# fastest olymipic recurve limb



## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Fastest limb, period, in my experience, is Border.

If speed is all you need. That's your brand.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

limbwalker said:


> Fastest limb, period, in my experience, is Border.
> 
> If speed is all you need. That's your brand.


I concur on the speed but John, you left your statement with an unanswered inference that there were other considerations that may make the Borders lacking. I haven't tried all the limbs on the market but I have tried many. I have been impressed the most by the Borders on many counts other than speed. If there is a better limb, overall, I would like to try it out. Looking forward to other reviews.


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## hoytshooter15 (Aug 13, 2012)

Next to Border I'd have to say Win&Win Inno EX Power


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## chrstphr (Nov 23, 2005)

what John is inferring is that speed is not that important when choosing a limb. Speed is the last thing i consider with a limb. Though i have shot some fast ones, it is not my focus. 

The slow arrow can also hit the mark.

Torsional support, rigidity, smoothness, accuracy, feel, and consistency are important. Speed is of lesser importance, but some people place it more highly. Since it was the most important factor in your question, he answered the rated fastest limb. Nothing wrong with Borders limbs, they are top quality. But it doesnt mean other limbs are less so because they are slower limbs. 

Chris


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## Mika Savola (Sep 2, 2008)

More speed usually means you need a stiffer (=heavier) arrow with, possibly, more point weight. So nothing gained...


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## Dacer (Jun 10, 2013)

Mika Savola said:


> More speed usually means you need a stiffer (=heavier) arrow with, possibly, more point weight. So nothing gained...


Adding point weight doesn't stiffen an arrow


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## anmactire (Sep 4, 2012)

A little bit of speed never hurts. My Borders are great fun to shoot and I've never come across anything faster pound for pound /grain for grain/ inch for inch.
That said at 51 pounds and 31 inch draw length you're certainly never going to be lacking in that department! If you really want extra speed just go for a slightly lighter arrow. 
Would be cheaper than getting a new set of limbs for the sake of the speed.


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## Plucker (May 24, 2014)

If memory serves me the old Hoyt FX limbs still performs very well compared to modern limbs in terms of speed. Some people found them lacking in torsional stability, however I found it more to be a matter of fining the right pair. Shoot 4 pairs over the years 2 where garbage and 2 were wonderful limbs. YMMW.


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## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

I think everyone is correct, for flat out speed Border Hex series and Dryad ACS Target limbs are top of the list but the lack of them in the hands of 90% of top shooters says there are other considerations too. Both a fantastic choice but neither are the only choice. I hear great things about MK limbs too.


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## Mika Savola (Sep 2, 2008)

Dacer said:


> Adding point weight doesn't stiffen an arrow


Yes I know that, thank you very much. You clearly missed my point...


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## anmactire (Sep 4, 2012)

+1 on the MKs. My coach has a set of 1440s and they're impressive.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Mika Savola said:


> More speed usually means you need a stiffer (=heavier) arrow with, possibly, more point weight. So nothing gained...


Not exactly. Shooting a heavier arrow at the same speed is worth something in the wind. 

Also, not every limb that is faster, requires a stiffer spine. It's all in the force draw curve. Borders, for example, are unique in this area in that you can shoot the same spine with more speed because of how soft they are at the clicker.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Dacer said:


> Adding point weight doesn't stiffen an arrow


Yes, Mika just implied that.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Mika Savola said:


> Yes I know that, thank you very much. You clearly missed my point...


I think what Mike meant was that for most limbs, as you get faster, you need a stiffer spine for the same draw weight, meaning the total arrow weight will be greater, negating any gains in speed you might have won by shooting faster limbs. Whether you increase point weight or not, is up to the archer though. 

At the end of the day, faster limbs are almost always better, provided they are equal in other areas. Why? Because they allow you to shoot the same arrow at the same speed with less draw weight, OR you can shoot a heavier arrow at the same speed, with the same draw weight. Either way, you are increasing efficiency of the system.


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## kakend (Oct 30, 2007)

25" GMX with Border Hex6h BB2 34# at 29"
23" GMX (camo) Border Hex 5h 40# at 29"
23" Fiberbow 5.3 Border Hex 6s BB2 42# at 29"
17" Dalaa with Centaur longbow limbs 55ish at 29" 

I go for speed!!!


Have a great day,
Kasey

I had some Samick Agulla Ultras that were mighty fast too!!!


