# Form feedback



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Would like some input on my form here. I know this video is from the back so if you need a different video I'll take one tomorrow. I know it's not the best video, but I am particularly looking at my follow through, after the shot and my bow arm wants to trail to the left (LH) shooter. My thought is if anything my arm should trail right or stay straight. Thanks in advance

https://youtu.be/kKcRFTopCp8

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

It's not your arm that's moving. It's your torso uncoiling. Watch your hips after the shot. Can't tell from the video but you might benefit from opening your stance a shade more and could even maybe use a little more loop length. Can't say for sure of course because we can't see anything in the video really.


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Huntinsker said:


> It's not your arm that's moving. It's your torso uncoiling. Watch your hips after the shot. Can't tell from the video but you might benefit from opening your stance a shade more and could even maybe use a little more loop length. Can't say for sure of course because we can't see anything in the video really.


I didn't even notice my hips. I'll open my stance a little and see what that does. I know it's not the best video to see everything. How does everything else look that you can tell from the video. Thanks so much 

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

wags1992 said:


> I didn't even notice my hips. I'll open my stance a little and see what that does. I know it's not the best video to see everything. How does everything else look that you can tell from the video. Thanks so much
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Really can't tell anything else. You might try this exercises to see if your stance is in your natural position. Draw the bow come to anchor with your eyes closed and relax your torso. Make sure you're lined up like you think you should be and draw like you're drawing to the target but before you actually draw back, close your eyes and hold at full draw a couple seconds until you settle in. Then open your eyes and see where your bow is naturally pointing. If it's not at the target and you can repeat that a couple times, move your feet to get pointed at the target naturally.


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Here is a frontal video. Let me know how this looks. Thanks in advance

https://youtu.be/AFvRivYYZIc

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

wags1992 said:


> Here is a frontal video. Let me know how this looks. Thanks in advance
> 
> https://youtu.be/AFvRivYYZIc
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Get camera phone off the chair, and all the way up to the same height as the arrow.

1) seems like top of bow hand thumb is HIGHER than your bow shoulder. Bow arm, especially forearm is pointing UPHILL from elbow to wrist, while arrow is level.
2) leaning backwards...too much weight on the right leg.
3) shoulders/collar bones are pointing way OFF to the right of where the arrow is pointed



Lean forwards, get backbone to vertical, and get two shoulders/two collarbones PARALLEL to the arrow, when at full draw. The un-coil will go away.
2)


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

wags1992 said:


> Here is a frontal video. Let me know how this looks. Thanks in advance
> 
> https://youtu.be/AFvRivYYZIc
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


You're punching that release pretty hard and if you watch your bow hand, you're anticipating and grabbing the bow before it actually fires. Watch the video in 0.25 speed and you really see it. Other than that, you're leaning back a little and it looks like your bow hand wrist is pushed forwards. You can see that the base of your thumb is not down onto the grip. The lean back and the straightened wrist could be an indication that you're trying to fit into a long DL. Probably an inch or so when you add them up.


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Huntinsker said:


> You're punching that release pretty hard and if you watch your bow hand, you're anticipating and grabbing the bow before it actually fires. Watch the video in 0.25 speed and you really see it. Other than that, you're leaning back a little and it looks like your bow hand wrist is pushed forwards. You can see that the base of your thumb is not down onto the grip. The lean back and the straightened wrist could be an indication that you're trying to fit into a long DL. Probably an inch or so when you add them up.


I will shorten the draw length 1/2" and see what that does. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Also does it look like my release elbow is too high? I am thinking part of the problem is when the bow fires my release arm swings backwards slighting causing the twist in the torso.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

wags1992 said:


> Also does it look like my release elbow is too high? I am thinking part of the problem is when the bow fires my release arm swings backwards slighting causing the twist in the torso.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Can't tell if it's too high until the shooting posture is correct. A good follow through would have your release hand snap quickly behind your right ear, just behind your head, without the hand flying wide or the arm swinging out of control. That would indicate that you're holding tension on the correct muscles in the back and that you're not anticipating the shot. Your follow through now will always be "manufactured" more or less because you're forcing off the shot and anticipating the release. You won't get an "organic" follow through until you're firing the release without so much hand in it. If you want to see a near perfect follow through every time from a shooter that shoots a thumb button check out Sarah Lopez from Columbia. Not only is she the best female compound archer in the world, she has beautiful form and follow through.


