# Hoyt Archery 2019 Rumors????



## Hunter4christ75 (Sep 12, 2013)

Anyone heard anything????

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## Olink (Jan 10, 2003)

The only rumor that I really want to hear about Hoyt is that they are dumping the hybrid cam (Cam and 1/2).


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Think "short"...:zip:


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Think "short"...:zip:


*facepalm*

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## JPR79 (May 18, 2010)

Olink said:


> The only rumor that I really want to hear about Hoyt is that they are dumping the hybrid cam (Cam and 1/2).


I wonder if they will totally dump it though. This seems to be the norm nowdays... a few years ago you would not see PSE without a hybrid (or a single cam) in the lineup, and Mathews did the same. Well technically PSE still has hybrids just not the flagships. I guess it's ok that Bowtech still has a few binaries to choose from?

It definitely keeps the techs on our toes and constantly researching.


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## rmscustom (Mar 7, 2011)

Bold new graphics, designer camouflage, 325ibo with a 6” brace and another $100 to msrp. 
But don’t forget about thier new $950 budget Bow. Lol


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## whack n stack (Dec 23, 2007)

rmscustom said:


> Bold new graphics, designer camouflage, 325ibo with a 6” brace and another $100 to msrp.
> But don’t forget about thier new $950 budget Bow. Lol


Yup, and space aged cast magnesium riser!! All that for $899!!! 🤪


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## Luv2shoot3D (Feb 4, 2013)

rmscustom said:


> Bold new graphics, designer camouflage, 325ibo with a 6” brace and another $100 to msrp.
> But don’t forget about thier new $950 budget Bow. Lol


And take 6 months to get in if you order it


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Wow, tough crowd! 

I've heard no rumors but I'll be curious to see if they deviate from the time-proven target platform of the Prevail and migrate more toward the Pro Force design. I've still been a non-parallel spiral cam devotee, but the Pro Force seems to be the ticket.

Love to see a 37-38" Pro Force with the new cam system and a 34-35" Turbo. 

Personally, I hope they never go to the slaved 2-cam/binary cam system. I'm a hybrid fan.


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## tmead (May 10, 2010)

Hoyt has a promo video on Facebook for a 2019 Nitrux


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## tmead (May 10, 2010)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nv1QRcMU9hU#menu


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## Mudpup2 (May 31, 2018)

Rumor is that there will be a shiny Mt. Ops sticker on the bottom of the flat billed hats and you won't be able to remove it.


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## cowdocdvm (Apr 24, 2011)

How is the pro force a deviation from Hoyt’s past? A 35 ata Target colored hunting bow with the flagship hunting bows cams....oh and don’t forget the shot through riser for cool factor. Every year there is a sprial cam option(prevail pro comp ultra elite etc) the same long ata platform with gtx cams and a proforce hyperedge pro edge etc


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## sambone (Mar 12, 2014)

I know Hoyt has done a good job marketing bows by sponsoring hunters.. Every year I want to buy one. Then I don't because other companies are making better bows. IMHO


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## jmike00 (Jan 6, 2018)

whack n stack said:


> Yup, and space aged cast magnesium riser!! All that for $899!!! ��


Where's this cast magnesium riser talk coming from? I thought it was pretty common knowledge when it was teased the bow was a Powermax riser.

Edit: As far as rumors go, I was at a shop not in my area a month or so ago and one of the techs pointed out the carbon riser really hasn't changed much since the Spyder. It's all been minor improvements rather than major upgrades. He said the grip size and location is going to be changing making the carbon having it's own exclusive grip. He also said they'll be increasing the length of the quad flex limbs and giving the pocket more of an angle allowing for more preload. It smelled like complete BS to me, especially since I've not seen anything closely related to what he said but a rumor is a rumor.


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## brendan's dad (Feb 21, 2013)

I hear they are offering a 6.5% interest rates on their flagship bows next year


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## OH_lungbuster (Sep 15, 2013)

brendan's dad said:


> I hear they are offering a 6.5% interest rates on their flagship bows next year


 60 or 72 months financing?


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## KMiha (Jan 8, 2015)

brendan's dad said:


> I hear they are offering a 6.5% interest rates on their flagship bows next year


Funny thing about this, unless they took them down, Lancaster Archery had signs from a bank that was would finance a purchase if the buyer chose, and got approved I would imagine. I guess with some target bows and carbon bows being $1500+, add all the top accessories, and it’s not too far fetched to finance a $2500-$3000 purchase lol


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## spyderGelement (Apr 15, 2013)

you probably shouldn't be buying anything in archery if you have to finance. For a crowd thats mainly conservative, people are awfully liberal with their money when it comes to bows.


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## 1/2 Bubble Off (Dec 29, 2016)

tmead said:


> Hoyt has a promo video on Facebook for a 2019 Nitrux
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I shot the Nitrux last night... very smooth draw, decent speed but a bit of hand shock on the shot. (I think a decent vibration damper/stab could improve the feel quite a bit)



jmike00 said:


> Where's this cast magnesium riser talk coming from? I thought it was pretty common knowledge when it was teased the bow was a Powermax riser.
> 
> Edit: As far as rumors go, I was at a shop not in my area a month or so ago and one of the techs pointed out the carbon riser really hasn't changed much since the Spyder. It's all been minor improvements rather than major upgrades. He said the grip size and location is going to be changing making the carbon having it's own exclusive grip. He also said they'll be increasing the length of the quad flex limbs and giving the pocket more of an angle allowing for more preload. It smelled like complete BS to me, especially since I've not seen anything closely related to what he said but a rumor is a rumor.


The riser looks exactly like the Powermax but the cams and limbs are totally different.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Ingo said:


> *facepalm*
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


I know right? :sad:


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

THE ELKMAN said:


> I know right? :sad:


I think people are missing the boat on Hoyt THIS year. I really like the new Double XL, RX-1 Ultra, and Hyperforce. I don't understand some of the metrics guys are using to compare bows anymore. I know those bows hold really nice for me and that's what I care most about. So does the Realm X and Elite Ritual. Really hard to get a bad bow right now. If someone gave me $2k to setup a new hunting rig I would probably pick an RX-1 Ultra. 

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## The Old Guy (Mar 28, 2017)

Whatever they release it will be $1600. If it’s a truly great bow, I will look at it. It will have to be a lot better than what I am shooting now to get me to bite. My current Hoyt is a Mathews......


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Ingo said:


> I think people are missing the boat on Hoyt THIS year. I really like the new Double XL, RX-1 Ultra, and Hyperforce. I don't understand some of the metrics guys are using to compare bows anymore. I know those bows hold really nice for me and that's what I care most about. So does the Realm X and Elite Ritual. Really hard to get a bad bow right now. If someone gave me $2k to setup a new hunting rig I would probably pick an RX-1 Ultra.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


The RX1 Ultra is the best hunting bow Hoyt has ever produced.


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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

I've been a Hoyt shooter for along time and have owned a bunch of them . They need to do something different the rx1 I bought this yr. was a turd in the speed dept. it was 20 fps off Ibo ! They need a new design really quick there sales are way down ! I sold the rx1 and purchased a bowtech realm x which was 18-20 fps faster than the rx1 at the same exact specs . I hope they get it together before its to late !


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## Whaack (Apr 2, 2006)

I like the "idea" of a Hoyt carbon bow, until I shot the Ultra and looked at the price. Can't even begin to justify the cost. I'm not even a gun hunter but for $1600 I'd go buy a semi-custom rifle for that kind of dough.


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## rmscustom (Mar 7, 2011)

THE ELKMAN said:


> The RX1 Ultra is the best hunting bow Hoyt has ever produced.


It’s very nice. Slow but very nice.


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## brendan's dad (Feb 21, 2013)

I think the problem with the RX1 is finding the extra $400 to $500 value over other flagship bows. 3.9 lbs killed the "Carbon" advantage as the average of the other Flagship bows was between 4.2 and 4.4. So in most cases that is less than 1/2 a pound which is equivalent to running a heavy front stab, a back bar, or even a 6 to 7 arrow quiver.

But..... the Hoyt name carries a certain amount of perceived value.... I think this year Hoyt perceived too much value in their company name!


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## horsehands (Jul 25, 2012)

Olink said:


> The only rumor that I really want to hear about Hoyt is that they are dumping the hybrid cam (Cam and 1/2).


Yeah, they need to catch up and buy a boat load of the cookie-cutter cams that some of the other companies use. lol


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## Corinth Hunter (May 6, 2009)

Doebuster said:


> I've been a Hoyt shooter for along time and have owned a bunch of them . They need to do something different the rx1 I bought this yr. was a turd in the speed dept. it was 20 fps off Ibo ! They need a new design really quick there sales are way down ! I sold the rx1 and purchased a bowtech realm x which was 18-20 fps faster than the rx1 at the same exact specs . I hope they get it together before its to late !


Yeah, I sold my Hoyt Spyder and went with a Bowtech couple years ago as well. Like it better and plan to keep it for many years to come.


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## NCAVI8TOR (Oct 5, 2003)

Doebuster said:


> I've been a Hoyt shooter for along time and have owned a bunch of them . They need to do something different the rx1 I bought this yr. was a turd in the speed dept. it was 20 fps off Ibo ! They need a new design really quick there sales are way down ! I sold the rx1 and purchased a bowtech realm x which was 18-20 fps faster than the rx1 at the same exact specs . I hope they get it together before its to late !


Was the Realm X in Comfort or Performance? If it was in Performance then a better comparison would be with the RX-1 Turbo. I have both bows and I would disagree with your evaluation.

NC

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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

The realm x was in comfort setting . i know its hard to believe but im not the only one with a really slooooow one. Check out the 2018 outdoor life test the rx1 they tested was over 20fps off also. Im not bashing the facts are well the facts . my bow was timed and tuned to perfection but it was way off on speed . the realm x was the exact same specs in comfort .


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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

U can disagree all u want for 1500$$$ those rx1 s should at least be close in speed .the shop i buy from tested all the new flagship bows at the same specs and it was the slowest out of the bunch .its the slowest 6 inch brace hgt. Bow on the planet .


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## NCAVI8TOR (Oct 5, 2003)

No need to get upset. My Turbo is 8 fps faster than my Realm X in Performance with everything being the same. Although I give no credence to a magazine bow review, I have heard that the standard RX-1s are shooting below IBO by a FEW fps in rare instances. However, 18-20fps is extreme and I would be disappointed too. 

