# Daughter is starting to "forget" which eye to close



## RedRokker (Feb 7, 2009)

Does/can eye dominance change sides as kids mature?

She (12 years old) shoots right handed, and has for 2 years since starting to shoot, and all of the sudden has begun closing the wrong eye, sending arrows about 4 feet left of the entire 4 foot wide target. :BangHead:

Can eye dominance change or is this just a result of not shooting enough and/or not concentrating?

Anybody else expereince this?


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## camofreak (Jun 18, 2009)

I dont think it changes, she is just going to have to learn to shoot that way or something.


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## countryboy173 (Jul 18, 2008)

I never experienced or have heard of eye dominance changing, but there is an easy way to find out what eye is dominant. Have her stand fifteen feet away from a small object, like a doorknob. have her point her index finger at the doorknob and close her right eye. if she sees her fingertip "move" to the right, then she is right eye dominant. If not, have her try with her left. hope this helps.
-Kevin


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## buckchaser86 (Jun 10, 2009)

Eye dominance does indeed change. In college for law enforcment, we had to shoot with both eyes open to get a better view of your surroundings. If we were the wrong eye dominant we had to wear an eye patch for two days just when we are sitting at home. 
This would made your other eye take over dominancy as the other eye was useless. As far as just changing on their own for no reason? I havent heard of it.


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## buckchaser86 (Jun 10, 2009)

Here is a really long article about eye dominancy issues btw

Getting a Grip on Your Dominant Eye 

By JOEL M. VANCE 


Eye dominance is a basic of shotgun shooting, but some hunters don't know if they shoot with their dominant eye or not — didn't even know they "had" a dominant eye.

Most of them are missing the mark — literally.

Everyone has a dominant eye and for most it is the eye that corresponds to their dominant hand; in other words, a right-handed person will be right-eye dominant and a lefty left-eye dominant.

But not always and for those who, say, shoot right-handed, but have a dominant left eye, there is a problem. The left eye will point the gun several inches from where it should be — far enough to almost insure a miss. Shooting with a built-in error is no way to consistent success.

It's simple to find your dominant eye. Just point at any object with both eyes open (or make a circle with thumb and fingers and center an object in the circle). Assuming you're right-handed, shut your left eye. The finger or circle should still be on target if your right eye is dominant.

Shut your right eye. Your finger will be pointing to the right of the target if you're right-eye dominant.
Another method is to cut a small circle in a sheet of paper and, with both eyes open, line it up on an object some feet away, using the hole like the peep sight on a gun. Assuming right-handedness, shut your left eye. The object should remain centered if you also are right-eye dominant.

Try it a half-dozen or more times. You should get the same result each time. But there are a few people who don't have a consistent dominant eye. Eileen Clarke, a Montana outdoor writer, is one. "I checked it some years back and every time, my right eye was dominant," she says.

"But a couple of years ago, I started missing birds. I checked again and every other time I tested, my dominant eye was different — one time the right eye, the next time the left eye."

She got help from Bill Dowtin, a Flagstaff, Ariz., gunsmith. Dowtin has worked with many "cross-dominant" shooters and believes the only two viable solutions are, first, to switch shoulders and shoot from the dominant side or, second, to close the dominant eye before the shot. In Clarke's case, he used a third solution: obscuring the vision in the dominant eye enough to force dominance to the other eye. The Orvis Wing-Shooting Handbook (Nick Lyons Books, 31 West 21 St., New York, N.Y. 10010, $8.95) is the only instruction manual I've found that deals with what author Bruce Bowlen calls cross-dominance. He deals with the problem in some detail.

His preferred solution is for the shooter to learn to shoot from the dominant-eye side. In other words, a right-handed shooter with a left-dominant eye should learn to shoot from the port side. This is the preferred solution for everyone I talked to.

