# Ibo Bedford "is it just me or would you be mad"



## MR get greedy (Jul 24, 2005)

Had an incident on Saturday. Got down to the check in check out tent and a guy that I knew and shoots my class was already there waiting. They put our cards together and told us that we just needed one more person to make a group. After a short while three other people came down to the tent and turned their cards in. Little did I know but the guy that I knew was friends with them all. So the lady removed my cards and paired them up and on they went. So I continue to wait and keeps raining and over an hour goes by with no luck. I ask the lady why didn't you send me along as a 5th they needed all 40 so I know the courses wouldn't be an issue. She didn't want to send groups of 5 and hold people up. I said that wouldn't happen it's slow and dead today because of the weather. So I wait a little longer and by that time it's getting mid afternoon and pushing the time to be sent out so its go time because I doubt I'd be able to get 20 on Sunday by 1pm depending on the weather. So what's she do sends me out to shoot my last 20 by myself with an official. Needless to say I was pissed after driving 13 hrs one way I didn't come to shoot by myself. I just find it odd and funny that when you have 2 people same class 1 needs all 40 and other needs 20 more that you would split them up. It's jusy straight bull**** that he got to shoot with all his friends while I had to shoot alone. So I'm asking is it just me or would you guys be upset too. Thanks for reading and keep shooting.


----------



## 3D Pinwheeler (Jan 29, 2007)

They should've sent the official with the group of friends. Typical IBO. At least split and sent group of 3 & 2.


----------



## 3dbowmaster (Sep 16, 2005)

Yeah i noticed the same thing at another IBO. my wife got sent out with a couple kids which is fine except the fact per rules she has to shoot first every time


----------



## dottrz (Jul 27, 2013)

From MY Bedford experience, I can't/won't blame IBO. A lot of the "tent decisions" I saw were made by club officials. In some cases, such as splitting friends' groups, they were seeking to protect the event's integrity; this may or may not have been misguided, but they try. I can see where other decisions were made that diminished the efficiency, such as the OP's situation. At Pipestem, we shot a group of 5, and it was no problem. Again, a club decision, not IBO, but it improved efficiency. I can see some people are trying to fracture sanctioning groups, and blaming them for all the ills experienced at a large scale shoot. Sometimes Joe, it just ain't so........ there are well meaning volunteers in these tents, on the courses, doing the work and sometimes they are trusted to make some pretty tough calls. They don't know how things work at Gem City, or World's, or anywhere else. They know how their club rules go, and I think in some cases they incorporate those norms into their decisions. Right or wrong, they make the calls that we shooters have to abide by. They're human, they're volunteers, they're working while we are having "fun." I realize also that there is typically an IBO official in each tent who observes and makes the call, but sometimes that's not reality either. Maybe I'm the misguided one, maybe I don't fully understand the intricacies of the shoots, this is just my take on the matter based on dealing with volunteers and my own event organization experiences.


----------



## nochance (Nov 27, 2008)

3D Pinwheeler said:


> Typical IBO. At least split and sent group of 3 & 2.


I think your living in the past. Most of the bigger shoots and smnaller qualifiers I've been to, they've done a great job of breaking people up. (with the exception of cleveland indoors  )


----------



## MR get greedy (Jul 24, 2005)

How am I living in the past it just happened last weekend??!!. Are you guys reading what I wrote? Yes the busting of groups is an issue but my main gripe is that I had to shoot the last 20 targets by myself while they enjoyed the shoot as a group. That is the issue after a 600+ mile 12 hour trip


----------



## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

You have every right to be upset. I would not have had your patience. I would have been long gone.

IBO cannot fix these kind of problems given their current format. I know people like to have the options as to when they schedule their 40 targets, but IMHO that's the fatal flaw in how their tournaments are run.

The proof is in the puddin'...ASA continues to grow because its shotgun start format assures some level of organization which is lacking in IBO.

If Regions had instituted a better plan, they could have offered a realistic alternative to IBO in the upper midwest, including Pennsylvania, Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan, and Wisconsin.


----------



## schmel_me (Dec 17, 2003)

Beating a dead horse there with ibo. Zero credibility with the scores and long waits. Been that way forever.


