# A new archer with some questions



## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Hello!

My girlfriend and I are venturing into the awesome realm of target archery. We have been doing a little research about the sport on-line and by visiting some local archery shops. While we were fortunate enough to have been given a compound bow by her father, I feel the need to purchase a bow of my own as the old bow bequeathed upon us is a tad short in the draw length for me (it fits her perfectly, however). 

I am interested in purchasing a recurve following the examples set by olympic archers, and just because I find recurves very elegant. I don't have many funds due to ever-increasing college tuition, but I would like a bow that I can grow into as I sharpen my skills over time. I found the Fred Bear BearCat Take Down recurve to fit my price range. I have fired a similar bow before and found a bow of that size and draw weight fits me well. What are some opinions on this bow? Before I plop down my cash, I have a few questions regarding entry into the sport:

Target recurves often sport a sight of some sort. I am considering Toxonics' 1400 First Stage front sight, but I am curious as to what will be used as a rear sight? The compound bow that we were given uses a multi-pin front sight and a rear peep-sight. I noticed a company called Hind Sight offers a sighting system that has both front and rear sights mounted to the riser. Do target sights even use a rear sight? 

I would like to eventually try competing, but I will want to spend a year or so practicing and learning more about this sport. Thank you all for your inputs!


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## Unk Bond (Aug 1, 2004)

J-san said:


> *Hello!
> 
> My girlfriend and I are venturing into the awesome realm of target archery. We have been doing a little research about the sport on-line and by visiting some local archery shops. While we were fortunate enough to have been given a compound bow by her father, I feel the need to purchase a bow of my own as the old bow bequeathed upon us is a tad short in the draw length for me (it fits her perfectly, however).
> 
> ...


Hello

My thoughts.

I shot a recurve for a number of years.
So hear are my views and suggestions.

No. 1 a 30 to 45 lb recurve is enough to get the job done.
Iam a small guy and i shot a 35 lb recurve

And one has to consider here you might pull a bow back a few times .And say to your self thats not bad .And you again might think in terms. Hey iam a big guy.

Now size has nothing to do with it. I have seen small guys that could out pull and hold more ploundage.Than being a big guy.

Now you want to consider a less ploundage bow . So as when the long match starts , you can be relaxed and in complete control.Through out it.

2 A front site and a peep site in the string. Is what i would recomend.

3 Adjust your front site bar lenth .To your best focal lenth.

4 A bear take down are nice bows. [But] any bow you may look at ,look at the width and angle of the grip.

Example a Hoyt bow is a fine bow in the right hands.

But in my case the grip design caused me to get arm slap

So do consider the grip.

5 Visit A T treads here and soak up all you can on your subject.
But consider we are all made different. And what works for me and others might not be your style.

And i asure you a recurve will talk to you in many ways.
So try and shoot a few if you can.Before you make your final decision.

Later
Unk

Add on sorry

Look for a long recurve, and with a lot of brace height. say in the ange of 9"or+ and remember here brace height is where you get a recurve bow to forgive you.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

Unk, you can't use peep sights when competing with FITA recurves.

If your planning on going down the Olympic archery road, you'll want an aluminum riser with international limb fitting limb pockets. Since your strapped for cash, I'd recommend the W&W Winstar and Carbon Challenger limbs. Should cost you about $250.

You'll also need a rest. ARE stick ons are good rests. Of course the W&W is cheap and effective.

You'll want a plunger, I use the Cavalier Master plunger, $25. Ask around on the plunger as my opinion is not the be all end all.

You'll want a good sight. I use a Quest X and I have a FITA extreme for sale on ebay. The 1400 is not a bad sight. If your strapped for cash, I'd get it.

You'll want a good string, 8125 or Angel Dyneema is best.

You might also want to look into some stabilizers. It comes down to personal preference on this one.

Hope that helps.

Leighton


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## TJ Mason (Mar 25, 2004)

> I am curious as to what will be used as a rear sight?


This is the Black Art of recurve shooting!

The rear sight is effectively provided by the whole body. A consistent stance and consistent draw length is the base of it all.

Precision is provided by a consistent anchor point. This is where the drawing hand comes to at full draw. Nearly always, this means touching the string and/or hand to the face. A kisser button on the string helps you -- you can touch the kisser button to the same point on the face each time. Also, you need to touch the string to the same point on the nose or chin (depending on physiognomy) each time. And put the string blur in a consistent place.