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## Mika Savola (Sep 2, 2008)

While I was considering what to write (english is not my first language obviously), Limbwalker summed it up very neatly.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

Mika Savola said:


> While I was considering what to write (english is not my first language obviously), Limbwalker summed it up very neatly.


Dont sell yourself short Mika, you hold your own in English better than many of us.

Cheers


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## FlyingWatchmake (Apr 15, 2012)

As an example of speed from Borders, I shoot 40# @ 28"DL, for a FITA90, I don't have to move my sight bar in or out for the various distances. 

I regularly shoot with people shooting 42-46# that have to move their sight bar in for at least the 90m, and some have 30-31" DL's ..

For me it just means not having to wear my shoulders out as much to get the same distance... 

T


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

Borders for me too...

the main reason you don't see that many of them around is :

1)they're not mass-produced..

2)they don't sponsor any shooter--ie--you can't get them free..

3)they're not cheap..

they're produced by a family who are passionate about archery and take pride in producing the best limbs possible and let their product do the talking vs those who spend a lot on advertising...


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

Depends of the draw length too. For my extra long draw Borders were quick but not the fastest I've had. Also a friend measured quite a big jump in speed when he went from Borders to Uukha with his 25.5" or so draw. For your average draw lenght they should be the best bet though.


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## LittleJP (Nov 4, 2012)

I suspect the top Uukha products will challenge Borders in speed in certain rig configurations. I haven't been able to afford both a Border and an Uukha setup, not have I chronographed or bought the newest Uukha limbs.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

> they don't sponsor any shooter--ie--you can't get them free..


Not necessarily true.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

Lots of speculation by archers who haven't shot Borders. I've shot uukhas and there was no comparison in speed for me and the difference in smoothness on the backend was very noticeable. Just my experiences.


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## MickeyBisco (Jul 14, 2012)

Ben,

Have you shot the latest offering from Uukha? They seem to have a profile that is edging closer to the aggressive curve of the Borders. I have owned and shot Borders ( Hex 6 H) as well as the lower / middle end Uukhas, and the Borders win on speed with no contest. The Short HX-10 Uukhas I shot were pretty snappy, but stacked and didn't have the "Border let-off" feeling through the clicker. 

I'm looking forward to seeing how Uukhas latest hold up to testing.


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## DruFire (Jan 10, 2013)

LittleJP said:


> I suspect the top Uukha products will challenge Borders in speed in certain rig configurations. I haven't been able to afford both a Border and an Uukha setup, not have I chronographed or bought the newest Uukha limbs.


Pound for Pound, at a proper draw length per bow length, Not even close. 
When talking odd combinations like a 25 inch draw with a 68 inch bow uukha may be faster, but dropping down to a proper bow length for that DL will give different results. Borders Have a functional flexing Limb tip, and if your not engaging it the bow is to long and you will not get the speed its capable of.

While Uukha has just stepped up to a geometry closer to what border use to use with there hex 4, border is already generations past that.. Up to a hex 7 now. New curve, new materials, and they are seeing as much a 7 fps increase over the Hex 6. Which was already 12-16 fps faster than anything on the market.


i can say, my medium 36# hex 6h bb2 on a 27" riser pulled to just shy of 31" giving me 43# OTF was fast enough to get the target compound guys at my local range to say " damn, that thing is fast "


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## anmactire (Sep 4, 2012)

limbwalker said:


> Not necessarily true.


What do you mean? Or do you think it's just a case of shooting them at the right level and Sid might be convinced?


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

MickeyBisco said:


> Ben,
> 
> Have you shot the latest offering from Uukha? They seem to have a profile that is edging closer to the aggressive curve of the Borders. I have owned and shot Borders ( Hex 6 H) as well as the lower / middle end Uukhas, and the Borders win on speed with no contest. The Short HX-10 Uukhas I shot were pretty snappy, but stacked and didn't have the "Border let-off" feeling through the clicker.
> 
> I'm looking forward to seeing how Uukhas latest hold up to testing.


Mickey, I have not shot the Uukha limbs for about a year. I am looking forward, though, to getting an ilf hex 7 if Border decides to market them.. My experience with the uukha was the same as yours, shooting a medium limb, I experienced a lot of stacking.


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

There are other small, independent, boutique limb manufacturers out there. You don't have to go just for Border if you want a hipster's choice. I've been toying with a loaned pair of KG archery limbs past few days and they are definetely worth checking out. I ordered a pair for myself yesterday, seem to have shipped today so delivery times seem ok. They seem to have all the feel and attributes I'm looking for in a limb, and the guy who I loaned them from has shot those for ages.


