# Mathews 09 news...very interesting



## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

Id love to see it, but I wonder how many current Mathews guys around here would start backpeddling on all the "Speed means nothing" statements.


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## B&C Bones (Jan 15, 2007)

Can't wait to see what they do. There kind of like america "its time for a change"


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## onmedic (May 23, 2004)

i hope so. I love my drenalin but at my short DL is would be nice to get a bit more speed for KE.


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## DesignedToHunt (Aug 5, 2008)

Machinegun, you nailed it buddy lol

At any rate, told you guys they were going to make you remember why they chose that slogan :shade:


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## Mathews4ever (Jan 13, 2007)

I can't wait til the 15 they are realseing the new ones then. I hope they stick to the solo cam but wouldn't mind seeing a 2 cam. I would love too see 340-360 but I am happy with the smooth shooting 323.


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## Jeff K in IL (Nov 4, 2005)

machinegun74 said:


> Id love to see it, but I wonder how many current Mathews guys around here would start backpeddling on all the "Speed means nothing" statements.


Speed means nothing.


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## chuckatuk (May 28, 2003)

i hope they can do something to bring me back.i love mathews and have had many of them.i just feel they haven't really done anything special since th outback-switchback era as far as a hunting bow.i still think they have one of if not the best tournament bows in the a7:thumbs_up


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## BowOgre (Jan 19, 2006)

I would like to the see the ad. Maybe the release of the new bows will help cheer some of us up.


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## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

Jeff K in IL said:


> Speed means nothing.



Come tell me that after you buy one and give Alan his 100 bucks.


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## wv_hunter (Oct 5, 2007)

Glad to see Mathews finally joined the speed party. As long as the speed bow doesn't have a ridiculously low brace height, that might be my next bow.:darkbeer:


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

the 360 is already out just not in the mathews name.... you all forget that pearson and mathews have a connection.. the new fast mathews has the rbd2 cam / revolution elite cam(still waiting to see who gets the patient).. the 340 has the same solo cam as the new pse... .. only thing is... both bows will have a short brace....


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## disturbed13 (Aug 16, 2005)

im calling BS
and i wont belive it until i see it
give me pics!!!!!!!


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## HOYTLVR (Feb 16, 2007)

what's the draw cycle like on these speed bows. I've never shot a sped bow but I would think the draw would be pretty aggressive.


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## trailk11 (Feb 21, 2007)

how ya like me now


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## bowhunters97 (Jun 25, 2007)

I'm sure the price tag is going to go through the roof. How long is it gonna be before a $1000 bare bow hunting rig hits the market? I guess as long as we keep buying them, they'll keep forking them out.


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## jrmsoccer32 (Feb 22, 2007)

If they come out with a bow that shoots 360 I'll probably buy one and trade in the DXT I'll have to shoot it first and see how it feels but that would definately be sweet. We'll see what happens


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## JCO.Bowhunter (Dec 3, 2007)

i think i am going to be adding to my signature :shade:


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## KurtVL (Nov 22, 2005)

wow, i cant believe it, about time mathews caught up, now the question remains how far will they get ahead


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## tileman (Jan 26, 2008)

If any company can do it Mathews can im sure


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## realmfg (Jun 4, 2005)

Good to see this from mathews. I may buy one now, well done!


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## MadArcher (Jun 25, 2003)

interesting very interesting.

madarcher


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## fletched (May 10, 2006)

machinegun74 said:


> Id love to see it, but I wonder how many current Mathews guys around here would start backpeddling on all the "Speed means nothing" statements.


I am thinking the same thing.


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## Big_tojo (Aug 18, 2007)

SWEET!!!! Cant wait to see the 09s!!!!!!!:teeth:


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## disturbed13 (Aug 16, 2005)

crash_gsxr750 said:


> wow, i cant believe it, about time mathews caught up, now the question remains how far will they get ahead


they just passed a little
but not a major leap
ill be watching elite to see what they shoot out :shade:
and as for the pic
i remember how PSE said that their X-Force (the original) didnt lead up to the released IBO speeds
ill be watching to see it the new mathews lives up to its IBO speeds


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## terrym (Feb 25, 2005)

Mathews bows have always shot under advertised speeds, but they will be shot through crono's as fast as they get sold so we will know soon enough. If the brace heights are @ 6 inches though then I will take a pass.


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## switchraph (Feb 14, 2006)

holy **** i think i gonna need a new bow


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## tileman (Jan 26, 2008)

Uh Oh, there goes Bowtech in the dust


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## switchraph (Feb 14, 2006)

terrym said:


> Mathews bows have always shot under advertised speeds, but they will be shot through crono's as fast as they get sold so we will know soon enough. If the brace heights are @ 6 inches though then I will take a pass.


my previous bow was a drenalin and it shot the advertised ibo 
it was 35 fps slow from ibo and i was using a 26.5 draw with loaded string


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## ats (Jul 20, 2007)

terrym said:


> If the brace heights are @ 6 inches though then I will take a pass.



same


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## sirrobinhood (Jun 15, 2005)

It will be nice if it even comes close to the IBO. It would be a nice change to not have to send the bow off to one of the supertuners


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## switchraph (Feb 14, 2006)

if it's 6" or greater it's mine

Raphael


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## storyteller_usa (Mar 22, 2003)

NOT a 6" brace height bow from what I'm hearing.
7 ''- 7 1/4" brace height. Totally NEW redesigned Solo cam Mathews bow. 
We will see the true facts on 11/17.

Remember Matt come up with this slogan.... 

CATCH US IF YOU CAN!!!!!!!!!!!
Looks like he is living up to his word.....


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>



terrym said:


> Mathews bows have always shot under advertised speeds, but they will be shot through crono's as fast as they get sold so we will know soon enough. If the brace heights are @ 6 inches though then I will take a pass.


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## cenochs (May 2, 2007)

From the add are we looking at a 2 cam bow pushing 360 from mathews


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## BigEves34 (May 9, 2007)

machinegun74 said:


> Come tell me that after you buy one and give Alan his 100 bucks.


:tongue::tongue::tongue::tongue::tongue:


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## switchraph (Feb 14, 2006)

cenochs said:


> From the add are we looking at a 2 cam bow pushing 360 from mathews


where do you see 2 cams?


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## jrmsoccer32 (Feb 22, 2007)

cenochs said:


> From the add are we looking at a 2 cam bow pushing 360 from mathews


I believe the 2 speedometers are because they are coming out with 2 different bows one at 340 fps one at 360 fps


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## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

jrmsoccer32 said:


> I believe the 2 speedometers are because they are coming out with 2 different bows one at 340 fps one at 360 fps


yep and i bet the 340 is a single cam and the other is a dare i say it 2 cam or hybrid or whatever ya call em


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

machinegun74 said:


> Id love to see it, but I wonder how many current Mathews guys around here would start backpeddling on all the "Speed means nothing" statements.


:chortle:

You hit the nail squarely on the head!!! :thumbs_up:thumbs_up

Sounds like they leased the binary cam from Pearson, which already does 360 fps.


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## realmfg (Jun 4, 2005)

Only problem now is you have to change the string and the grip (atleast for me). But it may be worth it if they dont cost $900 bare.


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## tileman (Jan 26, 2008)

Speed has its place, just not at the expense of accuracy or shootability. But your point is a valid observation I must concur


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## switchraph (Feb 14, 2006)

realmfg said:


> Only problem now is you have to change the string and the grip (atleast for me). But it may be worth it if they dont cost $900 bare.


the 3 previous mathews i had had good string and went through at least 15 000 shots through each set


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

A Mathews at 360. 2 in of brace gonna be a little hard on the hand. Not bashing, I've owned a couple and they shot well. No way the solo cams shootin 360 though, or even close and staying together. Just my opinion though and we all know the saying there. I do hope they do something with that godawful grip though.


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## switchraph (Feb 14, 2006)

hammerdown said:


> A Mathews at 360. 2 in of brace gonna be a little hard on the hand. Not bashing, I've owned a couple and they shot well. No way the solo cams shootin 360 though, or even close and staying together. Just my opinion though and we all know the saying there. I do hope they do something with that godawful grip though.


do you really think they'll come up with a bow that will come apart?


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

Ofcourse not, on purpose anyway.


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## xswanted (Feb 1, 2008)

Holy cow.

I can't wait!


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## MATXT (Aug 16, 2007)

I guess 360 and 340 sound good but I'd rather have a 330 with a smooooooth draw, 36 ATA, and a 7" or 7 1/2" BH. Maybe I'll get lucky and the new Mathews will have the above specs with the 340 -360 rating, then again...speed really doesn't matter to me. Smooth draw cycle is what its all about.


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## tileman (Jan 26, 2008)

MATXT said:


> I guess 360 and 340 sound good but I'd rather have a 330 with a smooooooth draw, 36 ATA, and a 7" or 7 1/2" BH. Maybe I'll get lucky and the new Mathews will have the above specs with the 340 -360 rating, then again...speed really doesn't matter to me. Smooth draw cycle is what its all about.


Did you just describe the Alahamax 35???:teeth:


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## xswanted (Feb 1, 2008)

machinegun74 said:


> Id love to see it, but I wonder how many current Mathews guys around here would start backpeddling on all the "Speed means nothing" statements.


Well I see where you're at here but for a lot of guys speed doesn't mean that much.

I know I didn't understand why you would want a really fast bow until someone told me this: So you can shoot a lighter draw weight or as a short draw you can still shoot a heavy arrow at a decent speed.

I know I don't hold a lot of weight on speed. But I want to shoot a 60 pound bow at 28.5 inches with a 440-450 grain arrow around 285. If this add is actually true I might get my wish.


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## MATXT (Aug 16, 2007)

tileman said:


> Did you just describe the Alahamax 35???:teeth:



Pretty darn close. Alphamax is on my list of bows that I have to try. I have been annoying the #$%@ out of my local dealer to get some in the shop already.


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

> I guess 360 and 340 sound good but I'd rather have a 330 with a smooooooth draw, 36 ATA, and a 7" or 7 1/2" BH. Maybe I'll get lucky and the new Mathews will have the above specs with the 340 -360 rating, then again...speed really doesn't matter to me. Smooth draw cycle is what its all about.
> Today 07:48 PM


Thats what I'm saying. Why try bustin into the speed market now. They build some pretty smooth hunting and target bows now, but are far from perfecting them.


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## Wishbone (Jun 19, 2006)

Oh boy this is gonna be good :darkbeer:


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

> Oh boy this is gonna be good


exactly what I was thinking when I typed it. Sorry, just in a little s--- stirrin mood tonight.


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## Van Handle (Jan 30, 2005)

realmfg said:


> Only problem now is you have to change the string and the grip (atleast for me). But it may be worth it if they dont cost $900 bare.


We have the grip covered for you. Finished in Lost Camo and 100% torque free.


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

Mathews solocam huh? I told all you guys two cams...or hybrid type deal...Oh and on the bowtech in the dust...all i have to say is two cams..two cams...


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## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

xswanted said:


> Well I see where you're at here but for a lot of guys speed doesn't mean that much.
> 
> I know I didn't understand why you would want a really fast bow until someone told me this: So you can shoot a lighter draw weight or as a short draw you can still shoot a heavy arrow at a decent speed.
> 
> I know I don't hold a lot of weight on speed. But I want to shoot a 60 pound bow at 28.5 inches with a 440-450 grain arrow around 285. If this add is actually true I might get my wish.


Thats really what speed high IBO numbers mean to me, horsepower. Im shooting a Black Max2 with the Turbo Cam for the time being, love it actually.


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

switchraph said:


> do you really think they'll come up with a bow that will come apart?


He was saying TWO CAMS...HAHA


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

> We have the grip covered for you. Finished in Lost Camo and 100% torque free.
> Today 08:12 PM


It would be cool if Mathews got it right though. There grips do suck horribly.


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## MATXT (Aug 16, 2007)

Did anyone that send a text in get a reply about this?


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## JMaxH (Mar 20, 2003)

Look at those eyes in the second speedometer... could this be "The Monster"?


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## itchyfinger (Jun 14, 2007)

jrmsoccer32 said:


> I believe the 2 speedometers are because they are coming out with 2 different bows one at 340 fps one at 360 fps


Naw.....you gots it all wrong see......They will have TWO solo cams on one bow :tongue:


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## fletched (May 10, 2006)

Speed comes at a price. Speed bows have a harder draw cycle. You can compare to bows, one that is 320 fps and one that is 280 fps. The slower one will usually feel better to draw at the same poundage. But if you take the poundage down on the faster bow so that it shoots the same speed as the slower bow, the faster bow will feel better. For those who rate bows on how the draw cycle feels, consider comparing them at the same speed and not at the same poundage. If it isn't about the speed but about the draw cycle, then compare them based on something more true to what you want.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

After all the crying last year there would be a lot of back peddling on speed means nothing. Smooth drawing easy holding all that has been preached, if true good bye. The solo just another single cam. The low brace height just like all speeders to.


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## ClaytonLJ (Jun 26, 2006)

Would that make it the deuce? 

Just hope the target companies can keep up with the abuse!


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## Hemingway (Sep 7, 2005)

hammerdown said:


> It would be cool if Mathews got it right though. There grips do suck horribly.


Not true, they're pretty nice grips for a target pistol


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

Hope it is not a 30"A/A 51/2-6" brace. Hey better not get rid of the old fat grip now because they need it to hang on.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

ClaytonLJ said:


> Would that make it the deuce?
> 
> Just hope the target companies can keep up with the abuse!


Yes make it the deuce/lo cam.


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

> Not true, they're pretty nice grips for a target pistol


 I shoulda thought of that one. Must be losin it.:darkbeer:


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## itchyfinger (Jun 14, 2007)

badbow148 said:


> Yes make it the deuce/lo cam.


What the deuce


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## marforme (May 30, 2006)

realmfg said:


> Only problem now is you have to change the string and the grip (atleast for me). But it may be worth it if they dont cost $900 bare.


And the chances of that are?


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## Dren1276 (Mar 10, 2008)

hammerdown said:


> It would be cool if Mathews got it right though. There grips do suck horribly.


 


I like the grips myself, but I have big hands. Not knocking Bowtech but I picked up one just to look at it a while back and it felt akward to me. Maybe because I used to what I have. But alot like them alot don't so maybe they should offer a choice.


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## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

If its a single cam I might bite, but I think after having their last speed bow I'll wait for chrono numbers with custom strings. The Black Max relies heavily on the Cuda factory string for a good part of its speed. I dont like to put twists in every two weeks.


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## vhunter (Jan 15, 2008)

Lets just wait and see it before we start bashing. Mathews has always built a quality bow. They have just been a little behind the times the last couple of years. If what is being said about this bow is true, it will be the top selling bow in 09.


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## salty444 (Dec 16, 2006)

I for one will definitely be buying one. I cannot wait.


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

If they were smart they would offer them with grip options. That way if you don't like there stock grip you could get side plates or something. And they could be ordered they way you like it


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## Limey (May 6, 2005)

340fps has been done before by Mathews =Black Max 2.

Now if they have managed to get the Apex or Apex 7 to 330-340fps then I am intersted.

360 fps is no good to me I shoot 3D and field only as bow hunting is illegal in the UK and I have a 300 fps speed limit to stick within.

I don't want a bow that I have to shoot 2315s at 45# to get down to 300fps, but something similar to my Apex 7 but a touch faster would light all my bulbs up:shade:


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

So it looks like the Mission was a tease. 

If this is true it is going to put the hurt on a couple other bow manufactures. People that wanted to play with a speed bow had no choice but to buy something with a lower reputation than Mathews. We also witnessed all manner of issues with limbs, cams, parts falling off, etc at a higher price than Mathews. People are going to flock to these two bows and you'll see other brands hitting EBay to fund them. 

I'm betting they had this bow in 08 and have been testing and improving it all year.

This could even be the end of a few lesser bow manufactures. Bowtech may have been purchased in just enough time to save them. Will see if Savages pockets are deep enough after recovering from the recall.

Between Mathews, Elite, and Martin there would be no reason to buy anything else. I'm guessing Hoyt has a big enough following to survive, but probably not some of the other companies.

Hang on to your socks 'cause things are going to get interesting in 09!


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> So it looks like the Mission was a tease.
> 
> If this is true it is going to put the hurt on a couple other bow manufactures. People that wanted to play with a speed bow had no choice but to buy something with a lower reputation than Mathews. We also witnessed all manner of issues with limbs, cams, parts falling off, etc at a higher price than Mathews. People are going to flock to these two bows and you'll see other brands hitting EBay to fund them.
> 
> ...


Yeah I am sure a recall of one model that needs some rivets installed for a company that sells as many bows as bowtech is really killing them
Just for your info, it was only a certain date range and the 100's sold at my shop needed zero replaced


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

spiaailtli said:


> So it looks like the Mission was a tease.
> 
> If this is true it is going to put the hurt on a couple other bow manufactures. People that wanted to play with a speed bow had no choice but to buy something with a lower reputation than Mathews. We also witnessed all manner of issues with limbs, cams, parts falling off, etc at a higher price than Mathews. People are going to flock to these two bows and you'll see other brands hitting EBay to fund them.
> 
> ...


are you kidding me?


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## Joe H. (Sep 15, 2007)

*uhhh*

ding! ding!


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## grizzlyplumber (Jul 21, 2005)

I hope they come with an XL or LD version of whatever it is, I will be interested for sure. Last year I was standing at the local archery shop waiting as the first Dren LD came off of the truck and bought it before they could even put it on the rack. I wont be quite so quick this year but I have a feeling it will happen.


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## GAGE12 (Jun 25, 2008)

i'm so glad I didn't buy this year..............


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## xswanted (Feb 1, 2008)

spiaailtli said:


> So it looks like the Mission was a tease.
> 
> If this is true it is going to put the hurt on a couple other bow manufactures. People that wanted to play with a speed bow had no choice but to buy something with a lower reputation than Mathews. We also witnessed all manner of issues with limbs, cams, parts falling off, etc at a higher price than Mathews. People are going to flock to these two bows and you'll see other brands hitting EBay to fund them.
> 
> ...


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## UltraMaxBandit (Jul 7, 2008)

Mathews has to many haters to get the recognition deserved if these bows are all they are cracked up to be. Wonder how many ppl will buy them and abuse them till they break so so they can come on here post pics and bash away. It will be a good year for mathews but the blowies will try to keep us from enjoying it.

