# back tension release?



## Beastmaster (Jan 20, 2009)

If you're using a Carter, then I'd recommend sticking with a Carter that's roughly the same size. Go with a Carter Evo +.

You'll end up with nearly the same anchor point. That's important.

I go back and forth between a Carter Evo + and a Just Cuz +. 

-Steve


----------



## Lee Orth (Mar 8, 2009)

I have a stan microIII and stan mag macro, as well as carter target 3 & 4 and carter revolution....I like the micro III the best....the problems encountered with the evolution and revolution are the same, as they are almost the same in mechanism....that is, they are inconsistent in their release....yes, many will jump at that and say "It Is You!".....but the responses by many shooters is the same...sometimes it goes off as soon as u release the safety...or, u can hardly get it to go off....the extremes, to be sure, but it happens regularly...people have even documented increasing pressures needed to trigger the evolution as the nite goes on....but it does make u a better shooter...cause it teaches you to hold ...hold...hold...a lot longer than u ever thought u could....by contrast, the mag macro and micro III are very consistent...not totally predictable (good) but they will fire once u rotate to a certain point.....and the stans are not as explosive as the evo/revo...which means a smoother shot...IMHO of course...


----------



## Beastmaster (Jan 20, 2009)

Lee Orth said:


> I have a stan microIII and stan mag macro, as well as carter target 3 & 4 and carter revolution....I like the micro III the best....the problems encountered with the evolution and revolution are the same, as they are almost the same in mechanism....that is, they are inconsistent in their release....yes, many will jump at that and say "It Is You!".....but the responses by many shooters is the same...sometimes it goes off as soon as u release the safety...or, u can hardly get it to go off....the extremes, to be sure, but it happens regularly...people have even documented increasing pressures needed to trigger the evolution as the nite goes on....but it does make u a better shooter...cause it teaches you to hold ...hold...hold...a lot longer than u ever thought u could....by contrast, the mag macro and micro III are very consistent...not totally predictable (good) but they will fire once u rotate to a certain point.....and the stans are not as explosive as the evo/revo...which means a smoother shot...IMHO of course...


I've been documenting my conversion to a Back Tension release (specifically, the Carter Evo +) in the forum.

The primary issue with the Evo + is basically form. I've never mentioned this before, but I have played with a homemade hooter shooter, a bunch of zip ties, two people, a stick with D-loop material, and the Evo + using a lower poundage bow.

The Evo + will trigger within a half pound of each other's shots, which is the most granular that I can get with the small force gauge meter that I was able to borrow for 2 hours. This tells me it's form and not the release. 

The secondary issue is that the Evo + really needs lube. If I don't put a drop of lube every once in a while in the gap between the hook and the release body, it will trigger horridly.

The Evo works as advertised. When it hoses up, I pin the blame on me.

-Steve


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Beastmaster said:


> I've been documenting my conversion to a Back Tension release (specifically, the Carter Evo +) in the forum.
> 
> The primary issue with the Evo + is basically form. I've never mentioned this before, but I have played with a homemade hooter shooter, a bunch of zip ties, two people, a stick with D-loop material, and the Evo + using a lower poundage bow.
> 
> ...


Hello Steve:

I agree 100%.

I have access to an indoor range (20 yards and 10 lanes wide).

So, after hours, I can spend 2-3 hrs training completely alone, per training session.

A drop of light machine oil helps.

The Evo demands precision in the shooter.

The handle angle must be absolutely the same in relation to the riser for each and every shot.

So, if we stand straight and tall,
and have a consistent leg angle,
consistent hip position,
consistent backbone angle...

then, the shoulder joints will be the same height for each shot.

Standing the same way is very important.
If a shooter leans sideways (slouches sideways),
then this sideways leaning away from the target has to be exactly the same for each shot.

Very difficult to do.

Absolutely must have the exact same facial anchor touch point.

Absolutely must keep that release side shoulder the same height above the ground. Sounds easy, but takes training to do consistently.

Absolutely must keep the release side elbow the same height above the ground. Again, sounds easy, but takes training to do consistently.


If you are chasing the x-ring on a Vegas target, with the Evo release,
then the difference between the 10-ring and the x-ring,
will be how consistently you pull back your release side elbow
or another way to say this,
is how much you rotate / swing the tip of the release side elbow
to be directly in line behind the arrow.

The goal is to line up the bones of your forearm
directly behind the arrow.

If you get your tip of release side elbow only 95% of the way
to being completely behind the arrow (in line)

and then

on some shots, you get the tip of your release side elbow only 99% of the way to being completely behind the arrow (in line)...

then,
this is the difference between the 10-ring and the x-ring.

You cannot SEE YOURSELF when training alone,
but you can FEEL the amount of stretch across the chest,
to gauge how much your forearm bones in the release arm/elbow
are in line behind the arrow or not.

YUP.

It's shooter position, when at full draw
or FORM,
when fine tuning sucess with the Evo release.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

One more thing.

Consistent finger curl around the handle.


If I use a "medium tight" finger curl on the handle of the Evo release,
then this sets a total spread distance
between the handle and my release side elbow tip.


If I use a "just barely on the finger tips curl" on the handle of the Evo release,
this INCREASES the total spread distance
between the handle and my release side elbow tip.


If I use a "TIGHT FIST" very tight curl on the handle of the Evo release,
then DECREASES the total spread distance
between the handle and my release side elbow tip.


The "total spread distance" between the handle and the tip of your release side elbow tip...

has a HUGE effect on the number of x-rings
or the number of 10-rings on the Vegas target.

