# Should Asa Change The Lens Rule For Bowhunter Class???



## mike2112 (May 10, 2005)

I do not know many guys who hunt with a lens, besides myself. But I do agree that in bowhunter class should be lens free. As a matter of fact, it was just voted on in our club that this year no lens in the bowhunter class.

Mike


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## romanc333 (Feb 10, 2006)

*I agree*

Bowhunter should be lense free. Its against the law to hunt with em in Wisconsin.

Steve


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

mike2112 said:


> I do not know many guys who hunt with a lens, besides myself. But I do agree that in bowhunter class should be lens free. As a matter of fact, it was just voted on in our club that this year no lens in the bowhunter class.
> 
> Mike


we have done the same thing in our club 
we to are lense free:wink:


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

*If your skared just say so!*



songdogshooter said:


> we have done the same thing in our club
> we to are lense free:wink:


:tongue: :tongue: :tongue: 

JUst because your eyes are good. Some need the lens. I dont shoot one in freestyle class:wink:


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## Davik (Apr 16, 2003)

*Lenses*

Don't get me wrong here, but ASA has lots bigger fish to fry than worrying about the HC using a lens for shooting...I agree, it is a reduntant thing, the lens and should be done away with, but a bigger problem is the vast number of accomplished shooters shooting in the Bowhunter Novice Class...or the number of people getting compensated for their shooting and shooting in the Open or Amateur Classes...or the Top Gun Teams that win BIG money that are "manipulated" by stacking shooters in each class that don't belong there. Personally, I shoot in the Hunter Class and don't use a lens...I have a setup that allows it, but find it unnecessary(it makes me shoot high). Sorry for the rant, but the lens doesn't bother me as much as the other stuff.Rock on!


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

Daniel Boone said:


> :tongue: :tongue: :tongue:
> 
> JUst because your eyes are good. Some need the lens. I dont shoot one in freestyle class:wink:



*HEY! ! !AT LEAST I HIT THE WOLF :tongue: ! ! !*
and yes i am skeeered


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

Davik said:


> Don't get me wrong here, but ASA has lots bigger fish to fry than worrying about the HC using a lens for shooting...I agree, it is a reduntant thing, the lens and should be done away with, but a bigger problem is the vast number of accomplished shooters shooting in the Bowhunter Novice Class...or the number of people getting compensated for their shooting and shooting in the Open or Amateur Classes...or the Top Gun Teams that win BIG money that are "manipulated" by stacking shooters in each class that don't belong there. Personally, I shoot in the Hunter Class and don't use a lens...I have a setup that allows it, but find it unnecessary(it makes me shoot high). Sorry for the rant, but the lens doesn't bother me as much as the other stuff.Rock on!


i agree a 110% 
all i am saying is its hard for guys like me that do okay in the bh class to go and compete with the guys that have a lens....you cant compete like that 
so whats the diffrence between bh and unlimited.....the main thing is the six foot stabelizer .... why not make them step up and let the bowhunters be bowhunters.....:wink:


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## Davik (Apr 16, 2003)

*Unlimited*

Step up to what?!? There is no other pins class above Unlimited...there ought to be several levels of pin classes to accomodate different levels of shooters, I mean the scope guys have C,B, and A...why not pin shooters?


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

Davik said:


> Step up to what?!? There is no other pins class above Unlimited...there ought to be several levels of pin classes to accomodate different levels of shooters, I mean the scope guys have C,B, and A...why not pin shooters?



what i mean is step up from bowhunter.........


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## LHpuncher (Apr 12, 2004)

no


thats why its a bowhunter class..............


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

:noidea:


LHpuncher said:


> no
> 
> 
> thats why its a bowhunter class..............


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## fnkybn (Jan 15, 2004)

*ASA rule change*

How about the guys that shoot with a single pin slider sight for hunting but get bumped to Open Class in ASA rules?


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## bfisher (Nov 30, 2002)

I might agree to a point, BUT?????????? Where do you draw the line as to whether something is intended for bowhunting only? How do you define it? Is it hunting equipment if it is camo?