NC

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## VanBalls (Apr 10, 2014)

I appreciate all of the promotion Hoyt put into the RX-1, because it made it possible for me to buy a Carbon Defiant for $600.


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## fatboy111 (Mar 5, 2003)

NCAVI8TOR said:


> No need to get upset. My Turbo is 8 fps faster than my Realm X in Performance with everything being the same. Although I give no credence to a magazine bow review, I have heard that the standard RX-1s are shooting below IBO by a FEW fps, but 18-20fps is extreme and I would be disappointed too.
> 
> NC
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk


Speed does not kill.... you’ll only miss faster.&#55357;&#56841;


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## NCAVI8TOR (Oct 5, 2003)

fatboy111 said:


> Speed does not kill.... you’ll only miss faster.


Very true! I am by no means concerned with speed, but the 18-20fps difference as stated with both bows and arrow being exactly the same is an outlier that doesn't pass the sniff test. 

I tune for 270-280fps with all of my hunting setups. 

Even though I am enjoying the Realm X, the Hoyt RX-1 Turbo holds and shoots better to me. Everybody is different! 

NC

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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Doebuster said:


> I've been a Hoyt shooter for along time and have owned a bunch of them . They need to do something different the rx1 I bought this yr. was a turd in the speed dept. it was 20 fps off Ibo ! They need a new design really quick there sales are way down ! I sold the rx1 and purchased a bowtech realm x which was 18-20 fps faster than the rx1 at the same exact specs . I hope they get it together before its to late !


Bull $h!t- ^^^


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Doebuster said:


> U can disagree all u want for 1500$$$ those rx1 s should at least be close in speed .the shop i buy from tested all the new flagship bows at the same specs and it was the slowest out of the bunch .its the slowest 6 inch brace hgt. Bow on the planet .


I've set up about 20 of em, and every single one has met or exceeded IBO. Troll on. Love the Realm X though, by far the second best bow of 2018, and the best bow Bowtech has ever produced.


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## NCAVI8TOR (Oct 5, 2003)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Bull $h!t- ^^^


I didn't want to say it but, yea I agree! 

NC

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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

I love hoyts as i said earlier. I wa shocked by the numbers .none of them are hitting 340 . a friend had one and it was 4-6 fps slower than his carbon defiant at the same specs .thats a 7 inch brace on the defiant versus a 6 on the rx1 .im not upset about anything .im really happy i got rid of it when i did. I love my realm x .i just didnt want to loose a bunch of money on the hoyt before the word got out. Good luck with ur hoyts.


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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

The shop i buy from has not had any of them close to ibo no need to be upset about . i know u have hoyt logo toilet paper. It is what it is. Check out the outdoor life bow test . theres was a turd to ! I guessthats the only 2 (mine) and theres that were way off . lol


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Yes. You are correct. Yours is the only one that is off.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

I heard a rumor that they were going to cut back on the number of prostaff they had ...less shilling. But i dont believe it.


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## norsemen (Feb 22, 2011)

My friend bought the RX-1 Ultra and an RX-1 Turbo (he's got money to throw away). I have a Realm X. He shoots a 30 inch DL and I'm a 27.5" DL. He shoots 73 lbs. of weight and I shoot 59.5 lbs. draw weight. We cannot compare his bow speeds to mine but he is shooting a lot faster of course. But when we throw arrows through the chrono, his bows come up about 8 fps slower than IBO (which is very surprising for Hoyt) and my Realm X comes up 2 fps slower than IBO. With that said, I'm also calling bull to the guy that says his Realm X is 18 to 20 fps faster than the RX-1.


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## tek (Feb 1, 2005)

I have never ever seen a Hoyt come in even close to 20 fps slow....sorry but that is way too much to believe.


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## ShootnBlind (Sep 28, 2017)

I don't know whats up with all the speed talk but my RX1 Turbo is 29.5" draw and 71.5 lbs shooting a 397 gr arrow through the chrono at 331 pretty consistently. All my Hoyts have been very quick. My Prodigy was the only other bow I've owned with similar speed. I haven't shot the Realm X but the Realm and its smooth too I honestly went carbon because in the late season I can shoot with out gloves as the carbon isn't as uncomfortable as the aluminum. Weight don't bother me the gym handles that aspect. Also about pricing they have great bows as all price points these days. If you can't afford it then don't buy it. No one is beating on Ferrari's doors saying make an affordable sports car. LOL


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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Bull $h!t- ^^^


I call your hoyt ultra the best hunting bow by hoyt yet is BS, that bow is loud, which doesn't make a good hunting bow, vibration like crazy, and the 3 I tested 2 were 5-3 under stated ibo and one was right on the money. But usually hoyt are over by 5fps. Hoyt has gone down hill since 2017, owned atleast one carbon bow since 2010 from hoyt every year but the defient was OK but the Ultra is a turd compared to the other carbon hoyts at about the same specs.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

bowtech2006 said:


> I call your hoyt ultra the best hunting bow by hoyt yet is BS, that bow is loud, which doesn't make a good hunting bow, vibration like crazy, and the 3 I tested 2 were 5-3 under stated ibo and one was right on the money. But usually hoyt are over by 5fps. Hoyt has gone down hill since 2017, owned atleast one carbon bow since 2010 from hoyt every year but the defient was OK but the Ultra is a turd compared to the other carbon hoyts at about the same specs.


ELKMAN's middle name is "Hoyt". He will never accept this reality - lol.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Hoyt needs to trim the fat and cut all the leetchs and prostaff off the dole. After that either fire or revamp the marketing dept because they have failed at creating an illusion of Exclusivity that they thought would sell 1600 bows.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

ShootnBlind said:


> No one is beating on Ferrari's doors saying make an affordable sports car. LOL


But Ferrari performs WAY better than a Toyota Camry. The RX-1 doesn't outperform anything. You paid a whole lot of money for a "warmer" handle. I put tennis grip wrap on my bows (for multiple reasons) and they cost me a few bucks. Don't get me wrong - I support your right to overpay for a bow - just sayin'. I could afford to buy everyone on this thread an RX-1 no problem....but I won't buy one for myself as I like to be smart about how I spend my money and I don't consider the RX-1 to be a smart purchase in any way shape or form (and this coming from a {once} long time Hoyt fan who has owned a bunch of them - in fact, my first compound ever was a Hoyt Superslam of some sort back in the early 90's).


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## zekezoe (Dec 3, 2007)

I shot an ultra set up the same as my carbon defiant 34, the ultra was 2fps slower. So I kept the cd 34.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

Hoyt is dumping carbon next year...mark this thread and well circle back. Their flagship will be a new aluminum model and they will still offer carbon but in much smaller runs.


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## Adamsdjr (Aug 17, 2015)

THE ELKMAN said:


> I've set up about 20 of em, and every single one has met or exceeded IBO. Troll on. Love the Realm X though, by far the second best bow of 2018, and the best bow Bowtech has ever produced.


It would be sad if they didn’t given a 6” BH, 32” ATA and only 340 IBO


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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

They sent all the fast ones to the elkman. They better do something quick 5 yrs ago at the shop i buy from they were the best seller but this year there sucking hind tit in sales. The triax and the realms are way ahead in sales . im just glad i got rid of mine and got a realm x before i took a bath on the turdmaster rx1 i had . the tech risers are outdated .they need a total makeover .


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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

I just looked at the outdoor life bow test and the rx1 only shot 318 it was only 1fps faster than the prime logic. So dont tell me there all hitting there ibo . 22 fps off . wow ! The 450 $$ bear hit 333 in the speed test .


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## Viper69 (Feb 4, 2003)

I would like to see them do a total revamping. Imo they just totally went downhill the past few years. Sales at the shop tanked the past few years. 

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## azscorpion (Feb 12, 2010)

Lots and lots of SUPER hype.....then a 3 to 6 month wait


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## burls (Jan 15, 2008)

I heard a new target bow which isn't really any different that the last 3 models they have introduced and it will only cost $2000...oh boy


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## brendan's dad (Feb 21, 2013)

The more I think about it, the more I think Hoyt knows exactly what they are doing. Stayed priced just high enough that no other company will price their flagship bow higher, but not so high that it is crazy. There is a certain prestige with being the most expensive. And there are people that will buy the most expensive since it must be the best! I was purchasing a acreage tractor a couple years ago and it was going to be a Deere or Kubota. The salesman at the Deere dealership told me that the green paint was costing me an extra 10%. Only 1 company tried to price with Hoyt over the last 10 years and we all know how that turned out for Elite. I think it will take Mathews or PSE to knock Hoyt of the top of the price hill, but it will take a huge set of balls on the part of the CEO to try it.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

brendan's dad said:


> The more I think about it, the more I think Hoyt knows exactly what they are doing. Stayed priced just high enough that no other company will price their flagship bow higher, but not so high that it is crazy. There is a certain prestige with being the most expensive. And there are people that will buy the most expensive since it must be the best! I was purchasing a acreage tractor a couple years ago and it was going to be a Deere or Kubota. The salesman at the Deere dealership told me that the green paint was costing me an extra 10%. Only 1 company tried to price with Hoyt over the last 10 years and we all know how that turned out for Elite. I think it will take Mathews or PSE to knock Hoyt of the top of the price hill, but it will take a huge set of balls on the part of the CEO to try it.


It's not in the DNA of either Mathews or PSE to try to price the regular hunter out of the market on flagship hunting bows so I don't expect Hoyt is at risk of losing their elitist status with product that doesn't back up the price.


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## bowshootn70 (Oct 15, 2017)

Doebuster said:


> U can disagree all u want for 1500$$$ those rx1 s should at least be close in speed .the shop i buy from tested all the new flagship bows at the same specs and it was the slowest out of the bunch .its the slowest 6 inch brace hgt. Bow on the planet .


I’ve seen and heard as many making ibo as I have not. As with anything, draw length length mods a person is using and tuning is the key,. Everyone wants a speed bow, but they want comfort, so shooting on the low end of a cam for easier drawing is not going to give the speed as shooting on the high end. Most I’ve seen not making ibo were on the low end. Someone with a 27”-28” draw shooting it on the cam where 27” is the beginning of the cam ( in case anyone doesn’t know) want get the speed he would if 27” were closer to the end of the cam.


