# pricing for lessons help



## michaelkronmann (Jun 5, 2011)

hi i am a level one coach becuse im 16 but i more then qualify to be a level 3 but becuse i am only level one i dont know how to price privit lesson help pls


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## Dand23 (Jan 3, 2013)

There is more than price in deciding what I would pay. I want to talk to the potential coach and make sure that they have the right attitude and patience to work with my boys. I would be looking for a well written and professional (proper spelling, grammar and layout) description of the approach the coach utilizes. How long are the lessons, and how often? What if there are questions between the lessons? Is a phone call with questions an extra charge?

At the low end, I would pay $20 per half hour for a new coach with out a track record. For an experienced coach with a record of taking kids to national level shooters, $75 or even $100 would not be out of the question if my child had the ability to reach that level.


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## michaelkronmann (Jun 5, 2011)

Thanks for the feed back and basically my idea is the lesson would be set at a hour but may go on for an extra 30 minutes and yes I am a new coach but do find my self to be very picky when it comes to form and i would have to tone that out for new b's. With saying i am new to coaching I have been coach by many great coachs and have learned good ways to explain things to kids and adults my inly problem is people still see me as a kid lol


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## subconsciously (Aug 22, 2009)

Don't wanna come come as an *****, but it takes years to become a coach. A "coach" not only deals the physical (the shot process physical training) but also the psychological and emotional aspects of the shooter. 

A good coach has- 

Knowledge of the sport
Motivation
Empathy
Excellent people and communication skills
A solid grounding in biomechanics, anatomy and physiology
Clearly defined coaching philosophy
A sound understanding of sports psychology
Experience of failure
The ability to coach at all levels
Patience, persistence and optimism
Honesty and credibility
Sound judgment
Per - US National Head Coach Kisik Lee

If you have all these qualities you are a coach. If not you are an instructor. 

Good luck. 

.02


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## michaelkronmann (Jun 5, 2011)

ok reading your list the only thing i think i would need to work on is penitence the bio-mechanics needs some work lol but i do have some knowledge from anatomy and my biotech class but i guess instructer is fine i dont care a bout titles i just love the sport and teaching people and i am insured and licensed to do it pluse i make a lil cash on the side but thanks for you .02


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## Chopayne (Mar 2, 2013)

You might not care about titles, but parents and your customers do.


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## michaelkronmann (Jun 5, 2011)

...most people i will teach dont know the difference


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## Inc. (Jul 5, 2013)

michaelkronmann said:


> ...most people i will teach dont know the difference


Funny but true , this kid has moxie


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

at your age, the best thing you could do to gain recognition and experience as a coach, is to help the interested parties for free. it's not that much time and it can easily be set up to correspond with both yours and the "students" free time. I can understand the concept of the reason you took your coaching classes, but what makes a coach a "coach" is "the experience gained in coaching that makes the coach desirable". at this point you have to develop that desirability and a few free lessons to get your name out there, is worth way more than the money you will bring in by charging as an "unknown coach".
look at it this way; it's real easy to proclaim you are a coach, and it's easy to show your Level one certificate, but your "value" as a coach is based on results that you haven't yet been able to exemplify. it is that exemplification, that justifies a charge for your services.

I commend you for wanting to make an income doing what you love doing, and no disrespect intended here, but your last statement sort of demonstrates a lack of integrity, that "subconsciously" posted about.


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## XForce Girl (Feb 14, 2008)

I have a young level one who helps me.out, he is also a level 1 due to age as he has also taken higher training but cannot be certified until he is 18.
Hes 15 now.
He works side by side with one if our older level 2 coaches at all times.
He is allowed to teach the beginner lessons and we charge $50/hr and $20/hr for bow rentals.
His take is $30 with the rest going to the shop to cover range and time.
He also works with.our NASP team in exchange for free shooting in the shop.
He is also 3 time state asa champion and helped coach 9 others to state championships this year.
He is a quiet kid and very patient and the kids admire him greatly.
He does this because he loves it and the money is just a bonus for him. I believe he would be just as happy doing it for free.


Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

it's alittle easier to justify the charge for a young coach, in a "shop setting" . everyone knows and realizes the "shops has overhead that needs to satisfied" and has less concern about the qualifications of a young person doing that coaching because he is employed by the shop, "so he must know what he is doing", or the shop wouldn't have him coach people at his young age.
that same young coach might likely be suspected as somewhat "fraudulent or illegitimate", if he were to try and get clients as a private enterprise, because there's no "outward support or confirmation of his abilities", by the shop being involved in his coaching operations.


