# Blank Bale..What Am I Missing?



## bgviii (Feb 16, 2010)

So I've been reading a lot about blank bale shooting. Shooting with eyes closed, open, you name it. Here's my issue. I can shoot for hours with zen like perfection, regardless of release set fast or with a long pull, on a blank bale. I've had my shot timed and the repetition and the form of the shot seems flawless. Around 7-9 seconds, like I like. However, as soon as I try to duplicate the shot when aiming at the X (5 spot NFAA), the timing of the shot does not coordinate with the aiming process. As soon as I try to coordinate the aiming and the shot, the target panic tries to creep back. It's not terrible, I shoot 300 around 45x. But I'm trying to get back into that 57-60x level I was at years ago. The more focused I become during the shot the less it replicates the blank bale shot or so it seems. If I stick with the blank bale shot, the arrow may not be settled at all when release goes off. It's a nice surprise shot and then another surprise that its a 4 or almost a 4 when I look at it again in disbelief. lol. That doesn't mean that the aimed shot doesn't work it's just not that sweet spot where the aim is floating easy while the release takes care of itself that I remember in my younger years. Suggestions? Months of blank baling doesn't seem to help other than I have a great follow through. Thanks!


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## stoz (Aug 23, 2002)

Not that this will help alot when you're probably in the middle of leagues and tournament season but here's what I do. I plan pre season what the date is I want to be shooting at 20 yards. For me its mid December. Than I determine the number of days I shoot per week and figure out how far I have to move back each time I shoot until I get to 20 yards. Continue to start your sessions with bb so you create the feel you want. I keep score every time so you will expect to shoot clean each time. The bad part is you need access to a 20 yard range many times a week. But it depends how bad you want it.hope this helps.


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## bgviii (Feb 16, 2010)

I live 15 minutes from my club and I have a key. Plus I have my short range in my basement. I will put it the time because I want this now more than ever...My question is then not to really blank bale but spot shoot close to coordinate the timing and the aim process? Because just shooting perfect form arrows over and over doesn't seem to be gaining ground. To rephrase you are saying retime the shot at close range when it's easy to stay in the X and then when I can shoot that distance clean, move back? 5 yard increments? Thanks. I appreciate the input!


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## RCR_III (Mar 19, 2011)

I would work on shooting up close. It will change the way your brain is perceiving the task at hand. You will re train yourself to think you can't miss an x this way. Working your way back in increments to help you get back on track at 20. 

Also, quit tyring to control your aiming. Right now you're focusing too much on your float and the way things look because of the differences from when you were shooting at times before. 

This could be related to draw length, draw weight, holding weight, or any other number of factors. Or, it could just be you over thinking and trying to be controlling to get things back in order. 

Working up close, your float won't look as big because you will be staying inside the x ring area. This will allow your brain to not stress on the float and start and stop the shot. That's what you are needing to have in your brain. The knowledge to know you can put the pin on the x.... then start your shot execution and let things happen as they may. When you get an x reward yourself. Take a moment while your muscles are recovering between shots to tell yourself you did things right by relaxing and letting it happen, or whatever it may be to say to yourself. And if you should miss an x, then try to think about why or what happened to do so. Over aiming still, getting too close to the end of your shot window and breaking down, distractions came into your mind and pulled you off your task, or whatever it may have been. Then come up with a plan to not do that again. Even if it's just saying to yourself, don't do that again haha


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

Your problem is accuracy, what I mean by this is that the moment that you move back you are now worried about how accurate the shot is going to be and this adds stress to your execution that wasn't present when you were just doing the blank thing. I think you just need to ask yourself a few simple questions:

1. Are you able to shot a 5-spot x?

2. Are you a good shooter?

3. Have you done the hours of work to deserve to shoot well?

If you answer no to these questions sell your stuff and buy a cheap harley and enjoy, if you answered yes to these questions then you are a few mental tweeks from shooting really well.

Just let go of any thoughts of accuracy and simply work on executing perfect shots, the moment that you make this decision you will change forever as a shooter. Why is there a change, because you stop worrying about where the arrow is hitting and forcing it to hit well and you can just relax and execute good shots and enjoy the arrow hitting where it should have. Just last night I didn't shoot overly well and I was missing a few x's early which was weird because I haven't been missing lately hardly at all and the fact is I didn't really even look at the target and where the arrow were hitting. I didn't doubt my bow or my ability to shoot well, I just took a step back for a moment and reminded myself to slow down a little and settle in executing a perfect shot and within a few minutes I was banging the x ring again and even though I missed a few and felt weird by never having doubt creep into my system to cloud things I was able to simply shoot and enjoy my evening on the shooting line.