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## Zep86 (Jul 13, 2018)

Word around the campfire is that the 2019s will be made from a cutting edge material called mimetic polyalloy. 


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Zep86 said:


> Word around the campfire is that the 2019s will be made from a cutting edge material called mimetic polyalloy.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Is Arnold on the pro staff? I hope so.....
That will be the best Hoyt ever till next years BS marketing campaign comes out.


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## NCAVI8TOR (Oct 5, 2003)

Heck yea! Skynet(Hoyt) has become self-aware!

NC









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## 17ghk (Nov 11, 2009)

Doebuster said:


> I just looked at the outdoor life bow test and the rx1 only shot 318 it was only 1fps faster than the prime logic. So dont tell me there all hitting there ibo . 22 fps off . wow ! The 450 $$ bear hit 333 in the speed test .


I still say bear is the best bang for the buck.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)




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## Mudpup2 (May 31, 2018)

THE ELKMAN said:


> View attachment 6616113



Chuckle

I wonder what his public comments were about the 2018 bows.


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## brokenlittleman (Oct 18, 2006)

THE ELKMAN said:


> View attachment 6616113


Short?


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

At least one is... :sad:


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

Heard from a rep that Hoyt is supposed to preview (not release) two new hunting bows very shortly. Also, on the latest Easton podcast, George and Steve briefly spoke about a new Olympic Recurve that they think is a pretty big deal.


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## fountain (Jan 10, 2009)

I'm saying they will go back to 30 and 34 bows...mid 340s +/-


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## fountain (Jan 10, 2009)

I'm guessing they will drop the hyper zt cam after 1 year from the sounds of that? Hate to hear that because I really like mine. Looking forward to the new bows. What day is the release day?


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

THE ELKMAN said:


> View attachment 6616113


Usually this stuff is just over-inflated marketing nonsense. See it every year from multiple brands and then the product is nowhere near as "revolutionary" as the marketing would suggest it is.

Example, a whole new riser design simply means minor aesthetic tweaks that have no functional value; faster smoother cam system - faster by 1 fps (depending on how you measure it) and "smooth" is more perception than reality so easy to claim; "vibration dampening technology" (lol) usually means a little more rubber in a diff spot and new grip system simply a slight tweak to grip options. This could be terribly underwhelming or they could surprise us. Proof is in the pudding.

Notable they have no marketing on a new finish so we can expect the same crappy riser finish out of Hoyt. PSE was smart enough to move to kolorfusion this year (about time). I don't suspect Hoyt or Mathews will make that move despite it being about 5 years overdue by now.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

fountain said:


> I'm guessing they will drop the hyper zt cam after 1 year from the sounds of that? Hate to hear that because I really like mine. Looking forward to the new bows. What day is the release day?


That cam never got much love from anyone compared to other cam options out there. Seemed like an attempt to move in the direction of the competition but they didn't quite get there and ended up with a bit of a fail. I'll still be shocked to see Hoyt dump it as they tend to hold onto old or substandard technology longer than they should. Maybe they will surprise us this year. It's hard to believe management doesn't see that they've fallen behind in recent years and need to do something to shake things up. Who knows, maybe they'll finally do so this year.


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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

THE ELKMAN said:


> View attachment 6616113


Well anything after the 2018 bows will feel great, especially in the vibration and Noise and hopefully they get back to hitting amo and over in 2019.


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## Kris87 (Sep 12, 2003)

I just wonder if they're still going to hold on to a hybrid system.....hmmmmm


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## IN_Varmntr (Oct 18, 2009)

Predator said:


> It's hard to believe management doesn't see that they've fallen behind in recent years and need to do something to shake things up. Who knows, maybe they'll finally do so this year.


Or maybe their books reflect something that our little corner of the world (AT) doesn’t see. 

You guys talk like AT is the deciding factor on the directions in which manufacturers should go. This community probably doesn’t account for 5% (random number) of their business. 

It’s quite comical.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

IN_Varmntr said:


> Or maybe their books reflect something that our little corner of the world (AT) doesn’t see.
> 
> You guys talk like AT is the deciding factor on the directions in which manufacturers should go. This community probably doesn’t account for 5% (random number) of their business.
> 
> It’s quite comical.


But we are a wide range sample of their target demographic. I would say "we count" for something with regards to customer driven direction...


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## Mudpup2 (May 31, 2018)

IN_Varmntr said:


> Or maybe their books reflect something that our little corner of the world (AT) doesn’t see.
> 
> You guys talk like AT is the deciding factor on the directions in which manufacturers should go. This community probably doesn’t account for 5% (random number) of their business.
> 
> It’s quite comical.


Someone stated that they (Hoyt) were really excited about their new Olympic recurve.
What percentage of their business do you think that accounts for?


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

IN_Varmntr said:


> Or maybe their books reflect something that our little corner of the world (AT) doesn’t see.
> 
> You guys talk like AT is the deciding factor on the directions in which manufacturers should go. This community probably doesn’t account for 5% (random number) of their business.
> 
> It’s quite comical.


You are correct that AT is a small percentage of the buying market but WAY more plugged in and knowledgeable than the other 95% (using your numbers). The 95% is largely clueless and buys whatever "feels" good or is pushed on them by the dealer. A large percentage of those folks bought a Triax this last year - LOL!

It's quite comical to think that the 95% has anything more meaningful to say about this topic than the 5% and quite comical to suggest that AT members shouldn't be able to share their opinions on these topics.

We also don't need to see Hoyt's "books" to know what's going on in the market - basic observation skills will tell you plenty.


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## brokenlittleman (Oct 18, 2006)

THE ELKMAN said:


> At least one is... :sad:


As long as there are other options I am ok with that.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

there was an interesting line in one of the podcasts that came out this week, basically saying how in general, ArcheryTalk is comically unhinged about their self importance. IE, this a forum filled with archery enthusiasts, it is not the decider on anything that drives the industry.


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> You are correct that AT is a small percentage of the buying market but WAY more plugged in and knowledgeable than the other 95% (using your numbers). The 95% is largely clueless and buys whatever "feels" good or is pushed on them by the dealer. A large percentage of those folks bought a Triax this last year - LOL!
> 
> It's quite comical to think that the 95% has anything more meaningful to say about this topic than the 5% and quite comical to suggest that AT members shouldn't be able to share their opinions on these topics.
> 
> We also don't need to see Hoyt's "books" to know what's going on in the market - basic observation skills will tell you plenty.


Nobody is saying they can't share their opinions, everyone is free to voice theirs. Though many will complain that the major bow companies aren't listening to them, not realizing their opinions might be in the minority.
There is much more to the archery world than Archerytalk, Archerytalk isn't even close to accounting 5% of the archery industry, and it is rather ignorant to suggest that because you signed up on an online forum that you are vastly more knowledgeable than those who do not.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

Mudpup2 said:


> Someone stated that they (Hoyt) were really excited about their new Olympic recurve.
> What percentage of their business do you think that accounts for?


Most of it. Worldwide, Olympic Recurve outnumbers Compound by something like 4 to 1 and Hoyt has a lot bigger share of that market than they do in the compound market.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

x-hunta said:


> Nobody is saying they can't share their opinions, everyone is free to voice theirs. Though many will complain that the major bow companies aren't listening to them, not realizing their opinions might be in the minority.
> There is much more to the archery world than Archerytalk, Archerytalk isn't even close to accounting 5% of the archery industry, and it is rather ignorant to suggest that because you signed up on an online forum that you are vastly more knowledgeable than those who do not.


He said it was "quite comical" that AT members share their opinions on where manufacturers should go with their product. Not too hard to figure out the implication.

And nobody is suggesting that just because you sign up for an online forum that you are vastly more knowledgeable than those who don't. But it's rather ignorant to think that a bunch of dedicated AT members who have been at this game for a long time and treat it as a year-round obsession aren't more knowledgeable than the majority of the consumers out there.


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> You are correct that AT is a small percentage of the buying market but WAY more plugged in and knowledgeable than the other 95% (using your numbers). The 95% is largely clueless and buys whatever "feels" good or is pushed on them by the dealer. A large percentage of those folks bought a Triax this last year - LOL!
> 
> It's quite comical to think that the 95% has anything more meaningful to say about this topic than the 5% and quite comical to suggest that AT members shouldn't be able to share their opinions on these topics.
> 
> We also don't need to see Hoyt's "books" to know what's going on in the market - basic observation skills will tell you plenty.





I get that you don’t like any other bow than the one you’re shooting, but you’re just some clueless guy on a forum yappin and everyone is supposed to follow your wisdom? You constantly bash the Triax, yet I can stack arrows at 80yds with it as good or better than any other bow I’ve owned, even my Bowtech, according to you that’s impossible from such a short ata bow. At some point I was hoping you’d feel your legacy of trying to sell your choice on everyone would ware old on you like it has on everyone else, but I have to admit you are persistent. Most of us grow out of that phase. 

Fortunately 95% of the guys on AT can think for themselves and form their own opinions on what bow to buy. 

I bought my first compound bow in 1986, I figure I probably got enough expirience behind my belt to know what I want in a bow and I’m certainly not so narsacistic to beleive that the rest of the population who hasn’t heard of AT is so clueless that they need a lesson from some fanboy on AT to educate them on what they want in a bow. 

Hoyt is a great bow company who makes a great bow, I predict they make a line up of bows for 2019 that hundreds of thousands of people will like.


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## 4IDARCHER (Jul 1, 2006)

friedm1 said:


> there was an interesting line in one of the podcasts that came out this week, basically saying how in general, ArcheryTalk is comically unhinged about their self importance. IE, this a forum filled with archery enthusiasts, it is not the decider on anything that drives the industry.


