# At a roadblock



## savagelh (May 6, 2011)

Maybe try a different release. I always seem to shoot better while trying a new style of release. For a while anyway.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

cplora said:


> I've reached a point while shooting 5 spot where I can't break 53 X's. The last few weeks at practice I've been consistently shooting 52/53X. What is a good practice routine/ drill to help break through this.


So, most people train backwards, meaning they train and train and train ALWAYS at 20 yards, and get stuck at a plateau just like you.

So, find the distance where you can NO brainer, NO sweat, nail 300 60X.
Shoot a 60 arrow game at 19 yards. Did ya get a 300 60X, no sweat? No?
Shoot a 60 arrow game at 18 yards. Did ya get a 300 60X, no sweat? No?
Shoot a 60 arrow game at 17 yards. Did ya get a 300 60X, no sweat? No?
Shoot a 60 arrow game at 16 yards. Did ya get a 300 60X, no sweat? No?
Shoot a 60 arrow game at 15 yards. Did ya get a 300 60X, no sweat? Yes, but just BARELY. Lots of jar lickers.

K.
So, 15 yards is your TRUE skill level, for 300 60X, but just BARELY.

So, time to do a diagnostic test at 15 yards. Huh? A WHAT?

So, an expert shooter contacted me just 7 days before his tournament. Wanted to know if I could BOOST his x-count,
on the 5 spot target, in less than 7 days. He said he was an expert shooter, averaging 550+ out of 560 points on a field archery course.

I said, K. Still need you to do a diagnostic test. This is all by email, of course.
I said fire 3 fletched arrows and ONE bareshaft at a 20 yd target.

So, expert shooter says he has NEVER EVER competed with a bareshaft
and expert shooter says he has also NEVER EVER wasted his time, training with a bareshaft. Never fired a bareshaft, not even once.

I says, well, you gots to PROVE to me your skill level,
so fire 3 fletched and one bareshaft. Just humor me.

So, expert shooter fires 3 fletched and one bareshaft. Here is a photo of his diagnostic test result.
NO ELECTRICAL TAPE on the back end of the bareshaft, cuz this is an aerodynamics test,
to show me how HARD the vanes are working, to provide STEERING correction.





So, what do we have here?
Well, the expert shooter was completely FLABBERGASTED.

Point for the bareshaft hit 12-inches below the tight fletched group. ALL three fletched arrows, have the points all touching at 20 yards. NOT ONE robin-hood, however. NOT ONE busted nock, however. THIS is important.

The nock for the bareshaft for 3-inches HIGHER than the fletched arrows, so the bareshaft is angled DOWN pretty steeply.

So, this diagnostic test tells me multiple things.
I tell the expert shooter I can ABSOLUTELY boost his x-count, by email, in less than 7 days.
AND, I tell the expert shooter, that this ONE photo of his 20 yd diagnostic test, has told me EXACTLY what needs fixing.

So, after we fixed what needed fixing,
here is his 20 yd AFTER diagnostic test. A different test. I call it my STRESS TEST.

Put one fletched arrow in your quiver.
FIRE that one fletched arrow for 30 shots in a row.
WHY?
CUZ, this will tire you out physically.

Double WHY?
CUZ, you gotta walk to the target, and pull out your ONE arrow, and walk back to the target, this slows you down on PURPOSE.

Triple WHY???
Cuz, firing that ONE arrow again and again, the mental pressure goes HIGHER and HIGHER.
What pressure?
Well, the GOAL of the test is to put that ONE fletched arrow in the SAME HOLE, for 30 shots in a row!



See, I never told the expert shooter WHAT distance to do my stress test.
Newbies can pass my stress test at 2 yards. Yeah, I have students fire ONE arrow at a target just 2 yards away.
My advanced students, can pass my stress test at 6 yards.

So, expert shooter tries my STRESS test at the full 20 yards.

He stopped after ONLY 21 shots...
technically, the hole pattern is about 1.5 arrow diameters, for his 27/64ths outside diameter Gold Tip Triple arrows.
That's at least 21 busted pin nocks.

