# Hot new MK Korea Riser!



## ryan b.

The bat-wing looking teeth things on the limb pocket are rather gaudy but the riser looks pretty dang sweet otherwise


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## limbwalker

What a great idea. Not sure why anyone didn't think of this before. Good for them.


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## Kumikaine

Looks awesome! Do you know if it has stabilizer bushings for when you are using ilf limbs? I don't use them but then was just wondering.


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## acco205

limbwalker said:


> What a great idea. Not sure why anyone didn't think of this before. Good for them.


Patent reasons I would suspect...


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## erickatgta

love it already! money saving started or I should treat my wife better...


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## chrstphr

yes, i have held off talking about the riser and limbs until they were available for sale. The limbs will be available in October. 

I have a set of Veracity limbs coming in a few weeks. They are the Vera 3 limbs. Jung Dasomi and Kim WooJin shot them at the Korean national archery tournament last month. Dasomi said they were so smooth. They cant keep them as they are Win Win sponsored shooters but she loved her set. 

here is another photo of the Veracity limbs when they were deciding on which graphic to use. 

View attachment 2028852



and another photo of the new MK riser

View attachment 2028851



Chris


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## Cylosis

It looks like the tiller bolt is moved back and forth? Interesting, but does the geometry mean you need to completely retune should you change limb fittings?

Also not a fan of the cutouts in the upper half, but what a great idea! But as a non-specialized product, I hope they're cheap.


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## projayjay

Looks a lot more agressive than the MK x10 riser... Looks sorta like the HPX


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## erickatgta

i wonder the same... but i do not think it is good idea to move the bolt..
let us see how smart the solution is..

any idea when the riser will be available?


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## chrstphr

Cylosis said:


> It looks like the tiller bolt is moved back and forth? Interesting, but does the geometry mean you need to completely retune should you change limb fittings?


You should return every time you change the limbs, regardless of ILF or Formula or switching between the two. 

Chris


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## projayjay

How will the limb alignment system look like? It looks like that they took that part out.


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## Plucker

acco205 said:


> Patent reasons I would suspect...


To my knowledge there is no patent on the Formula system, nothing that would live up to the inventiveness criteria i suspect. Might be wrong, but if there was an application it should have been made public by now and I have not seen one. Patenting the formula system would be a huge waste of money anyhow...


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## limbwalker

Agreed. There is no way you wouldn't have to retune after switching limbs. I have to do that with 2 pairs of ILF limbs now. 

Also, if the limb bolt is the same length, the ILF fitting would give you more "deflex" than the Formula setting, based on the relative position of the limb.


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## limbwalker

IMO, this is one of the more innovative products to come to the market in some time.


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## acco205

Plucker said:


> To my knowledge there is no patent on the Formula system, nothing that would live up to the inventiveness criteria i suspect. Might be wrong, but if there was an application it should have been made public by now and I have not seen one. Patenting the formula system would be a huge waste of money anyhow...


I would have thought the same thing, but considering the number of people shooting formula bows, you'd think other manufacturers would have jumped on board and made formula compatible limbs if something wasn't stopping them...but I could be wrong...

To my knowledge Uukha is the only brand that has done anything to allow formua shooters to use their product.


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## chrstphr

erickatgta said:


> any idea when the riser will be available?


end of the year is what i hear for the riser. They will have them at the Vegas shoot for everyone to check out. 


Chris


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## chrstphr

acco205 said:


> I would have thought the same thing, but considering the number of people shooting formula bows, you'd think other manufacturers would have jumped on board and made formula compatible limbs if something wasn't stopping them...but I could be wrong...
> 
> To my knowledge Uukha is the only brand that has done anything to allow formula shooters to use their product.


MK Korea has been making formula limbs for several years now.


Chris


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## Cylosis

limbwalker said:


> IMO, this is one of the more innovative products to come to the market in some time.


Nonsense! Scented string wax was clearly the most innovative invention to grace the archery world since composite bows! :wink:


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## acco205

chrstphr said:


> MK Korea has been making formula limbs for several years now.
> 
> 
> Chris


That I did not know! *googles furiously*


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## chrstphr

http://mkarchery.com/products

Formula Inpers, Formula 1440 and Formula Vera limbs.

Chris


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## Plucker

acco205 said:


> I would have thought the same thing, but considering the number of people shooting formula bows, you'd think other manufacturers would have jumped on board and made formula compatible limbs if something wasn't stopping them...but I could be wrong...
> 
> To my knowledge Uukha is the only brand that has done anything to allow formua shooters to use their product.


Well consider that it after all is a very limited market, Assuming Hoyt have a 20%-30% market share, and that half that is Formula bows that is 10%-15% of the already rather small market for new bows. So to compete for at best 15% of this market segment those manufacturers would have to make a not so insignificant investment. 

That investment is probably better spent in R&D, marketing, or a number of other things. The main problem is that a set of formula limbs cannot be used on old ILF bows, I assume that most new limbs that are sold are used in old bows. Based purely on myself I have on average bought 4 pairs of limbs for each new bow I bought. so for every new bow sold I would guess that there are four pair of limbs sold. 

So formula limbs probably represents no more than 5% of the limb market, and there will always be those who will not shoot anything other than Hoyt limbs in Hoyt bows. So the risk of competing for those few % of the market segment is probably not worth the investment in retooling. This might however change as formula bows become more and more common in the used market. 

Sorry for the rambling it is late here in Europe


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## ryan b.

Border also makes formula limbs


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## x1440

I have been using MK Vera F-Series (Formula) limbs for a couple years now and I love them. They are extremely smooth and fast.


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## Greysides

It's a nice looking riser. Wonder how it would work barebow...? Will have to wait.


