# Is Field Archery a dieing sport?



## TNMAN (Oct 6, 2009)

*is field dead?*

Looks pretty dead today. Maybe it's the snow. Could be the superbowl.

Seriously, you are right. Both ranges in Jackson, MS are forever gone, covered by houses. One range left in MS, and three in TN. Same thing everywhere except maybe the east coast states. NFAA field has always flown under the radar with little advertisement. Field is not easy. It takes a lot of work to shoot decent. If you don't own the land like Keowee in Clemson does, you won't keep it. Not sure what the answer is and I have searched and read similar threads in this forum. Glad to see one hard working bunch in NW Tennesse building a new range and are putting on shoots this coming year.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

It is just like everything else archery related. We used to have huge #s of shooters at state 3D and indoor shoots....not anymore. 

It isn't just field....it isn't the mid 80s anymore. There are a lot more things that people do now....but yes 3D is king now attendance wise. 

You all have to actually schedule the shoots to make people interested in the shoots....if I could only shoot one field shoot a year I wouldn't shoot it either :wink:


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## Jbird (May 21, 2002)

*Field Archery Demise?*

We just moved to Arkansas from New England. We have watched a slow decline there in Field Archery over the last few years but no more so than the decline in 3-D shoots. There seems to be a general decline in outdoor archery with indoor holding it's own. I think it is because it takes a lot more preparation and practice to be competitive outdoors and that practice is harder to arrange for this new "instant gratification" generation. Now that we have retired to our cabin in Arkansas the picture is really dismal. There is not one single field archery course in Arkansas that we have been able to find and evidently there hasn't been in years. We can't even find evidence of 3-D shoots or indoor leagues within a reasonable drive from Mena, AR. Looks like we will have to travel to NE Texas and NW Louisiana to try to shoot a few field shoots. Sadly our fishing rods and four wheelers will get a lot more use than our bows.
Jbird


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## TNMAN (Oct 6, 2009)

Jbird, It's about 6 hours from Mena to west TN shoots, and you are sure welcome. I think Bossier City still has an active club in Red River Bowmen.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

many many reasons.

monetary rewards for participating. that in itself creates it's own seperate issues. pencil pushin, the silly scoring line games, people that think they can make a career out of winning $4.00 every other month.

the so-called 'quicker target game'. i can shoot 116 arrows in the same amount of time it takes me to shoot 30 (ibo course) on my club's shoot days. where is the time 'savings' in that? but hey, 3D IS the quicker game....right? in a perfect world, it is. 5 mins for a group of 4 to shoot, as per the rules. takes one person that much time to get just one arrow into the target.

it's more appealing to the 'nintendo generation' low effort, immediate results.

then comes the 'group hug generation' where awards have to reach far into the ranks of the mediocre scores. notice i said scores, not shooters. even good shooters have a bad day. my personal feeling is that only the money classes should get awarded money and ONLY down to 3 or 5 places. keeps the purse levels high enuff to keep people coming back. paying the under 18 amateurs can seriously impact college eligibility should they choose to participate at the collegiate level.

the grand illusion of how low maintenance a 3D course is. ok, sure it is. you dont have to keep the lanes super clear, i'll give em that. now include the work needed to place targets every week/month, marking walking paths, staking the target and making sure the lanes are fairly clear and then removing the stakes and targets afterwards. compare that to a field course. clearing the lane and placing the bale is hard work, no illusion there. the advantage comes from only having to mow the lane and prune the sides and overhead once a month. the bales and stakes get checked every now and then and replaced/moved when needed. lanes are clear and easily marked. uprfront costs are about the same but the maintenance costs are much more advantageous for a field course.
unfortunately, there are some that feel it's their right to remove the field stakes and topple the bales because it 'corrupts' the 3D course. just because the 3D target is between the bale and the 50yd stake doesnt mean it's 50yds. a good target set can really mess with your head even with reference points.

clubs that once had many attendees for their shoots whether fun or awarded have seen drop offs in numbers. big fish little pond guys, economy and families re-evaluating their recreation time and funds, the older generation getting too old to do the work and the courses and clubs suffer.


i'll shoot most any round but given the choice between a field round or a fita round and a petting zoo course, i would choose the quantity of arrows. i'll support my club in their shoot formats but to say 3D is the ONLY round is wrong.


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## JawsDad (Dec 28, 2005)

Jbird said:


> We just moved to Arkansas from New England. We have watched a slow decline there in Field Archery over the last few years but no more so than the decline in 3-D shoots. There seems to be a general decline in outdoor archery with indoor holding it's own. I think it is because it takes a lot more preparation and practice to be competitive outdoors and that practice is harder to arrange for this new "instant gratification" generation. Now that we have retired to our cabin in Arkansas the picture is really dismal. There is not one single field archery course in Arkansas that we have been able to find and evidently there hasn't been in years. We can't even find evidence of 3-D shoots or indoor leagues within a reasonable drive from Mena, AR. Looks like we will have to travel to NE Texas and NW Louisiana to try to shoot a few field shoots. Sadly our fishing rods and four wheelers will get a lot more use than our bows.
> Jbird


I was in your neck of the woods (Mena, AR) just a few months ago.. Actually, you're not that far from plenty of 3D. Unfortunately, you are right about field though. We were talking about that at the last couple of indoor shoots. I've heard that there are no indoor or field ranges operating in Arkansas now and very little in the way of 3D. Being in Mena, you're not that far from the events that would be held in eastern Oklahoma. Tulsa would be a bit of a drive, but they are hosting more indoor events. Unfortunately they lost their field range to a fire if I remember right. Maybe someday they will get that going again. 


Here in Oklahoma there are only 2 active field ranges. One in Oklahoma City and one a little north of Tulsa in Bartlesville. I'm not sure if the Bartlesville range will be active this year or not. We will be trying to encourage more field events in the OKC area. We'll be holding the OSAA state shoot and then there will be a couple of additional field shoots throughout the year. Sadly, there just seems to be little interest in attending them. I'm not sure why though. People will spend the same time attending a 3D shoot and get 20-40 shots instead of the 100'ish they could get on a couple of field or field/hunter/animal rounds. :sad: But, like I said, we'll be working to try and encourage more field shooting around here. Hopefully it will be embraced by more over time.


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## garyb (Jan 5, 2007)

Keith,

I sure do remember the hey days at the range in Austin. And all the problems with the silly bird that lives in cedar trees. As so of the birders would try to make you believe that the oly place in the central tex the came to was the archery range. Their is only a small handfull of folks thst shoot feild archey here in Anchorage. But it is one of the most beautiful ranges anywhere. 

By the way we used to shoot a lot at the old Archery World shop with lee, nick and the bunch.

Gary


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## ursonvs (Sep 19, 2003)

i'm actually hoping for a rise in field archery here in manhattan, ks. when they get done with the archery range near the tuttle creek dam. from what i have heard there is going to be alot of nasty uphill and downhill shots along with hopefully a shot off of one of the spillways if we can get the engineers to agree with it.

I have plenty of 3-d, probably one of the best places for indoors except for the wichita group, but the closest place for me to shoot a round or field is close to 1.5 hours away at tri county rod and gun.


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## KStover (Jan 24, 2009)

*Thinking out loud*

Do you folks think that it would help if the NFAA changed the distances on the field course to meters and matched as many FITA distances as possible? What if our field course were setup with 18,30,40,50,60,70,90 meters etc..(wow they shoot 90 meters!) Do you think that we could get some of the FITA folks to start shooting our events? Remember that most major universities have an archery team/club. Here at U.T. they have several classes, compound bows and traditional shooters are common. The U.T. events draw as many shooters as our TFAA shoots do. It seems to me that the FITA shooters would enjoy our courses. I would think that it would be a lot more fun to shoot through the woods instead of shooting in a line in an open field.

Keith


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## garyb (Jan 5, 2007)

But I do think one of the problems with field archey also hase the manufactures to blame. They all got real big on the 3d support one of witch is the ease of setting up a 3d range and sponsership programs. They other problem was local clubs not doing what they could to be more open to more of the average joe and jill hunter. And all the way up to the NFAA for some time. But take the average joe hunter that wants to shoot 3d out on a field course and see that they really should spend more time on a field course to make their 3d even better.


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## garyb (Jan 5, 2007)

Don't change the rules at all. We can already shoot fita in a compound class. They can come and shoot our field round. Its about all from the local club up to the NFAA making them feel welcome. But it does come back to all these so called shooters that have some kind of factory sponserships. How are they promoting the overal sport of archery. 99% of them do not do anything past the 3d range for all of archery. They have this thing about shooting spots. I see so many with these so call factory shooters would never show up to anything but a 3d shoot.


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## CherryJu1ce (Feb 25, 2005)

Field archery has declined significantly, especially here in New York. Even as recently as 10 years ago, there were field courses all over the state, and we used to have 200-300 shooters at our outdoor State Championship. Field courses are closing as 3D is gaining interest, and the last two years we've had 66 and 70 shooters respectively. 

It's a frickin shame, too, because field archery is simply awesome. In fact, I look forward to outdoors WAY MORE than I look forward to 20 yards, simply because indoors gets boring after a while. It's really a vicious cycle...people lose interest, field courses close, those people that would like to shoot don't have anywhere to practice, they lose interest, etc...

Maybe field archery is dying because it's so much more difficult to excel at?


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## swbuckmaster (Dec 20, 2005)

target archers are a rare breed relativity speaking. There are far more hunters! 
Being a hunter first and a target archer second I fell in love with the 3d thing. I however have fell in love with field archery and prefer to shoot it instead of 3d. 

3d is expensive to shoot and the practice you get from field is way better if you are a hunter! I think the way you get more people involved in field is offering a combined course. I shot one last year and it was tons of fun. It was the color country shoot in utah. It was the best shoot by far I have ever shot.

If you wanted to shoot it you had to shoot 3d first, v formation with field targets 20-60 then 65-25 on the way back. They also through in a twist they had you shoot another style of shoot. ill explain, you shoot two or three ends at 40 yards and two or three ends 50 then shoot two or three ends at 60. they then get your final score and pair you up against shooters of your similar ability and have a shoot off single elimination to see who is the last one standing. all the shooting at the field type of targets teaches the 3d shooter it is just as fun, you get more shots, and it is cheaper to shoot! 

The best part was my 8 year old daughter wanted to shoot the elimination round but was totally handicapped with the distances they were shooting at. so The shoot organizers let her shoot at 15-20-25 yards tally her score and let here shoot against the guys with similar score. It was awesome and when my daughter shot her first couple of arrows she was ahead. She ended up shooting a flier and was eliminated but you should have seen her reaction. She told me she would get him next year.