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Huntinsker said:


> Can't tell if it's too high until the shooting posture is correct. A good follow through would have your release hand snap quickly behind your right ear, just behind your head, without the hand flying wide or the arm swinging out of control. That would indicate that you're holding tension on the correct muscles in the back and that you're not anticipating the shot. Your follow through now will always be "manufactured" more or less because you're forcing off the shot and anticipating the release. You won't get an "organic" follow through until you're firing the release without so much hand in it. If you want to see a near perfect follow through every time from a shooter that shoots a thumb button check out Sarah Lopez from Columbia. Not only is she the best female compound archer in the world, she has beautiful form and follow through.


I'll check her out for sure. What all do you recommend fixing as far as posture? I know you said the do might be a little long. I feel that it is pretty close. I adjusted it 1/2 and I feel is to short. . Here's is a picture. Let me know what you think.









Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

wags1992 said:


> I'll check her out for sure. What all do you recommend fixing as far as posture? I know you said the do might be a little long. I feel that it is pretty close. I adjusted it 1/2 and I feel is to short. . Here's is a picture. Let me know what you think.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It honestly doesn't look too bad but your back shoulder is a little high. A high back shoulder is an indication of not engaging the correct muscles to hold the bow at full draw. You want to engage the mid/lower trap and the rhomboids. When done correctly, this will bring the shoulder down and back. Right now you're likely using more upper trap and maybe a little rhomboid action to hold it. This video can help you with both front and back shoulders. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJbu3GtfUro&list=PLuQaON7ehdecO82aFUzBYfHWH9lTWhDW0&index=11 

You're also still leaning back slightly. That's probably the most difficult change to make. It feels like you're standing straight now so it's hard to slide the hips back and translate the shoulders forwards because then it feels like you're leaning forwards at full draw, when you'll actually be up straight. Getting the lean out, will allow the back elbow to come down a touch. You want the elbow up a little because it gives you some leverage at full draw. When it drops low, it puts you in a weak position so you'll want to keep it just above "level" with the wrist.

Oh. Also, put an arrow on the bow. I've seen way too many accidental dry fires from people "just checking" a peep or draw length or rest timing. It's also easy enough to hit the trigger letting down so it's just best to have an arrow loaded and pointing at a target.


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Huntinsker said:


> It honestly doesn't look too bad but your back shoulder is a little high. A high back shoulder is an indication of not engaging the correct muscles to hold the bow at full draw. You want to engage the mid/lower trap and the rhomboids. When done correctly, this will bring the shoulder down and back. Right now you're likely using more upper trap and maybe a little rhomboid action to hold it. This video can help you with both front and back shoulders. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJbu3GtfUro&list=PLuQaON7ehdecO82aFUzBYfHWH9lTWhDW0&index=11
> 
> You're also still leaning back slightly. That's probably the most difficult change to make. It feels like you're standing straight now so it's hard to slide the hips back and translate the shoulders forwards because then it feels like you're leaning forwards at full draw, when you'll actually be up straight. Getting the lean out, will allow the back elbow to come down a touch. You want the elbow up a little because it gives you some leverage at full draw. When it drops low, it puts you in a weak position so you'll want to keep it just above "level" with the wrist.
> 
> Oh. Also, put an arrow on the bow. I've seen way too many accidental dry fires from people "just checking" a peep or draw length or rest timing. It's also easy enough to hit the trigger letting down so it's just best to have an arrow loaded and pointing at a target.


Thanks, I feel like this is slightly too short dl. I had to drop my head quite a bit to get my nose to touch the string. I'll work on standing straight up. I have a tough time engaging my back muscles it's hard for me to tell them to engage. I'll watch that video I hope it helps. I did notice when I draw the bow back I do kind of a over the top pull with my release arm, I switch it more of a side pull and I noticed my back muscles seem to be engaged automatically at full draw. Does this seem accurate and correct?

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

wags1992 said:


> Thanks, I feel like this is slightly too short dl. I had to drop my head quite a bit to get my nose to touch the string. I'll work on standing straight up. I have a tough time engaging my back muscles it's hard for me to tell them to engage. I'll watch that video I hope it helps. I did notice when I draw the bow back I do kind of a over the top pull with my release arm, I switch it more of a side pull and I noticed my back muscles seem to be engaged automatically at full draw. Does this seem accurate and correct?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Having to drop your head down to touch the nose is a side effect of leaning back. Your spine is angling backwards, including your neck, but the string stops a little shorter so you have to lean the head forwards to touch your nose. If you straighten the spine, leaning the whole torso forwards, you'll be straight and the string will come back to your face without having to tip the head down. 