And yeh, what about slider sights? Many, including myself use them for hunting. No lens though. Just not very practical.


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## pabuck (Feb 8, 2006)

I don't shoot any ASA shoots b/c there aren't many held in my area but I have to say that no Bowhunter class should include sights with a lens. A lens is not pratical for bowhunting and unless a lens is legal for hunting everywhere is should not be allowed. 


However, I do think that a hunting slider sight (i.e. HHA, Sight master, Cobra, etc.) should be allowed since these sights are designed for the bowhunter. Here is the problem with the moveable sight rule: How do you write a law saying that you are allowed to use a moveable sight just as long as it isn't a Sure-loc, toxonics, CBE etc.


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

Davik said:


> Step up to what?!? There is no other pins class above Unlimited...there ought to be several levels of pin classes to accomodate different levels of shooters, I mean the scope guys have C,B, and A...why not pin shooters?


There is talk of a Semi Pro and Pro PINS class...

Y'all do know that at the ASA level this is "COMPETITION" and not practice for hunting.... When I hunt I don't use a lens... but when I compete I shoot full tilt...


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

pabuck said:


> I don't shoot any ASA shoots b/c there aren't many held in my area but I have to say that no Bowhunter class should include sights with a lens. A lens is not pratical for bowhunting and unless a lens is legal for hunting everywhere is should not be allowed.
> 
> 
> However, I do think that a hunting slider sight (i.e. HHA, Sight master, Cobra, etc.) should be allowed since these sights are designed for the bowhunter. Here is the problem with the moveable sight rule: How do you write a law saying that you are allowed to use a moveable sight just as long as it isn't a Sure-loc, toxonics, CBE etc.


You would write the rule to state that if it moves behind the riser (HHA, Sight master, etc) it is legal, if it moves in front of the riser it is illegal.

However, as Javi mentioned, this is a competition, and this is target archery, not bowhunting. To say it should be a "true" hunting setup would mean the hunter class would have to shoot broadheads, not field tips. Going by the theory if it is not legal to hunt with the equipment should be the criteria for the hunting class, we would have to shoot broadheads, and since some states prohibit letoff over 65%, there goes a bunch of bows that would not be legal to hunt with also. 

Where do we draw the line? I think ASA has it right since this is a format of target archery and not hunting.


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

JAVI said:


> There is talk of a Semi Pro and Pro PINS class...
> 
> Y'all do know that at the ASA level this is "COMPETITION" and not practice for hunting.... When I hunt I don't use a lens... but when I compete I shoot full tilt...





then why do they call it bowhunter class?????
and thats write its competiton so if you guys want to compete and shoot a lense 
shoot with the open or unlimited guys and let the bowhunters compete with each other...
i am the rangemaster at the local range here and let me tell you 
@ my range the bowhuter class is *BOW HUNTING SITUATIONS ! ! !*
the unlimited and open guys like to have level ground and they also 
like the lanes extremly clean.... thats what they like so thats what i try to give them.....traditional guys like it a little trashy so thats what they get....
i just dont see what a lense has to do with bowhuntin class 
its not legal in every state so why condone it....


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

bfisher said:


> I might agree to a point, BUT?????????? Where do you draw the line as to whether something is intended for bowhunting only? How do you define it? Is it hunting equipment if it is camo?
> 
> And yeh, what about slider sights? Many, including myself use them for hunting. No lens though. Just not very practical.



they have to seperate bowhunter & open guys some where....
alot of you guys think this is "target archery" it might be for some of you but for alot of the bowhunters its practice and thats it.....if we do well then we would like to compete with each other with bowhuntin equipment only.....
*WHY NOT PUT A FREAKIN LASER SIGHT ON YOUR BOW *
where do we draw the line ???????


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

songdogshooter said:


> they have to seperate bowhunter & open guys some where....
> alot of you guys think this is "target archery" it might be for some of you but for alot of the bowhunters its practice and thats it.....if we do well then we would like to compete with each other with bowhuntin equipment only.....
> *WHY NOT PUT A FREAKIN LASER SIGHT ON YOUR BOW *
> where do we draw the line ???????


