# How would this work?



## erdman41 (May 6, 2009)

Spirals and a little short stringing will do it.


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

Thanks for the reply. Will the spirals still perform close to the same?


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

Yes it's doable, rather easily. I know several shooters who have done similar setups; harness lengths and strand counts will get what you need, depending on where you fall in the DL range it may be best to change cam size as to keep rotation in a little better state


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## montigre (Oct 13, 2008)

Also you can tinker with limb deflections if you'd prefer to keep stock harness lengths; has the same effect with easier tuning. I'm currently holding 16.4# with a DW at 40# running spirals on my PCE. There's no loss of performance and the smoothness of the cams remains the same.


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

This idea may be the answer I was looking for. Possibly moving the mods to a half inch longer draw, and shortening the string will get the 65% let off down to 50%?


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

montigre said:


> Also you can tinker with limb deflections if you'd prefer to keep stock harness lengths; has the same effect with easier tuning. I'm currently holding 16.4# with a DW at 40# running spirals on my PCE. There's no loss of performance and the smoothness of the cams remains the same.


Do you use a lighter deflection so the limb bolts are all the way in? Currently I'm shooting 60# limbs, turned out to 54#.


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

What rig and cams are you working with?


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

I'm working with a 40" ata OK DST with large cams and #1 mods at 28". I also have C mods. This is something I was pondering with the Pro Comp I just sold also.


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## montigre (Oct 13, 2008)

MikeR said:


> Do you use a lighter deflection so the limb bolts are all the way in? Currently I'm shooting 60# limbs, turned out to 54#.


Yes. Not something I'd play with if the bow had solid limbs though...


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## bigHUN (Feb 5, 2006)

*move the Cam timing towards the valley*

OK Absolute 38 and also I have done this with my DST40
#57.5 is my comfort shooting/practicing FITA and Field and I like to hold about 24 lbs, this with modified timing on Cams and 70% letoff modules (the stock 70% would give me about 17 lbs holding that feels like a pudding).
On my 60% letoff modules I have a default 25 lbs and once I over twisted my cables and by coincidence I got the holding weight about 28 lbs, quickly I had to back it down....
I like to hold about 23.4-24 lbs
Either you go custom length cables, this for case you can not put more/less twists but when you move out the Cams timing you can stop the holding weight before the valley, something like the diagram below. I made this on my draw board. You can see you can save maybe 1" from your total draw length if you stop the Cams before the valley. Also, you will be faster, from "back" wall the Cams will first slow down before the speed comes, not with advancing the Cams...


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

with that system there isn't so much you can get away with due to cam style. Custom harness lengths, upped strand counts/larger cross-sectional dia's at the stops, and some tweaking will get you closer.


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

Thanks for the responses. I had to take a break and move some snow. When I posed the question, I was wondering if there would be a market demand. I see more seniors shooting competition. But now with the responses, I see that it is easy enough to modify existing cams and not suffer performance reduction. 
Currently I have 60# and 70# limbs for the Ok. (I bought this one from Daniel Boone). Would it be best to get a set of 50# limbs if I want to take it down to 46-48# and continue to shoot 2712's with 300 gn tips.


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## Rick! (Aug 10, 2008)

N7709K said:


> Yes it's doable, rather easily. I know several shooters who have done similar setups; harness lengths and strand counts will get what you need, depending on where you fall in the DL range it may be best to change cam size as to keep rotation in a little better state


Hmmm, interesting. I took some hints from earlier threads (no pun intended) and had some new threads made with more strands on the buss cable and it helped holding weight a bit. I don't like the under rotation of putting the draw stop in the "55%" hole on my PCE XL with 3.0's. What's a good starting recipe for bringing my current holding weight of 19lbs up to about 21lbs (64% to 60%) without my bomar shaving my control cable?


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## bigHUN (Feb 5, 2006)

MikeR said:


> ...Currently I have 60# and 70# limbs for the Ok. (I bought this one from Daniel Boone). Would it be best to get a set of 50# limbs if I want to take it down to 46-48# and continue to shoot 2712's with 300 gn tips.