It takes some learning, but it's a lot more interesting than using a peep sight.


For the bow and arrows, it's best that you shoot club equipment for a while until you get a clear idea of what will suit you. But I'm aware that in many parts of the US it's difficult to find clubs that specialise in recurve. The Hoyt Gold Medalist and the Win & Win Winact are good intermediate bows that will take you through your learning and will be suitable for competitive use. Best to start with aluminium arrows, such as Easton Platinum Plus. Avoid the Easton Jazz -- they're probably alright for knitting with, but are not much use for archery.

If buying second hand, make sure you get a bow of the right length. Recurve length is more critical than compound length. What height and draw-length are you?


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## TJ Mason (Mar 25, 2004)

I meant to say "Win & Win Winstar", not Winact. The Winact is a more expensive advanced bow.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Wow! So much great information in less than 12 hours! This forum is excellent! 

I am a guy of medium build at 5'9" and 155lbs. I had my draw length measured to be 28" and I feel comfortable around 35-40 lbs. draw weight. I was told by salepeople that draw length is not as critical of a factor when using recurves as it is for compounds, so I was told that a bow in the 60" range would suit me. The salesman added that a longer bow would be more forgiving and have a smoother draw. 

What is the difference between a mag riser and aluminum riser interms of performance? The bow I was planning to buy has a mag riser. 

I have never heard of W&W before, but I'll research it more after school today. As it currently stands, archery shops in my area carry mostly hunting compound bows and few recurves. I have since decided to look on-line for a decent retailer and found www.archeryexperts.com. 

Many thanks to all of you who take your time to answer my questions.


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## TJ Mason (Mar 25, 2004)

> I was told by salepeople that draw length is not as critical of a factor when using recurves as it is for compounds, so I was told that a bow in the 60" range would suit me.


Yikes! They told you wrong. Draw length is just as critical for recurve as for compound. Perhaps more so, since compound has more equipment options for compensating for a wrong draw length.

I'm 5'8" (I won't mention my weight... ) and use a 66" bow. I'd suggest you need a 68" bow, and would probably get on fine with a 70" bow. I'm not sure where the sales people got a 60" length from, since that's way short for a recurve. They might have been thinking of flat bows.

My draw length is 28", and I use 29" arrows to avoid over-drawing. I suggest you get some 30" arrows for safety's sake. You can always cut them down later.

Magnesium risers are lighter than aluminium risers, but aluminium is stronger. I wouldn't worry too much about the riser material, it's really only a factor when you get up to much higher draw weights. Magnesium is fine at 35-40 lbs.

Good luck!


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## TommyHawk (Sep 8, 2004)

*Online archery stuff*

Hi J-san,

I'm new, like you. I'm 5' 10", 165, just ordered a Winstar 25" riser. My Challenger Craft limbs are slightly used, and pull 42 lbs. That's a little heavy to start out with, but the price was right. So my rig will be 68".

A couple of heavy-hitters online are:

www.lasarchery.com
www.fsdiscountarchery.com

FS is a little cheaper for most things, as I see it.

Lots of good info here, some actual Olympic archers too.

Good luck and have fun!


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

Welcome J to the wonderful world or recurve target archery. Here's a few recomendations that I have for someone just starting out.

Set a realistic budget. I would say that your going to spend close to $500 for anything that's worth it's while, anything less is probably not going to make you happy or will only let you advance to a certain point where you'll have to shell out more money anyway to get new equipment. I think the $500 is a good budget to start out with for everything (a decent quality riser and limbs, arrows, a basic target sight, a basic stablizer, finger tab, arm guard, quiver, case, other accesories, etc.). 

Think about something from the KAP line such as the Evolution II or the Winstar. Both are excellent risers for their price. The Hoyt Gold Medalist is a quality riser and has a proven track record (20+ years with Olympic medals being won with it) but does cost a little more. 

Get a set of limbs that are comfortable with that don't push your strength. You said you were comfortable with 35-40 pounds, but is that with a recurve or compound? I would highly suggest nothing more than 30 - 34 pounds when first starting out. The muscles used for archery are very different than what we use day to day and even the strongest people can have a hard time with lower weight. You don't want to push yourself too fast, it's not a sport of strength after all. After you get consistent form down, you can start to move up in weight. Start with a set of limbs that are affordable. When you do get stronger and more consistent, better limbs will become more useful to you.

