# An "ugly" period in equipment design...



## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

I have too many riser already, BUT, if I was going to get one for cool value, I would not mind having a red, white and green, Spigarelli Revolution. It is beautiful in its ugliness.


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## eagle man (Jun 7, 2011)

I've seen a couple of those W&W Xpet risers on Ebay and always wondered why you would bid on one when there are so many other nice designs out there. Guess it was like leisure suits in the 70's YIKES!!!


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## Beastmaster (Jan 20, 2009)

I personally like the way the Spig looks. I recall a young girl shooting one last year at indoor nationals. 

She special ordered it, saved up for it, and shot it. 

She now shoots a Hoyt. 

-Steve


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## icehaven (Nov 30, 2010)

i laughed out loud at the "Variable" riser. very creative. and the magnetic levitation rest sounds interesting....


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## x1440 (Jan 5, 2003)

I had a Spigarelli Dal Monte riser in the late 90's that had a similiar geometry to the Xpert riser. It looked like a stealth fighter.

http://www.arcoefreccia.it/Archivio/Prove Tecniche/Spigarelli Dal Monte - 1993.pdf

The had a built in magnetic rest and the front riser mount had angled down for clearance. It was actually a very good riser but I got a lot of strange looks.

The is the only pic I could find of someone shooting it... 
http://gallery.fitarcoitalia.org/ga...ti Italiani Indoor Reggio Emilia/LO0L4405.JPG


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## Robert43 (Aug 2, 2004)

Have to agree with you Limb Walker but the variable is up there. To me the revoution looks too much like a DIY riser


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## skunklover (Aug 4, 2011)

The variable was quite interesting...
Some of those are quite interesting to look at. 

I don't think the Spig Revolution looks that bad...


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

The Expert riser from W&W has been the stiffest and stable riser ever made without increasing the weight. The concept of increasing stiffness and torsional stability by adding a front carbon bridge to a light alumnum forged riser was perfect, just the fancy color combinations and design graphics added to it made it not wel accepted to teh western market. colors combinations had to be changed and design had to stay in the market longer to be better accepted. Unfortunately, W& w discontinued it after just one year, cutting the front bridge and making the more commercially succesfull (but quite weak) Expert NX from it. My son has shot some of his best scores with the Expert riser, includind the double 1343 that is still Italian record for the Double FITA round. 
may be soon or later some others will come out with a similar design in new technology and again people will talk about "innovation".

Spigarelli revolution riser was a succesfull tentive to make a cheap ILF riser skipping the milling process from a solid block. Stilll in production, but now days forged risers from China are unbeatable price wise

Sirius Green Horn riser is the most succesfull existing design in bare Bow risers, still on top of the category today.

Ellipse limbs have been defined the fastest in the world at that time, but their stellar price have limited a lot their sales and diffusion.

Copper John ANT sight has been IMHO the best sight ever made. Like many best items, it has been discontinued because too expensive to make. 

The Infinite riser from W&W was the first mixed aluminum-carbon riser. Intersting development based on the wrong assumption that closer the button to the pivot point, better the riser will shoot. It was immediately evident that the concept was wrong. 

Can't comment about the Variable, as I have never seen one but on the internet.


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

Xpert is pretty nifty riser, I had one for couple of years. If I had to compare the feel, Axis is one that comes closest to it in all risers I've had.


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## shootthewhatnow (Jan 29, 2008)

I own one of those bladetech bows... picked it up as a curiosity... :angel:


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## andyman1970 (Apr 2, 2008)

The Air-Rest from DoubleTake Archery

Interesting concept, but I suspect not a lot of takers.


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## PRES 10 (Dec 16, 2007)

I too find the revolution appealing, its got that black sheep factor to it. Those eclipse limbs are pretty wild, they look like the wave that black swan is making with the double curve. http://www.blackswanarchery.com/home.html


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## TheAncientOne (Feb 14, 2007)

I had a set of limbs that looked like the "Ceramic Carbon Ellipse Bow Limbs from Greenhorn", I found them at the bottom of my trunk after a long hot summer under about 600 lbs of damp scuba gear. Funny, I don't remember them looking like that when I bought 'em. 

I agree with Beastmaster, I like the way the Spig looks. Old World genes I suppose. 

TAO


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## skunklover (Aug 4, 2011)

The spig painted right has the potential to look like a modern/futuristic design.


