# K50 & k45



## BROBB2112 (May 31, 2007)

*Known distance*



fiveshooter said:


> Is it just me or, was the turnout for the known yardage classes a little disappointing? After all the talk this winter I thought alot more people would be shooting in them.Please give me your opinions.


Maybe the shooters are trying to tell the ASA something. I personally have struggled with the known distance aspect of 3D. There are pros and cons to both sides. In my opinion if you are going to have known distance then go all the way and make everything, all classes, known distance and call it good. Your hard core 3D shooters will disagree with that but I really do not think that you can have it both ways.


----------



## John-in-VA (Mar 27, 2003)

The k45 had something like 51 shooters in it ,thats not bad .ASA was hoping for 50 .I think the entry fee for the K50 ,might of had something to do with it .200.00 bucks thats a lot .


----------



## Kill Shill (Sep 23, 2008)

estimating yardage is what 3D is about.


----------



## aubowman (Apr 28, 2008)

I thought the biggest part of 3-D was judging yardage and the challange of that. I enjoy shooting my bow and in the back yard I know the yardage and thing are good. On the course the greatest accomplishment is being able to judge your yardage and then make a good shot. That is what it should be about.


----------



## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

fiveshooter said:


> Is it just me or, was the turnout for the known yardage classes a little disappointing? After all the talk this winter I thought alot more people would be shooting in them.Please give me your opinions.


It's kinda hard to make an accurate assessment of the classes bases on the Florida Pro/Am. I think that it is a little early for a lot of shooters to be out getting ready for ASA. Plus you have a lot of people holding back a little until finances get a little better. I think a lot of the shooters in Florida are the ones that are gonna make a go at it all year long for the SOY plus the locals. 



BROBB2112 said:


> Maybe the shooters are trying to tell the ASA something. I personally have struggled with the known distance aspect of 3D. There are pros and cons to both sides. In my opinion if you are going to have known distance then go all the way and make everything, all classes, known distance and call it good. Your hard core 3D shooters will disagree with that but I really do not think that you can have it both ways.


Just because I am curious and in NO WAY do I intend to start a fight here, why can't ASA have it both ways?? As long as there are different classes for each why can there not be a Known Division and an Unknown Division??


----------



## John-in-VA (Mar 27, 2003)

The last couple years ,we have shot one day marked .I dont like it that way .This year were shooting all unmarked .I think my judging helps me shoot better .I dident shoot any better on the marked targets ,then I did on the unmarked .I also think the high 12's had something to do with it .If anything when I judge a target ,most of the time I'm a little hot ,that's why I hold on the lower 12 .That way if I'm a little hot Most of the time I'll stay in the 10 ,If I'm on it's a 12 .Like all ready said it's to early to tell .But if they keep shooting 56 up ,no one will want to shoot in it anyway .


----------



## treeman65 (Nov 24, 2005)

Maybe you should wait until the next ASA to make judgement on the known yardage classes.They had what the hope for in the 45 yd and yes 50 was very low but you have to stop and think this week is Vegas.


----------



## MrPibb (Apr 10, 2004)

*dang fellars*

What some of you don't realize is that these class's were designed to draw shooters from the Spot and Field Archery side of things. There are plenty of class's available for those that only want to shoot unknown. I think the k50 and k45 are a good thing. Besides when it comes to archery the bottom line is that we all love to shoot no matter what type it is. ASA is only trying to grow the sport of archery. I shoot spots, field, and 3d, I prefer 3d and shoot open A, (all unknown) but its all flingin arrows.


----------



## Devine Shot (Mar 17, 2008)

MrPibb said:


> What some of you don't realize is that these class's were designed to draw shooters from the Spot and Field Archery side of things. There are plenty of class's available for those that only want to shoot unknown. I think the k50 and k45 are a good thing. Besides when it comes to archery the bottom line is that we all love to shoot no matter what type it is. ASA is only trying to grow the sport of archery. I shoot spots, field, and 3d, I prefer 3d and shoot open A, (all unknown) but its all flingin arrows.




AMEN.........

Yes 3d is about judging yardage but the bottom line is if we can attract more people to the sport and get them hooked then it is all good.....

They do have classes for all unknown or half and half and all known....
Pretty good mix overall. 

After Vegas hopefully the classes will be swarmed with shooters...


