# Best short recurve for long draw???



## Northofhwy8 (Apr 5, 2018)

I'm looking for suggestions for a good short recurve for a longer draw guy...I'm 30.5 inches on my compounds so I'm guessing I'm drawing 29-29.5 on my recurves. I'm currently shooting a 62in and a 68in recurve but would like to find a short bow that dosent stack terribly past 29...A little stack is fine and expected but the couple I tried were like hitting the back wall of a compound bow past 29. I realize a guy with my draw should look at longer bows but one of my properties has no large trees and all bowhunting is done from blinds. I'm leaving my compounds hung up this year until I kill with my recurve so I'd like to get something that is blind friendly for that land. Thanks in advance for any help.


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## Moebow (Jul 8, 2010)

Not sure where HWY 8 is, extreme north west corner of MN?? Anyway, I shoot a Black Widow PSR 58" recurve with no issues to my 30" draw. Your best bet though is to contact the bowyer you are interested in and talking to them about bow length and desired draw length. I will add that there is NO acceptable "stack!!" Stacking simply implies that you are working harder to draw the bow with NO return in performance.

Arne


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## mamba/ny (Mar 11, 2012)

Kegan of Omega bows.


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## Northofhwy8 (Apr 5, 2018)

Moebow said:


> Not sure where HWY 8 is, extreme north west corner of MN?? Anyway, I shoot a Black Widow PSR 58" recurve with no issues to my 30" draw. Your best bet though is to contact the bowyer you are interested in and talking to them about bow length and desired draw length. I will add that there is NO acceptable "stack!!" Stacking simply implies that you are working harder to draw the bow with NO return in performance.
> 
> 
> Arne


 Thanks...I guess i phrased it wrong when I said stack...I meant that if it's not as smooth at the end as my longer bows I can deal with it. I'll definitely contact my bower and let him know what I'm looking for...and fyi HWY8 is a highway that runs east and west all the way across Wisconsin about 2/3 the way up the state...people say there is Wisconsin then there is North of hwy 8. Its a bit different up there where I grew up....thanks again for your help


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## moog5050 (Oct 23, 2012)

I have a 29” DL and have killed deer with a bear kodiak mag. Not the most forgiving but it’s shootable and huntable. Or get a taller blind. I can shoot a 62” bow seated out of my ******* softsided blind.


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## Northofhwy8 (Apr 5, 2018)

moog5050 said:


> I have a 29” DL and have killed deer with a bear kodiak mag. Not the most forgiving but it’s shootable and huntable. Or get a taller blind. I can shoot a 62” bow seated out of my ******* softsided blind.


 I thought about just getting a bigger blind but I already have 5 pretty new (too short)ones for that land so it's cheaper (and also a good excuse to the ol lady) to just get a new recurve. What length is the Bear KM? 58?


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## moog5050 (Oct 23, 2012)

Northofhwy8 said:


> moog5050 said:
> 
> 
> > I have a 29” DL and have killed deer with a bear kodiak mag. Not the most forgiving but it’s shootable and huntable. Or get a taller blind. I can shoot a 62” bow seated out of my ******* softsided blind.
> ...


52” It’s short. But for a normal height blind, I doubt 58” will work.


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## moog5050 (Oct 23, 2012)

I think the big mike blinds are tall and pretty inexpensive.


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## Northofhwy8 (Apr 5, 2018)

moog5050 said:


> Northofhwy8 said:
> 
> 
> > moog5050 said:
> ...


I see.. I'm thinking if you were able to shoot the 52in KM ok at 29 inches the Cheyenne 55 might be worth a look. It should go a bit longer than the kodiak and Would definitely fit inside the blind since I was really close to being able to shoot my 62 in there but not close enough to feel comfortable hunting. Thanks


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

The best bows for not stacking are super recurves. The large recurve pushes the lift point of the bow out do around full draw which is the minimum point of the first derivative of the draw force curve (lowest pounds per inch of draw). Stacking does not occur until you get quite a ways past that point. Also, the big recurves create a shorter tip to tip bow for the same AMO bow length. The chart below shows an example of that for a super recurve compared a conventional recurve. I have other charts that show the that include other bow types like longbows. I found this one first. Click on the picture to make it larger. The Border HEX6 is a super recurve. The KAP is a conventional recurve.


