# The Bowmar Scandal



## Mathias (Mar 21, 2005)




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## Smoke333 (Nov 29, 2020)

Really???


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

If it smells like a turd.....probably is!


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## IClark (Feb 12, 2013)

What happened now????


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## PDavis1025 (Aug 3, 2020)

IClark said:


> What happened now????


He got in big big trouble man


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## Adam634 (Jan 2, 2013)

Bowhunting Couple Faces Charges in Nebraska’s Largest Poaching Case Ever


The famous bowhunting couple will appear in federal court, where they face a laundry list of charges.




gearjunkie.com





don’t think this new news though


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## 50bmgshooter (Mar 25, 2019)

Adam634 said:


> Bowhunting Couple Faces Charges in Nebraska’s Largest Poaching Case Ever
> 
> 
> The famous bowhunting couple will appear in federal court, where they face a laundry list of charges.
> ...


11/02/20 according to the article


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## pinwheeled (Apr 27, 2008)

29 or 30 pages on this in the bow hunter forum.


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

There’s another problem in Iowa with him not tagging a deer correctly. That was in December and he plead guilty and paid the fine. Said it was a tag he had, washed it and ordered duplicates. Then when he went muzzleloader hunting he realized he didn’t get the right tag. Who knows.


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## Adam634 (Jan 2, 2013)

Haha whatever!


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## Jcoledickson (Jan 20, 2020)

He’s one of those guys that continually give anti hunters ammo. Doesn’t really matter if the community he’s chasing has his back or not if he hurts it in the general public eye time and time again. Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t he responsible for the push from anti hunters to ban bear hunting in BC?


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## WickedPissah316 (May 11, 2018)

Give Nebraska all the nose button money


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## bmanning (May 21, 2012)

Billie said:


> There’s another problem in Iowa with him not tagging a deer correctly. That was in December and he plead guilty and paid the fine. Said it was a tag he had, washed it and ordered duplicates. Then when he went muzzleloader hunting he realized he didn’t get the right tag. Who knows.


No. He said he didn’t read his tags closely when they were issued and the late season muzzleloader wasn’t printed by the lady issuing the tags...although he paid for it. He hunted late season muzzleloader and when he was transferring tags from bag to bag realized he didn’t have the tag. He called the DNR agent and turned himself in for hunting without the proper tag. He was issued a citation and paid the fine. How many of the highly principled people on here would have turned themselves in like he did. Seems like this site is Turing into a bunch of haters.


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## WickedPissah316 (May 11, 2018)

bmanning said:


> No. He said he didn’t read his tags closely when they were issued and the late season muzzleloader wasn’t printed by the lady issuing the tags...although he paid for it. He hunted late season muzzleloader and when he was transferring tags from bag to bag realized he didn’t have the tag. He called the DNR agent and turned himself in for hunting without the proper tag. He was issued a citation and paid the fine. How many of the highly principled people on here would have turned themselves in like he did. Seems like this site is Turing into a bunch of haters.



Its the internet. Of course we hate. Its easy to do with no face to face repercussions.


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## richmeister (Dec 13, 2015)

bmanning said:


> No. He said he didn’t read his tags closely when they were issued and the late season muzzleloader wasn’t printed by the lady issuing the tags...although he paid for it. He hunted late season muzzleloader and when he was transferring tags from bag to bag realized he didn’t have the tag. He called the DNR agent and turned himself in for hunting without the proper tag. He was issued a citation and paid the fine. How many of the highly principled people on here would have turned themselves in like he did. Seems like this site is Turing into a bunch of haters.


They hate because of jealosy.
This site is FULL of bosting idiots who've posted just to start a problem.


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## samhel (Dec 31, 2010)

Jcoledickson said:


> He’s one of those guys that continually give anti hunters ammo. Doesn’t really matter if the community he’s chasing has his back or not if he hurts it in the general public eye time and time again. Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t he responsible for the push from anti hunters to ban bear hunting in BC?


It would be silly to say he is responsible for starting the push to ban bear hunting in BC. Anti hunters are pushing to ban hunting of all kinds all the time. One person doesn't cause them to start that.


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## Jcoledickson (Jan 20, 2020)

samhel said:


> It would be silly to say he is responsible for starting the push to ban bear hunting in BC. Anti hunters are pushing to ban hunting of all kinds all the time. One person doesn't cause them to start that.


Him spearing that bear and posting the video was a jumping point that led to it.


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## Blackeagle1 (Aug 19, 2014)

Mistake is an accident. Nothing accidental about most of these TV guys infractions. Too much money at risk, too much pressure. 0 integrity. Imo


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

bmanning said:


> No. He said he didn’t read his tags closely when they were issued and the late season muzzleloader wasn’t printed by the lady issuing the tags...although he paid for it. He hunted late season muzzleloader and when he was transferring tags from bag to bag realized he didn’t have the tag. He called the DNR agent and turned himself in for hunting without the proper tag. He was issued a citation and paid the fine. How many of the highly principled people on here would have turned themselves in like he did. Seems like this site is Turing into a bunch of haters.


It’s actually quite sad to see what is becoming of AT. As for the bowmars I don’t know them but enjoy the content for the most part.


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## PDavis1025 (Aug 3, 2020)

🎯Bowmar Bowhunting🎯 on Instagram


🎯Bowmar Bowhunting🎯 shared a post on Instagram. Follow their account to see 3242 posts.




www.instagram.com





this was sent to me by a buddy maybe he didn’t do what we thought. Sounds like an honest mistake, I was unaware of this before posting


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## MI1 (Apr 10, 2013)

Seems like he is honest and owned it.
Not sure what the big deal is with this guy. I see several posts on him.

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## PDavis1025 (Aug 3, 2020)

MI1 said:


> Seems like he is honest and owned it.
> Not sure what the big deal is with this guy. I see several posts on him.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


Basically what I just said was it not


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## MI1 (Apr 10, 2013)

PDavis1025 said:


> Basically what I just said was it not


Somewhat, but mine was a bit different and used a different tone.

