# Unsportsmanship in the highest manner yesturday.



## asa3dpro (Dec 31, 2002)

Dan, I had the opportunity to do that this weekend at a qualifier in TX. Although, you may not shoot your best without competition the return is more when you get to help someone with things like how to shoot in the wind with your level and why we shoot large dia carbon arrows. For me I would rather help a new guy out so its more enjoyable for them that my own personal gain. But, thats what our world is coming to. I hate to say that but true.


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## Pinkarcherymom (Feb 28, 2011)

Was this at an asa shoot? I 100% agree with you my family is new to archery this year and there was more than one problem I seen at the shoot we went to this weekend with unsportsmanlike conduct but this was on Saturday and when it was question nothing was done about, now for myself I could careless but I have kids who love this sport and do not want them to see this as ok behavior and yes this couple should know that this is a very rare thing that these shooters probably took advantage of the shoot most everyone I have met in archery have been very good people!
Also when we went to this shoot I had taken to of my children to shoot both very new to the sport, they were grouped with a sr.pro who was such a pleasure to shoot with my children had a great time and learned so much from him and we would like to send a big thank you to him because he is what the children look up to and kids learn by example and he was a great example for these children!!!!!!!!


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## ftchmup (Jun 15, 2011)

I am new here, but don't understand why he would not shoot with them?


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## sagecreek (Jul 15, 2003)

Too bad some people are like that DB.


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## Highball (Jul 17, 2007)

That's very unfortunate. I shoot in a "shoot when you can" league and I've never been able to shoot with anyone else because of my work schedule. Of course it's nice to shoot with better people as it helps you improve, but if you're truly good, you're going to be good no matter who you shoot with.

Most times I'd just be happy to shoot with ANYONE, regardless of skill level. Heck, I wouldn't know how to act if there was another arrow in the target! Sure, I'm in it to win, that's just my personality when it comes to any type of competition, but I also enjoy meeting new people and the camaraderie that goes along with spending time together on the course.

Sometimes people need to remember, no matter how good you think you are, sometimes you're going to be the one in the group that someone else wishes was better.


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

Buddys shoot the state field this weekend and had a pee wee in there group. I always enjoy shooting with other folks. Heck shoot with my buddys all the time.
DB


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

asa3dpro said:


> Dan, I had the opportunity to do that this weekend at a qualifier in TX. Although, you may not shoot your best without competition the return is more when you get to help someone with things like how to shoot in the wind with your level and why we shoot large dia carbon arrows. For me I would rather help a new guy out so its more enjoyable for them that my own personal gain. But, thats what our world is coming to. I hate to say that but true.



Rebert someone helped us and shot with us as beginners. I think it the right thing to do.
DB


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## CarbonExtreme (Jul 7, 2010)

ftchmup said:


> I am new here, but don't understand why he would not shoot with them?


One reason is that new comers probably won't shoot that good and as a competitor many tend to do well when they are in a competitive group. A "shoot to your competitions level" type of thing. I for one would never act that way, but shooting with newbies can effect one's score. It happened to me a few times, but hey, if we get some new shooters it was worth it.


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## ftchmup (Jun 15, 2011)

yea I guess that is true in many sports. Thanks


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## tylo_g5 (Mar 23, 2011)

Well I don't know know what happend with with the other guy, but my buddy wound up shooting with the couple and had a great time. They were very friendly people and the guy wound up shooting one of the highest scores of the day. Heck i'll shoot with anybody, this sport is filled with some good folks so don't miss an opportunity to to make friends that could last a lifetime.


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## oldschoolcj5 (Jun 8, 2009)

ftchmup said:


> I am new here, but don't understand why he would not shoot with them?


He may not have wanted to answer questions about yardage estimation or help hunt for arrows that missed their mark or thought they might not move along at his pace ... basically anything that would have inconvenienced him. 

its a shame so many folks only concern is themselves ... 

BTW - Welcome to AT I hope you find good friends and good information here


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

tylo_g5 said:


> Well I don't know know what happend with with the other guy, but my buddy wound up shooting with the couple and had a great time. They were very friendly people and the guy wound up shooting one of the highest scores of the day. Heck i'll shoot with anybody, this sport is filled with some good folks so don't miss an opportunity to to make friends that could last a lifetime.


