# vfaa state indoors



## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

I believe the virginia field archery association is having thier state indoors this weekend. after everyone digs out of the snow, who is going? all vfaa state shoots are "open" to anyone.:thumbs_up


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## bowhunter_va_28 (Apr 28, 2003)

*Wythe Bowhunters*

I'm going to shoot at Wythe Bowhunters.


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## VA Vince (Aug 30, 2005)

Mr. Frank Jones- I would like to try and shoot some arrows at this state indoors this weekend. How many arrows do I need? How far do we shoot? What time can I shoot?


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*state shoot*



VA Vince said:


> Mr. Frank Jones- I would like to try and shoot some arrows at this state indoors this weekend. How many arrows do I need? How far do we shoot? What time can I shoot?


vince, you only need one arrow at a time. five arrows for an end, a total of twelve ends. that should be 60x's for a score of 300. the distance is about twenty yards, give or take. you need to shoot two rounds. I believe you can shoot at 3:30p.m and at 7:30 p.m on saturday or you can shoot at 8:00 a.m. and at 12:00p.m on sunday at the prince william archers located in manassas va. now can I have a free membership? you can shoot all four times if you register for two classes!


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## mag41vance (Mar 13, 2008)

If I can it would be at Walton Park, but all the time I planned shooting practice rounds have been spent on my Kubota plowing out of my place in Madison county. The other times have been keeping fuel in the Generator and shoveling snow off of my roof. I now know I am getting old. My brain is finally starting to believe my body.


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*snow*



mag41vance said:


> If I can it would be at Walton Park, but all the time I planned shooting practice rounds have been spent on my Kubota plowing out of my place in Madison county. The other times have been keeping fuel in the Generator and shoveling snow off of my roof. I now know I am getting old. My brain is finally starting to believe my body.


 bought a condo with a steep roof, pay condo association dues for labor, all archery ranges are closed in the big city. wish I had something to do!


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## X Hunter (Jan 11, 2007)

I'll be shooting @ Ogden Outdoors in Amherst if the weather hold off calling for up to 3 more inches toniteukey:


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## VA Vince (Aug 30, 2005)

My wife reminded me last night that we have to be in BFE Maryland saturday at 7pm for a party. Looks like it will be an all day affair at PW sunday.


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*sunday*



VA Vince said:


> My wife reminded me last night that we have to be in BFE Maryland saturday at 7pm for a party. Looks like it will be an all day affair at PW sunday.


you can handle it! I may shoot two classes, will know on friday. just took tomorrow off. I hope b&b is open on wednesday. If steven opens the shop, lunch will be on me! rob can eat too:wink:


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## phantom15 (May 12, 2005)

*Vfaa state*

I heard that Rusty had some X'S that needed killing , so I guess I am in ! I'll hunt just about anything.

Tim


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## gobblemg (Jun 13, 2006)

Frank, can you shoot both rounds 1 day? What are the line time on Sat. ?


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## VA Vince (Aug 30, 2005)

gobblemg said:


> Frank, can you shoot both rounds 1 day? What are the line time on Sat. ?


Yes

as for the line times, they are differant times at the locations. Which location do you want to shoot?


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## ArchmdFaulk (Jul 5, 2009)

*The State shoot at Prine William*

Hey Guys & Gals: 

We have ourselves a situation. . . . it's called SNOW. . . . AND LOTS OF IT!!!!! 

Due to inclement weather conditions, Prince William Archers is rescheduling their State Shoot from the original date of February 13th and 14th to February 20th and 21st with shooting times remaining the same as originally scheduled.

Walton Park Bowhunters, Ogden Outdoors, Amherst VA and Wythe Bowhunters, Wytheville VA will have their shoots this weekend February 13th and 14th as originally scheduled.

Vince and Frank, can you please get the word out.

Thank you for your help,

Matt


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

Thanks for the news Matt :darkbeer:


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## pennysdad (Sep 26, 2004)

*That's cool!*

Cause we really want to come, but it wasn't looking good for us! Hopefully the weather will hold out, and we can make it next week? Thnx. Jay.