How you draw the bow makes a huge difference in your ability to engage certain muscles. If you ever watch someone that draws with mostly their bicep, their rear elbow often times sticks way out to the side instead of coming around behind their head. They're also the people that punch themselves in the face if a loop breaks or they don't know how to draw with a hinge. That's because the arm is pulling the string at their head instead of past it. Here's another great GRIV video about back tension, what it is and how to engage the back to use it. It's not a main part of the video but if you pay attention, you'll see how to draw the bow as well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIQo0fZVIro&list=PLuQaON7ehdecO82aFUzBYfHWH9lTWhDW0&index=4


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Those are great videos. I learned a lot of how to draw. I will start to practice and implement those. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Huntinsker said:


> Having to drop your head down to touch the nose is a side effect of leaning back. Your spine is angling backwards, including your neck, but the string stops a little shorter so you have to lean the head forwards to touch your nose. If you straighten the spine, leaning the whole torso forwards, you'll be straight and the string will come back to your face without having to tip the head down.
> 
> How you draw the bow makes a huge difference in your ability to engage certain muscles. If you ever watch someone that draws with mostly their bicep, their rear elbow often times sticks way out to the side instead of coming around behind their head. They're also the people that punch themselves in the face if a loop breaks or they don't know how to draw with a hinge. That's because the arm is pulling the string at their head instead of past it. Here's another great GRIV video about back tension, what it is and how to engage the back to use it. It's not a main part of the video but if you pay attention, you'll see how to draw the bow as well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIQo0fZVIro&list=PLuQaON7ehdecO82aFUzBYfHWH9lTWhDW0&index=4


Hows this look? Trying to pay attention to not leave back and not hitch my hips.









Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

wags1992 said:


> Hows this look? Trying to pay attention to not leave back and not hitch my hips.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you are going to aim the arrow downhill, gotta lean forwards.


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

wags1992 said:


> Hows this look? Trying to pay attention to not leave back and not hitch my hips.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Better. The back shoulder looks lower but you're still putting more weight on the front foot and shifting the torso back a bit. It's hard to tell from the angle but it also looks like your stance may be a little closed to the target. (?) Can't really tell without seeing more of the feet and getting the camera back in line with the body and perpendicular. Definitely don't want to drop the bow arm for shooting down hill, especially when also leaning back slightly. With the correct posture, I think the DL looks like it'll be pretty darn close.


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

I am working on getting that bow arm up. I know this isn't there yet but I think it's getting closer. I found that if I took the ft of my hips back and engage my core it fixed my lean. Let me know what you think here. I appreciate all the help. I want to get this right.









Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

wags1992 said:


> I am working on getting that bow arm up. I know this isn't there yet but I think it's getting closer. I found that if I took the ft of my hips back and engage my core it fixed my lean. Let me know what you think here. I appreciate all the help. I want to get this right.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks good and solid. Better than 95% of shooters out there. Now practice proper execution of the release and proper body positions when shooting angles and you'll be good to go.


----------



## wags1992 (Jan 11, 2013)

Let me know what you think here. I feel it's pretty good. I am having problems with getting the release to fire, I have been squeezing my shoulders as much as I can, but it doesn't seem to fire. I have found that if I lightly apply pressure to the trigger then slowly grip harder with my pinky finger works the best. I still get that surprise shot. I'd appreciate thoughts on this as well... Thanks all your help. 

https://youtu.be/qMizdnKhddY

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


----------



## merlinron (Mar 23, 2020)

it looks to me that you have a lot of tension in your legs and your knees locked straight. relax all that and stand as if you are just standing around relaxed. let your feet set where they would in a natural relaxed stance. something else,.... previously, someone mentioned "opening your stance",....that doesn't mean spreading your feet farther apart, it means aligning your whole standing orientation to the target or line of flight of the arrow. you have a very closed stance from your draw length being too long. an "open stance" means that your body is more facing the target . this means shortening your draw slightly, which will also help introduce your rhomboid muscles into the draw and shot. the other thing is loose that big arching deliberate follow through. just let your release hand go where it wants to naturally, when the shot breaks. all the deliberate movement, starts to happen before the shot breaks and it cannot be consistent because it is not natural. basically your release hand should stay close to your face a swipe straight back along your jaw line to your ear.


----------