----------



## MR get greedy (Jul 24, 2005)

I don't mean to be a dick but how can we not blame this on ibo?? Yes we all including myself know they are just volunteers but the majority of them have been volunteers for a long time. They all know the rules and they are representing the ibo so there for ibo is responsible. It was not fair that I was there almost an hour before those other guys showed up and she had our cards together because we shot the same class and for her to take my cards out and put him with his friends and leave me high and dry is wrong. These guys all knew her cause they were hugging and giving her kisses. I should've been allowed to go with all of them instead I had to shoot by myself which I could've done at home 600 miles away. Sorry for ranting guys it just really upset me. I would definitely shoot asa like you guys said but the closest one is over 10 hours and they don't even have my class anymore.


----------



## sagecreek (Jul 15, 2003)

Shotgun starts is the only way to run big national tournaments.


----------



## hoosierredneck (May 10, 2010)

Been there,done that.but not ever again


----------



## Stringster (Aug 12, 2014)

It sucks being thrown on the backburner sometimes but I guess that is how some of those shoots go. I have only been to ASA but would like to go to an IBO eventually.


----------



## V3505 (Jan 31, 2013)

I've had to shoot with an official in the past because the only other shooter at that time was my brother. The official kept score on one set of cards, I on the other. I didn't have a problem with it. What is comes down to is attitude..... would you have left the other guy to shoot by himself? Archery is a competitive and social sport, and I certainly would have felt left out, but I wouldn't get pissed that someone else had more fun than me. Kinda selfish IMO, and not an IBO problem. under the circumstances, it just plain sucks!


----------



## sagecreek (Jul 15, 2003)

Yeah, I'd chalk it up to bad weather.


----------



## tmorelli (Jul 31, 2005)

sagecreek said:


> Shotgun starts is the only way to run big national tournaments.


If there is a $1 medal on the line, it should be shotgun start. JMHO.


----------



## Huntin Hard (Aug 8, 2011)

tmorelli said:


> If there is a $1 medal on the line, it should be shotgun start. JMHO.


Agree with you! Shotgun start is the only way to go


----------



## TMax27 (Nov 7, 2006)

If it's not a shotgun start with split groups, it is just a practice round.


----------



## GreggWNY (Sep 6, 2002)

Remember, once you pay your entry fee, the IBO won't give a crap about you.


----------



## mjharp46 (May 7, 2012)

Here is my experience with busting groups and scoring. In IBO I have met a ton of great guys and when it comes to scoring guys are more willing to give you a call on an arrow because they don't want to seem like a d*ck. The guys I travel with and shoot with are going to call my arrows tougher than most of the guys I have met in IBO. It seems easy to say call it what it is, but when that arrow is 1mm away from the line and "pulling" the line, 2 guys will see it two different ways. Some guys really have no idea what outside/in scoring really looks like on these Rinehart targets. How shot up a target is can make a difference too on how an arrow ends up scoring. There have been a lot of bad scenarios when it comes to group busting...1 Adult shooting with 5 kids as an example.


----------



## Kstigall (Feb 24, 2004)

Fairly typical. That is the format that the IBO has "perfected". The IBO has chosen to be stagnant, i.e. doing things the way they've always done it. I have never understood people that don't believe you should improve a product or change to meet customer demand. Could you imagine if we were all still driving 1950's era cars? That would mean we were in Cuba.

Other than Worlds the IBO really doesn't interest me even though the IBO tournaments are MUCH more convenient for me than the ASA tournaments. I intend to shoot at least 5 ASA tournaments this year and the closest will be an 8 hour drive.


----------



## IRISH_11 (Mar 13, 2004)

Granted the IBO does not run the shoots the clubs do. However it is still an IBO sanctioned event. These kind of incidents along with the IBO's stubbornness for not listening to what the shooters want is the reason their numbers will keep declining while they ASA is having record attendance. 

A friend of mine is an IBO director and at their fall meeting he proposed having a known yardage class. He said he thought Brian Marcum was going to have a heart attack when he heard the proposal. Brian and others are against the IBO having a known distance class. 

Wake up boys. It's 2015 90% of bow hunters have rangefinders or do it the old fashioned way which s to step off distances from the base of their tree and hang indicators like a piece of survey tape tied to a clothespin and the clothespin clipped to a branch or something at a known distance. The point is that most if not all bow hunters know how far a deer is when they draw their bow back.