This assumes a consistent wrist angle (keep it relaxed)

this assumes a consistent foot position,

this assumes a consistent hip position,


this assumes a consistent hip angle 
(say always due north)
(just point your hips the same direction for each shot)

this assumes a consistent shoulders angle 
(say always due north)
(just make sure you point your two shoulders the same way towards the target wall...open stance, closed stance, neutral stance).



So,
if the ONLY thing I am experimenting with,
is the finger curl amount,
I can change the left to right impact point on the Vegas target...
missing the x-ring left or right.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Ok.

One more thing about the Evo release,
and my discoveries.


If I am getting up down errors with the Evo release,
missing high on the x-ring, so hitting 10-ring 
or
missing low on the x-ring, so hitting the 10-ring..

high-low misses,
then I focus on the consistent release shoulder height above the ground
(keep the backbone vertical)
(keep the two shoulders level during the draw cycle to full draw)
(KEEP the release side shoulder dead still when pulling through)


then,
the high-low misses are directly related to
how much emphasis I put on the release side elbow tip.

You can force the release elbow high,
and put a distinct upward angle pull direction on the d-loop...

you can let the release elbow go "natural"
and put a "natural" upwards angle pull direction on the d-loop...

you can force the release elbow to pull back dead level
and put a "DEAD LEVEL" angle pull direction on the d-loop.


Same sight marks.
Same core body position.
No adjustments to cam lean.
No adjustments to centershot.

SAME HEAD TILT angle
frozen head/neck angle
*(if you dont freeze your neck during the draw cycle, you will get high/low hits...missing the x-ring high or missing the x-ring low)*


soooo,
the only thing I changed was the elbow tip emphasis....

this will cause high low x-ring misses.


----------



## montigre (Oct 13, 2008)

Awesome post, as usual, Alan. 

It seems to me that the body positioning with the various predictable results would hold true for whatever style release is being shot, as long as it's being shot with back tension. No? :smile:


----------



## Lee Orth (Mar 8, 2009)

With it having to be so precise, it would seem that all ......breaks loose if you vary the angles...as in, say, not shooting 20 yd indoor spots, but outdoor field, where one shoots, up down, sideways, and up to 80 yds...which I have used my revolution release for, and maybe that explains why, at times it seemingly wouldn't fire, esp up and down hills.....which is to say, that that release is not so good for outdoors?


----------



## Beastmaster (Jan 20, 2009)

Alan - excellent reply. That helps me understand things a ton more too. I appreciate it.

Lee - one of the things that I have had to do is I use the Evolution primarily for training and indoor spots that are on roughly the same plane.

I do NOT use the Evo for stuff like timed team spot competition, or 3D, or stuff where I need more precise control.

I have learned to move the whole upper body as if it was hinged at the waist. That helps a lot when shooting at odd angles.


----------



## field14 (May 21, 2002)

I did extensive testing of the Evolution + release aid, and my data clearly shows that the RELEASE MECHANISM is NOT changing from shot to shot to shot! As Nuts & Bolts posted...the SHOOTER is the thing that is changing from shot to shot to shot, but it is just easier to blame the release.

IMHO the three most critical aspects of shooting the Evo+ successfully and more consistently are as follows:

1. TO ANCHOR DRAW LENGTH: this is exceptionally critical. You can't pull "to the stops" on one shot, then HARD into the stops on the next, and then somewhere in the middle on the next shot....it is NOT the release tension that is changing...it is the SHOOTER'S tension against the wall of the cams that is changing...MOST shooters (excepting the very top echelon shooters), have a variance in their "to anchor" drawlength of 1/4" to as much as 3/4"...and that depends upon which shot in the end it is, which shot of the round it is, if they are "torqued off" because they missed, etc, etc, etc. If you vary the to anchor drawlength...YOU are varying the amount of tension YOU THINK it takes to set off the release...the fault is YOURS, you MUST be consistent every time on how you pull that bow to anchor.

2. FOOT POSITIONING (body angle). You hear a lot of talk today about "opening your stance" to emulate Jesse B and a few others....MOST shooters are already too long on drawlength (one reason their stance is more closed or nearly perpendicular to the shooting line). IF a shooter that is already a tad long (or way long) on draw length just simply opts to open their stance, then they are asking for trouble...and will start shooting all kinds of wide left arrows and spraying the target. The stance is tuned to the drawlength and the drawlength is tuned to the stance. There is a range of foot positioning a shooter can get away with....but if the DL is too long, this range really narrows down a ton.

3. HAND POSITIONING on the release and once you anchor. You cannot and must not try to rotate the evolution+ release aid like one would normally do with a trip gate release. If your to anchor DL is the same and your stance is the same, then normally the elbow positioning is also the same from shot to shot...BUT, if you let up with the first finger, or try to pull the release by squeezing with the middle and ring finger...ROTS OF RUCK....cuz you WILL struggle to get the release to fire.

Again, I'm telling you that in nearly all cases...the tension setting on the Evo+ is NOT changing....the shooter causes the problem because of their inconsistencies...that have been there all along. Yes, there have been some Evo+'s out there that had a rough edge, or the set screw MIGHT have moved...but all three of mine...NEVER MOVE unless I make them move by adjusting the set screw.

Take care of the above three...and especially getting the to-anchor draw length correct...and you will be amazed at the huge difference in how the Evo+ and you will start to mesh.

One last thing...the Carter ONLY release is a great BT release that is designed to shoot off a d-loop. The throat is a tad longer than the Evo+, the Choc Lite, and other releases, so you have to adapt your anchor for it...or shorten the d-loop about 1/8" to accommodate this change...But the Carter ONLY is crisp and clean and very comfortable in the hand. You will NOT feel any travel with it either.

field14


----------