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## jarlicker (Jul 29, 2002)

Here at DCWC in Morrisville, NC. we have been blessed with a tremendous increase in membership the past two years with mostly families very interested in shooting archery are joining. This sportsman club has a huge amount to offer members. The archery has until recently been just a small part of the club. With over 300 new memberships with archery being listed as the main reason for join the club After ten years of constructing a great facility it has paid off. Now our goal is to turn these new recreational shooters into field archers. Entry level price point into the sport has most people starting off in the recurve disaplines. As people get more serious about wanting to shoot the field course many are starting to transition over to compound. Lack of a very good retail archery shop holds alot of these people back. With all the area shop gearing there sales towards hunters it makes it hard for a new target type archer to get set up properly to start off.
20 - 50 pound bows and weaker spined arrows are just not found in the area stores.
I am just thrilled to see the huge interest in archery being generated in this area of NC. I pray for this to continue.
DCWC is an awesome place to play!
Come check us out at this years Archery Extraviganza May 1 & 2. We will be offering up a full field complement of Field, Hunter, Animal, 600 Target rounds and 3D targets to keep everyone occupied. This we be a great warm up leading into DCWC hosting the NFAA SE Outdoor Sectional later on in the month.
The word has gotten out we know how to keep archery fun for every one that comes to shoot here in NC.


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## garyb (Jan 5, 2007)

Their is nothing more fun than spending the a few hours out on the feild range than a hour 1/2 on the 3d. besides I have never seen a bunch of guys anilyze a 25 yard shot on a animal 3d that they have shot 100rds of time b4 so long. But for sure here in Alaska its awsome to be out at midnight during the summer and shooting. But doing the red or blue range very early in the morning during the spring in austin was a blast too.


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## jrip (May 19, 2008)

The only field archery around here is when I spend a couple hours every morning with the "old farts" at the club shooting the NFAA field course every morning during the summer months. I wish there was a field archery competition here, I would love that.


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## KStover (Jan 24, 2009)

*good ideas*

swbuckmaster – sounds like the Cedar City Archers are thinking “out of the box”. I’d like to know more about their shoot.

jarlicker – “With over 300 new memberships with archery being listed as the main reason for joining the club.”.. NOW THAT IS IMPRESSIVE! Does your club have a website?

Folks I think that ideas, like swbuckmaster and jarlicker shared, are what we all need to be doing to save this great sport.
I plan on inviting the U.T. archery club to a few of our shoots. Maybe even let them shoot for free.


Keith


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

KStover said:


> Do you folks think that it would help if the NFAA changed the distances on the field course to meters and matched as many FITA distances as possible? What if our field course were setup with 18,30,40,50,60,70,90 meters etc..(wow they shoot 90 meters!) Do you think that we could get some of the FITA folks to start shooting our events? Remember that most major universities have an archery team/club. Here at U.T. they have several classes, compound bows and traditional shooters are common. The U.T. events draw as many shooters as our TFAA shoots do. It seems to me that the FITA shooters would enjoy our courses. I would think that it would be a lot more fun to shoot through the woods instead of shooting in a line in an open field.
> 
> Keith


No.....this isn't FITA.....changing to meters would do absolutely NOTHING.....

hell 80% of the people that don't shoot field have worries or fears about the targets over 40 yds anyway.......throwing them out to 90m would give them a heart attack.....

plus you would have to change all courses.....

your looking to pull recurve shooters....which still isn't really that big in the US.....most of their compound shooters already shoot field.....if they don't it's because there is none in their area.


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## jarlicker (Jul 29, 2002)

DCWC.net

WE are going to total redo the archery section of the websight in the very new future. We have so many young people utilizing the archery facilities. I have a 14 year old computer wiz redo the entire thing. We have a pile of high tech ******** to look over his shoulder. I am trying to promote to the younger people


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## Scott.Barrett (Oct 26, 2008)

Our first scheduled field tourney is this upcoming Saturday in Florida....Within a 2 hour drive, we will have something to shoot every weekend for the rest of the year! For us, the International Round and 900 round is probably the most popular on the target side, and there is always some 3D somewhere....


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## FaT Archer (Jul 21, 2006)

anyone can shoot field in the NFAA or NAA, all you need to do is get a conversion chart, yards to meters. also in FITA field on the first day you shoot an unnarked round out to 60 meters, the second day is marked you shoot out to 65 meters, in fita field you only shoot 3 arrows and 24 targets.
the 90 meter shoot is fita target they shoot 90 70 50 30.


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## Scott.Barrett (Oct 26, 2008)

FaT Archer said:


> anyone can shoot field in the NFAA or NAA, all you need to do is get a conversion chart, yards to meters. also in FITA field on the first day you shoot an unnarked round out to 60 meters, the second day is marked you shoot out to 65 meters, in fita field you only shoot 3 arrows and 24 targets.
> the 90 meter shoot is fita target they shoot 90 70 50 30.



Now that is the true dying sport....FITA Field!

I think the only reason we have it in Florida is because our NAA affiliation requires it....


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## FaT Archer (Jul 21, 2006)

this is true


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Simple solution, if everyone would just recruit a few new shooters each week/month/year then the numbers would go up. As the demand grows local clubs will take note, where there is demand there will be supply.
Having shoots like the Hillbilly, and the DCWC extravaganza are great tools for recruiting new shooters. I have yet to take anyone to a field shoot who didn't have a blast. Last year I introduced 3 new shooters to the game, and plan on at least doubling that this season. 

There was some talk among some of us last year about trying to put together a regional tour sort of like the IBO and ASA but those talks seem to have vanished. Something like this could just be the ticket. 3D shooters around the country all have large scale shoots to get together, and have a great time, field shooters are very limited. We have the HILL the, extravaganza, and outdoor nats. I would love to see a regional tour put together to hold 3-6 big field events like the Hillbilly, or the Extravaganza up the east coast. Hold 1 in each of the following states, PA, MD, VA, NC, GA, FL once that takes off other regions would take note. Eventually it could be broken down into smaller regions, 3 shoots per region for the regional championship IE north east triple crown, south east triple crown, ect.....
We need something to rival the ASA and IBO to give field shooters a reason to travel, get together, and make some noise. Just leave monetary awards out of it other than in the pro classes. Nothing will ruin a good game like offering money to amateur, classes just look at the joke 3d has become. Trophy only for AM classes to keep it honest.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

first big hurdle is a place to shoot.

second big hurdle is getting someone to understand their bow can shoot more than 50yds and that there is fun and camaraderie on a course.

third, people to realize that once the brain begins to associate the distance/size ratio, their 3D scores go up and their hunting skills improve. 

taking the participation awards out of the game will discourage many that make a living off the sport. yes, that is called sarcasm.....and the truth.

once you give some of the big fish/little pond shooters a dose of reality......they'll stop going and bad mouth the game, then they'll complain about how hard it is, how unrealistic of a skills test it is. keep in mind, a happy customer tells one, an unhappy/disgruntled customer tells EVERYONE.

i dont burn up a field course, i'm a mid 530's shooter on avg. i have my good days and i have my bad days. if i had a greater choice of courses to shoot, i might do better. i do have the desire to be tested and the drive to do better.




BOWGOD said:


> Simple solution, if everyone would just recruit a few new shooters each week/month/year then the numbers would go up. As the demand grows local clubs will take note, where there is demand there will be supply.
> Having shoots like the Hillbilly, and the DCWC extravaganza are great tools for recruiting new shooters. I have yet to take anyone to a field shoot who didn't have a blast. Last year I introduced 3 new shooters to the game, and plan on at least doubling that this season.
> 
> There was some talk among some of us last year about trying to put together a regional tour sort of like the IBO and ASA but those talks seem to have vanished. Something like this could just be the ticket. 3D shooters around the country all have large scale shoots to get together, and have a great time, field shooters are very limited. We have the HILL the, extravaganza, and outdoor nats. I would love to see a regional tour put together to hold 3-6 big field events like the Hillbilly, or the Extravaganza up the east coast. Hold 1 in each of the following states, PA, MD, VA, NC, GA, FL once that takes off other regions would take note. Eventually it could be broken down into smaller regions, 3 shoots per region for the regional championship IE north east triple crown, south east triple crown, ect.....
> We need something to rival the ASA and IBO to give field shooters a reason to travel, get together, and make some noise. Just leave monetary awards out of it other than in the pro classes. Nothing will ruin a good game like offering money to amateur, classes just look at the joke 3d has become. Trophy only for AM classes to keep it honest.


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## Kale (Jul 29, 2007)

garyb said:


> Their is nothing more fun than spending the a few hours out on the feild range than a hour 1/2 on the 3d. besides I have never seen a bunch of guys anilyze a 25 yard shot on a animal 3d that they have shot 100rds of time b4 so long. But for sure here in Alaska its awsome to be out at midnight during the summer and shooting. But doing the red or blue range very early in the morning during the spring in austin was a blast too.


haha this if funny.

I watched the field shoot that they have on the alternative2tv website and you want to talk about excessive glassing of the target wow...
You can see the bull with the naked eye at 80 yards...why glass it 5 times at the stake...

with a 3d target you have to pick a spot to shoot, not put your pin on big white dot...

I have shot some field, a couple rounds but not alot, I really enjoy it! Not many courses around Canada but I think there will be a few more here in alberta this summer..3d is the main game though


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

Kale said:


> haha this if funny.
> 
> I watched the field shoot that they have on the alternative2tv website and you want to talk about excessive glassing of the target wow...
> *You can see the bull with the naked eye at 80 yards...why glass it 5 times at the stake...*


yeah, but can you see the grouping patterns with the naked eye? if you glass the target and see everyone is shooting to the left/right you know there's something 'different' about the target. same with the highs/lows. lows you want to take a little less off the cut, highs, take a little more.



Kale said:


> *with a 3d target you have to pick a spot to shoot, not put your pin on big white dot...*


yeah, but can you do it 4 times in a row and actually hit what you're aiming at? first shot tells you if you got your cuts and bubble off right. second shot confirms it. the last 2 get done the same as the first or second shot. telling me that knowing the yardage and just put it on the dot is easy is almost insulting. form is more important than guessing. shooting skill is rewarded, not discredited.


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## willieM (Nov 18, 2007)

Kale, I would like to have your eyes, if a 5 inch white spot looks big at 55 to 80 yards. I have been shooting field archery for 30 years and that spot looks smaller every year.


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

rock monkey said:


> first big hurdle is a place to shoot.
> 
> second big hurdle is getting someone to understand their bow can shoot more than 50yds and that there is fun and camaraderie on a course.
> 
> ...