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## jmike00 (Jan 6, 2018)

Isn't this just the same issue from a few years ago that keeps getting brought up over and over? The one where it's really more an issue with the Outfitter they used? I mean it is ultimately the responsibility of the hunter to verify the integrity of their Outfitter but I've seen several times over the years where a hunter got in trouble for the actions of the outfitter and the latter was the one punished and the hunter at max was just issued a small fine.


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## 168p&y (Nov 12, 2019)

I remember mark drury using wrong tag. Tagged a doe with iowa buck tag. Easily could of switched tags but fessed up on camera that he used his beloved iowa tag on a doe. Respect for that. If josh turned himself in I have no problem with it. The wi dnr gave a large ticket to my buddy because girl behind counter gave him first time buyer discount. He called dnr.guy on phone said no problem it happens. Gets checked by warden he doesn't like. Jerk gives him big ticket.


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## Seth234 (Sep 10, 2019)

bmanning said:


> No. He said he didn’t read his tags closely when they were issued and the late season muzzleloader wasn’t printed by the lady issuing the tags...although he paid for it. He hunted late season muzzleloader and when he was transferring tags from bag to bag realized he didn’t have the tag. He called the DNR agent and turned himself in for hunting without the proper tag. He was issued a citation and paid the fine. How many of the highly principled people on here would have turned themselves in like he did. Seems like this site is Turing into a bunch of haters.


 Dude. Stop it, just stop it. If, and only if he turned himself in, it was ONLY because of allllllll the bull$&@“ he’s gotten caught for and figured eyes were him, so he BETTER do the right thing. He’s got caught, they were breaking about every hunting law , just to get film, and now everyone knows he’s a fake ass film chaser , and if it were up to me, he would never get a hunting tag in this country again, and he would be stripped of anything he’s done in the past, and then be forgotten. A mistake is a mistake, but time and again and what they did, was not at all even close to a mistake or misunderstanding. He’s a fake ass has-been in my book, and forever more.


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## fcap60 (Jul 18, 2015)

I believe he is filing his legal response to the charges. Let's see what happens as opposed to jumping to conclusions and being overly negative.


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## MI1 (Apr 10, 2013)

I remember this guy now from reading about out him on in several posts.
Lol..
He he did a big no no.
Hopefully he learned from it and changes.


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## busanga (Jun 29, 2016)

can someone explain to me briefly, how the tag system works in USA


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

bmanning said:


> No. He said he didn’t read his tags closely when they were issued and the late season muzzleloader wasn’t printed by the lady issuing the tags...although he paid for it. He hunted late season muzzleloader and when he was transferring tags from bag to bag realized he didn’t have the tag. He called the DNR agent and turned himself in for hunting without the proper tag. He was issued a citation and paid the fine. How many of the highly principled people on here would have turned themselves in like he did. Seems like this site is Turing into a bunch of haters.


Didn’t he explain this on his video? I didn’t see the cast but read the article about it. He washed his tags and ordered duplicates, got them and went hunting. Then found that his duplicates didn’t include his ML tag. Either way, by either story, it was a mistake So he reported it. That’s commendable, and Technically, even if an honest mistake, he was guilty and paid the fine. Many of us have made similar things occur. But if I was already neck deep in charges and had lawyers involved in poaching cases that are going to tank my business, I personally would have fought it. Why wouldn’t he? He has nothing to lose at this point. He better fight his charges and win or he will be labeled a poacher from now on.


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

busanga said:


> can someone explain to me briefly, how the tag system works in USA


Ha! “Briefly”? Ok...the USA is 50 individual states. Each one has different laws regarding hunting. A “tag” is a licensing method. They differ from state to state.


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## Simplestman84 (Oct 22, 2019)

You’re right, everybody does make mistakes. Even people who take 100 yard full frontal Shots in 20+ mile an hour winds with 40 mile an hour gusts and on moving targets.


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## reddogjack (Dec 7, 2016)

guy always seemed like...
"shake his hand, count your fingers"


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## KySquid3552 (Jan 3, 2021)

Somebody needs to take over the nose button because those things are amazing and we don't need to lose them.


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## LetThemGrow (Apr 2, 2004)

conservewild said:


> It’s actually quite sad to see what is becoming of AT.


Says the newbie pot stirrer.


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

LetThemGrow said:


> Says the newbie pot stirrer.


Don’t kid yourself I’m part of the OG


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## FredBear86 (Nov 22, 2008)

Jcoledickson said:


> He’s one of those guys that continually give anti hunters ammo. Doesn’t really matter if the community he’s chasing has his back or not if he hurts it in the general public eye time and time again. Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t he responsible for the push from anti hunters to ban bear hunting in BC?


Yep. Heard they caught him doing doughnuts afterwards so they are looking at banning vehicles. Sell your oil stocks cause they are looking at banning automobiles. Josh has that kind of control.


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

conservewild said:


> Don’t kid yourself I’m part of the OG


Really? What was your name back then?


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## Jcoledickson (Jan 20, 2020)

FredBear86 said:


> Yep. Heard they caught him doing doughnuts afterwards so they are looking at banning vehicles. Sell your oil stocks cause they are looking at banning automobiles. Josh has that kind of control.











Oh no they’re gonna ban spears because josh bowmar killed a bear with a spear... yea he’s had zero effect...


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## MIbowhunter49 (Aug 5, 2010)

richmeister said:


> They hate because of jealosy.
> This site is FULL of bosting idiots who've posted just to start a problem.


I will never be jealous of conceited self-obsessed social media-driven scum like that.


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

Billie said:


> Really? What was your name back then?


No clue what your talking abt I don’t give my real name out to strangers.


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## Mdawgpound91 (Aug 24, 2019)

Seth234 said:


> Dude. Stop it, just stop it. If, and only if he turned himself in, it was ONLY because of allllllll the bull$&@“ he’s gotten caught for and figured eyes were him, so he BETTER do the right thing. He’s got caught, they were breaking about every hunting law , just to get film, and now everyone knows he’s a fake ass film chaser , and if it were up to me, he would never get a hunting tag in this country again, and he would be stripped of anything he’s done in the past, and then be forgotten. A mistake is a mistake, but time and again and what they did, was not at all even close to a mistake or misunderstanding. He’s a fake ass has-been in my book, and forever more.