Made some new friends as well. Thats awesome. I might have understood if he had to shoot with me! LOL Im old and slow!
DB


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## jmvaughn06 (Jan 10, 2009)

I said this in another post a while back, but when I was getting started I went to a small local shoot and Jerry Debree a senior pro was there and I didn't really know who he was or how good he was and I was by myself so Jerry offered to shoot with me. Jerry was a true pro he gave me many helpful hints and just talked to me about archery it was a very enjoyable shoot. And for a senior pro that man can lay it on a target!


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

jmvaughn06 said:


> I said this in another post a while back, but when I was getting started I went to a small local shoot and Jerry Debree a senior pro was there and I didn't really know who he was or how good he was and I was by myself so Jerry offered to shoot with me. Jerry was a true pro he gave me many helpful hints and just talked to me about archery it was a very enjoyable shoot. And for a senior pro that man can lay it on a target!


Jerry diffiantly a friendly guy who a heck of shooter. Always fun to shoot with Jerry, he always smiling. 
DB


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## shootertg (Sep 6, 2008)

I got to shoot with a guy I've never shot with this weekend and it's always fun to meet new people. I would love to shoot with someone new. It is fun to try and teach people that really like the sport. Every year when deer season is on it's way I shoot with people new to 3d and we all have a blast.


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## Okie101 (Nov 1, 2009)

That's really to bad Dan. I love getting to shoot with new people who are new to the sport, especially kids. Something about letting them win as well makes it even better. If that encouragement gives them the chance to be a pro shooter some day, is by far more satisfying to me than some trophy or who I get paired up with.

Life is just to short to be a complainer...Kinda sounds like the way he acted, no one will want to shoot with him now...


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

Okie101 said:


> That's really to bad Dan. I love getting to shoot with new people who are new to the sport, especially kids. Something about letting them win as well makes it even better. If that encouragement gives them the chance to be a pro shooter some day, is by far more satisfying to me than some trophy or who I get paired up with.
> 
> Life is just to short to be a complainer...Kinda sounds like the way he acted, no one will want to shoot with him now...



Archery a small comunity here in Oklahoma. Sometimes you make your bed you got to lie down in it.
DB


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## J-Dubyah (Mar 6, 2010)

That's unfortunate. At some point we were at a stage where all needed some guidance. I shot this weekend with a guy who had a bow for only two days at that point. I spent some time with him around his grip and helped him sight in. While it took us longer to shoot the course to look for some "misses" I gained a friend out of the experience. I enjoyed it immensely...


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## Okie101 (Nov 1, 2009)

Daniel Boone said:


> Archery a small comunity here in Oklahoma. Sometimes you make your bed you got to lie down in it.
> DB


Might be small, but we still have a bunch of great shooters with big hearts.


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## athomPT (Dec 14, 2008)

He may have been a cheat boy and was ticked off he couldn't get to shoot with some of his cheat boy buddies. I looooove shooting with new archers I was a noob once too.....still am seems sometimes


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## jasonposs (Jul 19, 2010)

Daniel Boone said:


> We had a shoot and one guy didnt like who he got grouped with.
> 
> He got grouped with two new archers a man and wife and both good folks joining archery this year. He refused to shoot with them and left. Range owner told him to leave and not return because this wont be tolerated and everyone at the shoot agreed. He had an oppertunity to be ambassador to the sport.
> 
> ...


what a D-bag


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## asa1485 (Jan 16, 2008)

Daniel Boone said:


> We had a shoot and one guy didnt like who he got grouped with.
> 
> He got grouped with two new archers a man and wife and both good folks joining archery this year. He refused to shoot with them and left. Range owner told him to leave and not return because this wont be tolerated and everyone at the shoot agreed. He had an oppertunity to be ambassador to the sport.
> 
> ...



That sucks. I bet that really made them feel welcome. Glad they told him to leave and not come back. I'll shoot with anyone , anytime. It's part of what makes it fun. Getting to meet new people.


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## Tonto79 (Feb 13, 2011)

I personally love shooting with older shooters, I get to hear those great "when i was your age I used to shoot an eighty pound recurve and hold it all day" or " I know that my shot's not a 10, but that's a dead deer, wouldn't have to chase that one more than 100 yards" LOL Little kids are a lot of fun to shoot with too, this past weekend, this dad who had no clue about archery but his seven year daughter loved it went to the shoot we were at, and she went with me and my dad, she had a blast, we helped her with her form, lining up her shots, and she ended up taking first place in the cub shoot. I gave her a high five and told her that she's done something I haven't yet, gotten a trophy.....hahahahahahahaha


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## southgaboy (Jan 28, 2007)

CarbonExtreme said:


> One reason is that new comers probably won't shoot that good and as a competitor many tend to do well when they are in a competitive group. A "shoot to your competitions level" type of thing. I for one would never act that way, but shooting with newbies can effect one's score. It happened to me a few times, but hey, if we get some new shooters it was worth it.


x2!!