I have been shooting beyond good lately and in the past when I was shooting well like this the moment that I started off a shooting session and something wasn't right or I missed a few I let doubt creep in and I let accuracy of my shooting dictate my thoughts to the point where I simply sucked the rest of the day ending up tweeking my processes or trying to force things to be perfect and the trip to my truck after the session was a depressing one to say the least. Now I simply don't do this because I have answered the three simple questions above and I am now able to really move on to awesome shooting.

You need to go to my website and read my mental approach articles and I also have some good indoor shooting sessions on there that you may enjoy doing, one of them is the paper plate session and it is my form of blank bailing because I hate doing the blank thing. The running totals one is awesome also and my most used session.

Just do a google search for:

Padgettarchery blog


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

When I say let go of accuracy I am talking about 20 yards or 50 yards or 70 yards not blank bailing, of course when up close on a blank target you aren't worried about accuracy but I am talking about actually being on the shooting line at 20 yards.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Beings you're doing fairly well, perhaps you need to "transfer" the shot. This is alternating between the blank bale (1 shot) and target (1 shot). Probably a loose description, but that you say you do good on the blank bale it's a matter of transferring it to the target. I've got it buried somewhere in my computer, Terry Wunderle article. If I understand the principle distance doesn't matter, but I think Terry noted 10 yards.


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## AJ the TP Guru (Jul 29, 2011)

As to what you are missing, the answer is nothing at all. Your comments mirror a very high percentage of the comments I hear every day. I even have a user (the one who appears with the lioness on my REVIEWS page) who owned a bowshop, and told me he blank baled so much that he robinhooded as many arrows as most guys will shoot in a lifetime, with no transference to the field.


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## stoz (Aug 23, 2002)

Only move back a step each time. You won't notice difference. At close range your timing should be same as bb. This will allow your brain to relax and you will expect the x not hope for it


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## bgviii (Feb 16, 2010)

Thanks for the input..I think I do have some break down as the shot progresses and I lose my timing in conjuction with the aim, I get panicky. I will try the close spots. It seems logical. 
Socket man, I like your premise but I'm wondering what is your focus on the line to defer the pressure of score, aiming or whatever is causing the break down? Are you focusing on the dot, the X, or the release itself to maintain the shot sequence...or maybe nothing at all?? Just curious.


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## bgviii (Feb 16, 2010)

Oh and last question before I get back to work, when reprogramming my shot with my trusty hinge, is a long gradual pull better with no click or just continue with the click and the hotter release? I currently shoot better now with click and hot to try to get my mind out of it, but I have no problem thinking long term.
Thanks guys! Fantastic input!


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

The problem with moving back a little at a time is that you are saying to yourself that I suck, I can't hit a x at 20 yards because I am not very good and I have to start at 8 yards and then spend the next two months working my way back to 18 yards to hit that x that I am not good enough to hit right now. Then in another 2 months I can hopefully move back to 20 yards to that incredibly long shot and hopefully my 4 months of training will allow me to hit a few x's.

Screw this, you are already good enough to hit a x at 20 yards. Hitting thousands of x's at 9 yards isn't going to tackle the mental issues that have forced you up there in the first place, the stress that you are placing on yourself to shoot accurately is the issue.

This stress really sucks, I became a good shooter and had already gotten a couple top ten finishes in the open b class at asa national events when I was on the practice bales with some pro shooters and I was watching levi morgan shoot at 50 yards. He simply didn't miss one of the little black 1.25 inch dots on the bags for 20 minutes or so and it was something that I thought about for months and then one day I had something happen inside my brain very similar to the things I was talking about in my post above. Since then that 1.25 inch dot is something that I simply really don't miss at 40 yards when I am shooting at home on my practice range and I am not worried about holding on the dot perfectly or praying that I hit it. I just execute my shot and the arrow hits it over and over. I have even had my own little 25 minute glory session where I did it at 50 yards on two special days this last summer. 

So again don't tell me that I have to bang x's at 9 freaking yards for months and that something is going to magically happen in my head and then I can hopefully hit a x at 20 yards, to me that is a slap in my face or anyone elses face. But stepping back and breaking down the target panic issues that are built up in your head that are holding you back is a discussion worth having.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

Click or no click is just a choice and you really should get a second hinge and set one of each up and train with them all the time and over time one of them will stand out as your dominant choice. 