Randy


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## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

I'm pizzed.:angry:

I haven't got to look at my issue of Muley Crazy yet!:angry::thumbs_do


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## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

Can anyone pull up the old Mathews adds degrading two cam systems?


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## hoggin03 (Oct 24, 2005)

machinegun74 said:


> Id love to see it, but I wonder how many current Mathews guys around here would start backpeddling on all the "Speed means nothing" statements.


I'm a "Mathews guy" (Switchback XT), and I've never said that "speed means nothing". But, I pick "feel" over "speed", and I liked the way the XT felt better than all the bows I shot when I was buying a new bow.

That being said, extra speed never hurts. I just hope it doesn't diminish the feel of the bow.

Should be interesting!!!


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## UltraMaxBandit (Jul 7, 2008)

Bobmuley said:


> Can anyone pull up the old Mathews adds degrading two cam systems?


Thanks for proving my point!

Randy


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## oldglorynewbie (Oct 17, 2006)

UltraMaxBandit said:


> Mathews has to many haters to get the recognition deserved if these bows are all they are cracked up to be. Wonder how many ppl will buy them and abuse them till they break so so they can come on here post pics and bash away. It will be a good year for mathews but the blowies will try to keep us from enjoying it.
> 
> Randy


When Mathews finally makes a hunting bow in my draw length I would love to try it out.... Do you *really* believe someone is going to buy a bow just so they can trash it and come on AT to say it is no good? Must be nice to have that kind of money to throw around.


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## BAArcher (Feb 5, 2004)

hoggin03 said:


> I'm a "Mathews guy" (Switchback XT), and I've never said that "speed means nothing". But, I pick "feel" over "speed", and I liked the way the XT felt better than all the bows I shot when I was buying a new bow.
> 
> That being said, extra speed never hurts. I just hope it doesn't diminish the feel of the bow.
> 
> Should be interesting!!!


Agree 100%....Feel of the shot and quality make a deadly combination no matter what you shoot.


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## wis_archer (Jul 27, 2007)

I know one thing for sure they will not pull easy.


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## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

UltraMaxBandit said:


> Thanks for proving my point!
> 
> Randy


For proving what? That Mathews for years had the marketing nuts to tell us all that the single cam was the best cam system and all others were flawed? 

Mathews also has too many blind followers.


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## The Arrow Guru (Feb 9, 2005)

*waaaa???*



spiaailtli said:


> So it looks like the Mission was a tease.
> 
> If this is true it is going to put the hurt on a couple other bow manufactures. People that wanted to play with a speed bow had no choice but to buy something with a lower reputation than Mathews.(Dumb statement) We also witnessed all manner of issues with limbs, cams, parts falling off, etc(one recall on a select run, dumb statement) at a higher price than Mathews. People are going to flock to these two bows and you'll see other brands hitting EBay to fund them.
> 
> ...


Surely you are just trying to get a reaction, because I just do not think that a person with at least average intelligence would really make these satements and truly believe them. Why even come on here just to sound off with something this absurd. Mmm mmm mmm, how silly.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

*Super speed Mathews*

I kinda go on the same side as Bobmuley, I can't believe the company who said they'd NEVER make a two cam bow is gonna put one out. Does this mean they've conceded that the Binary/two cam system is better than the single cam ? Or have they just reached the potential of the single-cam.
And of course they HAVE to jump in the speed game, Bowtech/Diamond outsold everyone this last fiscal year in the houses and shops combined, I just wonder when the houses will start to sell Mission, ya know thats coming.

Well said "fletched", why would anyone want to pull 70 if they only had to pull 60 to get the same speed and kinetic energy ?

XSWanted, look into a GT500, you'll get real close to those #'s your lookin for with over 7"bh.
:grouphug:


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## xswanted (Feb 1, 2008)

wis_archer said:


> I know one thing for sure they will not pull easy.


Why not?


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

I would be worried about Mathews if they didn't change and adapt with the market demands. That more than anything is a sign of a great company. Two issues prevent companies from evolving and rising or maintaining top positions. The first is ego and history has many examples of companies that are no longer around because of it. The second is not having modern processes that allow change to occur at a rapid pace, such as GM. Because it takes 5 years to retool and meet the changing market demand they had to close plants. 

As far as Bowtech goes their recall was announce for one model but they swapped limbs on all center pivot designs if the customer asked. They did have issues with every single model they made, just not quite as bad as the General and Commander. They have a very long running history (5 years) of having issues with limbs breaking, cams changing shape, mods not staying put, STS devices falling off, finishes peeling, and on and on. Back when I was looking at bowing Bowtech someone told me if they couldn't find a buyer there was a very good chance they would go under. I think Savage has the resources to keep them floating as long as they don't continue to have all of their quality control issues.

Strictly from a business stand point you have to think about how the economy is doing right now too. We've already see PSE letting people go, changing field processes, doing away with AR and pretty much Browning lines. They're hurting and didn't experience a recall or the bad reputation Bowtech currently has. They had a top selling model or two and still... You have to know Bowtech is feeling the pain. There is just no way they can't be. Timing is everything and to have the number one manufacture step on their toes after a recall, combined with the economy??? They are going to have a bad year.


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## Q2DEATH (May 12, 2003)

switchraph said:


> my previous bow was a drenalin and it shot the advertised ibo
> it was 35 fps slow from ibo and i was using a 26.5 draw with loaded string


What? It shot the advertised IBO and then it was 35fps slower than the IBO?


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## IrishMike (Mar 19, 2007)

You know, no matter what you critics care about speed, harsh draw, blah blah, blah. If Mathews brings speed into their line up, its like delivering a nock out blow to all the other manufactures. Catch Us If you Can will live up to its name and everyone who never bought a Mathews bow before will become very interested.............

09 Mathews looks to be like a record breaking year if they live up to their advertisements!!!


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

What is wrong with you people? Mathews has YET to say they are releasing a DUAL CAM bow and some of you have already started with the stupid comments. If they do release a dual cam...then bash away if that makes you feel better about your current set up.

But for now, please spare the rest of us your expert opinions until they actually release these bows. Right now, all you are doing is speculating. None of you know what is coming, no matter how hard you try to make everybody think that you do.

Give it a rest already.


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## tylerolsen12 (Feb 8, 2007)

spiaailtli said:


> So it looks like the Mission was a tease.
> 
> If this is true it is going to put the hurt on a couple other bow manufactures. People that wanted to play with a speed bow had no choice but to buy something with a lower reputation than Mathews. We also witnessed all manner of issues with limbs, cams, parts falling off, etc at a higher price than Mathews. People are going to flock to these two bows and you'll see other brands hitting EBay to fund them.
> 
> ...


can i get some of what this guys on that is quite the post


----------



## Q2DEATH (May 12, 2003)

Bobmuley said:


> I'm pizzed.:angry:
> 
> I haven't got to look at my issue of Muley Crazy yet!:angry::thumbs_do


I didn't even know there was a mag called Muley Crazy. I'm going to have to find a link online and get subscription to that one!


----------



## tylerolsen12 (Feb 8, 2007)

flohunter said:


> What is wrong with you people? Mathews has YET to say they are releasing a DUAL CAM bow and some of you have already started with the stupid comments. If they do release a dual cam...then bash away if that makes you feel better about your current set up.
> 
> But for now, please spare the rest of us your expert opinions until they actually release these bows. Right now, all you are doing is speculating. None of you know what is coming, no matter how hard you try to make everybody think that you do.
> 
> Give it a rest already.


it will be a dual cam it has to be unless it has a 4 inch brace height


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## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

flohunter said:


> What is wrong with you people? Mathews has YET to say they are releasing a DUAL CAM bow and some of you have already started with the stupid comments. If they do release a dual cam...then bash away if that makes you feel better about your current set up.
> 
> But for now, please spare the rest of us your expert opinions until they actually release these bows. Right now, all you are doing is speculating. None of you know what is coming, no matter how hard you try to make everybody think that you do.
> 
> Give it a rest already.


Dont hold back let them have it,,,I dare them discuss bows on an Archery discussion board.

No need to get all worked up!


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## DesignedToHunt (Aug 5, 2008)

Q2DEATH said:


> What? It shot the advertised IBO and then it was 35fps slower than the IBO?



It was 35 fps slow because he had a 26.5" draw but when he crunched his speed against IBO numbers (added the 35 fps back in obviously) it was dead on with IBO :darkbeer:


What kills me is that since the Drenalin was released Mathews has been at, above or within a couple of feet per second of their ratings, just like every other company, but guys still feel the need to go back to 2004 and say their Outback was a lot slower than advertised lol


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

Like I said....EXPERT OPINIONS.
You know about as much as the rest of us.....SQUAT.


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## mschviuz (Jan 18, 2006)

Q2DEATH said:


> What? It shot the advertised IBO and then it was 35fps slower than the IBO?


I think he is referring to the shorter dl he shoots accounting for the slower speeds....being if he shot 30dl it would have been shooting the ibo speed...dunno..just a guess


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## wis_archer (Jul 27, 2007)

xswanted said:


> Why not?


Because of the SPEED!!!!

What don't you guys get about speed, the faster it is the harsher the draw cycle will be.


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## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

wis_archer said:


> Because of the SPEED!!!!
> 
> What don't you guys get about speed, the faster it is the harsher the draw cycle will be.


not with new technology...

look at the speed we have today compared to 15 years ago...320 with a solocam


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## 500 fps (Oct 13, 2002)

bigrnyrs said:


> Surely you are just trying to get a reaction, because I just do not think that a person with at least average intelligence would really make these satements and truly believe them. Why even come on here just to sound off with something this absurd. Mmm mmm mmm, how silly.



Spitaloti is the only one on here that takes spitaloti seriously. Everyone else recognizes his drivel for what it is. 

"Someone told me"....wow what a reliable source.

Secondly, if Mathews does offer a dual/binary/hybrid it will serve as fodder for the naysayers, but that is about all. It will not hurt their sales or credibilty. I say good for them. Competition drives the industry.


----------



## BuckeyeRed (Sep 7, 2006)

Bobmuley said:


> For proving what? That Mathews for years had the marketing nuts to tell us all that the single cam was the best cam system and all others were flawed?
> 
> Mathews also has too many blind followers.


 Am I the only one that saw in the Ad a 340fps single cam?? how is that a flawed design because it wasn't the fastest? Don't Mathews single cam bows continue to lead the market in efficiency? 

Every bow manufacture has their own little cult following who claim they will only shoot brand X. That doesn't mean that the manufacture is to blame for these people. I am happy that Mathews has decided to to venture into other design possibilities, I would think most archers would be also. I would doubt Mathews will go throw their flawed Single cams out the window and go completely into 2cam/hybrid/whatever cams. Lots and lots of archers were asking for this from them, I'm glad they listened and gave those archers something they were asking for.


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## Roadrunner (Feb 25, 2004)

One things for sure about mathews, if they have a bow that Ibo's at 340 and 360 you know it's only gonna really do about 310 and 320. Mathews bows NEVER do what they claim speed wise.


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> I would be worried about Mathews if they didn't change and adapt with the market demands. That more than anything is a sign of a great company. Two issues prevent companies from evolving and rising or maintaining top positions. The first is ego and history has many examples of companies that are no longer around because of it. The second is not having modern processes that allow change to occur at a rapid pace, such as GM. Because it takes 5 years to retool and meet the changing market demand they had to close plants.
> 
> As far as Bowtech goes their recall was announce for one model but they swapped limbs on all center pivot designs if the customer asked. They did have issues with every single model they made, just not quite as bad as the General and Commander. They have a very long running history (5 years) of having issues with limbs breaking, cams changing shape, mods not staying put, STS devices falling off, finishes peeling, and on and on. Back when I was looking at bowing Bowtech someone told me if they couldn't find a buyer there was a very good chance they would go under. I think Savage has the resources to keep them floating as long as they don't continue to have all of their quality control issues.
> 
> Strictly from a business stand point you have to think about how the economy is doing right now too. We've already see PSE letting people go, changing field processes, doing away with AR and pretty much Browning lines. They're hurting and didn't experience a recall or the bad reputation Bowtech currently has. They had a top selling model or two and still... You have to know Bowtech is feeling the pain. There is just no way they can't be. Timing is everything and to have the number one manufacture step on their toes after a recall, combined with the economy??? They are going to have a bad year.


Yeah OK. They changed limbs for ANY center pivot model if asked. Can you prove that.
I would also like to see all these limb problems with the commander because I think I have seen 1 on here. None at the shop I go to
Why would you bring in Bowtech to a Mathews thread anyway?


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## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

BuckeyeRed said:


> Am I the only one that saw in the Ad a 340fps single cam?? how is that a flawed design because it wasn't the fastest? Don't Mathews single cam bows continue to lead the market in efficiency?
> 
> Every bow manufacture has their own little cult following who claim they will only shoot brand X. That doesn't mean that the manufacture is to blame for these people. I am happy that Mathews has decided to to venture into other design possibilities, I would think most archers would be also. I would doubt Mathews will go throw their flawed Single cams out the window and go completely into 2cam/hybrid/whatever cams. Lots and lots of archers were asking for this from them, I'm glad they listened and gave those archers something they were asking for.


Its not like we haven't seen 340 fps single cams before...honestly, I'm hoping that the 360 fps bow is a single as well. Yes, they have been at or near the top for efficiency. Its easy to be efficient when you're not going for speed...less hysteris. 

I agree with your other points, I just don't know why they didn't do it sooner. And yes, there are cults and haters for everyone of the bow companies. Neither is particularly useful when it comes to passing on unbiased information. Just think of how little market share some other up and coming companies would have got if they already had available the bows that they were asking for...


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## switchraph (Feb 14, 2006)

Q2DEATH said:


> What? It shot the advertised IBO and then it was 35fps slower than the IBO?


shot ibo rating for my DL


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## jkeiffer (Aug 3, 2007)

rodney482 said:


> not with new technology...
> 
> look at the speed we have today compared to 15 years ago...320 with a solocam


even with todays tech and eff. the faster the bow the harsher the draw cycle. Rodneny dont tell me that the single cam and binary cam at the Athens Factory pull the same way even though the binaries are faster. Think about what you are saying as wis_archer is refering to todays bows. the faster the bow the more energy required to put into the arrow which means a more aggressive/harsh draw cycle. even if its the same cam system and given draw length with just an inch difference in brace height, the shorter brace will be more aggressive because you have more energy to put into the draw force.

later
jkeiffer


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## JMaxH (Mar 20, 2003)

IrishMike said:


> You know, no matter what you critics care about speed, harsh draw, blah blah, blah. If Mathews brings speed into their line up, its like delivering a nock out blow to all the other manufactures. Catch Us If you Can will live up to its name and everyone who never bought a Mathews bow before will become very interested.............
> 
> 09 Mathews looks to be like a record breaking year if they live up to their advertisements!!!



I agree a lot of non-Mathews folks will become interested with the new speedy Mathews bows, but I wouldn't say it's going to be a "knock-out blow" to the other manufacturers. Perhaps in the speed category, but definitely not quality or (necessarily depending on what we see) innovation. With that said, I'm anxious to see what these new bows look like. I'm buying an Alpha Max 32 tonight. It won't do 340 FPS, but it sure will be nice to shoot a big whitetail with it!!


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

Well, this is typical Mathews. People wonder why Mathews is the premier bow manufacturer in the US... Is it because of quality? No. Is it because of speed? Definitely not. Is it because of accuracy? Absolutely not. The answer is MARKETING. This thread is doing its job by getting lots of folks salivating over something they have never seen, something they know nothing about. It only further proves that Mathews is the masters of promoting and marketing product.

If you read the posts, people are already arguing about how easy it draws compared to binary cams. People have also divined that this will be a 2 cam bow. The next thing you know, people will be asserting that they heard from a "reliable source" that this has satellite uplink capability so that you can surf the internet and text your girlfriend between rounds.


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## BuckeyeRed (Sep 7, 2006)

Bobmuley said:


> Its not like we haven't seen 340 fps single cams before...honestly, I'm hoping that the 360 fps bow is a single as well. Yes, they have been at or near the top for efficiency. Its easy to be efficient when you're not going for speed...less hysteris.
> 
> I agree with your other points, I just don't know why they didn't do it sooner. And yes, there are cults and haters for everyone of the bow companies. Neither is particularly useful when it comes to passing on unbiased information. Just think of how little market share some other up and coming companies would have got if they already had available the bows that they were asking for...


 touche....


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## customarchery (Aug 29, 2007)

*The ad I found*

I found this ad. Maybe the other was I typo
LOL


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## xswanted (Feb 1, 2008)

wis_archer said:


> Because of the SPEED!!!!
> 
> What don't you guys get about speed, the faster it is the harsher the draw cycle will be.


I see your point here. 

But.....

There are plenty of really fast bows on the market that draw quite smooth. The GT-500 from Elite, The DXT, the Apex 7 just to name a few. I haven't shot the new Bowtechs but I imagine they're not really harsh or they wouldn't be getting the reviews they are. 

Speed can (and has) come with a smooth draw cycle. I think the fact Mathews can get 322 out of a single cam with and 7" brace height and still draw smooth is a testament to what they "might" be doing this year.

It will be interesting to see, but based on the reputation of Mathews in the past, I don't think they would put a bow out that draws really hard just to get the speed out of it. I think they would go with a smooth drawing and forgiving bow ( like they have been ) before doing the opposite.

I know I can't wait!


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## wis_archer (Jul 27, 2007)

Yes it can be smooth drawing but can and will have a harsh draw cycle.

Even if it's smooth, the peak draw weight will have to increase faster in the draw cycle to achieve high speeds, such as the 360 claimed by Mathews.


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## rembrandt (Jan 17, 2004)

Modern golf equipment has made many courses obsolete.........will modern bows make current targets too porous and weak? Just a thought!


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## disturbed13 (Aug 16, 2005)

Bobmuley said:


> Can anyone pull up the old Mathews adds degrading two cam systems?


now thats what i really want to see



wis_archer said:


> I know one thing for sure they will not pull easy.


that is for sure
so they went back on outdated tech
just like bowtech with the center pivot system
why cant they be original?


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## Limey (May 6, 2005)

Time will make some of the comments made in this thread look real stupid and I am not sure yet which ones these are.

Face it nobody knows for sure what is coming out 1 cam, 2cams, 4cams, 2 idler wheels, 4limbs. 5 inch brace height or 7 inch. 25inch ata or 36 inch ata

What is clear some of you will buy it and some of you will not.