I have brought the DW down to 51 lbs and still some thread is remaining...Now what cams you have there, also can't remember did you meant DST40 or an other model bow was that?
Also, just a reminder, you lower the poundage you will exit from a spine comfort zone, for indoors you still in the safe level but for outdoors you may expect flyiers...
about lowering the DW....I had two surgeries since September and now struggling with mid 40ish lbs on other bow to pull just 2-3 times for exercise, the biggest surprise was >>>>my arrows bouncing out from my spyderweb target block.....kind of pissed, this is a huge drop for me, in August I was shooting/practicing every day a full FITA 144 + arrows with #57.5


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

Yes it is a DST40. It's a couple years old but shoots like a dream. For out doors I've been shooting ACG 480 with 100 gn points. Is there a recommended maximum number of turns when lowering the dw on 
an OK bow?


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## bigHUN (Feb 5, 2006)

MikeR said:


> Yes it is a DST40. It's a couple years old but shoots like a dream. For out doors I've been shooting ACG 480 with 100 gn points. Is there a recommended maximum number of turns when lowering the dw on
> an OK bow?


I just know one thing from the compound book, you turn the screws down equally no more then 1.5 turn difference between the two...I always do one and one and again...until the screw end is visible in the brass "nut" you are on the safe side...


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

Thanks BigHUN, I appreciate the feedback, I'll crank it down some till I see the end of the limb bolt in the brass nut. I am hesitant to tinker with it, as it is shooting fantastic as it is. Just looking for more practice and less tired old muscles.


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## Pete53 (Dec 5, 2011)

mike , i purchased on archery talk from uncle gus a nice used vantage elite plus with spirals that`s 30-40 lb`er,i have bow at 40 lb.s and spirals set on the 55 % letoff,its really fun to shoot,but it will not shoot any 27 shaft very consistent.but it does shoot fatboy 500`s well and 2512 aluminums good also. i am now going to try 3 in. vanes on the 2512`s because they should be more maintience free. i hope ? jim g. shot my bow thought its plenty fast enough for indoors. this age thing: won`t be long we will be back at 10 yards shoot`n with our young grandkids ! have a great thankgiving and god bless ! Pete53


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## MikeR (Apr 2, 2004)

I hope you and your family have a Great Thanksgiving also. 
I went to 4" vanes on the 2712's last year, I can't detect any difference in consistency from the feathers, but durability and cost favor the vanes. 
I was fishing for discussion about, lower let off and a more gradual power hump. I was wondering if many other seniors, (who like to practice often) are finding ways to extend their practice sessions.
LOL on the 10 yards!
Mike


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Older and...well, I don't know about wiser, but today's bows are so fast we can turn them down into the 50/55 pound range and shoot a bunch. One Bowtech I had for Indoor drew 47 pounds.

Having the property to have 3 practice ranges (1 is optional), two indoor ranges within 20 miles of home and retired I can practice all I want and sometimes 3 or 4 times a day. But 10 yards....only twice in the last month and right at 280 fps probably isn't all that conductive for 10 yards...And stuck in my hard head is just where does a does a arrow really settle down? I think one ragged hole accuracy, but shoot it where it's at, don't adjust what is perfect where it counts, 20 yards down range. 
I'm more into 3D and 25 yards is my "go for the 1 1/2" diameter bonus point" and farther is get it close, but stay in the 10. The ASA State Championship this year, for Super Seniors, averaged right at 35 yards per target. 2 of 30 were 23 and 25 yards, if I remember correctly.


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## kballer1 (Aug 31, 2010)

If you want to drop weight I would go down in limb deflection, it is the easiest way.


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## Pete53 (Dec 5, 2011)

since you are fishing for that answer: yep my lower poundage at 40 lb.s and 55 %. i can now shoot alot more indoors and don`t seem to tire nor hurt as much in mourning after and my valley is much easier also. i do have a 40 lb. barnsdale target bow with 55% letoff also that bow really has a very little nice valley. i just may go back to my barndale bow ? the eric kanne shoot is early march at our club this winter you and cary should come? and again happy thanksgiving ! Pete53


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