Equipment made by companies such as Cartel, K&K, and other "off brand" manufactueres can still be quality equipment. You can get stablizers at half the cost of a name brand such as Easton or Beiter. Same goes for a sight. Start with something very basic, but something that is dependable (aka won't move on you).

Easton carbon target arrows can be prohibitively expensive (X10s with Tungsten points can be $500 just for the dozen itself), but you also don't want to buy sticks of wood either. A great shaft to begin with are the XX75 Platiums. Great target arrow, very consistent, durable. 

One mail order retailer that maybe able to give you great prices is Lancaster Archery (http://www.lancasterarchery.com/)

eBay is your friend if you know what your looking for. Same goes for 2nd hand archery websites. I've bought lots of used and new equipment for less than I would have ever expected to pay. I must have saved several hundreds of dollars at this point from the equipment I've bought online second hand.

Last but not least, consider joining the NAA and joining the College Division. You may be able to get some referral to a target shooter in your area to get better information than the stores you've visited so far (which seem to be geared towards hunting more than target).


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## DZShooter (Sep 29, 2004)

My suggestions (based on my own experience)

Hoyt GM, W&W Winstar or similar KAP riser. ($140 - $180)
KAP Challenger Craft or Challenger Carbon limbs. Hoyt Edge perhaps. ($100 - $200)
Hoyt Super Rest or similar (small plastic thing) ($3)
XX75 Platinum Plus arrows (3" feathers, G-nocks) (~$60)
Dacron string is fine at first, but a FastFlight or Dyneema based string should be in your future. ($8 - $12)
A good finger tab (Neet inexpensive, Cavalier elite is nice) ($8 - $25)
A good armguard (Beiter fits me best) (~$10)
A decent hip quiver (Neet works fine) ($15 - $100(angel))
A takedown bow case (Neet? SKB? Cartel(Doosung)?) ($30 - $180)

(~$500 to start)

That's enough to start. As you continue on your archery journey you could look into:
- ARE or W&W magnetic rest ($12 - $25)
- Cartel, Cavalier or Shibuya plunger ($12 - $30)

as well as sights, stabilizers, clickers, carbon arrows, spotting scopes, etc.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

J-san said:


> *Wow! So much great information in less than 12 hours! This forum is excellent!
> 
> I am a guy of medium build at 5'9" and 155lbs. I had my draw length measured to be 28" and I feel comfortable around 35-40 lbs. draw weight. I was told by salepeople that draw length is not as critical of a factor when using recurves as it is for compounds, so I was told that a bow in the 60" range would suit me. The salesman added that a longer bow would be more forgiving and have a smoother draw.
> 
> ...


Mag risers are generally of lower quality than aluminum risers. Thats the basic rule. Notice that none of the top of the line recurve risers are made of anything other than aluminum.

lancasterarchery.com is a good place, so is k1-archery.com

PS I also meant winstar, not winact.


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

I contend that some magnesium risers are of better quality than some aluminum ones. I'd rather shoot a Hoyt GM or a Yamaha Eolla than a Evolution II riser. 

Aluminum is the material dujour in risers these days. But that doesn't mean that a die cast magnesium riser won't give you excellent results though.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

hkim823 said:


> *I contend that some magnesium risers are of better quality than some aluminum ones. I'd rather shoot a Hoyt GM or a Yamaha Eolla than a Evolution II riser.
> 
> Aluminum is the material dujour in risers these days. But that doesn't mean that a die cast magnesium riser won't give you excellent results though. *


Which is why I said "general rule of thumb." Its not always true that an aluminum riser is better machined than a magnesium one, but in most cases that is the case.

Sorry for the confusion.

-Leighton


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## TexARC (Mar 5, 2003)

J-San:
Do NOT buy anything yet!
Until you know what you like you cannot make good decisions about what to buy. Until you have shot some, though, you won't know what you like. 

If you can, I suggest you download a copy of Murray's fabulous (or is it, "Fabulous Murray's"  ) Recurve Guide. This free tome has a GREAT deal of good information about the sport. 
Murray's Fabulous Recurve Guide HomePage 

Since I am an NAA member and level II instructor, I have a bias towards getting a similar instructor (or better yet, a level III or IV) to give you some basic training. 
Even one simple hour will give you a HUGE boost in awareness, as well as establish some good basic technique to start with. 