I have learned a TON off Archery Talk in the last 11 years or so. While I have learned a lot about new products, tuning procedures, and different hunting techniques and locations one of the most important things I have learned is that there are thousands of different points of view and you will be challenged with those different points of view. You must come correct with whatever you post or the shortcomings of your viewpoint will quickly be exposed and highlighted. MANY, MANY of the archery “insiders” and experts do not want to deal with this type of scrutiny; this forge for ideas, and I get it. They have worked hard to get where they are at and they expect a bit of credibility, that those that hear them will take most of what they say as the truth, end of story. Archery Talk is not like that, people will challenge you, and I like that. It shows me the weakness of my arguments and makes me more knowledgeable and challenges me to dive deeper into the information I am seeking. Also many of those experts out there (inside the industry or the Social Medial Influencers) are sponsored by companies and therefore are limited in some ways on what they can post and how they HAVE to view things. I also understand this as I consider some of these people personal friends and understand that they have to make a living too, and trust me if Hoyt was going to give me the resources to hunt premium tracks of land for elk I would be willing to wear any tint of rose colored glasses they wanted me to. The issue with that is you cannot start with the huge contracts and high end accessibility to the industry. You must work your way up by showing loyalty to companies for small contracts where you are earning nothing but discounts on gear or small rewards for saying company X is the greatest. Many of those you see frequently on AT are NOT willing to do that. They want to find the best bow, arrow, release, sight, etc.… on the market and are not willing to trade 15% off something to not talk about what they really view is the best and what the shortcomings of products or ideas are. This does not jive well with those companies looking for someone to promote their products. This is where I see a lot of the friction and downplaying by the “experts” out there NOT on AT


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> He said it was "quite comical" that AT members share their opinions on where manufacturers should go with their product. Not too hard to figure out the implication.
> 
> And nobody is suggesting that just because you sign up for an online forum that you are vastly more knowledgeable than those who don't. But it's rather ignorant to think that a bunch of dedicated AT members who have been at this game for a long time and treat it as a year-round obsession aren't more knowledgeable than the majority of the consumers out there.


So you are simply "assuming" that he is implying that people aren't allowed to voice their opinion? 

That is essentially what you said, "It's quite comical to think that the 95% has anything more meaningful to say about this topic than the 5% and quite comical to suggest that AT members shouldn't be able to share their opinions on these topics."
I would argue an extremely high likelihood that there are a higher number of "knowledgeable" archery enthusiasts in that "95%" than here on Archerytalk.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

173BC said:


> I get that you don’t like any other bow than the one you’re shooting, but you’re just some clueless guy on a forum yappin and everyone is supposed to follow your wisdom? You constantly bash the Triax, yet I can stack arrows at 80yds with it as good or better than any other bow I’ve owned, even my Bowtech, according to you that’s impossible from such a short ata bow. At some point I was hoping you’d feel your legacy of trying to sell your choice on everyone would ware old on you like it has on everyone else, but I have to admit you are persistent. Most of us grow out of that phase.
> 
> Fortunately 95% of the guys on AT can think for themselves and form their own opinions on what bow to buy.
> 
> ...


Wow, you've created quite an alternative reality for yourself haven't you?

I have criticisms of every bow I come into contact with including the ones I shoot (which tends to vary year-to-year). I'm not a fanboy of any bow brand by any stretch and I try to be as objective as I can with respect to brand but I obviously favor bow attributes that I prefer. I don't do anything close to constantly bashing the Triax (someone seems awful sensitive about the bow they shoot - fanboy?). I may be more excited about the Mathews 2019 release than any of the other brands - call it a feeling - but may well be disappointed (I typically am - lol). I also don't expect everyone to buy what I like but I have no problem sharing my opinion (and value that of many others here as well) and even attempting to influence things (even though that expectation is likely delusional in most cases). I expect everyone on AT to form their own opinions on what to buy (as do I) but those opinions are often shaped, in some part, by the experiences and input of others - not just the brand marketing they see on the internet. The rest of the population who hasn't heard of AT isn't getting any lesson from someone on AT because, after all, they haven't heard of AT (completely nonsensical statement on your part). And Hoyt is a great company. Hoyt is the brand I was closest to ever being a "fanboy" of for a period of years where that's all I shot. I haven't been nearly as impressed with Hoyt now in a number of years. It's not that they aren't making good stuff - it's just that it's a much more competitive field at the high end and they haven't quite measured up (at least based on my expectations) to the competition.

People should be able to share opinions here - positive and negative - about brands and archery equipment, without having some other AT member personally attack them (like you did) just because you don't agree with them. Unfortunately that lack of maturity is on display all too often around here.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

x-hunta said:


> So you are simply "assuming" that he is implying that people aren't allowed to voice their opinion?
> 
> That is essentially what you said, "It's quite comical to think that the 95% has anything more meaningful to say about this topic than the 5% and quite comical to suggest that AT members shouldn't be able to share their opinions on these topics."
> I would argue an extremely high likelihood that there are a higher number of "knowledgeable" archery enthusiasts in that "95%" than here on Archerytalk.


If you are knowledgeable but not vocal the point is moot.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

4IDARCHER said:


> I have learned a TON off Archery Talk in the last 11 years or so. While I have learned a lot about new products, tuning procedures, and different hunting techniques and locations one of the most important things I have learned is that there are thousands of different points of view and you will be challenged with those different points of view. You must come correct with whatever you post or the shortcomings of your viewpoint will quickly be exposed and highlighted. MANY, MANY of the archery “insiders” and experts do not want to deal with this type of scrutiny; this forge for ideas, and I get it. They have worked hard to get where they are at and they expect a bit of credibility, that those that hear them will take most of what they say as the truth, end of story. Archery Talk is not like that, people will challenge you, and I like that. It shows me the weakness of my arguments and makes me more knowledgeable and challenges me to dive deeper into the information I am seeking. Also many of those experts out there (inside the industry or the Social Medial Influencers) are sponsored by companies and therefore are limited in some ways on what they can post and how they HAVE to view things. I also understand this as I consider some of these people personal friends and understand that they have to make a living too, and trust me if Hoyt was going to give me the resources to hunt premium tracks of land for elk I would be willing to wear any tint of rose colored glasses they wanted me to. The issue with that is you cannot start with the huge contracts and high end accessibility to the industry. You must work your way up by showing loyalty to companies for small contracts where you are earning nothing but discounts on gear or small rewards for saying company X is the greatest. Many of those you see frequently on AT are NOT willing to do that. They want to find the best bow, arrow, release, sight, etc.… on the market and are not willing to trade 15% off something to not talk about what they really view is the best and what the shortcomings of products or ideas are. This does not jive well with those companies looking for someone to promote their products. This is where I see a lot of the friction and downplaying by the “experts” out there NOT on AT


Well said.


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> If you are knowledgeable but not vocal the point is moot.


So are you saying that Archerytalk is the only way to voice opinions?

Nobody is saying you can't voice your opinion, my point is that a majority opinion on Archerytalk is not always reflective of the market's opinion, in fact it can often be skewed by the brand loyal individuals. Yes there will be brand loyal individuals defending Hoyt, but that would be 1 group against 10.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

x-hunta said:


> So are you saying that Archerytalk is the only way to voice opinions?
> 
> Nobody is saying you can't voice your opinion, my point is that a majority opinion on Archerytalk is not always reflective of the market's opinion, in fact it can often be skewed by the brand loyal individuals. Yes there will be brand loyal individuals defending Hoyt, but that would be 1 group against 10.


I'm obviously not saying that. But we are having a discussion on AT about topics AT members are concerned about. You may be knowledgeable about tuning bows etc. and have no clue about AT or about the upcoming Hoyt release etc. but if you aren't part of "this" conversation (or any conversation on the topic for that matter) the observation is a moot point.


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> I'm obviously not saying that. But we are having a discussion on AT about topics AT members are concerned about. You may be knowledgeable about tuning bows etc. and have no clue about AT or about the upcoming Hoyt release etc. but if you aren't part of "this" conversation (or any conversation on the topic for that matter) the observation is a moot point.


You are really missing the entire point here, don't expect manufacturers to cater to the needs of the opinions in this thread.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

x-hunta said:


> You are really missing the entire point here, don't expect manufacturers to cater to the needs of the opinions in this thread.


I'm afraid I'm not the one missing the point.

I don't expect manufacturers to cater to the needs of the opinions in this thread. I do expect any self respecting company to monitor social media and the internet and to SEEK (not just stumble across) consumer feedback. Archerytalk is one of the best sources of that information and I can assure you most (if not all) of the bow brands have people that monitor what goes on here. If a person's opinion is shared by enough others manufacturers WILL respond (I've seen in numerous times). All I can do is share my opinions. If others agree (won't know until they share their opinion) the manufacturers may make changes. If not, they won't but I'll still share my opinion anyway. If you don't share your opinion then I suppose you shouldn't be surprised when you don't see the changes happen that you hoped would happen but never took the time to voice.

It's really quite simple. Not sure why some here have difficulty with the concept or feel the need to attack others for voicing opinions they may not share.


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## Mudpup2 (May 31, 2018)

trial153 said:


> Hoyt needs to trim the fat and cut all the leetchs and prostaff off the dole. After that either fire or revamp the marketing dept because they have failed at creating an illusion of Exclusivity that they thought would sell 1600 bows.


Word is they are coming out with a really exciting Olympic recurve bow.
That should boost some numbers and show everyone else that they are leaders of the pack in the hunting/target industry.


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## Mudpup2 (May 31, 2018)

nestly said:


> Most of it. Worldwide, Olympic Recurve outnumbers Compound by something like 4 to 1 and Hoyt has a lot bigger share of that market than they do in the compound market.


I find it hard to believe that there are more Olympic recurve shooters worldwide than there are Compound target archers and hunters.
If there are that many of them they are losing their ass on flat bill hats alone.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Are Olympic shooter exclusive enough for hoyt ? ....after all they arent for the average archer. Just look at the commercials...


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## KamoKid14 (Aug 20, 2015)

Predator said:


> I'm afraid I'm not the one missing the point.
> 
> I don't expect manufacturers to cater to the needs of the opinions in this thread. I do expect any self respecting company to monitor social media and the internet and to SEEK (not just stumble across) consumer feedback. Archerytalk is one of the best sources of that information and I can assure you most (if not all) of the bow brands have people that monitor what goes on here. If a person's opinion is shared by enough others manufacturers WILL respond (I've seen in numerous times). All I can do is share my opinions. If others agree (won't know until they share their opinion) the manufacturers may make changes. If not, they won't but I'll still share my opinion anyway. If you don't share your opinion then I suppose you shouldn't be surprised when you don't see the changes happen that you hoped would happen but never took the time to voice.
> 
> It's really quite simple. Not sure why some here have difficulty with the concept or feel the need to attack others for voicing opinions they may not share.


