# "Practice" vs. Training - Making the Leap?



## RedlegIggy (Oct 11, 2013)

I have been shooting IFAA-style field competitions for a little while now, and I have been making steady improvement. I have also come to realize that, for me, continual improvement is part of the fun...I'm active-duty military and, yeah, I'm competitive! I seem to be plateaued at the 470-480 mark (Freestyle Unlimited) for Field/Hunter and I am ready to make the commitment in time for actual training-with-a-plan. 

Also, I'm stationed in Southern England, away from local support. My nearby club is great, filled with well-intentioned advisers, but no certified coaches. Really, it is just a place to go and loose a couple of practice arrows when I can. I can shoot up to 25 yards in my backyard, and I have one medium sized target butt.

First question - what are the best training resources for someone that does not have regular access to an archery coach? Videos, internet coaching, books, etc.?

Second question - if my constraints are only about 1 hour a day to spend behind a bow, what would be the most effective training methods (shoot spots, blank bale, long distance, etc.)?

Thanks,

RI


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## fanio (Feb 1, 2011)

Where in England are you based? What is the name of your local club?


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

I don't know where to begin. There are tons of books and videos.

It's all about form. It's all about doing the same thing for each and every shot, from planting your feet through follow through.

You've peak at 470/480. So where does your shooting drop off, long distance?

Here, on AT, there is field14, ex military flyboy and he can give tips to no end. At one time Tom was a super good Field shooter. Give him a PM.


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## RedlegIggy (Oct 11, 2013)

Thanks for the replies.

Fanio - the local club is SWAC. A great group but no field coaches available.

Sonny, I'll PM Tom, many thanks.

RI


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## fanio (Feb 1, 2011)

Unfortunately there aren't (m)any field coaches in England. If your club has a compound coach you're doing pretty well! It's worth the money getting help from one of the UK pros, like Duncan Busby, Liam Grimwood or Alistair Whittingham. It will cost you about £120-150 for a half day. But that's probably the best money you'll spend on archery. Duncan is the best archer, but Liam is the better field archer. In my view Alistair is the best coach of these. You can get a lot of good info by searching for performance archery on youtube.


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

the one thing that will help the best is to work on your shot process and perfect that. without it being in as good a condition as possible, the bow can't do it's job, which is make the arrow go in the same place every time it fires all by itself. you see, the bow will do that all by itself, it is only our inconsistent input that stops it from happening.
you are correct in your assumption that it takes switching from "practice" to "training" that accomplishes the agenda. 
with that in mind, understand that you don't need to shoot at 20 or 30 or any other distance than 10 yards to work, or train on perfecting your shot process. the doesn't know how far it's shooting and doesn't care....only you do....so why not make it easy to stay on target as you train your shot process. the easier it is to stay in the x-ring, the easier your shot process will learn what it should do. when it is confident and knows it's job, it will be easier for you to keep the pin or dot in the middle at any distance because it trust itself to do what it should.
you have to understand that the difficulty of hitting a long distance shot, is the conflict your shot process has with trusting itself to do it's job and "practice" doesn't help,.... in fact it supports the exact conflict that you are trying to get rid of. "training", on the other hand, is what you need to do, training does not support flaws,....it negates them....the problem is that it is hard to do enough "training" to negate what are already learned bad habits and get the good results we want.
the sooner you switch from "practice" to "training", the better you'll shoot.....you know what to do....put the pin on the x, you don't need to practice that.


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## RedlegIggy (Oct 11, 2013)

Ron W, that is good advice. Perhaps an odd question, how long (in anyone's experience) does it usually take to groove a part of the shot (e.g. setting a new bow hand position, proper scapular motion for release)? An old Army instructor quoted about 2500 repetitions to groove something into muscle memory...

I'm wondering how much blank bale shooting everyone does? Would anyone say that it encompasses the majority of their practice time?

Thanks,

RI


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

I don't think it takes that much , but it does depend on just how ingrained the fault is. the best thing to do in countless hours of mindless shooting at a 10 yard bale, but rather , short peoiods or sessions, with full attention to the specific problem and short sessions before and after you shoot a practice round.
you could say....retepitious individual shots, aren't what does the trick, it is repetitious sessions that does the job.
your muscle memory learns fairly fast, what is harder, is getting your brain into the right attitude, to tell your muscles the right things. that's the reason for the short, but intensely focused sessions....they teach your brain to get into the right attitude quickly. your muscles will only do what your brain tells them to do, if it doesn't learn to talk to your muscles correctly, your muscles won't do what they are supposed to do. 
why this works with archery, is because, most of the muscular activity that is used in archery, is done with muscle groups that are large skeletal groups, which are more responsive to learning to "run by themselves". walking, running, throwing and catching a ball, etc., doesn't take any thought, because of the "group type" of muscles that do it for the same reason.
do you think it took you 2500 tries, to learn how to catch a ball, or get a fork to your mouth ?.