If you go to the following link, you can read more and perhaps find a coach on their roster: NAA Coaches Information Page 

As an alternative if you can find a good club near you (try various archery ranges in the yellow pages or on the net), or even a JOAD, then you can usually find some recurve archers who will be willing to provide assistance and opinions


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

No, I'm not going to buy anything until I know for sure what I want. I checked out Lancaster's site and put together a little shopping cart of parts I could afford. As it is, my bow now consists of: 

- W&W Winstar riser
- KAP Surprise limbs for 68" and 32lbs. draw weight (I have shot a 30lbs. recurve comfortably)
- AIM Medalist sight (is this a good sight?)

for a total price of: $269.97


That's already getting up to my max budget  I can get some decent arrows from my girlfriend's father who knows how to build them. He gave us some arrows labeled "Easton X7 1816" on the shaft if that means anything to you guys. I already have a Vista shooting glove and arm guard. I realize the riser is something you would keep for a long time and the limbs would eventually be replaced as one advances, which is why I chose cheaper limbs. So a target recurve foregoes the rear sight. Could I just crimp on an extra nocking point thing on the string to act as a "kisser button"? 

I don't know of any archery instructors, but there are a number of very serious archers that frequent my local range. I chat with them now and then and try to learn all that I can. Unfortunately, about 90% of archers at the range are hunters or archers who exclusively use compounds. But, to a novice like myself, any bit of advice they can give me is gladly accepted.


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

Easton refers to the maker of the arrow, X7 is the model, and 1816 is the size. Arrows come in different sizes just like shoes; there are a few sizes that will fit you and your setup well. Depending on how long the arrows are 1816 might work out well for you. Arm guards are arm guards in my own opinion and you can use whatever you like, and a shooting glove is probably acceptable for now just to learn. Yes you can use a kisser button though. That's perfectly legal. You just can't use a peep sight. 

There are all these questions that you may have but really the best way to answer them is with someone who also shoots recurve in your area. I spent years at a range that only had a handful of recurve shooters and then after a hiatus from the sport, found a range that had a great amount of quality recurve shooters. My shooting benefited just from the brain trust that group had infinitely more than I ever had shooting at the other range. It's not a vastly different dicipline, but there are enough nuances that really I feel require someone to see you shoot and help you learn from that point of view. TexasARC is completely correct. 

I was in a situation very similar to you where I tried to get as much information online and from other shooters who didn't shoot recurve, but in my humble opinion you can only get so far with it before hitting a wall fairly quickly in terms of how to use your equipment, and in your technique.


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## Valkyrie (Dec 3, 2002)

I don't believe that the "suprise" limbs will fit your riser - the information that I have states:

"Material: High-tech foam core. Available Lengths: 64", 66", or 68". Weights: 16 - 32# (In 4# increments). Limbs: Interchangeable with Ragim, InterNature, or K&K."

Someone will correct me  if I"m wrong


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Odd, the KAP Surpirse limbs don't fit the Winstar riser? The description at Lancaster's site didn't specify which riser it was for. Since it was made by W&W, I assumed it would fit a riser of their own make. Which limbs will fit? How about the KAP Comet limbs? 

hkim, 

I looked around on-line and actually found an archery club not too far from me that holds archery lessons and competitions. I'll definately be looking into that.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

J-san said:


> *Odd, the KAP Surpirse limbs don't fit the Winstar riser? The description at Lancaster's site didn't specify which riser it was for. Since it was made by W&W, I assumed it would fit a riser of their own make. Which limbs will fit? How about the KAP Comet limbs?
> 
> hkim,
> 
> I looked around on-line and actually found an archery club not too far from me that holds archery lessons and competitions. I'll definately be looking into that. *


No dude, the surprise limbs are for the surprise riser. You need to get international fitting limbs for the winstar. Which is why I suggested it in the first place actually; you can upgrade the limbs and when your really good, you can plop down another $400 on a new riser.


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

> Wow! So much great information in less than 12 hours! This forum is excellent!


J-San, you may think you're getting good advice here, but I have to tell you, 60% of what has been posted on this thread is simply _basura_. 