This is spot on. If you think that any form of social media whether it be facebook or online forums don’t matter then you’ve clearly been living under a rock. Social platforms and the opinions voiced on them have been able to change how industries and big companies do things. Prime example right now is the gaming industry. Huge studios with boat loads of cash who thought they were untouchable are now caving to social media pressure before their products even hit the market. Also, just about everyone I know who bow hunts have very little knowledge when it comes to bows themselves. All they know is it felt good at the shop. None of them have ever heard of AT


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## fletched (May 10, 2006)

Kris87 said:


> I just wonder if they're still going to hold on to a hybrid system.....hmmmmm


I'm hoping that they would use a binary cam system of some sort. They can still produce the hybrid as well.


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> I'm afraid I'm not the one missing the point.
> 
> I don't expect manufacturers to cater to the needs of the opinions in this thread. I do expect any self respecting company to monitor social media and the internet and to SEEK (not just stumble across) consumer feedback. Archerytalk is one of the best sources of that information and I can assure you most (if not all) of the bow brands have people that monitor what goes on here. If a person's opinion is shared by enough others manufacturers WILL respond (I've seen in numerous times). All I can do is share my opinions. If others agree (won't know until they share their opinion) the manufacturers may make changes. If not, they won't but I'll still share my opinion anyway. If you don't share your opinion then I suppose you shouldn't be surprised when you don't see the changes happen that you hoped would happen but never took the time to voice.
> 
> It's really quite simple. Not sure why some here have difficulty with the concept or feel the need to attack others for voicing opinions they may not share.


Nobody is attacking others for their opinion, I feel I'm talking to a brick wall here. If somebody disagrees with your opinion its not attacking you, its a different opinion. I never said you shouldn't share your opinion, I pointed out that Archerytalk is an extremely small sample size to actual market that they listen to and users on here often feel the entitlement that their opinion is the be all and end all. Not sure why you keep having to go and try to change your argument, I'm out of ways to reword my point to get you to understand my view here. Cheers!


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> Wow, you've created quite an alternative reality for yourself haven't you?
> 
> I have criticisms of every bow I come into contact with including the ones I shoot (which tends to vary year-to-year). I'm not a fanboy of any bow brand by any stretch and I try to be as objective as I can with respect to brand but I obviously favor bow attributes that I prefer. I don't do anything close to constantly bashing the Triax (someone seems awful sensitive about the bow they shoot - fanboy?). I may be more excited about the Mathews 2019 release than any of the other brands - call it a feeling - but may well be disappointed (I typically am - lol). I also don't expect everyone to buy what I like but I have no problem sharing my opinion (and value that of many others here as well) and even attempting to influence things (even though that expectation is likely delusional in most cases). I expect everyone on AT to form their own opinions on what to buy (as do I) but those opinions are often shaped, in some part, by the experiences and input of others - not just the brand marketing they see on the internet. The rest of the population who hasn't heard of AT isn't getting any lesson from someone on AT because, after all, they haven't heard of AT (completely nonsensical statement on your part). And Hoyt is a great company. Hoyt is the brand I was closest to ever being a "fanboy" of for a period of years where that's all I shot. I haven't been nearly as impressed with Hoyt now in a number of years. It's not that they aren't making good stuff - it's just that it's a much more competitive field at the high end and they haven't quite measured up (at least based on my expectations) to the competition.
> 
> People should be able to share opinions here - positive and negative - about brands and archery equipment, without having some other AT member personally attack them (like you did) just because you don't agree with them. Unfortunately that lack of maturity is on display all too often around here.



Lol, ok bud. 

Keep up the good fight, I’m sure you’re convincing someone.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

x-hunta said:


> Nobody is attacking others for their opinion, I feel I'm talking to a brick wall here. If somebody disagrees with your opinion its not attacking you, its a different opinion. I never said you shouldn't share your opinion, I pointed out that Archerytalk is an extremely small sample size to actual market that they listen to and users on here often feel the entitlement that their opinion is the be all and end all. Not sure why you keep having to go and try to change your argument, I'm out of ways to reword my point to get you to understand my view here. Cheers!


If you don't think post #87 was an attack against me you aren't very well "edumacated" my friend. AT is a small but powerful voice that manufacturers do pay attention do - no entitlement, just recognition that your opinion actually matters and use of this forum to share it. Again, so simple - certainly no brick wall on my side. I'm beginning to wonder on yours though - thought you would have understood and fully agreed with my last clarification. It doesn't get any better so I give up. Cheers back at ya!


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

173BC said:


> Lol, ok bud.
> 
> Keep up the good fight, I’m sure you’re convincing someone.


Thank you, I will. I've weathered plenty of juvenile attacks - and will weather more. None have stopped me and none will. You can listen or ignore, agree or disagree - I only ask that you respect my right to an opinion on archery topics (without attacking me for it) and I'll respect yours (without attacking you for it). We can debate topics and opinions all you want as long as kept on topic and not personal. That's how I like to roll and that's how everyone here is supposed to roll (in accordance with the rules). Enjoy your Triax - I wish you much success with it.


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> If you don't think post #87 was an attack against me you aren't very well "edumacated" my friend. AT is a small but powerful voice that manufacturers do pay attention do - no entitlement, just recognition that your opinion actually matters and use of this forum to share it. Again, so simple - certainly no brick wall on my side. I'm beginning to wonder on yours though - thought you would have understood and fully agreed with my last clarification. It doesn't get any better so I give up. Cheers back at ya!


Bringing up a post that has no relevancy to the discussion I was having with you. 

You got upset that someone pointed out that there are opinions other than those on Archerytalk, good to see you've finally come around to that.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

x-hunta said:


> Bringing up a post that has no relevancy to the discussion I was having with you.
> 
> You got upset that someone pointed out that there are opinions other than those on Archerytalk, good to see you've finally come around to that.


Huh? Do you even think about your posts? Your last post (#102) starts with "Nobody is attacking others for their opinion". That's exactly was post #87 was - I mean exactly - so it's completely relevant. I never claimed it was you yet you say "nobody" is attacking me. SMH

And I never got upset by someone stating the obvious that there are other opinions than those on AT.

Seriously...let it go. Stop trying to put words in my mouth or making up an alternative reality. The things you have to deal with here sometimes - lol, unbelievable.


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> Thank you, I will. I've weathered plenty of juvenile attacks - and will weather more. None have stopped me and none will. You can listen or ignore, agree or disagree - I only ask that you respect my right to an opinion on archery topics (without attacking me for it) and I'll respect yours (without attacking you for it). We can debate topics and opinions all you want as long as kept on topic and not personal. That's how I like to roll and that's how everyone here is supposed to roll (in accordance with the rules). Enjoy your Triax - I wish you much success with it.


I don’t log on here too often anymore, nor do I post much, but every time there is a thread with Triax or RX1 in the title I can be sure I’ll find you saying how crappy the Triax is or how you can’t come to terms with Hoyt’s price point. It’s fine to have an opinion, you are way beyond that..... lol. 

You get hurt feelings when people put you in check? Maybe don’t insinuate people are clueless because they don’t share your taste in bows, or can see value where you fail to see it. 

There are thousands of different opinions out there, it’s not coincidence people take offense to how you convey yours, but I’m sure you are fully aware of how you are perceived. I just figured you could handle the response you get without cryin.


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

I’m just going to leave this right here...


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## 4IDARCHER (Jul 1, 2006)

Hard for me to figure they would go back to that blocky reverse flex arm system, but who knows.


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## zernzm08 (Feb 1, 2009)

were up to $1700 now? yikes


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

4IDARCHER said:


> Hard for me to figure they would go back to that blocky reverse flex arm system, but who knows.


That pic did not come from Hoyt it was from a 3rd party. I really think the bow in the background is a Carbon Defiant but don't know for sure.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

173BC said:


> I don’t log on here too often anymore, nor do I post much, but every time there is a thread with Triax or RX1 in the title I can be sure I’ll find you saying how crappy the Triax is or how you can’t come to terms with Hoyt’s price point. It’s fine to have an opinion, you are way beyond that..... lol.
> 
> You get hurt feelings when people put you in check? Maybe don’t insinuate people are clueless because they don’t share your taste in bows, or can see value where you fail to see it.
> 
> There are thousands of different opinions out there, it’s not coincidence people take offense to how you convey yours, but I’m sure you are fully aware of how you are perceived. I just figured you could handle the response you get without cryin.


Not sure if this is a disguised apology for acting like a jackwagon in post #87 or not - lol.

Can't even remember the last time I posted anything remotely negative about the Triax. It's a nice bow that's incredibly dead in the hand and the balance is much better than the Halon series. Not a big fan of grip angle (like many) but that can be remedied. I, long long ago was involved in a healthy debate over the inherent forgiveness in a bow with a very short ATA and a short BH. Not the bow for me (but neither would be the evolve 28 which IMO was just PSE chasing Mathews) and even at a 27.5" DL the string angle felt too steep for me. You act like I think the Triax came from the devil himself or something. While not posting you may be dreaming up alternative opinions from me. Perhaps I've gotten inside your head that much even from our few encounters - lol!

BTW, never insinuated anyone here was clueless - only that a large portion of the market (you know, the many guys who buy a bow last minute before season starts or get out the bow they hunted with last year a week before season and then go fling arrows out of an un-tuned bow at deer) is.

Maybe you should take another extended break from AT and when you come back perhaps things will be all better - probably not as I'll still be here and it's obvious you don't like me - lol. I'm very much ok with that.


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> Not sure if this is a disguised apology for acting like a jackwagon in post #87 or not - lol.
> 
> Can't even remember the last time I posted anything remotely negative about the Triax. It's a nice bow that's incredibly dead in the hand and the balance is much better than the Halon series. Not a big fan of grip angle (like many) but that can be remedied. I, long long ago was involved in a healthy debate over the inherent forgiveness in a bow with a very short ATA and a short BH. Not the bow for me (but neither would be the evolve 28 which IMO was just PSE chasing Mathews) and even at a 27.5" DL the string angle felt too steep for me. You act like I think the Triax came from the devil himself or something. While not posting you may be dreaming up alternative opinions from me. Perhaps I've gotten inside your head that much even from our few encounters - lol!
> 
> ...