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## Vittorio

Plucker said:


> Well consider that it after all is a very limited market, Assuming Hoyt have a 20%-30% market share, and that half that is Formula bows that is 10%-15% of the already rather small market for new bows. So to compete for at best 15% of this market segment those manufacturers would have to make a not so insignificant investment.
> 
> That investment is probably better spent in R&D, marketing, or a number of other things. The main problem is that a set of formula limbs cannot be used on old ILF bows, I assume that most new limbs that are sold are used in old bows. Based purely on myself I have on average bought 4 pairs of limbs for each new bow I bought. so for every new bow sold I would guess that there are four pair of limbs sold.
> 
> So formula limbs probably represents no more than 5% of the limb market, and there will always be those who will not shoot anything other than Hoyt limbs in Hoyt bows. So the risk of competing for those few % of the market segment is probably not worth the investment in retooling. This might however change as formula bows become more and more common in the used market.
> 
> Sorry for the rambling it is late here in Europe


Analysis is perfect. Non Hoyt risers for Formula limbs are such small market segment that is difficult to imagine any return from it, even making very small quantities and selling them at very high price. Curious to know how much will be the retail price for this riser.


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## rat4go

The 'bat wing' things near the limb pockets make it look like a really big bottle opener from the side view.


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## archeryal

Watching coverage of the Youth Olympic Games, I saw several Formula bows with MK limbs. (Some awesome shooting there - the Korean male gold medalist shot brilliantly, though he shot a W&W.)


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## jmvargas

the Koreans shoot anything well....


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## Arsi

I will be buying this when it comes out. Guaranteed. I base my equipment choices on the looks by the way


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## theminoritydude

Can someone please post up a detailed picture of the limb pocket's assembly please?


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## Kumikaine

theminoritydude said:


> Can someone please post up a detailed picture of the limb pocket's assembly please?





Kumikaine said:


> Looks awesome! Do you know if it has stabilizer bushings for when you are using ilf limbs?


Including the the top/bottom stabilizer bushings if any please.


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## chrstphr

Kumikaine said:


> Including the the top/bottom stabilizer bushings if any please.


You can see in the photos there is a top front bushing and a bushing for a long rod just the same as the MK X10 riser. There is no bushing for a back weight, though some have drilled on out. There is no bottom bushing like on the MK X10. The limb pocket takes up that space. 


View attachment 2029257


The limb pocket has two places drilled and set for tiller bolt placement dependent on the limb used. The top pivot point ( detent) is the same as the MK X10 riser.

View attachment 2029259



Chris


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## theminoritydude

Oh.....


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## chrstphr

here is a photo of the riser with the tiller bolts in, showing the stab bushings etc.

In this photo, there is no top bushing. 

View attachment 2029286


Chris


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## Seattlepop

rat4go said:


> The 'bat wing' things near the limb pockets make it look like a really big bottle opener from the side view.


I agree, but I was also thinking...the new MK "Jaws"

View attachment 2029300


View attachment 2029301


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## chrstphr

yes, i think the ends do look like a shark. 

I have suggested a name for the riser that they like. But i do not know what name they will choose yet. 


Chris


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## ThomVis

I want to see what this riser looks like with ILF limbs in it. I have a feeling it'll look very uhm.... floating. Window and bottom part look very beefy, weight would be interesting too. No top stabilizer bushing .


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## rookcaca

I had an mkx10 riser, very nice ilf riser. My question would be, with so many choices in good/excellent ilf limbs, why would you want to purchase a formula limb style at a premium price?


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## x1440

I'm pretty sure the unused tiller bolt hole can be used as a stabilizer bushing for both the top and the bottom rear. You might have to find a thread adapter somewhere. The formula limbs have the stabile bushing in the limbs but on this riser when you use ILF limbs, the holes closest to the grips will be open and threaded.


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## chrstphr

x1440 said:


> I'm pretty sure the unused tiller bolt hole can be used as a stabilizer bushing for both the top and the bottom rear. You might have to find a thread adapter somewhere. The formula limbs have the stabile bushing in the limbs but on this riser when you use ILF limbs, the holes closest to the grips will be open and threaded.


I hadnt thought of that


Chris


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## chrstphr

ThomVis said:


> I want to see what this riser looks like with ILF limbs in it. I have a feeling it'll look very uhm.... floating. Window and bottom part look very beefy, weight would be interesting too. No top stabilizer bushing .


They will have them at the Vegas shoot in the MK Korea Booth. You can probably shoot one there. They usually have a demo or two available to try. 


Chris


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## Ar-Pe-Lo

Cylosis said:


> It looks like the tiller bolt is moved back and forth? Interesting, but does the geometry mean you need to completely retune should you change limb fittings?
> 
> Also not a fan of the cutouts in the upper half, but what a great idea! But as a non-specialized product, I hope *they're cheap*.


I don't think so.....it's MK not SF ;-)


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## Kumikaine

x1440 said:


> I'm pretty sure the unused tiller bolt hole can be used as a stabilizer bushing for both the top and the bottom rear. You might have to find a thread adapter somewhere. The formula limbs have the stabile bushing in the limbs but on this riser when you use ILF limbs, the holes closest to the grips will be open and threaded.


 I was thinking along the same lines.

Also thank you Chris for the clarification.


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## Arsi

chrstphr said:


> They will have them at the Vegas shoot in the MK Korea Booth. You can probably shoot one there. They usually have a demo or two available to try.
> 
> 
> Chris


Hey Chris, any clue on release date and US vendors? If they have risers available at Vegas ill buy one there.


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## x1440

US distributors are MK Korea Archery in Southern California and Grea Tree Archery in Connecticut. Jim Park CEO of Grea Tree Archery used to be VP of Samick. MK Korea was started by a couple of ex-Samick engineers. Mr Park has been helping with some of the R&D as well.

www.mkarchery.com
www.greatreearchery.com

Veracity limbs were released in June in Korea. I'm hearing they will arrive in the US around Oct/Nov and The riser is going through final testing/pre-production, expecting to be released in Korea in Oct and early next year to the US.