I suggest you do not buy anything until you can follow some of the good advice you got from TexARC.


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## TJ Mason (Mar 25, 2004)

> J-San, you may think you're getting good advice here, but I have to tell you, 60% of what has been posted on this thread is simply basura.


gt, you've got a habit of making postings like this every time recurves get mentioned. I respect your opinion, but it would be more useful for everyone if you got specific.

I agree that some info on this thread is bad, but nowhere near 60%. What are you objecting to, exactly?


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## TJ Mason (Mar 25, 2004)

J-Sam wrote:


> Odd, the KAP Surpirse limbs don't fit the Winstar riser? The description at Lancaster's site didn't specify which riser it was for. Since it was made by W&W, I assumed it would fit a riser of their own make. Which limbs will fit? How about the KAP Comet limbs?


The Surprise limbs are intended for very basic beginner recurves, the type with wooden risers. It would be worth considering such basic bows if you can get a trade-in deal against a metal-riser bow at a later date, but wooden recurves won't get you very far beyond the basics of the sport.

The Comet limbs are international fitting, and will fit the Winstar riser. They're probably the least expensive international fitting limbs, but should do the job fine.


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## NativeCraft_NC (Nov 18, 2003)

I would also like to recommend checking out the Samick Mizar or Agulla "specials" that Alternative Sports in the U.K. is running. They've got a whole outfit (Mizar) for around $245, I believe. 

TA


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## BILL B (Jun 21, 2003)

I would like to second the response of TexARC and GT that you go to a coach and also get a good book. Much of the info on chat groups is opinion (as is this one) and you never know who is submitting a reply. Other than the two above, I also know Valkyrie and value all of their opinions. For the record, I am an NAA Level 4 Coach.


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## Jim1440 (May 14, 2004)

I would certainly agree with the need to find a coach that can teach proper technique from the beginning.

As far as a good book for beginners I'd recommend Larry Skinners new book/video combination (www.archeryshotexecution.com).

Jim


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

For starters, I started reading the Recurve Guidebook that TexARC suggested. Very informative manual. I am in the process of joining the University of MN archery club, so hopefully I'll continue to learn about the sport and save up enough for a decent bow. I'll probably stick with the Comet limbs for starters and invest in better ones as I improve.


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## Valkyrie (Dec 3, 2002)

J-san 

In days gone by - I believe that U of Minn archery club had equipment to loan out - I only attended one shoot there in 1989 where it was myself and one other guy shooting - you might find out if there is something lying about that you could use.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

BILL B said:


> *I would like to second the response of TexARC and GT that you go to a coach and also get a good book. Much of the info on chat groups is opinion (as is this one) and you never know who is submitting a reply. Other than the two above, I also know Valkyrie and value all of their opinions. For the record, I am an NAA Level 4 Coach. *


As much as I agree with all this, I do wonder how people who live in places without archery clubs can find a coach to teach them. Especially considering they'll need equipment to learn from the coach. Take for example, Hawaii. No recurve clubs in existence and no where to rent equipment.


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## BILL B (Jun 21, 2003)

Leighton

Try another state. There are two good NAA Level 4 coaches in Honolulu. See the NAA web page for coaches in other states.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

BILL B said:


> *Leighton
> 
> Try another state. There are two good NAA Level 4 coaches in Honolulu. See the NAA web page for coaches in other states. *


Never said there are no coaches. I said theres no equipment to rent. I know Mr. Sonoda personally, he was my coach for over 10 years.

How is the new archer going to get coaching without equipment? I know Mr. Sonoda doesn't have any. It all belongs to the Hawaiian Knights and they've dissolved.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

I was reading over the Recurve Guidebook and noticed it didn't say anything about stringing a bow. How does one string a recurve? I assume that you wouldn't keep the string on always since that would probably wear out the limbs.


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## >--gt--> (Jul 1, 2002)

> How does one string a recurve?


The only safe way to do it is with a bow stringer, a five dollar piece of kit consisting of an over-long string and two leather "socks". 

One threads the top limb through the top string loop, pulling the string 6-10 inches down the limb. Then one attaches the bottom loop to the bottom limb. 

The LARGER "sock" of the stringer goes on the BOTTOM limb tip(to capture the string loop in place) and the SMALLER sock goes on the top limb tip (to give you room to manipulate it). 