Well when we were talking last year we already had 3 locations on board capable of holding large scale shoots sure maybe not IBO large scale, but more than enough for 2-300 shooters.

I kinda agree, and disagree with the reward thought you have. Yes offering no cash will discourage those chest pounding "career" archers, but ask yourself this would it hurt your feelings if they didn't play? Those are the guys who have ruined 3d events for guys like you, and I just having a good time. Real archers know that a plaque or a trophy has much more worth than a check anyway. Once money becomes a part of AM level shooting the fun, and camaraderie take a back seat, the magic pencils come out, and the bickering, whining, BS steals the limelight. For many years I was a die hard 3d guy. We traveled to every IBO sanctioned shoot, the ASA shoots, ect...., and those are the things that ruined that game for me. It got to the point I no longer enjoyed shooting. I would still travel, but it was basically to hang out, and socialize on a national level. When I first attended the Hillbilly shoot 2 years ago (my first field shoot ever) I was taken back by the fun, and the fellowship. It reminded me of how the game used to be, it was almost nostalgic. That day on the Hill I fell back in love with archery, and fell in love with field. 

We need to take that feeling, and get it out to the masses. Get those guys who shoot 3d for the "right" reasons to check us out the fun, and fellowship will win them over as well. They'll tell their friends, their friends will tell there friends, ect....
The whole reason field doesn't have the numbers is because it lacks promotion. If the NFAA isn't going to promote it outside of Nationals then it is up to us to promote it. Start in your own backyard, then expand. With proper promotion a 3 star, or regional tour could really take off. Give archers a place to congregate, and spend the week end having fun with other archers from around the region, and they will come. Just look at the people who drive 9,10 20 hours 1 way just to shoot the Hillbilly each year. Take that format, and build on it. Every year the Hill introduces new archers to this game, have 3-6 shoots like the Hill each year your adding quite a few new shooters to the game. 
If none of the orgs are going to promote the game, and/or build the fan base then we the shooters need to or it will become the forgotten game. I had intrest in the game for many years before I ever tried it. The only thing that kept me away was lack of promotion. I never heard of any shoots, or ever met anyone who shot it. If it had been better promoted I would have made that switch years ago.


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## steve morley (Dec 24, 2005)

Field is alive and kicking in Europe, last years European champs,fully booked within 2 weeks of opening registration, World champs in Germany this year fully book 1 week after opening registration 6 months ago.

Many American Trad Bowhunters cant see the upside of shooting Field, even when you tell them their heros Howard Hill and Fred Bear honed their Bowhunting skills on the Field range they still cant see it. 

Nobody in Trad wants or feels the need to shoot past 20 yards, shooting 4 arrows per target out to 80y takes real discipline, for me 3D is fun but Field is where the real shooting challenge is. 

From the outside looking in Field looks kinda boring shooting at spots but eveybody Ive introduced into Field has enjoyed the challengeand the company, maybe run some combined half 3D round and half Field round events to temp people to try out Field rounds and it might generate some interest.


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## FitaX10 (Aug 1, 2002)

Here in Texas we have a sort of regional tour. We have a SYWAT (Shoot Your Way Across Texas) tour, both indoor and field. Much participation and a shooter of the year in both indoor and outdoor having to participate in several and taking your best and the first day at the State Championship. Seems to help and you get to see all your friends both old and new all summer long. 

The Tyler Archery Club built a new field range last summer, just 14 targets but have seen an increase in both field shooters and memberships. We are excited about the influx. We held a field league last summer after the state championship and had about 20 shooters with all saying they can't wait until spring to go to more shoots. I look forward to 2010.
Chris


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## KStover (Jan 24, 2009)

Brown Hornet said:


> No.....this isn't FITA.....changing to meters would do absolutely NOTHING.....
> 
> hell 80% of the people that don't shoot field have worries or fears about the targets over 40 yds anyway.......throwing them out to 90m would give them a heart attack.....
> 
> ...


Brown Hornet
I have to disagree with your last statement. At the TSAA Indoor Championship, held at U.T. last weekend, they had 126 shooters. 41 of them were shooting compounds, 16 barebow and 69 were shooting the normal FITA setup recurves. I dropped by to watch some of the event. I did not know a single person that was there, they do not shoot field archery. And yes there are two field courses within 40 miles of U.T..Their State Indoor tournament was right here in my home town and I did not know about it, until I looked at the U.T. Archery Club's website yesterday. This link shows the results and style of shooters at yesterdays tournament. 
http://www.texasarchery.org/Results/StateIndoor/SI2010.htm

It seems that the TSAA/FITA and the TFAA/NFAA shooters, in this area, just don't associate with each other. I plan on entering a few of the TSAA tournaments this year and getting to know some of them. I also plan on trying to get some of them to attend our TFAA/NFAA tournaments. We have lots of target shooters in this area but we're split up into two different crowds.

Keith


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## FitaX10 (Aug 1, 2002)

Not that they havent been invited and we (TFAA) been invited to their shoots as well. The TSAA puts on one of the best State Field (FITA) Championships ever and very few TFAA folks attend. I have been active in both organisations and have tried as well as many of the leadership of both organizations have to get folks to try the other game but not many seem to want to. Guess the animals are jsut too different. 
Chris


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## Limey (May 6, 2005)

steve morley said:


> Field is alive and kicking in Europe, last years European champs,fully booked within 2 weeks of opening registration, World champs in Germany this year fully book 1 week after opening registration 6 months ago.


I agree Steve.

Numbers in England (EFAA) are on the up. Perhaps it is because Steve left the country:wink:


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## CutTheLoop (Dec 26, 2007)

Brown Hornet said:


> It is just like everything else archery related. We used to have huge #s of shooters at state 3D and indoor shoots....not anymore.
> 
> It isn't just field...*.it isn't the mid 80s anymore*. There are a lot more things that people do now....but yes 3D is king now attendance wise.
> 
> You all have to actually schedule the shoots to make people interested in the shoots....if I could only shoot one field shoot a year I wouldn't shoot it either :wink:



What we need is another Rambo movie. :wink:

Maybe the next Robin Hood flick will give it a shot in the arm.


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## archerpap (Apr 24, 2006)

BOWGOD said:


> Well when we were talking last year we already had 3 locations on board capable of holding large scale shoots sure maybe not IBO large scale, but more than enough for 2-300 shooters.
> 
> I kinda agree, and disagree with the reward thought you have. Yes offering no cash will discourage those chest pounding "career" archers, but ask yourself this would it hurt your feelings if they didn't play? Those are the guys who have ruined 3d events for guys like you, and I just having a good time. Real archers know that a plaque or a trophy has much more worth than a check anyway. Once money becomes a part of AM level shooting the fun, and camaraderie take a back seat, the magic pencils come out, and the bickering, whining, BS steals the limelight. For many years I was a die hard 3d guy. We traveled to every IBO sanctioned shoot, the ASA shoots, ect...., and those are the things that ruined that game for me. It got to the point I no longer enjoyed shooting. I would still travel, but it was basically to hang out, and socialize on a national level. When I first attended the Hillbilly shoot 2 years ago (my first field shoot ever) I was taken back by the fun, and the fellowship. It reminded me of how the game used to be, it was almost nostalgic. That day on the Hill I fell back in love with archery, and fell in love with field.
> 
> ...



This would be great to see, but can most courses hande the number of shooters you are talking about. 300 guys on 1 course would take days to shoot, espically only 2 wide, and we know how you moaned about shooting 4 wide last year on a course that could handle it, along with 5 courses shooting at once. I for one, would be at these events, time allowing, but just remember the amount of time, people, and number of places that can accomidate these numbers.


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## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

archerpap said:


> This would be great to see, but can most courses hande the number of shooters you are talking about. 300 guys on 1 course would take days to shoot, espically only 2 wide, and we know how you moaned about shooting 4 wide last year on a course that could handle it, along with 5 courses shooting at once. I for one, would be at these events, time allowing, but just remember the amount of time, people, and number of places that can accomidate these numbers.


Absolutely. I've been working on the logistics in my head on this idea for probably a year or better and it will work, until it becomes amazingly popular and more than 224 shooters show up. Then the problems begin. 

However, I don't think that many people would show up to start with, so we would have a couple of years to figure the rest out, but I would like to have a plan in place before it got started.

The only way to really make it work in my mind would be to have a shotgun start in the morning and another group in the afternoon. That could accommodate 224 shooters on a 28 target course. Shoot Field on Sat and Hunter on Sunday with practice rounds open on Friday. 

Again, once it gets to 224, all that goes out the window.


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## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

Field shooting is on life support around here.


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## archerpap (Apr 24, 2006)

Spoon13 said:


> Absolutely. I've been working on the logistics in my head on this idea for probably a year or better and it will work, until it becomes amazingly popular and more than 224 shooters show up. Then the problems begin.
> 
> However, I don't think that many people would show up to start with, so we would have a couple of years to figure the rest out, but I would like to have a plan in place before it got started.
> 
> ...



Matt, this would work as long as there is 4 wide shooting. For 224 shooters to shoot 2 times per day(112/round) only shooting 2 wide on one 28 target range would probably run a little late, seeing there are no time restraints in field. 112 would be perfect numbers for that scenerio, but we don't live in a perfect world. Also remember tie breakers and shoot offs for late Sunday afternoon. I know in our immediate area, Mecahanicsburg is the only facility that could accomidate larger numbers. We have a good number of ranges here in Central PA, but they are only 1 28 target range, and some have really nice courses but are only 14 target ranges.


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

archerpap said:


> Matt, this would work as long as there is 4 wide shooting. For 224 shooters to shoot 2 times per day(112/round) only shooting 2 wide on one 28 target range would probably run a little late, seeing there are no time restraints in field. 112 would be perfect numbers for that scenerio, but we don't live in a perfect world. Also remember tie breakers and shoot offs for late Sunday afternoon. I know in our immediate area, Mecahanicsburg is the only facility that could accomidate larger numbers. We have a good number of ranges here in Central PA, but they are only 1 28 target range, and some have really nice courses but are only 14 target ranges.


2 wide or 4 wide really does not make that big of impact on time. When shooting 4 wide there are usually 2 on the stake spotting, and 2 shooting anyway. You mechanicsburg guys are just too hung up on that 4 wide shooting lol.
I've shot Mechanicsburg a few times. About half the times I shot there we shot 2 wide the other half we shot 4 wide. Every time though we finished in the same time frame didn't matter if we shot 2 or 4. 
On average it takes 4 hours give or take to shoot a 28 target course. Start 1 line at 8 am, and 1 line at 1 pm you can easily accommodate 2 groups a day. Even if it takes 5 hours groups at 7:30, and 1 would get the Job done.