That’s great…. Because you want to practice for hunting and possibly compete with your hunting equipment… the whole ASA organization should change its rules to satisfy you… 

How about you have a local rule that makes a Bowhunter class with your rules; then the folks who want to compete on a national basis don’t have to change just to satisfy you…

If you turn in a score card it ain’t practice no more…. It’s COMPETITION


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

JAVI said:


> That’s great…. Because you want to practice for hunting and possibly compete with your hunting equipment… the whole ASA organization should change its rules to satisfy you…
> 
> How about you have a local rule that makes a Bowhunter class with your rules; then the folks who want to compete on a national basis don’t have to change just to satisfy you…
> 
> If you turn in a score card it ain’t practice no more…. It’s COMPETITION


WHY NOT MAKE THE TRADITIONAL GUYS PUT SCOPES AND V-BARS ON THERE LONG BOWS ?????
you are completly missing the point ! ! ! ! 
its not about competition 
its about making it what it is 
bowhunting class
*IT IS NOT LEGAL TO HUNT WITH A SCOPE IN ALL STATES!!! WHAT ABOUT THOSE GUYS ???????
I KNOW LETS PUT THEM IN THE JR. EAGLES CLASS...THAT WOULD PROBALLY MAKE SINCE TO YOU ! ! ! ! *


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

songdogshooter said:


> WHY NOT MAKE THE TRADITIONAL GUYS PUT SCOPES AND V-BARS ON THERE LONG BOWS ?????
> you are completly missing the point ! ! ! !
> its not about competition
> its about making it what it is
> ...


Is it legal in OK to hunt with field tips?

I am sorry, but it is the Archery Shooters Association, not the practicing for bowhunting season association. It is a target archery venue. As such there are classes.


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## jeff 55/75 (Sep 8, 2004)

Hey Dog it,s verry simple if you dont like the rules then *DONT WASTE YOUR MONEY .*The people that shoot A.S.A are there to compete not practice .


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

songdogshooter said:


> WHY NOT MAKE THE TRADITIONAL GUYS PUT SCOPES AND V-BARS ON THERE LONG BOWS ?????
> you are completly missing the point ! ! ! !
> its not about competition
> its about making it what it is
> ...


No I understand your point… But the ASA rules committee is made up of archers who COMPETE, they wrote the rule. What you do at the local level is up to the individual club... unless it is a sanctioned ASA event like a Qualifier, State championship or Sectional tournament in which case it is supposed to follow the ASA rules for course layout as well… (good luck on that one) I’ll lay odds your course is laid out for a hunter without regard for the ASA rules (most local clubs are this way) so why be concerned with the lens rule…?


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## GVDocHoliday (Jan 20, 2003)

It's a target competition, some like the bowhunter restrictions for a better challenge. Don't blame something like a lense for your inability to compete at a 40 yard max range when they are adhering to the same rules and restrictions you do. 

I'm sorry but I have a hard time justifying that I'm going to spend 25.00 at a local ASA shoot, and up to 300.00 for a national shoot, to just say I'm going to practice for hunting. I'm there to win and that's it. Bowhunter is not an introductory class for beginners, it is a full tilt competition. Bownovice is for the rookies, shoot there if that's all you're looking for.


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## t8ter (Apr 7, 2003)

Do you really think a lense is that much of an advantage?This is ASA remember "rain".Plus the movement it adds to your pin.Most of the great pin shooters don't use a lense.OOPs don't look to far into that last statement you'll find a hidden secret.


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

all i am saying is lets make it a little more realistic.....

and i can asure you it has nothing to do with my shooting abilitys 
i went to the nationals last year and shot like crap and still didnt do that bad
and including shooting a new string in ,in the motel room 
plus i have several trophys in my huntin room from bowhunter class....
it has nothing to do with anyones shooting abilitys...
i would just like to make it realistic thats all 
and yes we(our archery club) do caiter to the asa and there rules...
we are hosting an asa qualifier in may... again thats not the point i am trying to make... i guess its just that i would like to see it a litte more primitive...
i dont know maybe i am a little old school 
i think if its called traditional it just that..traditional gear only 
if its open then it just that ..open to all gear.....
if its bowhunter it just that... bowhunting gear only.....


