# New Hoyt Bows



## kshet26 (Dec 20, 2010)

Over on Hoyt's Twitter they're detailing their new target lineup.

Looks like the 1st one is the new Formula Faktor. Formula bow that has a wider front-to-back width, new veritune plate, new tiller bolt, and weights that can attach to the top an bottom cutouts near the pockets (looks like the putty in Brady's riser may have been hiding a prototype weight system?). Not sure what to make of it, but the wider profile makes some sense in relation to riser stability.


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## toxoph (Mar 24, 2005)

Nice! I wonder if they'll do a GMX version?


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## Z3R0 (Nov 6, 2014)

toxoph said:


> Nice! I wonder if they'll do a GMX version?


Yup hoping for a new Hoyt ILF riser too, but we'll see.

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## wefsce (Feb 25, 2015)

You got your wish. The Grand Prix Epik


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## Z3R0 (Nov 6, 2014)

Looks nice, looking forward to trying one out some time. 

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## Arsi (May 14, 2011)

I want them all!


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Looks like some new limbs too.


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## teebat (Oct 28, 2013)

kshet26 said:


> Over on Hoyt's Twitter they're detailing their new target lineup.
> 
> Looks like the 1st one is the new Formula Faktor. Formula bow that has a wider front-to-back width, new veritune plate, new tiller bolt, and weights that can attach to the top an bottom cutouts near the pockets (looks like the putty in Brady's riser may have been hiding a prototype weight system?). Not sure what to make of it, but the wider profile makes some sense in relation to riser stability.


I hope it fixes the issues with the prodigy.


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## Z3R0 (Nov 6, 2014)

Sjef posted a video on YouTube about the Faktor but he also showed and briefly talked about the new limbs. Carbon X-Tour iirc. 

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## Z3R0 (Nov 6, 2014)

teebat said:


> I hope it fixes the issues with the prodigy.


What issues are those? 

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## Archery30 (Jan 15, 2016)

I hope they fix the issue of the quattro limbs delaminating....


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## teebat (Oct 28, 2013)

Z3R0 said:


> What issues are those?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


Limb pocket, alignment system.


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## Arsi (May 14, 2011)

Bamboo core limbs!


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## Bob Furman (May 16, 2012)

https://youtu.be/geJifg4yjGo

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## MickeyBisco (Jul 14, 2012)

New Collet Tiller bolt system! Because, hey... it was great on Samick risers 10 years ago!


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## teebat (Oct 28, 2013)

Archery30 said:


> I hope they fix the issue of the quattro limbs delaminating....


Just happened to me last month


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## Captain Kirk (Sep 11, 2016)

MickeyBisco said:


> New Collet Tiller bolt system! Because, hey... it was great on Samick risers 10 years ago!


Maybe i get the translation of "collet" wrong - but isn't this also the same Win&Win uses on all current risers?
http://www.bignami.it/files/BwFilesProdotti/53I/53I851/53i851_a.jpg
Or did i miss something in the detail pictures?

Nonetheless, a nice looking riser.


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## Arsi (May 14, 2011)

Captain Kirk said:


> Maybe i get the translation of "collet" wrong - but isn't this also the same Win&Win uses on all current risers?
> http://www.bignami.it/files/BwFilesProdotti/53I/53I851/53i851_a.jpg
> Or did i miss something in the detail pictures?
> 
> Nonetheless, a nice looking riser.


Most other riser manufacturers use the same design. Wonder what thread size they will be using.


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## MickeyBisco (Jul 14, 2012)

Captain Kirk said:


> Maybe i get the translation of "collet" wrong - but isn't this also the same Win&Win uses on all current risers?
> http://www.bignami.it/files/BwFilesProdotti/53I/53I851/53i851_a.jpg
> Or did i miss something in the detail pictures?
> 
> Nonetheless, a nice looking riser.



Yup, same tiller bolt design used on numerous risers for many years... there's nothing "new" about it. Decent looking riser, though.


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

MickeyBisco said:


> View attachment 4978921
> 
> 
> New Collet Tiller bolt system! Because, hey... it was great on Samick risers 10 years ago!


And in Hoyt Radian 25 years ago. Perhaps you didn't know that?