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## SD40 (Dec 25, 2005)

Zal,

KG stands for?, website?. 

Thanks Don;


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

Keith Gascoigne, out of Sherwood Forest (well, at least pretty close). http://www.kgarchery.com/


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## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

itbeso said:


> Lots of speculation by archers who haven't shot Borders. I've shot uukhas and there was no comparison in speed for me and the difference in smoothness on the backend was very noticeable. Just my experiences.


I've shot Hex4, Hex5 and Hex6 Ben, as well as Uukha UX100 and EX???. Didn't rate the Uukhas much, not that quick and too damn stiff at the tips. Hex limbs are good but no better or worse than 2 or 3 other options out there. It's just a case of finding what works. Mr Demmer shots those old fashioned SF limbs pretty good for example doesn't he.


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## SD40 (Dec 25, 2005)

zal said:


> Keith Gascoigne, out of Sherwood Forest (well, at least pretty close). http://www.kgarchery.com/


 Zal,

Many Thanks!.
All Good,
Don;


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

I've watched Uukha limbs shoot enough arrows to know they can't keep pace with Borders.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

Bigjono said:


> I've shot Hex4, Hex5 and Hex6 Ben, as well as Uukha UX100 and EX???. Didn't rate the Uukhas much, not that quick and too damn stiff at the tips. Hex limbs are good but no better or worse than 2 or 3 other options out there. It's just a case of finding what works. Mr Demmer shots those old fashioned SF limbs pretty good for example doesn't he.


John shoots extremely well but then again he has been practicing.:smile:


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## MartinOttosson (May 31, 2011)

LittleJP said:


> I suspect the top Uukha products will challenge Borders in speed in certain rig configurations. I haven't been able to afford both a Border and an Uukha setup, not have I chronographed or bought the newest Uukha limbs.


I´ve tried all Uukhas up to the UX100 and speed is lower than average. They are way to heavy to be fast, even with some added super recurve. The new VX limb is supposed to be 15-20% lighter, but even that makes it clearly heavier than some of the superlight laminates used in some other limbs. The BB2 version of the Hex6 for example is probably almost down to half the weight in the moving part of the limb compared to the UX100. The Border Hex are fast, yes, but the difference is smaller than what most think and as said before, there are quite a few limbs out there that are very similar in speed. The unique thing about the Hex6 is not the speed, but the feel in the draw, in my opinion.


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## wesel (Sep 6, 2013)

zal said:


> Keith Gascoigne, out of Sherwood Forest (well, at least pretty close). http://www.kgarchery.com/


Hi Zal,

which limbs model have you tried?

Ivan.


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## midwayarcherywi (Sep 24, 2006)

If someone were to talk about group size and speed, this thread would become a lot more relevant. I'll take a slow 10 versus a fast 8 any day!


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

wesel said:


> Hi Zal,
> 
> which limbs model have you tried?
> 
> Ivan.


KG QIL. I tried Apex too but they were far too heavy for my draw, about 55#. Haven't tried the new models, those two limbs were fairly old.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

midwayarcherywi said:


> If someone were to talk about group size and speed, this thread would become a lot more relevant. I'll take a slow 10 versus a fast 8 any day!


Let's talk about them. Show us your groups and I'll show you mine. I'm way behind most of the recurve shooters on here as far as being up on every riser and limb, having come back to recurve shooting in 2012 after a 39 year hiatus of shooting a compound, but my practice time has finally kicked in and Border limbs will be on any bow I shoot unless they get lost by the airlines.lol


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## midwayarcherywi (Sep 24, 2006)

I don't want to turn this into a mine is better than yours thread. The discussion is more useful if you put other parameters into the consideration mix. I've done lots of testing, including Border limbs. Speed did not win the day in my choice of limbs to shoot.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Well, Midway, you did kind of start it, and the OP did only ask what the fastest limbs were.


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## midwayarcherywi (Sep 24, 2006)

Ok then. I don't want to start a pi**ing match here. My testing did show the Hex 5 to be the fastet of the limbs I've shot. They are not on my bow, however.


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## Black46 (Oct 16, 2013)

midwayarcherywi said:


> Ok then. I don't want to start a pi**ing match here. My testing did show the Hex 5 to be the fastet of the limbs I've shot. They are not on my bow, however.


What's on your bow and why?


