# One day or Two for State Field & State Target?



## field14 (May 21, 2002)

There are some states that have or are going to change-over to a ONE DAY State Field tournament. Lots of reasons, but among them are:

1. Many people today cannot give up a full weekend due to work committments. If there is a two-day event, they cannot give up Time and a half money for Saturday AND Double time money for Sunday....especially to compete in a State event that draws so few shooters...So...those states with two day events are suffering something terrible.

2. Price of fuel and motels for TWO nights instead of one is prohibitive when coupled with #1 above.

3. Many 3-Ders won't go to a TWO day field event and miss out on a local 3-D shoot...but if they only had ONE day for a State Field event, then they still could "hit" the 3-D event on the other day.

In the states I know that have converted to ONE DAY events for their State Field....all of them have seen GROWTH in the number of participants. In addition, those that have done it for their state TARGET events have also seen their numbers climb as well.

Just wondering what those of you on here feel with regards to a ONE DAY event for state field and state target.

The formats these "other" states use:

State Field: 14-field, 14-hunter, 14-animal.

State Target: 900 round. Shoot 60 yards; break for 55 minutes while you are grouped with your competition (or classed), then pick up at 50 yards shooting next to your closest competitors and finish the round. 

field14:wink::tongue::darkbeer:


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## VA Vince (Aug 30, 2005)

I would prefer a one day tourney. Just for the fact that I and most others are busy. Weekends are valuble times.


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## Dave T (Mar 24, 2004)

I like shooting 28 target rounds (Field and Hunter both) but if it would bring in more participation and get more people interested in field I would go along with the idea.

As Tournament VP for my state organization (NFAA affiliate) I'm going to send this page to the other board members for consideration.

Dave


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## AKDoug (Aug 27, 2003)

We currently shoot a two day format. 28 field followed by 14 animal. 28 hunter followed by 14 more animal.


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## Spotshooter2 (Oct 23, 2003)

Ours here have been one day events for a long time now. Only thing different is on the 900 round we dont break after the 60 and get regrouped. Usually after the 50 yard round we take a dinner break and then return to shoot the 40 yarder.


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## Arrow (Aug 30, 2002)

We hold the state Indoor and the State Grand Field (28 F, 28 A, & 28 H), the rest of the shoots are mail-ins. Being the 5th largest state in area, it is not feasible to travel 3 to 8 hours for a tounament every month. There are only two outdoor ranges left, and one in development, there must be travel.

We went from an average of 15 to 20 shooters at the state shoots to 40 to 45 shooters at the state shoots. My club alone averages 20 shooters per state mail-in tournament.

It has yet to bring the participation up at the state Grand Field, but we hope to have that change soon.

Arrow


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## I BOW 2 (May 22, 2002)

Well I'll say this. We like shooting Field & Hunter the most so that is what we "PLAN" on going to do! We live in the Large state of Michigan. It is more than 8 hours from end to end driving. Most people like to go and practice on the day before Friday afternoon on courses that they don't normaly shoot. Going to a one day format "MAY" increase your local numbers but will do very little for people who actually have to travel a great distance. They may save on one nights lodging? But who wants to drive all morning long and then "TRY" and shoot well all day, and then drive all the way home? I know that the "young Bucks" can tolerate being away from modern conveiniences for twenty plus hours but very few of us old shooters can. Have you checked out shooter demegraphics lately??? Ken


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Shooter demographics haven't changed because the shooters won't change....it isn't "broken" and doesn't need "fixing", it's been this way forever so why change it now...we all know the "stories"....

However, PEOPLE have changed, and if we, the old fart die-hards don't be for accommodating the people's "demographics" as they now exist, then we are doomed for the 30 to 40 shooter STATE CHAMPIONSHIPS...wow, big deal...I beat 3 other shooters and won a State Patch...

The economy is in dire straights, and most people's budgets are also in dire straights. NOBODY in their right mind is going to turn down DOUBLE TIME or TIME AND A HALF...to go to a tournament that only has meager participation at best.
ONE night in a motel is a huge difference over two or three as well as the meals too.

Many, many of the people in this neck of the woods have openly stated that they will attend the Target and the field....if it is ONE DAY, but will not attend if it is a full-fledged two day event. Many of those have to work for sure on SATURDAYS now daze, so they are immediately eliminated from competitions if they are two day affairs.