If Mathews came out with a 1 cam bow at 37 inch ata with an 8inch brace height that did 360fps IBO some of you would still say it was too slow as it realy only did 351fps or old technology just because its Mathews and that is the sad part of this thread.

If you want to hate Mathews that is your right but for years they have been knocked for bringing out the same old bow and their lack of speed. So when it looks like they may have done something about it this year and even without even seeing this bow the closed minded have past judgement.

Before you call me a closed minded fanboy as well as my 2 Mathews bows I own 2 Bowtechs, 3 Martin's, 1 Hoyt and 1 Proline so I am no fanboy but I do like Mathew bows but I also like and shoot other companies bows.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

hedoe said:


> now thats what i really want to see
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Get a clue. You are only speculating. Have you shot this bow yet?
How can you guys make all of these assumptions and claims.....then pass them off as the gospel by merely reading a magazine ad?
Unreal. :thumbs_do


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## disturbed13 (Aug 16, 2005)

flohunter said:


> Get a clue. You are only speculating. Have you shot this bow yet?
> How can you guys make all of these assumptions and claims.....then pass them off as the gospel by merely reading a magazine ad?
> Unreal. :thumbs_do


hmmmm
that sounds so familiar
like all of the attacks on the company that i like

awwww aint that cute
you dont like it when the shoe is on the other foot huh?


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## Timber1 (Aug 31, 2006)

storyteller_usa said:


> NOT a 6" brace height bow from what I'm hearing.
> 7 ''- 7 1/4" brace height. Totally NEW redesigned Solo cam Mathews bow.
> We will see the true facts on 11/17.
> 
> ...




IT WILL BE HOT!!!:shade::thumbs_up


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## Robinhooder3 (Jun 18, 2008)

Limey said:


> 340fps has been done before by Mathews =Black Max 2.
> 
> Now if they have managed to get the Apex or Apex 7 to 330-340fps then I am intersted.
> 
> ...


WHAT illegal????? that must be hell.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

hedoe said:


> hmmmm
> that sounds so familiar
> like all of the attacks on the company that i like
> 
> ...


What are you talking about?

I am merely pointing out how so many of you "EXPERTS", with 2000+ posts to your credit, come on here and start making claims about how harsh of a draw cycle a bow has, how outdated the technology is, when you have never seen it, touched it, or even shot it. All of this from a two page ad in a magazine. :thumbs_do

As far as the company that you like....I could care less. Shoot what fits YOU best, and enjoy.


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## BigEves34 (May 9, 2007)

:set1_rolf2::set1_rolf2::set1_rolf2::set1_rolf2:

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:


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## trimantrekokc (May 16, 2006)

UltraMaxBandit said:


> Mathews has to many haters to get the recognition deserved if these bows are all they are cracked up to be. Wonder how many ppl will buy them and abuse them till they break so so they can come on here post pics and bash away. It will be a good year for mathews but the blowies will try to keep us from enjoying it.
> 
> Randy


on the positive side they would have to abuse it....some companies are blowing up pretty easily on their own... :teeth:


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

hedoe said:


> hmmmm
> that sounds so familiar
> like all of the attacks on the company that i like
> 
> ...


You do realize bowtech using the center pivot (invented a while ago) but something that didn't work out too well was made into something that works quite well now, is no different than a binary (like your famous brand uses) was also invented long ago and made into something that works very well now. You can't be serious and tell me because it is now a 2 track cam that it is not still something invented long ago. Same as the center pivot looks much different and functions differently than last year.
What exactly is the difference?

A failed idea is not stealing from someone, bringing it back out and perfecting it is a great thing, lots of things have been thought of before and I doubt there will be a new bow idea ever again, that has never been thought about.

We still don't know if pearson or elite will have this patent and neither do you

By the way it is not the Contential US, and Connstutition is not right either


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## dkd1990 (Jun 28, 2007)

Hey, I have a question. If this is out of a magazine then where are the staples in the fold? I don't mean to be a &*%@ but could this be a good photoshop? And I don't think I've ever seen a smiley face by the catch us if you can.


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

...and I don't even own a Mathews bow. 

It is funny how some people can put their blinders on though. I could be shooting whatever bow I wanted. The brand I shoot makes bow rated 310fps up to 355fps. I shot the low end, mid rage, and fast from this company before buying. I bought the slow one because it just works better for me. 

The thing that appeals to Mathews fans is they are better engineered, better tested, have more technology built in, are smooth, have plenty of power, and are very quiet. Owners find they have almost no problems and if they do the company will stand behind them. Anyone with an engineering degree knows they are very well built bows.

All of the marketing in the world won't make a company number one. Just as the other company is finding out. You have people selling their bows left and right because they are scared to shoot them. You see post daily on board about people not buying the new models because they are scared of them.

As to bowtech and this being a multi model fix just do a search on any board you vist and you see comander, general, and others with broken limbs with the user saying bowtech swapped them out no questions asked with the new design. That is if someone left the threads and post on this site. They're were 5 and 6 at a time being posted and for quite some time mods were deleting the post and fast as they appeared.

If you want to know if I shoot straight go over to the Mathews site and see what I said over there. I told them they had a good product but were missing the mark by not offering a speed bow, be it single cam or dual. I also gave them heck for selling a bow that couldn't be worked on without a press when everyone else had that technology. A fanboy I'm not. I call them like I see them regardless.

If you want to question anyone...How about anyone that has been on this site six months or more and tries to claim BowTech doesn't have issues. I mean holy crap batman! People were talking about lawsuites, calling the company to *****, not supporting them until they fixed the problems, showing pictures from the hospital from their bows blowing up, and on and on.

All I said was they are going to have a tough road ahead trying to recover and the economy and other companies covering their nitch isn't going to help. That's business 101. No need to get made about it, it's just part of life these days.


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## Limey (May 6, 2005)

We all know that Mathews is called the Darkside of archery. 

I found this advert in an archery magazine in the UK


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## jkeiffer (Aug 3, 2007)

dkd1990 said:


> Hey, I have a question. If this is out of a magazine then where are the staples in the fold? I don't mean to be a &*%@ but could this be a good photoshop? And I don't think I've ever seen a smiley face by the catch us if you can.


good point, plus there is no little circled R for the registered trade mark anywhere on the page. 

I suspect someone is up to something, be it Mathews or a member on AT. anyone could have put it together and printed it out and there you go.

later
jkeiffer


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

How wrong would that be!


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## B3AV3R (Apr 19, 2006)

Well, I'm intrigued. 

I've been thinking Mathews would have something really new this year for awhile. Time will tell, I guess...


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## JMaxH (Mar 20, 2003)

Going back to the POSSIBLE hybrid/two-cam system, IF they bring one out. It doesn't matter if you put up the old ad where Mathews says how "inferior" they are, because of their marketing department; they will come up with an incredibly great explanation as to why they brought it out, and why it's different than the other ad they did. And (many) people will buy into it. They'll put a lot of psychology into their marketing to save face.....


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## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

jkeiffer said:


> good point, plus there is no little circled R for the registered trade mark anywhere on the page.
> 
> I suspect someone is up to something, be it Mathews or a member on AT. anyone could have put it together and printed it out and there you go.
> 
> ...


If it were a fake it would not still be up over at mathewsinc... Its real!


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## B3AV3R (Apr 19, 2006)

JMaxH said:


> Going back to the POSSIBLE hybrid/two-cam system, IF they bring one out. It doesn't matter if you put up the old ad where Mathews says how "inferior" they are, because of their marketing department; they will come up with an incredibly great explanation as to why they brought it out, and why it's different than the other ad they did. And (many) people will buy into it. They'll put a lot of psychology into their marketing to save face.....


Couldn't have said it any better, myself...

Not that it's a bad thing. It's all marketing...


----------



## RT1 (Nov 20, 2006)

Can you say King of the Mountain

i'm slowly hearing that

hmm.

Mathews will once again will be looked at as the bow and company to be.


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## Mr. October (Feb 15, 2003)

Single cam, two cam, or 3 cam (or whatever) one this is for sure at those speeds it won't be very much fun to shoot. I hear folks yak all the time about how nice their speed bow is to shoot . . . then I try it and go home and ice down my shoulder. And I'm not a little guy . . . 

My ol' 60 lb. Switchback blew through a big six point from a quartering angle this morning at 30 yards. I don't think I'll be buying a new hunting bow any time soon.


----------



## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

They're talking about what cams they have on them too over there. I went over to see if the one posted there had a trade mark.

Bottom line is ...who the heck knows. 

If they do come out with a dual (hopefully that doesn't require a press) I'll have to say more pennies. I already have a Martin Warthog on my short list. I might sneak one more new bow in this this year or early next but I don't think I better get two. It would be my first Mathews which would then give me four different brands to choose from. Right now I just can imagine anything shooting better for me than my Martin. That thing is darn near magic.


----------



## disturbed13 (Aug 16, 2005)

flohunter said:


> What are you talking about?
> 
> I am merely pointing out how so many of you *"EXPERTS",* with *2000+ posts to your credit*, come on here and start making claims about how harsh of a draw cycle a bow has, how outdated the technology is, when you have never seen it, touched it, or even shot it. All of this from a two page ad in a magazine. :thumbs_do
> 
> As far as the company that you like....I could care less. Shoot what fits YOU best, and enjoy.


you think that just because i ask questions or make suggestions
and have 2000+ under my user name that i am an expert?
well that makes one of us
i am by no means an expert and i don't want to be one
i just want to be me

and as far as 'making the claims'
that's not correct
i am pointing out a fact that i was told on here many years ago
i wanted to know
so i asked
and as a result my question was answered
i just passed on the info that was given to me on cams that had came and went by the time i got into archery
nothing more
and those cams look like spirals and many different dual cams
and there is no way that you can sit there and tell me that the shooter wont feel the weight
as for smooth, or how smooth a 2 cam bow can be
my GTO is the smoothest bow i have drawn
but i most definitely all of the weight that she has

which is unlike mathews
very much so
i just don't want to read how well the bow shoots
when all of the fanboys wont even try any other brand that has been producing a bow that is very similar to it for a while now

and whats with you being so defensive?
what do you have to gain by saying that im wrong
you know as much as i do
if not less
what? im not allowed to voice my opinion anymore?
just because you say so?
then why does AT exist?
and what is the point in actually signing on?
if we can express ourselves
then we shouldn't have the freedom of speech


----------



## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Mr. October said:


> Single cam, two cam, or 3 cam (or whatever) one this is for sure at those speeds it won't be very much fun to shoot. I hear folks yak all the time about how nice their speed bow is to shoot . . . then I try it and go home and ice down my shoulder. And I'm not a little guy . . .
> 
> My ol' 60 lb. Switchback blew through a big six point from a quartering angle this morning at 30 yards. I don't think I'll be buying a new hunting bow any time soon.


When I was testing bows earlier this year I found I could shoot one (set at 74#) about 30 times before my shoulder started to complain. My current bow can be shot all day long without issue. I know cause I have.

I still want one though.


----------



## Mr. October (Feb 15, 2003)

Perfectionist said:


> Well, this is typical Mathews. People wonder why Mathews is the premier bow manufacturer in the US... Is it because of quality? No. Is it because of speed? Definitely not. Is it because of accuracy? Absolutely not. The answer is MARKETING. This thread is doing its job by getting lots of folks salivating over something they have never seen, something they know nothing about. It only further proves that Mathews is the masters of promoting and marketing product.
> 
> If you read the posts, people are already arguing about how easy it draws compared to binary cams. People have also divined that this will be a 2 cam bow. The next thing you know, people will be asserting that they heard from a "reliable source" that this has satellite uplink capability so that you can surf the internet and text your girlfriend between rounds.


I disagree with you on this. Yes, Mathews has a fantastic marketing dept. but that is not the only reason they sell so many bows nor why people so anticipate their new releases. They DO make top quality bows. I've been in archery for over 30 years and owned all different kind of bows and my Switchback is as good or better then any of them. I don't have my Apex any more and I am sorry for that . . becasue between the two of them they are and were the best shooting bows I've ever owned. I am not a brand loyalist. If someone comes out with something better . . . I'll buy it. 

Regarding marketing, there was a time when every hunting video featured a Mathews. Hardly the case any more. Bowtech, Hoyt, Bear, PSE and others have equal or more time on the air and in magazines. 

Marketing alone doesn't sell anything. If so, every hunter in the woods would be shooting a Thompson Center Encore. Heck, I've never seen ONE in the woods. A product has to be well made, reliable, and what people want. This is why Mathews sells so many bows. Sure . . if you are an archer, you may not like the grip. But hunters love them. Same with the strings. I'll bet far more deer are killed every year with Mathews factory strings then all custom string makers put together. (In the grand scheme of things, not many bowhunters use custom strings). 

The threads about Hoyt and Bowtech new products were just as long and as numerous as Mathews. Lots of stuff sells after it is chatted about on here whether it is good or bad. 

BTW . . are you coming up to the FITA East next weekend?


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## DesignedToHunt (Aug 5, 2008)

hedoe said:


> now thats what i really want to see
> 
> 
> 
> ...





So let me see if I got this. You are shooting a bow from a company that has been sued 37 times in 3 years for patent infringment but you are bashing other companies for not being "original"? 


BAWAAAAAA HAAAAAA HAAAAAAAA :laugh::laugh:


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## ABTABB (Apr 4, 2007)

*WOW!!!*
All this HATE over 2 pictures of speedometers. With no pictures, or specs, or even a description of a bow.


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## disturbed13 (Aug 16, 2005)

DesignedToHunt said:


> So let me see if I got this. You are shooting a bow from a company that has been sued 37 times in 3 years for patent infringment but you are bashing other companies for not being "original"?
> 
> 
> BAWAAAAAA HAAAAAA HAAAAAAAA :laugh::laugh:


and Mathews has milked the same dead horse for way to long IMHO
(i used a horse for a reason, if you dont get it dont ask me)


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## thespyhunter (Apr 8, 2005)

abtabb said:


> *wow!!!*
> all this hate over 2 pictures of speedometers. With no pictures, or specs, or even a description of a bow.




+1


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## UltraMaxBandit (Jul 7, 2008)

My dren set at 75lbs I know i can pull all day long. A admiral set at 64 lbs bothered me a little bit. It felt like i had 2 walls to get by before i was at full draw. I havent pulled another bow that pulls as smooth as mathews. Even my girls ultramax pulls smooth and its 10 years old. Only bows out there that may pull just as smooth or are close are martins single cams.

Randy


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## DesignedToHunt (Aug 5, 2008)

hedoe said:


> and Mathews has milked the same dead horse for way to long IMHO
> (i used a horse for a reason, if you dont get it dont ask me)



What does that have to do with you shooting a bow brand that has been sued repeatedly for copying off of every other company out there and not coming out with anything original themself? I thought that was the issue at hand but here you are trying to switch subjects.


Those who live in glass houses.............


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

customarchery said:


> I found this ad. Maybe the other was I typo
> LOL


I believe it says 340 and 460 must be a twin cam cross Bow


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

Mr. October said:


> I disagree with you on this. Yes, Mathews has a fantastic marketing dept. but that is not the only reason they sell so many bows nor why people so anticipate their new releases. They DO make top quality bows. I've been in archery for over 30 years and owned all different kind of bows and my Switchback is as good or better then any of them. I don't have my Apex any more and I am sorry for that . . becasue between the two of them they are and were the best shooting bows I've ever owned. I am not a brand loyalist. If someone comes out with something better . . . I'll buy it.
> 
> Regarding marketing, there was a time when every hunting video featured a Mathews. Hardly the case any more. Bowtech, Hoyt, Bear, PSE and others have equal or more time on the air and in magazines.
> 
> ...


Oops... my bad. Let me explain about the accuracy / quality. It was merely to point out that other bow companies make quality products, and that Mathews doesn't have a monopoly on that. If you look at Martin, and Hoyt based on quality and accuracy, they are all top shelf products. I didn't mean to take anything away from them, especially their top line target bows.

Now, with regard to marketing, the explosion of Bowtech, PSE et. al. is a recent phenomenon. By the time the other guys got on the scene, Mathews had already captured the market. And they have been absolute geniuses at creating loyalty with their customer base. (There again, not saying it is not without good reason.) 

Something else to consider, with Mathews marketing, they continue to differentiate themselves, which grants them more attention. Most bow manufacturers have already released their new models, while Mathews continues to wait until after the ATA show. This builds anticipation and excitement, as evidenced by this thread. People are not distracted by all the other brands coming out, so the attention span is not diluted (a captive audience). Again, absolute mastery of marketing. And to your point about the grip, while target shooters may not like it, hunters do. This is part of market research... finding out what your customers like and why, and then apply those to your new product line.

So, to your point, Mathews quality, shootability, accuracy, versatility etc., combined with excellent marketing, is I believe, what put Mathews on the top, and keeps them on the top.

And Yes, I will be there for the FITA East. Really looking forward to it. :shade:


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

UltraMaxBandit said:


> My dren set at 75lbs I know i can pull all day long. A admiral set at 64 lbs bothered me a little bit. It felt like i had 2 walls to get by before i was at full draw. I havent pulled another bow that pulls as smooth as mathews. Even my girls ultramax pulls smooth and its 10 years old. Only bows out there that may pull just as smooth or are close are martins single cams.
> 
> Randy


You must not have pulled a Pearson single cam with the Z-7 cam. Mathews has nothing over it.


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## Mr. October (Feb 15, 2003)

Perfectionist said:


> Oops... my bad. Let me explain about the accuracy / quality. It was merely to point out that other bow companies make quality products, and that Mathews doesn't have a monopoly on that. If you look at Martin, and Hoyt based on quality and accuracy, they are all top shelf products. I didn't mean to take anything away from them, especially their top line target bows.
> 
> Now, with regard to marketing, the explosion of Bowtech, PSE et. al. is a recent phenomenon. By the time the other guys got on the scene, Mathews had already captured the market. And they have been absolute geniuses at creating loyalty with their customer base. (There again, not saying it is not without good reason.)
> 
> ...


Appreciate the clarification . . . . 

See you next weekend. Is the good shooter in the family coming with you?