Step on the stringer in the middle with the bowstring on top of your foot, and pull the riser up from the center with your support hand while sliding the top string loop into position with your dominant hand. 

When everything's set you can relieve pressure slowly and you have a strung bow. Simply reverse the method to unstring.

Other methods are hazardous to users (push pull) or to the bow (step through).


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## Boltsmyth (Nov 16, 2002)

Hey J-san,

Let me add some garbage...

In my opinion the safest way to string a recurve is with a "bowstringer" this is basically a long string with leather or rubber cups on the end (or variations of this design) you slip the larger end over the bottom limb tip (which has the small bowstring loop already attached) and the smaller end over the top tip. you then step on the middle of the stringer as you pull the bow upwards and slide the larger end of the bowstring loop onto the top string groove. Most archery stores carry stringers.

Someone else can describe the stepthrough method my brain hurts now.

I usually use the push pull method which most beginner archery books advise aganst so I won't describe.


(Hey GT you beat me. You musta been posting as I was writing. I'll work faster next time! LOL)


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

J-san said:


> *I was reading over the Recurve Guidebook and noticed it didn't say anything about stringing a bow. How does one string a recurve? I assume that you wouldn't keep the string on always since that would probably wear out the limbs. *


This might be the point where you go out and look for some lessons.


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## Brick (Jul 23, 2004)

J-san said:


> * I am in the process of joining the University of MN archery club*


...which shoots out at Wolf Track Archery club.....which has lots of talented people who would love to help you out.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Brick said:


> *...which shoots out at Wolf Track Archery club.....which has lots of talented people who would love to help you out.
> 
> *


Hey! Are you a member of the club?


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## Brick (Jul 23, 2004)

J-san said:


> *Hey! Are you a member of the club? *


Yup, we just joined late this last summer. My daughter is shooting in the Youth Instructional League on Saturdays.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Ok. I've more questions about recurves. I was looking over the selection of risers on Lancaster's site and noticed that some were 24" and others were 25". Limbs varied in ther lengths from say, 62"-70" for example. My questions is: how can the store say the limbs create a specific overall length if there are different length risers? I assume there is some standard riser length in which the overall bow length is measured? 

So if I were to get a 68" recurve, I would be required to string it with a 68" string? The overall length of a bow is measured after it is strung, right? 

And for limbs; I am told by salesmen that compound bows can be adjusted to a draw weight within a set range depending on the limbs, cams, etc. Can this be done on a recurve? I saw on a compound that this was accomplished by adjusting the bolt that secured the limb to the riser, and by bolting the limb tighter to the riser, heavier draw weights can be had. 

Thanks!


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

The current "standard" riser length is 25". Many shooters go with the standard length. Standard short risers are 23". The only 24" riser on the market today is the Martin Aurora (The Sky Conquest was also a 24" riser) as far as I know. Most ther target recurve risers are 23" or 25". 

Standard limbs these days come in 3 sizes, short, medium and long, each two inches longer than the other. So if you had a standard short riser and short limbs, your bow would be 64" bow. A long riser and long limbs would give you a 70" bow. 66" bow can be achieved with a short riser and medium limbs or a long riser and short limbs.

That doesn't mean that there are companies that make different length risers and limbs, especially for hunting or for youth archers. 

As for a string, you would get a string that would fit the bow, but the string itself would not be the same length as the bow. So no the string is not 68" long for a 68" bow. But anyone who makes strings will be able to make the correct length string for you if you tell them how long your bow is. 

Weight is adjustable on some recurve risers but the range is generally much more limited. Remember though, a limb maybe marked 30 pounds. That doesn't mean that it's going to be 30 pounds at your draw length though.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

So, how would one determine the correct length of string for their bow? I'm planning on going with the Winstar riser and and the KAP Comet limbs for 68". Since the Winstar is 25" and with the limbs labeled as 68", that would mean the bow's length should be 68"? I'm going to order the neccessary parts from Lancaster later, but I want to get the facts straight first. Thanks for putting up with my endless barrage of questions.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

you'd want a 65" string. Thats the actual length. Well, you could go 1/2" shorter or longer too. But 65" is a good starting point.

Don't order a string from Lancaster, they're expensive.


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

You can just say the string is for a 68" recurve bow and the string maker will know how long to make it. That's much easier than to say you need a certain length string.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Great! Thanks for your help guys.