I know of a state close by that for the past 40 years has had their state target a one day, Sunday affair and the participation has always been very good. They were suffering the "ails" of a floundering state field tournament of two days and the participation was down in the 30's. They opted to go to a ONE DAY State Field and the participation is now back up and getting near to 100 shooters.

Afterall....think about it....the NATIONALS has the option of a 3-Day event for a NATIONAL TITLE...how can a state justify two days for a State event...especially when participation is miniscule.

Some LOCAL events (always ONE DAY) get MORE participation than a State event....and we all know that to be fact in many areas of the country.

we all want field and target shooting participation to grow...but first, we got to get the OLD FARTS who are more resistant to change than anyone...off the duff to realize that it just isn't the same anymore...and the shooter demographics WILL NOT CHANGE...if we don't bring NEW shooters in.

It should be obvious that if participation is miniscule and declining...then something is WRONG...it IS broken and it does need fixing.

I like two day state events too....cuz I like to shoot field and target...but I, too, will NOT travel and take two or three nights in a motel for an event that draws fewer people than a local one day affair will. I fully understand why a person won't give up double time too...or even time and a half for an event that doesn't mean all that much considering the number of competitors.

Got to think out of the box to get things re-generated, IMHO.

NEED to practice on the course to be used for competition? I know a few states that NOBODY "practices" on the course to be used for competition the day prior to the events..cuz the courses aren't available. Of course, I also know many states where the "local host club shooters" have a huge advantage...or so they THINK they do....when the shoot is on their home turf. Gotta still shoot 'em in the middle regardless.

So many are so unwilling to even consider a change...cuz afterall, it has always been "this way". And the ones that won't change and will fight tooth and nail are those "in the demographics of the existing shooter base" that is NOT growing and brining in new shooters.

field14:tongue::wink:


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## Melthuselah (May 12, 2006)

I am another Michigander and I agree with Ken. I live in the Lower Peninsular and two of out State shoots are being hosted by a club in the west side of the UP. There is no way I would drive that far for a one day shoot. I am having a hard time justifying that much of a drive for a two day event. I am not sure a one day event would increase participation. From talking to people in a couple other states I understand they have low turnout. It seems a lot of people focus on 3D and Field Archery suffers. It is hard to convince most of them to try Field Archery. A argument I hear a lot is I don't shoot at deer at 80 yards. It seem a lot of them are intimidated by the long shots. Here in Michigan we get approx. 80 for and outdoor two day shoot. Field14 mentioned the Nationals being a three day event. I understand that was changed to try to increase participation, but so far there has been no noticeable increase. I am all for increasing our participation but I am not sure this is the way.
Mel


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## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

We shoot 28F, 14H and 14A over two days. 

For the outdoor target we shoot a 900 on Saturday and a 600 (four ends of 5 arrows at each yardage) on Sunday. 

I'm as busy as anyone else, and wouldn't complain a bit about a one-day event. Wouldn't complain about a two dayer either.


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

I also know that several states that have two-day events go for the less intensive rounds on the second day.

For example some states don't shoot two full 900 rounds for state target, but opt for the 900 on one day, and an International round (60 arrows) on the second day.
Some states, like Bob Muley says only shoot 14 hunter and 14 animal on day 2 to make it shorter and get people out eariler.

It is very, very understandable for States that are large and have long driving distances to have two day events, because as was stated earlier, driving all that way for a one-day event isn't worth it either.

Now, of course comes yet another "buglaboo" that people cry and moan over...and that is MULTIPLE SITE tournaments in those larger states.

Sectional tournaments are going to multiple sites to try to relieve the monetary strain on their members and also to try to increase the participation by those that either cannot or will not travel to shoot.

For field shooting, this is tough, since the ranges do vary in "intensity"'; that is some are flat, others are hilly, etc. But what are we to do in order to try to get from under the stagnation and the "old way of doing things" that is no longer working, and in fact, hasn't for years?

The states I mentioned have had success with ONE-DAY state target and state field tournaments...but it was a change fought against very hard by the "old schoolers" and die-hards. Now, however, those same people have embraced this change...both from the increased participation and the RELIEF that they no longer can shoot so intensely two days in a row anymore.

As the demographics for the time being are NOT changing...we dedicated field shooters are aging and don't "heal up" as quickly...so we can't walk the courses like young bucks anymore...the time will come to pass, and really soon, where even WE will want something "toned down" so that we can handle it.