Yup, his x-count was now higher.
Yup, he won his age class as the Mid West Open.

My absolute best student (most accurate)
is also my oldest student at 70 years young.

SO, find your MAGIC training distance where you can NO BRAINER hit a 300 60X,
and then,
at your MAGIC training distance, try my diagnostic test...fire 3 fletched and ONE bareshaft.

So, we can figure out for YOU,
what needs fixin.


----------



## cplora (Jan 7, 2009)

nuts&bolts said:


> So, most people train backwards, meaning they train and train and train ALWAYS at 20 yards, and get stuck at a plateau just like you.
> 
> So, find the distance where you can NO brainer, NO sweat, nail 300 60X.
> Shoot a 60 arrow game at 19 yards. Did ya get a 300 60X, no sweat? No?
> ...


Sounds good. I'm at the range tomorrow night


----------



## cplora (Jan 7, 2009)

nuts&bolts said:


> So, most people train backwards, meaning they train and train and train ALWAYS at 20 yards, and get stuck at a plateau just like you.
> 
> So, find the distance where you can NO brainer, NO sweat, nail 300 60X.
> Shoot a 60 arrow game at 19 yards. Did ya get a 300 60X, no sweat? No?
> ...


This was 20 yards


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

cplora said:


> View attachment 7576107
> 
> View attachment 7576108
> 
> ...


TWO things to fix.
Easier thing to FIX is the VERTICAL miss issue.
Want the fletched and the bareshaft to hit at the same height of impact within 1/16th inch or LESS.
You have a cam SYNC issue...many call this a TIMING issue.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Tune your cam sync/fix your cam sync (timing) so the bareshaft hits ONE arrow diameter higher.










Put masking tape so the top edge splits the x-ring.
Then, fire at the x-ring with the bareshaft. Like this.



NAIL the x-ring.
HALF the arrow should hit above the top edge of the masking tape.
HALF the arrow should hit below the top edge of the masking tape.

Now fire at the top left corner of the masking tape...with the fletched arrow.
Same deal.
HALF the fletched arrow should hit above the top edge of the masking tape.
HALF the fletched arrow should hit below the top edge of the masking tape.

YELLOW arrow shows the height of impact for your bareshaft (centerline of bareshaft).
RED arrow shows where the height of impact NEEDS to be, for your bareshaft.

FIX this first.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

BARESHAFT is missing right just under 3-1/8th inches at 20 yards.

FIX your draw, until you can do THIS at 20 yards.



That's two fletched and one bareshaft at 20 yards.
Don't wanna fix your draw?

K.
Then, yoke tune, cam shim, shove arrow rest crooked right, until you can do this at 20 yards.



Wanna boost your x-count even HIGHER at 20 yards?
Want to hit a ONE arrow diameter group at 20 yards?

Then, fix your draw, in between module sizes...yup, that's right, learn how to tune your draw length
in 1/16ths of an inch
in 1/32nds of an inch.

BUT, how do I do that?
Tune the brace height 1/4-inch OUT of spec, and now your draw is also 1/4-inch different.
Tune the brace height 1/8th inch OUT of spec, and now your draw is also 1/8th inch different.





With bow IN SPEC, all three fletched hit the 9-ring on the 40 cm target, but bareshaft misses 7-inches LEFT.
Tweaked the brace height 1/16th inch out of spec on PURPOSE, so draw is also 1/16th inch different.

NEW bareshaft impact.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

When you dial in the horizontal miss pattern,
when you dial in the vertical miss pattern...

here is the BEFORE result for an expert shooter, who contacted me 7 days before his 5 spot tournament.
His 20 yd diagnostic test result.



This guy is at the expert level, shoots 550+ average out of 560 points on the field archery course.
He told me he averages 300 scores all the time, but has only a middling level x-count.
Wanted to know if I could boost his x-count in less than 7 days.