----------



## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

IBO is responsible for the actions of the "tent people" in as much as they are acting in the name of IBO.


----------



## MR get greedy (Jul 24, 2005)

Explain to me exactly how I'm the one being selfish?? Is it because I didn't enjoy my experience or is it that you enjoy everything you do on your own? This is not hunting or fishing we all from time to time do on our own and enjoy. This is a national tournament. No one should have to shoot on their own no matter what. I've clearly indicated that the circumstances did not indicate that. There was no reason we couldn't have had a group of 5 or 3 and 2. Everyone is always preaching on here that we need to grow the sport. Well how is that possible when you deprive someone from shootingwith and meeting new people. Now is that selfish of me to think like that or are we all selfish?


----------



## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

Me personally I think there are two acceptable ways for you and she chose a bad way to handle you. Since there could have been a 5 guy group or a 2 guy group one of those two should have been used instead of you left alone with nothing. With the 5 guy group when the three were done with their last 20 targets then the two of you could have finished the last 20 and if they were so worried about a group of two then they could have sent a official with you.

What I don't understand is if they were willing to send a official with you why couldn't they have just send the official with the two man group and then you would have had somebody to shoot with.


----------



## MR get greedy (Jul 24, 2005)

That is what should've happened because we shot the same class and the other 3 he went with shot a different class and stake.


----------



## nochance (Nov 27, 2008)

I love all the slammin by some people that have never even shot an IBO, and those that haven't in several years. Once again IBO is what we have in the North east and by all means they are not perfect. But their good enough that I'll keep going when I can.


----------



## phantom1 (Dec 14, 2004)

I've never shot either association, but from what I'm reading from guys that do, you must really love going and I respect that. I just shoot in the backyard with friends, family, or usually alone and I love that. And hunting.

I don't know anything about all the rules or traditions, but it sounds like it would be nice if IBO top leadership read this thread and respond. I would have no desire to drive the hours both groups say they are driving and then have to stand waiting to get started shooting. I will wait hours in a treestand to shoot a deer!haha! I guess you are passionate about the competition of what you do and that is obviously what motivates us to pursue our activities. I wish it could be more fun for all of you and the organizations would make it more user friendly to get more people wanting to participate.


----------



## robinofthehood (Jun 14, 2010)

MR, 
I believe I would have been rather upset myself having to wait that long and be "passed up" for a group and forced to wait even longer. You have every right to feel the way you do. I was definitely not impressed with the folks working the tent Friday. I shot all 40 Friday with Saturdays rainy forecast. When turning in my cards at the end, and I'm not joking here, there was a 4 or 5 year old girl that looked my cards over for accuracy and completion and stamped them. And who was the architect that put targets 9 & 10 together on "H" course. They should have had a beer and hotdog cart :darkbeer:there as I spent 1-1/2 hours perched on my stool waiting to take my last two shots...
I've been doing this IBO NTC thing since day one. I always enjoyed Bedford as the best run of the three. Knowing this would be might last trip to Bedford I was looking forward to a memorable shoot. I truly realize the hard work that went into putting this event together, but management dropped the ball on this one...IMHO.:***:


----------



## dottrz (Jul 27, 2013)

There has not been a single comment made that I do not agree with, or see the poster's point of view (except the one about how IBO forgets you after you pay......). I guess what I am trying to do is, sugar coat things a bit so I can try and continue to enjoy their shoots. Like KStigall noted, the closest ASA is more than a day's drive from NWPA, so it's like IBO is a bout the only game in town that is reasonably distanced from here. I know guys do it, but it certainly isn't easy. Is that reason to take a kick to the groin? Absolutely not. Voice your concerns, next year there will be at least 3 new venues, and hopefully a departure from some of these procedural faux pas......


----------



## IA Monsterbuck (Jul 18, 2006)

I've never shot a big competitive event, just local shoots and the R100. What I don't understand OP is why you would drive 6 hours by yourself to shoot 40 targets. Is it the competition and you hope to win a national event? Don't you have any 3D shoots in your area?