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## bonecollector66 (Mar 2, 2011)

if it wasnt for the people who let me shoot with them when i first started, i dont think my shooting would have been as good as it is today. i pushed myself to shoot as well as the others in the group and it payed off. i was able to shoot a perfect score in the winter league(one of the guys still hasnt been able to do it,because he spends alot of time with new archers). so imo the guy that didnt want to shoot with the newbis was very unsportsmanly!!!!!


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## VeroShooter (Jul 14, 2005)

Let me tell you how important first impressions are. I went to a local club for my first 3d shoot and had to shoot with someone who was such a jerk that I never went back to the club and didn't shoot much after that. I literally thought the whole club was a bunch of jerks and had no need to be a part of that. Ten years later I went back to that club and tried again. Since that time I have held officer postions for the past 6 years and my whole family attends every ASA pro/am every year. My wife has since become a womens pro and I shoot in semi pro. My 10 year old son is an eagle class competitor who makes regular trips to the podium. I wish I had those 10 years back that I did not participate in archery because of that ONE guy!


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## oct71 (Sep 26, 2008)

I would have loved to shoot with that couple. you can always learn something new about archery from anyone. I hope it doesn't give them a bad taste about archery. there is always a few dinks in every sport.


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## BAArcher (Feb 5, 2004)

I'll bet he has showed his butt prior to this.... Let him walk, quality of shooters at the club just improved.


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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

thats really bad, I enjoy helping another ppl and I learn even from the starters in archery! My wife shoots and she wasn't very good at the start and of course when I tried to help she get mad, so she really learned from other ppl willing to help her out. I've been shooting bow for 23 years now and I really like when I shoot with someone that is willing to show me things that I may know or may not know. You never know what you can learn or who you can learn it from!! I had a 14teen year old show me something about form and I tried it and it helped and I still use his wisdom today!


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## LLaBarr (May 21, 2011)

that is just wrong, I know I shoot better against good competitors but I thank to be the best you should be able to drop high numbers with anyone you shoot against. by the way who won all that BIG money.


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## 45er (Jan 18, 2009)

We all know there are going to be a few folks like that in every sport whether it be golf, sporting clays, 3D archery or any other similar sport where an individual may be teamed with people at a different level than he/she may be. I'll wager you won't find too many of them in Oklahoma, which, like Texas, has a reputation for having friendly, hospitable people. Three cheers for the range owner who told the jerk to go pound sand!


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## Shabbona (Nov 10, 2010)

I was a young kid maybe 11 or 12 and had a guy shoot with me who had a chromed out compound and took to the time to explain 
gap shooting to me since I didn't even have a sight. He encouraged me and it was great. This was over 25 years ago and I never forgotit. Sure wish I knew who he was.


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## shine (May 8, 2010)

We have seen one or two like that in our shoots. Sometimes it’s a lot bigger problem then sportsmanship. People who cannot control themselves and behave on a shooting range need to go - plain and simple. Club owner did the right thing.

My first shoot, one of the top guys in the state/country in my group -- totally cool and encouraged us to get more involved - invited us to come shoot at his club. You can never lift yourself up by pushing others down.


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## bfisher (Nov 30, 2002)

For some it's all about score or "ME". Often these are some that will end up down the road on their own with few friends and a reputation they can't be proud of. For these types all I can say is, "What goes around comes around".

Now let's back up a few decades. Early in my career I made a friendship with a local Pro who mentored me for about 3 years. I learned a lot and became one of the top shooters in my area. Now, some 35 years later I'm not the shooter I once was. Old eyes, old muscles, lack of desire to compete. I guess it happens. Over all those years I have always taken the time to help others and still do today. Just because I can't shoot as well doesn't mean I have forgotten how so life takes on a new meaning. Passing on some of what I've learned has given me much pleasure and made me many friends. Giving something back has it's own rewards and respect, self respect, and friends will always be more important when all trophies on the shelf have lost their luster.


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## NeilM (May 22, 2006)

I went to a two day Open 3D Championship shoot last year (IFAA rules). On the first day I shot with a mum and her son as well as a recurve archer. We had a great time and I had to dredge my memory of old corny jokes to keep a 12 year old laughing for the day. I put the best score in my class for the day. On the second day, I was with a group of top scorers and put the best score in my class for the day winning the shoot in my class.