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## rat4go (Apr 14, 2011)

Looks like the GMX got replaced by the Epik. Also looks like tek bar risers must not have sold well. No tek bar oly risers on the Hoyt site any more.


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## J-Shooter (Jul 12, 2007)

The Epik reminds me of the MK Korea offerings, which certainly isn't a bad thing. However, my first thought after seeing the new lineup was, "I should buy a GMX". Lol, I'm sure all the products are great...


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## Bbastos (May 26, 2013)

It's too bad the GMX got the axe, but I'm glad they're offering the Epik in a 23" model. 


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

Still no 27" ILF offerings...


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

Whoa, Epik is $100 more than the GMX. That sucks. May pick up a GMX while they are still around. Would have liked the Vera tune plate, but would have preferred if they hadn't added the pro dovetail bolt system. And the price hike makes them no longer such an economical top tier riser.


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## rat4go (Apr 14, 2011)

bobnikon said:


> Still no 27" ILF offerings...


Noticed that too. :-(



bobnikon said:


> Whoa, Epik is $100 more than the GMX. That sucks. May pick up a GMX while they are still around. Would have liked the Vera tune plate, but would have preferred if they hadn't added the pro dovetail bolt system. And the price hike makes them no longer such an economical top tier riser.



where'd you find prices? I looked on Hoyt site for MSRP and a quick look at Lancaster to see if they showed the new stuff yet. I might be blind, though.


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## rat4go (Apr 14, 2011)

Never mind on price stuff. Looks like I AM blind. Lancaster.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

rat4go said:


> Never mind on price stuff. Looks like I AM blind. Lancaster.


Don't feel bad. I checked and they weren't there, and then 5 minutes later they were.


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## rookcaca (Oct 10, 2002)

The Epik is nice, but I noticed the price jump too. Ouch.


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## rat4go (Apr 14, 2011)

bobnikon said:


> Don't feel bad. I checked and they weren't there, and then 5 minutes later they were.


Entire prodigy line is on clearance, too. $600. Used prodigy prices just went down. 

Not so much for the GMX or I might have to have one (again).


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## MickeyBisco (Jul 14, 2012)

That Epik makes me want to buy a ...MKX10. Or Titan. 


GT- I remember the Radian, I loved the grip. Yes, the mushrooming bolt has been used for years, by everyone . I objected to the "NEW" tag. It ain't.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

MickeyBisco said:


> That Epik makes me want to buy a ...MKX10. Or Titan.


Definitely the Titan. Just keeps getting to be a better option.


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## sdcoyote (Oct 19, 2016)

I've shot two different limbs with bamboo cores over the last few years and glad to see them in the new Hoyt lineup.


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## chrstphr (Nov 23, 2005)

Patrick Houston also made a video of the new riser and limb.

https://www.facebook.com/Patrickhustonarcher/?hc_ref=NEWSFEED&fref=nf


Chris


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## Z3R0 (Nov 6, 2014)

Sjef too.

https://youtu.be/knsn8BIzaEw

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## wesel (Sep 6, 2013)

>--gt--> said:


> And in Hoyt Radian 25 years ago. Perhaps you didn't know that?


GT,

do you know why these bolts were not used later? For me the current design looks pretty well made and locks the bolt perfectly. On the other hand I have/had 2 other risers with W&W bolt system and it happened from time to time that some of the bolts got loose.

w.


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## caspian (Jan 13, 2009)

>--gt--> said:


> And in Hoyt Radian 25 years ago. Perhaps you didn't know that?


so on the basis of that we'll expect to see stealth shots trotted out again in a few years as "new" in a marketing attempt to buy more stuff.

verta tune is nice for the small minority that will use it, for the rest it's much the same as before bundled up in a few new CNC mill cuts to make it look new.


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## Captain Kirk (Sep 11, 2016)

MickeyBisco said:


> Yup, same tiller bolt design used on numerous risers for many years... there's nothing "new" about it. Decent looking riser, though.


Thank you. So i translated it right. 
Really wondering why Hoyt replaces the GMX with the Epik instead of offering both side by side.
The GMX is a damn good classic ILF Riser. And would also sell well if priced a bit lower now.