But like spoon said it would take several years to get to the point where that would be needed. For the first few years it could easily run casual like the Hill. They get 100+ shooters through the course a day on casual registration, and everyone has fun.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

KStover said:


> Brown Hornet
> I have to disagree with your last statement. At the TSAA Indoor Championship, held at U.T. last weekend, they had 126 shooters. 41 of them were shooting compounds, 16 barebow and 69 were shooting the normal FITA setup recurves. I dropped by to watch some of the event. I did not know a single person that was there, they do not shoot field archery. And yes there are two field courses within 40 miles of U.T..Their State Indoor tournament was right here in my home town and I did not know about it, until I looked at the U.T. Archery Club's website yesterday. This link shows the results and style of shooters at yesterdays tournament.
> http://www.texasarchery.org/Results/StateIndoor/SI2010.htm
> 
> ...


I hear ya but of course I don't mean all of them....or even a ton in all areas of course. But there are a lot of people that do....and there are a lot of field shooters that shoot FITA. There are a lot of FITA people across the country that are shooting field now in general


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

*Is Field Archery a Dying Sport?*

Well, no doubt it has lost popularity. Here in Maryland we have seen a huge down-turn in attendance at shoots over the years. Hate to admit it... but I haven't helped.

IMHO there is *ONE* big reason we have seen Field participation decrease and clubs fold......

It is required by each member of a club to help maintain a Field range...

It is required by each club member to help run a shoot or paste targets...

It is necessary to set-up a bow...

It is necessary to fletch your own arrows...

It is necessary to develop and maintain your archery skills...

It is something most of us have precious little to give nowadays...

















*SPARE TIME............................*


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## Jbird (May 21, 2002)

*Deeper than That*

People make time for the things they love to do. The real question, for those who have shot Field Archery, is why don't you still love it? What drew you to the game that is no longer there? Back in the day people showed up for the fellowship, camped out, cooked out, and enjoyed being in the woods shooting their bow. At the end of the day they didn't burn rubber getting out of the parking lot, they sat around the camp fire with friends and shared stories, cooked hot dogs, and took time to live in the moment. If you are too busy to enjoy that then you are too busy to enjoy anything. It still works for me.
Jbird


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Jbird said:


> People make time for the things they love to do. The real question, for those who have shot Field Archery, is why don't you still love it? What drew you to the game that is no longer there? Back in the day people showed up for the fellowship, camped out, cooked out, and enjoyed being in the woods shooting their bow. At the end of the day they didn't burn rubber getting out of the parking lot, they sat around the camp fire with friends and shared stories, cooked hot dogs, and took time to live in the moment. If you are too busy to enjoy that then you are too busy to enjoy anything. It still works for me.
> Jbird


Very well said and is applicable to lots of other things as well.


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## X-Ray (Apr 3, 2004)

*glassing the target*



Kale said:


> haha this if funny.
> 
> I watched the field shoot that they have on the alternative2tv website and you want to talk about excessive glassing of the target wow...
> You can see the bull with the naked eye at 80 yards...why glass it 5 times at the stake...
> ...


fyi the target will tell you something. IE are most of the shots out to oneside? maybe there is a little hill that you have to deal with or wind. 
I have shot a lot of field archery and it isn't just looking at the yardage and shoot. I see most 3d guys get there eyes opened, most never come back because they didn't shoot very well. They usually say it is boring but the truth is they don't shoot it that well. 
I would like to see more people shoot it. usually it is the same 20 or so people.


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## archerycharlie (Nov 4, 2002)

Jbird said:


> People make time for the things they love to do. The real question, for those who have shot Field Archery, is why don't you still love it? What drew you to the game that is no longer there? Back in the day people showed up for the fellowship, camped out, cooked out, and enjoyed being in the woods shooting their bow. At the end of the day they didn't burn rubber getting out of the parking lot, they sat around the camp fire with friends and shared stories, cooked hot dogs, and took time to live in the moment. If you are too busy to enjoy that then you are too busy to enjoy anything. It still works for me.
> Jbird


I remember shooting field as a teenager with my recurve. Every sunday some where year round no matter how hot or how cold or how deep the snow was.
Always had a big fire going to roast hotdogs and visit with folks. Now days it hit the range and git r done as quick as possibale and on to something else. Everyone wants to shoot but no one want to stay and help or come out on a work day to helpout. We closed out local club a few years ago as only 2 or 3 guys to work and keep range clean and running. We even tried the half field and half 3d and cut the field back to only 50 yds and they still would not like it. So we sold all the 3d targets and shut the club down and had several people complain as to why we closed it down. No one stepped up to run and make it work or help make it work. I think there are still 3 active field ranges here in indiana. 2 i think have 28 targets and 1 has a 14 targets range. 1 has room for several ranges as they did back in the hayday of field. AC


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## archerpap (Apr 24, 2006)

Why not see what for clubs out there are available, get some addresses to mail a flyer out to see if they are interested, and try to come up with something until late summer arrives. Even if you can get 5/6 clubs interested and involved with it, it's a start. Name it the Mid-Atlantic Field/Hunter Challange or something like that(just seems that most courses are one the East Coast), and see who may want to jump on board. If you can get 2 shoots a month it will allow for more travel time and people to come out and try it, and hopefully it would take off.


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

Jbird said:


> People make time for the things they love to do. The real question, for those who have shot Field Archery, is why don't you still love it? What drew you to the game that is no longer there? Back in the day people showed up for the fellowship, camped out, cooked out, and enjoyed being in the woods shooting their bow. At the end of the day they didn't burn rubber getting out of the parking lot, they sat around the camp fire with friends and shared stories, cooked hot dogs, and took time to live in the moment. If you are too busy to enjoy that then you are too busy to enjoy anything. It still works for me.
> Jbird


I think most of us still enjoy Field archery. IMO many just don't have the time anymore. You have to admit...it takes a great deal of time to practice, prepare, help at your local club, etc. This creates a problem for many archers, especially those with families. So, when it comes to picking leisure time activities that don't require tons of time and preparation...Field archery just doesn't make the cut.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

mdbowhunter said:


> Well, no doubt it has lost popularity. Here in Maryland we have seen a huge down-turn in attendance at shoots over the years. Hate to admit it... but I haven't helped.
> 
> IMHO there is *ONE* big reason we have seen Field participation decrease and clubs fold......





mdbowhunter said:


> It is required by each member of a club to help maintain a Field range...


that's a club membership rules issue. when you joined the club, you were informed of, or given a set of the club's rules. you agreed. it's more about the bigger issue of "what's in it for ME?" attitude people have in general. look at who does the work at the club....what's in it for THEM?



mdbowhunter said:


> It is required by each club member to help run a shoot or paste targets...


so what is so hard about working the kitchen? running the grill, offering to do the shopping for the club? you dont have to mow the grass, paste and hang targets or perform grounds maintenance. just help in some way. there are people out there who find mowing a relaxing activity, find out who they are and ask if they'll be the lawn mower man. some people have a knack for the kitchen aspect. how about the building maintenance? just do something beneficial for the club. ask if someone can create a webpage for the club. find someone that is willing to do the public relations stuff like making and advertising the shoot. i'm sure there are people with a gift for getting local businesses to contribute to the club either by sponsoring/advertising or donating goods/services to the club. hey...maybe there's a guy with a lawn care business you could compensate with free membership and advertising space to him and any employee that takes care of the grounds. it doesnt take a whole lot of time to paste a target to a sheet of cardboard. if you do just one target a day you'll have a full course in a month. if there's 2 people that volunteer to do it, that increases the productivity. the more people you ask if they have a preference of help activity the more they'll feel appreciated. the more they feel appreciated, the more they'll do. the more people that help leaves less to be done.



mdbowhunter said:


> It is necessary to set-up a bow...


no it's not. you chose to have a seperate bow. you can use hunting equipment on a field course. that clear as mud class called bowhunter....there really are people that use their one bow that they bought just for hunting. if you feel that you can only be competitive with another bow, set it up as a dedicated venue bow. many archers do that too.



mdbowhunter said:


> It is necessary to fletch your own arrows...


and this is different from arrow maintenance in the petting zoo how? arrows are consumable. they will get beat up, they will get broken, they will get lost. they will need some tlc. that's like buying a target and not wanting to shoot at it because it'll eventually need to be replaced. they make more arrows every day. carefull....you may need to replace a string from shooting too.



mdbowhunter said:


> It is necessary to develop and maintain your archery skills...


how much work do you put into shooting rubber deer? how much effort is put into yardage estimation? how many times has that excuse been used on us field shooters why shooting rubber deer is HARDER? if i go out to the range, shoot 14 targets in an hour and a half, i still practiced my form, re-enforced known skills and learned some new skills to improve on for next time.



mdbowhunter said:


> It is something most of us have precious little to give nowadays...
> 
> *SPARE TIME............................*


ok....so that precious spare time isnt that much of an issue when you take a day off work, travel to where ever and spend 18hrs in 3days on the range for less than 100 arrows? time doesnt matter then, does it? oh wait....field isnt a 'family' event. yeah....the family goes to the club, pays their entry fees, gets classed and goes out and shoots. if it's a major event, the family wont be shooting together anyways. when i was a kid, i shot the local and some of the state shoots with my dad. many times, a single cub needs a chaperon. being that fourth in a group the cub already has a chaperon. most groups generally dont mind having a cub with them. i dont mind having a cub in my group as long as the child is courteous and behaved.


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## KStover (Jan 24, 2009)

rock monkey
your subtitle seems to fit you well.
"subtle as a sledgehammer" 

Keith


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

did i hurt your feelings?

sucks to be you.

there are things that need to be said regardless of who hears them and how they take it.


KStover said:


> rock monkey
> your subtitle seems to fit you well.
> "subtle as a sledgehammer"
> 
> Keith


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## Arcus (Jul 7, 2005)

mdbowhunter said:


> IMO many just don't have the time anymore.


Are you saying that in the heyday of field archery, there was more spare time to be had than now? Or is it that we now have more options for our spare time?


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

*rock monkey*

First of all, you have no concept of the officer positions I have held in archery clubs here in Maryland....the time I have donated...the number of years I have shot Field...etc. I would explain...but I suspect you would twist those facts into another rant.

If you can't understand the point I was making...which by the way wasn't a complaint but an observation that apparently you cannot grasp...then I guess we will have to agree to disagree.


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

Arcus said:


> Are you saying that in the heyday of field archery, there was more spare time to be had than now? Or is it that we now have more options for our spare time?


Yes...and yes. I truly believe people have less spare time these days...and they tend to pick activities which don't require a big commitment.


