# Injury because of the string



## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

Hello everyone, need your help very much. I have an injury under my chin because of the bowstring and with every practice it's becoming worse  My coach and I can not determine the cause. I have a side anchor.


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## Mika Savola (Sep 2, 2008)

How the string can hurt you UNDER your chin? Need more info


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

Yes, it's very strange! That's how it looks like. And I tried different tabs, it's definitely because of the string..


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## melman47 (Oct 25, 2006)

Think thumbnail?


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Elrose -

It's not the string. The string is nowhere that part of your chin, it's your tab.
Stop shooting until the wound heals, then coat parts of the top side of your tab with lipstick and see where the marks transfer to the underside of your chin.

You may have to have part of the tab ground down or trimmed, or get a basic AAE Cavalier tab. 

Doubt it's your thumb nail, unless you have very long digits, it shouldn't reach that far forward, ditto on the lipstick trick.

If your "coach" couldn't figure that out, find another coach...

Viper1 out.


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

Viper 1,
Thank you! But I'm using a shelf, so there is almost no place where the tab can touch my skin...also I tried different tabs and I had the same wound


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## ksarcher (May 22, 2002)

Index finger nail?

Just a thought


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Elrose -

The shelf is part of the tab... (remove it and see what happens).
The shelf is an option, not a requirement. 

Depending how deeply your hooking your index finger and how long your nails are, ks has a point, especially if you have it with different tabs. 
If we assume your index finger nail is the same length as your ring finger nail, it may be a bit of a stretch.

Sorry, no coach should allow that type of injury to continue. 
If you really can't figure it out, AFTER it heals, place a piece of cloth tape (3M or JJ First-aid tape) to cover/protect the skin from further injury.

Viper1 out.


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

Viper1 said:


> ....
> 
> It's not the string. The string is nowhere that part of your chin, it's your tab.
> ..........................
> You may have to have part of the tab ground down or trimmed, .....


Agree, it's a very common problem caused by the sharpness of the leather under your index finger during the release... Just trim down the leather top corner following the shape of the index at full draw and the probelm wil 99% disappear...


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

I've already cut off a lot of the leather, it didn't work..


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## rstgyx (Apr 13, 2013)

Going to assume it's your shelf scraping against the bottom of your shelf when you release. You can try to remove the shelf and anchor with your index finger (I went from anchoring with a shelf to without one and using my index finger instead) or try to work on your release so it's a little calmer rather than a sudden jolt backwards.


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## lksseven (Mar 21, 2010)

Elrose said:


> I've already cut off a lot of the leather, it didn't work..


Viper1 and Vittorio are two of the most knowledgeable archers/coaches IN THE WORLD. Instead of knee jerk arguing with them, you would be better served by thanking them for their attention and trying out their advice (not only to demonstrate your coachability as a student, but also because they're right).


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## Mika Savola (Sep 2, 2008)

Maybe you can show us a picture of your tab (palm side)


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## dchan (Jun 29, 2004)

That's the sign of a good tight anchor and a shelf or tab rubbing as you release. Looking at your anchor, as you release your fingers will uncurl, If it's not an extremely relaxed release, your palm and fingers uncurling will push the tab towards your neck. If there is any contact from the tab/shelf it will rub you right where that laceration is under your chin.

You say you have tried several tabs. Do they all have the shelf? if so, LOOSE THE SHELF!!


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## tunedlow (Nov 7, 2012)

it isn't the string -its the tab. I had a similar issue until I did the following things:

1) removed the shelf
2) trimmed the index finger leather 
3) filed down the sharp edges of the tab so they are all rounded. 

the KSL has very sharp edges and if you don't use a tab shelf to anchor (i use my index knuckle) you will find that the contact with your tab will either rub your skin a little or a lot. i filed down the sharp edges closest to my face until I resolved the issue.


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

Viper1, Vittorio, rstgyx,
Thank you, I'll try out your advice! I've just never met anyone with the same problem, and it hurts so much, so I started to be a little bit nervous.

lksseven,
I'm sorry, I'm really greateful for the attention paid to my problem.