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## MartinOttosson (May 31, 2011)

Nice looking lineup! I always liked the risers from Hoyt and these will most likely follow that tradition. As for limbs, I rest my case until I have shot them. Bamboo was an unexpected move. That normally brings a soft feel to the shot, but the laminate around the core is still what controls most of the performance and feel. I hope to be able to try the new bows when they start to reach the market. So used prices on Prodigys goes down and prices on used GMX:s goes up I assume


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

bobnikon said:


> ...but would have preferred if they hadn't added the pro dovetail bolt system.


Pity most folks do not really know what to do with those magnificent gadgets.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

theminoritydude said:


> Pity most folks do not really know what to do with those magnificent gadgets.


Obviously. Definitely can't shoot world class scores without it... with say a riser like the GMX.


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## derpa-fox (Jan 18, 2015)

theminoritydude said:


> Pity most folks do not really know what to do with those magnificent gadgets.


Is this about the pro series dowels? If so, I will admit, when I first got my Prodigy, I had no idea what to do with all the washers. My coach later explained to me that, if the limbs (or the riser) was bent a little, I could use those washers to adjust them so that the limbs sat square with the riser.


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## toxoph (Mar 24, 2005)

>--gt--> said:


> And in Hoyt Radian 25 years ago. Perhaps you didn't know that?


And prior to that, my Spigarelli 1300 or some version of. I may be wrong but I think they may have been the first, not sure though.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

derpa-fox said:


> Is this about the pro series dowels? If so, I will admit, when I first got my Prodigy, I had no idea what to do with all the washers. My coach later explained to me that, if the limbs (or the riser) was bent a little, I could use those washers to adjust them so that the limbs sat square with the riser.


The pro-series dowels were designed with an old concept of limb alignment in mind. It's a pretty common method used by South Korean coaches dealing with low-end to intermediate equipment that didn't quite hit the mark. It's a quick fix involving the use of everyday items such as bits from plastic cards to prop up one side of the limb butt on the limb pocket to align the limbs. All Hoyt did was to incorporate that function, because they knew it was commonly done in South Korea.

And yes, sometimes it was employed on the GMX. 

Honestly, I was rather surprised that not many people could tie the two together. Then I realised not many coaches outside of South Korea knew about this method. I learnt it here, at AT.


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## kshet26 (Dec 20, 2010)

I'm not sure I'd want to shim limbs to correct for twisted limbs. That's just masking the issue. You CAN shim for riser twist/limb butt inconsistencies though.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

When the Avalon just arrived, plenty of folks didn't know what to do with it. A coach was once heard saying to her student "Just get an Elan, no stupid limb alignment to be done."

Some things don't change.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

kshet26 said:


> I'm not sure I'd want to shim limbs to correct for twisted limbs. That's just masking the issue. You CAN shim for riser twist/limb butt inconsistencies though.


That's why WW CXT is made that way.


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## frankenarcher (Aug 18, 2015)

is it just me, or does it seem like hoyt is moving away from their "high-performance" geometry in favor of moving back to the original earl hoyt geometry that everyone seems to like better anyway?


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## Z3R0 (Nov 6, 2014)

frankenarcher said:


> is it just me, or does it seem like hoyt is moving away from their "high-performance" geometry in favor of moving back to the original earl hoyt geometry that everyone seems to like better anyway?


I got the same feeling from the new naming scheme too, since the "default" geometry on the Faktor is the original geometry and the Faktor HP, the "non-default", has the less deflexed new geometry. It is interesting. I would've expected a Faktor and Faktor RX, following the same scheme as the Prodigy.

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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

theminoritydude said:


> The pro-series dowels were designed with an old concept of limb alignment in mind. It's a pretty common method used by South Korean coaches dealing with low-end to intermediate equipment that didn't quite hit the mark. It's a quick fix involving the use of everyday items such as bits from plastic cards to prop up one side of the limb butt on the limb pocket to align the limbs. All Hoyt did was to incorporate that function, because they knew it was commonly done in South Korea....