Are you a millenial? It seems that may be the case since the fact that you decide from your computer that people are guilty until proven innocent.....I believe you may be jumping the gun quiet a bit. Not trying to tick you off, but come on....


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## Mdawgpound91 (Aug 24, 2019)

conservewild said:


> No clue what your talking abt I don’t give my real name out to strangers.


Hahaha you don't get it....you said you are part of the OG...except for the fact that you have only been a part of the sight for less than 2 years...that is why he is calling you a newbie....


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

Mdawgpound91 said:


> Hahaha you don't get it....you said you are part of the OG...except for the fact that you have only been a part of the sight for less than 2 years...that is why he is calling you a newbie....


Thanks for helping me understand. Really appreciate your selflessness taking time from your day for my benefit.


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## Doublea17 (Jan 30, 2017)

Haven’t read all the post on this but I heard that he just watched a Cam video on 80+ yard shots and was using Dud’s new release while podcasting with Rogan


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## ATLurker (Jan 2, 2011)

I just watched the spear kill video.

While I wouldn't have the guts to try it I don't think I would want to in the first place even if I did.


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## Pilotman25 (Mar 14, 2019)

Doublea17 said:


> Haven’t read all the post on this but I heard that he just watched a Cam video on 80+ yard shots and was using Dud’s new release while podcasting with Rogan


Thanks. I needed a good laugh on a Monday morning.


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

conservewild said:


> No clue what your talking abt I don’t give my real name out to strangers.


That good policy. But I’m not talking about your real name. Your name You use HERE. You know, because you said you are part of the “OG” right? That would mean you have been here longer than a year or two. But you knew that. 
Never mind. It doesn’t really matter anyway. It’s irrelevant in regard to how you label posters as “jealous” because they point out flaws or mistakes in a celebrity hunter you think highly of...


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

Jcoledickson said:


> View attachment 7343806
> 
> Oh no they’re gonna ban spears because josh bowmar killed a bear with a spear... yea he’s had zero effect...


That spear kill was legal, and as a hunter, he broke no law. The animal rights people ran with it, an made it news. Alberta made it into an animal rights issue. So now spear hunting is banned. The admitted that they doubt there were any bears killed with spears in the last 100 years, but now it’s illegal. I don’t blame Bomar for that, anymore than I would blame a bowhunter from getting backlash from shooting a bear with a bow.


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

Billie said:


> That good policy. But I’m not talking about your real name. Your name You use HERE. You know, because you said you are part of the “OG” right? That would mean you have been here longer than a year or two. But you knew that.
> Never mind. It doesn’t really matter anyway. It’s irrelevant in regard to how you label posters as “jealous” because they point out flaws or mistakes in a celebrity hunter you think highly of...


Thanks for the feedback


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## _Splinter_ (Sep 10, 2018)

I’ve had nothing but positive interaction with Josh (limited to social media) but something just seems off about the guy. That being said his products are nice.


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## richmeister (Dec 13, 2015)

MIbowhunter49 said:


> I will never be jealous of conceited self-obsessed social media-driven scum like that.


But you are


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## dk_ace1 (Mar 31, 2015)

_Splinter_ said:


> I’ve had nothing but positive interaction with Josh (limited to social media) but something just seems off about the guy. That being said his products are nice.


Especially that revolutionary plastic bottle he released recently...

D


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## al0885 (Jul 31, 2010)

I dont see the whole deal with spears being in humane they do massive damage immediately what am I missing?


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## al0885 (Jul 31, 2010)

I don’t bow hunt much mainly target but I would be very interested in spear hunting I realize it’s kinda off topic but I can’t think of a faster way to harvest a animal if your in the correct position


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## MIbowhunter49 (Aug 5, 2010)

richmeister said:


> But you are


Fake news.


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## Jcoledickson (Jan 20, 2020)

Billie said:


> That spear kill was legal, and as a hunter, he broke no law. The animal rights people ran with it, an made it news. Alberta made it into an animal rights issue. So now spear hunting is banned. The admitted that they doubt there were any bears killed with spears in the last 100 years, but now it’s illegal. I don’t blame Bomar for that, anymore than I would blame a bowhunter from getting backlash from shooting a bear with a bow.


I 100% support everything he did from a legal perspective. I only posted that in reply to the guy trying to be smart saying he has that kind of control. That being said, I don’t have any problem with Josh and enjoy some of his stuff but he seems to be a lightning rod for scandals that paint a bad picture for the over all sport of hunting.


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## dk_ace1 (Mar 31, 2015)

jmike00 said:


> Isn't this just the same issue from a few years ago that keeps getting brought up over and over? The one where it's really more an issue with the Outfitter they used? I mean it is ultimately the responsibility of the hunter to verify the integrity of their Outfitter but I've seen several times over the years where a hunter got in trouble for the actions of the outfitter and the latter was the one punished and the hunter at max was just issued a small fine.


The Bowmars repeatedly hunted over bait piles for several years in a state that bans baiting. They used the videos and pics of those kills to build their brand. It isn’t like they slipped up once on a technicality that their outfitter neglected to tell them about. Their vids, pics, and stories somehow always conveniently left out the bait piles, so I find it hard to believe they didn’t know it was illegal. They also consented to the guide bringing along a SUPPRESSED rifle when tracking.

Hunters should stick together. Part of that sticking together IMO is leaving no room for willful lawbreakers. It weakens our voice considerably if we make excuses for this kind of stuff.

D


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

dk_ace1 said:


> The Bowmars repeatedly hunted over bait piles for several years in a state that bans baiting. They used the videos and pics of those kills to build their brand. It isn’t like they slipped up once on a technicality that their outfitter neglected to tell them about. Their vids, pics, and stories somehow always conveniently left out the bait piles, so I find it hard to believe they didn’t know it was illegal. They also consented to the guide bringing along a SUPPRESSED rifle when tracking.
> 
> Hunters should stick together. Part of that sticking together IMO is leaving no room for willful lawbreakers. It weakens our voice considerably if we make excuses for this kind of stuff.
> 
> D


Do you know all of this to be the case or guessing/assuming?