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## chrstphr

here is a photo of the limb pocket as requested.

View attachment 2029554



and one of the white bows

View attachment 2029555


I am told they will be available end of the year. I expect the Vegas Show will be the formal entry into the US market aside from a few demo risers. 

You can contact [email protected] for ordering one before they are available. or requesting a demo one when they come in. 

Chris


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## chrstphr

View attachment 2029579



View attachment 2029577



Chris


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## limbwalker

The limb pockets do look like a supersized bottle opener. LOL. Not sure what's with the wings. But the dual-bolts is very, very clever.


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## theminoritydude

Erm.....so how is the riser's length being classified?


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## chrstphr

theminoritydude said:


> Erm.....so how is the riser's length being classified?


when i spoke with Eddie, he said he thought it was a 25 inch riser. 


Chris


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## indebtmd

Any word on how much this bad boy is going to go for?


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## chrstphr

I have not had any info on pricing on any of the new limbs or riser. 


Chris


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## gster123

But the riser is the wrong way round!


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## Drowsy

I notice that MK Korea is an exhibitor for the 2015 ATA Show. Do you think they'll have it on display?


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## rstgyx

chrstphr said:


> They will have them at the Vegas shoot in the MK Korea Booth. You can probably shoot one there. They usually have a demo or two available to try.
> 
> 
> Chris


Hey Chris. If I were to hypothetically purchase a MKX10 riser from the MKarchery website, would I be able to request the riser in the 'chrome' colour before it gets anodized like this?








With the limb pockets + bolt and logo of course


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## chrstphr

Drowsy said:


> I notice that MK Korea is an exhibitor for the 2015 ATA Show. Do you think they'll have it on display?


yes, if they are there with a booth, you can bet they will have both risers and all their limbs


Chris


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## chrstphr

rstgyx said:


> Hey Chris. If I were to hypothetically purchase a MKX10 riser from the MKarchery website, would I be able to request the riser in the 'chrome' colour before it gets anodized like this?
> View attachment 2029938
> 
> 
> With the limb pockets + bolt and logo of course



it doesnt hurt to ask, 


i will see if they will do that. which riser?


chris


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## Seattlepop

chrstphr said:


> here is a photo of the limb pocket as requested.
> 
> View attachment 2029554
> 
> 
> 
> and one of the white bows
> 
> View attachment 2029555
> 
> 
> I am told they will be available end of the year. I expect the Vegas Show will be the formal entry into the US market aside from a few demo risers.
> 
> 
> 
> You can contact [email protected] for ordering one before they are available. or requesting a demo one when they come in.
> 
> Chris



Interesting that they went with the Hoyt washer system.


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## chrstphr

Seattlepop said:


> Interesting that they went with the Hoyt washer system.


the dovel is slightly different, the ends prevent it from rotating, the top of the dowel is flat to match the riser in that same area, and they have two different thickness washers for more micro adjustment. Both an improvement i feel over the Hoyt adjustability.

I have an Aerotec and the MK X10 riser. But the basic dowel system for adjustment is the same concept.


Chris


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## rstgyx

chrstphr said:


> it doesnt hurt to ask,
> 
> 
> i will see if they will do that. which riser?
> 
> 
> chris


What do you mean by which riser? Any of the MKX10's in the picture will do


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## theminoritydude

chrstphr said:


> when i spoke with Eddie, he said he thought it was a 25 inch riser.
> 
> 
> Chris


With respect to ILF or Formula?


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## SoMe0nE2tAlK2

rstgyx said:


> Hey Chris. If I were to hypothetically purchase a MKX10 riser from the MKarchery website, would I be able to request the riser in the 'chrome' colour before it gets anodized like this?
> View attachment 2029938
> 
> 
> With the limb pockets + bolt and logo of course


I've asked Eddie Kim that same question. 
He says there would be a lot of risk of the riser oxidizing and maintenance to keep the riser looking good. 

I probably could have pushed further on the issue but stopped at that point. Shooting a bare riser currently and the shine does fade over time.


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## rat4go

Clear coat it?


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## Kumikaine

rat4go said:


> Clear coat it?


Clear anodizing is also a option.


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## Drowsy

Thanks Chris! I look forward to seeing MK Archery's products in January! Anybody else headed to Indianapolis for the ATA Show??



chrstphr said:


> yes, if they are there with a booth, you can bet they will have both risers and all their limbs
> 
> 
> Chris


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## limbwalker

chrstphr said:


> the dovel is slightly different, the ends prevent it from rotating, the top of the dowel is flat to match the riser in that same area, and they have two different thickness washers for more micro adjustment. Both an improvement i feel over the Hoyt adjustability.
> 
> I have an Aerotec and the MK X10 riser. But the basic dowel system for adjustment is the same concept.
> 
> 
> Chris


I noticed the shape of the dowels to keep them from rotating and immediately thought "nice job!" because that's one PITA I could have lived without on the Hoyt risers. The different thickness washers is another nice touch. Of course, if you were OCD and shot Hoyt risers, you were filing down alignment washers long before it was cool.


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## gif

theminoritydude said:


> With respect to ILF or Formula?



It would be the same either way. The length is measured between the dowels, not the bolts.


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## erickatgta

thank you,chrstphr... you answer all questions


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## FlyingWatchmake

As a side note on the MK X10, we have 2 in the club and no washers needed, straight limbs, straight riser ;-) 

(Other person shooting F7's, I'm shooting Border hex 6's, about to be hex 7's) 

If everyone shot straight limbs they could probably seal the alignment system!

Tom


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## limbwalker

> If everyone shot straight limbs they could probably seal the alignment system!