Not being argumentative, just trying to understand because I couldn't imagine driving 6 hours to get to a 3D shoot and definitely not without some friends coming along.

I'm not a competitive archer so for me just getting 2 or 3 friends together to shoot a local shoot is what appeals to me.


----------



## hoytxcutter (Sep 1, 2003)

There is always two sides to a story.


----------



## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

hoytxcutter said:


> There is always two sides to a story.


I wonder why nobody representing IBO or the club who worked the event has come forward to give the other side.


----------



## shanxalot (Mar 4, 2012)

I would be upset , shooting clean targets would stink for me,I like to have markers, plus I shoot as good as my group ! Good shooters great score , bad group Less than desirable! Lol


----------



## nochance (Nov 27, 2008)

I will admit i think IBO does a good job of getting the individual results up Usually by Sunday eve. Team results on the other hand ????? 4 days and counting?


----------



## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

dottrz said:


> From MY Bedford experience, I can't/won't blame IBO. A lot of the "tent decisions" I saw were made by club officials. In some cases, such as splitting friends' groups, they were seeking to protect the event's integrity; this may or may not have been misguided, but they try. I can see where other decisions were made that diminished the efficiency, such as the OP's situation. At Pipestem, we shot a group of 5, and it was no problem. Again, a club decision, not IBO, but it improved efficiency. I can see some people are trying to fracture sanctioning groups, and blaming them for all the ills experienced at a large scale shoot. Sometimes Joe, it just ain't so........ there are well meaning volunteers in these tents, on the courses, doing the work and sometimes they are trusted to make some pretty tough calls. They don't know how things work at Gem City, or World's, or anywhere else. They know how their club rules go, and I think in some cases they incorporate those norms into their decisions. Right or wrong, they make the calls that we shooters have to abide by. They're human, they're volunteers, they're working while we are having "fun." I realize also that there is typically an IBO official in each tent who observes and makes the call, but sometimes that's not reality either. Maybe I'm the misguided one, maybe I don't fully understand the intricacies of the shoots, this is just my take on the matter based on dealing with volunteers and my own event organization experiences.


If the IBO is going to put their name on this shoot, then yes, they hold the responsibility of what happens. Maybe they should run/manage the shoot, not just tie their name onto a club shoot.

The decisions should be up to the IBO, not the clubs.


----------



## MR get greedy (Jul 24, 2005)

Ttt. It's been slow lately. Would still like some input. Thanks for reading


----------



## SMshootsmathews (Feb 4, 2013)

what time did you get there that morning?


----------



## Fire Archer (Jul 23, 2008)

nochance said:


> I think your living in the past. Most of the bigger shoots and smnaller qualifiers I've been to, they've done a great job of breaking people up. (with the exception of cleveland indoors  )


Bottom line is IBO sucks. Their shoots are horribly ran. They are listed as National shoots and should be treated as such. All entries should be pre-registered and assigned shoot times. If you can't do that then go shoot a local shoot somewhere. You could easily win an IBO National tournament and would only have to shoot a few, if any, targets.


----------



## ACE430 (May 19, 2006)

I went to Nelsonville a few years ago and I also had to wait over an hour for a group to shoot with. I did not shoot with anyone in my class. At the IBO worlds it took me 8 hours to shoot my 20 target course. I can go on and on about the IBO. I will not go to another IBO National shoot again. All we have here in the northeast is IBO and that is fine but I will not travel and pay to put up with that.


----------



## glennx (Oct 7, 2006)

Bottom line is IBO sucks. Their shoots are horribly ran. They are listed as National shoots and should be treated as such. All entries should be pre-registered and assigned shoot times. If you can't do that then go shoot a local shoot somewhere. You could easily win an IBO National tournament and would only have to shoot a few, if any, targets.Fire Archer's 
How is this possible? Did you ever win a national shoot. I did and I had to shoot all the targets to do so. You make me sick with what you posted. Three time national and world IBO champion.


----------



## nochance (Nov 27, 2008)

Fire Archer said:


> Bottom line is IBO sucks. Their shoots are horribly ran. They are listed as National shoots and should be treated as such. All entries should be pre-registered and assigned shoot times. If you can't do that then go shoot a local shoot somewhere. You could easily win an IBO National tournament and would only have to shoot a few, if any, targets.