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*state shoot*



ArchmdFaulk said:


> Hey Guys & Gals:
> 
> We have ourselves a situation. . . . it's called SNOW. . . . AND LOTS OF IT!!!!!
> 
> ...


 this will give the archers going to vegas a chance to shoot for score this weekend. the archers from the north could drive to amherst because I believe they have less snow. If I drive down, can I shoot both weekends and use my highest score?:wink:


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## xring1 (May 28, 2008)

*open?*



frank_jones said:


> I believe the virginia field archery association is having thier state indoors this weekend. after everyone digs out of the snow, who is going? all vfaa state shoots are "open" to anyone.:thumbs_up


thanks its open to anyone but will the out of state shooters be put in a guest class? can we join the VFAA if we dont live in Va. ? and did I read that you can shoot both scores the same day?

thanks again Dale


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## VA Vince (Aug 30, 2005)

xring1 said:


> thanks its open to anyone but will the out of state shooters be put in a guest class? can we join the VFAA if we dont live in Va. ? and did I read that you can shoot both scores the same day?
> 
> thanks again Dale


Yes, out of state is guest. You have to have a residence in Virginia to be a member i believe, not 100% sure though. You can shoot both scores same day.


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## tabarch (Sep 20, 2006)

xring1 said:


> thanks its open to anyone but will the out of state shooters be put in a guest class? can we join the VFAA if we dont live in Va. ? and did I read that you can shoot both scores the same day?
> 
> thanks again Dale


As long as you are not a member of the NFAA thru another state you can join the VFAA and shoot, but if you are a member elsewhere you can still shoot as a guest but you will not be eligible for awards.


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## mag41vance (Mar 13, 2008)

X Hunter said:


> I'll be shooting @ Ogden Outdoors in Amherst if the weather hold off calling for up to 3 more inches toniteukey:


Where is that place?


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## mag41vance (Mar 13, 2008)

mag41vance said:


> Where is that place?




Disregard previous question. I found it.:ranger:


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## FS560 (May 22, 2002)

I am an officer of the Virginia Field Archery Association.

Any regular NFAA member from any state is eligible to compete for the state championship awards at all four of our state championships, Indoor, Spring Field, Animal, and Fall State Field Championship.

Non NFAA members must shoot as guests and there are no guest awards of any kind whatsoever.

A non NFAA member living in another state can join VFAA and can do so at the tournament.

An NFAA member affiliated in another state can still join VFAA and we would be happy to have you as a member, but there is no real advantage to do so for our state championships.


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*state shoots*



FS560 said:


> I am an officer of the Virginia Field Archery Association.
> 
> Any regular NFAA member from any state is eligible to compete for the state championship awards at all four of our state championships, Indoor, Spring Field, Animal, and Fall State Field Championship.
> 
> ...


thanks for the reply


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## 60Xbulldog60X (Mar 12, 2005)

frank_jones said:


> this will give the archers going to vegas a chance to shoot for score this weekend. the archers from the north could drive to amherst because I believe they have less snow. If I drive down, can I shoot both weekends and use my highest score?:wink:


NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!!! :smile:


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## mag41vance (Mar 13, 2008)

frank_jones said:


> this will give the archers going to vegas a chance to shoot for score this weekend. the archers from the north could drive to amherst because I believe they have less snow. If I drive down, can I shoot both weekends and use my highest score?:wink:


 Nice try Frank. olice: 

See what working in the District does to you!:bounce: :wink:


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## FS560 (May 22, 2002)

Maybe NFAA, states, and clubs should just start selling mulligans.

Wait, how about just selling the awards and nobody has to even shoot.

That's it? You send us your $20 registration fee and we ship you a state champion plaque, any division and style. For another $20 you can take a photo of yourself with your plaque and we put it on the state website.

AND, for another $20 we will put your name on the plaque.

Just hold your breath, I will be right back.


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## psargeant (Aug 1, 2004)

FS560 said:


> I am an officer of the Virginia Field Archery Association.
> 
> Any regular NFAA member from any state is eligible to compete for the state championship awards at all four of our state championships, Indoor, Spring Field, Animal, and Fall State Field Championship.
> 
> ...