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## jkeiffer (Aug 3, 2007)

badbow148 said:


> I believe it says 340 and 460 must be a twin cam cross Bow


mathews has the patent for a single cam cross bow I think, Seriously I think they do


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## UltraMaxBandit (Jul 7, 2008)

I like pearsons. Dont got one bad thing to say about them except ones not in my bow case lol. My step dad is an engineer and for those who want toknow why im so loyal is because I had him look at every bow I tried before buying the dren which was on the bottom of the list by the way. Out of all the ones he looked at with me he told me the machining and the overall construction of my dren was the finest out of all the bows I shot including the general and xforce and black ice and so on and so on. I shot alot of bows in 07 before i picked the dren. My step father is a very accomplished engineer and well I will take his word over anyone elses. Even a pro archer unless an engineer himself cant really tell what bows are better built than others.

Randy


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## Tuffy2 (Dec 5, 2003)

I'm getting one, it will help me miss faster!


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

Mr. October said:


> Appreciate the clarification . . . .
> 
> See you next weekend. Is the good shooter in the family coming with you?


:doh: ... yes, Jr. will be there too. Did Rich tell you? Jonathan won JOAD Nationals FITA round again this year, and also broke the 40 meter outdoor Star FITA national record in Cub division. He really poured everything into his archery this past year, so he enjoyed a little downtime this past month.

See you there!


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## jkeiffer (Aug 3, 2007)

there are many more things than machine work that go into a bow. While Mathews is very good at what they produce there are others that are just as good to the eye or better. I am an Engineer and I think strictly by looking at them that Hoyt and top end PSE bows are some of the finest (havent seen all the brands recently) the structure of the handles and the profile of the limbs are very improtant and are not as easy to detect as one might think. and even then there are things that you can do to those materials to enhance their properties that we cannot see on the finish of the bow.

if you look at the filt dip on a mathews you will ussually find a lot of little spots light in color, these are not part of the camo they are holes in the film dip process. and Mathews is pretty notorious for having film flake off. each brand has their issues/quirks so dont take this as me bashing mathews, I just feel that looking at the bows side by side doesnt always tell the story even to a trained/accomplished engineer.

later
jkeiffer


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## RT1 (Nov 20, 2006)

Tuffy2 said:


> I'm getting one, it will help me miss faster!


that is the funniest statement

i love it



truth in the matter is that they have been caught by alot of other companies.
My switchback is great, mathews best to date. But shoot a pearson right now, it's faster, pull easier, no vibe, just as quiet, dead in the hands, *less expensive*
nice grip etc. I'm not bashing, i'm a fan and always will be. There all good, in a large part due to mathews. I love my switchback


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

hedoe said:


> you think that just because i ask questions or make suggestions
> and have 2000+ under my user name that i am an expert?
> well that makes one of us
> i am by no means an expert and i don't want to be one
> ...



ukey:
Just the response I expected.


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

DesignedToHunt said:


> What does that have to do with you shooting a bow brand that has been sued repeatedly for copying off of every other company out there and not coming out with anything original themself? I thought that was the issue at hand but here you are trying to switch subjects.
> 
> 
> Those who live in glass houses.............



yes sued.. but you know what.. they are still hear and scarying the he_ _ out of other bow company's... the lawsuits were mostly fluff.. i mean come on.. file a lawsuit for the angle of the limb cup... PLease..... everyone that makes bows could be sued for that.... 

the lawsuits were because bowtech was mad that kevin left the company and went on his own.. without kevin they had no good ideas for new bows... bowtechs bows were kevins designs.. of course kevins new bows would have some similarity.. and they used that to make some lawyers very rich...lol


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

When Bowtech, Hoyt and the rest of the companies released their lineup for 09', did they have 5 pages worth of comments?

Only mathews can create this much conversation on an ad that doesn't even have a pic of a bow or specs other than an assumed speed.

Call it marketing or whatever, but they are set to make some major waves in this industry. And that will be good for everyone.


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## Dren1276 (Mar 10, 2008)

flohunter said:


> when bowtech, hoyt and the rest of the companies released their lineup for 09', did they have 5 pages worth of comments?
> 
> Only mathews can create this much conversation on an ad that doesn't even have a pic of a bow or specs other than an assumed speed.
> 
> Call it marketing or whatever, but they are set to make some major waves in this industry. And that will be good for everyone.




x2


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## xswanted (Feb 1, 2008)

flohunter said:


> When Bowtech, Hoyt and the rest of the companies released their lineup for 09', did they have 5 pages worth of comments?
> 
> Only mathews can create this much conversation on an ad that doesn't even have a pic of a bow or specs other than an assumed speed.
> 
> Call it marketing or whatever, but they are set to make some major waves in this industry. And that will be good for everyone.


Probably the most valid point in this whole thread.


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## BuckeyeRed (Sep 7, 2006)

flohunter said:


> When Bowtech, Hoyt and the rest of the companies released their lineup for 09', did they have 5 pages worth of comments?
> 
> Only mathews can create this much conversation on an ad that doesn't even have a pic of a bow or specs other than an assumed speed.
> Call it marketing or whatever, but they are set to make some major waves in this industry. And that will be good for everyone.



While I agree w/ you on alot of this but, It's statements like this that get's peoples back up.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

flohunter said:


> When Bowtech, Hoyt and the rest of the companies released their lineup for 09', did they have 5 pages worth of comments?
> 
> Only mathews can create this much conversation on an ad that doesn't even have a pic of a bow or specs other than an assumed speed.
> 
> Call it marketing or whatever, but they are set to make some major waves in this industry. And that will be good for everyone.


Pearson has like 9 pages in manuf. area and 6-7 here on there new bows.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

You need to check before bragging on Mathews. Pearson has 11pgs. in Manuf./Hoyt 8/ Darton 6/PSE 4 and then Pearson has 7pgs. on here.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

badbow148 said:


> You need to check before bragging on Mathews. Pearson has 11pgs. in Manuf./Hoyt 8/ Darton 6/PSE 4 and then Pearson has 7pgs. on here.



I am not bragging on Mathews. Just making a point.

This thread is like a wildfire and we dont even know what kind of product we are all talking about.
Who else creates this sort of interest?

According to your stats this thread has already surpassed PSE, will likely tie Darton by tommorow, and Hoyt....well, it is just a matter of time. Of course this is only MY opinion.


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## thespyhunter (Apr 8, 2005)

flohunter said:


> I am not bragging on Mathews. Just making a point.
> 
> This thread is like a wildfire and we dont even know what kind of product we are all talking about.
> Who else creates this sort of interest?
> ...


 To me, the interest is created *purely* in the entertainment value of watching the obnoxious fanboys like you duke it out with everyone else.
Of course, this is only MY opinion, and its worth nuts.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

That flier could just be a hoax also the one page says 340 the other 460 so where did someone get a 340 and a 360 Ibo bow.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

thespyhunter said:


> To me, the interest is created *purely* in the entertainment value of watching the obnoxious fanboys like you duke it out with everyone else.
> Of course, this is only MY opinion, and its worth nuts.


Why would I be an "obnoxious fanboy" as you so elliquently put it?
I merely stated the obvious....that this thread has gotten more attention than most of the other threads concerning bows that have actually been released.

You wouldn't agree with that? Or am I just being a "Fanboy"?


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## Had a Hoyt (Nov 28, 2006)

Yep... nobody else comes close to getting the same attention. Especially when you consider its all over two speedometers.


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## Boludo (Feb 18, 2003)

flohunter said:


> When Bowtech, Hoyt and the rest of the companies released their lineup for 09', did they have 5 pages worth of comments?
> 
> Only mathews can create this much conversation on an ad that doesn't even have a pic of a bow or specs other than an assumed speed.
> 
> Call it marketing or whatever, but they are set to make some major waves in this industry. And that will be good for everyone.



Here's why.

Mathews is the Toyota of the archery world. They produce a great product that loads of people like, that represents a great value. A "you know what you're going to get" type of deal. The other pontiacs, jaguars, and porsches in this analogy may offer better performance but they aren't going to sell as well, and who knows, you may end up with a lemon. Maybe Hoyt is the Honda.

This ad is the equivalent of Toyota coming out with an ad with a picture of their new Camry, with a speedometer reading of 200 mph and 300+ horse power. That would turn some heads, as this one has. It's unexpected and way outside the norm from what we've come to expect. Elite? Sure. Bowtech? You bet. Mathews? Whoa... that's not their gig.

I'm very exited to see if these bows keep their smooth shootability. If so, I will forsake my Hoyt connections and buy my first *gasp* Mathews bow.


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## ruger10x (Feb 1, 2006)

*fake add ??*

I think it is a fake advertisement.
If you left click on the attatchment paper clip
on the main page ,a box will pop up in the 
upper left hand of your screen with all of the attatched
photos,the first pic is filed as "mathewsfakead.jpg"
??? I dont know but it seems kinda fishy !!


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## Mathews4ever (Jan 13, 2007)

Can't worry about cost. I am interested in the 340 solo cam and I wouldn't mind seeing a 2 cam from them I am a big fan boy but I love my GTO we will see I thought the release date was going to be 11/15 and the shops will have them 11/17 they usually come out on a saturday 11/17 will be a monday.:thumbs_up


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## ShootingABN! (Nov 1, 2005)

Somebody has to leak some pic's......:shade::darkbeer:


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

ruger10x said:


> I think it is a fake advertisement.
> If you left click on the attatchment paper clip
> on the main page ,a box will pop up in the
> upper left hand of your screen with all of the attatched
> ...


I called the magazine this afternoon and confirmed it was legit.


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

the fake one is the 460 one the poster is laughing in the post..:tongue:
.. look at the numbers... lol.. 
photo shop...


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## ruger10x (Feb 1, 2006)

flohunter said:


> I called the magazine this afternoon and confirmed it was legit.


well..........cannot argue with that.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

ruger10x said:


> well..........cannot argue with that.


Just wanted to put that "rumor" to rest so I simply picked up the phone and called. They were very nice and just as excited as most of us concerning what it coming. :smile:


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## Woody69 (Feb 17, 2007)

joe4blow said:


> the 360 is already out just not in the mathews name.... you all forget that pearson and mathews have a connection.. the new fast mathews has the rbd2 cam / revolution elite cam(still waiting to see who gets the patient).. the 340 has the same solo cam as the new pse... .. only thing is... both bows will have a short brace....


So that would mean that it's really Pearson/Elite "catch us if you can" and nothing to do with Mathews at all, they are just renting/leasing the technology from someone else ???  :darkbeer:

It will be interestng to see what they come out with either way ! :thumbs_up

Woody


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

Mathews does not need any help with designing a quality bow and does not need to "borrow" technology ! Just wait until they release the "09 line before you guys pop a hemarhoid or something.:darkbeer:


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## Kss_Waylander (Aug 26, 2008)

I swore I'd never buy a Mathews simply because I am annoyed by all the advertising, but the fact of the matter is that if their new bow(s) pull smoother than my 82nd and can match it in speed, I may have to *gulp* go to the cookie cutter company. Time will only tell.


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## thespyhunter (Apr 8, 2005)

Kss_Waylander said:


> *I swore I'd never buy a Mathews simply because I am annoyed by all the *advertising, but the fact of the matter is that if their new bow(s) pull smoother than my 82nd and can match it in speed, I may have to *gulp* go to the cookie cutter company. Time will only tell.



*...........fanboys* :slice:epsi:


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## team_TRX (Feb 26, 2004)

joe4blow said:


> the 360 is already out just not in the mathews name.... you all forget that pearson and mathews have a connection.. the new fast mathews has the rbd2 cam / revolution elite cam(still waiting to see who gets the patient).. the 340 has the same solo cam as the new pse... .. only thing is... both bows will have a short brace....


I would *LOVE* to hear you explanation on how Pearson and Mathews are connected?As far as the R2B2(not rbd2) cam,there is no waiting to see who gets the patent(or patient as you said),as it belongs to Richard.People should know what they are talking about BEFORE they start talking.


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

team_TRX said:


> I would *LOVE* to hear you explanation on how Pearson and Mathews are connected?As far as the R2B2(not rbd2) cam,there is no waiting to see who gets the patent(or patient as you said),as it belongs to Richard.People should know what they are talking about BEFORE they start talking.


really.... he does have it? i would not be to sure about that... i think your talking about the one that ran out... 

i do not see a patent # on his cams????:darkbeer:

unless you can prove me wrong??????????

and the connection i believe is where matt bought the name back if i am not mistaken...:darkbeer:


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## CHAMPION2 (May 6, 2004)

+3. Fit and feel are the two things I look for in a bow. 




BAArcher said:


> Agree 100%....Feel of the shot and quality make a deadly combination no matter what you shoot.


----------



## fletched (May 10, 2006)

joe4blow said:


> really.... he does have it? i would not be to sure about that... i think your talking about the one that ran out...
> 
> i do not see a patent # on his cams????:darkbeer:
> 
> ...


This confuses me, how is mathews and pearson connected? What name did he buy back?


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

> Here's why.
> 
> Mathews is the Toyota of the archery world. They produce a great product that loads of people like, that represents a great value. A "you know what you're going to get" type of deal. The other pontiacs, jaguars, and porsches in this analogy may offer better performance but they aren't going to sell as well, and who knows, you may end up with a lemon. Maybe Hoyt is the Honda.
> 
> ...


Well said, and if they have a shootable speed demon this year more power to them.Maybe they will actually live up to their ever so annoying "catch us if you can" ad slogan. They just have'nt got it that just about every manufacturer has caught them and moved on.


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## Tylord (Apr 4, 2008)

thespyhunter said:


> To me, the interest is created *purely* in the entertainment value of watching the obnoxious fanboys like you duke it out with everyone else.
> Of course, this is only MY opinion, and its worth nuts.


I was just watching this thread but I figured this is so true that I must say:

x2


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## Woody69 (Feb 17, 2007)

hammerdown said:


> Well said, and if they have a shootable speed demon this year more power to them.Maybe they will actually live up to their ever so annoying "catch us if you can" ad slogan. They just have'nt got it that just about every manufacturer has caught them and moved on.


Only if they are using Mathews own technology, as someone else already said they might be leasing another companies cams, "IF" (notice that's a big "if") that is the case then there's nothing to catch, because it's not Mathews own technology !

It will still be interesting to see what they come out with though, leased or not ! :darkbeer:

Woody


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## BAMBRANCH (Oct 17, 2008)

*this bites*

Tech leaps forward should be out lawed. How dare they go beyond wood arrows and flint arrow heads. There should be an ox cart in 1/10 of the drive ways and nothing more. I'm gonna trade this thing for an abbacus.:angry:


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## hammerdown (Nov 30, 2007)

> It will still be interesting to see what they come out with though, leased or not !


I agree


> Tech leaps forward should be out lawed. How dare they go beyond wood arrows and flint arrow heads. There should be an ox cart in 1/10 of the drive ways and nothing more. I'm gonna trade this thing for an abbacus.
> Today 08:10 PM


Whatever. Best I could do in my almost speechless state. Goodnight.


----------



## BAMBRANCH (Oct 17, 2008)

hammerdown said:


> I agree
> Whatever. Best I could do in my almost speechless state. Goodnight.


Just being sarcastic bone head.................................


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## trophytaker75 (Sep 10, 2006)

From what I have heard the ad is true and I have also heard the brace height is suppost to be over 7" on atleast 1 of them.Atleast 1 of them is suppost to be a shorter bow but may not be as short as the DXT but this is just a something I over heard at a mathews shop.The shop owner shoots an 80#X-force and he mentioned the speed he was getting this person then said when the 09 Mthews come out a guarantee you will get rid of your X-force.Take it for what is worth just something I heard.I did ask this person about the ad and he just smiled.After he left I asked the owner about the possibility of them releasing a binary type cam and he said from what he gathered it is possible.


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## DesignedToHunt (Aug 5, 2008)

joe4blow said:


> yes sued.. but you know what.. they are still hear and scarying the he_ _ out of other bow company's... the lawsuits were mostly fluff.. i mean come on.. file a lawsuit for the angle of the limb cup... PLease..... everyone that makes bows could be sued for that....
> 
> the lawsuits were because bowtech was mad that kevin left the company and went on his own.. without kevin they had no good ideas for new bows... bowtechs bows were kevins designs.. of course kevins new bows would have some similarity.. and they used that to make some lawyers very rich...lol



Ummmmm, I won't even respond to the rubbish about Bowtech being jealous and mad because they seem to be doing just fine since Kevin left , but please explain to me why Darton and Bear proceeded to sue them as well? You are right, they are indeed still here, but I reaaaaaaaally don't think they are scaring anyone. Not that they don't make a nice bow, but they have a very long way to go before they sell anywhere near the number of bows that the other bow companies do.


----------



## DesignedToHunt (Aug 5, 2008)

joe4blow said:


> the fake one is the 460 one the poster is laughing in the post..:tongue:
> .. look at the numbers... lol..
> photo shop...





The 460 IBO is for a crossbow so Mathews has not released a dual cam bow. The 340 IBO is actually 341 fps, just like I said earlier in the year


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

oh boy.. look at the numbers.. its a bad photo shop work. the real ad is 340 and 360.. wow someone got you guys good with a 460...


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

customarchery said:


> I found this ad. Maybe the other was I typo
> LOL


you got guys good with the 460..lol


----------



## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

Wow, some people really need to move out of their parents basement and get a life.


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## trophytaker75 (Sep 10, 2006)

I do believe the whole dual track binary cam patt will be nasty on who gets what but I have heard Richard say b4 he had the patt on the roller cable guard and mathews usses it so I would assume if Richard does have the earliest app in for this patt he will be selling rights to it aswell.1 thing that does make me laugh is I have read people are making comments that mathews will try to steal or use without permission someone elses design.I dont think this is something that Mathews is known for but I do know 1 company that is known for it they even produced a bow that cost a grand and they used Mathews style supressors.And it really makes me laugh when I look at this companies site and people are already making comments that mathews is going to use their cams.Someone also said if this company does get awarded the pattend that Mathews would have to pay them rights which is even funnier because they would not pay rights till they themselves were made to stop production and pay up themselves.I do not care who gets awarded what but I do hope that Mathews new line is everything I am told it is suppost to be.