Again on my website there is hinge shooting articles and you really should do the hinge setup routine and read the firing engines and pick a couple of them and become proficient at them. I will send you my new hinge shooter pm and even though you really aren't new it is a good guide to pushing the reset button on what you are doing.


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## bgviii (Feb 16, 2010)

Thanks again. You are talking about confidence trumping fear. The confidence to go for it even if I fail rather than micro manage each shot? Do you have a preference about concentrating on dot , X or release...or nothing? I say nothing because Reo Wilde once told my wife to find that place where there is nothing....I haven't found it yet LOL. I will check out the sites. Very interesting.


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## stoz (Aug 23, 2002)

Padgett
im not disagreeing with you but I know this works if you put in the time. Unfortunately he probably doesn't have that off season time to work on this so your approach is probably best at this moment for him.


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## RCR_III (Mar 19, 2011)

I will say that you should concentrate on the target. Not in a controlling manner, just starting blankly at it the whole time. What you look at is what your brain will align what needs to be done to hit it. Once you start going back and forth from target to dot or target to release or whatever it may be is where you get into trouble and lose focus. I put my pin on the x and then just look at the x after that.


bgviii said:


> Thanks again. You are talking about confidence trumping fear. The confidence to go for it even if I fail rather than micro manage each shot? Do you have a preference about concentrating on dot , X or release...or nothing? I say nothing because Reo Wilde once told my wife to find that place where there is nothing....I haven't found it yet LOL. I will check out the sites. Very interesting.


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

if you are referring to the "shot window" timing drill, when you say "timing your shot"....it will do you no good, until your shot execution is firmly imbedded in the subconscious process, and will run reliably by itself, on it's own naturally and internally developed cadence.
the purpose of blind baling, is to imbed the muscular activity of the shot process into the internal administration, that will run the shot. until that is accomplished, there can be no specific timing of the shot's progression.


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## aread (Dec 25, 2009)

The problem is due to your subconscious getting different cues on the blank bale than it does at 20 yards. At 20 yards, your subconscious thinks it's supposed to be in TP mode. 

When you've laid the groundwork on the blank bale, then you have to slowly transition to 20 yards. This transition is a process of training your subconscious what it's supposed to do at that distance. 

I expect that there is a distance where you can shoot at a target as well as you can shoot at the blank bale. It may only be 2 yards, but you can nail a paper plate at that distance every time and do it with the same form that you trained on the blank bale. It may be a distance greater than 2 yards, but you KNOW that you can keep your BB form together with no signs of TP. 

Shoot a few days at that distance. Get used to aiming again and subconsciously running the same execution that you learned on the BB. After you feel comfortable, step back a little. Maybe a yard, maybe two, but make sure that at the new distance you can nail the paper plate every time while running your BB form and execution.

Keep stepping back a yard or two, but only when you KNOW for sure that you can run your BB form and execution. If you screw up an arrow or two, go back to the previous distance for a few more days. Work on the thing that you screwed up, because that's the part of your form or execution that you don't trust to operate without conscious supervision.

Take it slow, you are retraining your brain for new habits and that takes a while.

If you have to go shoot league or a tournament, go ahead, but put as little importance as possible on scoring. Focus only on staying relaxed, keeping your BB form and running your BB execution. It likely will be a little setback, but it's not fatal. We often develop TP because we are trying for scores that our current form is not capable of. So we try harder and the scores may improve for a time, but sooner or later will get worse, then the little problems creep in and as we try harder still, they get worse and worse. So, for the time being, at a scored shoot, try to relax and just see what scores your current form will get for you. Look at a tournament as a check to see if your form is as good as you want it to be. For almost all of us, it's not good enough, but don't "try harder" at the tournament, save that for your practice time. If you are lucky, the tournament can tell you what you need to work on the most.

During this short distance training, don't worry about where on the paper plate you hit. Pretend that the entire paper plate is the X ring. Once you get to 20 yards, you can start shrinking the X ring. The goal is to be able to run the form and execution that you learned on the BB at any distance. Once you can do that, refining your accuracy will be much easier.

