# Another new bow tuning thread! Tiller & Brace height query



## thedaffodilfish (Mar 29, 2020)

Hi all, new user here. I've read through the forums and had a quick search so apologies for another beginners query.

Since our club meets are currently suspended I've bought myself an entry-level recurve kit to practice target in the back field. Core Air riser @25" with Medium Core Element ILF limbs to give a 68"-24lbs set up.

I'm having difficulty with both the brace height and tiller. Current brace height is measuring 10.5" vs the recommended 8"-9". I've been twisting the string (66" Flex) forever but can't seem to get it below 10". I've just measured the tiller and the top limb is measuring 9.5" whereas the bottom is 8.2". Obviously that difference is way to big and needs adjusted, but should I be adjusting the top or the bottom? Whenever I search for 'adjusting tiller' everyone talks about that the *difference* should be but not what the actual distance is. Is this is where brace height comes in? The fact that the brace height is so high I take it I should be adjusting the top limb down 9.5" to around 8" rather than increasing the bottom limb?

Thanks in advance!


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## rapids (Feb 28, 2003)

You said you’ve been twisting the string forever but can’t get the brace height below 10”. When you twist the string you will increase brace height, so you need to untwist the string to decrease brace height.


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## thedaffodilfish (Mar 29, 2020)

Thanks for the reply. Yes, I should have made that clearer. I have been untwisting to the extent that it has started twisting the other direction. I've untwisted it about 20+ times which has dropped it from 10.50 to 10.03 and I'm now seeing the string twist in the opposite direction now.


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## Birdytry (Jul 23, 2020)

I am having the same problem. 25" Galaxy Quasar Riser with medium SF Archery limbs for a 68" bow. 65" string (actual length) which was recommended on a chart that I saw. I have untwisted the string to 10 twists and still have a 10.5" brace height. Everything is tuned and I am grouping well but the guy at the shop doesn't think it's set up right.

I measured everything again just to make sure they sent me what I ordered. I wondered if it is just the riser geometry but I saw a recommended brace height of 9.5" somewhere. Should I be using a string that is longer than recommended?


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

thedaffodilfish said:


> Hi all, new user here. I've read through the forums and had a quick search so apologies for another beginners query.
> 
> Since our club meets are currently suspended I've bought myself an entry-level recurve kit to practice target in the back field. Core Air riser @25" with Medium Core Element ILF limbs to give a 68"-24lbs set up.
> 
> ...


YOur string is the WRONG (incorrect) length. 68-inch recurve bow, you want a 64.5-inch string. 
I suspect you are not measuring brace height correctly. 66-inch bowstring, would give you a very SHORT brace height, because the string is way too long.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Birdytry said:


> I am having the same problem. 25" Galaxy Quasar Riser with medium SF Archery limbs for a 68" bow. 65" string (actual length) which was recommended on a chart that I saw. I have untwisted the string to 10 twists and still have a 10.5" brace height. Everything is tuned and I am grouping well but the guy at the shop doesn't think it's set up right.
> 
> I measured everything again just to make sure they sent me what I ordered. I wondered if it is just the riser geometry but I saw a recommended brace height of 9.5" somewhere. Should I be using a string that is longer than recommended?


Take a picture of your bow, with your bow square or tape measure, and show us the 10.5-inch "brace height" for your 68" bow and your 65" actual string length.
68-inch recurve bow, 9.5-inch brace would be on the high side. Find your personal sweet spot for brace (tightest groups, quietest sounding shots) with brace between
8.75-inches up to 9.25-inches. Of course, if you really do shoot better groups (smaller group size) at a 9.5-inch brace instead of a shorter brace, then, by all means, do it.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

thedaffodilfish said:


> Thanks for the reply. Yes, I should have made that clearer. I have been untwisting to the extent that it has started twisting the other direction. I've untwisted it about 20+ times which has dropped it from 10.50 to 10.03 and I'm now seeing the string twist in the opposite direction now.


When you UNTWIST, the purpose, the intent is to lengthen the string. If you get to ZERO twist, you cannot remove any more twist. If you continue to "untwist" a zero twist string, then, you are now twisting the string again, and adding twists, but in the counter direction.

So, when you ADD twist to a string, the length of each twist gets shorter.
So, when you REMOVE a twist from a string, the length of each twist gets LONGER.
When all the strands in the string are straight, you have a ZERO twist string, and have gone way too far.

If you have a two color string, this is easier to see the length of 1 twist.









When ADDING twists, each twist will get shorter. If the twists are getting LOGNER, you are removing twists.
Ideally, ONE twist will measure 1,5 inches long...about 37mm.

If you must ADD twists to shorten a bowstring, because you want to INCREASE the brace height, do not allow a single twist to measure less than 1,0 inch...about 25mm.

If you must REMOVE twists to length a bowstring, because you want to DECREASE brace height, do not allow a single twist to measure more than 2,0 inches...about 50mm.

Why should I care if a twist is too short or too long? When the string has too many twists, the string will start to create knots, tight coils/spirals of string. The bowstring is no longer aerodynamic. When the string has not enough twists (each twist measures too long), then, the strands do not stay together, and the individual strands can balloon and separate. Again, not aerodynamic.

Who says so? I do. I teach/coach Olympic recurve and barebow recurve, and barebow compound, and compound sights/releases. I also build strings for my better students.


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## Birdytry (Jul 23, 2020)

nuts&bolts said:


> Take a picture of your bow, with your bow square or tape measure, and show us the 10.5-inch "brace height" for your 68" bow and your 65" actual string length.
> 68-inch recurve bow, 9.5-inch brace would be on the high side. Find your personal sweet spot for brace (tightest groups, quietest sounding shots) with brace between
> 8.75-inches up to 9.25-inches. Of course, if you really do shoot better groups (smaller group size) at a 9.5-inch brace instead of a shorter brace, then, by all means, do it.


Oops, it turns out that I was measuring the bow wrong. It is a 70" bow. With my 26-1/2" draw length, I guess I will be looking some shorter limbs or a smaller riser.

Thanks for the response


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## Johno97007 (Aug 15, 2020)

I'm also a noob but looking at your draw length, multiplied by 2 would indicate that you need a much shorter bow,, ala 66" or thereabouts. Looks like a new riser is in your future. A 70" bow would fit someone above 6' .I'm 5 10 and have both a 66" and a 68" and draw around 29 1/2" There is a noticeable "stack" with the 66". Your limbs should fit which ever riser you have.

Good luck.


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