I'm certain everyone would LOVE to shoot straight limbs. If only the manufacturers could deliver straight limbs.


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## chrstphr

a few more colors....

View attachment 2031584



View attachment 2031585



Chris


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## chrstphr

i just saw video, the top stabilizer screws in to the tiller bolt. 

brilliant and very clever. the videos are on my facebook page here

https://www.facebook.com/chrstphrhill

chris


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## ThomVis

chrstphr said:


> i just saw video, the top stabilizer screws in to the tiller bolt.


Somebody has been using the gray matter....


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## rookcaca

Great job!


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## rookcaca

I also hope they have a 27" version available. I currently shoot a 25"/med length bow now, but if I purchased one of these I would like to try a 27"/short limb combination.

One of the things I noticed on the 25" Hoyt Formula was the short sight window when shooting indoors during winter target leagues. Maybe a 27" riser with short limbs would be the was to go.


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## chrstphr

honestly most asians are not very tall, so there is not much of a demand for 27 inch risers. I am surprised Win Win has one. 

While MK Korea has not ruled out a 27 inch, the focus is 25 inch risers for now. 

I personally shoot a 25 inch riser with longs. You should try that combination.


Chris


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## chrstphr

View attachment 2032435



Orange, Copper, Gray, Black, White, Green, Blue, Sky Blue, Purple, Pink, Red



Chris


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## Vittorio

chrstphr said:


> honestly most asians are not very tall, so there is not much of a demand for 27 inch risers. I am surprised Win Win has one.
> 
> While MK Korea has not ruled out a 27 inch, the focus is 25 inch risers for now.
> 
> I personally shoot a 25 inch riser with longs. You should try that combination.
> 
> Chris


A riser for formula limbs has by design a shorter window than a riser for ILF limbs. In practical use, a 27" formula riser has a window corresponding to a 25" ILF riser, and a 25" formula riser has a window corresponding to a 23" ILF riser. With men poundages or and tall face may be difficult to get proper vision of the sight at short distancies with a short window. This must be taken in consideration when choosing the lenght of a formula riser.


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## Joe T

I find the concept behind this riser somewhat baffling. Why would anyone wanting to use ILF limbs (the vast majority of archers) want to buy a "formula" compatible riser which costs more and has less sight window. For the minority who want to use formula limbs then you have a very nice Hoyt formula riser available and if you want non Hoyt formula limbs then these are available in theory from other manufacturers. Though again if you want to use non Hoyt limbs far more sensible to use standard ILF fitting, what would be the point of buying non Hoyt formula limbs. (Obviously this excludes the few archers who are "paid" to use the formula riser).


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## ma1

I must agree. There doesn't seem to be any advantage in shooting this new riser when compared to its predecessor. The fact that it can take formula limbs doesn't seem to benefit performance unless, for example, there is an increase in mass weight.
Chris, do you know the mass weight of the new riser? It seems quite chunky so I would think it is a little heavier.


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## jmvargas

...there are some people who may want the flexibility of being able to use both ILF and formula limbs on the same riser...

..am not sure how big this market is but it's the only reason i can think of for coming up with this riser..

FWIW i'm not part of that market!!


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## chang

I would wonder, 

The riser geometry optimal for for formula series of limbs. would it perform the same with ILF limbs? 

The thing is the initial FRX riser followed more closely to the ILF riser geometry, and end up slower.


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## limbwalker

The limb angle will be different depending on whether you're using formula or ILF limbs, and how much either limb is wound in or out. That's going to affect the way the bow shoots quite a bit.

As for why we need a riser like this? I don't really care. I'm glad someone finally made one just because.


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## Ar-Pe-Lo

chang said:


> I would wonder,
> 
> The riser geometry optimal for for formula series of limbs. would it perform the same with ILF limbs?
> 
> The thing is the initial FRX riser followed more closely to the ILF riser geometry, and end up slower.


It's end up slower then korean ILF bows because of slower Hoyt limbs, not because riser.


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## chrstphr

Ar-Pe-Lo said:


> It's end up slower then korean ILF bows because of slower Hoyt limbs, not because riser.


lol.....


Chris


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## chrstphr

Joe T said:


> I find the concept behind this riser somewhat baffling. Why would anyone wanting to use ILF limbs (the vast majority of archers) want to buy a "formula" compatible riser which costs more and has less sight window. For the minority who want to use formula limbs then you have a very nice Hoyt formula riser available and if you want non Hoyt formula limbs then these are available in theory from other manufacturers. Though again if you want to use non Hoyt limbs far more sensible to use standard ILF fitting, what would be the point of buying non Hoyt formula limbs. (Obviously this excludes the few archers who are "paid" to use the formula riser).



some people may want to be able ot buy or try a Quattro limb, a Winex limb, or a Vera limb without worrying about formula or ILF. Perhaps someone hasnt decided yet which limb type they will want to shoot throughout their archery career. 

Having this riser will allow them to change to either in the future and not be dependent on one type of limb. Who knows, perhaps in 25 years, formula limbs will be the only limb on the market. Either way, it gives an archer choices. 

Chris


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## massman

Chris,

Wouldn't it be simpler to design a fitting that replaces the doveltail fitting on the Formula limb. It could index off of the limb notch and into the hole formerly where the Formula dovetail was installed. It could have the new dovetail where it would need to be to fit ILF risers.

That way you retain the longer sight window of the 25" ILF riser and the flexability of using ILF or modified Formula limbs.

No??