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## KStover (Jan 24, 2009)

rock monkey said:


> did i hurt your feelings?
> 
> sucks to be you.
> 
> there are things that need to be said regardless of who hears them and how they take it.


No you did not hurt my feelings at all. Just having a little fun .
Are you a little sensitive?

I agree things need to be said, and things need to be done. The sport that I love is dieing. Why do you think I started this thread?


Keith


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## kavo 71 (May 9, 2009)

i just started shoothing field last year. i still haven't broke 500 but i really enjoy it. i took my wife to a local shoot as a walk along and she enjoyed it so much she signed up for classes and we just finished putting her bow together. even if we are both terrible shots we now have something to do to together for a sat or sun morning that we both enjoy.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

i failed sensitivity training.......miserably. GySgt Hartman is my hero.

field is dieing because of many things. shops are goin away so one of the primary word of mouth advertising is going away too. clubs that fold surrender their land.

back in the late 70's, the NFAA Nationals was a community event. the host towns made the shooters welcome. Jay Peak, VT; Clemson, SC and North Aurora, IL all made the archers and the families welcomed. there was a scheduled tour for the family members that werent shooting. i remember my mom and sister going to the sears tower one year. it was a family activity then.

manufacturers are pushing target venues lopsidedly. marketing, more like pandering, to one whole segment while letting another die a slow death. atleast hoyt has the huevos to support both compound and recurve venues along with 3D.

the older guard is getting more old. i can count on one hand of a retired butcher how many in my club know about field, including me.

the whole greed factor. squabbling over chump change and ego boosting pencil pushers making those with an interest in the recreational aspect not want to play. not everyone has a desire to conquer the world, but atleast let them play a game that people arent going to take advantage of and demoralize them. not everyone is a winner.

every single point that a 3Der uses to justify why 3D is better can be used for promoting field. lack of labor required. speed, family friendly atmosphere. the biggest difference is that there are no built in excuses. it's all on the archer.

mdbowhunter, glad you contributed. however, i can not count the times where i have contributed labor and brain power to any activity i have participated in where i helped. lazy leadership of the group in charge allowed the 'staff' to neglect their responsibilities to the point where the paying customer was filling in for the 'betterment of the activity'

unfortunately, a day is still 24hrs long. been that way for a while.




KStover said:


> No you did not hurt my feelings at all. Just having a little fun .
> Are you a little sensitive?
> 
> I agree things need to be said, and things need to be done. The sport that I love is dieing. Why do you think I started this thread?
> ...


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## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

archerpap said:


> Matt, this would work as long as there is 4 wide shooting. For 224 shooters to shoot 2 times per day(112/round) only shooting 2 wide on one 28 target range would probably run a little late, seeing there are no time restraints in field. 112 would be perfect numbers for that scenerio, but we don't live in a perfect world. Also remember tie breakers and shoot offs for late Sunday afternoon. I know in our immediate area, Mecahanicsburg is the only facility that could accomidate larger numbers. We have a good number of ranges here in Central PA, but they are only 1 28 target range, and some have really nice courses but are only 14 target ranges.


As far as 2 wide vs. 4 wide, I really don't have any experience shooting 4 wide (except fans). When we shoot at DCWC, we shot 2 wide and we usually get done pretty quickly. 



BOWGOD said:


> 2 wide or 4 wide really does not make that big of impact on time. When shooting 4 wide there are usually 2 on the stake spotting, and 2 shooting anyway. You mechanicsburg guys are just too hung up on that 4 wide shooting lol.
> I've shot Mechanicsburg a few times. About half the times I shot there we shot 2 wide the other half we shot 4 wide. Every time though we finished in the same time frame didn't matter if we shot 2 or 4.
> On average it takes 4 hours give or take to shoot a 28 target course. Start 1 line at 8 am, and 1 line at 1 pm you can easily accommodate 2 groups a day. Even if it takes 5 hours groups at 7:30, and 1 would get the Job done.
> 
> But like spoon said it would take several years to get to the point where that would be needed. For the first few years it could easily run casual like the Hill. They get 100+ shooters through the course a day on casual registration, and everyone has fun.


I am sort of a "Build it and they will come" kinda guy. The only problem is it HAS to be done right to start with, or they won't come back. The idea in my mind is a mini version of what Nationals is. It would give folks a chance to shoot in an organized competition to prepare for what Nats brings. It actually might be as close to Nationals as some shooters get. That is why I haven't really pushed things too much more than conversations. 

I would LOVE to liken it to the ASA Pro/Am tour in 3D. There is so much going on around the shoot that it really becomes more of an "experience" than just a competition. It would also give clubs/ranges that host these events an opportunity to make some good money and perhaps expand an existing 14 target course to 28 or a 28 to a 42 or 56 target course. Allow the hosts to grow with the Tour. 

The current format swimming around in my head is 28 Field on Fri, 28 Hunter on Sat, and 14 Animal on Sunday am to allow for shoot-offs and awards on Sunday midday and get people back on the road headed home before it gets too late on Sunday.

I would LOVE some feedback from you folks as to what you think about the idea in general and what I have so far. Who knows, maybe this idea CAN become a reality and the East Coast Field Archery Tour could be coming to a city near you!!!!!


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Spoon13 said:


> As far as 2 wide vs. 4 wide, I really don't have any experience shooting 4 wide (except fans). When we shoot at DCWC, we shot 2 wide and we usually get done pretty quickly.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I told you before I am in. I can get clubs up this way on board. 
But to get the ball rolling I think something along the lines of the Hillbilly format to attract people would be the way to go. Open practice for early comers Friday, Casual shoot Saturday cards in by 4, semi casual sunday cards in by 2, Fun novelty shoot Saturday evening (or for that matter just make the Hinky shoot a traveling circus)
The Hillbilly probably attracts more new shooters, than any other shoot on the east coast. If we had 5 or 6 hillbilly's we would attract 5-6x as many new shooters. Once the numbers get up to a certain level we would obviously have to adjust the format to make sure everyone gets through.
I do also like involving the animal round. Maybe do casual registration Saturday 14 field/14 hunter cards in by 4, followed by novelty round Saturday evening, then semi casual 28 animal round Sunday cards in by 2 to allow for awards, and early departure.

I would think making it too formal from the start would hurt attendance from "new" shooters. Most guys that are thinking about trying field are already intimidated by the game. Making the shoot so formal (like nationals) is only going to make it seem more intimidating. 
Keep it informal, and generate a buzz, but have the formal plan on the back burner. Once we grow it to a point that casual is no longer going to work then employ the formal plan. By that time there should already be enough buzz surrounding the shoot that it will still draw some newbies. But if you make it too formal from the jump we're never going to draw too many "new" shooters.


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## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

BOWGOD said:


> I told you before I am in. I can get clubs up this way on board.
> But to get the ball rolling I think something along the lines of the Hillbilly format to attract people would be the way to go. Open practice for early comers Friday, Casual shoot Saturday cards in by 4, semi casual sunday cards in by 2, Fun novelty shoot Saturday evening (or for that matter just make the Hinky shoot a traveling circus)
> The Hillbilly probably attracts more new shooters, than any other shoot on the east coast. If we had 5 or 6 hillbilly's we would attract 5-6x as many new shooters. Once the numbers get up to a certain level we would obviously have to adjust the format to make sure everyone gets through.
> I do also like involving the animal round. Maybe do casual registration Saturday 14 field/14 hunter cards in by 4, followed by novelty round Saturday evening, then semi casual 28 animal round Sunday cards in by 2 to allow for awards, and early departure.
> ...


Or perhaps hold two shoots in one. It would require a 28 target course. Using DCWC as an example since that is the only course I've shot and I know you've been there. Let shooters that want to compete and be more serious shoot the front and let the new shooters shoot the back to start and then switch after lunch. New shooters can shoot whatever rounds they want to. No real structure and a reduced entry fee. 

I think this could attract some of the more serious shooters that want to hone skills for Nationals and still keep the relaxed setting of the Hillbilly to encourage new shooters to come out. This way if it becomes incredibly popular we don't have to change the format. It's already in place.

I'm just shooting from the cuff here. So let me know what you think. 

I know somebody other than BG has an opinion about this. Let me have it!!


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Spoon13 said:


> Or perhaps hold two shoots in one. It would require a 28 target course. Using DCWC as an example since that is the only course I've shot and I know you've been there. Let shooters that want to compete and be more serious shoot the front and let the new shooters shoot the back to start and then switch after lunch. New shooters can shoot whatever rounds they want to. No real structure and a reduced entry fee.
> 
> I think this could attract some of the more serious shooters that want to hone skills for Nationals and still keep the relaxed setting of the Hillbilly to encourage new shooters to come out. This way if it becomes incredibly popular we don't have to change the format. It's already in place.
> 
> ...



I think you'll just end up with everyone shooting for fun, and less entry fee. It's going to take years to build the numbers up to where a structured format is going to be necessary so I think we'd be better off keeping the casual atmosphere as long as possible. Just make it all about fun, leave the competitive side for the novelty shoot. Like the Hillbilly you have a trophy or something for the top shooter of the week end, and maybe allow for 2 man teams to battle for a second trophy for those who feel they need to compete (that would have to be structured though) but for the most part make the F/H round just all about having fun. Leave the prizes, and winnings for the novelty shoot, and make sure the novelty shoot requires at least a little luck. You get more participation when everyone (no matter skill level) have a chance at a prize. But I honestly do believe the fun factor is a must if you want it to grow. Most of us who like to shoot field can find a shoot locally every week end. So there is no need to travel, but when something like Jarlicker's thing, or the Hillbilly comes up where I can go spend a casual week end, and just have fun with friends, I am in the car, and on my way.

Sure keeping it structured, and competitive might draw the diehard field crowd, but it is going to do nothing to grow it. With in a few years the Diehards will get sick of all the travel, and stop coming. You have to give everyone a reason to WANT to come or no one will.