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

My Dad tried to buy a variable riser many years ago. The email conversation basically went

My Dad: "I would like to buy one of your Variable risers"
Variable Guy: "There is someone shooting one in Australia, perhaps he can let you have a shot"
MD: "No, I would like to buy one, he lives 1000kms away"
VG: "I have looked on the internet, you shoot compound"
MD: "Yes, I also shoot recurve and want to buy your bow"
VG: "No"

***????


Back on topic
I did not mind the Xpert riser, but the Infinite was TERRIBLE. I know quite a few who had them and hated them.


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

"The Variable Guy" chooses extremely carefully to whom he solds his kit  There's one I know of in Finland (and even he is a former olympian), even though the designer's from Sweden. It's not really a commercial riser, just a technical showcase.


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## midwayarcherywi (Sep 24, 2006)

limbwalker said:


> http://www.centenaryarchers.gil.com.au/new_archery_gear.htm
> 
> Came across this website of "state of the art" gear from about 7-8 years ago. Man, what were they thinking?!? Had to be the ugliest period in target archery design since the 60's! ha, ha.
> 
> ...


Jim Ploen still shoots the Variable. And he looks good when shooting! That bow looks pretty in his hands. Sorry to say John, but PSE might have a horse in the ugly bow contest. But again, any bow looks pretty when you shoot it well.


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## Beastmaster (Jan 20, 2009)

Hank D Thoreau said:


> I have too many riser already, BUT, if I was going to get one for cool value, I would not mind having a red, white and green, Spigarelli Revolution. It is beautiful in its ugliness.


I need to dig up the photos of the red/white/blue Spig that this young girl shot in 2011. The bow was quite pretty.


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## massman (Jun 21, 2004)

Friend of mine here in MA has a Surius riser. He's modified it by moving the plunger rearward to align with the yoke of the grip. Actually shooting it barebow. Seems very well balanced for that style.

Regards,

Tom


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## SBills (Jan 14, 2004)

Greenhorn Sirius is on my list of bows to own someday.


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## Hunter Dave (Jul 17, 2007)

midwayarcherywi said:


> Sorry to say John, but PSE might have a horse in the ugly bow contest.


If you're referring to the x-Appeal, I'd have to agree. 

I was intrigued with the curves of those Greenhorn Ceramic Carbon Ellipse limbs. Couldn't seen to get a response from Greenhorn at the time, so they may have very well saved me some bucks.


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

zal said:


> There's one I know of in Finland (and even he is a former olympian),


That's what got us, my Dad's an ex-Olympian. :/ Probably the best enquiry they would have had out of AUS and he knocked it back.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Marcus, your dad is a FORMER Olympian. You're never an "ex" - Olympian. It's like a Marine. No such thing as an Ex-Marine  

Hunter, I've already weighed in on my opinion of the X-appeal's "curves" but at least now I can say that it is indeed a very good shooting riser!

John


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## Marcus (Jun 19, 2002)

haha good point :thumbs_up


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## MartinOttosson (May 31, 2011)

The Variable riser is one of few risers where you can rotate the whole grip in basically any angle you want. I tried it a few times and I didnt really like the balance of it, but for me that always have a problem of leaning the bow, it was a relief to just loosen a bolt and turn the grip to maybe 15 degrees offset in comparasion to a normal "straight" grip. Very unique feature!


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## wozie (Jul 21, 2005)

I own A Greenhorn SIRIUS . I had it powder-coated black it looks excellent, probably as good as new. I am currently using WIN WIN Winex 36#medium limbs with a small weight on the front of the riser (a FITA barebow set up). This bow like most bows from Europe has very good ballance without stabilizers. The SIRIUS is currently one of the hottest barebow bows in use in Europe today, very big on the FITA field archery circut. I am very happy with my SIRIUS.


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## Harperman (Sep 3, 2006)

limbwalker said:


> http://www.centenaryarchers.gil.com.au/new_archery_gear.htm
> 
> Came across this website of "state of the art" gear from about 7-8 years ago. Man, what were they thinking?!? Had to be the ugliest period in target archery design since the 60's! ha, ha.
> 
> ...


John.....That Win & Win X-Pert riser might be ugly, but I have a black one, with the red swirly graphics, and the only riser that I've shot as good or maybe better was my Nilo/Luxor, with 4 brass weights in the bottom of the riser...And the X-Pert is quieter, and has way less after-shot vibrations...I have a modified Loesch grip on mine, and the riser is a bit beat up and scratched looking, but I cant see selling it any time soon...I've owned two Aerotecs, various other Hoyt risers including a Nexxus, Elan, 2 Radians, a Martin Aurora, a Win Win Exfeel, the aforementioned Nilo, a PSE , and have shot a handful of other top-shelf gear...Over-all, I wouldnt trade the X-Pert for any of them.....maybe I should ship this one out to 'Ya, and let Ya shoot it, see what You think??......Jim


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## Murray (Aug 12, 2002)

I love my NX Xpert risers (Xpert without the front bridge), but for looks, I always look back to the Avalon Plus!