Tom


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## chrstphr

massman said:


> Chris,
> 
> Wouldn't it be simpler to design a fitting that replaces the doveltail fitting on the Formula limb. It could index off of the limb notch and into the hole formerly where the Formula dovetail was installed. It could have the new dovetail where it would need to be to fit ILF risers.
> 
> That way you retain the longer sight window of the 25" ILF riser and the flexability of using ILF or modified Formula limbs.
> 
> No??
> 
> Tom


there already was one. It didnt make it to market. I would assume it had some real world problems or something that prevented it from being coming to market. Uukha also has one. Lancaster carries it though its currently on backorder and only works on Uukha limbs. 

Doesnt seem to be used much at any tournament i have been to. 

I think this is the next best choice, Especially since the formula limb has a stab attach to it. Adding an adapter to it as well, may affect bow reaction. 

Chris


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## massman

I do remember a fitting that allowed ILF limbs on a Formula riser. What I envision is a simple plate with a dowl that would index in the hole in the Formula limb where the dovetail fitting goes. A small finger/tab that would index on the rounded part of the limb bolt notch and the underside part of the dovetail where it would index on a std ILF riser. Fitting secured to the limb through the face of the limb through the hole for the dovetail on the formula limb.

Regards,

Tom


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## limbwalker

What folks aren't thinking about is the used market. This riser will open that up for archers who are looking at used limbs.


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## ThomVis

massman said:


> I do remember a fitting that allowed ILF limbs on a Formula riser.


Uukha Formula risers adapter


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## Joe T

chrstphr said:


> there already was one. It didnt make it to market. I would assume it had some real world problems or something that prevented it from being coming to market. Uukha also has one. Lancaster carries it though its currently on backorder and only works on Uukha limbs.
> 
> Doesnt seem to be used much at any tournament i have been to.
> 
> I think this is the next best choice, Especially since the formula limb has a stab attach to it. Adding an adapter to it as well, may affect bow reaction.
> 
> Chris


I think what Massman is suggesting is something different. Instead of going from ILF to Formula by changing the position of the tiller bolts keeping the same riser length, you go from ILF to Formula by adding an extension piece converting the riser say from 25" ILF to 27" Formula i.e. moving the pivot point. This allows you to keep the sight window.


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## chrstphr

Joe T said:


> I think what Massman is suggesting is something different. Instead of going from ILF to Formula by changing the position of the tiller bolts keeping the same riser length, you go from ILF to Formula by adding an extension piece converting the riser say from 25" ILF to 27" Formula i.e. moving the pivot point. This allows you to keep the sight window.



that just gives you new problems. First is how to make the adapter stable against that pivot point as thats the point that takes the most weight and stress aside from the tiller bolt.

two, you would have to have different length strings, and the poundage would be different when switching between ILF and formula limbs and the pivot point changing also would change the length and poundage. 

By moving the tiller bolt, the archer can use the same string for both limbs, and if both limbs are marked 42 pounds, then both would be 42 lbs as the pivot point and length are the same. 

unless i havent thought it through correctly. 

Chris


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## erickatgta

for those whom wanna know where the top stab will be...
got from facebook


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## erickatgta

I wonder if I can install the hoyt stealth shot.... then I will be perfect riser for me....


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## theminoritydude

chrstphr said:


> By moving the tiller bolt, the archer can use the same string for both limbs, and if both limbs are marked 42 pounds, then both would be 42 lbs as the pivot point and length are the same.
> 
> unless i havent thought it through correctly.
> 
> Chris


I do not believe that a formula limb is pivoted to allow the same string to be used by the ILF equivalent.


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## bobnikon

chrstphr said:


> that just gives you new problems. First is how to make the adapter stable against that pivot point as thats the point that takes the most weight and stress aside from the tiller bolt.
> 
> two, you would have to have different length strings, and the poundage would be different when switching between ILF and formula limbs and the pivot point changing also would change the length and poundage.
> 
> By moving the tiller bolt, the archer can use the same string for both limbs, and if both limbs are marked 42 pounds, then both would be 42 lbs as the pivot point and length are the same.
> 
> unless i havent thought it through correctly.
> 
> Chris


I see what you are saying about stability. I think that could be real issue.

as for the string and weight issue, that could easily be mitigated by buying the formula limbs 2# heavier, and I imagine for tune, string weight, nock height etc you would probably need a second string anyhow. After all even with two identical sets of limbs, they are rarely identical. I cant imagine a formula and an ILF set being spot on, without going through a lot of sets to get there.

On another note, this riser is a great idea, a flexible and innovative approach to a question that has vexxed many. Now there is no need to choose. The real coup for MK will be if they can make one at an affordable level to make it accessible to everyone.

on yet another note... I REALLY want to meet the beer bottle this opens :darkbeer:


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## massman

What I'm invisioning is... remove the dovetail fitting from the Formula limb. The formula to ILF fitting is place on the underside of the limb. Indexed in place by a dowel that fits through the dovetail hole and a small tab at the limb notch. From the face of the limb a screw is installed through the dovetail hole in the limb, screwing into the fitting. The fitting has the new dovetail in the correct location to fit ILF risers.

You would need to obviously change string lengths.

Regards,

Tom


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## limbwalker

Pity they chose the bottle opener teeth for the limb pockets. Otherwise, it's an attractive riser.


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## SBills

limbwalker said:


> The limb angle will be different depending on whether you're using formula or ILF limbs, and how much either limb is wound in or out. That's going to affect the way the bow shoots quite a bit.
> 
> .


John,

The limb angle would not necessarily need to be different. If the second hole is on a higher plane the exit angle remains the same. I’m sure MK thought about that. While interesting I am not so sure about those cutouts. Not to my taste but oh well. Would make some serious room for lower barebow weight options with ILF limbs.


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## SBills

limbwalker said:


> Pity they chose the bottle opener teeth for the limb pockets. Otherwise, it's an attractive riser.


We are of a very like mind on that.


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## limbwalker

Yea, I was assuming the holes were on the same plane. Perhaps they aren't. If they are, the formula limbs will be worked a bit more.