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## XForce Girl (Feb 14, 2008)

ron w said:


> it's alittle easier to justify the charge for a young coach, in a "shop setting" . everyone knows and realizes the "shops has overhead that needs to satisfied" and has less concern about the qualifications of a young person doing that coaching because he is employed by the shop, "so he must know what he is doing", or the shop wouldn't have him coach people at his young age.
> that same young coach might likely be suspected as somewhat "fraudulent or illegitimate", if he were to try and get clients as a private enterprise, because there's no "outward support or confirmation of his abilities", by the shop being involved in his coaching operations.


Very true Ron.
There is also adult supervision at all times.
Correct me if Im wrong but arent level 1 coaches supposed to assist and have at least a level 2 present while coaching?
Level 2 must be background checked as well.
Very important when dealing with children.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2


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## X-file (Jul 7, 2012)

ron w said:


> at your age, the best thing you could do to gain recognition and experience as a coach, is to help the interested parties for free. it's not that much time and it can easily be set up to correspond with both yours and the "students" free time. I can understand the concept of the reason you took your coaching classes, but what makes a coach a "coach" is "the experience gained in coaching that makes the coach desirable". at this point you have to develop that desirability and a few free lessons to get your name out there, is worth way more than the money you will bring in by charging as an "unknown coach".
> look at it this way; it's real easy to proclaim you are a coach, and it's easy to show your Level one certificate, but your "value" as a coach is based on results that you haven't yet been able to exemplify. it is that exemplification, that justifies a charge for your services.
> 
> I commend you for wanting to make an income doing what you love doing, and no disrespect intended here, but your last statement sort of demonstrates a lack of integrity, that "subconsciously" posted about.


I agree completely. Volunteer your time to begin with. This has many good results. It gives you the chance to build a reputation as an instructor or a coach. You will gain a following that will respect when you decide to start charging. It will give you the experience of actual coaching, when the student is there to learn and not expecting immediate results because they paid for it. You will probably also see more patience from students because you are volunteering your time. Once you have a following and a reputation, you may be able to charge more and turn it into something. You could then turn the volunteer part into helping under-privileged kids or lower income families. I can see that you are driven to do something that you love, but money isn't everything. Just my opinion


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

micheal,

a couple other points that will go a long way, in gaining good view of your intended services.....

....a parent's child...isn't a "kid"...
...."yer" is spelled ....y-o-u-r.
it may seem small and insignificant to you at this time.....but's it not....at all,....in the eyes of those who are going to entrust their children to you..


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## Chopayne (Mar 2, 2013)

Ill have to agree with Ron, taking on a more professional language will help your credibility which you are lacking right now at your age. Also like he pointed out, using proper english and not text english wouldn't hurt. Nothing more laughable when adults use all those acronyms in text messages, makes them seem like a kid.


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## Inc. (Jul 5, 2013)

USAA levels 1 & 2 are "instructors " and are not classed as "coaches"
May I ask the O.P. how he is insured and licensed ?


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## Old Man Archer (Mar 31, 2009)

Just my 2 cents , I have been shooting for over 44 years and have been teaching others for more than 20 and I have never charged a dime. I have had many state champions and a Canadian national champion. I am not certified and did not hang out a shingle as some of you have to advertise. I have taught many that have gone on to become instructors. Some over the years have called me their teacher , instructor and some called me their coach to the ire of some that are certified but what I am proud of is that they all called me their friend and continue to come back and ask me to help when they need it. I have a job to be able to make a living.. Archery is a passion and I would not think about charging for lessons. Too many are certified and can't shoot themselves let alone teach others to shoot but as I said this is just my 2 cents.


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## XForce Girl (Feb 14, 2008)

Inc. said:


> USAA levels 1 & 2 are "instructors " and are not classed as "coaches"
> May I ask the O.P. how he is insured and licensed ?


This is true, level 2 are not considered coaches.
I did join USA Archery and have been through the background check and have insurance through them as well.
Once my two years as a.level 2 are up I intend to go for my level 3.
I do coach kids on a regular basis.
But only a few that are committed to their archery and want to reach higher levels.
And I do charge them, I used to do it for free before I received my certification. 

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

there is some validity in charging for lessons because there are a large group on people that believe that if a person claims to be a "coach" his or her coaching isn't worth much if he's willing to do it for free. it is kind of a grey area, where you're , "damned if you do, damned if you don't".
the problem is that as soon as people are willing to spend money for coaching, they want to see " national champions", or "state champions", or something like that in a coach's resume, and not all coach's have the opportunity to do that. it doesn't make those that can't put that on their resume, a "poor coach", by any means, but in todays "proof oriented" world, it does make it hard for a young archer to get his foot in the door, when money enters the picture.


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## Roydw3 (Jun 4, 2013)

that's my kind of man...good job sir...and thank you for your service. We need more people that are more concerned about sharing and helping rather than glory. Thanks for your character.