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

trophytaker75 said:


> I do believe the whole dual track binary cam patt will be nasty on who gets what but I have heard Richard say b4 he had the patt on the roller cable guard and mathews usses it so I would assume if Richard does have the earliest app in for this patt he will be selling rights to it aswell.1 thing that does make me laugh is I have read people are making comments that mathews will try to steal or use without permission someone elses design.I dont think this is something that Mathews is known for but I do know 1 company that is known for it they even produced a bow that cost a grand and they used Mathews style supressors.And it really makes me laugh when I look at this companies site and people are already making comments that mathews is going to use their cams.Someone also said if this company does get awarded the pattend that Mathews would have to pay them rights which is even funnier because they would not pay rights till they themselves were made to stop production and pay up themselves.I do not care who gets awarded what but I do hope that Mathews new line is everything I am told it is suppost to be.


wow your a little off on the stealing part.. maybe you should look into the lawsuits before you get more egg on your face..:angel:


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## trophytaker75 (Sep 10, 2006)

joe4blow said:


> wow your a little off on the stealing part.. maybe you should look into the lawsuits before you get more egg on your face..:angel:


Really Might want to read the post again I said I dont THINK this is something Mathews is known for.I was not aware they ever stole anthing I have been told they pay royalties to other companies.I dont call that stealing


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

trophytaker75 said:


> Really Might want to read the post again I said I dont THINK this is something Mathews is known for.I was not aware they ever stole anthing I have been told they pay royalties to other companies.I dont call that stealing


i was not referring to mathews.. i was talking about the other company you accused of stealing...


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## trophytaker75 (Sep 10, 2006)

joe4blow said:


> i was not referring to mathews.. i was talking about the other company you accused of stealing...


Really they were not made to stop production and ordered to pay royalties?


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## Woody69 (Feb 17, 2007)

trophytaker75 said:


> I do believe the whole dual track binary cam patt will be nasty on who gets what but I have heard Richard say b4 he had the patt on the roller cable guard and mathews usses it so I would assume if Richard does have the earliest app in for this patt he will be selling rights to it aswell.1 thing that does make me laugh is I have read people are making comments that mathews will try to steal or use without permission someone elses design.I dont think this is something that Mathews is known for but I do know 1 company that is known for it they even produced a bow that cost a grand and they used Mathews style supressors.And it really makes me laugh when I look at this companies site and people are already making comments that mathews is going to use their cams.Someone also said if this company does get awarded the pattend that Mathews would have to pay them rights which is even funnier because they would not pay rights till they themselves were made to stop production and pay up themselves.I do not care who gets awarded what but I do hope that Mathews new line is everything I am told it is suppost to be.



Wouldn't Martin have the Patent on the roller guard ??? (just asking, i don't know if they do or not) look at the smaller pic on the right.










Woody


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## trophytaker75 (Sep 10, 2006)

Not sure who actually ownes the pattend on it Richard Newberry claims he owns the pattend on the roller cable guard but I do not think he started using it till after Mathew came out with it.Does anyone know who really owns the pattend on the roller cable guard?


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## HCAman (Nov 3, 2003)

According to USPTO, Patent # US 6,722,354 B1. 

Spencer D Land ownes the patent....


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## BAArcher (Feb 5, 2004)

Y'all sound like a bunch of kids on the playground...................


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## mocheese (Dec 19, 2003)

*I don't shoot a Mathews*

However, I do think they make a great bow and are a great company. I also believe it is an extremely smart move to target some of the guys who are all about speed and I believe they will sale a lot of bows again in 09. Whatever they come out with they will sale a lot of them no matter how many cams it has. Reading this thread leads me to believe that a lot of the guys shooting other brands of speed bows are a little nervous about this. Whatever it is Mathews has done a great job advertising for it and we don't even know what it is. Good job Mathews. As stated before I don't shoot a Mathews or intend to but the truth is the truth. JW


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## vhunter (Jan 15, 2008)

09 is going to be a great year for us archerys. I can't believe how many great bows are coming out. I don't care what company makes them, I love what I'm seeing and hearing for 09. Fact is we all win in 09.


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

You have done it again MATT . You actually brougt out all the haters without even given a hint about the new line. Some of you guys are silly as little girls . Could it be possible that Mathews will have the best bows for "09 ? Absolutely!!! SPEED AND QUALITY with a SMOOTH DRAW ...........WOW! CATCH US IF YOU CAN !!!!!! NO RECALL HERE BABY!!!:darkbeer:


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## team_TRX (Feb 26, 2004)

fletched said:


> This confuses me, how is mathews and pearson connected? What name did he buy back?


Matt has nothing to do with Pearson Archery.He is thinking McPherson archery which is totally different now.So once again this guy has no idea what he is talking about.As far as the new cam Richard has for Pearson,just wait and see.There will be no infringments or anything else because it is his design.Someone just wants to stir the pot all the time.


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## Bob_Looney (Nov 17, 2003)

The patent on the roller guard is essentially worthless.
Stanislawski invented it and sold them in the late 70's or early 80's. Martin had one on their bow a year or two after that. The picture of the Martin version is on archeryhistory.com


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## rmadduxjr (Jul 20, 2007)

Mathews marketing team obviously hit a homerun with the 2 page ad. I have never seen so many posts about a new bow without knowing one single thing about it. I have shot Mathews in the past, don't currently shoot one, but might be in the future depending on what they come out with. I am not a fanboy of any brand and will give most every bow a chance before deciding if it is for me or not. Whoever designed the 2 page ad with the speedo's should get a raise. lol


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

rmadduxjr said:


> Mathews marketing team obviously hit a homerun with the 2 page ad. I have never seen so many posts about a new bow without knowing one single thing about it. I have shot Mathews in the past, don't currently shoot one, but might be in the future depending on what they come out with. I am not a fanboy of any brand and will give most every bow a chance before deciding if it is for me or not. Whoever designed the 2 page ad with the speedo's should get a raise. lol


I agree, they are definitely the king of advertisements. Make a real nice bow too. Would love to see them do something with their grip or atleast offer grip options


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## tuskbuster (Apr 8, 2006)

Bob_Looney said:


> The patent on the roller guard is essentially worthless.
> Stanislawski invented it and sold them in the late 70's or early 80's. Martin had one on their bow a year or two after that. The picture of the Martin version is on archeryhistory.com


I thought that was Don Kuldecheck (?)


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## bowtech dually (Mar 10, 2003)

spiaailtli said:


> So it looks like the Mission was a tease.
> 
> If this is true it is going to put the hurt on a couple other bow manufactures. People that wanted to play with a speed bow had no choice but to buy something with a lower reputation than Mathews. We also witnessed all manner of issues with limbs, cams, parts falling off, etc at a higher price than Mathews. People are going to flock to these two bows and you'll see other brands hitting EBay to fund them.
> 
> ...


You did say Martin, didnt you !!!


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## tuskbuster (Apr 8, 2006)

DesignedToHunt said:


> The 460 IBO is for a crossbow so Mathews has not released a dual cam bow. The 340 IBO is actually 341 fps, just like I said earlier in the year


So you've shot them. What's the ATA and BH? What do you think as far as hand shock?


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## RT1 (Nov 20, 2006)

*there watching*



rmadduxjr said:


> Mathews marketing team obviously hit a homerun with the 2 page ad. I have never seen so many posts about a new bow without knowing one single thing about it. I have shot Mathews in the past, don't currently shoot one, but might be in the future depending on what they come out with. I am not a fanboy of any brand and will give most every bow a chance before deciding if it is for me or not. Whoever designed the 2 page ad with the speedo's should get a raise. lol


not only is mathews web watcher paying attention but so is every other bow company reading this thread and others trying to get the latest info.

Mathews web watcher is probably getting a kick at recording all this buzz.

Amazing response


I want to know what darton and bear archery patents that mathews might have infringed on. Not saying they did just curious of what it could've been?


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## xswanted (Feb 1, 2008)

Wow. I can't believe........well wait a second........I guess I can believe this thread has got this many posts and it over an ADVERTISEMENT!!!!!!!


Simply amazing.


I hope when I release the Moythewstech ad it gets this much buzz.


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## Cornfed (Oct 15, 2002)

WOW.... these new models should be interesting. I'm sure like most serious speed rigs though, it will draw like a monster. I'm curious either way.


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## Bob_Looney (Nov 17, 2003)

tuskbuster said:


> I thought that was Don Kuldecheck (?)


nope

Kudlaceck had the first shoot thru riser on a compound. Everybody laughed at him then copied his idea. Hoyt still uses the design.
Patented his offset step wheels. ie; they were non concentric eccentrics. Hoyt modified them into their power wheels, then Nurney shaped both sides to create the Hatchet cam.
Don had a bow that used levers to pay out cable during the draw process but I don't know exactly what the purpose was for.


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## DesignedToHunt (Aug 5, 2008)

tuskbuster said:


> So you've shot them. What's the ATA and BH? What do you think as far as hand shock?



I was just kidding about the crossbow lol. Honestly, I knew nothing about the 360 IBO bow, but earlier in the year a "friend" had told me they were releasing a bow that would do 341 IBO with a 6" brace height and the ATA was going to be roughly 35". I was under the impression that this bow wouldn't be out until next year though and the bow they were releasing this fall would "only" do 333 IBO.


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## JCO.Bowhunter (Dec 3, 2007)

DesignedToHunt said:


> I was just kidding about the crossbow lol. Honestly, I knew nothing about the 360 IBO bow, but earlier in the year a "friend" had told me they were releasing a bow that would do 341 IBO with a 6" brace height and the ATA was going to be roughly 35". I was under the impression that this bow wouldn't be out until next year though and the bow they were releasing this fall would "only" do 333 IBO.


you just described the bow i want :smile:


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

people should read the whole thread...the 460 ibo was PHOTOSHOPPED...right click and save it and i bet it says something about a fake as a file name...


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

customarchery said:


> I found this ad. Maybe the other was I typo
> LOL


go to page 3 and look at the 4 in the 400's......*FAKE!!!*...the first ad on the first page is accurate and its 360...so my guess is that its not a *CROSSbow* at 460 beacuse its FAKE

Why are we arguing over the roller guard...id rather have a slide personally...to much tension...at least to me and all of the techs at the pro shop...none of them like it either


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## BigEves34 (May 9, 2007)

This thread is hilarious!:tongue::thumbs_up


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## gafferq2xl (Aug 1, 2003)

While I don't know this to be fact, I suspect these new speed bows will have cams similar to the Mission Menace. It would give a realistic reason for these speeds.


http://missionarchery.com/menace-bow.asp


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## trailk11 (Feb 21, 2007)

Wow who knew when I picked up a muley crazy mag and posted the ad that it would turn into this....I think i should get a free bow on the house for creating this much hype.


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

I think Kevin proved his point that he made in his letter posted on this site.

His claims of 200 limbs breaking per week in the lab and wanting bowtech to use quality cams and risers turned out to be true.

When he started Elite he took his riser he designed at bowtech and put top quality limbs, strings, and Barnsdale limbs on it. Poof 5 year worth of limbs breaking gone! Elite continues to upgrade everything about their bows to the best parts that can be manufactured. Bowtech is still trying to get by with the same old "hope they're good enough" parts. We see where that got them.


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> I think Kevin proved his point that he made in his letter posted on this site.
> 
> His claims of 200 limbs breaking per week in the lab and wanting bowtech to use quality cams and risers turned out to be true.
> 
> When he started Elite he took his riser he designed at bowtech and put top quality limbs, strings, and Barnsdale limbs on it. Poof 5 year worth of limbs breaking gone! Elite continues to upgrade everything about their bows to the best parts that can be manufactured. Bowtech is still trying to get by with the same old "hope they're good enough" parts. We see where that got them.


 How much does Elite pay you?
You can't be into a company this much


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Nothing, I've just been keeping tabs since it the letter was posted 5ish years ago. His story matched what I had heard and I wanted to see how it played out. 

I believe in the rule time tells the truth. 

Heck, I don't even own an Elite bow. I was thinking about it though before the Mathew anouncement hit.


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## Deer30 (Oct 19, 2006)

spiaailtli said:


> I think Kevin proved his point that he made in his letter posted on this site.
> 
> His claims of 200 limbs breaking per week in the lab and wanting bowtech to use quality cams and risers turned out to be true.
> 
> When he started Elite he took his riser he designed at bowtech and put top quality limbs, strings, and Barnsdale limbs on it. Poof 5 year worth of limbs breaking gone! Elite continues to upgrade everything about their bows to the best parts that can be manufactured. Bowtech is still trying to get by with the same old "hope they're good enough" parts. We see where that got them.


Where has it got Bowtech, top of the food chain. Get a clue before posting


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

They're not and for the life of me I can figure out why some people think they are. Kind of like charging 40K for a scooter and calling it a porsche.


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## Jhorne (Jul 15, 2003)

spiaailtli said:


> They're not and for the life of me I can figure out why some people think they are. Kind of like charging 40K for a scooter and calling it a porsche.


I'm sure Elite is sucking hind tit.:teeth:


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Nope Elite makes a great product. They are right up there with Mathews, Hoyt, Martin, and PSE.


Now back to our regularly scheduled program...How about those new 360 FPS Mathews bows!


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## Jhorne (Jul 15, 2003)

What few bows they sell ends up in the classifieds.:teeth:


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

hidden danger said:


> You have done it again MATT . You actually brougt out all the haters without even given a hint about the new line. Some of you guys are silly as little girls . Could it be possible that Mathews will have the best bows for "09 ? Absolutely!!! SPEED AND QUALITY with a SMOOTH DRAW ...........WOW! CATCH US IF YOU CAN !!!!!! NO RECALL HERE BABY!!!:darkbeer:



Best statement yet! :thumbs_up


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

rmadduxjr said:


> Mathews marketing team obviously hit a homerun with the 2 page ad. I have never seen so many posts about a new bow without knowing one single thing about it. I have shot Mathews in the past, don't currently shoot one, but might be in the future depending on what they come out with. I am not a fanboy of any brand and will give most every bow a chance before deciding if it is for me or not. Whoever designed the 2 page ad with the speedo's should get a raise. lol


2nd best staement. :thumbs_up


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## Dren1276 (Mar 10, 2008)

flohunter said:


> Best statement yet! :thumbs_up




Yep this ad has definatly brought out the Limb busters club. Congrats to Mathews for another succesful year of great bows and sales. Best part is there not even out yet. I guess we know why Mathews is number 1 year after year.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

badbow148 said:


> You need to check before bragging on Mathews. Pearson has 11pgs. in Manuf./Hoyt 8/ Darton 6/PSE 4 and then Pearson has 7pgs. on here.



You were saying...........

Wether you want to admitt it or not, only Mathews can create this kind of buzz over something that none of us have seen, touched, or shot.

That's not a fanboy statement, just the facts. This thread speaks volumes for the impact that Mathews Inc. has in this industry. Like it or not, good or bad.


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## BAArcher (Feb 5, 2004)

There are several great bow manufacturers out there but few can come close to what Mathews has done for the sport. 
From the National Archery in Schools Program through their sponsoring of 3D archery......They have enhanced the sport which allowed everyone to benefit.


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## Jhorne (Jul 15, 2003)

BAArcher said:


> There are several great bow manufacturers out there but few can come close to what Mathews has done for the sport.
> From the National Archery in Schools Program through their sponsoring of 3D archery......They have enhanced the sport which allowed everyone to benefit.


True.


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## 3D-Nut (Jan 26, 2007)

One thing is for sure here.

AT will need new servers after these bows hit the market regardless of all of this dithering about how smooth they are or arent or how short the brace hieghts are or arent or how hard or smooth they pull ect......


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## JMaxH (Mar 20, 2003)

Okay guys.....this probably means nothing, and I'm reading into it too much....

BUT - does the speedometer on the right look like it's got a carbon fiber background, while the one on the left doesn't??? Is there a reason for this??

I called my wife in earlier without saying anything and she noticed it right off....


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## Mrwintr (Jan 15, 2006)

JMaxH said:


> Okay guys.....this probably means nothing, and I'm reading into it too much....
> 
> BUT - does the speedometer on the right look like it's got a carbon fiber background, while the one on the left doesn't??? Is there a reason for this??
> 
> I called my wife in earlier without saying anything and she noticed it right off....


I see what your saying, the background Black has a different texture, but I would dare guess to what meaning it has....?


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## cdhunter (Feb 4, 2006)

team_TRX said:


> I would *LOVE* to hear you explanation on how Pearson and Mathews are connected?As far as the R2B2(not rbd2) cam,there is no waiting to see who gets the patent(or patient as you said),as it belongs to Richard.People should know what they are talking about BEFORE they start talking.


where is said patent and patent number? like you said people should know what they're talking about before they start talking. If you can provide it then I apologize if not your just like the rest of us only goinig by what we hear or read.


If Mathews is using a two track binary cam and if the Elite gets the patent on the dual track cam, then the question becomes does Matt have enough money to keep Mathews open, or does he abandon his two cam bow?


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Someone was talking about the "No Fear" logo in the middle of the second one too. I looked it up and it is close but not exact. It just adds more to the mystery and gets people looking harder for clues. I think the whole Mission dual cam at 300 fps release was nothing short of briliant. 

It started the buzz and people still overlook its true meaning. Some even laughted at the speed. I thought the coments were way too funny and wondered how those folk would react later.

Anyone notice anything else about the ad?


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

I'm almost 100% sure they had this bow in the works before they released the DXT. There are just too many things starting to add up now. I wonder why they waited?


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## XTFreak (Sep 1, 2007)

In 7 days the whole mystery will be revealed.
Until then I will be paitent...
Bill


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

spiaailtli said:


> I'm almost 100% sure they had this bow in the works before they released the DXT. There are just too many things starting to add up now. I wonder why they waited?



I have felt this has been in the works since they released the Switchback. They have only made small adjustmnents since then.


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## TailChaser (Aug 13, 2005)

Thanks for showing the add. As far as the speed, from an engineer, it's really just all about the efficiency. Maybe they made one a little more effiicient, but if it's shooting 360 I can promise you it doesn't have the brace height or smooth draw of an outback/switchback. Hopefully they found a new way to make it more efficient and only made it just a little harder to draw. Then I'd like


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## Kelsnore (Feb 7, 2005)

TailChaser said:


> Thanks for showing the add. As far as the speed, from an engineer, it's really just all about the efficiency. Maybe they made one a little more effiicient, but if it's shooting 360 I can promise you it doesn't have the brace height or smooth draw of an outback/switchback. Hopefully they found a new way to make it more efficient and only made it just a little harder to draw. Then I'd like


Well if I've learned anything about Bow Companies over the years, they have a way of blowing my socks off every year by surpassing my expectations!!

I suspect this year will be no different!


