# New Nylon Turbo Nocks Available!!!



## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

FINALLY after a year of testing and experimenting and retooling , we have the new glass filled nylon TURBO NOCKS in stock.
All shipments to distributors, dealers, and individuals on our internet sales site will be filled with the new Nylon TURBOS.
Anyone who ordered TURBOS on the internet over the weekend will get the new nocks.

These new glass filled nylon nocks are many times more durable than the original polycarbonate TURBO NOCKS. 
They resist damage from contact from other arrows and are exteremely difficult to damage. 
One of my TEAM TURBO shooters Jeff Vick just shot in a broadhead tournament in California and did not damage any TURBOS. 
I wish to thank Tom Rowe at Speciality Plastics in St Peters Mo for all the advice and help in getting this retooling done!!!!!!!!

The nylon nocks are also virtually impossible to Robin Hood ( yeah someone will prove me wrong on this!) I have been test shooting them at 10 ft with my 60 lb matthews LX and have been able only put a small notch in a vane. I now have done 200 shots with about 180 solid contacts with other arrows.
The original polycarbonate TURBOS would have had several missing vanes in this same test.

I am attaching a poster showing the new nocks. The colors are close to the original, but their strength is awesome!!!!!!!!!

WE now have added WHITE HUNTERS. and will soon have this category up on our website. If you wish to order White HUNTERS
before they come up on the website you can call our toll free number, 866 814 4722


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

This is a grouping of the new nylon TURBOS (DEADX)
NO DAMAGE!!!!!


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

One point I would like to make!!

The Hunter and DEADX I would recommend for 3-d competition or any shooting where other arrows can contact the turbos.

The HTX which fits the g-nock bushings found on accs and redlines, I would not recommend for 3-d shooting. The vanes are very strong. and are great for hunting, and target shooting where contact is not a problem, but because of the smaller diameter insert, a direct hit can sometimes snap the nock off.

The DEADX and HUNTER do not have this problem because they have a larger diameter insert. The DEADX and HUNTER fit most carbon shafts, (except the new AXIS )and fit all easton shafts that use the supernock bushing.


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## FopSight (Mar 20, 2004)

*Turbo Nock*

Seen them at Columbia, Missouri Whitetail Deer Classic. How well do they work with a whisker biscuit?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Remember all the photos of animal kills at my booth.
All of them except for the blacktail and the whitetail deer were taken with the whisker biscuit.. That included the bear, caribou, pronghorn, etc.
I will attach some of the photos. of the whisker kills


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## robk (Jun 10, 2002)

hey boss 
i sent you a email about some deadx standards and hunters in white in nylon for me to use and show
thanks
rob k


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## TheTone (Oct 7, 2003)

Nick I sent you a PM.


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## FopSight (Mar 20, 2004)

*Nylon Turbo Nocks*

Thanks for the reply. Looks like great groupings.


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## MerlinApexDylan (Oct 14, 2002)

Awsome Nick. It will be intresting to see if you design some for smaller diametre Fita shafts. I believe they would go over really well and help as a tough alternative to the flimsy spin wings and flownite curly's


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## Trushot_archer (Dec 19, 2002)

Now that's what I've been waiting for! Looks great Nick...My order will be placed today!


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

Nick I have a question about FOC

I have heard these are a lot heavier than vanes and it basically kills your foc.
for hunting (broadheads) and long range shooting I thought FOC was important.

WHat do you think?


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## ronedog (Feb 27, 2003)

Is the price the same?

Are you offering an exchange of the old for the new? 
Like 2 old for 1 new?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Francis 
FOC is an issue with an arrow that does not spin when leaving the bow and uses only wind resistance to get it spinning.
Most fletched arrows take 20yds to spin 2 times. The TURBO spins instantly because of the twisted nock and turns two times in the first five feet of flight. It stabilizes like no arrow in the past 30.000 years of archery. It has more in common with a bullet.
Guns have been using the same principle (rifling) for nearly 200 years and no one fletches bullets.
The TURBO Hunter weighs 54 grains, Three plastic vanes and a nock weith 46 grains.


I am attaching an 80 yd group shot by Jeff vick with TURBO HUNTERS and 100 grain Muzzies. A picture is worth a thousand 
words in this case.