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## midwayarcherywi (Sep 24, 2006)

The limbs on my bow have been able to produce the smallest groups for me. They have been most forgiving of my inconsistencies. They have been very predictable through the clicker. PM me and I'll tell you what brand. Posting it at this point would be inflammatory. And I'm not in the mood to go back and forth with what is best. For me, I am currently shooting the best combination for my abilities.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

midwayarcherywi said:


> Ok then. I don't want to start a pi**ing match here. My testing did show the Hex 5 to be the fastet of the limbs I've shot. They are not on my bow, however.


Anytime speed, or Border limbs come up, you can almost guarantee a pi**ing match. 



> The limbs on my bow have been able to produce the smallest groups for me.


+1


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

Only Borders I currently own are from 1999 or so. They are definetely not the fastest limb around. But I still think they are the best Border limb ever made.


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## SD40 (Dec 25, 2005)

"I am currently shooting the best combination for my abilities."


+1.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

midwayarcherywi said:


> The limbs on my bow have been able to produce the smallest groups for me. They have been most forgiving of my inconsistencies. They have been very predictable through the clicker. PM me and I'll tell you what brand. Posting it at this point would be inflammatory. And I'm not in the mood to go back and forth with what is best. For me, I am currently shooting the best combination for my abilities.


Is there any other reason for having a set of limbs on your bow? I happen to shoot my best groups with border limbs, the fact they are extremely fast is an added bonus.There was no pi&&ing match until you insinuated that speed equates to missing. In the case of border limbs, I challenge that assertion.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

John Magera, I would like to get your analysis of Border limbs, good or bad, and why you are shooting what you shoot.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Ben, I'd really rather not beat a dead horse in public. But I may PM you with my thoughts.


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## midwayarcherywi (Sep 24, 2006)

itbeso said:


> Is there any other reason for having a set of limbs on your bow? I happen to shoot my best groups with border limbs, the fact they are extremely fast is an added bonus.There was no pi&&ing match until you insinuated that speed equates to missing. In the case of border limbs, I challenge that assertion.


I made no such assertion. And the point was and is that speed alone is a poor reason to select a limb. I happen to respect what Sid does and would never knock his products......especially on line.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

limbwalker said:


> Ben, I'd really rather not beat a dead horse in public. But I may PM you with my thoughts.


Not looking to win or lose a discussion. Just trying to gain more insight on equipment for my own personal knowledge.


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## Demmer (Dec 1, 2012)

Ben, its the same reason I don't shoot them.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

Demmer said:


> Ben, its the same reason I don't shoot them.


??????? Which is?


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## Demmer (Dec 1, 2012)

I've told you. You just don't listen. Lol


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

Demmer said:


> I've told you. You just don't listen. Lol


Oh yeah, I forgot, you would have to spend as much for one set of borders as you would 3 sets of what you are shooting. Damn, my memory doesn't work too well sometimes. You could put in another shift at the quarry.:darkbeer:


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## northernrecurve (Oct 16, 2013)

I just want to clarify the reason I started this thread was because fast limbs like the kgs I am currently running have shot far better groups then slower limbs I have shot ie g3s or f7s so that's why I asked if theres another thing I should be considering besides consistency and forgiveness please let me know


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## Demmer (Dec 1, 2012)

itbeso said:


> Oh yeah, I forgot, you would have to spend as much for one set of borders as you would 3 sets of what you are shooting. Damn, my memory doesn't work too well sometimes. You could put in another shift at the quarry.:darkbeer:


.


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## anmactire (Sep 4, 2012)

To


northernrecurve said:


> I just want to clarify the reason I started this thread was because fast limbs like the kgs I am currently running have shot far better groups then slower limbs I have shot ie g3s or f7s so that's why I asked if theres another thing I should be considering besides consistency and forgiveness please let me know


Consistency, forgiveness and speed are major things to consider in your choice bar the obvious of draw weight and cost. All else being equal, take the faster limb if you group just as well with it. There is no logical reason not to if all other considerations are accounted for. 
Really what you want to do is get the best shooting limb you can afford and best is measured in mm when it comes to shooting. I shoot my borders because I liked the feel, I had the cash and I didn't suffer any scoring penalty using them. The speed is an added bonus. And I'll admit, a pain when it comes to soft targets.


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## vabowdog (Dec 13, 2007)

I keep seeing these threads about speed and I'm sure speed is SO much more relevant at distances beyond what I'm shooting which is about a 35 yard max...