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

hkim823 said:


> *You can just say the string is for a 68" recurve bow and the string maker will know how long to make it. That's much easier than to say you need a certain length string. *


Or you could do that. Which reminds me, I should just have that as an option on the order page. *goes and adds option*


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Are string silencers used on target recurves? Is there any benefit for a novice to use a stabilizer? The weather is getting cold where I live, so I will spend the rest of the season shooting indoors. I am told that indoor shooters prefer to use larger diameter arrows. If my bow is 34 lbs. draw weight, what size arrows are recommended?


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

J-san said:


> *Are string silencers used on target recurves? Is there any benefit for a novice to use a stabilizer? The weather is getting cold where I live, so I will spend the rest of the season shooting indoors. I am told that indoor shooters prefer to use larger diameter arrows. If my bow is 34 lbs. draw weight, what size arrows are recommended? *


No, string silencers are not used on target recurves. I would not invest in a stabilizer if I were you.

use the Easton Arrow Chart.


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## TJ Mason (Mar 25, 2004)

J-san wrote:


> Are string silencers used on target recurves? Is there any benefit for a novice to use a stabilizer? The weather is getting cold where I live, so I will spend the rest of the season shooting indoors. I am told that indoor shooters prefer to use larger diameter arrows. If my bow is 34 lbs. draw weight, what size arrows are recommended?


For a stabiliser, start with a 30" long rod. These can be got for around $45. If you join a club, there's a good chance that someone will have one that you can borrow or buy. There's no point getting other stabilisers uintil your shooting settles down.

Easton has some nice on-line applications for selecting the right arrow. This one is for target shafts:
http://www.archeryoutdoors.com/shaft-selector-guides/TargetShafts/Step1.tpl 
Some people say that it gives arrows that are too stiff, but I've not found that.


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

I disagre with Leighton on this one. Even a green novice I think should start with a very basic long rod. We're not looking for vibration absortion so much as we're looking for forward balance so the falls forward when you shoot it and thus your already training yourself not to hold your bow. Shooting a bow that kicks back instead of kicks forward on you can make a big difference in just how everything feels in the beginning. 

A simple cheap long rod with a small amount of weight (a few ounces at most) is a good investment in the beginning. 

Arrow size has a lot of different variables, weight is only one variable. Length of your arrow, length of your draw, how much over or under draw, and several other variables come into play.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

I was at a sporting goods store today checking out arrows and noticed different sizing numbers used. I recognized the numbers used on some aluminum hunting arrows (like 2019, 2018, etc.), but then I saw some aluminum arrows numbered "400". I also saw some carbon arrows with size numbers way higher than what I usually saw. One particular box of 8 carbon arrows had a size of 6075. I assume they size carbon arrows differently than aluminum?


I also found a device called a doinker. The packaging claimed this acessory reduced vibrations from shooting. Would it be a good idea to invest in one?

Thanks for the responses!


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

J-san said:


> *I was at a sporting goods store today checking out arrows and noticed different sizing numbers used. I recognized the numbers used on some aluminum hunting arrows (like 2019, 2018, etc.), but then I saw some aluminum arrows numbered "400". I also saw some carbon arrows with size numbers way higher than what I usually saw. One particular box of 8 carbon arrows had a size of 6075. I assume they size carbon arrows differently than aluminum?
> 
> 
> I also found a device called a doinker. The packaging claimed this acessory reduced vibrations from shooting. Would it be a good idea to invest in one?
> ...


No, don't buy a doinker. Waste of money.

Carbon arrows have different numbers than aluminum ones. Just get a lancaster catalogue. 1-800-829-7408


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

One thing that isn't standarized is how arrow manufactuers size their arrows. Everyone has a different way of doing it, especially with carbon arrows. In that sense you'll have to check with the manufacturer and how they size arrows, and usually they'll have a chart based on how long the arrow is, and many pounds your using, and recommend a certain arrow to use. Those 4 digit numbers that you saw on the aluminum shafts is the Easton standard of sizing arrows (The first 2 digits is the outer diameter of the shaft, the inner # is the thickness of the shaft).

Doinker is a product made by Leven industries made specifically to reduce vibration. A product like this though shouldn't be used until you get the basics down first. Vibration and shock absortion shouldn't be your first concern right now. After shooting for a while, if you want to invest in these types of items you can, but in the beginning? It's probably not worth it at all.