I will also attach the 100 yd group shot with 2512 aluminums.
Fita shooters watch out!!!!


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

There is no price change.


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## brandoninaz (Aug 8, 2003)

When are the nocks coming out without the vanes?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

The mold work has been started on the T-4 TURBO NOCK for conventional fletched arrows and will take a minimum of 13 weeks to get into production.


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## brandoninaz (Aug 8, 2003)

I guess I won't get to use them in the August deer season, but they will be on my arrows for the December season if they perform as well as I expect.


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## p8ntballnryan (Apr 5, 2003)

whoa! i might be able to shoot something from turbonock out of my longbow for once! 

i'm actually pretty excited about those nocks!!! especially with a trad bow where the quicker the stabilization the better!


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

I think I will try some of these nocks as well.

How long have turbo nocks been around for?

Has anyone ever tried anything like this before?

I thought I heard of someone making this sort of thing in the past and it did not work out?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Francis

We are going into our third year with the TURBO.
Over the years there have been other attempts to make solid vane nocks and fletching. Most have had problems and failed because they attempted to do this using just wind resistance.
It takes way too much plastic to stabilize an arrow using just the wind and the weight is too much. 

The TURBO using the twisted nock mechchanically stabilizes the arrow and the extremely small vanes ( weight reduction) only have to keep the arrow spinning. 
Again the TURBO NOCK is not just another plastic nock. The work TURBO is there for a reason!!! They spin like a turbine right off the bowstring. NO other arrow has ever done that since the dawn of time. This truely is new technology for arrow flight.
I am attaching a photo of the back of the TURBO where you can actually see the twist in the nock.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

PAINT8BALLNRYAN

Gosh ! that is hard to type!!

I made up a few T-4 prototypes by hand and have been shooting feathers with my good ol BEAR TEMUJIN 1971
I have actually been shooting fingers, instinctive. just like when I was a kid. My groups Suck, but I am getting excellent arrow flight
with test arrows and I have already taken a knife and cut half the feathers off the t-4 arrows and they fly just as well as the full fletched. 
I will do some compound testing in the next few days comparing regular fletch and t-4 and show just how little fletch is needed when using the t-4. Less fletch = less wind resistance= flatter trajectory= less wind drift. 

My BEAR bow has the original little brush sticking out of the side of the riser. I am also setting up my REALLY OLD Indian
solid fiberglass stick bow and will do some shooting with that.
I am hoping to get Byron Ferguson to do a few test shots with the t-4 at the next show where we cross paths.


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

Thanks Nick


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## p8ntballnryan (Apr 5, 2003)

hehe...if you want a traditional field tester!  


i've got high hopes for these...anything to give me an advantage.


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## brandoninaz (Aug 8, 2003)

No way Ryan, that's what I want to do


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## psgpowell (Feb 4, 2003)

*T-4 nocks*

Nick- Which will work best to stabilize fixed broadheads with the T-4 nocks feathers or vanes? Straight or helical fletch? What lenghth? Thanks, Vern


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## brandoninaz (Aug 8, 2003)

That's a good question, I just want to add on to it; Would a left or right helical be best if helical is desired?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

The t-4 as with all TURBO NOCKs is only made with a right helical twist in the nock. There is a reason for this. I am a lefty and in my early experiments I made a left helical twist in a nock and shot broadheads with it. The instant spin of the TURBO produced enough torque to actually unwind the right hand threads of the broadhead and it fell off in mid air and my arrow went throug my barn siding. The right helical of the turbo keeps broadheads tight on the shaft.

As to vanes or feathers being better, it does not matter very much. With my recurve shooting off the shelf I prefer feathers.
Since the T-4 will make a fletched arrow spin instantly you should use a right helical or a right off set minimum 2 degrees of pitch 4 to 6 degrees would be best. 
Straight fletch will fight the rotation the nock provides and I would not recommend it.

The T-4 will enhance conventional arrow flight , because the energy taken from the bowstring to make the arrow spin, makes the fletched arrow have more efficient flight. because it does not have to use up energy to make the arrow spin. 
You will in all likelyhood be able to use 50% less (smaller) vanes to accomplish the same job. for hunting arrows , and 70% to 80 % smaller vanes to fly target arrows.
In my early experiments I used soft fletch and was able to stabilize a target arrow with only .50 square inch of vane.
The DEADX flys arrows with .80 square inch of vane. A set of feathers or plastic vanes can be quite small.
I will try to find a photo of the early experiments so you can see just how small you can go using the turbo.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Early TURBO experiments using soft fletch.


