# Mathews Apex 7 Timing Holes



## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2017)

Hi - Looking to setup an Apex 7 and can't seem to find a diagram anywhere explaing which holes on the cam are the timing holes and what it is supposed to line up with. Profile on the cam or parallel to the string? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Here you go. Apex 7 has two "dimples" on the cam. I painted the dimples GREEN, so it is easier for you to see.



These dimples should form an imaginary line parallel to the bowstring, when the bow is at rest. This is the factory recommended starting cam rotation position. Yes, it matters. You twist or untwist the buss cable, to change the single cam starting rotation position. Then, you shoot arrows. The idea is to CUSTOM tune the twists in your buss cable (add more and more, or remove more and more half twists) to see what gives you the tightest fletched arrow groups. You change the cam starting rotation position, to adjust nock travel in the vertical direction. This means you are trying to get the FLATTEST groups (minimum vertical size on your groups). For me, I get best results with the two dimples dead parallel to the bowstring.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Hi - Looking to setup an Apex 7 and can't seem to find a diagram anywhere explaing which holes on the cam are the timing holes and what it is supposed to line up with. Profile on the cam or parallel to the string? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks


So, when you find your sweet spot for cam starting rotation position on your Apex 7,
you will also have to find the sweet spot for d-loop position. I have to have my Apex 7 d-loop a bit higher than level, when the riser is vertical.

Next, you have to find the sweet spot for un-equal limb turns. Yes, my limb bolts are not equal turns away from maximum. For best results, my 29-inch DL cam needs ONE limb bolt 1 full turn weaker than the other limb bolt. Your results will be different, depending on what size fixed DL cam you have, and your form.


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2017)

Thank you @nuts&bolts for the very helpful diagram and explanation. I am more familiar with the Conquest bows than the Apex models as it had been several years since I shot one. Thank you for the green dots. 

Would this method regarding bus cable tuning apply to all solo cam bows or just the Apex series?

Also regarding the unequal limbs turns is that for the Apex or all Solocam bows?

Do you find that there is a difference between the gold label limbs vs the ones with the newer decals?
Also how much is shooter form vs limb deflection differences vs Cam Size?


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

ALL single cams, use one size of idler wheel pulley up on the top axle. So, for example, the Apex 7 series uses fixed draw length cams. So, the shortest fixed DL cam on the Apex 7 uses that same tiny idler wheel pulley on the top axle, as the longest fixed DL cam. This is gonna be a problem, because that idler wheel pulley diameter will be the ABSOLUTE best diameter pulley for only ONE fixed draw length cam, on the bottom axle. So, what you will discover, is that you have to do all kinds of tuning tricks, to get to level nock travel, as the fixed draw length cam gets shorter and shorter than the ideal draw length size cam. As you go longer and longer than the ideal draw length size cam, you have to do all kinds of tuning tricks to get to level nock travel again.

Things like weakening one limb bolt, more and more compared to the other limb bolt.
Things like moving the d-loop (nock point) higher or lower than level.
Things like adjusting the twists in the buss cable, to get the Apex 7 cam dimples (reference marks) either parallel to the bowstring, or the dimples pointing downhill or the dimples pointing uphill.

So, the Apex 7 cam (single cam) has dimples...reference marks.
So, the later Mathews single cams have reference holes drilled into the cam, to give you an idea for the factory recommended starting rotation position. Yeah, it matters.

So, for ANY single cam bow design, the cam is obviously NOT round..therefore, ANY single cam will always have a "recommended" starting rotation position...yeah, it matters. The other manufacturers may provide a reference rotation position marker, or the other manufacturers may not. HINT. Get the ATA and the Brace height correct, and you will be BALL PARK in the close to factory recommended single cam STARTING rotation position.