Using shims under sides of limbs pockets to get on plane badly twisted risers is a common system used since the invention of the take down bows, much before archery become a professional sport in Korea. Surely, the first one using an aluminium strip from a can of Coke to do it has been an US archer long, long time ago. I have used the same trick hundreds of times my self in the years with risers of any supposed quality level. But, the system corrects easily twisted risers, surely not twisted limbs. Limbs usually twist during traction, not a the static starting position, and you can't find a countertwisting action on pocket that can correct all kind of twisting may happen during traction. In case of twisted limbs, you need a file, sandpaper, some time a bowl of hot water, a lot of experience and patience to get to some working result, depending form the amount of twisting and from its origin. Filing the tips to correct twisting is quite easy, filing U seat and lever points is a bit more difficult, filing the entire limb side is for expert bowyers, only. 
In my experience, while I respect a lot Korean archery, top Korean coaches and their fanatstic sport results, I also have to point out that almost nothing new in archery has been invented in Korea, from materials to tuning to shooting and to coaching techniques. They are surely more efficient than others in using what was already known since ages, but technically they are not innovators, they are still followers.


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## RMBX10 (Jun 20, 2002)

>--gt--> said:


> And in Hoyt Radian 25 years ago. Perhaps you didn't know that?


Hey, I've got a couple of those. One doesn't even have a date stamp or serial number on it. Any guesses on how I got one of those?


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## frankenarcher (Aug 18, 2015)

Z3R0 said:


> I got the same feeling from the new naming scheme too, since the "default" geometry on the Faktor is the original geometry and the Faktor HP, the "non-default", has the less deflexed new geometry. It is interesting. I would've expected a Faktor and Faktor RX, following the same scheme as the Prodigy.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


Thats exactly what i was thinking, that paired with the fact that the HP is only offered in a 25" version. It seems almost as if they aren't expecting them to sell very well.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Vittorio said:


> Using shims under sides of limbs pockets to get on plane badly twisted risers is a common system used since the invention of the take down bows, much before archery become a professional sport in Korea. Surely, the first one using an aluminium strip from a can of Coke to do it has been an US archer long, long time ago. I have used the same trick hundreds of times my self in the years with risers of any supposed quality level. But, the system corrects easily twisted risers, surely not twisted limbs. Limbs usually twist during traction, not a the static starting position, and you can't find a countertwisting action on pocket that can correct all kind of twisting may happen during traction. In case of twisted limbs, you need a file, sandpaper, some time a bowl of hot water, a lot of experience and patience to get to some working result, depending form the amount of twisting and from its origin. Filing the tips to correct twisting is quite easy, filing U seat and lever points is a bit more difficult, filing the entire limb side is for expert bowyers, only.
> In my experience, while I respect a lot Korean archery, top Korean coaches and their fanatstic sport results, I also have to point out that almost nothing new in archery has been invented in Korea, from materials to tuning to shooting and to coaching techniques. They are surely more efficient than others in using what was already known since ages, but technically they are not innovators, they are still followers.


All the more puzzling that the Pro-series dowel should be viewed as some sort of "alien device", since as you have mentioned, that using shims under limbs started in the west. But just like the take-down bow, few could argue that while the South Koreans have bought into an idea from the US, they have had phenomenal success pretty much unmatched at this point by any other countries, including the training and shooting methods (I was told the Japanese were credited in this regard) but you would be half right to say that nothing new has been invented (using carbon on their risers, MAYBE not an invention, probably an innovation). As for them being followers, I would respectfully disagree. They may be unoriginal adopters, but they are definitely not followers. As for tuning......the truth is, depending on the definition of tuning being used, specifically, the Koreans are not so into it. Almost a "couldn't care less" attitude. These folks generally don't delve too deep into tuning their bows. They tune their archers.

But I digress.


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

Well considering that Shibuya archery has people lined up out the door here in Tokyo trying out the new bows, I would say Hoyt will
do just fine with the new lineup.


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

theminoritydude said:


> ----(using carbon on their risers, MAYBE not an invention, probably an innovation).----


First full Carbon riser has been made in Russia long time ago and has been used by Vladimir Esheev in competition in the early 80's. After that, Peron riser came, then the Carbonfast one.
Just as additional reference.


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

Vittorio said:


> First full Carbon riser has been made in Russia long time ago and has been used by Vladimir Esheev in competition in the early 80's. After that, Peron riser came, then the Carbonfast one.
> Just as additional reference.


Don't forget the Yamaha Centennial, as well- 1987.

Not to mention numerous prototypes from some companies that never saw the light of day.