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## dk_ace1 (Mar 31, 2015)

conservewild said:


> Do you know all of this to be the case or guessing/assuming?


It’s a published indictment by a grand jury...

They haven’t been convicted yet, but the outfitter has and is in federal prison, many of the others involved in the case have pleaded guilty, and there’s already a lot of published evidence against them. 

D


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

dk_ace1 said:


> It’s a published indictment by a grand jury...
> 
> They haven’t been convicted yet, but the outfitter has and is in federal prison, many of the others involved in the case have pleaded guilty, and there’s already a lot of published evidence against them.
> 
> D


I have not followed it just inquiring thanks for the info.


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## _Splinter_ (Sep 10, 2018)

dk_ace1 said:


> Especially that revolutionary plastic bottle he released recently...
> 
> D


Yeah I forgot about that. Bowmar stops on the evolve cams are nice though. I’m debating trying a nose button.


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## dk_ace1 (Mar 31, 2015)

_Splinter_ said:


> Yeah I forgot about that. Bowmar stops on the evolve cams are nice though. I’m debating trying a nose button.


I don’t think Josh had anything to do with those stops. The stops are “bomar” and his name and other products are “bowmar”.

I agree though. those stops are great I put them on a beast ext this year. 

D


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## vmals (Jul 24, 2018)

I saw the bear spearing video nothing wrong with it IMO. Dudley has a way more graphic bow kill on YouTube where the bear literally dies in sight on a field spewing blood from it mouth. 

Black bear hunting isn’t banned in bc but grizzly is and they did ban spearing bears and his video was ammo for it. I think some weird group from Europe got a hold of the video months after it was posted and blew it up. 

I don’t get the hate for bear spearing by other hunters. Imo we should be fighting for the right for hunters to spear bears. First they came for spears next it will be bows and arrows. 


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## MNarrow (Nov 10, 2009)

conservewild said:


> I have not followed it just inquiring thanks for the info.


You have not followed it but are the most active member on every Bowmar thread??


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## EJP1234 (Aug 10, 2014)

MNarrow said:


> You have not followed it but are the most active member on every Bowmar thread??


Hahahaha I found that hilarious myself.


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## richmeister (Dec 13, 2015)

MIbowhunter49 said:


> Fake news.


True story...saw it on the internet...


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

MNarrow said:


> You have not followed it but are the most active member on every Bowmar thread??


I like their content on you tube and heard joshs explanation of a recent tag issue I heard he was involved in the outfitter deal but don’t know many of the specifics other than what he posted online saying he has never been convicted of anything except the recent tag issue.


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## horsehands (Jul 25, 2012)

You talked about his wife loving him. If your privy to that info you must have some kinda bromance going on.


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

horsehands said:


> You talked about his wife loving him. If your privy to that info you must have some kinda bromance going on.


It seems like they get along pretty well I saw a video that was user questions they talked abt their relationship seemed pretty sincere I like to see the positive in people.


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## snipe78 (Apr 27, 2018)

Josh bowmar was definitely NOT the first person to spear a bear and post it!!! Relentless pursuit.....this guy has been doing it for years as a way of hunting!! This incident got more exposure due to his wife losing sponsorship with under armour because of the incident! Many hunters as well as athletes boycotted under armour

Sent from my SM-G950W using Archery Talk forum - Apps on Google Play


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## horsehands (Jul 25, 2012)

conservewild said:


> It seems like they get along pretty well I saw a video that was user questions they talked abt their relationship seemed pretty sincere I like to see the positive in people.


Maybe you can visit them in jail.


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## EJP1234 (Aug 10, 2014)

conservewild said:


> It seems like they get along pretty well I saw a video that was user questions they talked abt their relationship seemed pretty sincere I like to see the positive in people.


You dont find this sub topic a bit odd....?

by the way, you know why the case passed the grand jury so easily?? Their crimes are all on film, lots of them...

Super people to look up too... they even tried to sue the government over the films, because his wife drops trou to take a pee/crap in some of them while being secretly filmed while breaking the law. If they won that lawsuit, the evidence would have had to have been discarded.

When you smell dog crap so much, time to take a different path!!


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## MNarrow (Nov 10, 2009)

Dudley hahahhaahahaha

MHGA Dudley


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## ChappyHOYT (Feb 26, 2009)

Kind of reminds me of Kevin Strother. Glam hunting


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## nbardall (Oct 2, 2017)

Adam634 said:


> Bowhunting Couple Faces Charges in Nebraska’s Largest Poaching Case Ever
> 
> 
> The famous bowhunting couple will appear in federal court, where they face a laundry list of charges.
> ...


This has been going on for a while, check out the kifaru podcast with him. They go into great detail on this and you can get his opinion.


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## Adam634 (Jan 2, 2013)

nbardall said:


> This has been going on for a while, check out the kifaru podcast with him. They go into great detail on this and you can get his opinion.


Yeah I listened to that one, don’t think that podcast helped him very much, sounded like a huge goofball androgen kept going on how the fish and wildlife just wanted to stare at his wife all day


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## ADWalters (May 1, 2013)

In his defense, if I got to hunt some of the game/places he hunts and had a dime-piece ol’ lady like his I’d be a goofy sack of [email protected] too!


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## OkHunter84 (Feb 23, 2018)

Dude is a douchebag. Spearing the grizzly set hunting back and doesn't help when you're trying to get them delisted. All the rest just further proves he has some poor decision making. I know of a few different "pro" Hunter types that are garbage humans. There's a reason people say not to meet your heroes usually.


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## Noob Bow Guy (Sep 25, 2020)

Don't know the guy, have watched a few of his videos... My initial take would be he is a bit full of himself...

That said!!!!....

Understand, in a LOT of these states the systems, tagging, laws, etc are extremely difficult to manage and adhere to. I often joke with my brother that in Montana you have to have a PhD to hunt there, because every 5 feet might have a different reg.