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## brandoninaz (Aug 8, 2003)

Thanks for the reply.
I shoot 4 inch feathers, with a right wing helical, in a 75 x 105 four feather configuration. How do you think these would perform compared to 3 fletch, I am guessing not quite as good since there is more resistance to the spin...


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## Bow Only (Feb 1, 2004)

For those of you that haven't seen the Turbo Nocks, I hunted with them last year. My accuracy has never been better. The reason I liked them for hunting (besides dropping several deer in their tracks without hitting the spine) was because they are so quiet in flight. Standing down range of an 70 yard shot and listening to them go by, I couldn't believe the difference between my vanes and the Turbos. The Turbos do make a light buzzing noise like a mosquito, but it does not scare deer (at least not in GA and WI). Now that Nick has made them more durable, that should stop some of the nock breaking that happened last year. I'm no 3-D shooter, but with the Turbos, I was shooting so good that I was breaking nocks. On my 3-D target, I would have to shoot a heart shot, then a lung shot, then shoot between those arrows, and never did I shoot more than 3 or 4 arrows. If you have never tried them, you are missing out.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

BRANDONDIAZ

I used 4 fletch for all my test shooting of turbos.
If you look at the photos above you can see the little fletching.
If you were to take a knive and scrape off all but the back 3/4 inch of you feathers you are using and put on a turbo t-4 , it would be just as stable. 

If you had a three fletch you would need to leave about an inch and a half of feather.

3 or 4 fletch would make little difference.

The bottom line the T-4 turbo will enable you to fly with much smaller feathers or vanes. the benefits are obvious.

In essence you can use basically the same vane area that the solid vane hunter and deadx use. 

I am researching vane companies to see if I can get a TURBO vane made that will corrospond to the needs of the T-4.

You can also just put the t-4 on your regular feathers or vanes without cutting them down and get a benefit, but why fly extra vane that can increase wind drift if you do not have to?


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## Larebow (Feb 18, 2004)

nick snook
What are thought for using the t-4 with FLP400 and 6* twist?
Is this still to much vane? When are the t-4's due to be out?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

You are going to have to bring me up to speed on the vanes.

I have not paid much attention to fletching since the original turbos do not use it. I grew up fletching arrows and grew to dislike the process for many reasons.

The TURBO t-4 will be at least 13 weeks away.

Basically the T-4 will enhance the performance of any fletch feathers or vanes , any size . because it spins the arrow instantly the energy usually used up by vanes to make an arrow spin is reduced.
But as a result of this you can also fly arrows with much smaller vanes. You can basically shoot broadheads with the little 1 1/2 inch vanes some archers use for 3-d competition.

This evening I will try to get some comparison photos up


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Here are a few early TURBO experiments that basically used the T-4 concept except the prototype was a glue on nock.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

This shows just how little vane is needed if the twisted nock stabilizes the arrow


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

size comparison


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

another compairson photo


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## MerlinApexDylan (Oct 14, 2002)

Nick, I truley hope you make turbo for small diamtre shafts like ACE, NAV, X-10, and some of Cartels line up. I believe they would do really well in a mini-me version of the other turbo nocks.

Product is looking great. 
Dylan


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## Larebow (Feb 18, 2004)

Nick
.360 heigth and 4"long.Sounds like they may still be to much vane.This version is also coming out in a three inch soon.


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## PJBinMI (Oct 31, 2003)

*Nick*

Are they IBO legal?? Not for hunter class I'm sure.
I use spin vanes I'm curious how the T-4 nock would work with 4" (IBO legal) spin vanes?

Question , can you get to much spin on an arrow?

Patrick


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## Larebow (Feb 18, 2004)

The four inch are IBO legal the 3"are not


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Larebow 
I think the T-4 would work fine with those fletches.
I was messing around with the photo to also show you in comparison just how much less you can get away with with the t-4


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Just thinking!!!

Another benefit the T-4 will provide for hunters who use regular fletch is that fixed blade broadheads will tune a lot easier.