Wholly smokes, attacking you like a jakwagon...... hahahaha talk about sensitive little feelers. How about you “attacking” the clueless people for buying a Triax? Why is it you can dish out the insults but can’t be held accountable for it? Are you hoping a mod will read your post and feel you’re in danger? I pointed out your bashing of those who bought a Triax and you start crying about personal attacks??? Grow up man.

I can see there are many who share my opinion of you, it’s earned not given, trust me.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

173BC said:


> Wholly smokes, attacking you like a jakwagon...... hahahaha talk about sensitive little feelers. How about you “attacking” the clueless people for buying a Triax? Why is it you can dish out the insults but can’t be held accountable for it? Are you hoping a mod will read your post and feel you’re in danger? I pointed out your bashing of those who bought a Triax and you start crying about personal attacks??? Grow up man.
> 
> I can see there are many who share my opinion of you, it’s earned not given, trust me.


I don't insult people for having a different opinion than me. Those (obviously yourself included in this case) are the folks that need to "grow up". Oh, and lots of clueless people bought lots of different bows - probably more Triax bows than others because of 3 things: 1) Better distribution of the brand (more dealers pushing them) 2) Better marketing of the brand 3) A better "feel" on the shot in the shop than any other bow out there. Simple reality - doesn't make the bow good or bad - just a simple reality. Why are you so sensitive about that? I don't understand the emotional attachment to the bow.


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

Just saw this on Instagram. I'm a huge fan of Hoyt bows and even though I am venturing off into other brands I will always own some form of a Hoyt bow. However if the new Hoyt is retailing for $1700 that is utterly absurd!!!

As a recent owner of a bow shop, I could hardly convince people to pay $1100 for a bow let alone $1500-$1700!!! 

If they are in fact that expensive, then they are the Apple iPhone of compound bow companies. Minimal upgrades with a unbelievable inflated price! 

As a huge diehard fan of Hoyt this is getting ridiculous!









Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

I didn't know that the Rx1 came with a free inferiority complex. They should have advertised that.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

It's Redwrx - only the elite and truly dedicated hunters can hunt with Hoyt's top of the line bows and a $1700 price tag should be of no concern whatsoever. :wink:


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## Moose39x (Feb 23, 2017)

Jesus christ. Your guys are acting like a bunch of children pissed off cause you cant have your cookies and juicebox. Thought this was a hoyt thread not a ***** and moan thread


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## Moose39x (Feb 23, 2017)

Summit3 said:


> Just saw this on Instagram. I'm a huge fan of Hoyt bows and even though I am venturing off into other brands I will always own some form of a Hoyt bow. However if the new Hoyt is retailing for $1700 that is utterly absurd!!!
> 
> As a recent owner of a bow shop, I could hardly convince people to pay $1100 for a bow let alone $1500-$1700!!!
> 
> ...


 no different than bear releasing that kuma with a shoot through riser thinking they can get 1500 for it.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

Moose39x said:


> no different than bear releasing that kuma with a shoot through riser thinking they can get 1500 for it.


No, I think the Bear deal is worse. Just a funky aluminum riser and it has the Bear name on it. Nobody is buying that bow. Some will actually drop the $1700 for the Hoyt believe it or not.


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> I don't insult people for having a different opinion than me. Those (obviously yourself included in this case) are the folks that need to "grow up". Oh, and lots of clueless people bought lots of different bows - probably more Triax bows than others because of 3 things: 1) Better distribution of the brand (more dealers pushing them) 2) Better marketing of the brand 3) A better "feel" on the shot in the shop than any other bow out there. Simple reality - doesn't make the bow good or bad - just a simple reality. Why are you so sensitive about that? I don't understand the emotional attachment to the bow.


It’s not about my sensitive feelings or an emotional connection to a bow (your way of insulting me), it’s about you and your sly way of insulting people that got me irritated. And the irony of you cryin about personal attacks..... Too funny. 

I said my piece, done with you now, don’t want to further the derail.


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## hoytshooter03 (Oct 28, 2003)

All I am saying that Sunday I was at Hoyt Dealer and there were a lot of RX1's on the rack.


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## hoytshooter03 (Oct 28, 2003)

And I am a Hoyt fan and I generally bow every two years. This year not so much?


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> Huh? Do you even think about your posts? Your last post (#102) starts with "Nobody is attacking others for their opinion". That's exactly was post #87 was - I mean exactly - so it's completely relevant. I never claimed it was you yet you say "nobody" is attacking me. SMH
> 
> And I never got upset by someone stating the obvious that there are other opinions than those on AT.
> 
> Seriously...let it go. Stop trying to put words in my mouth or making up an alternative reality. The things you have to deal with here sometimes - lol, unbelievable.


I put no words in your mouth, your childish ignorance is clearly shown in your posts.

But as one last word to you, if that post was personally attacking you (if that was a personal attack, you have some seriously thin skin), what was this post towards me? Food for thought :wink:


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## zacha79 (Sep 23, 2013)

Pretty sure that $1700 value is for the "Mega Box" that MtnOps is giving away. The box just includes a Hoyt bow


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## Moose39x (Feb 23, 2017)

Predator said:


> Moose39x said:
> 
> 
> > no different than bear releasing that kuma with a shoot through riser thinking they can get 1500 for it.
> ...


 ill wait til next year and buy that bear for 400 off amazon still new in the box cause no one wants it


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Wow, the only thing that popped out at me was the comment about manufactures heeding advice for Archery Talk? 

Good Lord I hope not! We've successfully ran off every Pro that attempted to help, we heckled professional hunters to the point that they left never to return, and we destroy companies like Strother and Truball that actually tried to come on here and address comments. 

And Bowwreck would never sell another bow. Ever. And every brand new bow would be priced for....12 bucks.

Listening to us idiots on AT would be the kiss of death!


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

rattlinman said:


> Wow, the only thing that popped out at me was the comment about manufactures heeding advice for Archery Talk?
> 
> Good Lord I hope not! We've successfully ran off every Pro that attempted to help, we heckled professional hunters to the point that they left never to return, and we destroy companies like Strother and Truball that actually tried to come on here and address comments.
> 
> ...


LOL, funny you should phrase it like that. 

Every time I've asked a shop owner or bow technician if they are on AT, the answer I almost always get is : "Heck no, those guys are a bunch of idiots..."


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## nontypical (Jan 4, 2004)

Is this archery talk or real housewives?


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## Moose39x (Feb 23, 2017)

nontypical said:


> Is this archery talk or real housewives?


more drama than jerry springer


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## Bourbon Boy (Mar 18, 2013)

Hopefully Hoyt will bring their game up a couple of clicks, with the $1700 price. It better have a flawless finish, and shoot like a dream for sure. I still have a couple of Nitrums, one of my favorite bows ever made, by anyone. But I did wait for almost 14 weeks to get my silver ice target model. Don't for a minute think Hoyt doesn't read these forums, they do, and that's how they know some problems with certain models and certain cams, I think the R&D team sometimes doesn't test every configuration of each bow. I hope you guys can get along a little better, and hopefully we can discuss what the new bows are when we hear about them. Bear dropped a large egg, they can't be serious, but time will tell.--BB


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

That_TN_Guy said:


> LOL, funny you should phrase it like that.
> 
> Every time I've asked a shop owner or bow technician if they are on AT, the answer I almost always get is : "Heck no, those guys are a bunch of idiots..."


What's funny as every time I go into some of the shops around me I end up knowing WAY more about what's going on in the industry than they do. Seriously, it's shocking how out of touch many of the shop guys are. I've gone into dealers and asked if they had the new models in for brands they carry right after a release and they've not even know what I was talking about. And witness the elite situation this year with the jacked up cams. People here knew much more about what was going on than 90% of the dealers did. Countess stories of informed archers from AT telling the dealer about the cam issue that they had never heard of. There are a ton of stories like that. And as far as about 1/2 the techs I've seen at shops - they know less about bow tuning than a whole bunch of people here.

Any dealer who says the guys on AT (as a generalization) are idiots is either being defensive or perhaps an idiot himself.


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

Predator said:


> What's funny as every time I go into some of the shops around me I end up knowing WAY more about what's going on in the industry than they do. Seriously, it's shocking how out of touch many of the shop guys are. I've gone into dealers and asked if they had the new models in for brands they carry right after a release and they've not even know what I was talking about. And witness the elite situation this year with the jacked up cams. People here knew much more about what was going on than 90% of the dealers did. Countess stories of informed archers from AT telling the dealer about the cam issue that they had never heard of. There are a ton of stories like that. And as far as about 1/2 the techs I've seen at shops - they know less about bow tuning than a whole bunch of people here.
> 
> Any dealer who says the guys on AT (as a generalization) are idiots is either being defensive or perhaps an idiot himself.


No, the use of the word "Idiots" by them actually meant "know-it-alls" as described in rattlinman's post.



rattlinman said:


> Wow, the only thing that popped out at me was the comment about manufactures heeding advice for Archery Talk?
> 
> Good Lord I hope not! *We've successfully ran off every Pro that attempted to help, we heckled professional hunters to the point that they left never to return, and we destroy companies like Strother and Truball that actually tried to come on here and address comments. *
> 
> ...


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

That_TN_Guy said:


> No, the use of the word "Idiots" by them actually meant "know-it-alls" as described in rattlinman's post.


Got it.

The reality I describe nonetheless exists.


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

Can a admin just shut this sucker down. This is getting way to petty for anyones good. 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## Doebuster (Mar 5, 2006)

I’m sure Hoyt will listen to there customers ! They will have a revamped tec riser ( same riser different cut outs ) for at least a decade ! There carbon bows will have a new high tec name . And a really higher price tag ! They will have new camo options that still wear off around the grips . They will boast an iBo speed of 340 and will only shoot 320.and they will have a new cam Hanes signature bow called keep hammering the customers wallets so I don’t have to work ! That’s about it !


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## AZSpaniol (May 6, 2012)

Summit3 said:


> Can a admin just shut this sucker down. This is getting way to petty for anyones good.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


Agreed


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Captjock (Oct 16, 2009)

Summit3 said:


> Just saw this on Instagram. I'm a huge fan of Hoyt bows and even though I am venturing off into other brands I will always own some form of a Hoyt bow. However if the new Hoyt is retailing for $1700 that is utterly absurd!!!
> 
> As a recent owner of a bow shop, I could hardly convince people to pay $1100 for a bow let alone $1500-$1700!!!
> 
> ...