Also understand if you haven't gotten some sort of ticket hunting, you have probably not hunted (much). I got a warning ticket the 3rd year I hunted Montana for tagging an elk wrong... And the reason I tagged it wrong was I would have gotten a ticket had I not. It was in a "sh1t show" area where a lot of people are poaching, wasting game etc, and we tagged the head not the bodies (as per the reg) because we had to hump the heads out first - and knew if someone saw us they would have reported us for wasting game. A few years later we became friends with the same game warden and he said that we were correct, we probably would have gotten jacked up - and that's why he only wrote us a warning ticket.

Finally, let me say in some level of defense, there seems to be a federal and state trend towards these far reaching game violations. Its kind of like RICO for game... In other words if you talked with the guide, even if you did not hunt with them, or knowingly do anything wrong, you get snagged up in the net. I am not sure if it is because these states and feds are looking to change laws; increase their tax coffers; or just want to look good in the more PC, liberal society we are in now - but do not doubt they are coming at you... and maybe coming for you soon.

So instead of hanging a man (and his wife) before the dust settles, let's be decent humans and let this play out. Even if this guy ends up being a ****-bag turd - HE HAS contributed a lot to the hunting community. Give him the grace of his day in court and opportunity if he is guilty to repent for his sins. He's human. Let's stop being the lynch mobs.


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## conservewild (Sep 24, 2019)

Noob Bow Guy said:


> Don't know the guy, have watched a few of his videos... My initial take would be he is a bit full of himself...
> 
> That said!!!!....
> 
> ...


Well said and I agree I have received several innocent violations without any knowledge or thought I was doing something wrong fishing south of a bridge that was unmarked but closed deep in the back country having an unplugged gun it was new and I simply didn’t check but ironically was hunting turkeys and only had two shells in the gun when checked...... I would be hung as a trash poacher if I was a celeb by AT.


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## flatwater77 (Dec 30, 2020)

Lifelong Nebraska resident here. I have no opinion on the Bowmars but I do see a lot of rationalization going on in this thread. First, there is NO ambiguity about the illegality of baiting in NE. There can be no baiting within 10 days of the opening of big game and turkey season. Hunting within 200 yards of a bait pile within 10 days of it being removed is baiting. It is pretty hard to "accidentally" bait, especially in the sandhills where you aren't hunting over a cornfield. Second, the indictments are overt, very specific, repetitive and even specify nicknames of deer that were being hunted. This means prosecutors have photos, video, or other documentation of what was going on. I read through their legal counsel's latest statements etc. and it appears that they are primarily fighting the application of the Lacey Act. That Act makes it a felony to transport game across state lines that was taken in violation of state law. Shooting deer over bait is a violation of state law. Whether or not this is an appropriate application of the Lacey Act is going to be argued in court. Seen in the best possible light - the Bowmars got duped by a crooked guide into hunting over bait. Seen in the worst possible light - the Bowmars colluded with the guide to hunt illegally over bait for the purpose of making videos/money. The government is trying to prove the latter.


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## Noob Bow Guy (Sep 25, 2020)

flatwater77 said:


> Lifelong Nebraska resident here. I have no opinion on the Bowmars but I do see a lot of rationalization going on in this thread. First, there is NO ambiguity about the illegality of baiting in NE. There can be no baiting within 10 days of the opening of big game and turkey season. Hunting within 200 yards of a bait pile within 10 days of it being removed is baiting. It is pretty hard to "accidentally" bait, especially in the sandhills where you aren't hunting over a cornfield. Second, the indictments are overt, very specific, repetitive and even specify nicknames of deer that were being hunted. This means prosecutors have photos, video, or other documentation of what was going on. I read through their legal counsel's latest statements etc. and it appears that they are primarily fighting the application of the Lacey Act. That Act makes it a felony to transport game across state lines that was taken in violation of state law. Shooting deer over bait is a violation of state law. Whether or not this is an appropriate application of the Lacey Act is going to be argued in court. Seen in the best possible light - the Bowmars got duped by a crooked guide into hunting over bait. Seen in the worst possible light - the Bowmars colluded with the guide to hunt illegally over bait for the purpose of making videos/money. The government is trying to prove the latter.


I hear you... Not arguing if the Bowmars are guilty or not... I don't know. I just asked everyone to give them their day in court and remember they are human. Whether it was "they were duped by a crooked guide" or "they got too full of themselves and fell to the pressure/lure"... I don't care. We all have bad moments and some of us really bad moments.

As to your commentary on "it is clear you can't bait or hunt over bait"... I have hunted in several states like that. In one case in Ok, I almost accidentally did exactly that - and they have very clear "can't bait" laws. In my case I was hunting with a club and was new to the lands. I moved without knowing to a position where I was calling in a turkey that was within some bait - two yahoos with the club had kept some corn out to watch a trophy deer over the off season - but it would have been considered bait. I had no clue until I walked out that way and ran across the bait it was there.

Again... remember when you hunt across states (like I do) you don't know what all the locals may have out or what things they happen to have done, that if you are there you can get charged with. Also remember with hunting you are up early and leave late - you don't always see anything other than the area around your stand in the cold light of day. Especially if you are depending on a guide. Also remember if you are hunting 3, 4, 5, 6 states in a few months, the regs can blur and I often have to depend on my local contact to keep me honest.


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## Mohican (Feb 7, 2003)

I have hunted out west quite a few times and in Wisconsin twice. I did not hunt with a guide or outfitter when out west but did in Wisconsin. You just don't pick up your bow and head west. You have to apply for tags and go over the rules thoroughly, same when with an Outiftter. Both Outfitter made sure I knew the laws, because if I didn't and got busted, they would face charges as well. I don't have a dog in this fight but if you are going out West or hunting with an Outfitter it is still your responsibility to know the laws. If an Outfitter willingly puts you in an illegal situation you should know what you are getting yourself into. Innocent until proven guilty, right, even if you do know the laws and break them.