Mika Savola,
I'll take a picture, thank you


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## Arsi (May 14, 2011)

The KSL straps have a piece of metal at the end of the strap on the place where it would touch your face and cause this. Most people cut that and tie a knot but even that could irritate your skin.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Elrose said:


> Hello everyone, need your help very much. I have an injury under my chin because of the bowstring and with every practice it's becoming worse  My coach and I can not determine the cause. I have a side anchor.
> 
> View attachment 2071232


Quick question. Do you have a corn or hard skin developing on your index finger, somewhere below the first joint?


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## rkumetz (Jun 20, 2014)

There is nothing wrong with asking questions. Some of us need to understand WHY we are doing things.

That being said, a close look at the bruising shows 2 things. First, the injured area doesn't appear to be anywhere near where the string appears to contact 
her face in the first photo. Second the bruising is on a 45 degree angle to the string which would indicate that the string being drawn into the face or 
leaving on release is not causing the injury.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Not everyone here is interested in the WHYs, and it can be difficult for them to understand WHY some of us ask questions. That's why.


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## rkumetz (Jun 20, 2014)

theminoritydude said:


> Not everyone here is interested in the WHYs, and it can be difficult for them to understand WHY some of us ask questions. That's why.


Hmmm. Why did you say that?


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## Fury90flier (Jun 27, 2012)

get some pictures from the other side and from a downward (viewing up) angle- at anchor. If you can, video from the same angle- you shouild be able to isolate the source of the issue. 


You may simply look in a mirror as you draw to anchor...the issue may be obvious.

If it ends up being the shelf and you need someone to grind it down- send it to me and I'll get it shaped for you.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

rkumetz said:


> Hmmm. Why did you say that?


Just, because. Hehehehehe


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

My bet is the index finger nail.


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## tunedlow (Nov 7, 2012)

theminoritydude said:


> Not everyone here is interested in the WHYs, and it can be difficult for them to understand WHY some of us ask questions. That's why.


really? i'd imagine that most -if not all- archers would be interested in the "why" because it isn't only going to keep you from repeating a mistake but it'll contribute to improving your overall technique in the sport.


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## toys (May 29, 2009)

I had that problem several years ago. In my case I solved it by adding more mass to the bow. What I discovered was that I had increased draw weight but did not increase bow mass enough, and during release the vibration from the bow turned the tab into a cutting device, it was painful but went away immediately after adding a few ounces to the front stab.


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## rkumetz (Jun 20, 2014)

theminoritydude said:


> My bet is the index finger nail.


Simple enough to try shooting with the index finger covered by a finger cot or finger cut off a latex glove.


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## lksseven (Mar 21, 2010)

Elrose said:


> Viper1, Vittorio, rstgyx,
> Thank you, I'll try out your advice! I've just never met anyone with the same problem, and it hurts so much, so I started to be a little bit nervous.
> 
> lksseven,
> ...


Elrose,

No worries [I, too, argued with Viper1 about something early on after I'd joined this forum, before I knew that he (author of one of the archery world's bibles Shooting The Stickbow) was the archery knowledge Master (one of them, anyway) and I just a gleam in my grasshopper daddy's eye. I have since - to my substantial benefit - learned my lesson and take to heart whatever Viper1 and Vittorio and Limbwalker and midwayarcherywi and many others here choose to share with us.]

Here's a pic that shows what is likely happening to you (actually I believe this archer - from the 2012 Olympics - is wearing some kind of 'tough skin' ointment on her under chin to keep the skin from abrading). You'll just have to not shoot till that sore heals, and then wear some tape for a bit while trying to sort out your tab/anchor issues.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Some are more interested in the WHOs, and the HOWs.


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## DK Lieu (Apr 6, 2011)

I used to have precisely that injury. It's caused by the edge of the tab, which may include the shelf, the edge of the plate, or the edge of the leather. Trimming the leather and filing the edges of the metal will definitely help. Being aware of, and reducing, the pressure of your anchor under your chin will definitely help. You will need to stop shooting until the injury heals, otherwise it will only get worse. I currently use two layers of clear medical tape over that location under my chin as a preventative measure when I shoot, whether or not an injury is there. When I see the slightest sign of abrasion, I just add a spot band-aid under the tape, and the abrasion goes away quickly. Taping the chin is actually quite common, even in Korea (where it is almost considered fashionable among the women archers). I use this stuff, made by Nexcare: http://www.amazon.com/Nexcare-Clear...14510347&sr=8-1&keywords=nexcare+medical+tape Don't get the Johnson&Johnson tape, as it does not stick well. Also, the tape needs to be applied before applying any skin lotions or sunscreen.