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## SSIUV4L (Mar 4, 2005)

if it were in fact just bowhunting practice.....no one would have any reason to complain about what others are using

WE do not draw the line...ASA does, and i reckon they can draw it wherever they think it needs to be drawn..they will never please everyone

i shoot an HHA slider with no lense or a sure loc slider with an HHA head and no lense
the last 3d shoot i went to the top 2 in the open class shot no lense and scored 214 and 218 on 20 targets...50 yd max. they weren't complaining about all their competition shooting a lense. I myself am not in love with the idea of a lense in hunter class, but if that is the rule, then it's the rule. If we don't like it, we can go "practice" somewhere else...or learn to deal with it


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

Please understand that I’m not trying to be glib or harsh, but there is an organization that provides the rules you are searching for; it’s called THE Deerman… You might consider holding some of their style shoots as well, the hardcore hunters would love them. 

But I’m tired of visiting local shoots that claim to be ASA then set the courses up with targets that are behind brush at a maximum of 28 yards and you have to shoot ½ the targets from your knees… 

I visit them to practice for the ASA Pro/Ams and want to see low 12’s not center 11’s and trick shots…. That isn’t challenging it’s just ugly. 

BY the way I NEVER turn in a score card… except at an ASA Pro/AM…


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

JAVI said:


> Please understand that I’m not trying to be glib or harsh, but there is an organization that provides the rules you are searching for; it’s called THE Deerman… You might consider holding some of their style shoots as well, the hardcore hunters would love them.
> 
> But I’m tired of visiting local shoots that claim to be ASA then set the courses up with targets that are behind brush at a maximum of 28 yards and you have to shoot ½ the targets from your knees…
> 
> ...


Then you would love our courses.......I am not against hiding a head behind a tree......but the entire scoring ring will be completely visible from the stake, and we do not force anyone to shoot kneeling, on stools, in blinds, in treestands, whatever.

Around this area, let one branch, twig, blade of grass, leaf or anything end up inside the scoring rings and holy heck breaks loose from the shooters.


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

:amen:


reylamb said:


> Then you would love our courses.......I am not against hiding a head behind a tree......but the entire scoring ring will be completely visible from the stake, and we do not force anyone to shoot kneeling, on stools, in blinds, in treestands, whatever.
> 
> Around this area, let one branch, twig, blade of grass, leaf or anything end up inside the scoring rings and holy heck breaks loose from the shooters.


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

reylamb said:


> Then you would love our courses.......I am not against hiding a head behind a tree......but the entire scoring ring will be completely visible from the stake, and we do not force anyone to shoot kneeling, on stools, in blinds, in treestands, whatever.
> 
> Around this area, let one branch, twig, blade of grass, leaf or anything end up inside the scoring rings and holy heck breaks loose from the shooters.


That’s as it should be….

Don’t get me wrong, I see nothing wrong with and enjoy shooting the “REAL” hunting scenarios also; but with my hunting rig not my open rig. 

I just don’t think it’s right to advertise your club shoot as ASA, unless you follow the rules and have the correct targets. I’ve spent quite a bit of money traveling to and from shoots this year, only to find center 11’s and brush on short courses, with virtually no similarity to ASA courses. 

Again that’s fine just tell me straight up; so I can choose to participate or not without a long drive.


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

The only thing I will say is that we do not have McKenzies.....our club voted to keep the Rineys.....


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

reylamb said:


> The only thing I will say is that we do not have McKenzies.....our club voted to keep the Rineys.....


I can understand the reasoning behind that vote...:wink: But that is important to know for the folks who want to shoot the McKen... and should be told up front...