Old Man Archer said:


> Just my 2 cents , I have been shooting for over 44 years and have been teaching others for more than 20 and I have never charged a dime. I have had many state champions and a Canadian national champion. I am not certified and did not hang out a shingle as some of you have to advertise. I have taught many that have gone on to become instructors. Some over the years have called me their teacher , instructor and some called me their coach to the ire of some that are certified but what I am proud of is that they all called me their friend and continue to come back and ask me to help when they need it. I have a job to be able to make a living.. Archery is a passion and I would not think about charging for lessons. Too many are certified and can't shoot themselves let alone teach others to shoot but as I said this is just my 2 cents.


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## montigre (Oct 13, 2008)

Old Man Archer said:


> Just my 2 cents , I have been shooting for over 44 years and have been teaching others for more than 20 and I have never charged a dime. I have had many state champions and a Canadian national champion. I am not certified and did not hang out a shingle as some of you have to advertise. I have taught many that have gone on to become instructors. Some over the years have called me their teacher , instructor and some called me their coach to the ire of some that are certified but what I am proud of is that they all called me their friend and continue to come back and ask me to help when they need it. I have a job to be able to make a living.. Archery is a passion and I would not think about charging for lessons. Too many are certified and can't shoot themselves let alone teach others to shoot but as I said this is just my 2 cents.


^^^This...^^^ Very well stated, Old Man!!


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## subconsciously (Aug 22, 2009)

The logic behind certification is not to charge people for your services, it is to be able to be on the same page when it comes to teaching kids. USA Archery has a great JOAD program which gets thousands of kids shooting. Wanna help. Get your Instructors Certification. Archery is hands on. I would be wary of a "coach" with out credintials. Its one thing to read a book to learn the lingo. Its another to be able to apply your hands on knowledge from experience. As for me, I have never charged anybody a dime for my services. I have had then try to pay me and I refuse. Does that mean I will not ever charge. Definitely not. If I am going to have to spend my time with an adult who is trying to get ontop and pick my brain and use my time for his personal gain - I probably will. Kids- no charge.


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## Moebow (Jul 8, 2010)

I support nearly EVERYTHING subconsciously said!! I to NEVER charge, but I'm retired and really don't need or want the hassle of charging and the incumbent paperwork.

Where I disagree ( and it is MY problem -- I know) is that JOAD is a great concept BUT there is NO support from USA Archery for the program. In the 6 years I've been trying to resurrect our local JOAD, I have gotten exactly 0 (ZERO) responses to questions asked of the JOAD coordinator -- NOT ONE!!! I have the JOAD handbook (4 year old version and haven't pursued even finding if there is a newer version) but I teach archery and refuse to become a "club book keeper/secretary/etc.!!"

I'll just "fumble on" and teach the kids to shoot. END RANT. Sorry for the slight hijack.

Arne


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## subconsciously (Aug 22, 2009)

I can somewhat understand Moebow. I was going to have a level 2 class and USA's third party book handler is out of stock. Many time gettting questions answered is not easy. My Level 2 was supposed to be posted on their website - never happened. The South Texas JOAD in victoria Tx has been a vital player in our area and has sent several kids to World Competiton. We had our first meeting last nite for our local JOAD - Third Coast Archers. We had 15 kids show up. Our problem at the moment is possibly getting too big too fast. We need the money for equipment. We have been at it for several weeks now, but is has been a slow go.

.02


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## Moebow (Jul 8, 2010)

sub...,

I did a L2 class last month and had no problem getting it listed OR getting packages. After the class, I sent an email to USAA to "critique" the materials. Nothing really big but very irritating -- test questions were really mixed up between the instructor's key and the student tests. Got a reply on that, that they would "check into it." Maybe they are???? and hence the packages are being re-worked? We can only wish. If you'd like a copy of the "critique," PM me your email and I'll send it out to you.

Arne


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## michaelkronmann (Jun 5, 2011)

OK so first it has been a while from read this thread ( school got in the way) . But first i want to apolagize for my vocabulary on AT buti would never use txting acranimes for a formal paper or flyer or something of that nature. The reason i do use it on AT and forms like this is i have a hand righting disability that correlates whit late childhood motor skill development so txting make it less frustration to type when i use acronyms. i have mostly over come this but my handwriting and typying is less then dysirable so agian i am sorry for that. second yes i under stand parents want a trust worthy person teaching their kids and yes i would torecntly i have gotten a job else were and have helpout couple kids and a few adults whit setups and made a couple string sets for them. I have deciede to give up on coaching because mostly ehat all of u have siad and that I do not think i should teach what i don't do myself ,it seems superficial. but thanks any ways ill try agian in a few years when i can call my self a coach and own my own shop hahh well tanks for the advice every one


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