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## acco205 (Jun 13, 2014)

I agree with the edge of the tab.

Its not so much that you need to cut it, its that the edge of the leather itself is sharp enough to cut you up after repeated use. It doesn't feel like much, but given enough time even a butter knife will break the skin.

Take a finger nail file or emery board to the edges of the leather and like everyone else has mentioned, let it heal! (Or at least put some gauze and tape over it while shooting until it does!).

I'd also have someone look under your chin at anchor and see if there is any part of the leather making contact before your finger that can still be removed.


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## lksseven (Mar 21, 2010)

Here's a pic that shows a top archer using tape to protect her chin in exactly your scenario ..


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## chrstphr (Nov 23, 2005)

Ki Bo Bae with same abrasion on her jaw line from the tab. 

View attachment 2071453



Chris


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

You're not all listening to her. She's said that she's cut off a lot of leather.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

chrstphr said:


> Ki Bo Bae with same abrasion on her jaw line from the tab.
> 
> View attachment 2071453
> 
> ...


I see a different type of abrasion. KBB has a small point type abrasion located on her jaw line. OP has a lengthy one under the jaw, away from her jaw bone.
It's length and location suggests a source that transited a long distance at a high speed in one particular direction repeatedly, towards her neck, not along the jawline, as with most release action involving the tab plate or shelf.

Index fingernail. At least her release was good.


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## acco205 (Jun 13, 2014)

theminoritydude said:


> You're not all listening to her. She's said that she's cut off a lot of leather.


Cutting off a lot of leather does not mean its not still making contact. Obviously SOMETHING is, and a sharp edge from (as you mentioned) cut leather is the most likely case. With a tight, solid anchor you'd be hard pressed NOT to get some contact with the leather without seriously degrading the protection on your index finger. It may be so minimal that you can't feel it, but on the release it is still going to drag and cause abrasions.

That is the first thing that needs to be checked.

Leather contact isn't a bad thing, you just need to file down the edge so it doesnt cut you up. This is actually mentioned a few times in the instruction booklet that comes with the KSL tab.


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## Seattlepop (Dec 8, 2003)

Tilt your head back slightly to create space for your fingers/tab to uncurl as you release the string.

The length and angle of the abrasion tell me that the top edge of your tab leather scrapes your jaw/chin as your fingers/tab uncurl at release. The photos show that your chin bone overhangs your index finger, so as you cut leather you just compensate by continuing to press up under your chin bone. Experiment with tilting your head back slightly, it should be immediately apparent if that is the cause. 

fwiw


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

Thank you for your help and your attention! Today I've tried to shoot with a simple tab which is a small piece of leather with a finger spacer, it still hurt (photos here were taken several days ago, so my chin is okay now).
Seems like I figured out what was happening.. While drawing a bow I move my right hand from below to the anchor point and lift my skin. So the string works like a sandpaper.. I guess I just need to go straight to the anchor point after the "set up" position. Sorry, I'm not sure I explained it clearly


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Elrose said:


> Thank you for your help and your attention! Today I've tried to shoot with a simple tab which is a small piece of leather with a finger spacer, it still hurt (photos here were taken several days ago, so my chin is okay now).
> Seems like I figured out what was happening.. While drawing a bow I move my right hand from below to the anchor point and lift my skin. So the string works like a sandpaper.. I guess I just need to go straight to the anchor point after the "set up" position. Sorry, I'm not sure I explained it clearly


No, you explained it quite clearly.


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## c365 (May 15, 2013)

Another tidbit. I see quite a few of the ladies, Khatuna included put some kind of powder on their anchor area. I guess Talcum powder, maybe baby powder.


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

c365 said:


> Another tidbit. I see quite a few of the ladies, Khatuna included put some kind of powder on their anchor area. I guess Talcum powder, maybe baby powder.


 I saw it several times, but didn't understand the purpose. May be it can help me, thank you!


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## TheLongbowShoot (Mar 23, 2012)

PM sent


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## archeryal (Apr 16, 2005)

Some people draw well below the chin (4-5 inches) until the string contacts the jaw and raise the hand until they achieve anchor. If you pull in very firmly and drag the string up under the jaw, that could move the string in a sawing motion and make the marks you show here. If this is true, try drawing only an inch or so under the jaw before raising to the anchor and/or pull the string firmly into the chin, but not as hard. It's a little hard to see in the picture, but if the skin is pulled up under the jaw, that may be it. Worth a try, anyway.