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## caspian (Jan 13, 2009)

>--gt--> said:


> Well considering that Shibuya archery has people lined up out the door here in Tokyo trying out the new bows, I would say Hoyt will
> do just fine with the new lineup.


of course they will. nobody doubts that, it's a pretty good product. it's just not remarkably better than that of any of a number of other companies, so ultimately it's just a lesson in how to buy a customer base with enough advertising.


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## damiaan (Feb 17, 2014)

For what its worth I think Hoyt really has a solid lineup for this year.
To me they made all the logical steps to improve on the prodigy series and I am glad they incorporated the new dowels and vertatune plates to an ILF platform. 
Also the plastic washers under the limb-bolts seem to be gone as well. 
The weight system they put in the "banana's" seems like a good idea as well, 
maybe in the future an offering of different materials and therefore weights might be desirable.

To be honest I am not a huge fan of the aesthetics this year but then again I didn,t like the look of the GMX at first and I have one now 
Also the names.. so just replacing all the C's with K's makes it....better?

All in all I think Hoyt's engineers have done a great job!


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## Matt Z (Jul 22, 2003)

frankenarcher said:


> Thats exactly what i was thinking, that paired with the fact that the HP is only offered in a 25" version. It seems almost as if they aren't expecting them to sell very well.


I see youth archers using the 25" 'HP' risers who are looking for extra speed to get the distances needed and the 'traditional' geometry for older archers with the consistency of feel they are looking for. I'll be curious as the youth age, if HP risers become the norm in the future as that's what they grew up with.


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## GoldArcher403 (Jun 25, 2014)

Dont get me wrong, Hoyt makes great bows indeed but I think their ability is over exaggerated IMHO. Doesn't matter how many times you re-invent the wheel, it's not gonna get any rounder  Just the same concept with a new look. Only big difference is they added a weight system and fixed the alignment problems the prodigy had. But who cares, when you're Hoyt, zombie brained archers will drop $1,500+ every year for the latest greatest no questions asked.


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## archerychick15 (Oct 6, 2016)

love the new bows


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## kshet26 (Dec 20, 2010)

With the exception of the new weight system, it seems like this iteration is about fixing issues that were introduced in previous revisions. Reducing riser twist (they've been trying to fix this over the last few Formula revisions)... Fixing the veratune plate... Fixing limb bolt alignment issues...


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

Arguably they have had riser twist sussed since 1983. The TD 3 was their last actually troubled riser. And they have provably improved every year since.

The vertatune plate was never broken in the first place. It's a good solution to a number of issues, including the often overlooked ability to instantly switch out a compromised arrow rest. 

I'm also not aware of any limb bolt alignment issues that couldn't be solved by- you know- *reading* the instructions.

I would say Hoyt is making the best bows in the history of the company, and I do have a point of reference for that point of view.


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## derpa-fox (Jan 18, 2015)

kshet26 said:


> Fixing the veratune plate


I've heard this quite a bit since the new line-up but what exactly was the problem with the veratune plates?


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## kshet26 (Dec 20, 2010)

>--gt--> said:


> Arguably they have had riser twist sussed since 1983. The TD 3 was their last actually troubled riser. And they have provably improved every year since.


I'm specifically talking about the possibility of torsion under load. It just appears that the initial Formulas may have been too aggressive in their minimalism. They have been beefing them up in the last few revisions (adding support back to the limb pocket, increasing width). I'm actually happy that this iteration is less about marketable innovation.



>--gt--> said:


> I'm also not aware of any limb bolt alignment issues that couldn't be solved by- you know- *reading* the instructions.


Then why the change and the Hoyt marketing copy _"This new design ensures that the tiller bolt remains centered in the pocket, in all conditions, by locking internally against the threads of the riser as the bolt is tightened"_? This would suggest that the old design_* didn't*_ remain centered in the pocket in all conditions.



>--gt--> said:


> I would say Hoyt is making the best bows in the history of the company, and I do have a point of reference for that point of view.


No disagreement there.

derpa-fox - I have no first-hand experience with the vertatune plates, but just based on the language they're using in their own marketing copy tells me that there were issues.