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## Noob Bow Guy (Sep 25, 2020)

Mohican said:


> I have hunted out west quite a few times and in Wisconsin twice. I did not hunt with a guide or outfitter when out west but did in Wisconsin. You just don't pick up your bow and head west. You have to apply for tags and go over the rules thoroughly, same when with an Outiftter. Both Outfitter made sure I knew the laws, because if I didn't and got busted, they would face charges as well. I don't have a dog in this fight but if you are going out West or hunting with an Outfitter it is still your responsibility to know the laws. If an Outfitter willingly puts you in an illegal situation you should know what you are getting yourself into. Innocent until proven guilty, right, even if you do know the laws and break them.


Do you know every law for your state?? I promise you, that you don't. I am an ex LEO and can tell you even as a professional LAW ENFORCEMENT it was hard for me. We had classes on the new laws every year and still couldn't keep up.

Before you hunted out west did you know what corner jumping is? I didn't and even after reading the regs, given where I came from hunting wasn't exactly sure of the interpretations. Hell even here in my home state of NC I had to call the local wildlife officer about our sunday blue laws to make sure I was reading them correctly.

Try keeping all of them straight across 3, 4, or 5 states in a few months. I have and I often literally had to stop a hunt and go back to the truck to read the regs in a few cases.

You also are very wrong, young grasshopper... A CRAP TON of people do head out west and hunt with no planning. Some very skilled hunters I know (ex spec ops guys) did that just last year. My old PA on a lark bought an OTC Colorado tag and headed out... I have to admit, my first hunt in Montana was that way in that I totally relied on my brother (a resident).

And please tone down the attacking rhetoric. I am not on any side here. Nor am I saying its ok to break regs and laws. And you are correct according to all laws in all states IT IS YOUR responsibility to know them - but I dare say when you drive your car across state lines you don't go read their road laws? And if we put that analogy in effect, the hunting regs are often 10x more extensive than traffic laws. Plus talk to any wildlife officer, there ARE ALWAYS laws that are ambiguous and require judgement on the officers part.

All I asked in my original post and will ask again is don't crucify people. Its not our place. Don't try and convict them, that is for a jury. Don't take away a man's right to make mistakes - no matter how hideous or wrong - until YOU ARE READY to have your right to mistakes taken away. And for God's sake - let's not forget that this person has contributed to this community (maybe not AT but hunting and archery) in what appears to be a decent way. Let's let it all play out.

Everyone get off your freaking high horses... or maybe the reaper will find you


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## Smada962 (Dec 25, 2007)

Noob Bow Guy said:


> Do you know every law for your state?? I promise you, that you don't. I am an ex LEO and can tell you even as a professional LAW ENFORCEMENT it was hard for me. We had classes on the new laws every year and still couldn't keep up.
> 
> Before you hunted out west did you know what corner jumping is? I didn't and even after reading the regs, given where I came from hunting wasn't exactly sure of the interpretations. Hell even here in my home state of NC I had to call the local wildlife officer about our sunday blue laws to make sure I was reading them correctly.
> 
> ...



You sure are trying awfully hard to justify poaching and law breaking.


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## Noob Bow Guy (Sep 25, 2020)

Smada962 said:


> You sure are trying awfully hard to justify poaching and law breaking.





Smada962 said:


> You sure are trying awfully hard to justify poaching and law breaking.


Ok I give up... Clearly God(s) exist on this forum who know everything that happens...

Do you just read what you want in my post or are you just a pimply face laptop ranger who wants to poke the bear in any way?

Quite the opposite... I keep stating if he broke the law he broke the law. What I am also stating is neither you, I, or anyone else on here is GOD and knows everything that took place or contributed to it. The jury is still out. And what I am also saying is it is quite easy to break laws unknowingly - whether hunting or driving a car. There is a vast difference in the knowingly and maliciously poaching and making a mistake.

But I give, this is my last post. In my time humans were allowed to make mistakes. Sometimes we paid prices for those, sometimes grace gave us a pass. Either way we had a chance to learn and evolve - and often be forgiven. Nowadays society is zero tolerance and there are no more chances to evolve. One violation and your life ends... 

You guys (who want to convict the Bomars in this forum) want that world... Good luck with that world of zero tolerance. It is a venomous viper who will strike and and kill you one day.

Respectfully from a "law and order" type of guy.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

Noob Bow Guy said:


> Ok I give up... Clearly God(s) exist on this forum who know everything that happens...
> 
> Do you just read what you want in my post or are you just a pimply face laptop ranger who wants to poke the bear in any way?
> 
> ...


well said.

i'm not a fan of the Bomar's content, so i make it simple and don't watch their stuff (as hard as that sounds, it's really pretty easy) i don't know what they did or didn't do, or their intent. if they broke the law, i would hope it's treated like if i broke the same law(s) i'm not a fan of people getting an example made of because of their status, whatever that may be.... i like fair, and everyone treated the same.

if you put yourself out there like they do, they better play by the rules, because they are being watched more than most of us, especially when they film everything.... they need to be more careful, because a high profile person may be more of a "trophy" to law enforcement. i don't even know their charges, but i hope the outcome is fair on all sides, not over or under punished because they are high profile


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## Noob Bow Guy (Sep 25, 2020)

roosiebull said:


> well said.
> 
> i'm not a fan of the Bomar's content, so i make it simple and don't watch their stuff (as hard as that sounds, it's really pretty easy) i don't know what they did or didn't do, or their intent. if they broke the law, i would hope it's treated like if i broke the same law(s) i'm not a fan of people getting an example made of because of their status, whatever that may be.... i like fair, and everyone treated the same.
> 
> if you put yourself out there like they do, they better play by the rules, because they are being watched more than most of us, especially when they film everything.... they need to be more careful, because a high profile person may be more of a "trophy" to law enforcement. i don't even know their charges, but i hope the outcome is fair on all sides, not over or under punished because they are high profile


Thank you!

Aside from my initial impression, the only thing I have as a gripe (as of now) with the Bomars (or a lot of celebrity hunters) is the constant chase for the trophy. Don't get me wrong, I lust after them too... But I took a little pronghorn buck deer and two does this year and was just as happy. They were all my firsts with bow hunting and it was more awesome than anything else (and I have a few 130's up on the wall as well).