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## jrmsoccer32 (Feb 22, 2007)

So on the Mathews forum they were kicking it around that Matt owns the patent on a solocam crossbow and that this 360 fps deal could be a crossbow... anyone have any thoughts on that i think i would puke if Mathews made a crossbow


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## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

Carbon Fiber Riser, new limb composite and 3 grains per pound arrow weight.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

jrmsoccer32 said:


> So on the Mathews forum they were kicking it around that Matt owns the patent on a solocam crossbow and that this 360 fps deal could be a crossbow... anyone have any thoughts on that i think i would puke if Mathews made a crossbow


I may be wrong.....but I doubt that is what is going to happen.


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

about a solo cam cross bow.... that would be very hard to do... reason being is that a solo cam does not have level nock travel.. by that i mean 90 deg.... solo cams start high and work down to level.. so you would end up with sideways travel...


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## jrmsoccer32 (Feb 22, 2007)

joe4blow said:


> about a solo cam cross bow.... that would be very hard to do... reason being is that a solo cam does not have level nock travel.. by that i mean 90 deg.... solo cams start high and work down to level.. so you would end up with sideways travel...


http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...50&s1=6267108.PN.&OS=PN/6267108&RS=PN/6267108 

there you go theres the patent for it matt has the patent so that leads me to believe he'd like to make it... someday maybe now


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## IL 88 (Aug 15, 2007)

jrmsoccer32 said:


> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...50&s1=6267108.PN.&OS=PN/6267108&RS=PN/6267108
> 
> there you go theres the patent for it matt has the patent so that leads me to believe he'd like to make it... someday maybe now


i think we might have a winner


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## jrmsoccer32 (Feb 22, 2007)

IL 88 said:


> i think we might have a winner


it only makes sense


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

jrmsoccer32 said:


> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...50&s1=6267108.PN.&OS=PN/6267108&RS=PN/6267108
> 
> there you go theres the patent for it matt has the patent so that leads me to believe he'd like to make it... someday maybe now


says right in there that there is .4in travel.. that is the prob


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## jrmsoccer32 (Feb 22, 2007)

joe4blow said:


> says right in there that there is .4in travel.. that is the prob


What are you talking about? That is the ratio of track to string.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

What this tread shows is how bad the fan boys (Mathews) really want a speed bow. Like last year they where let down and said its all about, what ever crap they come up with for reason why not. I hope they come up with a true speed bow, more to choose from. I heard they had dollar size vib . dampners from a rat.


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## Jay-J (Apr 20, 2005)

*wow*

I sure hope it 's not a crossbow!!! ...Surely not,,...Huh


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## BuckeyeRed (Sep 7, 2006)

It will not be a crossbow :nerd:


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## vince71969 (Apr 17, 2004)

joe4blow said:


> about a solo cam cross bow.... that would be very hard to do... reason being is that a solo cam does not have level nock travel.. by that i mean 90 deg.... solo cams start high and work down to level.. so you would end up with sideways travel...



You're incorrect about your comments on nock travel. Not only does Mathews have level nock travel vertically (many single cam bows do these days) but they also have level nock travel laterally (side to side).


Still, I would guess that it's not a crossbow.


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

badbow148 said:


> What this tread shows is how bad the fan boys (Mathews) really want a speed bow. Like last year they where let down and said its all about, what ever crap they come up with for reason why not. I hope they come up with a true speed bow, more to choose from. I heard they had dollar size vib . dampners from a rat.


Could be but I'm shooting a new Martin. They had a 350 fps and a 340 fps bow out when I bought mine. I bought the 310 fps bow for all the same reasons the Mathews fanboys shoot Mathews. It's fast enough, very quite, no hand shock, very smooth, it hits exactly where I aim it and I can shoot it all day long.

As to the crossbow, that was a joke. It says so later in the thread. If they were going to produce a crossbow they would have done it 8 years ago when they built they proto type. If Matt "always wanted one" he would have one. It's not like they're hurting for money or don't have the design. It is his company you know.


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## la.basscat (Jan 16, 2006)

3D-Nut said:


> One thing is for sure here.
> 
> AT will need new servers after these bows hit the market regardless of all of this dithering about how smooth they are or arent or how short the brace hieghts are or arent or how hard or smooth they pull ect......


They need them now!


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## so1ocam (Aug 24, 2007)

Mathews marketing department has got to love threads like this. All the speculation and nothing to back it up but 1 add. In 7 days we will find out what's really going on at Mathews.


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## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

kinner said:


> You're incorrect about your comments on nock travel. Not only does Mathews have level nock travel vertically (many single cam bows do these days)* but they also have level nock travel laterally (side to side).*
> 
> 
> Still, I would guess that it's not a crossbow.


Who, Ive never seen a single cam that doesnt need the idler lean set. At full draw the cable needs twists in the harness to set the idler to plumb and at rest there is lean so wouldnt that make horizontal travel of the string to some degree? It seems impossible not to have some left to right travel.


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## PMantle (Feb 15, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> I'm almost 100% sure they had this bow in the works before they released the DXT. There are just too many things starting to add up now. I wonder why they waited?



My thought is, and I hope I do not offend, is that a company like Mathews would be crazy to release the absolute end of their known tech. If they did, where would they go? Release enough to maintain your spot or grow a bit in the market. Reserve enough to continue growing. Or, I could be completely wrong. 


Oh, and it can't be a crossbow. The speed is too low to justify this kind of announcement. It will be a fast bow that one will still pay the price to draw. There is still no free lunch out there.This is why speed discussions are useless. The archer has to load the bow to get there no matter what. Want to compare bows? Forget IBO and throw out peak weight. Set the two bows to the same speed, then compare the draw.


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## wis_archer (Jul 27, 2007)

machinegun74 said:


> Who, Ive never seen a single cam that doesnt need the idler lean set. At full draw the cable needs twists in the harness to set the idler to plumb and at rest there is lean so wouldnt that make horizontal travel of the string to some degree? It seems impossible not to have some left to right travel.


There is definently cam lean in the Drenalin/DXT.


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## metrofire (Sep 6, 2008)

Might be that fast but who nows where your arrow will go it will be so hard to shoot. Smooth and quiet is the key.


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## txcookie (Feb 17, 2007)

crazy hype las yr as well. Big let down imo I hope they make somthin worth the wait this yr!


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## BigEves34 (May 9, 2007)

metrofire said:


> Might be that fast but who nows where your arrow will go it will be so hard to shoot. Smooth and quiet is the key.


It's going to shoot wherever you point it..... :tongue:


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## bowhuntermitch (May 17, 2005)

Whatever they come out with it will be a nice bow, just like the previous years bows


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## B3AV3R (Apr 19, 2006)

bowhuntermitch said:


> Whatever they come out with it will be a nice bow, just like the previous years bows


I can't remember the last time I saw a bad bow... from any manufacturer, really.


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## 500 fps (Oct 13, 2002)

Don Beaver said:


> I can't remember the last time I saw a bad bow... from any manufacturer, really.


That's exactly right. Which makes all the negativity out there ridiculous.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

bowhuntermitch said:


> Whatever they come out with it will be a nice bow, just like the previous years bows


You are right the samo/solo


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

kinner said:


> You're incorrect about your comments on nock travel. Not only does Mathews have level nock travel vertically (many single cam bows do these days) but they also have level nock travel laterally (side to side).
> 
> 
> Still, I would guess that it's not a crossbow.


 the up and down travel that a solo cam has would turn to side to side on a cross bow....


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## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

kinner said:


> You're incorrect about your comments on nock travel. Not only does Mathews have level nock travel vertically (many single cam bows do these days) but they also have level nock travel laterally (side to side).
> 
> 
> Still, I would guess that it's not a crossbow.


 the up and down travel that a solo cam has would turn to side to side on a cross bow.... 

mathews has straight line travel.. not 90 deg travel... mathews are high at full draw and come down straight level.. y do you think you need to have the arrow above 90 deg to string on a mathews... if it was perfect level 90 deg travel you would not need to be tail high...


----------



## vince71969 (Apr 17, 2004)

joe4blow said:


> the up and down travel that a solo cam has would turn to side to side on a cross bow....
> 
> mathews has straight line travel.. not 90 deg travel... mathews are high at full draw and come down straight level.. y do you think you need to have the arrow above 90 deg to string on a mathews... if it was perfect level 90 deg travel you would not need to be tail high...



No. The travel is in fact perpindicular to the axle line (or 90 deg as you call it). This isn't my opinion, it's fact.


As far as tuning, that's dependent on other variables including release used, d-loop or nockset etc. When a d-loop is used with proper form, a level nock height usually works best.


----------



## camoham (Nov 3, 2004)

this is a historic thread i believe.

bump to keep this one going!

:thumbs_up

thanks for the entertainment.

camoham


----------



## joe4blow (Oct 24, 2008)

kinner said:


> No. The travel is in fact perpindicular to the axle line (or 90 deg as you call it). This isn't my opinion, it's fact.
> 
> 
> As far as tuning, that's dependent on other variables including release used, d-loop or nockset etc. When a d-loop is used with proper form, a level nock height usually works best.


let me dig up a draw map done on a shooting machine of a few bows nock travel... mathews is not 90 deg level.. only ones that were are a 2 cam in perfect time.. and a few binarys.. most did not..


----------



## jkeiffer (Aug 3, 2007)

joe4blow said:


> let me dig up a draw map done on a shooting machine of a few bows nock travel... mathews is not 90 deg level.. only ones that were are a 2 cam in perfect time.. and a few binarys.. most did not..


when the cable and string are tuned to proper length they are designed to have level, perpendicular (what ever you want to call it, Perfect) nock travel

If you play around with things this much to see that it isnt perfect then try adjusting the cable or string and see if it improves, if it gets worse then go the opposite way and I bet you can tune it in perfect.

later
jkeiffer


----------



## PMantle (Feb 15, 2004)

The eyes look like an owl's.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

badbow148 said:


> You need to check before bragging on Mathews. Pearson has 11pgs. in Manuf./Hoyt 8/ Darton 6/PSE 4 and then Pearson has 7pgs. on here.



You were saying..............:RockOn:


----------



## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Last year it apears a couple people had inside info and leaked bits and pieces. Everyone got way excited. When Mathews released the 08 line, the stuff hit the fan and people complained big time.

It now looks as though the inside info may have been correct but the leaks were about this years model...the 09 line up. The leaks match what could be reflected in the posted ad. That's what makes me believe Mathews has been working on this for a couple of years. The people that had info or seen product just assumed it would be released in 08 and got people fired up.

I don't know if those "features" will be released this year, but one of them could give a manufacture an advantage if it were relaease at the right time and the market accepted it. Quite often we see technology released before people are ready for it and it backfires. Success also depends on the technology being mature.


----------



## archerm3 (Jan 4, 2007)

flohunter said:


> *When Bowtech, Hoyt and the rest of the companies released their lineup for 09', did they have 5 pages worth of comments?*
> Only mathews can create this much conversation on an ad that doesn't even have a pic of a bow or specs other than an assumed speed.
> 
> Call it marketing or whatever, but they are set to make some major waves in this industry. And that will be good for everyone.


Um...yes, they did.


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

PMantle said:


> The eyes look like an owl's.


I know, I know...They are ninja eyes and the new bow is a carbon fiber stick bow.


----------



## vince71969 (Apr 17, 2004)

joe4blow said:


> let me dig up a draw map done on a shooting machine of a few bows nock travel... mathews is not 90 deg level.. only ones that were are a 2 cam in perfect time.. and a few binarys.. most did not..




Mathews bows have level nock travel on all planes. This is done with the string being pulled from directly behind the berger button. If you start high or low from that point you'll still have a straight line but it will slope in that direction.


----------



## Big Ragu (Feb 27, 2008)

*speed bows?*

The bench marks that the big bow company's strive for (i believe) will never be reached. I am referring to speed, Its like Tony Sinclair says and says it best .... all good things in moderation baby....Your ability to hit the center of a target has less to do with speed than predictability and accuracy. Imagine all of your shooting flaws condensed, super charged,and magnified to the power of ten. Faster is better but only in moderation, even the very best archers in the world will begin to notice errors at speeds in the 360 to 380 range. I'm intrigued as much as the next guy about how far the technolgy will take the sport ,but as for me I would give up 10 or 15 fps for a better shooting bow every time, I like a long A/T/A and a big brace hight and Im sure im not alone.:shade::shade:


----------



## PMantle (Feb 15, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> I know, I know...They are ninja eyes and the new bow is a carbon fiber stick bow.


Not at 360 fps. :wink:

Makes me think it's not a solocam. Not a dual cam. A system that has never been used before.


----------



## UltraMaxBandit (Jul 7, 2008)

I just hope that the time has finally come to shut bowwreck up and their blowies. Bowtech doesnt even have an engineer thats in Matts class. Matt is the validictorian of archery. Bowtech is that guy that sits in the back and does just enough to get by. Hoyt is the shy little girl with above average test scores and the runner up to the validictorian. Face it if All the top engineers from other bow companies were in the same class as Matt in college Matt would have smoked them big time. He uses his mind to think about other things than money. The money for him is just a bonus. 

Randy aka drenalinhnterco


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

huntntrail said:


> Here's a tid bit for anyone out there dying for any new info on the 2009 stuff....Just picked up a copy of the Nov Dec issue of Muley Crazy Magazine and on the last 2 pages there are two mathews ads......It reads..."Mathews. The fastest, most efficient bows, Ever!...and below there are two speedometers only it's in FPS feet per second....the one on the left page has a pic of the idler wheel "solocam" and the needle is pointing at 340...the ad on right is also a speedometer, has no idler wheel and the needle is buried at 360 FPS.......so...very exciting and interesting can't wait to see them....
> _________________


interesting.....

gas on


----------



## HoytFlinger (Jan 26, 2007)

UltraMaxBandit said:


> I just hope that the time has finally come to shut bowwreck up and their blowies. Bowtech doesnt even have an engineer thats in Matts class. Matt is the validictorian of archery. Bowtech is that guy that sits in the back and does just enough to get by. Hoyt is the shy little girl with above average test scores and the runner up to the validictorian. Face it if All the top engineers from other bow companies were in the same class as Matt in college Matt would have smoked them big time. He uses his mind to think about other things than money. The money for him is just a bonus.
> 
> Randy aka drenalinhnterco


lol...whatever


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## marforme (May 30, 2006)

HoytFlinger said:


> lol...whatever


 Yeah I was thinking the same thing.

Also seems to be a few expert tuners here. Talk to a real expert tuner before saying Mathews has level nock travel.


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## salty444 (Dec 16, 2006)

PMantle said:


> The eyes look like an owl's.


so are you saying it will be called the Mathews Hooter ?


----------



## marforme (May 30, 2006)

salty444 said:


> so are you saying it will be called the Mathews Hooter ?


Great, then they will be known as Hooter shooters.


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## Jeff K in IL (Nov 4, 2005)

marforme said:


> Yeah I was thinking the same thing.
> 
> Also seems to be a few expert tuners here. Talk to a real expert tuner before saying Mathews has level nock travel.


Most bows don't acheive level nock travel throughout the whole draw.


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

First kill with it is posted on the Mathews site. I was thinking Piggy1 might be the first but it looks like someone might have beat her to the punch this year. 

Waiting on official word but I'm pretty sure.


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## PMantle (Feb 15, 2004)

salty444 said:


> so are you saying it will be called the Mathews Hooter ?


The HT1.


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## vince71969 (Apr 17, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> First kill with it is posted on the Mathews site. I was thinking Piggy1 might be the first but it looks like someone might have beat her to the punch this year.
> 
> Waiting on official word but I'm pretty sure.


I would say no.


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## Jeff K in IL (Nov 4, 2005)

kinner said:


> I would say no.


The man is Ron Bion, a Mathews Warranty Tech.


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## badbow148 (Dec 5, 2006)

Need to get that Mc Cain & Palin off there it was not even close.


----------



## vince71969 (Apr 17, 2004)

Jeff K in IL said:


> The man is Ron Bion, a Mathews Warranty Tech.


I still don't think he was using one of the new bows.


----------



## machinegun74 (Jul 24, 2005)

kinner said:


> Mathews bows have level nock travel on all planes. This is done with the string being pulled from directly behind the berger button. If you start high or low from that point you'll still have a straight line but it will slope in that direction.


No they dont, and Ive never seen a single cam that did. Nock point has to be set a little higher than the berger hole, the idler leans at rest and is set when its plumb at full draw and center shot isnt in the center. Please explain why all this is necessary if they have level travel both ways.


----------



## gafferq2xl (Aug 1, 2003)

I think it's kind of mystic that Electronic Arts newest in the "Need for Speed" series (aptly named, Undercover) is coming out the same day as the new Mathews bows.


----------



## caliwhackmaster (Feb 14, 2007)

Great as if the other 40 ads they have in every hunting magazine weren't enough. I am so sick of seeing Mathews on everything. Reminds me of a bragging school boy lying about getting laid


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## Jeff K in IL (Nov 4, 2005)

badbow148 said:


> Need to get that Mc Cain & Palin off there it was not even close.


Pssshhh, whatever. Thats who I support, so thats what stays!


----------



## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

archerm3 said:


> Um...yes, they did.


Oh yeah, now I remember all the hype and conversation afterwards. ukey:


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## Pride Hunter (Aug 6, 2005)

*Jeez.*

Come on now folks. We all like to poke a little fun at the other brands but when it comes down to it we are all still ARCHERS. I for one hope the new Mathews is everyting people could want out of a bow. Because when any company comes up with any inovation, be it Mathews single cams, Bowtec center pivot, Darton and their cams, or Pearson with their ETI insert Barnsdale limbs, the the true winners are us- the consumers. Plus the other companies work that much harder to get us a better product than the "other guy". And until we actually see these new bows everything will be just speculation.


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## Q2DEATH (May 12, 2003)

badbow148 said:


> Need to get that Mc Cain & Palin off there it was not even close.



The funny thing is, 4 years from now you'll still see those bumper stickers and yard signs.


----------



## marforme (May 30, 2006)

badbow148 said:


> Need to get that Mc Cain & Palin off there it was not even close.


What are you smokin, he won with only 52% of the vote. I would call that close, but the media will have you thinking otherwise.

Sorry, back to topic


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## JOE PA (Dec 13, 2003)

*I'm hoping...*

Hope the new Mathews IS all that. Might help me get a good deal on a used Switchback.