I said, depends on your diagnostic test results. SHoot 3 fletched and one bare.
He says, he nEVER competes with a bare and NEVER trains with a bareshaft.
SO, he did my test.

I told him I can absolutely boost his x-count, based on this test result. This photo tells me that his pRIMARY issue
is a badly tuned Blade Rest.

So, after we fixed his blade rest tuning,
he did my STRESS test.

FIRE with only one fletched arrow in the quiver.
FIRE the SINGLE fletched arrow in the quiver, for a total of 30 shots.
Yes, gotta walk back and forth to the target and pULL out the one fletched arrow.

He stopped at 21 shots in a row, with that ONE fletched arrow.
HIS new group size at 20 yards.



So, AFTER you tune your bow, after you fix the cam sync (timing), and AFTER you dial in the draw length to the 1/16th inch, AFTER you can do THIS at 20 yards...



WHEN you can do THIS at 20 yards...



NOW you are tuned. AS that famous pro shop guy loves to say...

either you is TUNED
or
you is NOT TUNED.

You is NOT tuned. Not yet.


----------



## cplora (Jan 7, 2009)

Thank you. I've followed your guide with this exact information for draw length adjustment and bareshaft tuning however I was only able to shoot about 5 yards at my house when I set this bow up. I'll get to the range again this Sunday. 

For the vertical miss...advance or ****** the cam to bring the unbleached arrow up? 

Horizontal miss...I'm guessing the draw length is still short since missing right?


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

cplora said:


> Thank you. I've followed your guide with this exact information for draw length adjustment and bareshaft tuning however I was only able to shoot about 5 yards at my house when I set this bow up. I'll get to the range again this Sunday.
> 
> For the vertical miss...advance or **** the cam to bring the unbleached arrow up?
> 
> Horizontal miss...I'm guessing the draw length is still short since missing right?


If you are RIGHT handed,
cuz you are only 3-inches off to the right,
some grip tape can do wonders. 1 layer or 2 layers of tape around the grip
might thicken the grip 1/16th inch, and that makes the brace 1/16th inch LESS and therefore,
the draw length is now 1/16th inch shorter.

So, the nock is now 1/16th inch CLOSER to the riser.
So, the IMPORTANT part is that we REALLY want to SWING your right hand side elbow COUNTER_CLOCKWISE
forwards of the back of your head.

THIS is the change we are looking for.



Bareshaft should smack side by side with fletched group.
Then, the x-count should go up.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

cplora said:


> Thank you. I've followed your guide with this exact information for draw length adjustment and bareshaft tuning however I was only able to shoot about 5 yards at my house when I set this bow up. I'll get to the range again this Sunday.
> 
> For the vertical miss...advance or **** the cam to bring the unbleached arrow up?
> 
> Horizontal miss...I'm guessing the draw length is still short since missing right?


Vertical miss pattern,
try to get bareshaft to hit just one arrow diameter higher,
might be half a twist in ONE cable end loop on the top cam.

You just have to figure if you need to ADD or remove that half twist.



Want this result...at 20 yards.


----------



## TannerL31 (11 mo ago)

cplora said:


> I've reached a point while shooting 5 spot where I can't break 53 X's. The last few weeks at practice I've been consistently shooting 52/53X. What is a good practice routine/ drill to help break through this.


Newbie question here but what exactly does 5 spot mean and also 52/53x?


----------



## hrtlnd164 (Mar 22, 2008)

TannerL31 said:


> Newbie question here but what exactly does 5 spot mean and also 52/53x?


Look a few posts up at the blue/white target face. Shot as a 60 arrow round, the entire white area scored as a 5 with the smaller X ring. Possible score of 300 with 60X’s.


----------



## TannerL31 (11 mo ago)

hrtlnd164 said:


> Look a few posts up at the blue/white target face. Shot as a 60 arrow round, the entire white area scored as a 5 with the smaller X ring. Possible score of 300 with 60X’s.


ahh ok that makes sense! Alot to lingo and terminology to learn haha still in the very beginning stages of this sport but eager to learn as much as i can quickly


----------