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## Unk Bond

SBills said:


> We are of a very like mind on that.


Hello
X2 on that.
Guess the riser looks. Is in the eye of the beholder. My first and second impression of the riser is a 7
Would like to see a picture with limbs mounted. For my 3rd impression. :wink: [ Later


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## chrstphr

Unk Bond said:


> Hello
> 
> Would like to see a picture with limbs mounted.[ Later



I linked to several photos with limbs and video on my facebook in an earlier post.


Chris


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## chang

From FRX to HPX, the different is not just mounting angle but also in the deflex level. 

In fact, I had tried and found a pair of extra short limbs works better with formula on a 27' riser. compare the same config in ILF (with border's limbs).

and a extra short formula limb is about the same real length as a short ILF. I am not so sure the limb base is 100% rigid now. (it may be not so obvious with recurve, but there are lot of example in compound that bending portion of limbs between the 2 support points). 

All these makes me suspect, formula configuration may perform differently to ILF, with not only different mounting angle but also the amount deflex


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## chrstphr

theminoritydude said:


> I do not believe that a formula limb is pivoted to allow the same string to be used by the ILF equivalent.


is a formula limb longer than an ILF limbs from button to tip?

i thought the difference was from button to dovetail. 

if that is correct, then on the new MK riser, the button detent is the same for both, the tiller bolt moves down to accomodate the longer dovetail. thus the same string will work for both since the total length has not changed, only the limb dovetail goes lower on the riser.


perhaps im not understanding .

i will have one to test and review in a few months. i have 42 lb vera formula and ILF vera i can test on it. i will see if the same string works for both. both limbs are long and same poundage.

chris


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## Kumikaine

chrstphr said:


> is a formula limb longer than an ILF limbs from button to tip?
> 
> i thought the difference was from button to dovetail.
> 
> 
> 
> chris


That is correct. Formula limbs from the Button/ Detent Assembly to the tip are the same length as ILF Limbs. The major change with the new hoyt risers whether ILF or Formula (Hpx/Ion-x/Gpx) as stated before is the deflex which changes the brace height and string length required compares to Korean ILF risers


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## x1440

I just received more information on the riser. 

MK in Korea is calling the riser MK Alpha. It will be available in the US in October. MK Archery in California will have US pricing information near the end of this month. 

The weight is 1130 grams. Quite a bit lighter than the MK X10 even though it looks like it has more bulk to it.

Riser will only be available in 25". It's probably due to tooling costs but Koreans are not big fans of 27" risers anyway.

I was also told the same string can be used for both F-Series (Formula) and ILF limbs.


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## massman

So if I'm reading this correctly...the riser has the sight window of a 23" riser. The riser with Med length limbs would then be a 66" bow. With Formula limbs it would be a 68" bow??

Tom


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## bobnikon

I would imagine you are correct on the size of the sight window due to the position of the Formula tiller bolts, but the dovetail is in the same position for both set of limbs, so shouldn't change the length of the bow, if it is a 25" riser medium limbs should be 68" bow.


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## chrstphr

the riser should have a sight window that is the same as a 25 inch riser. You cant compare it to a formula riser. It is different.

the riser with medium limbs will be 68 inches, regardless of Formula limbs or ILF limbs. Having the pivot point be the same makes the limbs the same length. 

As i said, you will be able to use the same string. 

I had heard, that they may choose the name Alpha. That was my suggestion in a way. I suggested MK Omni since it can could both types of limbs. 

If you write Omni in Korean, you get 암니 which means Alpha. 


Chris


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## fango0000

limbwalker said:


> Pity they chose the bottle opener teeth for the limb pockets. Otherwise, it's an attractive riser.


Now you can crack open a cold one after a good afternoon of shooting?


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## x1440

chrstphr said:


> If you write Omni in Korean, you get 암니 which means Alpha.


Omni is writing as commonly written as 옴니 in Hangul. Alpha is 알파. There is no Korean word for either so we use the same Greek words and meanings. We just write them phonetically in Hangul (Korean).


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## chrstphr

x1440 said:


> Omni is writing as commonly written as 옴니 in Hangul. Alpha is 알파. There is no Korean word for either so we use the same Greek words and meanings. We just write them phonetically in Hangul (Korean).


you would know better as i am a beginner with the Korean Language. I was pming Eddie and we were discussing the new riser and the lack of an official name. I suggested MK Omni and then i asked him if there was a word for 엄니 in Korean as that was what i thought it would be phonetically. He said yes, it meant Alpha. But he did not give me the correct Korean phonetic spelling. Perhaps he was thinking of the phonetics. So i had no correction on how it would be spelled.

He then suggested Alpha to MK Korea guys, and they seem to have chosen it. 

Chris


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## Greysides

Chris, thanks for the pictures and info. I think this is the best looking riser to come on the market in a long time. 

Looks very 'oriental' to me, a break from the tedium and in a range of appealing new colours. I hope it shoots to match.


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## bobnikon

Greysides said:


> Chris, thanks for the pictures and info. I think this is the best looking riser to come on the market in a long time.
> 
> Looks very 'oriental' to me, a break from the tedium and in a range of appealing new colours. I hope it shoots to match.


I think it will be a love it or hate it kind of thing. I am still not sure. 

If the wings were just a little bigger at the pocket I would swear they were commissioned for a new movie where, like in the Arrow series, they use the bow as much as a bludgeoning weapon as a bow. Or maybe the Klingons will be using bows in the next Star Trek movie. 

That being said, a few aesthetics are a small issue for the flexibility the riser promises.