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## JLH (Feb 22, 2005)

If it were really hunting "practice" then they would be rewarding you with a 12 for a gut shot. (almost)
As others have stated, it is a archery competition, where you are trying to shoot the highest score within the rules.
Heck, you may want to outlaw target colored bows as well in hunter class.


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

:doh: *AS I HAVE STATED BEFORE IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH COMPETION READ THE WHOLE THREAD! ! ! !*


JLH said:


> If it were really hunting "practice" then they would be rewarding you with a 12 for a gut shot. (almost)
> As others have stated, it is a archery competition, where you are trying to shoot the highest score within the rules.
> Heck, you may want to outlaw target colored bows as well in hunter class.


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## Target Tony (Mar 3, 2003)

songdogshooter
Quote " if its bowhunter it just that... bowhunting gear only....." 

please define for me what real bowhunting equipment is ? :wink: 

maybe since you have issues with the ASA and its bowhunter class, you should shoot IBO rules. they have 2 differant classes that allow pins only. Hunter Class (HC) and Male Bowhunter Release (MBR).

Shoot Strong
Tony


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## LHpuncher (Apr 12, 2004)

did you ever wonder how many guys hunt with painted bows..........


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

Target Tony said:


> songdogshooter
> Quote " if its bowhunter it just that... bowhunting gear only....."
> 
> please define for me what real bowhunting equipment is ? :wink:
> ...


do you hunt with a lense????
does your state allow you to hunt with a lense????
bowhunting class to me is shoot with your hunting rig
what is your definition of the hunting class?????
i really like the low 12's cause i like to shoot deer in the heart 
as a matter of fact i shot 5 deer last year and all but one was in the heart 
i think the low 12's makes me a better hunter.....
again i really like the asa just thats the only issue i have and i have talked to *ALOT *of guys that agree with me even
at the nationals last year......
everyone talks about being more competative then why not shoot without a lense.....that to me would be more competative....how about you????
is the edge really that big ??????


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## t8ter (Apr 7, 2003)

Reylamb,I didn't mind shooting off them milk crates.


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## Top Cat (Jun 22, 2002)

Target Tony said:


> songdogshooter
> Quote " if its bowhunter it just that... bowhunting gear only....."
> 
> please define for me what real bowhunting equipment is ? :wink:
> ...




1. HUNTER CLASS (HC)
A compound, recurve, or longbow shot with or without sights. A sight shall have no more than four fixed, cross hair, or circle style pins without lens or magnification. If circle style pins are used, all circles must be the same size. A sight may have a rear aperture (ie. Peep sight or fixed rifle type sight). Sights may not be adjusted after entering the shooting course. Arrows must have screw in points and at least three feathers or vanes no less than four inches long (measured minimum 3.75in). Only one stabilizer may be used. The stabilizer shall be no more than twelve inches long, and extend no more than twelve inches from the point of attachment to the bow.


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

Top Cat said:


> 1. HUNTER CLASS (HC)
> A compound, recurve, or longbow shot with or without sights. A sight shall have no more than four fixed, cross hair, or circle style pins without lens or magnification. If circle style pins are used, all circles must be the same size. A sight may have a rear aperture (ie. Peep sight or fixed rifle type sight). Sights may not be adjusted after entering the shooting course. Arrows must have screw in points and at least three feathers or vanes no less than four inches long (measured minimum 3.75in). Only one stabilizer may be used. The stabilizer shall be no more than twelve inches long, and extend no more than twelve inches from the point of attachment to the bow.


Yep that's IBO rules... but not ASA...


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

t8ter said:


> Reylamb,I didn't mind shooting off them milk crates.


Yeah but tater.........you were the only person that liked that shoot.........w/15 turkeys on top of the milk crates!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## bhtr3d (Feb 13, 2004)

Top Cat said:


> 1. HUNTER CLASS (HC)
> A compound, recurve, or longbow shot with or without sights. A sight shall have no more than four fixed, cross hair, or circle style pins without lens or magnification. If circle style pins are used, all circles must be the same size. A sight may have a rear aperture (ie. Peep sight or fixed rifle type sight). Sights may not be adjusted after entering the shooting course. Arrows must have screw in points and at least three feathers or vanes no less than four inches long (measured minimum 3.75in). Only one stabilizer may be used. The stabilizer shall be no more than twelve inches long, and extend no more than twelve inches from the point of attachment to the bow.



