# Pse Rep Called My Dealer



## TomG (Dec 4, 2002)

I'm sure the same thing any good engineering company would do: keeping in touch with the competition, all of it...

I'm sure you have some PSE, Hoyt, Matthews or Bowtech bows laying around in your company...

I would only take this as a compliment... I do not really understand why the angry smiley...

TomG


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## qualitymilk1 (Apr 23, 2004)

*Hmmmmm.....*

Concept,

I like TomG's post. This happens a lot in the chemical industry too! We are constantly asked to send in competitive samples of product (or equipment) to let R&D look at it. Usually to make a similar product. My guess is they are lookin at your design, and lookin for ideas. Either that, or bootleggin'!  I would be more concerned if they were coming in to the dealership, and trying slam out your product line. Just my 2 cents. 

BTW, I agree with TomG if they are lookin for design ideas, then you should see as a compliment. I would say you got 'em worried a bit.

Good luck,

Damon


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## psychobowz (Feb 25, 2004)

I would agree, take it as a good sign, I know PSE had a bow 4 years ago that was 98% let-off, but the engineers could keep it from falling apart at full draw, so maybe they are just trying to see how you did it.


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## concept (Aug 27, 2003)

TomG said:


> I'm sure the same thing any good engineering company would do: keeping in touch with the competition, all of it...
> 
> I'm sure you have some PSE, Hoyt, Matthews or Bowtech bows laying around in your company...
> 
> ...


Tom,no i do not have any other brand in my place other than Concept.Maybe i'm just a little old fashioned.I have worked darn hard to get what little i have,and done so with out other companies help.


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## MoNofletch (Jul 28, 2003)

PSE owns most of the archery pattens anyway! They are probably going to try and get some $$ out of you on some copyright infringement. Just kidding!!
Look what happend to Champion and a host of other small companies!
"I thought of it first!"....."No, I did!"....................
I think they like your ideas and are thinking 'why didn't we think of that?'
OR maybe the rep wants to shoot a good bow!!


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## Jim C (Oct 15, 2002)

DougK said:


> I think most of the top companies keep tabs on each other-and examine and test each others equipment. If I was Concept, I would be flattered someone thought enough of your product to be interested in it-even if it was a competitor.



true, I know that when I was having elbow problems aggravated by a stiff riser I like, a good friend who works for one of the other major bow companies was able to suggest a softer riser he knew I had access to.

IF I were trying to convince someone to buy my brand of bow I sure think it would be helpful to be able to have an informed basis to compare it to another one


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## Friar Tuck (Nov 18, 2004)

*Pse*

In every single aspect of business you have to be able to sell your product line to your customers, including end users and dealers. They probably have Hoyt, Mathews, Merlin, etc etc in their premises for a number of reasons. R&D, comparisons to their bows etc etc.

I work in the motor vehicle industry and we obtain new product line from other companies to enable a selling point comparison to be done. When they are pushing their bowline they will sell the strongpoints of their bow compared to the competition. 

Being competition is a good thing and PSE are doing their job in looking at your bows - maybe the REP is pissed because he has lost sales to Concept recently and wants to know why, I would.


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## Bo Hunter (Apr 15, 2003)

I would have guessed two things:

1. Looking for patent infringements. This is very real. If you did not consult a patent attorney before selling your bows, you could be in very real danger. You may be old fashioned, but PSE is in the business to make money. They don't care if you came up with your designs in your basement without ever seeing a PSE, or their host of patents. If you have features on that bow they have patented, you will pay...

2. Design Ideas - they are looking to your bows for design ideas. They may be looking for patentable ideas that you didn't realize were patentable. They may be looking to licence ideas from you, or possibly even buy patent rights so they can market it and make a fortune.

Those are my two guesses...

I wouldn't be to worried, but ignorance of their patents, is not an excuse to use them without paying royalties....

Bo


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## concept (Aug 27, 2003)

*maybe bo hunter*

We did exhaustive searchs into patents,and i can tell you that we don't cross over on any patent.Our 99% let off system is our own and no one else has even came close to it. Our dual cam uses a format never used by any one else in the industry.What.


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## Bo Hunter (Apr 15, 2003)

I was actually thinking more about riser design etc. For instance, from what I recall, whether they were the first to use it or not, PSE holds (or held) the patent on the cutout riser for broadhead clearance. Remember when the first risers came out with that feature? Stupid little items like that which are assumed common design feature, which companies actually have patents on....Cable guard locations or mounting mechanisms, manufacturing processes, cam/shim configurations, cable configurations, etc. etc.... 

No one around here carries Concept bows, so I've never gotten to shoot one, although I would like to... 99% letoff doesn't appeal that much to me, but that might be because I haven't shot one yet!

Considering they wanted two, I'd be guessing they are reverse engineering the bows and trying to find ideas they can use, possibly for free if your patent paperwork isn't in order.

Heck, either way, thats two more bows sold! Make sure they get full MSRP out of them!  

Bo

PS - Whatever happened to the Mono-Bow? That is supposed to be coming out this month or next right? March or so of 2005? That thread sort of died, and I haven't heard anything about it since. Let me know...


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## Jorge Oliveira (Aug 13, 2004)

In my area of work, before purchasing say an oscilloscope, I would call Tektronix and ask about HP equipment.
Thy knew all the negative points of it.