If you use a fallaway rest, the instant spin the nock provides, virtually eliminates any planing . You really would not have to line the broadhead up with the vanes or the nock.
The solid vane TURBO NOCK HUNTER works this way , so the T-4 would also.

ONE limitation of the SOLID vane HUNTER is that 125 grain broadheads are the maximum.


If you shoot heavy broadheads like Zwikies ( spelled wrong)
up in the 140 + class . I would think the T-4 with regular size vanes would really tighten up groups and improve trajectory with those type of broadheads.
This will be one of the first tests I do when the first batch of t-4s 
come out.


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

Nick, If I got rid of my fletching and used the turbo nock, youare saying I am limited to 125 grain broadheads right?

I just want to clearify, and why is this?

Thanks
Francis


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

The TURBO NOCK HUNTER with 1.6 square inch of vane will stabilize broadheads up to 125 grains. 

Usually broadheads that are heavier are also larger and cause more resistance to spinning . We have done a lot of testing, and the heavier broadheads just do not group as well.

If you shoot heavier broadheads, the new t-4 when it comes out in september would provide extra stability with your conventional fletch.


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## Jim G (Apr 8, 2003)

*They really are durable*

Shot quite a bit yesterday tuning the Outback with several tips and bow settings, shootin for groups at 40 yards can be hell on fletching. I did break several poly T-nocks, but no new Nylons. They are very tough. I have only broken part of one vane from a nylon in the last two weeks, and it still shoots great.

I think you will be very impressed with the nylon material. It is virtually impossible to break one of these new nocks in your fingers, or even break off a vane.

Try them, you'll like them.

Jim G,


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Hey Jim . now you can shoot those killer groups like the one in the old posts and walk away with arrows in good shape.
Here is a photo taken today of my first demo with the new nylons.
I am on the left, the deer with turbos is in the middle and Dennis Scharadin is on the right. Dennis is the president of the Pa Outdoor Writers Assoc. and was also an old wrestling partner when we both wrestled for Kutztown State. many years ago whern we both had hair.
I have recently cranked all my bows up to 50 lb. and this was the first time since my shoulder surgery that I put on a shootin show.

I managed all but one in the heart and Two TURBOS collided with no damage!!!
I still have to spray paint the heart . most anything past 20 yds is difficult for me to sight on without some color. All in All not bad for an old fart.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

This is the closest I have come to doing a Robin Hood with the TURBOS.

I did this with some easton redlines and the HTX. One nock got hung up on another and the arrow penetrated the target without it. It had about a 1/4 in. notch in it , but was still shootable.


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## BDHUNTR (May 24, 2003)

Nick, when the T-4 nocks become available, where can we purchase them, and do you have an idea of the cost and unit of issue?

I would be real interested in trying them on my 6 degree right-helical feather-fletched XX75 2213's.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

I am hoping that the dealers and distributors I have now will pick up the new T-4, They will be available on our internet site.

I will know the pricing after the mold is made

I am hoping to get it in at about $12 for a dozen.


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## BDHUNTR (May 24, 2003)

Hmm-m-m-m, a buck an arrow for ultimate stability? I'll take it!


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

The main difference between the solid vane TURBOS and the T-4
is that The t-4 will leave it up to the archer to select his vane setup.
We will offer suggestions as we (TEAM TURBO) test them.

I personally do not like soft vanes for two reasons. 
I would rather be shooting than fletching.
Secondly the original reason I went to solid vanes on the Original TURBOS was from watching high speed video of soft fletch.
at 200 fps vanes and feathers deform and flap in the wind turbulance . 
This creates variables in every shot. Common sense the less variables the more consistant the accuracy.

Bottom line - The t-4 will open up the TURBO technology to those archers who could not use the solid turbo . Recurve Shooters, non fallaway rest shooters. And the T-4 will provide and improvement in the tuning and stability that conventional fletch using just wind resistance can not do.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

HERE ARE SOME TURBOED DEER!!

I TOOK THESE IMAGES FROM A VIDEO THAT WHIPSTOCK PRODUCTIONS DID, FROM LOUISIANA.
THE QUALITY IS NOT TO GOOD BECAUSE I PHOTOED THEM FROM MY TV SCREEN, BUT YOU CAN SEE THE TURBO DID THE JOB!!