Dial in the holding weight, to get SMACK dab on correct holding weight, for the correct letoff percentage, and then, you have the factory recommended single cam starting rotation position, when the bow is at brace height. If your holding weight is not correct, then, your single cam starting rotation position is not correct, and you would adjust the twists in the buss cable, to GET to factory correct holding weight.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Thank you @nuts&bolts for the very helpful diagram and explanation. I am more familiar with the Conquest bows than the Apex models as it had been several years since I shot one. Thank you for the green dots.
> 
> Would this method regarding bus cable tuning apply to all solo cam bows or just the Apex series?
> 
> ...


If your form resembles Dudley...like this..



then, you have a good chance of reaching dead level nock travel, with a single cam bow, with some tuning effort...limb bolts, tweaking buss cable twists, adjusting the d-loop height.

If your form resemble this fella...like this..










not much hope of getting level nock travel with a single cam, or any bow for that matter.
Form first, get the draw length correct, kill the massive bend in the elbow, if the arrow is pointing downhill, lean forwards to get your back bone 90 degrees to the arrow. Elbow below wrist (release side) will never work well for any bow.

Single cam bow form.



With his "new form", he was busting nocks at 30 yards.


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2017)

nuts&bolts said:


> ALL single cams, use one size of idler wheel pulley up on the top axle. So, for example, the Apex 7 series uses fixed draw length cams. So, the shortest fixed DL cam on the Apex 7 uses that same tiny idler wheel pulley on the top axle, as the longest fixed DL cam. This is gonna be a problem, because that idler wheel pulley diameter will be the ABSOLUTE best diameter pulley for only ONE fixed draw length cam, on the bottom axle. So, what you will discover, is that you have to do all kinds of tuning tricks, to get to level nock travel, as the fixed draw length cam gets shorter and shorter than the ideal draw length size cam. As you go longer and longer than the ideal draw length size cam, you have to do all kinds of tuning tricks to get to level nock travel again.
> 
> Things like weakening one limb bolt, more and more compared to the other limb bolt.
> Things like moving the d-loop (nock point) higher or lower than level.
> ...


Got it and yes I have everything else set to spec ATA , brace, etc just didn’t know which holes to look at but thank you for the detailed explanation. 

Were the Mathews Solo Cams designed with 29” as the optimal draw length? I am guessing that is why the idler wheel changes size when going from the Max to Mini Max cam. 

Have you ever tried different idler wheel sizes on the Apex cams? I am guessing that is getting into frankenbowing....short stringing etc....not looking to go down that path but curious why say the C4 has two different idler wheels and the Apex bows do not.


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2017)

nuts&bolts said:


> If your form resembles Dudley...like this..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My form is good and I can shoot well. This bow is for someone else and there form probably needs a bit of work but isn’t terrible. 

Also where can one get the “I’m fresh” t-shirt? Did he actually wear that shirt? 

That made me laugh and choke on my sandwhich at the same time. Nice


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Got it and yes I have everything else set to spec ATA , brace, etc just didn’t know which holes to look at but thank you for the detailed explanation.
> 
> Were the Mathews Solo Cams designed with 29” as the optimal draw length? I am guessing that is why the idler wheel changes size when going from the Max to Mini Max cam.
> 
> Have you ever tried different idler wheel sizes on the Apex cams? I am guessing that is getting into frankenbowing....short stringing etc....not looking to go down that path but curious why say the C4 has two different idler wheels and the Apex bows do not.


Apex 7 is a super old design. The "29-inch" fixed draw length cam actually delivers 29.25 inches of draw length. So, to get a real world 29-inch draw length, had to drop the brace 1/4-inch less, from 7-inch spec brace down to 6-3/4 out of spec brace. You do this with a longer single cam bowstring and a longer buss cable. Get the reference holes on the Apex 7 cam dead parallel to the bowstring, at brace. With the cam starting rotation position set, then, I ended up with one limb bolt one full turn weaker than the other limb bolt, and had the nock point a bit higher than level, to get level nock travel.

So, nope, I would say the Apex 7 was not optimized at the 29-inch fixed draw length cam, cuz the bottom axle/bottom half of the bow was taking in more nock travel, than the upper half of the bow (idler wheel too small OD).


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