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## DZShooter (Sep 29, 2004)

FWIW, the 6075 number on those shafts mean it's for a bow of 60-75lbs. AFAIR that company doesn't make anything lower than 4560.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Thank you all for the replies! I have my bow and am a member of an archery club where I can shoot 24/7. I have already met some very knowledgable people there who have helped me a lot with my form and technique.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

I've got a quick question. What are the different sizes of nocks corresponding to? Do they refer to the diameter of the arrow shaft? I have Easton X7 1816 shafts, which size nocks would fit best? The shafts have the tapered ends so I'm planning on getting the American BJ nocks. 

Thanks!


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

Different shafts have different nock options. That size X7 shaft has a feature built into it (assuming it's an X7 made recently) that allow the shaft to take Easton G nocks. You may see something like "Uni bushing" next to the description of the shafts. 

If they are older X7s though that have the tapered ends (there's no hole in the end of the arrow), then you can use the old style glue in nocks (like what you named)


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

The shafts I'm using are the older X7s with the tapered ends. I'm just curious as to which size nock I should use. The sizes available are: 7/32, 1/4, 9/32, 5/16, 21/64, 11/32. If the nock size corresponds to the shaft diameter, then with the 1816 shaft, the 9/32 nock should fit, right?


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

I don't think you can use G-nocks with aluminum shafts. Well, maybe if you get an insert... Now, I could be completely wrong on this, but I'm pretty sure.

Just use the generic nocks that come with the arrow. You don't want to invest too heavily, you'll be changing arrows a lot as time goes on until you find the ones that "work" for you.

PS, your string is done and should be shipped monday. Pics should be up on my website soon.


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## hkim823 (Oct 6, 2004)

Easton since the late 90s (and probably much easier) Easton has sold X7s with Uni / Super Uni bushing pre installed. The Platiums are the same deal. X7 Cobolts have Super Swage nocks but it's still an insert nock. In fact the only Easton target shaft that doesn't take an insert nock is the Jazz.


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## oldbow (Aug 24, 2003)

J-san you are right 1816 = 9/32 nock. Be sure to twist the nock around a couple of times when you glue it on and check for straightness. When you start shooting nocks off be sure to clean the old nock off good and match the alianment with your other shafts. 

Good luck


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

The X7s I'm using were given to me by my girlfriend's father who used to shoot a lot a number of years back. Using the shaft selector chart, it was determined that a 1914 or a 2012 shaft would be ideal. However, the 1816 shaft shoots very well for me. Since they were free and I'm strapped for cash, they will do for the time being. 

Oldbow, 

I can just use the fletching glue to secure te nocks, right?


Leighton,

Great! Thanks a lot! Do I have to occasionally wax the string? Is there a special string wax I need?


Thanks a lot for your help, guys!


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

When I glued in nocks, I'd just use fletching glue.

Yes, you should wax bowstrings occasionally to keep them in good working order.


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## biblethumpncop (May 14, 2004)

Look at TSAA under their resale. Someone has a couple sets of Challenger limbs that are $95. http://www.texasarchery.org/L1/ForResale.htm


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

TSAA's a great place for finding used FITA equipment.

Speaking of TSAA, did anyone know that they have a business classifieds section? I didn't until I googled "custom recurve strings" and found it.

http://www.texasarchery.org/L1/bidnessads.htm

Just sort of an obscure piece of html. Just wanted to point that out.

-Leighton


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## Boltsmyth (Nov 16, 2002)

For glueing nocks I used to use Duco cement. Fletchtite and other fletching glues are flexible which is not good for consistancy. I've used the superglues in a pinch but they fail more often than Duco in this application.

On 1816s I used to use 1/4 inch nocks for 12 strand dacron. What you are looking for is a nock that fits the end of the arrow and fits your string so the size of your nock will also be related to the number and size of the strands in your string.


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## niceguy (May 30, 2004)

fsdiscountarchery was mentioned in an earlier reply. Stay away from them. Read the posts on FS in the general discussion forum. Will make your hair stand on end.

regards


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

What do you guys think of the Golden Key Ultra Trac rest?


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## Leighton (Aug 24, 2004)

Looks like it'll work.


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## J-san (Oct 12, 2004)

Great, thanks!


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