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## la.basscat (Jan 16, 2006)

badbow148 said:


> You are right the samo/solo


Works for me and many others. Whatever they come up with will probably end up in my stable. Got to love the suspense


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

Jeff K in IL said:


> Pssshhh, whatever. Thats who I support, so thats what stays!


:thumbs_up


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

9 pages. That is unbelievable.


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## mschviuz (Jan 18, 2006)

People looking for "change"...isn't why Obama got elected too?


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## 30 X (Apr 4, 2005)

wow 8 pages of no news and no pictures.


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

30 X said:


> wow 8 pages of no news and no pictures.


There're coming...........Mathews 09..............to be continued.....


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

18,973 people have viewed this thread.........WOW!!!


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

hidden danger said:


> 18,973 people have viewed this thread.........WOW!!!


A lot of folks on here won't admit it, but that is really something.
No, that is not a "Fanboy" statement, just my opinion.


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## Kelsnore (Feb 7, 2005)

Personally, I'm hoping for a solocam bow 31-33" Long, with an IBO around 320'ish! That bow would stand out for sure!!!


----------



## Mathews4ever (Jan 13, 2007)

Kelsnore said:


> Personally, I'm hoping for a solocam bow 31-33" Long, with an IBO around 320'ish! That bow would stand out for sure!!!


You are joking around right being the dren is 33ATA and 320ibo.


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## tylerolsen12 (Feb 8, 2007)

Mathews4ever said:


> You are joking around right being the dren is 33ATA and 320ibo.


thats what i was thinking also lol


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## Kelsnore (Feb 7, 2005)

Why?? Something around 4#'s would be perfect!!


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

sure wish someone would spill the beans already...............geeeez:darkbeer:


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## Crackers (Mar 9, 2004)

McPherson Binary cam bow may be.......they did by the name back


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## NewPragueArcher (Aug 6, 2008)

30 X said:


> wow 8 pages of no news and no pictures.


LMAO, Are we sick? or just........?


----------



## SilentSniper (Sep 1, 2005)

Im not going to buy one. Obama will take speed from your bow and give it to me. I don't have to do anything to earn it. I love America. ukey:


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## Jay-J (Apr 20, 2005)

*Please*

36 - 37" ata....please!!!!!!!!!


----------



## MegaDan (Jan 23, 2007)

*The new mathews"kick a** technology"*

i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r

35" ATA
7.25" BH
40-80 lbs
3.9lbs(mass wieght)
Draw 25-31"
340fps
"solocam"

The bow shoots smooth as silk, whisper quiet, can't beat it


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

MegaDan said:


> i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r
> 
> 35" ATA
> 7.25" BH
> ...


I will be the first to say it.........That is killer if in fact you did shoot it.
Dont take that personal but NOBODY knows anything and you've already shot the thing?


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## Mike from Texas (May 15, 2004)

MegaDan said:


> i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r
> 
> 35" ATA
> 7.25" BH
> ...


We'll see on the 17th.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

:thumbs_up:thumbs_up:thumbs_up:thumbs_up:thumbs_up


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

SilentSniper said:


> Im not going to buy one. Obama will take speed from your bow and give it to me. I don't have to do anything to earn it. I love America. ukey:


Grow up.


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

flohunter said:


> I will be the first to say it.........That is killer if in fact you did shoot it.
> Dont take that personal but NOBODY knows anything and you've already shot the thing?


thinking the same


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## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

MegaDan said:


> i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r
> 
> 35" ATA
> 7.25" BH
> ...


I find it surprising someone told you that you could release any of that info.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

rodney482 said:


> I find it surprising someone told you that you could release any of that info.


He's a PSE pro staffer. I find it hard to believe he's shot anything new from Mathews and I can assure you he's got no clearance to share any info so I think we can safely assume this is bravo sierra until we see the "real" info from Mathews.


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## 22Hertz (Mar 15, 2005)

silentsniper said:


> im not going to buy one. Obama will take speed from your bow and give it to me. I don't have to do anything to earn it. I love america. ukey:


hahaha:d


----------



## skynight (Nov 5, 2003)

Predator said:


> He's a PSE pro staffer. I find it hard to believe he's shot anything new from Mathews and I can assure you he's got no clearance to share any info so I think we can safely assume this is bravo sierra until we see the "real" info from Mathews.


http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?p=7554813#post7554813

See post #116


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## wis_archer (Jul 27, 2007)

SHHHHHHHHHHH that's one of Matt's top secret bows, he's planned out for the next couple years


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## 22Hertz (Mar 15, 2005)

What about that sweet Mathews hat. Thats gotta add at least 5FPS


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

hidden danger said:


> 18,973 people have viewed this thread.........WOW!!!


Nope...Sorry, I got a little excited that day. 18,900 are mine.


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

spiaailtli said:


> Nope...Sorry, I got a little excited that day. 18,900 are mine.


All you got to see was 18,900 " internet explorer cannot display web page "....................:darkbeer:


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

wis_archer said:


> SHHHHHHHHHHH that's one of Matt's top secret bows, he's planned out for the next couple years


Not a Mathews. Look closely at the limbs. They are cracked so it's obviously a Bowtech model.....the new I.E.D . IMPROVISED EXPLODING DEVICE so to keep up with the military theme. And yes they copied the HUNS technology!:shade:


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## JustRace (Oct 18, 2006)

hidden danger said:


> All you got to see was 18,900 " internet explorer cannot display web page "....................:darkbeer:


Thats my quote of the day for sure.... Thank you that made me laugh.


----------



## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

Do any of you guys remember this same thing last year?
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=567001

13,000 views, 6 pages of replies... 500,000 cases of severe disappointment when the new bows were finally released.


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Yep and I think that was due to information leaking about this bow. When the info was posted everyone though they were releasing it last year. It's looking like the ad confirms they are turning it loose this year.

There was some very good info posted about it last year, so we'll see if this is it.


----------



## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

spiaailtli said:


> Yep and I think that was due to information leaking about this bow. When the info was posted everyone though they were releasing it last year. It's looking like the ad confirms they are turning it loose this year.
> 
> There was some very good info posted about it last year, so we'll see if this is it.


I agree. I think the past years modest changes have been due to the fact they have been developing these new ponies. I can't wait!


----------



## Bob Jenkins (Jul 20, 2006)

MegaDan said:


> i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r
> 
> 35" ATA
> 7.25" BH
> ...





NOPE !!!!!!!!!! guess again.............


----------



## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> Yep and I think that was due to information leaking about this bow. When the info was posted everyone though they were releasing it last year. It's looking like the ad confirms they are turning it loose this year.
> 
> There was some very good info posted about it last year, so we'll see if this is it.


Yes it will be interesting to say the least. Either Mathews will completely dominate the market again, or they will go down in flames. My belief is that the people watching this thread will have one of the following reactions:

1) OMG - "This is the greatest bow ever made! It is fast, and it's a Mathews, what more could you want !?!"

2) Disappointment, because the bow is too harsh to draw. "Speed don't matter to me, so I'm going to stick with my ______ bow."

3) Backpeddling - all the people who were trashing Bowtech because they were fast ("I'd rather have a slow hit than a fast miss") will suddenly be praising the speed demons, but will secretly carry the burden of shame because of their prior childish behavior.


----------



## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

MegaDan said:


> i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r
> 
> 35" ATA
> 7.25" BH
> ...


i thought you said that you werent supposed to even whisper that it was at the shop

but you missed the ata on your post here......then again....you are always just short


----------



## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Perfectionist said:


> Yes it will be interesting to say the least. Either Mathews will completely dominate the market again, or they will go down in flames. My belief is that the people watching this thread will have one of the following reactions:
> 
> 1) OMG - "This is the greatest bow ever made! It is fast, and it's a Mathews, what more could you want !?!"
> 
> ...


I hope no on trashed them because they were fast. That would be silly.

If a bow won't stay together because of the design used to get the speed then that's different. If a bow cannot be shot more then a couple dozen times because of the new draw cycle...I could see people complaining. I think there are many reasons one could complain about a faster bow made by any company. Two complain just because they are fast...nope, can't see it.

As with anything I think people have trouble seeing the other side or many not even be secure about decisions they made. That leads to jabbing and poking. 

When I bought a new Martin I shot the fast, the middle, and the slow. I bought slow because that works for me and I smoked the targets with it. Heck, I've been smok'n deer with it too. 

I have no problem with people owning fast bows or even using them to hunt if they can shoot them. Most likely I'll buy a fast bow too very soon. I just wouldn't want that to be my only bow because my shoulder won't handle it. After shooting one 20 to 30 times my shoulder started hurting. I want something I can shoot all day. People that are younger and stronger can shoot fast bows all day long. That's perfect.

I also see way too many people confusing speed with quality and innovation. Speed implies neither. I dare say many, many people shooting bows don't have a clue. Evidence of that can be found by looking at some of the companies still in business. If that's what makes people happy then have at it.

This really shouldn't be about BowTech vs Mathews, Elite, Martin or whoever. It should be about cool toys we get to play with.


----------



## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Bob Jenkins said:


> NOPE !!!!!!!!!! guess again.............


Does that mean if we keep guessing you'll tell us if we're right or not?


----------



## JOE PA (Dec 13, 2003)

*So...*



Bob Jenkins said:


> NOPE !!!!!!!!!! guess again.............


It doesn't shoot as smooth as silk? It isn't whisper quiet? You can beat it?

I would think a 35" ATA and more than 7" brace would be a little surprising.

Again, I hope lots of guys will be getting rid of those "horribly slow":wink: Switchbacks or Drenalins to get this new bow. That will help me out some.


----------



## so1ocam (Aug 24, 2007)

spiaailtli said:


> I hope no on trashed them because they were fast. That would be silly.
> 
> If a bow won't stay together because of the design used to get the speed then that's different. If a bow cannot be shot more then a couple dozen times because of the new draw cycle...I could see people complaining. I think there are many reasons one could complain about a faster bow made by any company. Two complain just because they are fast...nope, can't see it.
> 
> ...


Someone is finally making sense.


----------



## MegaDan (Jan 23, 2007)

OneBowTie said:


> i thought you said that you werent supposed to even whisper that it was at the shop
> 
> but you missed the ata on your post here......then again....you are always just short


As i recall, that wasn't the case at the barn last year....... and ohh yea, the American round this year... It's all comin' back ain't it:tongue:



Man, one little post and u guys are on the edge of ur seats, THAT WAS EASY!!!:nyah:


----------



## Innova (Aug 1, 2005)

You guys let this thread get to the second page...and we are only 4 days away from the "truth". 

Shame on you!

:darkbeer:


----------



## BowHunter63082 (Nov 22, 2005)

MegaDan said:


> i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r
> 
> 35" ATA
> 7.25" BH
> ...


to bad only mission will have the 80# option this year! you wont need it with a 360 or a 340 ibo bow.


----------



## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

MegaDan said:


> As i recall, that wasn't the case at the barn last year....... and ohh yea, the American round this year... It's all comin' back ain't it:tongue:
> 
> 
> 
> Man, one little post and u guys are on the edge of ur seats, THAT WAS EASY!!!:nyah:


Dan the Electrician,,,,,its ok,,,not alot going on in the PSE threads is there?

:nyah:


----------



## Eric131 (Oct 24, 2008)

LOL.....C'mon guys. Every bow out there is a dang chunk of metal with carbon limbs and a string on them. They're freeken bows and arrows. This stuff cracks me up. It's embarrassing. Just shoot them. :darkbeer:


----------



## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

Eric131 said:


> LOL.....C'mon guys. Every bow out there is a dang chunk of metal with carbon limbs and a string on them. They're freeken bows and arrows. This stuff cracks me up. It's embarrassing. Just shoot them. :darkbeer:


Hovie you are on the edge of your seat just like the rest of us!!!!!


----------



## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

I heard the new Mathews bow is going to come with the new cloaking device that one of the University Profs developed earlier this year. That goes way beyond a chunk of metal and carbon limbs.


----------



## MoNofletch (Jul 28, 2003)

Eric131 said:


> LOL.....C'mon guys. Every bow out there is a dang chunk of metal with carbon limbs and a string on them. They're freeken bows and arrows. This stuff cracks me up. It's embarrassing. Just shoot them. :darkbeer:


 I agree with you ............

But some of us are *SICK!* Very sick. Don't kick us while we are down. :wink:


----------



## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

Just a few more days. Maybe.


----------



## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Anyone want to take bets on the carbon fiber riser thing? I'm setting on the fence and can only convince myself that there is about a 70% chance. This is one of the rumors that floated around last year and the background on the 360 does make one wonder if it might be true.

I also heard rumors of two different ATA, one for the 340 and another for the 360. The 340 is supposed to be the same ATA as the DXT.

I would love to see a good CF DXT riser with slim limbs and duals running 360 IBO. I think there is about a 30% chance that will happen. It sure would be sweet though.

I think the smaller ATA CF would have a better chance of being stable because it would be stiffer. Some day, within in the next 10 years, I think all risers will be CF or something even better.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

Interesting theories.
I think the ATA will be longer than the DXT; 33-35 ".
Slim Limbs and a BH of 6.5-7 inches.


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## T.R.U.PRO (Jan 3, 2007)

380


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

T.R.U.PRO said:


> 380


Pass the doobie on the left hand side, pass the doobie on the.....


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## pabuck (Feb 8, 2006)

MegaDan said:


> i just shot the 340fps bow today, i'm not at liberty to discuss anything other than the specs so here they r
> 
> 35" ATA
> 7.25" BH
> ...


What do you guys think the speed for this bow would be in a 29" draw length with 60# limbs? If I could get 300fps with this setup, I would be selling my Drenal LD!!!!


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

You can do that already with the DXT and a IBO arrow.


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## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

T.R.U.PRO said:


> 380


Have you been given secret info??????

Come on Brandon you can share with us less fortunate...


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## pabuck (Feb 8, 2006)

spiaailtli said:


> You can do that already with the DXT and a IBO arrow.


I would never hunt with an IBO arrow and the DXT is too short to use for hunting with a 29" draw. The peep sight is way too far from my eye.


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## PMantle (Feb 15, 2004)

pabuck said:


> I would never hunt with an IBO arrow and the DXT is too short to use for hunting with a 29" draw. The peep sight is way too far from my eye.


The no-peep is a wonderful thing.


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## DirtNapTV (Aug 7, 2005)

*string angle*

I agree the string angle is not what I like, but the bow shoots great, as for carbon fiber riser the bows are light enough now, the two cam deal, if you have drawn the 2 cam mission you would see why I do not think it would be that either.

It will probably be something that none of use have ever thought of, hey just like a one cam bow was back in 1992.

Look forward to seeing what they bring out before a new purchase.


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## huntinduo (Feb 25, 2008)

*Low Down on New Mathews Bow*

This is what I think, two bows this year. First one is a Mathews solo cam it shoots 340, Next one is a Mission split limb dual cam bow that shoots 360. I know a fella that put his hands on the Mission bow this weekend. But he didn't see the Mathews yet because it has not been shipped yet


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## PMantle (Feb 15, 2004)

3DMountaineer said:


> It will probably be something that none of use have ever thought of, hey just like a one cam bow was back in 1992.


Owl's eyes!


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## T.R.U.PRO (Jan 3, 2007)

rodney482 said:


> Have you been given secret info??????
> 
> Come on Brandon you can share with us less fortunate...


We will all seen now won't we. Monday.


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## JMaxH (Mar 20, 2003)

Like I said in another post, if the 360 was by Mission you wouldn't think they'd advertise it under the Mathews name, but rather the Mission name. Otherwise it would be a conflict of advertising and look bad on them for trying to keep Mathews & Mission look like separate companies.


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> Anyone want to take bets on the carbon fiber riser thing? I'm setting on the fence and can only convince myself that there is about a 70% chance. This is one of the rumors that floated around last year and the background on the 360 does make one wonder if it might be true.


I would bet against the carbon fiber theory. HCA made carbon fiber bows in 2002-2004, but had to stop because of the demand for military grade fiber (which is what a bow would require) was eaten up by the military.


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## harleyryder (May 2, 2005)

spiaailtli said:


> I heard the new Mathews bow is going to come with the new cloaking device that one of the University Profs developed earlier this year. That goes way beyond a chunk of metal and carbon limbs.


Yep , thats it, the device hides the Bi-cams on each end and makes it appear as if there is only a solo cam and wheel:wink:


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

Perfectionist said:


> I would bet against the carbon fiber theory. HCA made carbon fiber bows in 2002-2004, but had to stop because of the demand for military grade fiber (which is what a bow would require) was eaten up by the military.


There have been 4 new materials developed since then. That's one of the reasons you can buy spectra fishing line now.


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## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

T.R.U.PRO said:


> We will all seen now won't we. Monday.


You know old buddy you could PM me some info! 

By the way nice Indiana Buck,,great mass.


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

You talking to me and if so, where did you see him 'cause I never entered him in the books?

...also, I have no information. I'm just having fun guessing.


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## RT1 (Nov 20, 2006)

*selling your mathews*

when the new 09's come out, anybody looking at selling there switchback, switchback xt, drenalin,

I would even consider the x-force, pearson tx4, darton pro 3000, Browning illusion.



give me a shout. Just pm here and i will respond

Thank you


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

We could look up all the Mathews pros and see if anyone slipped up. Someone may have a picture of someone hunting with one.


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## KDS (Oct 11, 2005)

The mission cams look similar to pse's, but have the yoke system like darton cps-g2's. Interesting year for archery, and 340 out of a single cam that is shootable would have my attention.


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

spiaailtli said:


> There have been 4 new materials developed since then. That's one of the reasons you can buy spectra fishing line now.


Good info to have. I was not aware of that. You could be onto something. :darkbeer:

But just for good sportsmanship, I'll still bet against you. :tongue: :wink:


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

Man you guys are killing me .............. I want to know the truth right now , but I'm willing to wait .....I guess


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## MegaDan (Jan 23, 2007)

i just hope it's NOT

-6.5" BH or less
-33" ata or less
-Inferoir string by making it 14 strands or less, that will be unstable(other bow manufacturers did this to pick up some extra fps
- extremley harsh draw cycle
- or any other funky stuff that makes the bow unforgiving

If they meet these expectations the bow will be a top seller for years to come


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

MegaDan said:


> i just hope it's NOT
> 
> -6.5" BH or less
> -33" ata or less
> ...



Well said.