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

You can get a 62 inch Covert Hunter that will be as short, tip to tip, as the shorty bows you are talking about, and it will not stack. If fact, quite the opposite.


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## moog5050 (Oct 23, 2012)

Hank

A 62” CH is the same length tip to tip as my 60” BW. It’s no where near as short as a KM. But if he can use a 58” conventional bow then yep a 60” Border would be about the same strung length and a 58” Border would be like a 56” conventional.


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## woof156 (Apr 3, 2018)

I agree with Hank D if you can pick a super recurve to lessen the force required to pull past 28 inches as his chart shows. In my limited experience my super recurve is nearly as smooth at 64 inch AMO as my 68 inch Sabastian flute- both at DL 28 inches tho and a draw wt of 38 # so I am a fan of super recurves...


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## Northofhwy8 (Apr 5, 2018)

Thank you Hank...I'm looking into them as we speak. Man I spend 30 years learning everthing I can about compounds and thought going back to trad would be extremely simple, but here I am looking at derivative charts and writing out my own equations to make sense of it all...who knew?😀


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## Dao (Apr 7, 2015)

*Scherrinsky 48!*








here's scherrinsky 48" that's being drawn to 32 inches no problem. if you want SHORT (to me bow isn't short unless it is below 50" AMO)recurve that has absolutely NO stacking at 32 inches, there's no bow at similar size that can do this. sooo if you want REALLY short recurve with massive riser that keeps things stable, and doesn't stack at the 32 inches. I'd say this is the BEST at the given size.

it isn't speedster but plenty fast for non-static full working tip recurve bow 47#@28": 470gr. average 170fps.








here's what it looks like unstrung








here's what it looks like strung. (obviously bottom bow: top is herter's perfection mag 46 that's amo 43". that one will stack at 28).

my draw is 27.75, but I've had people with 30+" draw length shoot this without any problem.


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## Yooper-travler (Feb 28, 2011)

I grew up waaaayyy north of HWY 8. It is/we are different up here lol. Another vote to at least check out a super curve. One thing to also consider is a hidden hunter blind. I can shoot a 64" long bow out of mine. Lightweight, vertical windows easy set up.


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## Bowmania (Jan 3, 2003)

Stacking is not the problem with short bows, it's string angle. Excluding SR's.

Bowmania


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

Bowmania said:


> Stacking is not the problem with short bows, it's string angle. Excluding SR's.
> 
> Bowmania


Unless you are a skinny armed weakling with a 32 inch draw length that cannot power through the stack....like me.


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## mamba/ny (Mar 11, 2012)

Dao said:


> View attachment 6509889
> 
> here's scherrinsky 48" that's being drawn to 32 inches no problem. if you want SHORT (to me bow isn't short unless it is below 50" AMO)recurve that has absolutely NO stacking at 32 inches, there's no bow at similar size that can do this. sooo if you want REALLY short recurve with massive riser that keeps things stable, and doesn't stack at the 32 inches. I'd say this is the BEST at the given size.
> 
> ...


Dao that SCHERRINSKY is way cool,to bad from what I searched he stopped making bows around 97.


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## kentsabrina (Aug 23, 2017)

Bodnik Mingo is the least stacking n fastest short bow I have ever tried.

Herewith my review:
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=5336089


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## Dao (Apr 7, 2015)

mamba/ny said:


> Dao that SCHERRINSKY is way cool,to bad from what I searched he stopped making bows around 97.


believe it or not, this was made brand spanking new for me in 2014. it is, so far, the ONLY and also THE LAST 48" he made since he re-started. The form for this has been de-commissioned due to warping, it may not be made for a LOOONG time. 

Including those he made in 90's there's only four or five of these in the world so it is RARE!


