# Recurve strength training ???



## x1440 (Jan 5, 2003)

It's all about using your bones and bone alignment. Weight training will only slightly help. Look at the elite archers. They're skinny and not huge like a body builder, but they're still pulling 50# for the men and 40#+ for the women.


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## sundevilarchery (May 27, 2005)

Any top archer or athletic trainer will tell you... low weight, high reps. You don't want bulk, but you do want those muscles tuned to prevent injuries. Believe it or not, most folks also agree that there is a cardio factor involved (necessary for tournaments). We're not talking running, etc... but the muscles need to be used to and comfortable with extended use.


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

sundevilarchery said:


> Any top archer or athletic trainer will tell you... low weight, high reps. You don't want bulk, but you do want those muscles tuned to prevent injuries. Believe it or not, most folks also agree that there is a cardio factor involved (necessary for tournaments). We're not talking running, etc... but the muscles need to be used to and comfortable with extended use.


I absolutely agree, your first shot and your last shot in a tournament ideally would be exactly same, your body ideally would feel the same with no noticable fatigue (ideally of course, but of course that's impossible). I know that I and most people I know feel great at 90m but by the time they get to 30m, they're dog tired getting through the last few ends struggling to get the shot off / their timing is not the same as they started in the beginning of the day / etc. etc. etc. 

I distinctly remember a story about Dave Barnes started weight training, and Ki Sik Lee told him to stop.


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## cc46 (Jan 22, 2005)

Pete

I would agree with you that the general thinking is that strength required to "effortlessly draw the bow", as you describe, may not have much to to with the power to draw the bow. And for a FITA you need to do this all day, perhaps several days in a row. This implys, in my rudimentary understanding of physiology, that you need endurance. An archer may be able to pull an 60# bow and hold it for a second or two but this is a peak strength and not much use for us, since after about 5 shots you're finished for the day because you can't repeat it. However if you pulled that bow as a type of strength training you may find that week over week you are able to pull it 6 or 7 times and over time maybe a dozen times. What's happened is your peak strength has increased. With increased peak strenght it's possible that the carryover is that endurance strength has increased too. Training with a heavy bow was popular a while back, it might be worth considering. 

Just for fun have a look at the attached link, about 4 years old I think, has a training routine that makes reference to
Specific Strength:	Means strengthening exercise on the shooting line, while shooting 
which I take to mean heavy bow shooting, probably with limbs 5-10# heavier than their regular limbs.

http://www.thearcher.com/coachCorner/tipDetails.cfm?tipId=9&type=general&email=No

It's an interesting routine...but way more time needed than I have...ha ha.

Chuck


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

The key area of development you need is in the lower traps on the release side. The arms shouldn't be developed because during eth shot process they don't do anything, should all be alignment. 
Best weight training is SPT. This is where you draw the bow and keep good technique while holding teh bow for as long as possible. When your form starts to give in let down and rest for twice as long as you held. Do this an hour per night. 
As you get better at it increase the weight by wrapping therabands around the riser and string to increase poundage. Dave and Tim did this to increase their bows to over 90lb and SPTed for 2 hours. 
This is the best weight training as it;s archery specific. 

Mr Lee asked Dave to slow his training cause Dave was getting huge. (he's not a small guy) otherwise all the AIS atheletes weight train a few times a week.


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## cc46 (Jan 22, 2005)

Hi Marcus, 
That's a great idea to wrap bands around the riser and string to increase poundage! and the static holds too...do you know what kind of weight training routine the AIS atheletes use? movements, reps etc?
Thanks 

btw, found these for reference
the lower trap
http://www.exrx.net/Muscles/TrapeziusLower.html

and a popular movement to train it
http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/BackGeneral/BBBentOverRow.html


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## c3hammer (Sep 20, 2002)

Thanks for the links and info Chuck and Marcus.

I've been shooting a set of 46 lbs. limbs (normally shoot 41 lbs) and doing interval holding at full draw. All this helps incredibly with your strength and power when you get to anchor and are finished with the setup.

The issue I'm having is with getting to anchor and setup consistantly. The time period I'm refering to, is before I have the references touching during the draw cycle. It's during this stage of the draw and setup that I feel the need for incredible torso control and strength such that I end up at the proper references without having to move them around as I begin sighting.