----------



## N2RCHRY (Feb 12, 2005)

TWO HUNDRED? As in DOLLARS?:mg:


----------



## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

N2RCHRY said:


> TWO HUNDRED? As in DOLLARS?:mg:


Yep. It is the Pro Known class. If you were to try and leave that class you must shoot Semi-Pro or higher.


----------



## N2RCHRY (Feb 12, 2005)

So the K50 is Pro and K45 is Am.? What's the entry fee for the K45?


----------



## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

N2RCHRY said:


> So the K50 is Pro and K45 is Am.? What's the entry fee for the K45?


$50 Puts it in line with Open A.


----------



## BROBB2112 (May 31, 2007)

Just because I am curious and in NO WAY do I intend to start a fight here, why can't ASA have it both ways?? As long as there are different classes for each why can there not be a Known Division and an Unknown Division??[/QUOTE]

I never said that they couldn't have it both ways. I do understand what they are trying to do as far as drawing more shooters into 3D. That is a great idea. There are a lot of people that shoot that cannot go out and spend the time to judge yardage or can afford to buy a full range of targets. Like I said before , I can see it from both sides of the aguement and I do not think that there is a right or wrong answer to it.


----------



## John-in-VA (Mar 27, 2003)

That's what there doing this year .Known and unknown .Just the last 2 years they had it 1/2 and 1/2 .I think it's great for all shooters ,now you can shoot what you want .Yes it's 200 dollars entry fee for the K50 ,and I 50 dollars for the K45 .Come on out and shoot some ASA ,it's always a great shoot .Hope to see you there .I shoot SR open


----------



## VeroShooter (Jul 14, 2005)

At a recent ASA director meeting it was pointed out that since the institution of the known distance factor Bow Novice and Womens Hunter have seen an increase in shooter participation of 64% and 97% respectively. These are the "farm" classes where the sport gets its new shooters and I would say it is working quite well. Its hard enough to learn to shoot a bow to begin with so not having to worry about yardage is one thing that is bringing new shooters to the sport. I think ASA is doing wonders to give everyone the opportunity to shoot 3D the way they like to shoot it.


----------



## N2RCHRY (Feb 12, 2005)

I shot ASA for several years. Open A and Semi for a couple years. LOVED IT! Still love 3D but I got into the field stuff and set a goal to make Florida State shoots a priority for awhile. My 3D game, which I used to ONLY shoot has suffered. I plan on fixing that!
Maybe I'll see you at a ASA Pro/Am soon...


----------



## VeroShooter (Jul 14, 2005)

Hey Mitch! Erika and I are going to try to make a couple state shoots this year. Hope to see ya there


----------



## fiveshooter (Sep 26, 2007)

*K 45 & k50*

I don't have a problem with the known yardage classes, but something like open b should stay all unknown and let the K45 class take the place of open c or something like that? I guess what I am saying is, let the beginner classes be all known and the higher classes be unknown.


----------



## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

fiveshooter said:


> I don't have a problem with the known yardage classes, but something like open b should stay all unknown and let the K45 class take the place of open c or something like that? I guess what I am saying is, let the beginner classes be all known and the higher classes be unknown.


I can see that. I think the idea behind the two Known classes was to entice some of the NFAA/NAA guys to come shoot 3D. Field archery being a known distance style of shooting would lend well to the Known 45 or 50 depending on how confident one might be.

The Open classes are stair stepped to allow shooters to move up the ranks in a fair manner I feel. Open C being 40 yds 1/2 & 1/2, Open B 45yds 1/2 & 1/2 and Open A being 45 yds all unknown seem to have a natural progression to it. 

I don't think the Known classes were ever meant to be part of this hierarchy.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

The asa in gainesville actually had almost 1200 shooters total...I think the reason why there is not more people in either of the 2 know distance classes are due to the over abundance of classes .....take a look at the number of shooters in each class over the past few years and you can see how the numbers spread out into the new classes ASA developed....10 years ago there was not a know distance class or novice classes or 3 open classes...yet there are still an average of 1,000 shooters at each ASA pro am....I have mixed emotions about this because the class I shoot has lost so many shooters....take look at semi pro and open A scores just from 2003 to now...these classes have been cut in half....now if you could look at the results for these 2 classes from back in 2000-2001 you would see they have been reduced by 100-150 shooters....Open B had 300-400 shooters in it back in the late 90's early 2000's. Some like the fact they have a better chance to possibly win because of the lower number of competitors in each class but I can tell you from experience your payout will be alot less than it could be....I guess we are in a society where we have to make everyone a winner these days


----------



## N2RCHRY (Feb 12, 2005)

drtnshtr said:


> I guess we are in a society where we have to make everyone a winner these days I would rather be in 20th place out of 300-400 shooters than I would be in 1st out of 40-50....probably win more $$$...