I can't believe we're not getting input from anyone else on this. If no one else wants to chime in, maybe you, and I should just set a day to get together, and get the ball rolling on our own. If we build it they will come


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

i got no ideas. i live in the center of the IBO universe so i'm the bait fish swimmin up the rapids stocked with apex predator fish that finished a period of fasting.

there's a ton of changing a group's mentality in this area. it can be done, but it's going to take a very long time.

i'm getting involved in a board position in my club with a prez that is very open to the field game but has no experience with it. because we're on public land and have minimal usable land, we are only going to set up a 10 target international course at first. we'll judge popularity after the year. if the use of the field course is good and we get lots of good feedback, we'll see how we can incorporate the other 4 targets and look at getting more formal shoots scheduled.

things that are going to work against us is the whole 'no payback' thing. it's an accepted and expected practice in the formal type shoots. fortunately, the club has been running casual start, fun shoots so we have a reputation for the fun part covered.

the biggest part that will work against us and gets under my skin to the point of anger is range vandalism by members. those that feel it is there birthright to remove markers/stakes and topple bales on a field course because they dont and wont shoot it. it only takes a couple, but it still is what it is.

this club has been robbed atleast twice that i remember in their current location. clubhouse broken into, practice bales and 3D targets stolen or vandalized, lawn equipment stolen. unfortunately, we have no real way to prevent it at the moment other than removing the high value items. we're VERY accessible, and that is also what makes the club vulnerable.

i know what the opposing points against field are and i know what the answers to the questions are, but i dont know if the 'if you build it they will come' thing will work around here. only 1 club in this area from the 'glory days' still exists on their land, because they own it, but their field course is nothing but piles of rotting excelsior and straw.

i'm open to getting it going up here, and the early success that the Clinton County group has had is encouraging.


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

rock monkey said:


> i got no ideas. i live in the center of the IBO universe so i'm the bait fish swimmin up the rapids stocked with apex predator fish that finished a period of fasting.
> 
> there's a ton of changing a group's mentality in this area. it can be done, but it's going to take a very long time.
> 
> ...



The idea we are shooting at here would require travel. What spoon, and I have been discussing is like an east coast tour of shoots something like the Hillbilly that will draw people in, and make it worth traveling.
I personally am against cash payout for amateur classes. I know this would not go over well with the career minded amateur 3d shooter (it's hard to say that with out laughing) But I also feel that the cash payout in AM 3d has led to most of the issues with that game. If there will be a lot of PRO'S supporting the venue then I could see having a cash pot among the pro's, but offering a cash purse to amateurs is only inviting cheating, bickering, whining, complaining, fights, and disheartened honest people. 
That being said you absolutely have to employ some sort of prize system that will attract attention, and new shooters. This is where I feel the novelty round in necessary. Keep the prizes in the novelty round where it is observed by everyone to eliminate the possibility of cheating. Also the Novelty round needs to be set up so that everyone has the same chance of winning something no matter their personal skill level. The Hinky shoot is a prime example of what I mean. I took second in the Hinky shoot last year, and I am far be it from a great shooter. There were several top name pro's in the shoot, and yet it came down to me, and another amateur (SHE whooped me)
Everyone who participated walked away with some sort of prize.

The Rinehart 100 shoot is another prime example. Those shoots get absoloutely packed with shooters in every state they hold one. But there is NO money to be won. It is simply good wholesome fun, and friendly competition. They give away a bunch of great prizes, but none of them have anything to do with the score shot. 

If we make it sound fun, and promote it right there is no telling how big it could grow. But it's going to have to sound fun even to those who have never shot a field round. And promotion will go a long way to determining how big it gets.


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

rock monkey said:


> mdbowhunter, glad you contributed. however, i can not count the times where i have contributed labor and brain power to any activity i have participated in where i helped. lazy leadership of the group in charge allowed the 'staff' to neglect their responsibilities to the point where the paying customer was filling in for the 'betterment of the activity'.


Lets just say maybe you did fail sensitivity training...and I'm too sensitive. A bad combination. :wink:

I've been around Field archery since 1988. Seen the ups...and seen the downs. Still waiting for another up-swing.  I'm amazed at the number of archers who stormed in with tons of enthusiasm...and left after a short time.

rock monkey...I believe you took my post too literal. My point about 'spare time' being a culprit comes from first hand experience. There was a time when I could take a half-day off here and there and spend it at the range. No more. And...I know many who have experienced the same change. Seems we spend more time at work...taking care of the house...family...then we used to. If you haven't experienced the same...then consider yourself lucky.

But I agree as most, the problem with Field archery goes deeper. Frankly, the whole concept of a sport relying on volunteer efforts to survive is gonna have its ups...and downs. I believe it contributes to the huge turnover. 

Lets look at a leisure time sport that has grown by leaps and bounds...golf. Sure, like archery it takes a good bit of practice to be good...but it's a 'play as you go' sport. You can put down your $$$ and go hit a bucket of balls at the local driving range...play 18 holes...then walk away. *No further commitment is needed.* Now, do you think golf would be as popular if before you played you had to join National, State and local organizations... help maintain the grounds...work in the clubhouse...etc? I don't think so. I suspect you would see the same turnover and problems as organized archery.

Now, before some of you go into 'attack mode'...give this a little thought. I'm not complaining...just providing some thoughts and obsrvations I have developed over time. Think about how other successful and growing leisure time sports are structured vs. archery. I think it is a fair comparison...and it may give us some clues on how to turn things around.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

i was pondering the good/bad about having the option to join just state or state&national. it came down to money.

if the option to join just state level, membership may increase within the ranks of the states BUT, the national level will lose those 'not quite so serious' competitors and the monies generated just from their membership funds. yes, the requirement to be a national member to participate in sectional and above events is a requirement, overall it would be a negative in numbers and the quality of the whole product will suffer more.

i dont have an answer or idea about the membership stuff. that's a whole lot of cacti to be rollin around in.

there is nothing that prevents a club from holding 'open' shoots. the thought of you have to be a total member to participate is wrong. yes, a club needs to be affiliated with the org for insurance purposes and maintain a certain amount of national level members, but for fun shoots and informal trophy shoots, no national level membership is required.

local clubs need to look at the small picture. let those that are in it for the 'fun factor' enjoy it as such, but also allow the archers that have the desire to excel and improve. give them the opportunity to compete in the bigger state and national stuff and have the support of the local club. remember when club shirts were as popular as 'staff' shirts? THAT is what field archery is about.

the sport needs to grow from the roots up, not from the canopy down. the nfaa needs to develop programs that go thru the state associations to their clubs and local dealers. you hafta nurture the seeds before you reap the crop.

you make a comparison between archery clubs and golf country clubs. how many struggling clubs would fail if they went to higher dues to pay for full time grounds keeping? there's only one club that i know of and that is a sportsman's club with rifle, pistol and trap ranges. the archery is their 'novelty' club. the archery side of things still had to put in and maintain the bales on their 14 target range. the groundskeeper just kept the lanes cleared and mowed.

targets are expensive enuff these days. labor is much more expensive on a full time basis. you'd have to pay almost 30k/yr + materials/supplies. i dont know of many clubs that have those kind of deep pockets.

why not offer a free year's membership to the member/s that work for a lawn care company to mow the club grounds once or twice a month? you dont need to raise the dues, the club guys win and they get some free advertising for their company.

i watched a show on the battle of antietem the other night and it talked about how the technology and evolution of the weapons and how the tactics failed to evolve with them and how the soldiers were the end result.

that same analogy can be used with the nfaa. communication technology has evolved insanely fast while the operation and decision making hasnt. the sport suffers. how long does it take to get something done? how long does it take just to get something written in a 'presentable' matter? how many times does one change get presented in several different worded ways?

i started a thread months ago for members to submit ideas and proposals so the district, regional and state guys can get a feel, talk amongst themselves and present one, well crafted item, not several half-assed. it got ridiculed.


you want to discuss and change scoring. why? why fix what aint broke? ONE really damn good archer cleaned a field round. ok....so. he's a pro, he's supposed to be a REALLY GOOD archer and is. it will make the other really damn good archers work harder to beat him.

they changed the scoring in vegas because SOME really good archers cleaned it. they also changed it because some GOOD male archers were threatened by a REALLY GOOD female archer.

now, many REALLY GOOD archers clean it on a regular basis. we enjoy seeing our favorite guy/gal in the shoot-off. we enjoy watching, either live or from video, the shoot-off. that's what vegas is about. REALLY GOOD archers going head to head. why has FITA gone to the hit or miss system? it creates that drama we want to see.

fixin what aint broke is not going to fix the NFAA's issues.


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## JPE (Feb 1, 2004)

Spoon13 said:


> I know somebody other than BG has an opinion about this. Let me have it!!


I like the idea but it could be difficult to schedule if you're hoping to pull in some of the top dogs. They're not going to give up a weekend where they can earn money shooting at rubber deer. And for the regular joes, you'll have to make sure you don't step on any of their state field championships for the surrounding states that you're hoping to draw from.

Scheduling is the hardest part for any archery group. We're getting beat up a little for scheduling our Indoor 300 championship over the Georgia ASA (we're in the heart of IBO country) and some FITA shoot in a neighboring state. We pulled schedules from ASA, IBO, NFAA, etc, and it's tough to find dates for our state shoots without stepping on the bigger orgs.


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## bowpro34 (Jun 17, 2007)

*Field dying...*

I sure hope field sticks around. I just finally tried it last year and I'm loving it and target archery in general. So much so that we are trying hard to get a field round going at my local club. Currently you have to drive an hour to just to find a field round. I'm hoping to change that. We've gotten far enough along now that we just need to raise the money for hay bales. We are having an indoor 600 round to help raise money for them. I really have NO idea if its going to work. If we can fill up our indoor range for 3 days at the end of February, hopefully it will be enough to get us started. 3D's are so much work to set up, I can see how these different clubs would say 'forget it' quickly.

I've had lots and lots of generous people help me over the years for shooting in general. All I can do is try to repay the favor by introducing it to new archers and introducing new games to old archers. 

I'm a very competitive person and for years I've come to the conclusion that i just can't win the big 3D tournaments without a practice course in my back yard (which I don't have). I can however practice shooting (and enjoying practice) which can help get me better at target archery. I'm rambling now but I hope it sticks around. You guys will know if it works for us, as I will post it here on AT. If it does, I think we'll have one of the neatest shoots around as we have some amazing terrain.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

my club prez found this company at the ATA show.
http://www.biggreentargets.com/indoor-outdoor-range-targets.html

price-wise they would work great into a small club's budget. 

if all things go well, these will be one of the options we look at for the course.


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## Nomad_Archer (Aug 27, 2008)

BOWGOD said:


> The whole reason field doesn't have the numbers is because it lacks promotion.


This is very true. I started shooting about three years ago. I started shooting in the back yard and then was introduced to 3d. That was fun but after awhile it lost the attraction because of the magic pencil and the shots at the various shoots lost alot of there challenge. This happened because the courses where not changing very much and everything for the most part was under 45 yards. At one point I knew where and when all the 3d shoots where withing a 2 hour drive of my home.

Over the last year and half I got into indoor spot shooting and noticed the NFAA logo on the 5 spot targets. That led to my discovery of field archery. At that point I was intrigued but couldnt figure out where to start. 