$1,699?? No one knows what the retail price will be, but it’s most likely that there won’t be a decrease, but I can guarantee it won’t be $1,699.


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

Captjock said:


> $1,699?? No one knows what the retail price will be, but it’s most likely that there won’t be a decrease, but I can guarantee it won’t be $1,699.


Who knows but better reading the offer on Instagram and Facebook, neither state anything in the "Megabox" other than the bow. Which states a $1699 value. However who knows. Still love Hoyt but personally am done with Carbon riser bows all together. Carbon is an incredible material but think it's a little inflated on its value as a riser design.

As a former shop owner/ dealer of Hoyt, PSE and Elite it was difficult for me to "Market" carbon bows from Hoyt and PSE when the extra $500ish value of carbon was inconsistent to justify to potential buyers. Still love Hoyt, I've just lost 100% interest and justification for carbon risers and it's sometimes outrageous price. To each his own and good luck to all who are hunting this season regardless of make,model, year or material. 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## Luv2shoot3D (Feb 4, 2013)

When are they coming out this year


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

Luv2shoot3D said:


> When are they coming out this year


Last year it was mid October

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## IN_Varmntr (Oct 18, 2009)

Predator said:


> You are correct that AT is a small percentage of the buying market but WAY more plugged in and knowledgeable than the other 95% (using your numbers). The 95% is largely clueless and buys whatever "feels" good or is pushed on them by the dealer. A large percentage of those folks bought a Triax this last year - LOL!
> 
> It's quite comical to think that the 95% has anything more meaningful to say about this topic than the 5% and quite comical to suggest that AT members shouldn't be able to share their opinions on these topics.
> 
> We also don't need to see Hoyt's "books" to know what's going on in the market - basic observation skills will tell you plenty.


The bottom line is that Hoyt only cares about what their books tell them. Right along with every other manufacturer out there. I think you understand what I mean by that, but in case what I implied and what you read don't jive, I was implying that regardless of what the (arbitrary) 5% of AT says, as long as the (again, arbitrary) 95% still buy based on what their shop, their buddy, etc... says, they won't overhaul their lineups to suit the 5% that have informed opinions on their bows. Watch any of the Total Archery Challenge videos and witness the plethora of Hoyt bows running around. I would wager the vast majority of those folks don't have a press and couldn't tell you a single thing about their bows or how they differ in feel than last years. Still, people are buying them regardless of what AT collectively says, and doing so in numbers that would allow Hoyt to keep doing what they've been doing. Hoyt is a top brand, and I don't need to tell you why people buy them.

If I took some of these posts on this forum for truth, I would find it hard to believe that Hoyt has stayed in business for as long as they have because their bows have absolutely sucked the last x amount of years for one reason or another. I'm smart enough to know that asking 100 people how this bow feels will yield 100 different reactions. 

Also, I never said you shouldn't be able to share your opinions of these topics. You put a whole bunch of words in my mouth there. Believing that's what I wrote was purely based off your knee-jerk reaction to my statement, and 100% incorrect. 



Predator said:


> He said it was "quite comical" that AT members share their opinions on where manufacturers should go with their product. Not too hard to figure out the implication.


Wrong. I stated it is quite comical that folks believe that AT alone is responsible for changing the directions that manufactures go. Again, I said nothing regarding you sharing your opinion on this forum. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion. Nowhere in my post did I even say opinion. 



x-hunta said:


> Nobody is attacking others for their opinion


Right, I wasn't attacking anyone, their opinions or their ability to share their opinions. Predator, you are one of the opinions on AT I tend to not to skip over, I just simply disagreed with one. I'm not the one getting defensive about something that I literally didn't say.


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## horsehands (Jul 25, 2012)

Doebuster said:


> I’m sure Hoyt will listen to there customers ! They will have a revamped tec riser ( same riser different cut outs ) for at least a decade ! There carbon bows will have a new high tec name . And a really higher price tag ! They will have new camo options that still wear off around the grips . They will boast an iBo speed of 340 and will only shoot 320.and they will have a new cam Hanes signature bow called keep hammering the customers wallets so I don’t have to work ! That’s about it !


^^^This plus a free re-call just as your season begins.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Hoyt is obnoxious.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

That_TN_Guy said:


> That pic did not come from Hoyt it was from a 3rd party. I really think the bow in the background is a Carbon Defiant but don't know for sure.


Correct ^^^


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

nontypical said:


> Is this archery talk or real housewives?


Agreed. Predator really knows how to mix $h!t up... LMAO!


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

zacha79 said:


> Pretty sure that $1700 value is for the "Mega Box" that MtnOps is giving away. The box just includes a Hoyt bow


Yeah people are a little "slow on the uptake" around here, and even if it were a so called "$1,699.00 value" they would NEVER sell for anywhere near that and everyone knows it...


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## BucksnBass525 (Feb 21, 2009)

I just know that with the PSE Evoke reviews trickling in, and what I suspect Bowtech and Mathews will unveil for 19' - Hoyt better come out with something "super special".


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## trucker3573 (Feb 14, 2010)

They will rearrange some specs slap a new name on it and people will eat it up.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## westhall55 (Sep 16, 2018)

im excited to see


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

BucksnBass525 said:


> I just know that with the PSE Evoke reviews trickling in, and what I suspect Bowtech and Mathews will unveil for 19' - Hoyt better come out with something "super special".


The Evokes are awesome bows, but again WAAAY to heavy in the 35 version anyway, and they re released the worst grip in the industry on their carbon so really they aren't even an option other than their Response bow and it lacks a bunch of what makes PSE cool right now... Wish they would have lightened their aluminum line...:sad:


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## rmscustom (Mar 7, 2011)

THE ELKMAN said:


> The Evokes are awesome bows, but again WAAAY to heavy in the 35 version anyway, and they re released the worst grip in the industry on their carbon so really they aren't even an option other than their Response bow and it lacks a bunch of what makes PSE cool right now... Wish they would have lightened their aluminum line...:sad:



Funny...
Me and my buddy weighed our bows for fun. 
My evolve 35 was only 4oz heavier than his rx1 ultra. Both only had a sight on. Pure gold 6” dovetail on mine and a cbe 4” dovetail on his. 
He says wow that’s a really light aluminum bow. I said no that a really heavy carbon bow. Lol


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

rmscustom said:


> Funny...
> Me and my buddy weighed our bows for fun.
> My evolve 35 was only 4oz heavier than his rx1 ultra. Both only had a sight on. Pure gold 6” dovetail on mine and a cbe 4” dovetail on his.
> He says wow that’s a really light aluminum bow. I said no that a really heavy carbon bow. Lol


I'll pull the two off the wall tonight at the shop and weigh them and post "the actual results" of that little experiment here in the next few days. Care to bet any money if it will be 4 ounces or not? I'll take the over... Going hunting.


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## RavinHood (Sep 17, 2015)

Oh I love it such a beautiful thing 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## rmscustom (Mar 7, 2011)

THE ELKMAN said:


> I'll pull the two off the wall tonight at the shop and weigh them and post "the actual results" of that little experiment here in the next few days. Care to bet any money if it will be 4 ounces or not? I'll take the over... Going hunting.


It was .31lbs. My my estimation of 4oz was a little off and is actually 4.96oz. 
You can’t own a Hoyt carbon and make fun of others for weight. Lol


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

rmscustom said:


> It was .31lbs. My my estimation of 4oz was a little off and is actually 4.96oz.
> You can’t own a Hoyt carbon and make fun of others for weight. Lol


Not making fun. I just wish they would have went back to their pre evolve weights on their aluminum line that's all. The Evolve 35 is just plain to heavy for real hunting here in the west. I'm not walking 200 yards to a tree stand dude. Love the new Evokes, we got our preview order in a couple days ago and they are awesome, but again just to heavy...


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## BucksnBass525 (Feb 21, 2009)

THE ELKMAN said:


> The Evokes are awesome bows, but again WAAAY to heavy in the 35 version anyway, and they re released the worst grip in the industry on their carbon so really they aren't even an option other than their Response bow and it lacks a bunch of what makes PSE cool right now... Wish they would have lightened their aluminum line...:sad:


I never thought my Evolve 31 or 35 were heavy, mainly because I feel like the PSE's balance really well. Felt comparable to the Hyperforce and my current RealmX, which by the way make a Triax feel like 8 lbs IMO- LOL.
If I were a spot and stalk guy I could see how weight would be important, but for us under 200 yard guys to the treestand, I actually prefer a little more weight over the lighter carbons.


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Not making fun. I just wish they would have went back to their pre evolve weights on their aluminum line that's all. The Evolve 35 is just plain to heavy for real hunting here in the west. I'm not walking 200 yards to a tree stand dude. Love the new Evokes, we got our preview order in a couple days ago and they are awesome, but again just to heavy...


It's the change to 7075 aircraft alloy over previous 6061 aluminum. A tad heavier but makes for a much much stiffer riser. I wish Hoyt would get away from 6061 and finally invest in cnc bits and aluminum blanks for 7075. 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Summit3 said:


> It's the change to 7075 aircraft alloy over previous 6061 aluminum. A tad heavier but makes for a much much stiffer riser. I wish Hoyt would get away from 6061 and finally invest in cnc bits and aluminum blanks for 7075.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


It's more than that man. Look at the old risers compared to the newer ones. Hell they could lose the weight by removing those stupid little spike things on the back of the Evolve that do absolutely nothing other than make them look like a kid designed them. The new Evoke risers are much more appealing to the eye in my opinion...


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

THE ELKMAN said:


> It's more than that man. Look at the old risers compared to the newer ones. Hell they could lose the weight by removing those stupid little spike things on the back of the Evolve that do absolutely nothing other than make them look like a kid designed them. The new Evoke risers are much more appealing to the eye in my opinion...


Yeah wasnt a fan of the Evolve riser as well but I prefer the extra weight. I mostly backcountry hunt here in my home state of CO. I've had too many windy encounters on game at fairly long distances where a light carbon bow turned into a wind sail for me. I've learned to welcome the extra weight of Aluminum Hoyts, Primes and their sweet 82X alloy or newer PSE's. The lugging the extra 4 or 5 ounces has seemed to become a non issue over the years. Not to say a carbon bow is not a sweet concept!