AMEN to that!


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

N2RCHRY said:


> AMEN to that!


ya caught me before I edited and removed that last line...thought I would catch some heat for that one...finally someone that agrees with me.:mg:


----------



## mw31 (Apr 23, 2007)

The k45 & k50 will probably pick up once indoors is over.


----------



## la.basscat (Jan 16, 2006)

fiveshooter said:


> I don't have a problem with the known yardage classes, but something like open b should stay all unknown and let the K45 class take the place of open c or something like that? I guess what I am saying is, let the beginner classes be all known and the higher classes be unknown.


Makes perfect sense to me.


----------



## MegaDan (Jan 23, 2007)

they need both known and unknown classes, what there trying to do is bring more people to the sport

lets face it, it tough to satisfy everybody, and having the known classes is a step in the right direction

if u eliminate any classes, then ur just gonna drive people away, these classes provide restriction(in some cases) in the game for peoples comfortablity, or in other words each class is taylored for what certain people like to shoot

u can't dictate and force people to shoot a certain class because of thier skill level(unless they win $), people want to shoot what they want, and if u don't give them the option, then they simply won't attend!!


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

MegaDan said:


> they need both known and unknown classes, what there trying to do is bring more people to the sport
> 
> lets face it, it tough to satisfy everybody, and having the known classes is a step in the right direction
> 
> ...


I kind of agree and disagree....adding all of these classes (im not talking about the new K classes) hasnt brought new shooters to ASA...they are still at the same numbers (or less) than they were 10 years ago...they simply spread out the field to make everyone happy and give folks a better chance to win...like I said in my previous post we wouldnt want anyone to be disappointed or lose would we???I dont think eliminating classes will drive people away...it will give guys that shoot mediocre a chance to win a little money even if they are in 20th or 30th place...right now shooting the class I would shoot (open A or Semi pro) is like going far away to shoot a local shoot against 40-50 other shooters...dont get me wrong I love ASA shoots to death but this whole mentality of lets make everyone a winner is killing me....whats wrong with maybe 1 or even just 2 open classes? do we really need 3 open classes and a novice class on top of that?


----------



## NCSUarcher (Feb 14, 2005)

*classes*

It's only been one shoot, a few year of review will tell the tell. I don't think the K50 will get much bigger because it is not considered a real Pro or semi-pro distinguished class and those pro's or semi-pro's have to give something up in their contract to go down a level and not be considered a PRO. I think the K45 class hit the number ASA wanted realistically and it will grow a little. It's all about giving everyone a cahnce to win and getting as may people a chance to compete by giving them so many options.


----------



## VeroShooter (Jul 14, 2005)

drtnshtr said:


> I kind of agree and disagree....adding all of these classes (im not talking about the new K classes) hasnt brought new shooters to ASA...they are still at the same numbers (or less) than they were 10 years ago...they simply spread out the field to make everyone happy and give folks a better chance to win...like I said in my previous post we wouldnt want anyone to be disappointed or lose would we???I dont think eliminating classes will drive people away...it will give guys that shoot mediocre a chance to win a little money even if they are in 20th or 30th place...right now shooting the class I would shoot (open A or Semi pro) is like going far away to shoot a local shoot against 40-50 other shooters...dont get me wrong I love ASA shoots to death but this whole mentality of lets make everyone a winner is killing me....whats wrong with maybe 1 or even just 2 open classes? do we really need 3 open classes and a novice class on top of that?



The numbers may be down from 10 years ago but we need to take a look at the trend from 2003-2005 when numbers were in rapid decline with no end in sight. Then take another look at the trend since the known distance factors were introduced and there is an OVERALL 12% increase in number of shooters at ASA ProAms since that took place. We are well on our way to seeing numbers of a decade ago if the trend continues. In fact ASA was the only archery organization that actually saw an increase in attendance numbers last year - even with the tremendous price of gas. 
I do agree with possibly eliminating the Open B class and just having a novice open class (C) and plain old open. I shoot open A and we had 98 shooters in Gainesville I would love to see that number double.