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

Nick, with the extra spinning the turbo nocks provide, do you think a lot of broadhead penetration would be lost due energy lost as the broad head tries to "twist" into the animal?

I wonder if you would recommend a head like what Nap offers where the broadhead spins independently of the arrow shaft for this reason with turbo nocks?

Thanks

Francis


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

I wonder if mechanical heads are affected by the extra spinning in terms of penetration?

does anyone think turbo or even t4's would be a real benefit when using mechanical broadheads? I mean most already fly as well as field points right?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Whether you are using mechanicals or fixed blades the TURBO provides more consistant accuracy and flatter trajectory than conventional fletched arrows.
I am attaching a poster of Terry Whitfords Afican hunt. These were taken with mechanicals.
We have seen no detrimental effect from the high rpms on penetration, or have any mechanicals opened in the air.

Bottom line . THE TURBO NOCK is not just another "archery gimmick" It is a new technolgy of arrow flight and stabilization.
It is the first and only mechanically stabilization system for arrows.
For 30,000 years every arrow ever made used only wind resistance from feathers or vanes to make it stable. 
The TURBO NOCK has more in common with modern bullets than
ancient arrows. The same principle that stabilizes bullets it what the TURBO USES. 

WE have had the TURBO on the market now for a little less than two years, and have gone from being the "Crazy people" at the hunting shows, to a business that is growing and surviving in a very competitive marketplace. We just got in the CABELA'S Archery catalog and are very proud of that!!!

The biggest problem , well the two biggest problems we have had were:
DURABILITY . The original TURBOS would break when hit by other arrows. This problem has been solved with the new more durable Nylon material used in the production process.
The seconded biggest problem is The BELIEF FACTOR.
There has been so much junk that is hyped and promises so much and delivers so little in this archery market that most of us , inclucing myself are very skeptical of claims made by many products .
When I first approached my patent attorney and told him I made an arrow with no feathers that flies like a bullet, he gave me quite a strange look. 
When I showed him the first turbo, He looked at it and just glared at me. His words were " I am an attorney and an aerospace engineer" Why didn't I think of this??

When you look at a TURBO on an arrow is just does not look big enough to work. The twist in the nock that makes them work is barely noticeable. That little twist is doing to arrows what those 
little cams did to the recurve. 


Here is the photos of the mechanical kills.


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## MerlinApexDylan (Oct 14, 2002)

I believe they will do for Olympic archery what the clap skate did for speed skating. I sure hope you make some for EASTON target shafts and other target shafts as well.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

MerlinApexDylan

I would like to work up some for olympic archery , I just do not know if they would get past the rules committee.

I have not familiarized myself with the olympic arrow diameters , perhaps you can get me up to speed on them. 

If any of them use the G-nock size nocks I can hand make some prototypes without too much trouble.

The expense of making a production mold will have to wait a while.
the T-4 mold is costing me two arms and a leg and will be our project for this year. 

If the politics for designing one for the olympic style is favoraable,I could possibly make an aluminium mold and make a limited production version. 

First thing would be to check the rules to see if they would allow 
a solid vane or if a T-4 version would be acceptable.
I have a feeling they would not permit the Twisted nock.


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

nick, 

I would imagine these nocks are a little hard on the serving though because of how it twists when leaving the string, instead of a regular nock with a straight slot in it?

what do you find?


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## MerlinApexDylan (Oct 14, 2002)

Nick, All ACE, X-10 and Navigator type arrows use a g-nock. Cartel Triples are sized to there own specs and Beiter actually makes a nock for each size as well as them having pin nocks that fit and then putting Easton nocks on top of the pins.

Cartel X-perts that are more designed for compound are G-Nock size all the way through the dimensions.

With the new Nylon use, if you ever did make a nock for those sizes. You could think about an outnock like the one beiter makes and it would be very protective of the shaft. Or and In nock like the Turbo's you make now. 

I see no problem with Turbos. They are still a clip on the string nock system.

Like I mentioned, Clap skates give a slight mechanical advantage but they were excepted to be used in speed skating the world over. So every athelete now uses them and world records are broken with them. 

I think it would be very closed minded not to allow a nock system like Turbo nocks to have it's chance. Magnock has more of a mechanical advantage and I could see where they would leave it to compound shooting only. As the nocks don't clip onto the string and it's like using a mechancial release aid and then having another mechanical release aid in front of it. Plus they just never performed on a curve from my knowlege. 