The company makes the day different and enjoyable, it only gets serious when I step up to the peg.


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## Josh_Putman (Jun 18, 2004)

What a loser. That guy just showed his true colors.

I guess I am fortunate to have never had that type of experience when I was new to the sport. We are all newbies at the beginning. Nobody starts out as an instant expert (even though some people *do* have a very high opinion of themselves when just starting out). 

I say good riddance to the jerk, and hopefully without him around, some more new folks will feel welcome and will enjoy archery for the rest of their lives.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Read through this and never caught what the 3D was, a local run or had some sanction. And perhaps some details were left out? Grouped, it had to one of two things, some club having club shoot with a shotgun start, which I'm opposed to or a sanctioned event with a shotgun start, which I am not opposed to. If a local shoot the new comers should have been placed by the club with a knowledgeable shooter. Here volunteers should come out all over the place, so no problem... If a sanctioned shoot, where points or awards are given, the offended shooter should have at least someone of his caliber in the group. And it is the responsibility of the club to make it happen....

I was witness to one disheartening grouping. A sanctioned event, a descent shooter and squad-ed with nothing but kids.... He stood the test, he shot with them, but don't think for a minute there wasn't and still are hard feelings, not when there was time to break up the kids with other groups. Again, a bad situation caused by a shotgun start. I was not aware of this until we crossed trails at the mid section. Another sanctioned event, a person grouped by one having hostile feelings for that person. Yep, after the event hard feelings came to the surface big time... The club lost and the sanctioning body lost.

Said was the squad-ed person refusing to shoot and left on his own accord. If he left by giving notice he was dissatisfied and not causing some disruption, what's the problem? Better for him to leave than carry a chip on his shoulder throughout the event. Of course, by the report the club owner took disciplinary action, the person no longer allowed there. First offense (if it was a offense) and gets the full hammer, no warning? Just plain seems some details are left out....

"He had an opportunity to be ambassador to the sport" as in he flubbed it. So? Having served as President of a shooting club, Vice-President of a archery club, Sec/Trea of a archery club, Board member of archery organization and Area Rep of another I know not everyone is cut out to be the "good ambassador."

I wonder... Could the club owner have taken the disliked situation and turned it into good situation and been the good ambassador? Again, details seem left out.

Just rambling. Seems someone is always exploiting bad situations here....


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## AcesUpArchery (May 24, 2011)

Wow, what to say after all that has been posted.. I guess to start, if you've been in this game any amount of time at all, then I'm sure you've been put in similar situations, on both sides of the coin. I understand the frustration it can cause to disrupt the flow you develop, and interfere with the mental game, but I'm sure as a young archer, I was in somebodys head at some point.. In fact I'm sure of it because I was treated poorly.. I think it goes without saying that we all are involved in a gentlemans sport that is truly about honor and respect.. Any new archer reading this post should rest assured that the absolute majority of those involved in competetive shooting of any sort are awesome people, and compete because they have a true passion for the sport.. Yes, there tends to be a few bad nuts in every bushell, but they get spit out pretty quickly, or at least are found and discarded.. I've shot ASA, FITA, and IBO over the past few years, and even at the top to premier classes have seen some unsportsmanlike conduct.. In the corporate world we now live in, the competetion reaches a dog eat dog mentality.. but nonetheless, we all still involve ourselves because we love it.. This is a family sport, as my father and I started shooting 20+ years ago in 3-d, just to prepare for deer season, and we both were hooked. We both started out in traditional, moved to bare compound, and my father stayed with that and I moved on to fixed pins and eventually into open classes.. I have shot with so many youth archers, and even my father sent me chasing arrows on a pretty regular basis as he used no sights.. and he was one of those old timers that was happy to walk off the course with all 5's .. 10's and 8's were a bonus to him.. lol and honestly I prided and still pride myself on being the one who can find the missed arrows quickly, because i pay attention to the archers around me and been doing it a long time.. I have my children shooting with me on a pretty regular basis, and honestly I approach it like Tiger Woods daddy.. The more that is going on sometimes just makes you a better archer... The best advice anyone has given and i'll give too .. is keep it positive, shoot with everybody, grow the sport.. Very rarely will you ever see me or my crew on a range without an ear to ear smile.. That's My 2 cents.. ! :wink:


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## J Whittington (Nov 13, 2009)

Not the only case of poor sportsmanship this year. I know of a case that's just as bad, if not worse. Wish I could spill the beans, but politics are involved.