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## RT1 (Nov 20, 2006)

RT1 said:


> when the new 09's come out, anybody looking at selling there switchback, switchback xt, drenalin,
> 
> I would even consider the x-force, pearson tx4, darton pro 3000, Browning illusion.
> 
> ...


scratch the x-force from the list unless it's a really good price


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

Name a price. :tongue:


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## mathews_outback (Feb 25, 2008)

*dont forget*

The bow madness is 336 ibo and with mathews making it I'm sure they could squeeze another 4 fps into it


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

mathews_outback said:


> The *bow madness *is 336 ibo and with *mathews making it *I'm sure they could squeeze another 4 fps into it


  You lost me there.

Oh, unless you were comparing Mathews' new bow to the PSE bow. Then I understand.


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## MegaDan (Jan 23, 2007)

mathews_outback said:


> The bow madness is 336 ibo and with mathews making it I'm sure they could squeeze another 4 fps into it


i don't know where u get that info but according to thier site, the 36" bow maddness on it's best day is 324-332fps w/ a 6.5" bh, and the 32" bow is 318-326fps, thats nothing special, besides they sound like a .22cal. when shot


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

mathews_outback said:


> The bow madness is 336 ibo and with mathews making it I'm sure they could squeeze another 4 fps into it


pse makes the bow madness. Mathews makes a 360 fps SOLOCAM ...... amazing!!


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## Bnbfishin (Apr 25, 2004)

You may want to change your signature since you sound like a donkey talkin' smack about PSE and yet you have PSE Pro Staff listed  
Also next time try putting an arrow on the string before you fire it so it doesn't sound like a 22 going off :rofl:


MegaDan said:


> i don't know where u get that info but according to thier site, the 36" bow maddness on it's best day is 324-332fps w/ a 6.5" bh, and the 32" bow is 318-326fps, thats nothing special, besides they sound like a .22cal. when shot


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## Bnbfishin (Apr 25, 2004)

Wow suddenly you know it's a single cam bow?  It just never ends with you guys does it :dontknow: Don't worry only about 29 1/2 more hours until we find out what is coming. I'm waiting to see what they come out with as much as anyone 


hidden danger said:


> pse makes the bow madness. Mathews makes a 360 fps SOLOCAM ...... amazing!!


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## Aggieland (Jun 23, 2007)

All I can say it's going to have to be one hell of a bow to compare to my Elite Envy. This bow is one amazing bow. But, If anyone could come up with something totally new it would be matthews. Guess we will find out soon enough!! Im excited..


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

Bnbfishin said:


> Wow suddenly you know it's a single cam bow?  It just never ends with you guys does it :dontknow: Don't worry only about 29 1/2 more hours until we find out what is coming. I'm waiting to see what they come out with as much as anyone


A little wager then? I say solo and you say not , so if I am right you must write me an apology post and I will do you the same if you are right. :wink:


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## Bnbfishin (Apr 25, 2004)

I didn't say you were wrong and I am not by ANY means implying I know what it is they are coming out with. All I am saying is the next 26 hours aren't passing fast enough so you guys can all start to debate/complain/sing their praises over what they come out with :thumbs_up


hidden danger said:


> A little wager then? I say solo and you say not , so if I am right you must write me an apology post and I will do you the same if you are right. :wink:


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## Hidden Danger (Mar 13, 2008)

Bnbfishin said:


> I didn't say you were wrong and I am not by ANY means implying I know what it is they are coming out with. All I am saying is the next 26 hours aren't passing fast enough so you guys can all start to debate/complain/sing their praises over what they come out with :thumbs_up


Yeah I don't have a clue either , but I believe it will be a solocam regardless. And what do you mean by " you guys "? You know you're just as anxious to see it and to post about it . You are one of " you guys " and don't ever forget it .:wink:


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## slackster (Jan 6, 2008)

If the rumor's I've been hearing in my little archery neck of the woods are true. Things could be pretty interesting next year with Mathews to say the least. Can't wait to find out:tongue:.


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## JWaltrip (Dec 30, 2006)

Very exciting to see some speed bows come from Mathews. Whatever they put out will be a well thought out and tested product, unlike their competition who's bows are known to blow up in the face. Thank God, I won't have to lower my standards anymore to get speed.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

JWaltrip said:


> Very exciting to see some speed bows come from Mathews. Whatever they put out will be a well thought out and tested product, unlike their competition who's bows are known to blow up in the face. Thank God, I won't have to lower my standards anymore to get speed.


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## T.R.U.PRO (Jan 3, 2007)

Less than 17 hours till the big unveiling.

Will we see 380 fps? :wink:


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

JWaltrip said:


> Very exciting to see some speed bows come from Mathews. Whatever they put out will be a well thought out and tested product, unlike their competition who's bows are known to blow up in the face. Thank God, I won't have to lower my standards anymore to get speed.


Yet again why i complain about die-hard mathews shooters...not because of their bows, because of whats on the shoulders of their shooters..


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## rodney482 (Aug 31, 2004)

T.R.U.PRO said:


> Less than 17 hours till the big unveiling.
> 
> Will we see 380 fps? :wink:


we just might with the new lightweight arrows mathews is bringing out.....:zip:


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

trob_205 said:


> Yet again why i complain about die-hard mathews shooters...not because of their bows, because of whats on the shoulders of their shooters..


Not all of us are like that.


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## trob_205 (Aug 18, 2008)

flohunter said:


> Not all of us are like that.


my bad...forgot to add most diehard mathews shooters


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## rutnstrut (Sep 16, 2003)

JWaltrip said:


> Very exciting to see some speed bows come from Mathews. Whatever they put out will be a well thought out and tested product, unlike their competition who's bows are known to blow up in the face. Thank God, I won't have to lower my standards anymore to get speed.


By making a post like this you may not lower your standards,but definately your IQ. By the way I am not a Mathews basher so don't go there,I am looking forward to the release of the new bows also.


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## bow duke ny (Oct 15, 2006)

Im sick of seeing this thread. I wish we could see what there coming out with so I can decide on my new bow. :darkbeer:


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## T.R.U.PRO (Jan 3, 2007)

Great things are worth waiting for. 1AM EST.


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## t8ter (Apr 7, 2003)

The metal plate in my neck is screaming please be a fast bow.I want to shoot my 7595 @ 60lb's or less with decent speed.


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## Shooters Edge (Feb 6, 2005)

Please don't let it be another low let off experiment, Please! ukey:


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## PA SILVERBACK (Jan 22, 2007)

After reading through this Topic... I would Just Like to Remind Some Of You....

Before Pulling Up Your Panties,,, The Sticky Side Goes Down ...
:darkbeer:


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## JovenPadaguan (Dec 6, 2004)

Countdown... I love it :tongue:


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## spiaailtli (Sep 5, 2007)

The meter on their website shows 330, 340, and 360. Some people believe this means three new bows. 

I don't have a clue what it means.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

It means if they don't release 3 new bows, the regular bashers will have 1 more thing to complain about...other than...

The harsh draw cycle, 
The Dual Cams, 
The unrealized speed, 
The Grip, 
The Draw Specific Cam, 
The Un-Level Nock Travel, 
The poor Strings, 
The outdated, stolen, copied technology, 
The Name, 
The Harmonic Dampers, 
The late night, big hype release, 
The magazine ad.


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## mihuntn (Jan 2, 2007)

trob_205 said:


> Yet again why i complain about die-hard mathews shooters...not because of their bows, because of whats on the shoulders of their shooters..


Whats that......brains???? (j/k):darkbeer:


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## tileman (Jan 26, 2008)

spiaailtli said:


> The meter on their website shows 330, 340, and 360. Some people believe this means three new bows.
> 
> I don't have a clue what it means.


It means 3 different cam options ?????? just guessing of course:darkbeer:


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

JovenPadaguan said:


> Countdown... I love it :tongue:


They are the kings of advertisement. not knocking the bows but they sure know how to get the anticipation up.
I hope they are great bows


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## powerful1992 (Oct 13, 2008)

can't wait 7 more hours ,even though i am that i am not buying one, and i am just curious


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## parkerbows (Oct 27, 2004)

Will people be happy if the go binary, dual cam or just saythey are stealing other designs?
Or what if it was a 5" brace height single cam super fast bow
Just curious
Me I think it would be cool to see a switch.
Not a complete switch just offer different cam options


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## ws6guy (Oct 10, 2008)

I cannot wait until tomorrow. I've narrowed my new bow to either Hoyt, Mathews, or Elite. Probably won't be an Elite since there is not a dealer close by.


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## beenfarr (Feb 13, 2006)

parkerbows said:


> Will people be happy if the go binary, dual cam or just saythey are stealing other designs?
> Or what if it was a 5" brace height single cam super fast bow
> Just curious
> Me I think it would be cool to see a switch.
> Not a complete switch just offer different cam options


If it's binary I will seriously think about buying one. :wink:

Ben


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## pabuck (Feb 8, 2006)

ws6guy said:


> I cannot wait until tomorrow. I've narrowed my new bow to either Hoyt, Mathews, or Elite. Probably won't be an Elite since there is not a dealer close by.


I think I will be buying either a new Mathews or switching to a Hoyt now that they brought their bow weight down to an acceptable weight for hunting. The new Alpha Max weighs only 3.9lbs, but I am concerned about shooting a 32" bow. I am hoping the new mathews will be in the 35" range.

Anyone looking for a Drenalin LD PM me!!!!

Eric


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

badbow148 said:


> You need to check before bragging on Mathews. Pearson has 11pgs. in Manuf./Hoyt 8/ Darton 6/PSE 4 and then Pearson has 7pgs. on here.


You were saying..........................:wink:


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## mihuntn (Jan 2, 2007)

Yep, here it comes....thats why bowtech had their roller guards before mathews right..refuse to follow...pssssh, go start a blowie hates mathews thread.


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## mihuntn (Jan 2, 2007)

Oh yeah....5 hrs 52 mins!!!!!


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

Yeah the entire REFUSE TO FOLLOW slogan means squat!
Roller guard.......
What a bunch of stupid remarks.


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## mihuntn (Jan 2, 2007)

Hey...his post diappeared?!?!? that's whats happens when you dis mathews:wink:


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

I don't mind someone voicing a legit complaint, but this place is full of people who have NO CLUE, I mean, they really don't have a clue. All they have is a bunch of ill-founded remarks that make no sense and speculation they can't back up with any proof.


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## wis_archer (Jul 27, 2007)

flohunter said:


> Yeah the entire REFUSE TO FOLLOW slogan means squat!
> Roller guard.......
> What a bunch of stupid remarks.


Remember who invented the roller guard?


Martin


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## mihuntn (Jan 2, 2007)

wis_archer said:


> Remember who invented the roller guard?
> 
> 
> Martin


Yeah, what looked like a roller guard...but this is a bowtech/mathews fight:wink: and mathews re-used it first


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## wis_archer (Jul 27, 2007)

Just like parallel limbs


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## gafferq2xl (Aug 1, 2003)

flohunter said:


> I don't mind someone voicing a legit complaint, but this place is full of people who have NO CLUE, I mean, they really don't have a clue. All they have is a bunch of ill-founded remarks that make no sense and speculation they can't back up with any proof.


I hear that....and I call them "ACWABS" Another keyboard without a brain.


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

wis_archer said:


> Remember who invented the roller guard?
> 
> 
> Martin


Really? I though Darton first used the roller guard. Didn't Darton also create the first single-cam (aka solocam) bow?


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## boonecoon (Oct 27, 2008)

B&C Bones said:


> There kind of like america "its time for a change"


I think i just threw up in my mouth alittle...


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## Hunter2678 (Jan 16, 2008)

Well I know a few things that mathews shooters cannot stand on their soap box about anymore.......speed, brace height and accuracy. Apparently if you have that available to you, you cannot shoot quietly and accurately.


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## Jeff K in IL (Nov 4, 2005)

wis_archer said:


> Remember who invented the roller guard?
> 
> 
> Martin


Its not who invents it anymore, but who makes it better. Its call Innovation. Ideas will be re-used and made better.:thumbs_up


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## Hunter2678 (Jan 16, 2008)

Perfectionist said:


> Really? I though Darton first used the roller guard. Didn't Darton also create the first single-cam (aka solocam) bow?


I believe you're right Perf ..Darton is the original gangsta.


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## boonecoon (Oct 27, 2008)

spiaailtli said:


> So it looks like the Mission was a tease.
> This could even be the end of a few lesser bow manufactures. Bowtech may have been purchased in just enough time to save them. Will see if Savages pockets are deep enough after recovering from the recall.
> 
> Between Mathews, Elite, and Martin there would be no reason to buy anything else. I'm guessing Hoyt has a big enough following to survive, but probably not some of the other companies.


Personally.. I think you ve lost your mind. I think hoyt, pse, and bowtech can rely enough on their quality and service enough to not have to worry about advertisements of ibo speeds that makes everyones eyes pop out.


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## Hunter2678 (Jan 16, 2008)

boonecoon said:


> Personally.. I think you ve lost your mind. I think hoyt, pse, and bowtech can rely enough on their quality and service enough to not have to worry about advertisements of ibo speeds that makes everyones eyes pop out.


You aint the only one who ever said that about him..:wink:


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## Bnbfishin (Apr 25, 2004)

I'll take that public apology anytime now.  Their new bow isn't a solcam and it looks like the PSE X-Force to boot!! :rofl: HAHAHAHAhaahaahahhahaa :tongue: Sorry buddy but I had to bust on you a little bit after seeing the new Mathews bow this morning epsi:


hidden danger said:


> A little wager then? I say solo and you say not , so if I am right you must write me an apology post and I will do you the same if you are right. :wink:


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## Hunter2678 (Jan 16, 2008)

Bnbfishin said:


> I'll take that public apology anytime now.  Their new bow isn't a solcam and it looks like the PSE X-Force to boot!! :rofl: HAHAHAHAhaahaahahhahaa :tongue: Sorry buddy but I had to bust on you a little bit after seeing the new Mathews bow this morning epsi:


LOL...haahh I remember seein his post last night...poor fella.


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## asa_low12 (Mar 15, 2008)

**

I hope their new bows shoot better and faster than their new website works I set my alarm for midnight last night, it's 844 in the am and I still haven't got their page to load


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

Bnbfishin said:


> I'll take that public apology anytime now.  Their new bow isn't a solcam and it looks like the PSE X-Force to boot!! :rofl: HAHAHAHAhaahaahahhahaa :tongue: Sorry buddy but I had to bust on you a little bit after seeing the new Mathews bow this morning epsi:


:chortle: Too bad they don't have a smiley for "humble pie ". :icon_1_lol::rofl:


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## heilman181 (Mar 24, 2006)

asa_low12 said:


> I hope their new bows shoot better and faster than their new website works I set my alarm for midnight last night, it's 844 in the am and I still haven't got their page to load


Mathews marketing department sure knows what they are doing if people are setting their alarm to midnight! :wink:


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## KSU Turkey Nut (Aug 11, 2007)

The new Mathews bows are a solid group of bows.
The 2 Reezen single cam bows are real nice. I shot the Reezen 6.5 today and it was great.

The Monster bows which I have not shot, I expect will stand up against any of the speed bows.

If you don't like them, don't buy them.


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## Woody69 (Feb 17, 2007)

flohunter said:


> What is wrong with you people? Mathews has YET to say they are releasing a DUAL CAM bow and some of you have already started with the stupid comments. If they do release a dual cam...then bash away if that makes you feel better about your current set up.
> 
> But for now, please spare the rest of us your expert opinions until they actually release these bows. Right now, all you are doing is speculating. None of you know what is coming, no matter how hard you try to make everybody think that you do.
> 
> Give it a rest already.





flohunter said:


> Like I said....EXPERT OPINIONS.
> You know about as much as the rest of us.....SQUAT.





flohunter said:


> Get a clue. You are only speculating. Have you shot this bow yet?
> How can you guys make all of these assumptions and claims.....then pass them off as the gospel by merely reading a magazine ad?
> Unreal. :thumbs_do





flohunter said:


> You lost me there.
> 
> Oh, unless you were comparing Mathews' new bow to the PSE bow. Then I understand.





flohunter said:


> I don't mind someone voicing a legit complaint, but this place is full of people who have NO CLUE, I mean, they really don't have a clue. All they have is a bunch of ill-founded remarks that make no sense and speculation they can't back up with any proof.


YOU WERE SAYING !!!!   

Woody


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## Woody69 (Feb 17, 2007)

hidden danger said:


> A little wager then? I say solo and you say not , so if I am right you must write me an apology post and I will do you the same if you are right. :wink:


So how's that apology coming along ???   

Woody


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## Perfectionist (Mar 2, 2004)

Sounds like some folks need to make some public apologies. :tongue:


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## Bnbfishin (Apr 25, 2004)

I don't need to read an appology on here to know who shot their mouth off more than they should have  It was fun to read though 
Hey it's AWESOME that Mathews isn't shipping any Monster bows until February :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :thumbs_do I guess we'll have to deal with more threads like this speculating as to how good that one is going to shoot


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## EPLC (May 21, 2002)

Now this is true innovation:

Ovation riser
Conquest 3 limbs
Apex cam & Idler


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## Shaman (Jun 19, 2005)

My post was not inflammatory and got deleted?
shameless Mathews protectionism.


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## flohunter (Jan 31, 2005)

Woody69 said:


> YOU WERE SAYING !!!!
> 
> Woody



Yeah, I posted an apology to the guys on here the day after the release. I will say it again...I was wrong, you guys were right about the DUAL CAM.

As far as how these bows are going to shoot or feel......most of you still dont have a clue, including myself.
Shoot one then post what you think it was like, but give the Assumptions on their performance a rest.


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## acesup (Jul 4, 2008)

Shaman said:


> My post was not inflammatory and got deleted?
> shameless Mathews protectionism.


this website is affiliated with Martin


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## Shaman (Jun 19, 2005)

acesup said:


> this website is affiliated with Martin


and that counters what I said how?


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## Princess Sonja Martin (Feb 8, 2006)

Shaman said:


> My post was not inflammatory and got deleted?
> shameless Mathews protectionism.


Due to the over whelming Mathews threads some were move to thin things out, we are working on getting them all put back!!


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## Shaman (Jun 19, 2005)

Sonja said:


> Due to the over whelming Mathews threads some were move to thin things out, we are working on getting them all put back!!


If you find it honestly insulting, I of course accept your decision as the board owners. It just looked a bit 'selective' as it were. 

Thanks for the update!


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