I dunno about other people. But I get annoyed slightly about how quickly the Spin wings and Kurly vanes break down.. especially the elite spinners. I am actually looking into the Aerofoils by a company called Spin tite.

Last weekend I shot a PB at 90metres and I barely had any fletch on my arrows. Using elite spinners. I would refletch but it costs me 21.00 and then I have to pick the remainents of the old fletch off, clean the shaft, redraw the lines, set the tape, clean the fletch and set the fletch. It takes a long time and there is not advantage to shooting when the fletch is broken down. My bow spits out a bare shaft perfectly 1/2 to 1" low center of the fletched group and I still get broken fletches.

I would look foward to testing something out that would give my arrows a little bit of wind advantage and also not break down so quickly. Basically it's just a though Nick. Maybe some day. 
Dylan


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Some of the early turbos did wear on serving, until we started vibration finishing them, which rounded the outer edges of the nock and virtually eliminated the problem.

I get over 6000 shots and I just use some serving I bought at Gander Mountain. It is black and white and that is all I know about it.
The new nylon nocks should provide even less serving wear, because Nylon is a "slippery" material.

I get about 3000 shots with my string loop. 

Bottom line I can reserve my bowstring and put on a new string loop faster than you can fletch a dozen arrows.

I get a lot of e-mails and questions on these forums from folks who have not tried the TURBO yet and most usually ask about 
negative aspects shuch as, are they noisy, do they wear out strings, do they affect penetration, ETC. 
I had a gentleman talk to me at The Harrisburg show this year who had bought the TURBOS the year before. 
He said they were very accurate , but that he would not hunt with them , because he could hear a whirring noise when he shot them at his local indoor range. 
While he was talking there was a video running on our moniter showing the first black bear and the first pronghorn being taken with these arrows. 

We just took a really nice Bear in Canada, 
AGAIN No animal has ducked or complained when shot with a TURBO. 
I guess it is just human nature to try to come up with as many reasons as possible not to change.
We have all heard the old saying " If it aint broke, don't fix it"
Well if we all lived by those words we would still be riding horses and dragging things around in sleds without wheels. And we would all be shooting long bows and hand carved stone broadheads.

The Sport of archery has made a great many changes in the past few years, Mostly in bow design. 
Even though arrow shafts have changed into modern materials, there has never been a change in how arrows fly until the TURBO NOCK. That is 30,000 years without a real change in arrow stabilization. 

I just got a complaint from a customer who just bought some turbos and had a problem shooting them through his whisker biscuit. He stated that His fletched arrows were zeroed in and that there must be something wrong with the Turbo because they were not flying well through the rest.
We supply a TUNING TIPS sheet with every package of turbos and also have a website to help archers with this new technology.
TURBO NOCKS DO NOT FLY OR TUNE LIKE CONVENTIONAL ARROWS.
We have found that a TURBO flys best from 1/16 to 3/16 inch nock high.
If you decide to buy some TURBOS , PLEASE read the tuning tips .
In most cases they will help you do a few simple thing to make the TURBO work.

Again I am going to post this 80yd group with muzzy broadheads.
as an example of the benefits of using TURBOS


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

This is one of my favorite photos of anothe animal that did not complain about being shot with the TURBO


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## PJBinMI (Oct 31, 2003)

1) first what IS the size of the hunter are they 4 " ?? is so this shortening of the arrow will stiffen it ?

2) Can i shoot them in hunter class.

3) I'm most interested in the T4 nock with 4" fletch how do you fletch them? straight off set etc???

and whats the cost on the T4's
Need any MI pro shooters?? hee love free stuff! we could carry them at the shop.
thanks Pat.


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## 60X (Nov 8, 2002)

How do other arrows react after contacting a turbo nock? I'm guessing these are very ridgid and I was wondering about glance outs on field and target rounds. I know how far an arrow can kick off a nock and would think these might really ramp it out.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

What is really nice about turbos is that their high rate of spin acts like a gyroscope. Turbos virtually eliminate kiss outs . They usually deflect less than an inch when they hit another arrow.
This becomes an advantage for 3-d shooters and also for hunting. Turbos will not deflect as much as a conventional arrow if you hit a small twig.