_"We have built upon the success of our VertaTune system by introducing a full 360 degrees for cushion plunger lock-down by recessing a machined aluminum plate into the riser. We also increased thread depth for better engagement, ensuring the cushion plunger is securely locked in place in all settings."_ You can read into that statement to determine what issues customers were having.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Vittorio said:


> First full Carbon riser has been made in Russia long time ago and has been used by Vladimir Esheev in competition in the early 80's. After that, Peron riser came, then the Carbonfast one.
> Just as additional reference.


I am not familiar with these examples. Thank you for highlighting them to me.


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## frankenarcher (Aug 18, 2015)

Matt Z said:


> I see youth archers using the 25" 'HP' risers who are looking for extra speed to get the distances needed and the 'traditional' geometry for older archers with the consistency of feel they are looking for. I'll be curious as the youth age, if HP risers become the norm in the future as that's what they grew up with.


Interesting. wouldn't it stand to reason then that they should offer the HP in a 23" as well?


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

frankenarcher said:


> Interesting. wouldn't it stand to reason then that they should offer the HP in a 23" as well?


Unlikely to happen. The Formula system is a design with a short window, which explains why there hasn't been any 23" Formula riser ever produced. To do that would be to cater to a very small (no pun intended but be my guest) group of archers, which does not make economic sense.


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## frankenarcher (Aug 18, 2015)

theminoritydude said:


> Unlikely to happen. The Formula system is a design with a short window, which explains why there hasn't been any 23" Formula riser ever produced. To do that would be to cater to a very small (no pun intended but be my guest) group of archers, which does not make economic sense.


Gotcha. Makes sense.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

theminoritydude said:


> Unlikely to happen. The Formula system is a design with a short window, which explains why there hasn't been any 23" Formula riser ever produced. To do that would be to cater to a very small (no pun intended but be my guest) group of archers, which does not make economic sense.


No 23" but a 21". Though that is a hunting riser it does have sight mounting holes. Can't imagine the window at short range. Never mounted a sight for the short time I had one.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

bobnikon said:


> No 23" but a 21". Though that is a hunting riser it does have sight mounting holes. Can't imagine the window at short range. Never mounted a sight for the short time I had one.


I was referring to target risers.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

theminoritydude said:


> I was referring to target risers.


Hence why I said that the Tiburon is a hunting riser. And why I didn't mention the 19" Buffalo as it does not have sight mounting holes. Yours was just a very definitive statement, that while technically true, omitted the existence of an even shorter riser.... "there hasn't been any 23" Formula riser ever produced"


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Well, that wasn't wrong, was it?


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## paper shooter 2 (Jun 30, 2016)

If somebody wanted to try GMXish geometry without the hassle of dealing with Hoyt there is always this:
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2675714
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2677682


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## wbundy (Aug 18, 2010)

Sweet!


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## rat4go (Apr 14, 2011)

kshet26 said:


> derpa-fox - I have no first-hand experience with the vertatune plates, but just based on the language they're using in their own marketing copy tells me that there were issues.
> 
> _"We have built upon the success of our VertaTune system by introducing a full 360 degrees for cushion plunger lock-down by recessing a machined aluminum plate into the riser. We also increased thread depth for better engagement, ensuring the cushion plunger is securely locked in place in all settings."_ You can read into that statement to determine what issues customers were having.


At a minimum, Kaminski suggested (during his review of the new stuff) that when he shot fat 27's indoors and set plunger depth for these arrows, he barely had any thread engagement of plunger to plate with thr Prodigy. He said he expected the new design to help so there was at least this issue. Not sure how many shoot 27s out of a recurve ( not legal in WA IIRC) so maybe its a so-what for most of us.


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## SHPoet (Nov 13, 2009)

Z3R0 said:


> frankenarcher said:
> 
> 
> > is it just me, or does it seem like hoyt is moving away from their "high-performance" geometry in favor of moving back to the original earl hoyt geometry that everyone seems to like better anyway?
> ...


Same here.

I was going to pick up a couple of Prodigy RX risers just to stay kind of current. It seems that no one in the US has any in stock in the color I want.

I talked to Hoyt today and they said the Factor is almost dead on the RX geometry. I may just get a couple of those but it would be nice to get my hands on one first.


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## Jalthi (Aug 14, 2016)

Both the Faktor and Epik look like you could use them to bludgeon a baby seal to death. Not necessarily a bad thing, just an observation. I'm interested to hear reports of how they feel on the shot.