Yesterday I found out I have a field archery course 20 minutes away and the course happens to be right up the road from archery club. The sad thing is I never heard about the course and the members of the archery club helped build the range before I joined. There are not many shoots held at the field course but you better believe I will be there for them. 

Right now its like a whole new world of archery just opened up to me and I cant wait for the course to open up at the end of march. I just wish I could get the snow to melt so I can go walk around the course and check it out. The course is free and open to the public and with all the archers in the area and two archery shops within 15 minutes have I never heard of this place. It just boggles my mind. 

So at this point I cant wait to be humbled by the 80 yard shots and to really start having so serious fun this spring and summer. I feel like this is somthing I really can get behind and start having fun at organized shoots. Instead of some of the rude jerk behavior I have experienced from some of the big fish little pond IBO shooters that have pushed my fiancee out of the way on the practice range because they were too important to have to wait their turn.


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## TNMAN (Oct 6, 2009)

*status quo field*

"We have met the ememy and it is us." The famous Pogo quote seems to apply, imho. Promotion of field and recruiting of new members has to happen from a grass roots level.


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## Tom1953 (Jan 22, 2009)

*field archery*

I must of met some of you years ago, I shot at Jay, Aurora and Clemson. It seems like in the early 70's we could shoot a field round in less than 2 hours.
I used to shoot early in NY (Elmira or Binghamton) and then drive to Bloomsburg or Benton Pa to shoot a second round in the afternoon. (gas was only 50 cents a gallon) But as we began to shoot better, it took longer to shoot. THe 3-D rounds that are popular today can be shot in under an hour. I tried once to get the Mid Directors to try an outdoor 300 round. It used to be on the books, but I couldn't find it last time I looked. But it is 15 targets, 65 yards max. It would make it easier for clubs that don't have many volunteers to maintain a course. PLus alot of newbies are intimdated by the 80 yd wu. I know the 80 yard shot is only 2 arrows but I used to spend a lot of time practicing to make those 2 shots.

I don't spend much time shooting archery anymore, but I believe Field Archery is the KING. Field Archery will teach you more about your equipment than indoors or 3D ever will.


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Nomad_Archer said:


> This is very true. I started shooting about three years ago. I started shooting in the back yard and then was introduced to 3d. That was fun but after awhile it lost the attraction because of the magic pencil and the shots at the various shoots lost alot of there challenge. This happened because the courses where not changing very much and everything for the most part was under 45 yards. At one point I knew where and when all the 3d shoots where withing a 2 hour drive of my home.
> 
> Over the last year and half I got into indoor spot shooting and noticed the NFAA logo on the 5 spot targets. That led to my discovery of field archery. At that point I was intrigued but couldnt figure out where to start.
> 
> ...



I was the same way. I had interest in in trying field for quite a few years. I had been shooting a lot of 3d, but had been sick of it for years. The problem was I couldn't find anyone, or anywhere who shot field. I have been near dozens of field courses over the years, but had no clue that they were even there. If I did know they were there I had no clue that anyone actually shot them. The ones I knew about I always just assumed were old ranges that used to get shot before 3d blew up. I had no idea they were still active, and no one talked about them.

If there was better promotion I would have been shooting years ago.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

nomad archer, i sent an idea to JPE about something and he liked it. when he gets back from vegas, he'll bounce some more off my skull.

it may be a boost to the 'where' part.


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## Kills Shills (Feb 8, 2010)

??? dandylions are growing on NFAAs grave.


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## Rattleman (Jul 6, 2004)

rock monkey said:


> first big hurdle is a place to shoot.
> 
> second big hurdle is getting someone to understand their bow can shoot more than 50yds and that there is fun and camaraderie on a course.
> 
> ...


You kow that finding FREE places to have a club are not that uncommon. Actually that is the easiest part. Contact your local government. Find a piece of property that you can lease for a small amount each year and get an extended contract. They will have some reservations but with proper knowledge let them know that your newly formed archery club will provide ample shooting oppurtunities for both the membership and also non members. In return offer them something in return. We hold archery classes thru the Anne Arundel County Dept. and Recs for the Dept. of Rec. They provide the equipment, register the students and all you have to do is provide a few sessions usually in the fall and spring. The good thing about this is you will always have interest in archery via students as well as the casual bowhunter. These people will then become a part of the club. From this point on all you need to provide is the manpower. (Sometimes very hard to find) We have 9 targets that we provide for the non members with stipulations. (RULES) These targets are actually our practice range. You will need to be incorporated and have officers. You will need insurance. You will also need a working body. The initial cost can be pretty steep but the rewards are well worth the effort. We hold 3D in the winter months and also a summer 3D league. The money that you reap from these events will allow the field course to pay for itself. Just remember you will probably have more field archers that will step up and help build the range. The 3D guys will usually only show to shoot the 3D. But you never know you may actually be able to convert some of these shooters.


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## Nomad_Archer (Aug 27, 2008)

rock monkey said:


> nomad archer, i sent an idea to JPE about something and he liked it. when he gets back from vegas, he'll bounce some more off my skull.
> 
> it may be a boost to the 'where' part.


Sounds good I cant wait to see what you two come up with.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

All this dying talk is kind of funny to me.....

I haven't followed this thread because these type of threads are usually full of nothing but people *****in' about it not being the old days....or either people *****ing about not having anything but aren't really doing anything to make changes or get shoots going. :doh: this doesn't apply to everyone so pull your undies out before you post....:wink:

Then I get an e-mail today with the MD State 2010 schedule . I am glad field is dying....I don't know how I could make anymore shoots.

There are 42 field shoots in MD this year  :faint: 

You want to shoot field come play with us....or at least talk to the people that are doing it right :wink:


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Brown Hornet said:


> I don't know how I could make anymore shoots.


Just be sure you "dress properly" for the ones you attend. :mg:


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## dmassphoto (Feb 8, 2010)

CutTheLoop said:


> What we need is another Rambo movie. :wink:
> 
> Maybe the next Robin Hood flick will give it a shot in the arm.


You may be joking, but the Kevin Costner movie is what got me into this sport in the first place, when I was about 9. I shot in my back yard for about 10yrs before I finally gave up because I didn't know where else to go to shoot that wasn't dominated by bowhunters shooting 3d. If I had actually paid attention and found out there were competitions for this sort of stuff, I would've stayed in it. Now that I'm wanting to get back into shooting again, I'm finding my area is still dominated by hunters, and targets shoots are literally nonexistant to my knowledge. 

Not to say anything bad against bowhunters, as they seem to have had much success in archery, but speaking purely from an outsider's prospective, field archery seems to be a perfect fit those who enjoy hunting, and those who enjoy the challenge of archery in general. I'm not a big hunter, but I still appreciate the art of shooting a bow, and I'm almost certian there are many out there who would love to try, but may be intimidated. Field archery could bridge that gap. I'd personally love to see a "course" almost like golf where anyone who wants to try their hand at shooting, can. There has been a lot of success lately with frisbee golf on public land in cities, why not find find land for archery?


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## Redwolf141 (Jan 10, 2010)

I am new to this whole target archery thing, I have shot 3ds in the past to get ready for hunting. After a long layoff from archery shooting of any kind I am getting back into it again but this time I want to shoot or tryto shoot field archery along with my 14 year old son. problem is not sure where there are any palces to shoot in western Pa. You guys were talking about payouts and winnings I myself would much rather have a plague or a medal to han on the wall than a check to spend and if they gave out nothing I would porbably still shot just to see if I could beat my last score. If anyone knows of palces to shoot in western Pa{Johnstown Area} let me know also don't mind traveling a little ways on the weekends to shoot. I only know of one course in the area that is Flood City Bowman course.


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## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

After some thought, NO Field archery is NOT dying. It merely catching it's second wind.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Rattleman (Jul 6, 2004)

Redwolf141 said:


> I am new to this whole target archery thing, I have shot 3ds in the past to get ready for hunting. After a long layoff from archery shooting of any kind I am getting back into it again but this time I want to shoot or tryto shoot field archery along with my 14 year old son. problem is not sure where there are any palces to shoot in western Pa. You guys were talking about payouts and winnings I myself would much rather have a plague or a medal to han on the wall than a check to spend and if they gave out nothing I would porbably still shot just to see if I could beat my last score. If anyone knows of palces to shoot in western Pa{Johnstown Area} let me know also don't mind traveling a little ways on the weekends to shoot. I only know of one course in the area that is Flood City Bowman course.


Put out a thread in the General population asking about Field courses in Western Pa. We have 1 course in Western Maryland. Also know as Cumberland Bowhunters home of the famous HillBilly shoot in July. For more info onthe Maryland Archery Association www.md-archery.com


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Redwolf141 said:


> I am new to this whole target archery thing, I have shot 3ds in the past to get ready for hunting. After a long layoff from archery shooting of any kind I am getting back into it again but this time I want to shoot or tryto shoot field archery along with my 14 year old son. problem is not sure where there are any palces to shoot in western Pa. You guys were talking about payouts and winnings I myself would much rather have a plague or a medal to han on the wall than a check to spend and if they gave out nothing I would porbably still shot just to see if I could beat my last score. If anyone knows of palces to shoot in western Pa{Johnstown Area} let me know also don't mind traveling a little ways on the weekends to shoot. I only know of one course in the area that is Flood City Bowman course.


I think Floodcity is the only 1 in that area, but they do have a nice facility. I used to make the 6 hour round trip once a week to shoot with those guys.
If you head east there are some courses out the other side of Huntington in the Lewistown area. From J-town your only about 3-3.5 hours from some of the courses in MD. One other option is Cumberland which is closer to you, it's straight down 99 to 220 then follow 220 down to the border. The club is about 5 minutes from the PA border.


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Brown Hornet said:


> All this dying talk is kind of funny to me.....
> 
> I haven't followed this thread because these type of threads are usually full of nothing but people *****in' about it not being the old days....or either people *****ing about not having anything but aren't really doing anything to make changes or get shoots going. :doh: this doesn't apply to everyone so pull your undies out before you post....:wink:
> 
> ...



Your right in some areas it seems to be growing, and growing well, but in most areas it's still like a secret society, and viewed as the black sheep. 
I have been pushing a couple of clubs over this way to put in a field course. I have even offered to do all the labor if they supplied the material. Most of the clubs around have old field ranges from the old days so the lanes are already there, just need a good grooming, new butts, signs, and stakes.
It's just so hard to change the mind set of all the diehard 3d shooters.
But I do think the one club I have been leaning on is starting to consider it so who knows WV may end up with 2 active field ranges someday.


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## Bownut61 (Dec 15, 2007)

*Alive and Well !!!*

When I started reading this thread I thought wow this is really depressing. Then I had to remember what I've seen and been thinking for years. I'm sure in some areas it seems dead but from where I'm standing I see growth. 