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## 1bigtaco (Nov 3, 2003)

Nick i cant wait try these new T4 with my Gold Tip Pro Hunters fletched with the new Bohnin Broadhead Vanes, they will be the ULTIMATE setup! Go ahead and put me down on the reserve list for a dozen of them! , Thanks! Clay


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Hey PJBin MI 

I forgot to answere some of your questions

I am guessing that if you used legal vanes or feathers, The t-4 would be legal, but when it comes to competition and new inventions , ????????

Fletching with the T-4 requires an off set or helical
4t0 6 degrees would work best.
Straight fletch would not work. Since the Nock would make the arrow spin, you need helical or ofset to keep it spinning.
Straight fletch would work agains the TURBO.

The main benefit the T-4 will provide is that it stabilizes arrows instantly when it leaves the string. Also because it takes a little energy from the bow you can if you want to improve trajectory, reduce the size vanes you use. Less vane = less wind resistance and less drift in cross winds.

Again I will post a comparison photo to show just how much less vane works with a TURBO

This photo has the hard vane Hunter and DEADX
but the T-4 will operate virtually the same and can fly arrows with 
the same size vanes.

The only advantage of using full size vanes would be if you were shootin big broadheads over 125 grains. 
The T-4 will improve the stability of regular size 4 and 5 inch vanes, but you are wasting energy .


All conventional arrows have the same aerodynamic problem that old time fixed pitch propellor airplanes have.
Our old Piper J-3 Cub had a wooden propellor, with the angle of the propellor blades set. It had to work at low speed for takeoff
and also at crusing speed. Fixed blade props waste a lot of energy at crusing speed.
Modern Variable pitch propellors use a steep pitch for takeoff and then can be Tuned to a lesser pitch for more efficient crusing.

Conventional fletch arrows need to be large enough to get the arrow spinning to stabilize it. Once the arrow is spinning, all that vane then becomes a liability , and slows the arrow down and drifts in cross wind.

The TURBO NOCK Kind of does what a variable pitch propellor does. The small vanes are all that are needed to stabilize an arrow that is spinning. and the twisted nock gets it up to crusing speed.
Using the Mechanical boost of the twisted nock is using a mechanical force rather than wind resistance.
This virtually changes everything about arrow flight.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

this is the most recent TURBO Kill
Taken by Greg Hopf . We sponser his show on the Sportsman Channel and this video should be aired sometime this summer.


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## A4BEST (Nov 2, 2002)

Nick and friends, Sorry I dont get here to AT very often and just saw this post. Need to correct the 80 yd group statment. It is 80 but is with field points not muzzy as stated. Just want to keep the information straight. Here's a 28 yd turkey with a muzzy and the new Nylon Hunters.


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## A4BEST (Nov 2, 2002)

41 yard Antelope Muzzy and Nylon hunter

Jeff


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## A4BEST (Nov 2, 2002)

Last one, Nylon hunters and Montec 85 gr HS. these 2 products compliment each other very well. The grind on the HS induces spin and works great with the turbos. 46 yd moose


Jeff


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## MerlinApexDylan (Oct 14, 2002)

Thats some great shooting. I'm impressed.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

Thanks Jeff!!!


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## karday (Aug 20, 2002)

*T-4's*

Nick: I picked up from one of your posts that you need to shoot right helical fletches witht he T-4"s. MY jig clamps and feathers are all left helical so that means investing i the right helical clamp. Not all that big of a deal but is it worth it to get get better groups? Would you see more distinct results on shots over 30 yards using opposing fletching helical?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

I am not quite sure of your question, but if you were to use the T-4 which will be spinning your arrow clockwise at around 5000 rpm off the bow string and then put left helical vanes on the arrow, YOU are going to have an aerodynamic mess.
Your vanes will be trying to spin the arrow the other direction and you will not get any benefit.

I found that I had to use right helical , or a right twist in the nock because most broadheads have right hand threads.
With the high spin and high torque, I had some early test turbos with a left twist actually unwind the broadheads in midair.

The advantage the T-4 will give to accuracy if you have the helical the same direction as the twist in the nock , is the same benefits that the solid turbos have.