Hope this helps,
Allen


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## Ned250 (Aug 10, 2009)

Padgett said:


> I have been shooting beyond good lately and in the past when I was shooting well like this the moment that I started off a shooting session and something wasn't right or I missed a few I let doubt creep in and I let accuracy of my shooting dictate my thoughts to the point where I simply sucked the rest of the day ending up tweeking my processes or trying to force things to be perfect and the trip to my truck after the session was a depressing one to say the least. Now I simply don't do this because I have answered the three simple questions above and I am now able to really move on to awesome shooting.


This x 100000


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## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

Padgett said:


> The problem with moving back a little at a time is that you are saying to yourself that I suck,
> 
> you are already good enough to hit a x at 20 yards. Hitting thousands of x's at 9 yards isn't going to tackle the mental issues that have forced you up there in the first place, the stress that you are placing on yourself to shoot accurately is the issue.


Agree 1,000,000,000%

Anywhere in the 40-50X average game means you are very close to getting all of the things to come together. The blind bale is just for getting the feeling of your release down without the pressure of aiming. You would benefit more from studying your sight picture without the pressure of shooting. What some guys call the "let down drill", is the place to do that. Draw, find the middle, hold it there as best you can for as long as you can, then let down.

You need to learn how to aim. People here will kick and scream saying that is the wrong approach, and that you shouldn't focus on trying to hold the dot in the middle, but if you do that, you will not just hit Xs regularly, you'll put the arrow inside them. Trust nothing. Learn how to put the dot in the middle. Combine that with a focused release and confidence you gain from seeing it happen several times over and you will get there.

I think the short game is better served for those in the 290ish range, if there is any use for it at all.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

I just wanted to shock your system with the way I presented myself in this thread in the beginning, sure I do some short range shooting. I just did some earlier this week but I didn't look at the short range shooting as something that was going to mystically going to change my brain or something because it isn't. I went up and shot a blank bale at 9 yards or so because I wanted to just feel my execution of the shot an have nothing else going on and yeah it was a nice 10 or so shots that I enjoyed feeling.

Then I went back to 20 yards and I activated my aiming at a x on my target and I floated on that x while I executed the exact same feeling shot that I was feeling up close. This is the key is to learn to smoothly execute shots without any funny little jerks or pulls or forces happening during the shot that like to pull the pin in funny directions.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

You asked two times about my focus wheather it is on the dot the target or the release, Just sitting here I can't even answer the question. I have been sitting here for a few minutes thinking about it and I keep coming back to the fact that right now 100% of my focus is on me executing perfect shots, for me my personality slows down a little and my vision of my surroundings tightens up a little and I become aware of every single inch of my body. So really not one thing gets total attention but I am totally committed to execution and nothing else.


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## stoz (Aug 23, 2002)

Just goes to show you find what works for you. MAny opinions. Good luck


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

Now the question becomes EXECUTING WHAT? 

For me in the last two years I have really became a solid shooter that went from only feeling a good execution once every 10 to 15 shots in the beginning once I started looking for them to now I shoot hundreds in a row many times without even one poor execution. I shouldn't give perfect execution to all of the hundreds that I have in a row, I would probably say that 80% is perfect and 19.5% is good and .5% is poor. 

So to me once I identified what I considered to be a perfect shot I stepped back and visualized what it really felt like and tried to do it again, in the beginning it would have been one issue such as firing of my release but as I have progressed it has become much more complex because I have given the green light to my form and my mental approach and my firing of the release and my follow through and my draw cycle and my anchor and my vision of the target and my peep lining up with my scope. Every little detail has been finalized and I have nothing left to work on and I am 100% happy with each of them so that now I can just allow myself to tighten up my focus on the job at hand and execute each and every area of the shot more as a supervisor of the shot and not really being involved. This is what I consider a perfectly executed shot.

Notice that not one time did I mention accuracy in my description of a well executed shot, the arrow hitting the center of a x is just a byproduct of it and nothing else. Just yesterday I missed a x and I remember telling the guy shooting with me that it had felt like a great shot and I had no idea why it missed, it didn't bother me at all and I just executed a good one on the next shot and went on with my shooting.


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## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

bgviii said:


> I've had my shot timed and the repetition and the form of the shot seems flawless. Around 7-9 seconds, like I like. However, as soon as I try to duplicate the shot when aiming at the X (5 spot NFAA), the timing of the shot does not coordinate with the aiming process. As soon as I try to coordinate the aiming and the shot, the target panic tries to creep back.