If you all promise not to laugh too hard, I'll show you an example of what it looks like when you don't have perfect control of your setup:embara: 

Like I said don't laugh too hard. I shot 582 at our State Indoor FITA 10 days after I did this video with the exact same form. 

The animation is 10 shots at the lower left target of a vegas 3 spot face the frame after the click, before the arrow is gone. My feet, target and camera are all in the exact same spot each time.

I'd love to see what someone like Michele Frangilli or Park Kung Mo look like at the click on 10 consecutive shots.

Again, the question is how to build the strength and control to have all these shot setups look and be exactly the same each time ???

http://www.c3di.com/images/archery/form/pete1_22_05.gif (560k file size)

Cheers,
Pete


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

I would do 2 things
1) get a 18-26lb bow or set of limbs
2) practise with a delay video or a mirror the darw and setup process so it's quiet and identical. 

After that is right increase poundage and see if you can replicate it. 

Also set your whole body before teh draw and only move your rear scapula to draw the bow. This helps keep everything set and stable. 

Should be breaking 590-595 after that :thumbs_up


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## c3hammer (Sep 20, 2002)

Marcus said:


> I would do 2 things ......
> 1. Set your whole body before the draw
> 2. Only move your rear scapula to draw the bow.
> This helps keep everything set and stable.


Well DOH! There it is in a nut shell. How in the hey do you keep from going through the clicker on the draw if you do that 

Seriously, it's as simple as asking your body to not move around. I have always thought of the shot as a very dynamic thing. It really is amazing how I can turn such simple things into the complicated.

Thanks for the help!

Cheers,
Pete


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

practise. 
when done right the point tip is on the edge of the clicker just before you settle in.


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## sundevilarchery (May 27, 2005)

Just a heads up... as you train your release arm with pull-backs, etc... don't forget to do equal/similar training on your bow arm. You don't want one side of your back to be overdeveloped compared to the other side. This will lead to spine/back problems later in life. Balance your training.


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## Hoyt Dude (Jan 5, 2005)

The most important for me is running for every minute I shoot I run. I believe Cardio is very important especially at large multi day tournaments.


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## IdahoFitaShooter (Jan 7, 2004)

*Being consistant*

As mentioned above, in the old days, (1974-1980), when I was shooting a lot, I would shoot 52# to be able to make the 90M distances. I would shoot my hunting bow at 65# twice weekly for about 120 arrows and time myself so that my draw, anchor, aim was the same time frame as my target shooting. I would then shoot another 120 arrows, usually at 50M with my target bow. Now with the equipment being so much better, the poundage doesn't need to be nearly that much. I usually shot at least four hours per day. (Worked swing shift so time was not an issue.)
I have had a bad knee since 1973, so running has never been an option for me. Instead, I did a lot of swimming. I would swim twice a week and would alter my breathing between strokes, (ten laps breathing every other stroke, ten laps breathing every fifth stroke, ten laps every third stroke, and repeat). I would also swim under water to see how long I could hold and swim. (I was able to swim up to 75 meters in one breath, after doing the above training.) I was a metal shear operator so my job kept me in good upper body strength, but I would do some lifting twice per week. The days that I lifted, I would also ride my bycycle for about 1 1/2 hour. 
I found that I could pull through the shot very smoothly and remember reminding myself to make the shot "smooth as glass".
I never was a National contender, but I averaged in the low 1200s. This is when we would shoot a full FITA on Saturday, and then a 900 on Sunday.
Now, before I get hammered with the time spent, yes, it did cost me a marriage, but I thought I could make a living at it. My two claims to fame is that I shot a 309 90M before McKenny and Pace shot in Japan, (314? & 319?). and I did Robin an arrow in the ten ring at 90M. I was being coached by Shig Honda and John Williams in 1975 when the above feats were done.
I now longer spend even close to that amount of time training and shooting now. Now I'm lucky to shoot four hours per week.
If I had my druthers, I would still shoot 20 to thirty hours per week, but I won't allow my pastion to interfere with my home life again, (too painful).
Hope this gives you some confidence and commitment ideas. I believe you to be one of the better shots that post, (not certain, but some of the things you cover are very informative). Good luck
Les


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