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## x1440

chrstphr said:


> you would know better as i am a beginner with the Korean Language. I was pming Eddie and we were discussing the new riser and the lack of an official name. I suggested MK Omni and then i asked him if there was a word for 엄니 in Korean as that was what i thought it would be phonetically. He said yes, it meant Alpha. But he did not give me the correct Korean phonetic spelling. Perhaps he was thinking of the phonetics. So i had no correction on how it would be spelled.
> 
> He then suggested Alpha to MK Korea guys, and they seem to have chosen it.
> 
> Chris


Chris, I think it's cool you're trying to learn Korean. I would have preferred Omni too since it's such a unique name and fits the riser better, but I think "Omni" is too hard for Koreans to pronounce :wink: so they went with "Alpha". 

By the way, Omni also sounds similiar to "앞니" (ap ni) which means "Front Teeth" in Korean. Might be another reason why they didn't like it, but it kind of describes the riser too...


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## chrstphr

x1440 said:


> Chris, I think it's cool you're trying to learn Korean. I would have preferred Omni too since it's such a unique name and fits the riser better, but I think "Omni" is too hard for Koreans to pronounce :wink: so they went with "Alpha".
> 
> By the way, Omni also sounds similiar to "앞니" (ap ni) which means "Front Teeth" in Korean. Might be another reason why they didn't like it, but it kind of describes the riser too...


감사합니다, 자는 한극어를 공부해요, 잘못해요. 

chris


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## w8lon

I'm sorry the bottle openers would have to be filed off as there is no purpose for them. At least with the fifties cars tail fins served well in a stylistic approach to a unique persona of the vehicle. The riser is unique enough without the fins.


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## theminoritydude

chrstphr said:


> is a formula limb longer than an ILF limbs from button to tip?
> 
> i thought the difference was from button to dovetail.
> 
> if that is correct, then on the new MK riser, the button detent is the same for both, the tiller bolt moves down to accomodate the longer dovetail. thus the same string will work for both since the total length has not changed, only the limb dovetail goes lower on the riser.
> 
> 
> perhaps im not understanding .
> 
> i will have one to test and review in a few months. i have 42 lb vera formula and ILF vera i can test on it. i will see if the same string works for both. both limbs are long and same poundage.
> 
> chris


Easy, just put a 25" GMX next to a 25" HPX and take note of their respective dovetail sitting positions.


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## chrstphr

theminoritydude said:


> Easy, just put a 25" GMX next to a 25" HPX and take note of their respective dovetail sitting positions.


yes, there may be a difference between the HPX, RX, Ion X etc, but we are talking about the MK riser with both types of limbs. The only difference is the dovetail is longer for formula and will need a lower tiller bolt placement. 



Chris


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## chrstphr

View attachment 2035140



Chris


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## ppayne

chrstphr said:


> View attachment 2035140
> 
> 
> 
> Chris


Never mind omni or alpha...there is no way the nickname " The Shark" won't stick to that riser


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## bobnikon

ppayne said:


> Never mind omni or alpha...there is no way the nickname " The Shark" won't stick to that riser


And in white... JAWS


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## HikerDave

bobnikon said:


> And in white... JAWS


I think that it looks kind of like a pit bull. So ugly that it's cute.


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## theminoritydude

chrstphr said:


> yes, there may be a difference between the HPX, RX, Ion X etc, but we are talking about the MK riser with both types of limbs. The only difference is the dovetail is longer for formula and will need a lower tiller bolt placement.
> 
> 
> 
> Chris


I'm sorry, I meant their button sitting positions. But even that may be comparing apples to oranges.


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## chrstphr

Mk Korea will be at the ATA show. Booth 5824.

The ATA show is January 8-10th in Indianapolis IN.


You can see the new MK Alpha riser there as well as the new Veracity (Vera 3) limbs. 


Chris


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## Gauvinra

Chris, Any idea when the limbs will be available? Are they going to continue making MKX 10 Riser?

Rich


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## chrstphr

Gauvinra said:


> Chris, Any idea when the limbs will be available? Are they going to continue making MKX 10 Riser?
> 
> Rich


The new Veracity limbs should be available in the next two months. They are still making the MK X10 riser.


Chris


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## chrstphr

MK Alpha risers finally received in the USA....

View attachment 2099785


Red one is Arsi's, Purple one is mine, Blue one is stock. 

They are impressive. As i got them last night, i havent had a chance to shoot it yet. But I am told it is also a great choice for a barebow riser as the feel is great for the shot and the extra tiller bolt hole lets you add weight. 


Chris


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## Arsi

Looking forward to it!


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## Mika Savola

A young man that I coach, got his purple riser (could not get veracity limbs yet) few weeks ago. I helped to set it up, and also got to shoot three shots myself with his gear: Aiming on a blank bale at 18 meters, with his tab and too short arrows, I managed to shoot a group that could fit x10 inside out on 40 cm target face! The shot feel was great, maybe one of the best risers I have ever tried.


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## DarkMuppet

My club mate got his yesterday, a blue one, and I have to say it's a stunning piece of kit! It looks and feels so well engineered with an attention to detail that seems to be missing on many other current risers. :thumb: 

It didn't take long to get everything on it and it was soon up and running. One thing that was immediate was just how quiet it was. All his equipment was ported over from his GMX and that always just to shoot with a clunk, this seemed whisper quiet by comparison. Tapping it produced a "tink" sound as opposed to a "dunk" with the GMX. All down to the higher grade of aluminium I'd imagine.

Unfortunately I couldn't have a go as I'm left handed but it did seem very impressive. Maybe in the spring .... :wink:


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## rstgyx

Chris what are you opinions on the new MK Alpha risers and the Veracity limbs? Are they "superior" to their predecessors?


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## chrstphr

Hi, The veracity limbs are a step up from the Vera 1s in my opinion. Much smoother and deader shot. Almost no recoil in the limb after the shot with my setup. My sight marks are alittle different from the Vera's so i think the Veracity limbs may be slightly slower. 