This constant trophy quest gives the illusion that you are only ever going to kill monsters - and it runs off a lot of people who might not hunt, but support hunting conservancy; as well as newbie hunters who get frustrated they are not seeing or killing monsters and give up.

What happened to the fun in hunting? The joy in failing to bag anything, but hunting your ass off trying? The cat and mouse satisfaction of just chasing these creatures? The reverence for the sustenance they give back to us? A lot of the hunting world has become cynical "show me the money"... For me, if the Bomars are set free or found guilty I hope they learn exactly what you say; I hope they realize that trophy hunting isn't what its about; and I hope they get back their "fun" in hunting.


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## Drjoe (Aug 8, 2005)

If you purchase a hunt in a different state, shouldn't you be able to trust the outfitter to not put you in harms way and break any laws? The outfitter is making a financial gain from the sale of the hunt. He has the land or has the permission on the land. I have never asked the outfitter if its legal to bait, what the blaze orange rules are, what broadheads are legal, etc... If there were strange rules/laws the outfitter stated them without me asking.


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## superslamsam (Nov 24, 2004)

roosiebull said:


> well said.
> 
> i'm not a fan of the Bomar's content, so i make it simple and don't watch their stuff (as hard as that sounds, it's really pretty easy) i don't know what they did or didn't do, or their intent. if they broke the law, i would hope it's treated like if i broke the same law(s) i'm not a fan of people getting an example made of because of their status, whatever that may be.... i like fair, and everyone treated the same.
> 
> if you put yourself out there like they do, they better play by the rules, because they are being watched more than most of us, especially when they film everything.... they need to be more careful, because a high profile person may be more of a "trophy" to law enforcement. i don't even know their charges, but i hope the outcome is fair on all sides, not over or under punished because they are high profile


Very well said and I agree 100%... although, I believe you might be using a little more common sense and decency than this forum can handle! Lol


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## dk_ace1 (Mar 31, 2015)

Drjoe said:


> If you purchase a hunt in a different state, shouldn't you be able to trust the outfitter to not put you in harms way and break any laws? The outfitter is making a financial gain from the sale of the hunt. He has the land or has the permission on the land. I have never asked the outfitter if its legal to bait, what the blaze orange rules are, what broadheads are legal, etc... If there were strange rules/laws the outfitter stated them without me asking.


Simply put: no. When you hunt in a different state it’s on you to learn, understand, and follow the laws there. They aren’t a mystery, they’re published and there are people who will answer any question you have in every state in advance. I wouldn’t put my reputation, finances, and hunting privileges in the hands of a random outfitter, ever. You’re the one with a lot to lose, not them. 

D


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## Noob Bow Guy (Sep 25, 2020)

dk_ace1 said:


> Simply put: no. When you hunt in a different state it’s on you to learn, understand, and follow the laws there. They aren’t a mystery, they’re published and there are people who will answer any question you have in every state in advance. I wouldn’t put my reputation, finances, and hunting privileges in the hands of a random outfitter, ever. You’re the one with a lot to lose, not them.
> 
> D


This is where I have heartburn with the wildlife legal system (nothing to do with the Bomars)... Hunting is not drug dealing or murder. Yet the Lacey Act and how the system is now applying it is making very close to that. Yes, break the law be penalized (reasonably)... But some of this is overreach.


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## Mohican (Feb 7, 2003)

Noob Bow Guy said:


> Do you know every law for your state?? I promise you, that you don't. I am an ex LEO and can tell you even as a professional LAW ENFORCEMENT it was hard for me. We had classes on the new laws every year and still couldn't keep up.
> 
> Before you hunted out west did you know what corner jumping is? I didn't and even after reading the regs, given where I came from hunting wasn't exactly sure of the interpretations. Hell even here in my home state of NC I had to call the local wildlife officer about our sunday blue laws to make sure I was reading them correctly.
> 
> ...


Didn't attack you at all, just expressing my opinion on all of this. Not a Grasshopper, Mr. Kung Fu! I respect your opinion but you sure have a way of pushing a leftist agenda. If you have questions about the section you are hunting, talk with the Game Department, that is why they are there. Just saying be prepared for the area you are hunting. Have a blessed day.


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## Rolo (Dec 16, 2002)

So...assuming the allegation is true...is there really all that much ambiguity about agreeing to have a person accompany you trailing a wounded animal while that person is carrying a firearm (whether suppressed or not) while trailing said animal? Nebraska ain't Alaska..their ain't any griz there. Not seeing the difficulty understanding this one.

To this specific case...wonder if they were given the opportunity to plead to state charges, but chose not to do that. If that's the case, using Lacey is certainly not an abuse of anything.


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## Noob Bow Guy (Sep 25, 2020)

Mohican said:


> Didn't attack you at all, just expressing my opinion on all of this. Not a Grasshopper, Mr. Kung Fu! I respect your opinion but you sure have a way of pushing a leftist agenda. If you have questions about the section you are hunting, talk with the Game Department, that is why they are there. Just saying be prepared for the area you are hunting. Have a blessed day.


BTW, I am Mr Kung Fu (well not Kung Fu) but I did enjoy the show, box and fight full contact karate at an pro/am level. In my youth of course...

If you think I am leftist than you must have been part off the crowd storming the capital... I am about as right as you can get dude... You clearly wear some mud covered glasses... Probably why you misread what I wrote.

All I have asked on her is: 1) let the man be tried by a jury (not by ArcheryTalk) 2) recognize the person has contributed (or tried) in the past in a positive way to the community 3) let the man (if guilty) do his time and have an opportunity to change/repent (with out AT hanging him). 4) and presenting the fact there are plenty of ways to commit crimes innocently. On this point, if I were still an active LEO I can promise you if I followed you around any given day of your life, I could put you in jail. 

I am still scratching my head how you view that as leftist?

Finally while i am blessed to live in a state where my wildlife enforcement takes calls, is very available and there are plenty of them... Most places I have hunted out west and in some other states - unless you are in the middle of some hunting **** show - asking questions is a bit difficult. For instance in Montana if I go into a local office, I can often get some of my questions answered - but there are not always "enforcement" officials there. Even in some of the hunting **** shows out there - getting ahold of or finding a wildlife officer is often random to very difficult. They cover such vast areas. About the only way you do is if you are in trouble or run them off the road as they are flying from one issue to another.