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## RedlegIggy (Oct 11, 2013)

Awesome, Thank you very much, indeed.

Knowing me and my athletic ability...it took me that long to get a fork in my mouth! Didn't make my waist any smaller, though.

Very appreciative of all the help.


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## rohpenguins (Dec 2, 2012)

great advice above. You have to have a purpose when you train. All too often people go out and shoot a 100 arrows a day for a weeks, months or years and dont improve. I would rather shoot 10 arrows with purpose that 10000 just to get in repetions. What is it that keeps you from the next level? Identify several and work to eliminate them. Its amazing how 4-5 not so great shoots in a field round can kill a score. Cut those bad shots in 1/2 and your scores will rise.


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

exactly, every arrow you shoot in "practice" should have a purpose, or a motive, attached to it....something that is a higher level than just, "shooting the bow". i'll say that every "pro level" athlete in any sport, doesn't practice, unless he or she is "working on something specific and individual" about their performance.


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## RedlegIggy (Oct 11, 2013)

Absolutely perfect advice. I've taken it a step further and broken my shot sequence down in good detail. I have 14 steps from when I set my feet on the peg until I lower the bow after the shot. Some of the steps are small (cleansing breath). Some of the steps have sub-steps (like coming up into anchor after the draw). I have to admit that I was guided by Tom Dorigatti's book _ProActive Archery_. It had some good ideas for structuring my thoughts.

I took video of my shots, with a nod to the camera at what was a "good shot, good result" (felt good and hit the bull at 20 yds). From that, I kind of grouped things into 6 points of performance that I figured out from comparing good and bad shots. They are:

A - Stance
B - Low shoulders/strong bow arm
C - Draw and alignment
D - Anchor and head position
E - Pre-tension/execution
F - Shot execution

These seemed to be the least consistent things in the shot sequence. I've selected "Group D" to work on, and in the absence of a coach, am videoing about 60-70 Blank Bale shots, concentrating on getting my anchor consistent and head in the correct (best result/feel) position.

It is really slow going, having to shoot and review video, make notes, etc. I'm sure that a coach would speed up the analysis process; any ideas on that? Any "internet coaches" that AT members would recommend?

Many thanks, RI


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## Azzurri (Mar 10, 2014)

I think up to a point of reps/arrows per end/days per week, a little more shooting is beneficial. My weekend scores took off when I added a Thursday league to my usual rotation.

I do think at a certain level of work it gets to be too much, you need to be mindful of your body. Another reason you might plateau is too much work where you're not fresh when you shoot.

I'd encourage getting a coach and implementing changes they suggest because just upping reps is eventually diminishing returns because you eventually just get as good at that way of doing things, as you can get.

I agree about purposeful practice. Lots of people talk practice scores. I am winning no plaques or medals in practice. I am not experiencing stress levels in practice. IMO in practice you want to be changing things or pressing in certain directions, and that is a step back before two steps forward process. If all you do is try to hit the center at the same distance in the same way at practice every day, it will level out and go nowhere. Keep pushing yourself and fixing and trying things.

I also think that pushing out to 30-50 yds outdoors for practice will expose issues that are hidden at 20 indoors.


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## steve morley (Dec 24, 2005)

Training really starts after your first competition, after each competition it's about evaluating your performance, identifying your weaknesses and addressing them before the next tourney. 

When I started out I kept notes on my performance and tourney info like weather, terrain scores etc, it helped with identifying what I need to work on next. When you have a Coach they're pretty much doing all this stuff for you and as you don't have one, you will just have to apply yourself a little more to move forward. 

My wife is an experienced Coach and helps check my Form a few times a month, I still video some of my practice sessions just to make sure no bad Form habits are creeping into my shot.


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

every body is a bit different about exposure and retention, to the value of good practice. just keep in mind that one deliberately perfectly shot arrow is 10 times better than an average shot. in archery, the quality of your "practice", is everything.


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