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

I will run my analytics package on any bow that I can get decent draw force data for. The first derivative of the DFC will tell when stacking starts to occur.

I would like to get some data on the Scherrinsky and the Bodnik if either of you has the means to measure. I can provide instructions. PM me if you are interested. I send PDF's of results to anyone that sends me data.

The results also go into my database for future comparisons.

I have somewhere around 70 bows in my database. I like to create peer groups for comparisons. It is comparing bows where you learn.


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## Dao (Apr 7, 2015)

Hi Hank, I really respect your objective recording and analysis of different bow/setup. 

I wish I can contribute, but I don't have a way to measure my bow. not reliably anyway. 

so I tried to find the force curve that the bowyer did for the bow in other forum... but I'm having no luck. when I find it, I'll post it here. 

I also found that my memory was faulty. bow was made in 2015 not 2014. seemed like I had it longer. probably because I shot it ALOT .


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## Reesealex86 (May 18, 2018)

IVe herd 50/50 from people the kodiak magnum from bear being a bear fan I will admit I’ve herd from some guys that this bow is good I have the same draw length around 29 or lil more some people say the kodiak magnum has little to no stacking at this draw length but I don’t know persionaly it was between this bow or the super kodiak at 60 inches but this is all strictly for hunting my 60 super kodiak has no pinch and little if at all stacking but a kodiak mag might be one to atleast try 🤷‍♀️🏼


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## marcelxl (Dec 5, 2010)

I recently acquired a Caribow Tuktu.

60" 50#@28 static tip recurve. Not my usual cup of tea but is it ever sweet! Fun to shoot, does not feel like 50# and the static tips definitely improve the back end of my draw (29.5") feels way easier at the back end than my 45# 62" Black Widow
Could not refuse it, will make a great hunter as I intend to explore blind and stand hunting this fall. 

As soon as 3D season is done, I'm looking forwards to setting this thing up properly


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## kentsabrina (Aug 23, 2017)

Hank D Thoreau said:


> I will run my analytics package on any bow that I can get decent draw force data for. The first derivative of the DFC will tell when stacking starts to occur.
> 
> I would like to get some data on the Scherrinsky and the Bodnik if either of you has the means to measure. I can provide instructions. PM me if you are interested. I send PDF's of results to anyone that sends me data.
> 
> ...


Hi Hank,

Does it require special equipment to do the test? Cause I basically do most things on hand and by feel.

Thx.


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## GrayGooseShaft (Apr 11, 2014)

Short hunting bow? Big Jim's Thunderchild, JK Traditions Kanati, Javaman's Elkheart or Helmsdeep. Ask the bowyer about draw length versus stack.


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## thare1774 (Dec 13, 2010)

Javaman bows all the way. Gregg Coffey used to make the bows for Shrew archery, which were known for being very pleasant shooting short bows. I had a Super Shrew he made me and my draw is 29”, I shot it better than anything I’ve ever owned. I always kicked myself for selling it. I just picked up one of his Falcon XLs and it shoots as well as my shrew did. He also makes a couple different recurves and I couldn’t recommend his bows more. They’re simply the best shooting short bows in my opinion


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

kentsabrina said:


> Hi Hank,
> 
> Does it require special equipment to do the test? Cause I basically do most things on hand and by feel.
> 
> Thx.


It takes a scale, an arrow, and a measuring stick. I prefer data that is at least accurate to 0.2 pounds. Less accurate than that and the first derivative smoothness curve will have too much scatter.

I can describe how to do it by hand if you are interested.


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## Bill 2311 (Jun 24, 2005)

Back to point.
First, measure your draw length to find out.
ILF risers run as short as 13" allowing for some XL limbs to accommodate longer draws and still be short over all.
15"/Longs= 60"


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

Recognize that there are only a few companies that make XL limbs. The big players do not.


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## kentsabrina (Aug 23, 2017)

I am interested to do a test on my Bearpaw Bodnik Mingo

as it is really smooth to draw, even being 50" short n in 45#


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