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

Vero I must disagree with eliminating Open B. What about those folks who shoot Open B that are down the list. They shoot the scores they do with half marked yardage. What would they shoot if they judged all the time. We need a place for the average shooters to be so they can play the game and still have some fun. The win out system ASA uses keeps better archers moving up. Every one still has the choice of shooting where they want(unless they have won out) so everyone should be happy. Is there too many classes..........when ASA gets to the point NFAA is at I will say they have too many.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

VeroShooter said:


> The numbers may be down from 10 years ago but we need to take a look at the trend from 2003-2005 when numbers were in rapid decline with no end in sight. Then take another look at the trend since the known distance factors were introduced and there is an OVERALL 12% increase in number of shooters at ASA ProAms since that took place. We are well on our way to seeing numbers of a decade ago if the trend continues. In fact ASA was the only archery organization that actually saw an increase in attendance numbers last year - even with the tremendous price of gas.
> I do agree with possibly eliminating the Open B class and just having a novice open class (C) and plain old open. I shoot open A and we had 98 shooters in Gainesville I would love to see that number double.


I normally shoot Open A also and have seen the numbers decrease tremendously in that class...Look at semi pro and there measly 60-70 shooters. If you been shooting ASA for any amount of time like I have then you can remember the days when Open B had 300-400 shooters in it and 2 shooting times each day..or when semi pro had 200+ shooters...Heck for that matter the Pro class always had 125-150 and now have what...60? Im not sure which class I would rather see eliminated (maybe open A or B) but I wish they would do something like that. I can see the need for a novice class but not 2 novice classes and then a bowhunter class on top of that.



Bubba Dean said:


> Vero I must disagree with eliminating Open B. What about those folks who shoot Open B that are down the list. They shoot the scores they do with half marked yardage. What would they shoot if they judged all the time. We need a place for the average shooters to be so they can play the game and still have some fun. The win out system ASA uses keeps better archers moving up. Every one still has the choice of shooting where they want(unless they have won out) so everyone should be happy. Is there too many classes..........when ASA gets to the point NFAA is at I will say they have too many.


IMO if there were more people in a class you would have a better chance at winning some cash...with 20% of each class getting a check you are only gonna have the top 20 shooters on average getting a very small payback...put 200-300 shooters in that class and you make alot more people happy because they shot "fair" and still received $$$$...


----------



## Bowtech11 (Mar 21, 2006)

Personally, I think they are trying to offer everyone the opportunity to come and shoot how they want. Good for ASA to have the balls to try something different. Wouldn't it be nice that we could go to one association for all our needs. Nobody will make you shoot known if you do not want to. I was against the known for the second day, but I like it now. we move so fast and we seem to have more fun with each other.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

Bowtech11 said:


> Personally, I think they are trying to offer everyone the opportunity to come and shoot how they want. Good for ASA to have the balls to try something different. Wouldn't it be nice that we could go to one association for all our needs. Nobody will make you shoot known if you do not want to. I was against the known for the second day, but I like it now. we move so fast and we seem to have more fun with each other.


I think its great ASA has brought known distance to the table...I just think as thin as some of the classes are getting it wouldnt hurt to do some consolidation...Eventually guys are gonna get tired of placing in the top 10-20 and not getting anything out of it.


----------



## absolutecool (Mar 26, 2006)

I am just happy to be able to shoot!!!

If you are in a class that has known distance and you don't want to shoot known, switch classes.....there are way more mens classes than womens.


----------



## Bowtech11 (Mar 21, 2006)

drtnshtr said:


> I think its great ASA has brought known distance to the table...I just think as thin as some of the classes are getting it wouldnt hurt to do some consolidation...Eventually guys are gonna get tired of placing in the top 10-20 and not getting anything out of it.


 I agree, I hope they realize what is needed for the shooters to have a chance. But still better than some associations that only pay certain classes and have 100 or more shooters. But with ASA having so many classes they offer more for the families that come and shoot together.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

Bowtech11 said:


> I agree, I hope they realize what is needed for the shooters to have a chance. But still better than some associations that only pay certain classes and have 100 or more shooters. But with ASA having so many classes they offer more for the families that come and shoot together.