Then I would call HP and ask about Tektronix equipment.
Same as above.

Then, I could take an unbiased decision...


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## KEN-813 (Jun 26, 2002)

Almost every bow manufacture does this I think our shop has sent bows to almost all of them in over the last 20 years,  PSE does do it alot, nothing wrong with it, happens in alot of competitive product markets, they use them for testing, posible patent infringments, to disect them to see why they work or dont work, they test them just like thier own bows for the most part, always good to know what the other guy is doing, also helps in marketing pros and cons of other Bow co. features vs your own.

How many cam 1/2 Hoyts do you think mathews has ?  for testing and to compair systems  I bet more then alot of pro shops have on thier walls   
Ken


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## toxo (Jun 19, 2002)

*Concept bows*

All of the above...........just doing business the old fashioned American way.........copy it then make it 10% different!!!


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## Sagittarius (May 22, 2002)

Concept,

Stewart Bowman (bowmanbows.com) has had lots of manufacturers borrow bows to study from him over the years.
Stewart doesn't mind one bit and always complies.
Happens all the time, like mentioned above.
Maybe PSE will see a feature they like on your bow and make you an offer to share it.
Sure, they may copy it but you shouldn't worry for now.
I know, easy for me to say.  


Sag.


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## cath8r (Jan 17, 2003)

"Copy it then make it 10% different" that would just be PSE being PSE.


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## concept (Aug 27, 2003)

*X*

Ttt


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## hessvl (Sep 20, 2004)

I agree, PSE's been doing it for years, I will never own PSE equipment EVER?


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## ar34shooter (Jan 27, 2004)

*guys*

Pse, has been doing this way longer than mathews, do you really think they have to copy anyone?Plus look at the Archery Research bow, mmmmmmmmmmm, it s hurting mathews right now, more nad more shooters that shoot the AR line wind up getting a AR.hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. wonder why.I have shot the outback just to feel the bow, not a bad bow, Id say all mathews needs to work on is a grip.AR has made a great bow, and every year made it even better, then brought it to the PSE bows.If you havent shot a AR bow try it , you may just like it.


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## robk (Jun 10, 2002)

your doing soemthign right it seems and they are looking to see what you do and if they do something to make it work better that is what everyone seems to do in the world of archery case in questiont he cps cam from darton. hoyt figured out a way to make it work differently and they are paying for their newer model as the originator was darton.
it happens in all walks of the sport life in fishing and in boats in cars and everything.
for me if they took it i would say maybe they like what i am doing and want to try it out and see what you did to make it happen.
on the other hand if it a court case they are thinking about just do what everone else does if there is a court decision pay a little roylaity and keepp on plugging along man the best thign to do is ride it out 
rob k


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## concept (Aug 27, 2003)

*pse*

ttt


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## crazy horse (Nov 4, 2002)

PSE not coping bows, who are you kidding. My PSE rep came into the shop several years ago with to sample bows to show me, a Carrera and a Durango.
He then began to state how closely they copied Mathews Ultra and MQ1, I believe his quote was "we put their bows in a copy machine and spit out a PSE" it was at this time that I decided to sell Mathews, why sell a copy when you can get the original for the same price or cheaper?
If I were Concept I would look for PSE to have a high let off bow, just hope they come up with their own idea and not just copy it.


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## preyquester (Feb 3, 2004)

if i were you i would start to sweat.& dont bend over..take all your bows & hide them..something bad is about to drop on you....this dont look good.....


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## psychobowz (Feb 25, 2004)

This is my last post for this thread, as this is turning into more of a PSE bashing thread than anything else, and I am starting to wonder if this is the women's gossip board.
Let's state a very obvious fact that without PSE, archery would not be where it is today, they were the first to CNC machine bows, without companies like PSE archery would not be where it is today, it would be a stale example of sports.
If you want good examples of copying, just look at the fishing industry.
As for crazy horse's statment of putting the mathews bows in a copying machine, PSE does not own such a machine, so perhaps there are some valid and interesting things being posted on this thread, but it seems to me that there is just as much BS.
I'm outta here, have fun with your gossip session.


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## Africanbowhunter (May 29, 2003)

At the SHOT SHOW & ATA show two oriental guys go around and buy 2 of everything they dont even know what they were they took 8 of our free Tinks Scent bombs ( They are made in China anyway) just to rip off


I had a neignbor that Moved to Korea and makes $200K a year looking for high tech Products for firms like SONY DAE WOO etc to rip off.

If I were you i would not sell them one my 2 cents

PSE ain't going to offer you anything but a summons


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## midskier (Feb 10, 2005)

new to archery , new to this site , registered today , 

1. concept do you have a web site I can look @ ?

2. in a local Chicago PSE shop just yesterday looking for something new 
for my wife. and the sales guy was telling me about the dealer show in Indy and about a bow with 99% let off!!!
I really like the original stuff 

makes me wonder.......


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

*Pse*

Will be looking for patent infringements and if they can make a 99% bow and feel they can make money. They will and they will get away with it. Unless you have the lawyers to fight them.

Not the first time they have done this.


Springy rest was designed by another guy. PSE placed it on there bows and never paid royalities.

Patents are a joke


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## Bowhuntxx78 (Oct 7, 2003)

*midskier*

midskier,

Here ya go, try this......

http://www.conceptarchery.com/


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