OK, sounds like another "i got my a** beat so someone must have cheated" sob story. There's been a lot of copmplaining about ASA on here lately as well. We have IBO in the NE and that what we shoot, ASA territory people shoot ASA. Shoot what works for you.


----------



## bsharkey (Apr 27, 2009)




----------



## irishhacker (Sep 4, 2011)

so.. you stay in bed to long.. and walk up to the tent expecting to be paired with others who did the same? Sounds like a YOU problem to me.. Not IBO


----------



## SMshootsmathews (Feb 4, 2013)

Fire Archer said:


> Bottom line is IBO sucks. Their shoots are horribly ran. They are listed as National shoots and should be treated as such. All entries should be pre-registered and assigned shoot times. If you can't do that then go shoot a local shoot somewhere. You could easily win an IBO National tournament and would only have to shoot a few, if any, targets.


This is absolutely the most ignorant thing ive ever seen. Maybe you should practice and actually win a tournament like the rest of us do. All the people I know what have won IBO tournaments won them fair & Square. Sorry other people shoot better than you,bud.


----------



## Fire Archer (Jul 23, 2008)

SMshootsmathews said:


> This is absolutely the most ignorant thing ive ever seen. Maybe you should practice and actually win a tournament like the rest of us do. All the people I know what have won IBO tournaments won them fair & Square. Sorry other people shoot better than you,bud.


You guys should keep your goats hidden a little better.


----------



## SMshootsmathews (Feb 4, 2013)

Goats hidden?


----------



## 3D Pinwheeler (Jan 29, 2007)

I think he's referring to Greatest Of All Time not the animal.
I know fire archer. He has won Nationals and World's. He is a great shooter. I see his point though.


----------



## Fire Archer (Jul 23, 2008)

3D Pinwheeler said:


> I think he's referring to Greatest Of All Time not the animal.
> I know fire archer. He has won Nationals and World's. He is a great shooter. I see his point though.


LOL. That is not what I was referring to at all. That would probably be Levi or a lot more people besides me. Ever heard the old saying "got your goat", meaning you get disturbed by someone's actions or comments, that is what I was referring to. This is the second year that I haven't shot 3d archery and it is mostly due to the fact that I do not agree with how IBO (or the clubs) runs their tournaments. I do not want to shell out the cash it would take to travel to the ASA's by myself. That would get expensive fast. I really enjoy shooting but the buddies always shooting together and the pencil pushing is out of control in IBO. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out who is doing it either. All you have to do is look at first two legs of the triple crown then watch some of their scores plummet in peer groups at 3rd leg and then again at the World when they don't get to choose their groups. Seems guys can't/don't shoot as well when their buddies aren't with them. I do understand that everyone has a bad day. I have had a bunch of them. But every year, its a lot of the same guys shooting lights out at Bedford and Erie then miraculously have a bad day or two at Marengo and the World.


----------



## Fire Archer (Jul 23, 2008)

By the way 3D Pinwheeler, how have you been shooting this year?


----------



## 3D Pinwheeler (Jan 29, 2007)

Been golfing. Haven't shot in two years fed up with Ibo also. Can't beat them leave them. Nice to hear from ya.


----------



## Fire Archer (Jul 23, 2008)

3D Pinwheeler said:


> Been golfing. Haven't shot in two years fed up with Ibo also. Can't beat them leave them. Nice to hear from ya.


I know quite a few guys that have hung it up because of the way things are ran. I do miss shooting but not all the B.S. that goes with it, IBO anyway. Good luck with your golfing.


----------



## NYS REP (Dec 21, 2003)

How does that song go? 
ewe ewe take the money and run!!!!!


----------



## Fire Archer (Jul 23, 2008)

NYS REP said:


> How does that song go?
> ewe ewe take the money and run!!!!!


That's exactly what the IBO and hosting clubs do. They could care less how the shoot is ran or about anyone's opinions to help make the organization better. I have seen first hand that they don't even care what the pros think as long as they get those entry fees from everyone. To (supposedly) be non-profit, they sure worry about the almighty dollar a lot. I'd be willing to pay higher entry fees if they would run their tournaments like they should be and not some backyard shoot where you just shoot with who you want to.


----------