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

archeryal said:


> Some people draw well below the chin (4-5 inches) until the string contacts the jaw and raise the hand until they achieve anchor. If you pull in very firmly and drag the string up under the jaw, that could move the string in a sawing motion and make the marks you show here. If this is true, try drawing only an inch or so under the jaw before raising to the anchor and/or pull the string firmly into the chin, but not as hard. It's a little hard to see in the picture, but if the skin is pulled up under the jaw, that may be it. Worth a try, anyway.


The string touches the jaw before the hand..is this what I am doing wrong?


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## archeryal (Apr 16, 2005)

It's OK to contact the jaw with the string an inch or so below the jaw, but I suspect you're pulling in too hard or farther below the jaw than the picture shows. Maybe you could try another serving material or just a small band-aid which should allow the string to slide up without digging in.


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## b0w_bender (Apr 30, 2006)

ksarcher said:


> Index finger nail?
> 
> Just a thought


This, to check put a band-aid over the nail and see if it still happens.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

Elrose said:


> The string touches the jaw before the hand..is this what I am doing wrong?
> View attachment 2071574


Not sure where you are (USA or not), but with NTS, the string should contact the chin and nose at "draw to load" before your hand travels up to "anchor". It still looks like your string contact is well forward of your abrasion though.


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## tunedlow (Nov 7, 2012)

b0w_bender said:


> This, to check put a band-aid over the nail and see if it still happens.


If its her nail doing the cutting, that is a helluva sharp set of nails she must have on her! The string doing the sawing motion shouldn't be enough to cause a cut that intense, especially at the direction it is coming of your face. The abrasion looks like it is well under her jaw so I am thinking it is the sharp edge of the KSL tab right where the index finger knuckle and spacer are positioned -that right angle edge is pretty sharp.

I recommend putting a bit of lipstick or white-out along that ledge and anchoring as usual. If the marks coming off are more pronounced on one side than the other then you'll have your point of contact.


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## Fury90flier (Jun 27, 2012)

you mention that it happens with other tabs...are you sure it's not your index finger nail? I know it's been mentioned but I just picked up my tab and did some "test by feel" and found that with an anchor that close into the neck and that far forward to the chin...index finger hitting the chin on release is very easy to do.


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## x1440 (Jan 5, 2003)

It looks like it might also be the strap of your tab on your index finger rubbing on your chin causing a burn. I have the same scare but not as big as yours and I also saw a lot of the same scares in Korea while I was training. Most archers there put a Band-aid on their chin to cover up the contact area. Place the band-aid length wise so it goes from our chin towards your neck.


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

I often use a band-aid over the index finger not to get a callosity, so I'm sure that's not the reason. Also the abrasion is just in the place where the string touches the chin, although it's not clearly seen in the pictures. I don't know how to avoid it, more likely I pull too hard, as archeryal said.


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

x1440 said:


> It looks like it might also be the strap of your tab on your index finger rubbing on your chin causing a burn. I have the same scare but not as big as yours and I also saw a lot of the same scares in Korea while I was training. Most archers there put a Band-aid on their chin to cover up the contact area. Place the band-aid length wise so it goes from our chin towards your neck.


Thank you! I thought about the strap, but I tried another tab and it didn't help  even the band-aid didn't help me, I still got the wound


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## ksarcher (May 22, 2002)

I'm still betting it is the finger nail...

Go to the drug store and get a pack of thin mole-skin. The stuff you use to prevent blister for poorly fitting shoes! Cover the top of the tab Shelf.. leave enough to wrap over the edges. Shoot some and see if that helps. If not, put a small strip over the index finger nail..


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## w8lon (Jun 2, 2012)

I find that growing a beard helps...although it may look out of place on some:wink:


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## Elrose (Feb 20, 2014)

ksarcher said:


> I'm still betting it is the finger nail...
> 
> Go to the drug store and get a pack of thin mole-skin. The stuff you use to prevent blister for poorly fitting shoes! Cover the top of the tab Shelf.. leave enough to wrap over the edges. Shoot some and see if that helps. If not, put a small strip over the index finger nail..


I'll try it, thank you!


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