I do NOT think field shooting is dead; but we need to be thinking out of the box in order to try to get SOME of the state associations back onto their feet and get more than 30 or 40 shooters at a STATE level tournament.

field14


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## swerve (Jun 5, 2005)

You could handicap the courses. That would even things up a little better if you were doing a multi-site state championship.

I am actually game for either a 1 day or a 2 day. 1 day shoot setup worked real good for our state Forma,


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

Presently Maryland uses a two day format in late August: Day 1- 28 Field, Day 2- 28 Hunter. 

Personally, a one day or two day format doesn't matter to me. But, you know the die-hards in most areas will balk at a shorter format. I'm all for experimenting for a year or two...see how participation is affected...poll the shooters who attend...and go from there.


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## The Swami (Jan 16, 2008)

Our state has 28 field then lunch followed by 14 animal. Sunday is 28 Hunter.

Having it one day won't make much of a difference in this state. 3D is still king here and they are held fo 2 days as well, though they are not combined score, but 2 seperate shoots.

I can see why it would make sense in other states to have it one day however.


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## pjfrompa (Nov 19, 2006)

*PA state rounds*

The outdoor target shoot is a 1200 on saturday and a 900 on sunday.

The field/hunter is 28 field on saturday and then 28 hunter on sunday.

The animal round is on a separate weekend. 28 both days - 2 different courses.


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## AKDoug (Aug 27, 2003)

Just to add since this thread was originally posted when diesel was under $4.00 a gallon. I WILL NOT  travel to my State shoot if it is only one day. If I am going to drive 100 miles to shoot I am going to shoot for two days. I bring a tent so I don't have to stay in a hotel.


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## sharkred7 (Jul 19, 2005)

AKDoug said:


> Just to add since this thread was originally posted when diesel was under $4.00 a gallon. I WILL NOT  travel to my State shoot if it is only one day. If I am going to drive 100 miles to shoot I am going to shoot for two days. I bring a tent so I don't have to stay in a hotel.


And now gas is $4.00 ($4.70 diesel) I woludn't travel that far for a one day shoot either but in our state it's at most a 3 1/2 hour drive. This year its on our home range so I only have an hour drive.
John


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## Paul Payne (Apr 1, 2007)

So how about making it the best of both worlds....If you want to shoot one day you can shoot it one day...If you want to shoot 2 days then take the best score of the two days....for field & hunter instead of 28 field or 28 hunter each day shoot 14 field and 14 hunter each day????


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Paul Payne said:


> So how about making it the best of both worlds....If you want to shoot one day you can shoot it one day...If you want to shoot 2 days then take the best score of the two days....for field & hunter instead of 28 field or 28 hunter each day shoot 14 field and 14 hunter each day????



This does work...however, the old die-hard resistors....well they'll be the first to complain that so and so shot theirs yesterday when the weather was good and I had to shoot mine today under different conditions and it was windy and it rained a widdle bit...

Of course if the other guy shot in crap conditions and YOU shot in good conditions, then that wouldn't matter...if you know what I mean?

They don't seem to realize that conditions are almost never THE SAME...from morning to afternoon, or from one side of the "hill" to the other....lighting, wind, and other factors constantly "change" all day long...top vs. bottom target, etc....

With this game, somebody is always going to make an excuse for missing...afterall, it is NEVER THE SHOOTER'S fault when they miss...and if the "other guy" shoots better, then he must have a "big eraser", or his "conditions" to shoot in were better than mine....

The NFAA is getting all sorts of grief over the 3/5 day format on this same issue concerning conditions from one day to the next. Seems that rarely, if ever are any two people happy with regard to the issue at hand.

field14


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## Jbird (May 21, 2002)

*2 Day/1 Day*

We like the 2 day format. Now with fuel costs going through the roof and all of our ranges 2 hours away or more, we sure aren't going to spend the money to go down for a 1 day state shoot. Glad all the state shoots in our area are 2 days. If you are going to spend the money it takes to get there, get your moneys worth. You may not be making as many shoots this year. I keep hearing about how this is a different world today and people don't have time to spend two days shooting. That's a load of crap. People still take the time to do what they love. Bass tournaments are 2 days. Lot's of golf tournaments are two days and both get a heavy turnout. I love archery and I make time for it. If you just have a limited interest in archery that's fine.
Stay home and shoot in the back yard instead of trying to trim the sport to fit your interest level. The 3/5 Outdoor Nationals is a good idea. Keeps the hard cores and the Attention Deficit Disorder types happy, and lets those folks that really have legitimate reasons for shooting only the weekend happy.
Jbird


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