Totally agree...Thats why I am proud to be a Lifetime ASA member:smile: I guess they spoiled me back in the day when I could shoot mediocre in open B class (20-30th place) and still win my entry fee back


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

dtrnshtr- Just remember that anyone that finishes out of the money was a donator at that tournament. If you lump all the Open Classes together you make more donators . What happens when those folks at the bottom decide not to come out anymore..................numbers drop and the payback falls with it. I don't think the ASA system is perfect but it is damn close. You can't please everyone. As far as one class for Open goes look at the IBO system. One Open class and with the exception of the World the winner gets $130 with 300 shooters. Don't think I want ASA to go that route. BTW I am an ASA lifetimer also.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

Bubba Dean said:


> dtrnshtr- Just remember that anyone that finishes out of the money was a donator at that tournament. If you lump all the Open Classes together you make more donators . What happens when those folks at the bottom decide not to come out anymore..................numbers drop and the payback falls with it. I don't think the ASA system is perfect but it is damn close. You can't please everyone. As far as one class for Open goes look at the IBO system. One Open class and with the exception of the World the winner gets $130 with 300 shooters. Don't think I want ASA to go that route. BTW I am an ASA lifetimer also.


If Im not mistaken the IBO payout is totally different than ASA...Im not suggesting ASA go down to just 1 open class...I think 2 would be plenty though as long as they have A bowhunter class also...why not have a larger and deeper payout per class like they used to have? whats wrong with an open class shooter winning $1,000.00 for 1st place and paying down 20% like they do now which could be equivilent to 30-40 places easy? What is wrong with donators? Im sick and tired of this everyone has to be a winner society. Im willing to donate as long as I have a chance at winning something worth my while. I personally dont like spending $200-$300 and driving 1000 miles for a chance to possibly win $300 topps.... and I have already heard the "go pro" thing before and thats not happening anytime soon unless my entry fees are paid for....


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

Dtrnshtr- There is a difference between the ASA of the old days and today. Back in the old days Miller Beer put a tremendous amount of money into ASA. That money is gone now. I understand what you are saying, I would love a big payout too but we have Open C to get folks started and the move out system to move them along so eventually the top two Open classes should start being the largest hence more money. If you look at IBO numbers for Open vs ASA numbers I believe ASA has more shooters but I could be wrong.


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

Spoon13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by N2RCHRY View Post
TWO HUNDRED? As in DOLLARS?
Yep. It is the Pro Known class. If you were to try and leave that class you must shoot Semi-Pro or higher.


It is my understanding that if you shot in Semi or Pro you were required to shoot in K50. I don't believe that K50 participation makes you a Pro or Semi if you drop out.


----------



## kkromer (Sep 14, 2004)

drtnshtr said:


> If Im not mistaken the IBO payout is totally different than ASA...Im not suggesting ASA go down to just 1 open class...I think 2 would be plenty though as long as they have A bowhunter class also...why not have a larger and deeper payout per class like they used to have? whats wrong with an open class shooter winning $1,000.00 for 1st place and paying down 20% like they do now which could be equivilent to 30-40 places easy? What is wrong with donators? Im sick and tired of this everyone has to be a winner society. Im willing to donate as long as I have a chance at winning something worth my while. I personally dont like spending $200-$300 and driving 1000 miles for a chance to possibly win $300 topps.... and I have already heard the "go pro" thing before and thats not happening anytime soon unless my entry fees are paid for....


I really see both sides here. I can remember winning local tournaments with one open class and winning more than a top 3 place at a national ASA open A now. While I like the bigger payouts, I understand what the driver is behind what ASA is doing. It's all about ASA increasing shooter numbers so sponsors have more opportunity to sell product. Nothing wrong with that - if it really grows a lot we'll end up with the right kind of numbers to generate larger payouts - a healthier archery industry as well as healthier competition with higher payouts all around. 

The toughest part of the whole 3-d thing for me now is judging the distance. It used to be such an easy thing, not so much anymore. I have to practice a lot to stay moderately competative in the A class. That said, I'll likely shoot one of the known distance classes and focus all the distance judging effort to making myself a better shooter.


----------



## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

Bubba Dean said:


> It is my understanding that if you shot in Semi or Pro you were required to shoot in K50. I don't believe that K50 participation makes you a Pro or Semi if you drop out.


Lorraine told me that if you left the Known 45 you must go to Open B or higher and if you left the Known 50, it was Semi or better. They may have changed their collective minds about that. 

My thoughts are if you gotta be Semi or Pro goin in, you gotta be Semi or Pro coming out too.