How do you reconcile that with the NFAA Constitution? I ask because I would like to do that myself here in NC, but it would seem that if we are playing by the rules set forth by our national org we cannot. Here is Article 3 Section A Paragraph 10 from the 2009-2010 Nfaa by-laws in case you are not familiar with it:

_10. Adjacent NFAA affiliated states shall be authorized to arrive at unilateral or reciprocal nonresident
membership arrangements. Resident as being defined as from the state through
which the Member’s NFAA card is drawn. NFAA members may join as many affiliated
states, if accepted, as they wish. However, they may only shoot in the Sectional and the
State Championship of the resident state for championship awards. The member must
notify NFAA Headquarters in writing when changing residence. NFAA members may
compete for awards in only one Indoor, one Outdoor and one 3-D Sectional; and only one
Indoor, one Outdoor and one 3-D State tournament per calendar year. The member may
shoot as a guest at any other time. Members may be privileged to change their state of_


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## X Hunter (Jan 11, 2007)

psargeant said:


> How do you reconcile that with the NFAA Constitution? I ask because I would like to do that myself here in NC, but it would seem that if we are playing by the rules set forth by our national org we cannot. Here is Article 3 Section A Paragraph 10 from the 2009-2010 Nfaa by-laws in case you are not familiar with it:
> 
> _10. Adjacent NFAA affiliated states shall be authorized to arrive at unilateral or reciprocal nonresident
> membership arrangements. Resident as being defined as from the state through
> ...



It's because VA is just that AWSOME!!!! :doh:


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*bylaws*



X Hunter said:


> It's because VA is just that AWSOME!!!! :doh:


if that is the case, then tabarch and psargeant are correct. now I am confused.


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## Kstigall (Feb 24, 2004)

psargeant said:


> How do you reconcile that with the NFAA Constitution? I ask because I would like to do that myself here in NC, but it would seem that if we are playing by the rules set forth by our national org we cannot. Here is Article 3 Section A Paragraph 10 from the 2009-2010 Nfaa by-laws in case you are not familiar with it:
> 
> _10. Adjacent NFAA affiliated states shall be authorized to arrive at unilateral or reciprocal nonresident
> membership arrangements. Resident as being defined as from the state through
> ...


If NC and Va. have a reciprocal or unilateral agreement then PSargeant could come shoot with _real_ archers in the VA. state championship but then couldn't shoot fro NC's state championship.


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## Kstigall (Feb 24, 2004)

FS560 said:


> Maybe NFAA, states, and clubs should just start selling mulligans.
> 
> Wait, how about just selling the awards and nobody has to even shoot.
> 
> ...


That would save me from having to drive to North Carolina to win a state championship in BHFS! That Davis fella' and the Eeewers guy are carrying mighty BIG hammers in BHFS right now!

Jimbo,
Do you take personal checks? How much for a new state record? How to tie the state record? Do you give a discount for purchasing multiples? How much for second place?


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## Kstigall (Feb 24, 2004)

ArchmdFaulk said:


> Hey Guys & Gals:
> 
> We have ourselves a situation. . . . it's called SNOW. . . . AND LOTS OF IT!!!!!
> 
> ...


This may be good for me......


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## DHawk2 (Feb 18, 2007)

Kstigall said:


> This may be good for me......


I was told today that Wytheville has postponed their State shoot till March 6-7 due to the snow. They said there is 40" of snow and you can't get to the building. Looks like there will only be 1 place holding the shoot this weekend in VA.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bowhunter_va_28 (Apr 28, 2003)

DHawk2 said:


> I was told today that Wytheville has postponed their State shoot till March 6-7 due to the snow. They said there is 40" of snow and you can't get to the building. Looks like there will only be 1 place holding the shoot this weekend in VA.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That's the dates for the Mid Atlantic at Wytheville according to their website:

http://wythebowhunters.org/default.aspx


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## bowhunter_va_28 (Apr 28, 2003)

bowhunter_va_28 said:


> That's the dates for the Mid Atlantic at Wytheville according to their website:
> 
> http://wythebowhunters.org/default.aspx


I spoke to Larry Emerson from Wythe Bowhunters and he said that Wytheville has rescheduled for next weekend 20-21, same start times.


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## VintageGold (Apr 29, 2004)

Kstigall said:


> That would save me from having to drive to North Carolina to win a state championship in BHFS! That Davis fella' and the Eeewers guy are carrying mighty BIG hammers in BHFS right now!
> 
> Jimbo,
> Do you take personal checks? How much for a new state record? How to tie the state record? Do you give a discount for purchasing multiples? How much for second place?




You could shoot AMFLRL with me, it's not too crowded at the top yet


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## DHawk2 (Feb 18, 2007)

So now they are going to have it the same weekend as the Vegas Tournament.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*vfaa*

try moving indoor state shoots to a later date, maryland has had thiers after the indoor nationals, seems to workout fine. oh, thats right, I'm in va.