So shooting my blazer fletching isn't considered bowhunting equipment? hhhhmmmm. I wonder if my pendilum site would be marked as not bowhunting equipment too.


Yes, I know these are the IBO rules for HunterClass.. 
I guess I can't copy and paste well.


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## shootstraight (Apr 28, 2005)

*If you can't beat em...*

I got a lens this year to shoot unlimited then read the rules and find out I can use it in hunter, soooo why not. My eyes need all the help I can get. So don't whine and complain or critisize those that do, just get a lens.


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

shootstraight said:


> I got a lens this year to shoot unlimited then read the rules and find out I can use it in hunter, soooo why not. My eyes need all the help I can get. So don't whine and complain or critisize those that do, just get a lens.



I am not whineing and i am not complaining .....
couple of things i would like to say.. first off 
if i couldnt see very well and had to get a lense to hunt or shoot 3d, 
i would like to think i am smart enough not to talk trash to someone that could probally out shoot me with pins ! ! ! ! !
second if my eyes were that bad... i think the next thing for me to worry about would be my future and the safty of others on the 3d range(i would almost be blind)........
*IN ANOTHER WORDS I WOULD QUIT BEFORE I GOT ONE ! ! ! ! *


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## bhtr3d (Feb 13, 2004)

Well to answer this quite simply.....ITS your choice....no one says you have to or not. So if you feel you need to then by all means go ahead. Not everyone that shoots in Unlimited shoots with a lense anyhow. As well as not everyone in open or semi or pro shoot with a lense... It's a matter of preference and that is how it should be. 

There is no need to have umteen classes because oh i dont shoot with a lense and i only use feathers and are 4inches long, So I need at to have a class for that.


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## Top Cat (Jun 22, 2002)

bhtr3d said:


> So shooting my blazer fletching isn't considered bowhunting equipment? hhhhmmmm. I wonder if my pendilum site would be marked as not bowhunting equipment too.
> 
> 
> Yes, I know these are the IBO rules for HunterClass..
> I guess I can't copy and paste well.


 I believe your pendilum sight is hunting equipment but those blazers are deffinatly target stuff:wink: 
I dont care what people shoot. I shoot for fun not money. Right now I shoot pins in the open class. 
Just have one class and shoot what you bring.


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## JAVI (Jun 19, 2003)

bhtr3d said:


> Well to answer this quite simply.....ITS your choice....no one says you have to or not. So if you feel you need to then by all means go ahead. Not everyone that shoots in Unlimited shoots with a lense anyhow. As well as not everyone in open or semi or pro shoot with a lense... It's a matter of preference and that is how it should be.
> 
> There is no need to have umteen classes because oh i dont shoot with a lense and i only use feathers and are 4inches long, So I need at to have a class for that.


Gosh that's all we need..... next thing will be a class for right handed archers shooting left handed bows while standing on their heads.....:behindsof


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## LHpuncher (Apr 12, 2004)

how about a class for left handed archers shooting right handed bows?????????


if they do that i'm in.........    :wink:


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## Cyberone (Jun 8, 2002)

The ASA is about competition not getting ready for hunting. I shoot HC with a lens. If you don't like the lens don't shoot one but don't take it away from those that do. I find that it helps with definition. If you have not tried one maybe you should. I don't hunt as much as I shoot 3-D because of my kids playing soccer during the fall. Some of the better shooters in Hunter don't shoot a lens. There is nothing about shooting in hunter class that is hunting situations. I have never had a deer walk out in a wide open lane and stand there while I look at him thru the binos, range him, look thru binos again, draw and shoot. 

It is what it is Competition.


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## 1wayin (Mar 26, 2006)

> I have never had a deer walk out in a wide open lane and stand there while I look at him thru the binos, range him, look thru binos again, draw and shoot.