Sorry I missed this the first time I read it. Simple answer, stop trying to time your shots. Find the center, when the dot settles, start the release.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

When cbrunson says when the dot settles he doesn't mean when the dot is perfect, to shoot with your personal float pattern you have to learn that at no time are you looking for the pin to be perfect and then make the shot. Sure sometimes the pin will stop for a few seconds and it is really cool when this happens but it isn't your focus and should never be your focus or goal. You simply allow as you come to anchor and check your bubble for you pin to settle in on the spot you want to hit and then you start your firing engine and let it run and you pin will move around a little during this time and sooner or later your hinge will fire and send the arrow on its way. Done.

The moment that you decide that you are going to settle in and wait for the pin to be perfectly still in the center is when you are screwed and target panic is going to bite you in the butt.


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## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

Padgett said:


> Now the question becomes EXECUTING WHAT?
> 
> For me in the last two years I have really became a solid shooter that went from only feeling a good execution once every 10 to 15 shots in the beginning once I started looking for them to now I shoot hundreds in a row many times without even one poor execution. I shouldn't give perfect execution to all of the hundreds that I have in a row, I would probably say that 80% is perfect and 19.5% is good and .5% is poor.
> 
> ...


Now step back to the point when you were NOT executing perfectly and needed to analyze certain characteristics of your form/release/holding. Reflect on the things that you did have to focus on to get to the point where it became second nature.


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## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

Padgett said:


> When cbrunson says when the dot settles he doesn't mean when the dot is perfect, to shoot with your personal float pattern you have to learn that at no time are you looking for the pin to be perfect and then make the shot. Sure sometimes the pin will stop for a few seconds and it is really cool when this happens but it isn't your focus and should never be your focus or goal. You simply allow as you come to anchor and check your bubble for you pin to settle in on the spot you want to hit and then you start your firing engine and let it run and you pin will move around a little during this time and sooner or later your hinge will fire and send the arrow on its way. Done.
> 
> The moment that you decide that you are going to settle in and wait for the pin to be perfectly still in the center is when you are screwed and target panic is going to bite you in the butt.


This is correct.

However, studying what your dot is doing when you hold it there and experimenting with different things to get the movement reduced to nearly no percievable movement is possible. Then watch it through the release process, to see what is happening to it. Then you can refine that part with the dot in sight. That is further down the road though, when you have it at least floating in the X. You get to that point consistently, and you start "one-hole"ing spots.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

Yeppers, Just last night I had been shooting for the last week or so with more of a yield of my hand as my firing engine and I had adjusted my sight for this engine. it being a softer kind of shot my follow through doesn't jump forward as much when the shot fires and it hits about a quarter inch lower than my normal dominant firing enigne so last night I decided to go ahead and shoot with my dominant one and I decided to go ahead and shoot without adjusting the sight and just see how the arrow hit and they hit dead on or on the upper half of the x and I did shoot out the top a couple times until I clicked the sight back to the appropriate setting.

So yeah I do agree that you have to really be solid and then you can start feeling the little subtle things that go along with the different methods that you are using and then decide which ones are best for you.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

Not only is there a difference in the poi of those two firing engines but my float pattern isn't the same either, with the yield firing engine my float is slightly larger and it is more fluid and relaxed feeling in a good way. With my squeeze and pull engine my float pattern is smaller and it feels like something is putting the brakes on it and slowing it down and it does float but it is much more slow in its pattern. Now it does act like a elephant though in respect to when it starts heading out the door there is no stopping it because of the momentum so even though it is a slow float once it starts out the door don't even try to stop it. I just let down.

It is so cool to me to be able to choose what kind of shooter I want to be, either a more relaxed and passive one just sitting against the wall or a smooth pull into the wall with some rotation.


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## AJ the TP Guru (Jul 29, 2011)

I really hope the OP (and others) have advanced their level of accuracy while lowering their tendency towards target panic due to Padgett's input. The guy knows whereof he speaks. No question but that if one practiced diligently, and was able to assimilate and incorporate his instruction as their own, success would follow.

I have no such thoughts about the "instruction" of ronw or aread; I rather figure no one has ever benefitted from their my-way-or-the-highway approach.

Nutsand bolts shows up on these threads from time to time offering good advice, but I'm guessing he opts to spend more of his time with paying clientele, same as me.

I have my doubts how useful any of these threads are in terms of actually "fixing" folks' game of archery. My experience says not very. Thing is, more often than not, the input just goes in one ear and out the other. I speak here from the time when I too, offered free advice (and free recorded subliminal messages) on another forum. I spent a lot of time, both via email and replying to threads, in attempting to right the ship for the target panic afflicted. Success rates varied, but they were not nearly what they have been since I opted for a pay site.