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## DHawk2 (Feb 18, 2007)

I know most of us here in Southwestern VA pack the fat arrows up after the Nationals and bring out the skinny field arrows. Well with the exception of the Fatboys for 3D. 
I'm not going to Las Vegas so having the State shoot in Wytheville next weekend would be OK for me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## FS560 (May 22, 2002)

psargeant said:


> How do you reconcile that with the NFAA Constitution? I ask because I would like to do that myself here in NC, but it would seem that if we are playing by the rules set forth by our national org we cannot. Here is Article 3 Section A Paragraph 10 from the 2009-2010 Nfaa by-laws in case you are not familiar with it:
> 
> _10. Adjacent NFAA affiliated states shall be authorized to arrive at unilateral or reciprocal nonresident
> membership arrangements. Resident as being defined as from the state through
> ...


I have the same book that you do and am quite familiar with it. I have to be since I am the VA director.

There is no reference anywhere stating that a state must make its state championships to be closed tournaments. Since we make our state championships open tournaments to any NFAA member, members from other states may compete.

The language you quote is based on the assumption that each state holds their state championships as closed events. The language prevents an NFAA member from joining several states for the purpose of shooting in several state championships and thereby forcing himself on the states with closed tournaments that he does not reside in or is his affiliated state. A member can only be affiliated with one state but can be a member of as many as will have him. The primary purpose of the subject language is to set forth the conditions for an NFAA member to be allowed to be affiliated with an adjoining state for convenience and be allowed to shoot in that state's championships but not to be able to force his attendance on the state he lives in but is not affiliated with, if that state has their championships closed.


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*state shoots*



FS560 said:


> I have the same book that you do and am quite familiar with it. I have to be since I am the VA director.
> 
> There is no reference anywhere stating that a state must make its state championships to be closed tournaments. Since we make our state championships open tournaments to any NFAA member, members from other states may compete.
> 
> The language you quote is based on the assumption that each state holds their state championships as closed events. The language prevents an NFAA member from joining several states for the purpose of shooting in several state championships and thereby forcing himself on the states with closed tournaments that he does not reside in or is his affiliated state. A member can only be affiliated with one state but can be a member of as many as will have him. The primary purpose of the subject language is to set forth the conditions for an NFAA member to be allowed to be affiliated with an adjoining state for convenience and be allowed to shoot in that state's championships but not to be able to force his attendance on the state he lives in but is not affiliated with, if that state has their championships closed.


with that said can the archers from west va. and north carolina shoot for awards at our vfaa state shoots and then turn around in the same year and shoot for awards in thier home state?


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## FS560 (May 22, 2002)

Yes because our state championships are not closed tournaments and, not being affiliated members in Virginia, they are not using the reciprocal agreement provisions to shoot in the VA championships.

Although the NFAA language refers to recriprocal agreements, I believe that there are no actual written recriprocal agreements in effect. NFAA has simply set forth the provision that a member can join any state for the purpose of establishing his home state regardless of actual physical residence. This provided, of course, that the receiving state will accept the person as a member.

Sometimes, this provision is used by small minded child-like individuals for misguided vindictive reasons that serve no useful purpose than to display their true colors.


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*state shhots*



FS560 said:


> Yes because our state championships are not closed tournaments and, not being affiliated members in Virginia, they are not using the reciprocal agreement provisions to shoot in the VA championships.


that should clear it up for everyone!:thumbs_up


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## pennysdad (Sep 26, 2004)

*U go va.!!!!!!*

That's cool! I wish more states would follow suit, and quit being so closed minded! Sure would do alot more to promote the sport! Good for Va.!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## xring1 (May 28, 2008)

*Wvaa*

all of our shoots are open to the public,but our indoor and closed shoots are the only ones that are for a state championship title. NFAA & WVAA membership required, you can shoot but are put in a guest class


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## tabarch (Sep 20, 2006)

FS560 said:


> Yes because our state championships are not closed tournaments and, not being affiliated members in Virginia, they are not using the reciprocal agreement provisions to shoot in the VA championships.
> 
> Although the NFAA language refers to recriprocal agreements, I believe that there are no actual written recriprocal agreements in effect. NFAA has simply set forth the provision that a member can join any state for the purpose of establishing his home state regardless of actual physical residence. This provided, of course, that the receiving state will accept the person as a member.
> 
> Sometimes, this provision is used by small minded child-like individuals for misguided vindictive reasons that serve no useful purpose than to display their true colors.