They can't walk away with those stakes in their feet?Gee whiz


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## srcarlso (Mar 3, 2005)

*Bowhunter Class - no lens!*

Bow Hunter Class should be NO LENS - just my 2 cents. It is called BOWHUNTER for a reason. How about an Open Pin class.


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## TAYLOR CO. (Jun 9, 2005)

songdogshooter said:


> do you hunt with a lense????
> does your state allow you to hunt with a lense????
> bowhunting class to me is shoot with your hunting rig
> what is your definition of the hunting class?????
> ...


I don't hunt w/field points either!
Yes we can use them here in GA!
Use a camoed bow only! 
Well the 12-ring is not a heart shot in ASA! It is a good low-lung which bleeds them out qwik. Shoot a real Hog 3'oclock in the 10-ring and see what happens! You will not get any penetration!
What are your scores in Hunter Class...That's competitive! There's plenty of competition to oblige anyone! 
IMO ASA has it right! Have a nice day.


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## Cougar Mag (Jun 17, 2003)

Tell you what......lets change scenarios. If ASA shoots are only for competing, then ASA needs only to have two classes.......Pros and amateur and let anything go. 

Bowhunting is bowhunting and target shooting is target shooting. If there is to be a true bowhunter's class there should be no lens and the course should be set up as it would be in bowhunting settings. Our club has many more shooters in the bowhunters class. If we would change and allow shooters in that particular class to use a lens, we would lose 1/2 of our shooters. 

Another beef I have with ASA is the rediculous scoring rings. Once in a while a guy can get lucky with a bad shot and score higher on a target than a truly good shot. Give me IBO any day.


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

TAYLOR CO. said:


> I don't hunt w/field points either!
> Yes we can use them here in GA!
> Use a camoed bow only!
> Well the 12-ring is not a heart shot in ASA! It is a good low-lung which bleeds them out qwik. Shoot a real Hog 3'oclock in the 10-ring and see what happens! You will not get any penetration!
> ...


if i thought it would do any good i would argue with you but i dont think your
*DADDY KNOWS YOUR ON HIS PUTER LIL' BOY ! ! ! !*


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## Swamp Booger (Apr 16, 2006)

*What about the new guy???*

I read most of this listed form. What about the new guy? The 13 year old kid that thinks the Bowhunter class has something to with bow"hunting". I am not saying re-write all of the rules to make bow hunters happy, just make a class which gives entry leval shooters... people who prefer to hunt with there bow instead of getting paid to shoot one... a place to compete. The more accomidating a ASA shoot is the more shooters show-up. The more shooters the more friends and family thus the more revcenue generated.


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## TAYLOR CO. (Jun 9, 2005)

songdogshooter said:


> if i thought it would do any good i would argue with you but i dont think your
> *DADDY KNOWS YOUR ON HIS PUTER LIL' BOY ! ! ! !*


Before you stoop to that level read my profile...I have been shooting bows for 27-yrs. There really is no arguement! You pose a question and someone wants to put in their Opinion and you don't like...so your right and everyone else is wrong See you in Oak Ridge. I'll be there w/my lense and multi-pins...when hunting rolls around I'll simply screw the lense out. That's my choice and we are all entitled to our own choices.
Next time you start jumping on someone about being a child...check the profile...my puter is only accesible to me and my kids are in College...you were 5 when I was shooting deer with a bow...Have a happy resurection day!