Answer me this what will be the difference when you miss yardage by 5 yards and 10-15 fps...


IE if I'm shooting 55 yards and shoot my 50 yard gap or crawl with a bow at 190 compared to 200-205??



Thanks in advance for your intelligent response...LOL!!





Dewayne


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

vabowdog said:


> I keep seeing these threads about speed and I'm sure speed is SO much more relevant at distances beyond what I'm shooting which is about a 35 yard max...
> 
> 
> Answer me this what will be the difference when you miss yardage by 5 yards and 10-15 fps...
> ...


You only shoot 33 yards Dwayne so it doesn't behoove you worry about speed. In fact , probably the slowest limbs you could get would be your best bet to get your point on down. I would recommend Demmers limbs.:mg:


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## Demmer (Dec 1, 2012)

I remember how you and Alan both said my was very flat shooting.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

Demmer said:


> I remember how you and Alan both said my was very flat shooting.


Flat----as opposed to Perky.lol


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## Demmer (Dec 1, 2012)

Lol


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## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

In the end, with known yardage, does speed really matter that much anyway?


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## vabowdog (Dec 13, 2007)

That's what I'm asking....known yardage is one thing especially with a clicker....the unknowns is what I'm asking...


Ben, what is your desired speed for unknown yardages out to 55 or so??? Are you talking 220? Is it all about speed for you or are you willing to sacrifice speed for a smoother limb??


As far as I'd be better off with the slowest limb possible...I still want a flat trajectory...without having 18" gaps at 20 yards.


Dewayne Martin


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Dewayne, for me it's not so much the speed as it is what my "point on" distance is. For fita field courses, I want a point on distance of 50 meters. I can crawl down from that. 

The other thing that so many are forgetting here is that speed is a function of not just limbs, but also arrow weight. From the same set of limbs, I can get 220 fps, or 190 (or less). Depends on the arrow I tune, and the string I build for it.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

vabowdog said:


> That's what I'm asking....known yardage is one thing especially with a clicker....the unknowns is what I'm asking...
> 
> 
> Ben, what is your desired speed for unknown yardages out to 55 or so??? Are you talking 220? Is it all about speed for you or are you willing to sacrifice speed for a smoother limb??
> ...


Dewayne, my honest answer to you is that I have never been a speed freak. Bqck when I was shooting compounds and no sight, my speed was only around 215-220. The thing about speed with the Border limbs is they allow me to shoot a heavier arrow at lower poundage than most limbs. I hardly ever chrono my bow, I just go for groups. With as high of anchor that you shoot, your gaps from 0-33 should all be tight.


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## UrbanDeerSlayer (Feb 10, 2012)

itbeso said:


> Dewayne, my honest answer to you is that I have never been a speed freak. Bqck when I was shooting compounds and no sight, my speed was only around 215-220. The thing about speed with the Border limbs is they allow me to shoot a heavier arrow at lower poundage than most limbs. I hardly ever chrono my bow, I just go for groups. With as high of anchor that you shoot, your gaps from 0-33 should all be tight.


And I would assume the Border limb would allow you to shoot a stiffer arrow arrow as well? Assuming same draw weight versus another brand of limb.

I bring this up as it may be important to a longer draw archer (30+ inches) that wants to shoot a 32" arrow in order to reduce gaps, but requires a stiffer arrow (due to draw length). A stiffer arrow usually comes with increased arrow weight. It would be nice to have a set of limbs that can push the additional arrow mass without compromising speed.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Strangely enough, Borders allow you to shoot faster with the same spine (and weight) of arrow. How? They are very soft at release compared to other limbs, so the acceleration is slow, and thus doesn't require as stiff a spine. It's one of the benefits of their design.

But there are trade-offs. There is no such thing as a free lunch.


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

I found that my Border limbs actually require a stiffer spine then similar weight conventional limbs.
Also I don't seem to do well with set-ups pushing arrows much faster than 205fps or so, I'd rather put some more weight in the front of the arrow and arrive at an overall more forgiving set-up. Throwing a heavier arrow the same speed as conventional limbs at the same draw weight seems to be where they shine.
Most target folks have only tried them with lighter arrows, my testing at 11.5gpp was very interesting to say the least. 28.5" AMO draw produced 190fps.

Also due to the way they store energy I find that arrow speed and tune is much more consistent when DL varies such as shooting BB on steep inclines or stringwalking.

-Grant


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