Jim if you go to the NFAA Consttution go to page 11 Article III Membership item 10, it states that NFAA members may join as many affiliated states, if accepted, as they wish.However, they may only shoot in the sectional and the state championship of the resident state for championship awards.Now the way I interpit that then no you can not come out of NC, WV or any other state and compete for awards.
Terry


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*nfaa?*



tabarch said:


> Jim if you go to the NFAA Consttution go to page 11 Article III Membership item 10, it states that NFAA members may join as many affiliated states, if accepted, as they wish.However, they may only shoot in the sectional and the state championship of the resident state for championship awards.Now the way I interpit that then no you can not come out of NC, WV or any other state and compete for awards.
> Terry


maybe the nfaa should ammend this and let the respected state say who can shoot for the awards.I understand the issue of a multi-state champion, but do you really feel like a champion when someone from across the state line, sooting in the guess class, out scores you? I understand the sectional issue, but with the decline in archery, we should promote more shooters. after all, if you do your job and shoot a good score, you really don't lose.:smile:


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## bowhunter_va_28 (Apr 28, 2003)

frank_jones said:


> maybe the nfaa should ammend this and let the respected state say who can shoot for the awards.I understand the issue of a multi-state champion, but do you really feel like a champion when someone from across the state line, sooting in the guess class, out scores you? I understand the sectional issue, but with the decline in archery, we should promote more shooters. after all, if you do your job and shoot a good score, you really don't lose.:smile:



I don't shoot anywhere near the top, but I love to shoot, so I would shoot whether it was single or mult-state shooters. But I believe if you allow folks to cross the state line then you have a multi-state championship and have lost the State Championship. To use your logic, if you cross the line and shoot a good score you really don't lose, even if you're shooting guest class. Are you really promoting the sport and gaining more shooters by allowing someone, who already shoots, cross state lines and shoot for awards?

SEC teams don't compete for the ACC championship, American League teams don't compete for National League championships, should VA shooters compete for the WV championship. I assume that's why there are regional and national championships.


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## frank_jones (Mar 2, 2006)

*shooting*



bowhunter_va_28 said:


> I don't shoot anywhere near the top, but I love to shoot, so I would shoot whether it was single or mult-state shooters. But I believe if you allow folks to cross the state line then you have a multi-state championship and have lost the State Championship. To use your logic, if you cross the line and shoot a good score you really don't lose, even if you're shooting guest class. Are you really promoting the sport and gaining more shooters by allowing someone, who already shoots, cross state lines and shoot for awards?
> 
> SEC teams don't compete for the ACC championship, American League teams don't compete for National League championships, should VA shooters compete for the WV championship. I assume that's why there are regional and national championships.


it really isn't my logic. the results are.. if the archers can't shoot for an award, they do not participate. with that, you end up being a " state champion" shooting against a few people,if anyone at all, some archers win a tournament with a less desirable score. the key here is to get more people shooting.


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## pennysdad (Sep 26, 2004)

*Like minded!*



frank_jones said:


> maybe the nfaa should ammend this and let the respected state say who can shoot for the awards.I understand the issue of a multi-state champion, but do you really feel like a champion when someone from across the state line, sooting in the guess class, out scores you? I understand the sectional issue, but with the decline in archery, we should promote more shooters. after all, if you do your job and shoot a good score, you really don't lose.:smile:


That's how I see it also! I like your way of thinking! You go frank!


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## pennysdad (Sep 26, 2004)

*Hmmm?*

If the said shoot was like 10 mins. away? I might consider shooting as a guest, just to shoot? But I am not going to take the time, and money to travel, very far out of my way just to shoot as a guest! I might as well just go to Gander Mt. and shoot a practice round! The result would be the same, and take alot less time! It's like inviting your neighbor to go to dinner, with you, and your family, and say oh btw, you will have to sit at the guest table, ours is for members only! I completely agree with Frank, on this one! It would generate more shooters, which yes, that is promoting the sport nationally, maybe not state wide, but are we looking at the big picture-(nationally), or the little picture-(state).? Now I know what some will say, yes there are State championships, and there national championships! We are talking about a State championship! But I still believe the best man/woman should win! If I was shooting in a closed State championship, and a guest was shooting in the "guest" class, and he shot a better score than me, but I won because I was a resident! That would be winning by default, I still got beat! I would not feel a sense of accomplishment! It's kinda like the handicapp system! I hate being beat by handicapp, and I don't like winning by handicapp! How can anybody feel good winning by default???


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