Gun writer Tom Gresham is cross-dominant. His father, Grits Gresham, who also is a gun writer, noticed it when Tom was young. "He quickly switched me to shooting left-handed," Gresham says. "The thing to watch for is a shooter leaning his head over the stock to use the 'wrong' eye for sighting."

Gresham shoots a handgun right-handed, but the aiming stance is different from a shotgun and the handgun essentially splits the difference between the two eyes. Try it — grip your fists together as if you were shooting a handgun and point at an object. If you close your eyes alternately, you'll see your pointing fingers jump to one side or the other of the object.

But you can ' t shoot a shotgun like that unless you rest the butt in the center of your chest. Hurts. Not recommended.

Gresham estimates that about 10-12 percent of the population is left-handed, but somewhere around 20 percent is left-eye dominant, which means quite a few people have a cross-dominant problem. He thinks left-handers with right-eye dominant are few — but I've talked to some, so the problem exists on both sides.

"People can change their shooting side even as adults," Gresham says. "Easiest way is to keep a gun handy in your office or living room. Shoulder the gun on the 'correct' side every few minutes. Do this every day for a couple of months and it starts to feel natural."

New shooters shouldn't have much problem adjusting, but old dogs probably will have trouble learning that new trick. However, people learn to eat offhanded or dribble a basketball. And baseball is filled with switch-hitters (Ted Williams, modern baseball's greatest hitter, is cross-dominant). For many, it's a matter of practice. When the incentive is more birds on the ground, it's worth a try.

Dennis Carpenter, an archery coach from Washington state, also recommends switching sides. I've worked with eye patches with some success, but if shooters are serious about improving beyond average, I always recommend switching hands to match the dominant eye."

Steve Gregory is a Maryland certified NRA instructor who is left-handed and right-eyed. "I've worked with a number of boys who are cross-dominant, including my son," he says. "It initially takes a bit of work, but with patience anyone can learn to shoot off either shoulder."

Orvis's Bowlen also suggests as a solution shutting the dominant eye at the moment of shooting. "The shooter can use both eyes until the last instant," he says. "Only after the decision to shoot has been made and the gun starts toward the shoulder is the eye closed."

But Bob Brister, longtime gun editor of Field and Stream magazine, competition shooter and gun instructor, thinks that at least in some shooters the sight picture is so fixed that they'll continue to point the gun where their dominant eye told them to. even with that eye closed. "You should shut your eye before you ever see the target," he says. 

And there are some who simply can't close one eye -- they can't wink. They either have both eyes open or both shut. So the closed-eye solution won't work for them.

It goes against good gunnery to shut one eye while shotgun shooting. Keeping both eyes open and concentrating on the bird is the nub of successful shotgunning — but that's only when the eye and hand work together.

A third possibility is to obscure part of the dominant eye or blur its vision enough to force the other eye to become dominant.

It doesn't work with all people, but most shooters respond. Some put a bit of tape on the top part of the dominant eye lens of their shooting glasses.

Opaque tape cuts vision, so transparent tape is better. It blurs vision enough to cause the dominant eye to stumble and hand the baton to the other eye.

Brister has used tape or something to weaken vision in a cross-dominant eye, forcing the proper eye to become dominant. He once ran onto a cross-dominant shooter at a meeting and improvised a solution by spitting on the fellow' s lens, then sprinkling dirt on the slobber. Crude — but effective.

His method is to mount the gun on the shoulder of a buddy or over a tree limb so you don't have to use the leading hand. Close the cross-dominant eye and get a proper sight picture with the eye you want to become dominant. Then shut that eye without moving the gun.

Grease your free hand forefinger with something — Vaseline, hair grease, even nose slime. Position your finger until it obscures the gun barrel and dab the grease on that spot. you later can apply Scotch tape or a shooter' s aid called Magic Dot to the inside of the lens so it won't come loose.

Then you have a permanent fog that should force your dominant eye into submission. It' s an aggravation — any eyeglass wearer knows how irritating a blur on the lens is — but may solve the problem.