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## droy (Dec 21, 2012)

More on the bolt issue - Google translate is really bad in Japanese!ukey:

http://archerreports.org/


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Nice looking lineup, with some significant improvements IMO. I like the greater depth of the risers, the return to expanding limb bolts and the weight system. Backweight bushings in logical places are always nice, and sadly Hoyt is still one of the few companies that sees this as important enough to keep. 

Vertitune is a nice feature for those who will use it correctly. I'm still not sold on the alignment pads on the dowels - just one more thing for most people to screw up IMO - and I've seen too many archers and coaches chasing their tail with those in fits of frustration. 

Should be good risers though. I hope they stick around for a while.

As for the 27" Grand Prix, there simply is not enough of a market for a 27" riser still, and the main reason for the 27" formula is the short sight window. For guys like me, I'm glad 27" ILF risers like my Gillo and Bernardini are available however. Not sure I can go back to shooting a 25" riser now.


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## derpa-fox (Jan 18, 2015)

rat4go said:


> At a minimum, Kaminski suggested (during his review of the new stuff) that when he shot fat 27's indoors and set plunger depth for these arrows, he barely had any thread engagement of plunger to plate with thr Prodigy. He said he expected the new design to help so there was at least this issue. Not sure how many shoot 27s out of a recurve ( not legal in WA IIRC) so maybe its a so-what for most of us.


That's really interesting. I never had a problem with the vertatune plates and my beiter plunger was pretty secure on there at all times. Then again, I only shoot 600 spined VAPs so I guess what Kaminski was having, I'll probably never see.

I am also curious now if the new bolts can be used on the Prodigy series.


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## Blunt Arrow (Mar 2, 2006)

Guy's this is a never ending game with Hoyt. Keep changing models and jacking up the prices higher and higher. Will these changes make you a better shooter ? Oh , $1700 for there new compound bow. Are they out of there minds.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Hoyt has certainly bought into the "gotta produce new models every year" marketing model, if they didn't invent it for the sport of archery. Other successful companies keep the same models around for years. Two different approaches. It's up to the consumer to decide which one they prefer, I guess. One thing is for sure though - people are sheep, marketing works, and the world really hasn't been the same since professional advertising and marketing took over.


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## sdcoyote (Oct 19, 2016)

Absolutely agree on the "new model every year" syndrome! I love golf and the exact thing is happening there and sometimes models are changed twice during the year and of course with higher prices for advancements that only a few golf pros will be able to notice.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Blunt Arrow said:


> Guy's this is a never ending game with Hoyt. Keep changing models and jacking up the prices higher and higher. Will these changes make you a better shooter ? Oh , $1700 for there new compound bow. Are they out of there minds.


How much did someone have to pay for a top-of-the-line Hoyt compound bow in 2000?

http://www.usinflationcalculator.com


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## GoldArcher403 (Jun 25, 2014)

droy said:


> More on the bolt issue - Google translate is really bad in Japanese!ukey:
> 
> http://archerreports.org/


Lol paragraph three, "GPX bringing pain in the back of the dealer" :set1_rolf2:


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

So, who scooped up a GMX for $499 from Lancaster on clearance? Only 1 right hander remaining... and it's pink!


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## Azzurri (Mar 10, 2014)

teebat said:


> I hope it fixes the issues with the prodigy.


Prodigy looks to be disappearing. If you look at LAS between the New Arrivals, stuff with no indicia, and the Clearance bin, you can kind of tell what happened, which risers and limbs are replacing which.


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## Azzurri (Mar 10, 2014)

Archery30 said:


> I hope they fix the issue of the quattro limbs delaminating....


I'd be interested from a materials perspective if they are trying bamboo for that reason. I don't know one way or the other but if the response to delamination issues is they change core wood next season that might suggest something. Someone who knows the materials/mfr'ing would know better than me.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

In my experience, delams tend to occur at a greater rate on foam core limbs, and on low end limbs. But that's just what I've seen...


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## teebat (Oct 28, 2013)

droy said:


> More on the bolt issue - Google translate is really bad in Japanese!ukey:
> 
> http://archerreports.org/


Weird my anti virus won't let me go to that link.


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