----------



## TANC (Mar 14, 2005)

I think Bubba Dean is correct:

6. Known 50 Open – No restrictions on age or sex. Known distance only. 50 yards, 280 FPS. Anyone required to compete in semi-pro or above must compete in the 50 yard class. Competitors may elect to return to another competition class after their first competition in this class, subject to meeting that class’s qualifications. Competitors may elect to switch to this class at anytime during the season prior to the Classic.

2. Known 45 Open - No restrictions on age or sex. Known distance only. 45 yards, 280 FPS. Any amateur eligible to compete in Open A or lower may compete in the 45 yard class. Competitors may elect to return to another competition class after their first competition in this class, subject to meeting that class’s qualifications. Competitors may elect to switch to this class at anytime during the season prior to the Classic.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

Bubba Dean said:


> Dtrnshtr- There is a difference between the ASA of the old days and today. Back in the old days Miller Beer put a tremendous amount of money into ASA. That money is gone now. I understand what you are saying, I would love a big payout too but we have Open C to get folks started and the move out system to move them along so eventually the top two Open classes should start being the largest hence more money. If you look at IBO numbers for Open vs ASA numbers I believe ASA has more shooters but I could be wrong.


Bubba, Im pretty sure MBO class in the IBO class has way more shooters...as a matter of fact if im not mistaken IBO has more shooters in MBO class than all 3 of ASA's open classes combined...For some reason Im not finding their prior year results page on the IBO website or I could say for sure....of course IBO up here in general has more shooters than ASA not to mention there is only ONE open class...


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

IBO up here has more shooters......that is because for years IBO has been the only game in town. Folks accept IBO's rules as the rules of 3D archery. When ASA does come to town many of the IBO shooters won't make the changes to shoot just one tournament. I remember a few years back at the Michigan ProAm a gentleman who had been the National Triple Crown champion in Hunter Class shot Bownovice and spent Saturday evening resighting because he had shot IBO speed in a class that at that time was 260 fps. How many times do you hear these guys say they can't afford to set ups..an IBO and an ASA. I think a lot of these guys take more pride in how fast their bow shoots than they do in how well they shoot it but that is just my opinion. Another difference is that ASA will get you were you belong...it may take a shoot or two but you will be there. In IBO all you have to do is sit out a year and then come back. They don't seem to have much of a memory for where there shooters belong. There is one fella who is a former World Champion in Hunter class who has sat out and come back a couple of times.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

Bubba Dean said:


> IBO up here has more shooters......that is because for years IBO has been the only game in town. Folks accept IBO's rules as the rules of 3D archery. When ASA does come to town many of the IBO shooters won't make the changes to shoot just one tournament. I remember a few years back at the Michigan ProAm a gentleman who had been the National Triple Crown champion in Hunter Class shot Bownovice and spent Saturday evening resighting because he had shot IBO speed in a class that at that time was 260 fps. How many times do you hear these guys say they can't afford to set ups..an IBO and an ASA. I think a lot of these guys take more pride in how fast their bow shoots than they do in how well they shoot it but that is just my opinion. Another difference is that ASA will get you were you belong...it may take a shoot or two but you will be there. In IBO all you have to do is sit out a year and then come back. They don't seem to have much of a memory for where there shooters belong. There is one fella who is a former World Champion in Hunter class who has sat out and come back a couple of times.


Yeh that sux that folks arent forced to move up...I agree with all of that but would like to add this...Just from experience and shooting a ton of ASA shoots I can tell ya that the Southern groups will not travel up here like we travel down south. I cant say I blame them our weather here sucks. I can remember several times while at a stake and asking my southern friends or fellow shooters if they were going to Michigan,Indiana,PA or even sometimes VA they said "heck no thats a 6 hour drive" or "no way thats an 8 hr drive"....its nothing for us to travel 12-13 hrs to most shoots from up here. IBO shoots are only 3-4 hrs for most shooters up here.


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

dtrnshtr- Got to agree with you on that. However if you remember the ProAms in Michigan and Indiana in the early part of 2000's how many of your buddies went? The last Indiana ProAm was held 13 miles from my house. There were quite a few of the locals there but not nearly the number that go to IBO. I didn't even shoot it.....something about tearing the cartilage in knee the weekend before and not being able to walk. I just did a look at the Open Classes for Florida last year and as a total they had 300 or so. So I think number are similiar, IBO may draw a few more but not a major difference. Plus look at how an ASA shoot runs......with the classes split you can get on a 20 target range and be done in 4 hours. In IBO how long does it take you????? Plus try to shoot 20 at an IBO on Sunday, good luck being done in time to turn in your scorecards. Then we an argue the payback.....but that is another dead horse. I will just say that anyone who finishes fifth in any of the ASA's Open classes wins more than the guy who wins MBO at any of the NTC shoots.