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

Xpert (with front bridge) feels very similar to Axis, only with better damping properties. I think it is probably the most underestimated riser ever made. Weight (1420g iirc, depending of the finish) definitely scared people away.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Jim, I've decided life is too short to shoot a bow that ugly.  ha, ha.

Actually, I'm shooting a bow right now that I distinctly remember telling one of my teammates "too bad it's so ugly!" ha, ha, ha! But once I shot it, it started looking a whole lot purtier! So, yea, I guess I will offer a little "room" for ugly if it has a "nice personality." 

John


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## Arcus (Jul 7, 2005)

limbwalker said:


> Jim, I've decided life is too short to shoot a bow that ugly.  ha, ha.
> 
> Actually, I'm shooting a bow right now that I distinctly remember telling one of my teammates "too bad it's so ugly!" ha, ha, ha! But once I shot it, it started looking a whole lot purtier! So, yea, I guess I will offer a little "room" for ugly if it has a "nice personality."


Though targeted for the barebow crowd, I think I remember you describing the riser I use as "butt ugly" (Spig 650 Club). Perhaps you didn't give it a chance to show its nice personality


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## SBills (Jan 14, 2004)

I still consider the Spig 650 to be uhummm visually challenged. But I own two and have little interest in changing soon.


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## Chris RL (Oct 30, 2011)

Just ordered a Variable Light. Yes, it's late 2012. And yes, Bertil will actually sell me one.
Want to experiment with the deflex possibilities in conjunction with my Border limbs.
Also don't mind the looks, since I've also shot a lot of Olympic air and free pistols and rifles - they all have a similar look to the Variable.
Just FYI! LOL!!!


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## MickeyBisco (Jul 14, 2012)

Personally, I love the "Lamborghini Countach" 80s styling of the Hoyt GM. Sharp lines and Miami Vice colors. What's better? Throw on some Gold limbs and you're the pimp of the line. 

The Spig above is pretty cool, actually. It's like a guitar strap.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

...i've owned the hoyt GM, elan and matrix, martin aurora, x-factor and my latest is the spigarelli explorer II...

among these and in order of priority i would rate my top 3 based on eye-appeal---to me---as follows:

1) x-factor
2) elan
3) matrix

...and they're all BLACK..


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## Chris RL (Oct 30, 2011)

awesome!
love things that are a little bit different.
love em even better, if they're... better...


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## Harperman (Sep 3, 2006)

I've just returned this evening from the Bow shop, was shooting indoor 3-D with my old beat up Win & Win X-Pert riser, with my new Uukha limbs mounted on it...New limbs, old riser, great combo...I get this set-up dialed in and tuned properly, I might actually scare myself....As much as I like my Hoyt FRX riser, if I had to make a choice between the FRX and the old beater X-Pert, I'm pretty sure that the X-Pert would be the riser that I would be hanging onto...............Jim


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## zal (May 1, 2007)

X-pert is probably the most underrated riser ever. I used to love mine and have been looking for one for a while now. I definitely rate it higher than these new hoyts.


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## Chris RL (Oct 30, 2011)

Just FYI, Bertil's Variable riser holds, I believe, the most recent international patent for a recurve riser design. Which means that the patent department, at least, thought it was sufficiently innovative and distinct from other riser designs to award him one.

For me, the ability to look into deflex, draw length and brace height as it affects arrow flight and accuracy sets it apart from the other risers in this thread, since the others seem to me to be variations on the basic theme. 

Of course, that hasn't much to do with its looks. And for those of us who think that curvy is sweet, then I'd wholeheartedly agree with you! (But as an owner of a Lotus Esprit model 1, I'd say I was more a fan of the folded-paper design philosophy anyway... 

Plus, I shoot an Aerotec myself, and it's also on Limbwalker's list - and so the new Ion-X from Hoyt would therefore be on it too!

Ah well, to each his own.

BTW if you're interested in what a Variable Light looks like these days, check the bottom of the Equipment section of my iShootRecurve.com blog to see what Bertil is assembling for me. He's building a wooden shipping box for it now, natch... Old School Rules!! 

Chris


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