didn't want to drag very well so I walked up to the shop and got the deere cart He didn't want to trailer very well either,, had some extra gravity hanging on him or something I'm getting old enough, I believe I'll be shoppin' for a 4 wheeler


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## old_rogue (Oct 1, 2004)

*nice buck!*

is that the exit wound on the chest?
what kind of broad head did you use?


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## walks with a gi (Oct 1, 2002)

Nope, just blood from his mouth. I had just got him back to the house and didn't take time to clean him up, hope no one is offended by the blood The deere was walking almost straight away at 10 yards after passing my tree at 3 feet!! I grunted and rattled him in and he had my poistion pin pointed!!! The arrow hit high in the back ribs and exited through the lower left shoulder. The Justice was set on 70/29 and was shooting an Easton XX78 2314 and Muzzy 100 grain 4 blade at 247 fps. Arrow weight is right at 500 grains. The one thing I have come to like about the short bows like the Justice is that I don't have to worry about hitting my seat frame on my tree stand as much when making very close shots behind or to the side of my position. The Justice is one great hunting bow!!! 

So,,,, tomorrow is the 1st. Will we see the official release of the 2005 BowTechs??? I'm sitting on pins and needles to put a name with a face so I can order one,,, or two


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## Trushot_archer (Dec 19, 2002)

Nice Job Wwag....love those crab claws


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## gungho (Dec 16, 2003)

ok it's 4:30 am nov 1 wheres my pics and info was hoping to see sompthing befor i go to work but now i will have to wate 15 more hours man is it going to be a long day hope they can get a pic and specs posted by the time I get home

Gungho


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## Trushot_archer (Dec 19, 2002)

HELLLLOOOOOO It's the 1st now!!!


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## Tax Lawyer (Feb 5, 2003)

*Re: First of all, "Bowtech doesn't overstate their speeds"*



old_rogue said:


> *but they do understate there draw lengths....
> i have owned 2 new bowtecs this year and both drew over an inch longer then the mod spec.....(both bows were in spec as far as axel to axel length and brace go, even took off the strings and measured them..they were correct)
> 
> don't get me wronge, i love there bows.......but i've found this to be true, you think the speed your getting is at one draw length but your actually drawing considerably more...
> ...


I totally agree.


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## grasshopper (Aug 13, 2004)

*Draw Length*

(Just while we're waiting on the goods ) I have only owned one: a Pro 40 DC. Its spot-on stated draw length. If its not exactly 31" AMO, I can't measure the difference.


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## pdq 5oh (Sep 7, 2002)

The 04 BowTechs were better re: draw length. Mine were always closer than others claimed their draw lengths to be. But I have no reason to doubt some were off. Very few, if any, company's draw lengths are all exactly as advertised.


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