----------



## asa_low12 (Mar 15, 2008)

*k45*

I haven't been to an asa since florida of 03. I shot a LOT and shot to win. I was in young adult at the time and just got burnt out. I just started shooting again last fall. Went to one shoot last year and my shots were good, but my yardage was terrible. Worst score I have ever shot but with good reason(first shoot in 5 years). This year I have really started shooting a lot again and at least on the bag at the house i'm shooting better than I did back in the day. I went to my first known distance shoot two weeks ago and won it. On fire all day long. It reallllly boosted my confidence back up there to where I feel like i'm ready to take on anyone again. That was the first and only shoot i've been to this year so far(due to the ice storm last week) so it could be misleading but i'm hoping not. I want more than anything to be competitive in pro one day soon but i'm not going to try it until I have to. I want to shoot open a first and hopefully have to move to semi. But until I have been shooting a lot of unknown tournaments again to get that practice back up (seeing how theres no way I can afford a bunch of target to practice judging) then i'm going to shoot k45. I hate to shoot bad and especially at an asa. So at least for me, the known classes are getting me back into asa's a lot quicker than if there was no known classes. I'm going to hattiesburg next month. Known classes are good in some ways for some people but I can't wait to get my practice back to normal and jump back in to unknown.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

Bubba Dean said:


> dtrnshtr- Got to agree with you on that. However if you remember the ProAms in Michigan and Indiana in the early part of 2000's how many of your buddies went? The last Indiana ProAm was held 13 miles from my house. There were quite a few of the locals there but not nearly the number that go to IBO. I didn't even shoot it.....something about tearing the cartilage in knee the weekend before and not being able to walk. I just did a look at the Open Classes for Florida last year and as a total they had 300 or so. So I think number are similiar, IBO may draw a few more but not a major difference. Plus look at how an ASA shoot runs......with the classes split you can get on a 20 target range and be done in 4 hours. In IBO how long does it take you????? Plus try to shoot 20 at an IBO on Sunday, good luck being done in time to turn in your scorecards. Then we an argue the payback.....but that is another dead horse. I will just say that anyone who finishes fifth in any of the ASA's Open classes wins more than the guy who wins MBO at any of the NTC shoots.


I will never argue that ASA is better than IBO....there is no question about that....as far as the Michigan shoot goes....there were probably the usual 12-15 of my buddies there...they travel to all the ASA shoots.....where can I find IBO results from previous yrs...it was always on their website but I dont see it anymore...


----------



## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

treeman65 said:


> Maybe you should wait until the next ASA to make judgement on the known yardage classes.They had what the hope for in the 45 yd and yes 50 was very low but you have to stop and think this week is Vegas.


Wasnt there some well known pros missing from Gainesville period?


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

Only Danny and Chance were AWOL from Gainesville as far as I know.Geting ready for Vegas I suppose. I really am not a head counter of the Pros. I feel if none of them showed up we would still have a tournament,

Drtnshtr- IBO website is being rebuilt and the results archive has not been put back on yet, hopefully soon.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

wow I didnt realize Mcarthy and beabouf didnt make gainesville until you guys mentioned it...looked on the results page and sure enough you are correct....Thats hard to believe


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

Well Pros can drop one and still be shooter of the year.


----------



## treeman65 (Nov 24, 2005)

I dont beleive Cuz was there either.


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

treeman65 said:


> I dont beleive Cuz was there either.


I wasnt even thinking of that its just hard to believe a pro that is normally in the shootdown wouldnt make the trip...seems like danny is almost always a "shoe in" to make the shootdown.


----------



## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

I believe he and Chance did well in the early dot shoots and were still in dot mode. I haven't talked to either one since the ATA so I really don't know.....heck maybe Danny got a girlfriend and gave up shooting.:wink:


----------



## drtnshtr (Jan 20, 2003)

Bubba Dean said:


> I believe he and Chance did well in the early dot shoots and were still in dot mode. I haven't talked to either one since the ATA so I really don't know.....heck maybe Danny got a girlfriend and gave up shooting.:wink:


I bet if he has a GF she is shootin also:wink: seems like if he misses a shoot he is giving up a really good chance to win some $$$$


----------