The Alpha riser is a great riser. Every bit as good as the MK X10. I do not consider it a better riser though, it just has a different purpose/ niche. I prefer the lines of the mK X10 riser. To me the big appeal of the Alpha is the ability to use Formula AND ILF limbs. If you have a closet full of Formula limbs, You can get this riser and it also opens the field up for ILF limbs that come on the market. 

There are many Formula shooters that have sets of limbs and were stick with a limited series of risers. Now there is an alternative. 

The Alpha is a great shooter and it feels much like the MK X10 for shot. I dont really shoot any Formula limbs so i will be staying with my MKX10 risers for my outdoor tournaments. I did buy a set of Formula Inpers to put on the Alpha, since everyone is interested to see the shot window with Formula limbs. I am planning to setup the the Alpha as a indoor bow and as a demo for archers to try when i am at tournaments. 

Chris


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## rstgyx

chrstphr said:


> Hi, The veracity limbs are a step up from the Vera 1s in my opinion. Much smoother and deader shot. Almost no recoil in the limb after the shot with my setup. My sight marks are alittle different from the Vera's so i think the Veracity limbs may be slightly slower.
> 
> The Alpha riser is a great riser. Every bit as good as the MK X10. I do not consider it a better riser though, it just has a different purpose/ niche. I prefer the lines of the mK X10 riser. To me the big appeal of the Alpha is the ability to use Formula AND ILF limbs. If you have a closet full of Formula limbs, You can get this riser and it also opens the field up for ILF limbs that come on the market.
> 
> There are many Formula shooters that have sets of limbs and were stick with a limited series of risers. Now there is an alternative.
> 
> The Alpha is a great shooter and it feels much like the MK X10 for shot. I dont really shoot any Formula limbs so i will be staying with my MKX10 risers for my outdoor tournaments. I did buy a set of Formula Inpers to put on the Alpha, since everyone is interested to see the shot window with Formula limbs. I am planning to setup the the Alpha as a indoor bow and as a demo for archers to try when i am at tournaments.
> 
> Chris


That's very interesting. Looks like I'll stick with the MKX10 when I purchase a new bow rather than than the new MK Alpha. Are the Veracity limbs 'worth it' over the Vera 1s in terms of the smooth and deader shot but sacrifice of a little fps? (To me the lose of FPS for a more smoother shot with less vibrations seems to be pretty justifiable)


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## chrstphr

i think the Veracity limbs are worth it. They are on my gold bow currently which is slowly becoming my main bow. I have the Veras on my blue bow. The shot is so smooth and nice. 

Also it doesnt hurt that the current 70 meter world record was shot on veracity limbs.


Chris


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## Zarrow

chrstphr said:


> i think the Veracity limbs are worth it. They are on my gold bow currently which is slowly becoming my main bow. I have the Veras on my blue bow. The shot is so smooth and nice.
> 
> Also it doesnt hurt that the current 70 meter world record was shot on veracity limbs.
> 
> 
> Chris


Are they wood or foam core?


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## chrstphr

The Vera, Inpers and Veracity limbs are a wood core limb. 

The 1440, Prime and Mach3 limbs are foam core. 

Chris


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## ClanLee

Chris,

Have you shot any of the foam limbs from MK? I'm looking to purchase new limbs and am still deciding between foam and wood cores.


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## chrstphr

ClanLee said:


> Chris,
> 
> Have you shot any of the foam limbs from MK? I'm looking to purchase new limbs and am still deciding between foam and wood cores.


I shot the Samick Extremes when MK was making those. Great limbs. I have not shot the foam limbs MK Limbs. I started with the Vera limbs and never looked back. I have shot the intermaedite Inpers limbs. They are a nice limb. 

Any MK Korea limb will be a great well made limb. They are a leading limb maker in the archery world. 


I should also state that the Alpha riser has a bushing for a back weight, but the MK X10 riser does not. 

Chris


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## anmactire

Shot the Alpha last night with a set of 46lb mk1440 limbs. It's a gorgeous bow to shoot and has one of the only grips that I wouldn't rush to change from stock that I have used. My only issue was it was a set of short limbs and my draw length is 29.75 inches! Very very nice feel to it and the groups were good at 18m. 
Would definitely pick one up if I was looking for a new riser and the limbs are pretty sweet too.


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## rstgyx

Chris could you post some pictures of the MK Alpha riser? Sort of like a general 360 of the riser, a few closeups and what not - similar to these pics of the MKX10.

http://www.archery-forum.com/showthread.php?32450-MK-Korea-MKX-10-Riser


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## rat4go

There are quite a few pictures at the beginning of this thread.


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## chrstphr

it appears that Lancaster Archery is going to carry the Alpha riser and Mk Korea limbs. 




Chris


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## StarDog

chrstphr said:


> it appears that Lancaster Archery is going to carry the Alpha riser and Mk Korea limbs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Chris


I saw that yesterday but everything is backordered so I suspect they'll have the standard waiting period as every other dealer.


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## rstgyx

chrstphr said:


> it appears that Lancaster Archery is going to carry the Alpha riser and Mk Korea limbs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Chris


The prices are pretty good too! Lower than what I was expecting from an online store like Lancaster.


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## chrstphr

$25 cheaper on most limbs and the Alpha riser but $25 more on the Inpers. It will be interesting to see what they stock, and what is a special order. 


Chris


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## noobcaheo

Got my set up last week from Eddie Kim. Lovin' it


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## StarDog

chrstphr said:


> $25 cheaper on most limbs and the Alpha riser but $25 more on the Inpers. It will be interesting to see what they stock, and what is a special order.
> 
> 
> Chris


Then it's a good thing I ordered my Inpers from you!

I experimented with a couple of items like the riser by "shopping". I suspect it's all special order.


----------