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## songdogshooter (Jan 18, 2005)

TAYLOR CO. said:


> Before you stoop to that level read my profile...I have been shooting bows for 27-yrs. There really is no arguement! You pose a question and someone wants to put in their Opinion and you don't like...so your right and everyone else is wrong See you in Oak Ridge. I'll be there w/my lense and multi-pins...when hunting rolls around I'll simply screw the lense out. That's my choice and we are all entitled to our own choices.
> Next time you start jumping on someone about being a child...check the profile...my puter is only accesible to me and my kids are in College...you were 5 when I was shooting deer with a bow...Have a happy resurection day!


 where do you think a deers heart is?????? (under his lungs) 
first off i was not jumping on you ...
if you thought that i am sorry 
that was not my intension
i was joking cause i thought you were ....
yea our club president is about your age 
he has shot indoor comp. and 3d comp. 
he still shoots like crap...
being seasoned dont mean anything.....
i know some veterans that shoot lights out 
and i know some young guys that do the same 
age has nothing to do with it...
i put the thread up to get opinions....
*IF YOU DONT LIKE MY COMMENT LEAVE! ! ! ! *
i am me you if dont like me ......sorry 
i dont mean any disrespect....
this is just my opinion


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## sanka (Dec 26, 2002)

*asa*

no


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## REDX (May 8, 2004)

I know alot of people that hunt with a lens. Alson know people that shoot the open class without one. and if you guys actually think a lens helps you that much try shooting with it in a hard rain prine examples Oak Ridge last year and Wetumpka this year.

rules are rules and are set place for the better of the whole not the few or one. if you don't like them find another venue.

IMHO If you guys would practice as much as you whine on here you would realize that it doesn't matter what the other guy is using.


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## TAYLOR CO. (Jun 9, 2005)

REDX said:


> I know alot of people that hunt with a lens. Alson know people that shoot the open class without one. and if you guys actually think a lens helps you that much try shooting with it in a hard rain prine examples Oak Ridge last year and Wetumpka this year.
> 
> rules are rules and are set place for the better of the whole not the few or one. if you don't like them find another venue.
> 
> IMHO If you guys would practice as much as you whine on here you would realize that it doesn't matter what the other guy is using.


Nice post! My sentiments exactly!:darkbeer: If you like'em use'em if not don't. 
dog... try shooting the hog in the 10-ring and see what happens I've shot probably 50 or so w/ the bow and that shot generally will yield just what I said...No penetration. I respect the fact that young eyes are better than older or others eyes...that's why I shoot a lense. Leave...I ain't goin' no where....except to Oak Ridge and get what I can get by the rules set fourth by ASA. Don't try to say that you didn't jump on me You know that you did by bringing my Father into it...My father is nearly 70-yrs. old! I just responded to the absurd comment that you made in regards to that otherwise It would have been over...as far as I am concerned it is..
THE RULE SAYS WE CAN SHOOT A LENS IN HUNTER CLASS ASA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## 1wayin (Mar 26, 2006)

REDX said:


> I know alot of people that hunt with a lens. Alson know people that shoot the open class without one. and if you guys actually think a lens helps you that much try shooting with it in a hard rain prine examples Oak Ridge last year and Wetumpka this year.
> 
> rules are rules and are set place for the better of the whole not the few or one. if you don't like them find another venue.
> 
> IMHO If you guys would practice as much as you whine on here you would realize that it doesn't matter what the other guy is using.


Thats great


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## slinger09 (Oct 11, 2004)

If you are only shooting 3d for staying in tune for bow season then why don't you just shoot a fun round and skip the competition part completely?


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## jeff 55/75 (Sep 8, 2004)

I cant stand it any more  I hunt with hunt a lens bought one just for hunting in low light one of those yellow ones . Now keep in mind I only hunt out of ground blinds so I am protected from the elements .

I cant say it has helped me when it comes to deer but it sure did come in handy when I drilled two bob cats at over 30yds .

Also I shoot A.S.A where I cant use a lens no big deal its competition not hunting . I use blazers for hunting and A.S.A they work great for both :zip:


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## 3rdplace (Jan 3, 2004)

When I shot in Hunter I used a lens. I don't see a great advantage when a 4X lens (.500 diopter) only truly magnifies about 1.8 times.

As far as hunting I have many customers that use a lens while hunting. If it helps make a humane kill then by all means use it if it is legal.

Keep the rule as it stands IMO.


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## TundraMan (Nov 1, 2003)

A bowhunter class should not have lens IMHO. But then again, a bowhunter class SHOULD have broadheads!:wink:


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