First the arrow will be stable instantly.
Second , Since the arrow is already spinning you can use much smaller vanes to get the same performance,
Third. The smaller vanes will drift less in windy conditions.
You should get flatter trajectory and tighter groups.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

I just found a photo of vanes I used in early turbo experiments.
In this chart you will see a conventional fletch at the top and experimental turbo vanes below.
#1 became the Hunter and #6 became the deadX

The Square inch number listed are for a total of four of these vanes. for example The vane you see in #6 is only .25 (1/4) square inch .


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## karday (Aug 20, 2002)

*helical compatability*

Roger the aero mess. Can I then assume if I am fletching with a Jo-Jan I would set the offset to the right (looking at the arrows from the top as sitting on the fletcher)? How much right offset? If I don't have to buy right helical clamps that would be nice. 

This obviously explains why the existing Turbos I cut the fins off didn't show an improvement since I had them fletched with a left helical. Also lets' me do some more meaningful experimentation with 2413's fletched with 1.75" vanes.

I will try the new Turbos. I trashed the 2 dozen I had tuning 3 bows and didn't see much point continuing, if I couldn't group tune without destroying the T's.

Any data using T's with the Crimson Talon Broadheads?


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## 1bigtaco (Nov 3, 2003)

> Any data using T's with the Crimson Talon Broadheads?



Ill give you some data: No matter what you hit with those Crimson Talons be it paper, foam, water or a brick wall, they will either loose a blade or explode on impact. CT's are JUNK......for now anyways, do a search for them hear, you will hear all of the horror stories.


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

They should fly best with about 4 to 6 degrees of right ofset.
That should be about as steep a pitch as the fletching tool will make. If you look at the vanes on the Solid turbo they are also ofset , not helical. The throat of the nock itself is a true helical twist. either ofset or helical will do the job.

Actuallly the Crimson Talon is one of the few fixed blade broadheasd that will work with the DEADX, it also works with the hunter.
Bill Snodgrass used the Crimson Talon last year on his hunts with the TURBO. Hunts to Remember on the Sportsman channel


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## 1bigtaco (Nov 3, 2003)

Nick: Not sure if you have addressed this yet. Will the T4's be the new Nylon material? And do you have any idea what colors you will make (white?) ? Thanks! Clay


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

The t-4 will also be the new nylon and they will be available in black white green and orange. Again we are looking at Sptetmber as when they will be available.


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## ronedog (Feb 27, 2003)

Nick,
Is there a way to tell if you have the new Nylon Turbs or the older poly(?) ones?

I only ask because I broke one today from my latest order which was supposed to be of the Nylon variety. It was only the first hit on this specific Turbo too. Was it a fluke that this one broke? I understand that they are not indestructible but one hit? I thought they might last a bit longer.

Anyone else break the new ones yet?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

If you got it from my internet site since I made the announcement they are nylon. That is about 2weeks ago.
The nylon ones are not shiny like the poly. If you take the broken one and try to bend the vanes the poly will break with about one or two bends the nylon are very difficult to bend and can be bent back and forth probably four or five times.
If you ordered from one of my dealers or distributors, they probably still have some polys in stock.

did you slice a vane from a direct hit or what?


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## ronedog (Feb 27, 2003)

I did order from your website after the annoucement so they must be the Nylon turbos. They do look a bit different from the Poly ones I was using before. 

It was a direct hit, so much for group tuning  , The vane is broke/sliced but still hanging on by a little bit, if I wiggle it too much I am sure it will fall off.

I was thinking of dabbing a bit of glue on to firm it back up. I suppose the balance would be off though, what do you think?


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## francis (Jan 18, 2003)

Nick, 

will a good FOC ( maybe 12-15 ) hurt the arrow flight at all when using the turbo nock?

is there a limit , being a min or max value when using turbos in regards to FOC? example, no less than "x" amount, and no more than "y" amount of foc?


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## nick snook (Jun 16, 2002)

FOC is less of a factor with turbos than conventional fletching 

I did an experiment a while back where I took an easton redline with a 60grain target tip and put about 100 grains on the back of the shaft . This should not have flown well at all, but it did.

Basically you can shoot lighter target tips and lighter broadheads and get good arrow flight.
If you want more detailed info go to our website www.turbonock.com and click on tuning tips. you will be able to ask the Team member what their best setups are. 

This is a photo of the group I shot with back heavy arrows.
I broke one. this was at 20yds


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