The offender mentioned is going to get hammered, and the "paid pro" that I can't talk about (gag order!!) is going to get away with it Scot free.


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## XForce Girl (Feb 14, 2008)

Personally I don't care who I am grouped with. It doesn't effect my performance in the least. (I can win or lose just as good as the next person, my group I'm with doesn't effect how I shoot)
Actually I prefer to shoot with different people as much as possible, make new friends and even learn something.

Someone else mentioned that there is not enough info: Perhaps the person had previous history with the shooters and just didn't want to shoot with them. 

If the guy went away quietly then fine. If he threw a temper tantrum then that is really wrong.

I have seen some unsportsman like behavior at shoots and all it does is make the "offender" look like a fool. 
I've seen "pros"(not real pros, the wannabees) throw their bows, shop shooters start fights, stomp their feet in anger, you name it.


It's an ugly situation but funny at the same time.


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## CutTheLoop (Dec 26, 2007)

I like shooting with the newcomers ... it's the rare chance I get at being the best shooter in the group. :wink:


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## Kstigall (Feb 24, 2004)

J Whittington said:


> Not the only case of poor sportsmanship this year. I know of a case that's just as bad, if not worse. Wish I could spill the beans, but politics are involved.
> 
> The offender mentioned is going to get hammered, and the "paid pro" that I can't talk about (gag order!!) is going to get away with it Scot free.



:shocked: Oh no you don't, Jerry! Gag order my arse, spill it! :moviecorn


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## geezer047 (Mar 11, 2007)

Well as usual I got a story:wink: Over 20 yrs ago an 8 yr old boy and his mom came to our club for a tourn. The boys Dad could't make it and his Mom had a bad leg and could't walk the course with him. 2 guys took the boy with them and helped him. He had a BALL. Came home all smiles and telling what a great time he had. Said, the 2 guys helped him pull his arrows, find the lost ones when he missed. It was DAD I WANT TO DO IT AGAIN.
I know this because the boy was my son. Till this day I don't know who those 2 guys were or where they were from. Even if they were from the same club. But I know that I owe them a big THANK YOU. They showed him a good time and a good experiance. 20 yrs later he's still at it and has become a great archer. I believe that first time helped set the way for him.
Today, since my shooting has declined so, thats what I enjoy most. Helping first time shooters have an enjoyable experiance.
Charlie


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## rigginuts (Dec 27, 2008)

I like shooting with good shooters it makes me try harder, but I also like shooting with the kids and less experence shooter. What I don't like is shooting with a father and son team that likes to argue and were it almost ends up in a fist fight. I wish they would stay home, it ruines it for everyone at the shoot.


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## TOMMYY01 (Oct 21, 2003)

That guy is a real dirtball. The past 2 years, I've gotten 8 trophies, 3 last year, and the rest this year. They are only flight trophies, but they are still trophies. I'm by no means a great shooter, but I still like it. Heck, I'm going in the next 2 weeks to a shoot where I'll pick up a trophy I won in March. I'm going to shoot also, but my main reason is to pick it up. It's nothing fantastic, but it gives me a feel good. Also, this year, I started shooting with 3 other people that just started 3-D this year. All 3 have a knack for archery, and they will pass my skill level by the end of the year. I've even helped them with maybe giving them a few things like stabs and sights that might help them. All this is to further the great sport.


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## 3-D Quest (Jan 26, 2007)

SonnyThomas said:


> First offense (if it was a offense) and gets the full hammer, no warning? Just plain seems some details are left out....
> 
> "He had an opportunity to be ambassador to the sport" as in he flubbed it. So? Having served as President of a shooting club, Vice-President of a archery club, Sec/Trea of a archery club, Board member of archery organization and Area Rep of another I know not everyone is cut out to be the "good ambassador."
> 
> ...


Long story short...I agree with you on this one, Sonny!
No disrespect intended, but there is 3 sides to the story...theirs, his and somewhere in between, the truth.


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## shine (May 8, 2010)

Two issues here: (1) Bad Sportsmanship/personal conduct, (2) club official/management problems -- Its fine to address the second, but not by violating the first. And, I recently saw a "sanctioned" event with know and unknown shooters placed in the same group. So, fairness to everyone sometimes calls for challenging an administrative decision - but, keep it with management and not offend the other participants. 

Club shoots, I would rather shoot with a mixed group -- had some traditional guys with us a few weeks back and it was really fun. Plus, one of them turned out to be a new member of our hunt club. Even got me shooting my old recurve just for fun.


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