The dominant eye can change as one grows older and eyes themselves undergo change. Brister says, "Of all the problems I see among shooters who are reasonably competent, eye changes are the most common. A shooter who was strongly right-eye dominant when he was younger starts to get some eye changes and the eye that doesn't have all that gun mass in front of it wants to take over and start running the show."

Brister has had a couple of cataract operations and finds that when his eyes gets tired, dominance will switch to the off-eye.

The final and most expensive solution to the problem is what's known as a crossover stock, a specially-made stock that bends (casts) enough to point the gun properly even though the cross-dominant eye is trying to force it off the target.

Theoretically, it should work. If you're shooting properly, you aren't looking at the barrels and have no idea where they are pointing. You won't notice that they're off-line according to your eye. If you did, you'd bring them back in line — and, for the cross-dominant shooter, force them off the target again.

But Dowtin doesn't think special stocks will work. "I've made stocks for 20 years," he says. "And I've seen no evidence that a bent stock will correct the problem. Your dominant eye will pull those barrels off the target. I don't know how much is conscious and how much subconscious, but the dominant eye will take over and ruin the shot."

Gunstocks are like education — they're built for the average user. Most shooters find a gun that fits or is comfortable enough to use. They experiment with straight grips or pistol grips or Monte Carlo grips, find a length that feels good. Some build length in with a butt pad or add weight to the stock.

A good gun maker (for a commensurately good price) will custom-fit a stock by using a try-gun (a gun with an adjustable stock, like an old dressmaker's form). Try-guns solve all problems except the cross-dominant eye. They aren't versatile enough to design a stock that bends enough to help the cross-dominant shooter. So, the gun maker must rely on trial-and-error and experience.

It costs money, probably lots, because only very good gun makers will have the skill to build a successful stock. It really isn't a practical solution. Having a special stock made will cost far more than buying a bunch of ammunition to learn how to shoot from the other shoulder. While it goes against the grain of every shotgun shooter, most of whom are convinced they ' re as good a shot as anyone, to start all over, starting over is better than muddling through life shooting several inches off-target every time.


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## camofreak (Jun 18, 2009)

I aint readin that.

Someone want to summ it up for me??


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## countryboy173 (Jul 18, 2008)

camofreak said:


> I aint readin that.
> 
> Someone want to summ it up for me??


lol +1


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## Paul H (Apr 2, 2009)

Well.. after reading that and trying it out it appears I am Left handed but Right eye Dom...


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## Sighting In (Feb 5, 2009)

I didn't read it either. This is my point of view on it:

I think it can change, but only in rare cases. I don't like the thumb-check. It just does not seam to be as accurate for me. Try this instead: Take a piece of paper, and cut a small hole in it (arrow-hole is about the right size). Have her hold it out in front of her with both hands. While looking through the hole at an object, pull it back to your face, keeping the object in the middle of the hole. Whichever eye it goes over, that is the dominant eye.

Check her. If she is still right eyed, I think that she is not concentrating. Good luck!


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## buglebuster (Feb 18, 2009)

Maybe she could try both eyes open for a little bit, thats how I shoot


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## HuntinChic (Feb 22, 2009)

I shoot with both eyes open, I've tried it with one eye and it doesn't work as well for me. So like buglebuster said have her try both eyes open, it may not work but you could give it a try.


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## Joe(y) (Mar 1, 2009)

Just give her an eye patch and put it over the eye she needs to have shut that way her dominant eye will have to stay open


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## therazor302 (Jun 2, 2008)

HuntinChic said:


> I shoot with both eyes open, I've tried it with one eye and it doesn't work as well for me. So like buglebuster said have her try both eyes open, it may not work but you could give it a try.


It works the same for me, I was having troubles with squinting and just switched to both eyes and all seems to be great.


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## Southern Boy (Sep 4, 2008)

put a pach over hr left eye


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