Hope you kill what your hunting with those glasses you have on... Good luck with that.


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## Rolo (Dec 16, 2002)

Noob Bow Guy said:


> BTW, I am Mr Kung Fu (well not Kung Fu) but I did enjoy the show, box and fight full contact karate at an pro/am level. In my youth of course...
> 
> If you think I am leftist than you must have been part off the crowd storming the capital... I am about as right as you can get dude... You clearly wear some mud covered glasses... Probably why you misread what I wrote.
> 
> ...


How does someone "innocently" violate the criminal law? They may do it without intent or knowledge, or an active mens rea, but that still ain't innocent. I've never heard the term 'innocent crime committer' used before.


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## Mohican (Feb 7, 2003)

Noob Bow Guy said:


> BTW, I am Mr Kung Fu (well not Kung Fu) but I did enjoy the show, box and fight full contact karate at an pro/am level. In my youth of course...
> 
> If you think I am leftist than you must have been part off the crowd storming the capital... I am about as right as you can get dude... You clearly wear some mud covered glasses... Probably why you misread what I wrote.
> 
> ...


No mud colored glasses, by the way I don't wear em. But the left comment comes from you trying to push your ideas on others. I just mentioned know the laws of the state, county and section of the area you are hunting, simple as that. Some laws are tougher to interpret than others that why you consult in the authorities. You are entitled to your opinion and as I said I do not have any fight in this Bowmar fight. They are innocent until proven!!!


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

al0885 said:


> I don’t bow hunt much mainly target but I would be very interested in spear hunting I realize it’s kinda off topic but I can’t think of a faster way to harvest a animal if your in the correct position


I have killed hogs with spears. Imagine a 12 inch long 4 inch wide double edged razor through you chest. It’s quick.


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

dk_ace1 said:


> The Bowmars repeatedly hunted over bait piles for several years in a state that bans baiting. They used the videos and pics of those kills to build their brand. It isn’t like they slipped up once on a technicality that their outfitter neglected to tell them about. Their vids, pics, and stories somehow always conveniently left out the bait piles, so I find it hard to believe they didn’t know it was illegal. They also consented to the guide bringing along a SUPPRESSED rifle when tracking.
> 
> Hunters should stick together. Part of that sticking together IMO is leaving no room for willful lawbreakers. It weakens our voice considerably if we make excuses for this kind of stuff.
> 
> D


Isn’t that what the court trial is about? If they did it, as charged, the evidence will be presented. You seem to know these charges are true. Are they?


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## dk_ace1 (Mar 31, 2015)

Billie said:


> Isn’t that what the court trial is about? If they did it, as charged, the evidence will be presented. You seem to know these charges are true. Are they?





dk_ace1 said:


> It’s a published indictment by a grand jury...
> 
> They haven’t been convicted yet, but the outfitter has and is in federal prison, many of the others involved in the case have pleaded guilty, and there’s already a lot of published evidence against them.
> 
> D


I hate to quote myself, but if you insist...

D


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

OkHunter84 said:


> Dude is a douchebag. Spearing the grizzly set hunting back and doesn't help when you're trying to get them delisted. All the rest just further proves he has some poor decision making. I know of a few different "pro" Hunter types that are garbage humans. There's a reason people say not to meet your heroes usually.


He didn’t spear a grizzly. It didn’t set back hunting, and black bears aren’t “listed”.


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

dk_ace1 said:


> I hate to quote myself, but if you insist...
> 
> D


I do. I asked a question. You answered. So your answer is NO. You don’t know if this is true or not. You know nothing more than everyone else here. And to be clear, I’m not defending these people. If they did this as stated and the evidence convinces the jury, then they are guilty. They should be hit across the face with the results of that. But you seemed to “know”, so I asked. If they are found not guilty, will you still think they did it?


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## dk_ace1 (Mar 31, 2015)

Billie said:


> I do. I asked a question. You answered. So your answer is NO. You don’t know if this is true or not. You know nothing more than everyone else here. And to be clear, I’m not defending these people. If they did this as stated and the evidence convinces the jury, then they are guilty. They should be hit across the face with the results of that. But you seemed to “know”, so I asked. If they are found not guilty, will you still think they did it?


I don’t know it’s true anymore than anyone else, but seeing as a grand jury saw sufficient evidence for an indictment, a jury already convicted the outfitter and he was sentenced to a federal prison, the other defendants plead guilty, and their hunts with the outfitter are well documented (by them)... yeah I think they probably did it. Seems like a reasonable conclusion... I don’t really care if that bothers you...

D


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## Billie (Jul 1, 2004)

dk_ace1 said:


> I don’t know it’s true anymore than anyone else, but seeing as a grand jury saw sufficient evidence for an indictment, a jury already convicted the outfitter and he was sentenced to a federal prison, the other defendants plead guilty, and their hunts with the outfitter are well documented (by them)... yeah I think they probably did it. Seems like a reasonable conclusion... I don’t really care if that bothers you...
> 
> D


Ha! Don’t get your hackles up. I don’t care if you don’t care! I asked you a simple question. You seem as if you DO care and it bothers you. I can assure you, I don’t. I thought you might have some insider info. You were so sure, I had to ask.


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## tiberiuswade (Feb 12, 2015)

This reminds me of the old 'Nol Feather' case, I was just getting into archery and he and Chuck adams were a wealth of information and how-to's. All his so call hunts and record buck animals were canned or taken out season. He was convicted and kinda fell of gave earth after

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk


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## bmanning (May 21, 2012)

Jcoledickson said:


> Him spearing that bear and posting the video was a jumping point that led to it.


Which is crazy. Tim Wells has been killing hundreds of animals with spears for years...he even speared himself. He's killed a grizzly with a spear and no one said a word. Bowmar threw the javelin in college...all America I believe. Now have they done some questionable things...probably...but it seems that folks just like to hate on some folks, particularly folks who kill big animals.


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