I couldn't be anymore involved in archery than I already am. I've ran into many archers giving up 3D for Field. Many are short draw archers. Others just see the advantage and enjoyment of an even playing field where the best archer wins. I work hard to perfect my archery skills. I'm not going to lose to someone with lesser skills that guessed the yardage correct when I didn't. Besides 30 or 40 shots is a ripoff for my entry fee. I can't imagine sitting on a stool waiting for a target then shooting 1 shot and sitting back down on my stool again. What time are they due back at the nursing home? So maybe I'm preaching to the choir but I needed to vent. 

I feel bad for those who are in areas that Field is dead or dying. When I got back into target archery in 06 it would have been easy to find a 3D shoot if I wanted one. Now that I'm knee deep in it I can find Field shoots every weekend from April to Sept even if I have to go to Maryland. God love ya Marylanders!!! You guys are hardcore!!! ( I love that word ). Reminds me of me.:wink: 

Anywho, as for BowGod and the others that talked about a 6 event tour or challenge. I LOVE IT!!! Count me in!!! BowGod that one format you mentioned is exactly what we did at the Shawnee Challenge last year and you were there. Maybe our shoot could be part of the tour??

I agree with all of your ideas. Keep it fun, no money, just awards of some kind and a novelty shoot that everyone has a chance to win. Worked for us and works for the Hill Billy.

Speaking of the Hill Billy. I think what makes it so appealing is it's an event of sorts. I don't want to go to a shoot whether it be a 1 day shoot or a weekend and just shoot a couple hrs and go home. I'm there to shoot for awhile and hang out and have a good time. Also, I was so impressed at my first Hill Billy at the caliber of shooters they had. It drew everyone from Pros to the newbies. The course was a challenge and at the end of the day you could compare how you did with some of the best. I'm always trying to improve my game and no matter what the sport you're only as good as your competition. 

So in closing I think you have to appeal to everyone. Some just wanna have fun and don't care about score and that's ok. Others strive to be the best. 

Field is alive and well !!! At least in Pa. and Maryland.


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Bownut61 said:


> Speaking of the Hill Billy. I think what makes it so appealing is it's an event of sorts. I don't want to go to a shoot whether it be a 1 day shoot or a weekend and just shoot a couple hrs and go home. I'm there to shoot for awhile and hang out and have a good time. Also, I was so impressed at my first Hill Billy at the caliber of shooters they had. It drew everyone from Pros to the newbies. The course was a challenge and at the end of the day you could compare how you did with some of the best. I'm always trying to improve my game and no matter what the sport you're only as good as your competition.



There in lies the key. If a 3 star or 6 star tour would work all lies in the promotion. It has to be promoted as an event. No one is going to take time off work, or travel 100+ miles to go to another shoot. But if it is veiwed as an event like the Hill then people will come from all around. Half the fun of the Hillbilly is just hanging out with friends from up, and down the east coast. If we can take that atmosphere to other venues then the idea can/will really take off.

Shawnee had the right idea with awards. A nice trophy to the top of each class, then prizes during the novelty shoot where everyone had equal chance of winning. I know I am not alone when I say I would rather get a trophy for winning than a check. If I get a check it will be gone next week, if I get a trophy I'll have something to show for my efforts for the rest of my life.


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

Brown Hornet said:


> All this dying talk is kind of funny to me.....
> 
> I haven't followed this thread because these type of threads are usually full of nothing but people *****in' about it not being the old days....or either people *****ing about not having anything but aren't really doing anything to make changes or get shoots going. :doh: this doesn't apply to everyone so pull your undies out before you post....:wink:
> 
> ...


It's all about the numbers there Hornet. No doubt...participation was higher back in the late '80's and early '90's. I've discussed this issue with tons of people...just not sure *IF* there is an answer. Maybe it's just the normal cycle of things.

Just be glad us MD Field archers are hard headed...we still keep scheduling *LOTS* of shoots despite the drop in attendance.

BTW...I kept my tidy-whities in place before posting. :wink:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

BOWGOD said:


> There in lies the key. If a 3 star or 6 star tour would work all lies in the promotion. It has to be promoted as an event. No one is going to take time off work, or travel 100+ miles to go to another shoot. But if it is veiwed as an event like the Hill then people will come from all around. Half the fun of the Hillbilly is just hanging out with friends from up, and down the east coast. If we can take that atmosphere to other venues then the idea can/will really take off.
> 
> Shawnee had the right idea with awards. A nice trophy to the top of each class, then prizes during the novelty shoot where everyone had equal chance of winning. I know I am not alone when I say I would rather get a trophy for winning than a check. If I get a check it will be gone next week, if I get a trophy I'll have something to show for my efforts for the rest of my life.


BS.... The problem has nothing to do with distance, money or prizes. How many people travel a long distance to shoot the Hill...all the stuff that goes on hasn't always happened. How many people go to ASA....IBO or Nationals with no chance of winning SQUAT? 98% of them....

If someone wants and archery trophy I will give you one.....

You shoot to have fun....it's a hobby....if you need compensation then you are either a PRO....or your in it for the wrong reasons. 

The travel and prize and money comments have had me laughing for hours now. My dad and his buddies just drove 8 hours or more to go play golf for 4 days....they have done it every year for about 10 years. My buddies and I have done it....and MILLIONs of people all over the world make similar trips every year all over the world. My irons cost more then any bow I have ever paid for....and that doesn't count the rest of my clubs...2 wedges and my putter cost more then a doz X10s....then you have green fees. Hell I paid more last year in fees in two months then I have spent on entry fees for archery the past 2 years total...and that includes LAS twice and Nationals....

How many people travel all over the country to go fishing? Hell I probably have spent more money on spinner baits in a summer then I did on arrows last year and this year. 

Either you love to shoot or you don't ....were not PROs....this isn't done for a living.......do it because you love to shoot and enjoy the people you shoot with and meet shooting....

How many of you bowl, play softball, basketball in a league or have....did you do it for a trophy? I bet you didn't.... Heck if it isn't a National title, state title, or regional title who gives a crap about a trophy? wow you beat a couple locals....and most times you didn't even have to shoot a real good score to get it. 

I hope I get a trophy the next time I beat my buddies at golf.....

99% of the people that say they will come if there are "prizes" will be the first ones to stop coming after they get beat a few times......

You want field to grow...or not die.... Hold shoots, build a range or at least take some people that shoot on a course.


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## TNMAN (Oct 6, 2009)

Brown Hornet said:


> If someone wants and archery trophy I will give you one.....


Hornet, I have seen a one of a kind trophy draw shooters from all over SE U.S. to Manchester, TN. The Silver Arrow Shoot trophy (for each style) was a hand made hardwood plaque with a to scale recurve at full draw with a silver arrow on the string, complete with white vanes and silver broadhead. One man made all of these beautiful trophies for many years.

Also, a well run shoot by the best people you will ever find anywhere didn't hurt attendance.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

TNMAN said:


> Hornet, I have seen a one of a kind trophy draw shooters from all over SE U.S. to Manchester, TN. The Silver Arrow Shoot trophy (for each style) was a hand made hardwood plaque with a to scale recurve at full draw with a silver arrow on the string, complete with white vanes and silver broadhead. One man made all of these beautiful trophies for many years.
> 
> Also, a well run shoot by the best people you will ever find anywhere didn't hurt attendance.


That is a good shoot....with a good trophy....but like I said 90 some % of the people have no SHOT at a trophy....and most shoots the have a $5 trophy.... Even with a super trophy your not gonna go just for the trophy. It's the entire experience. Yes it would be cool to win it and an achievement.....

The Stanley Cup....Super Bowl trophy.... World Series trophy etc are all sweet.... But guys don't play to "get" that trophy....it is the actual title.... A little rinky dink trophy from the local club isn't gonna draw anyone. Just like with the Silver Bowls at Nats.....they Bowl is the prize but the winner beat the best of the best....Va Vince and I got medals at our first FITA and neither of us shot over a 1350 in a 30+ mph wind and rain with nobody there....shot the worst we shot all year...and the prize meant nothing. We went for the experience and because we love to shoot. 

Hell I have shot shoots were the winners get food.... Turkeys, hams and hens...didn't want or need the food but I wanted to shoot. You pay $10 to shoot at most at most shoots....why do you need a trophy to go do what you like to do?

I like to watch sports and drink.....were is my trophy for drinking JD and cheering louder then the other people?


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

Brown Hornet said:


> BS.... The problem has nothing to do with distance, money or prizes. How many people travel a long distance to shoot the Hill...all the stuff that goes on hasn't always happened. How many people go to ASA....IBO or Nationals with no chance of winning SQUAT? 98% of them....
> 
> If someone wants and archery trophy I will give you one.....
> 
> ...



Once again you misinterpret what I was saying. I could care less about prizes or awards. My thoughts are if there is going to be prizes or awards we are better off giving trophy's. I'm all for no prizes, ain't no prizes on the hill. But I do believe that if there are going to be prizes those prizes need to be trophy's not cash. Cash payout in AM classes just opens the door to trouble. 

The whole point of that post was It has to be promoted as an event. 
The success or failure both lie in the promotion. If it is advertised or promoted like any other week end club shoot nobody is going to want to travel 5 or 6 hours for a club shoot. But if it is promoted like a must attend EVENT people will come. 
If the hillbilly shoot was viewed as just a week end shoot on Cumberland's schedule nobody would travel to shoot it, but the Hillbilly shoot is touted as the must shoot field event on the east coast so people come from far, and wide to shoot it. Even though outside of the Hinky shoot it's nothing more than a local club shoot. But because it has been promoted so well it draws a crowd, and the atmosphere takes on a life of it's own taking the shoot from club shoot level to archery EVENT.

My post had nothing to do with my thoughts on prizes. Read back through my post on here Prizes are far from the top of my priority list. Proper promotion is the one key factor that will either make or break this whole idea.


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

Surprisingly, California has many great field courses but few field competitions. I have joined two field clubs and am learning the ropes so that I can add some field tournaments to my NAA target schedule (barebow recurve). I will at least shoot the California State Field. I even got a couple of compound finger bows so I can level the playing field in the NFAA barebow class. (I wish the NFAA had a recurve barebow class for us stringwalkers).


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## feildfool (Jul 22, 2009)

*Redding field competition*

How big is Redding? And where can I find more info about it?


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## FitaX10 (Aug 1, 2002)

Go to Straight Arrow Bowhunters and you will get all your information for the shoot at Redding. Its a pretty big deal. Lots of shooters and a lot of fun!!!
Chris


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