Over time it became obvious that a lot of guys were just wasting my time by not taking seriously enough what I was trying to impart to them. My best guess is that because it was free, it was not thought to be worth much.


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## unclejane (Jul 22, 2012)

AJ the TP Guru said:


> I have no such thoughts about the "instruction" of ronw or aread; I rather figure no one has ever benefitted from their my-way-or-the-highway approach.


Well I have. Though I don't think there's anyone yet in any of these threads that I haven't learnt something valuable from. But like it or not, ron w is right to talk about the notion of fundamentals and basics - this seems to be what he gets the most pushback on in terms of subject matter. I find that kind of odd personally, but there it is for better or worse.

This itself is a fundamental of any sport or activity. As I've said before, within a pretty wide range of variation, there really is a core invariant in a fundamental that, once strayed from a certain amount, starts to produce poor results as you deviate from it further. Yes of course it's arguable a) what those fundamentals might be and b) how restrictive they are, but I don't think "anything goes" is a good approach either.

But I can't deny the points made by, well, pretty much everyone in these threads. I can't really take sides there, but c'mon fellers.... lets give ron w an ear also. Yeah his presentation can be gruff, but we're all adults here... 

LS


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## PSE Archer (Oct 26, 2014)

aread said:


> The problem is due to your subconscious getting different cues on the blank bale than it does at 20 yards. At 20 yards, your subconscious thinks it's supposed to be in TP mode.
> 
> When you've laid the groundwork on the blank bale, then you have to slowly transition to 20 yards. This transition is a process of training your subconscious what it's supposed to do at that distance.
> 
> ...


Good post Allen. 

The shooter needs to focus on the process. Breaks your shot down into chunks and focus in those peices. All the peices make a whole. But you have to have all the peices.


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## snowshovler (Oct 15, 2011)

I'm not a great shot with a bow but I can shoot extremely well offhand (standing) with a match rifle so take this for where it comes from... I was having a difficult time trusting the slight movement, aka float, would still allow me to hit the X ring at 50 meters. With a .22 the X is about the size of a dime. I wanted to know where to aim, look at, etc. An Olympic level coach had me take the front aperture out of the sight and shoot. I had nothing to focus on but sight alignment and trigger squeeze. The sight pic. encompassed an area about twice the size of the aperture and I figured no way would it work but I trusted his advice, aligned the sights and pressured the trigger. The group opened up a bit but still held the 9 ring (guessing 1 1/2" dia. been a long time). What this did was taught me to trust myself and ignore the slight movement and stop trying to fix it. The movement is so slight humans do not have the motor control to stop it and we end up magnifying the problem. I also had to have my setup (natural point of aim, alignment etc.) dead nuts on. We also shot at distance at large (encompasses peripheral vision so you can't cheat), blank pieces of paper. Set up, take a shot, step away then repeat. You learn how consistent your setup is by how tight the group is. I learned I need a much more open stance to accomodate my frame. Not sure how to set this up for archery but I bet it'd be enlightening and helpful. These two drills were exceptionally helpful. With the gun, when I hold and allow the sights to find a rhythm and focus on execution things work and the Xs fall. Sometimes the sight pic at the break is awful but the X still falls. Try taking any aiming aid out of the front housing and just shoot. Archery seems to be hyperfocused on grip, draw length, anchor, etc. which are important. Just a guess but starting the setup at the soles of our feet might be a good place to remove any tension which we will also have to damp in addition to what is inherent by holding 5-10 pounds of bow out in front of us.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

And I can't see naming names and telling of wrong if someone replies of what they believe. Let's post our "two cents" of the topic and go on. Right or wrong, whoever reads such will choose what they want to accept. AJ even noted close to the same; "more often than not, the input just goes in one ear and out the other." So he tried and people chose to ignore, chose to accept something other.


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## unclejane (Jul 22, 2012)

Well, see, you guys just aren't as used to being totally wrong as I am LOL. To me it's like ok, well, Im wrong again - reset, recycle and relearn lol.... But again I absorb as much as I can from all you guys; I can be gruff too so it doesn't really bother me that much about the presentation. OTOH, I'm not new to the learning business and if I think something is wrong, I just say it's wrong. I let the other guy stamp his foot until we return to the subject matter or the discussion just can't continue.

LS


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