But totally agree the Evolve risers where a little tacky. 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## 4IDARCHER (Jul 1, 2006)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Not making fun. I just wish they would have went back to their pre evolve weights on their aluminum line that's all. The Evolve 35 is just plain to heavy for real hunting here in the west. I'm not walking 200 yards to a tree stand dude. Love the new Evokes, we got our preview order in a couple days ago and they are awesome, but again just to heavy...


Isn't the Evoke 31 lighter then the Hoyt HyperForce?


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

That_TN_Guy said:


> LOL, funny you should phrase it like that.
> 
> Every time I've asked a shop owner or bow technician if they are on AT, the answer I almost always get is : "Heck no, those guys are a bunch of idiots..."





Predator said:


> What's funny as every time I go into some of the shops around me I end up knowing WAY more about what's going on in the industry than they do. Seriously, it's shocking how out of touch many of the shop guys are. I've gone into dealers and asked if they had the new models in for brands they carry right after a release and they've not even know what I was talking about. And witness the elite situation this year with the jacked up cams. People here knew much more about what was going on than 90% of the dealers did. Countess stories of informed archers from AT telling the dealer about the cam issue that they had never heard of. There are a ton of stories like that. And as far as about 1/2 the techs I've seen at shops - they know less about bow tuning than a whole bunch of people here.
> 
> Any dealer who says the guys on AT (as a generalization) are idiots is either being defensive or perhaps an idiot himself.


Oh, I have no doubt you are always the smartest one in the room Predator.

I personally enjoy the AT guys that come rolling into our shop like Cliff on Cheers, telling us that we should be shooting a 825 grain arrow to get the FOC correct, bareshaft their bows out to 100 yards, and shoot 1" groups while doing so. We are always in awe of the knowledge that AT brings to the table. :wink:


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

4IDARCHER said:


> Isn't the Evoke 31 lighter then the Hoyt HyperForce?


I wouldn't doubt it. Hoyt aluminum are ridiculous heavy in my opinion...:sad:


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

rattlinman said:


> Oh, I have no doubt you are always the smartest one in the room Predator.
> 
> I personally enjoy the AT guys that come rolling into our shop like Cliff on Cheers, telling us that we should be shooting a 825 grain arrow to get the FOC correct, bareshaft their bows out to 100 yards, and shoot 1" groups while doing so. We are always in awe of the knowledge that AT brings to the table. :wink:


Yeah ain't "those guys" the best??? LOL!


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Summit3 said:


> Yeah wasnt a fan of the Evolve riser as well but I prefer the extra weight. I mostly backcountry hunt here in my home state of CO. I've had too many windy encounters on game at fairly long distances where a light carbon bow turned into a wind sail for me. I've learned to welcome the extra weight of Aluminum Hoyts, Primes and their sweet 82X alloy or newer PSE's. The lugging the extra 4 or 5 ounces has seemed to become a non issue over the years. Not to say a carbon bow is not a sweet concept!
> 
> But totally agree the Evolve risers where a little tacky.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


Oh I like the correct amount of weight on a bow. Not because I don't have the ability to get close enough for an actual archery shot on an animal, or because my ego needs me to succeed so bad that I would take a long distance shot in the wind, but because the right amount of weight is just "correct". But I want my weight where I PUT IT on the bow. I don't need it pre installed from the manufacturer...


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## Adamsdjr (Aug 17, 2015)

rattlinman said:


> Oh, I have no doubt you are always the smartest one in the room Predator.
> 
> I personally enjoy the AT guys that come rolling into our shop like Cliff on Cheers, telling us that we should be shooting a 825 grain arrow to get the FOC correct, bareshaft their bows out to 100 yards, and shoot 1" groups while doing so. We are always in awe of the knowledge that AT brings to the table. :wink:


“Cliff on Cheers” That pretty much says it all!


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Adamsdjr said:


> “Cliff on Cheers” That pretty much says it all!


Oh Claven... Those were the days... :wink:


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## CSchelk2 (Sep 26, 2017)

This was posted today by a friend of mine on facebook; he is a head tech at a hoyt shop.


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## MNarrow (Nov 10, 2009)

CSchelk2 said:


> This was posted today by a friend of mine on facebook; he is a head tech at a hoyt shop.
> 
> View attachment 6617153


And also posted on page 3 of this very thread.


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## BucksnBass525 (Feb 21, 2009)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Yeah ain't "those guys" the best??? LOL!


In all fairness and on the flip side I am lucky to have 4 "PROSHOPS" all very close to me, one shop does all my work, the other 3 don't have a tech that I would ever let touch a bow of mine again-LOL.
So say what you will about the "AT" gang, there is a lot more valuable information and knowhow on here than you think. I personally know a handful of guys that would make super techs, but the "working techs" think they are above all of them.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Adamsdjr said:


> “Cliff on Cheers” That pretty much says it all!





THE ELKMAN said:


> Oh Claven... Those were the days... :wink:


Showing our age brothers!


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## CSchelk2 (Sep 26, 2017)

Meh, internet fail; i tried.


Looks like a release of 10/20/18 but maybe thats buried in the thread between all the bickering.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

BucksnBass525 said:


> In all fairness and on the flip side I am lucky to have 4 "PROSHOPS" all very close to me, one shop does all my work, the other 3 don't have a tech that I would ever let touch a bow of mine again-LOL.
> So say what you will about the "AT" gang, there is a lot more valuable information and knowhow on here than you think. I personally know a handful of guys that would make super techs, but the "working techs" think they are above all of them.


I agree that the knowledge base on here is by far the most vast, but it's how we use that knowledge that makes us look poor. Some folks, like Padgett, try to help folks, and that's a good thing. But others use it to show their backsides or belittle others, kind of like every attack on Dale every time he offers his opinion or how they ran off Nuts and Bolts. As I stated earlier, the Pros and the tv hunters won't post on here anymore, yet they actaully make a living doing what we all only dream of. Wonder why that is? :sad:

Trust me, outside of our little AT world, we are our own worst enemy. I've been in too many conversations where industry folks commented about the congregation on here. It's not favorable.

Will great knowledge comes great responsibility, and we are about as responsible as a room full of 2 year olds crapping our pants and wiping our faces with it. 

If the Hoyt folks are reading this, it's out of amusement only. Heck, we've declared them bankrupt so many times it's almost comical to me!

Sorry, I'm in a mood today.......


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## BucksnBass525 (Feb 21, 2009)

rattlinman said:


> I agree that the knowledge base on here is by far the most vast, but it's how we use that knowledge that makes us look poor. Some folks, like Padgett, try to help folks, and that's a good thing. But others use it to show their backsides or belittle others, kind of like every attack on Dale every time he offers his opinion or how they ran off Nuts and Bolts. As I stated earlier, the Pros and the tv hunters won't post on here anymore, yet they actaully make a living doing what we all only dream of. Wonder why that is? :sad:
> 
> Trust me, outside of our little AT world, we are our own worst enemy. I've been in too many conversations where industry folks commented about the congregation on here. It's not favorable.
> 
> ...


You make some very good points, the Tech at my preferred shop refuses to visit AT because of many of the reasons you highlight.
Anyway back to the original thread question, Hoyt will have a solid line-up that appeals to many in 2019.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

rattlinman said:


> I personally enjoy the AT guys that come rolling into our shop like Cliff on Cheers, telling us that we should be shooting a 825 grain arrow to get the FOC correct, bareshaft their bows out to 100 yards, and shoot 1" groups while doing so. We are always in awe of the knowledge that AT brings to the table. :wink:


Gotta love Cliff. And that suggestion is an interesting one. I actually take the opposite approach. I almost always go into archery shops and play dumb, so to speak, because I like to see what they know or what wisdom they'll want to impart on me. 90% of the time I'm underwhelmed or disappointed. It's unfortunate because there are a lot of guys who walk into those shops that are somewhat clueless (yes, I used that word again despite the apparent sensitivity some around here have to it -lol) and looking for help and I feel like it's the blind leading the blind in some of these shops. If you go to the archery section of a big box store it's far worse. I've seen some scary advice and assistance provided to beginner archers at those places.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

BucksnBass525 said:


> In all fairness and on the flip side I am lucky to have 4 "PROSHOPS" all very close to me, one shop does all my work, the other 3 don't have a tech that I would ever let touch a bow of mine again-LOL.
> So say what you will about the "AT" gang, there is a lot more valuable information and knowhow on here than you think. I personally know a handful of guys that would make super techs, but the "working techs" think they are above all of them.


All very true.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

rattlinman said:


> I agree that the knowledge base on here is by far the most vast, but it's how we use that knowledge that makes us look poor. Some folks, like Padgett, try to help folks, and that's a good thing. But others use it to show their backsides or belittle others, kind of like every attack on Dale every time he offers his opinion or how they ran off Nuts and Bolts. As I stated earlier, the Pros and the tv hunters won't post on here anymore, yet they actaully make a living doing what we all only dream of. Wonder why that is? :sad:


Agree completely and that was my exact point about being able to share opinions without getting personally attacked for them. Not being a crybaby - trying to encourage more appropriate behavior around here. Dale has a blunt approach but the personal attacks that guy endures are ridiculous. I've been subject to more than my fair share but nothing compared to Dale. That's the immature behavior we don't need around here. Just let Dale be Dale. If you want to debate with him about an archery topic go for it - but the name calling and personal attacks are for sure the acts of people with the maturity of a 2 year old.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

rattlinman said:


> I agree that the knowledge base on here is by far the most vast, but it's how we use that knowledge that makes us look poor. Some folks, like Padgett, try to help folks, and that's a good thing. But others use it to show their backsides or belittle others, kind of like every attack on Dale every time he offers his opinion or how they ran off Nuts and Bolts. As I stated earlier, the Pros and the tv hunters won't post on here anymore, yet they actaully make a living doing what we all only dream of. Wonder why that is? :sad:
> 
> Trust me, outside of our little AT world, we are our own worst enemy. I've been in too many conversations where industry folks commented about the congregation on here. It's not favorable.
> 
> ...


Yeah.....somehow I doubt Ford and Chevy monitor car forums to watch fanboys rip on the other brands..... I dont see Hoyt or Mathews doing here either.

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

BucksnBass525 said:


> You make some very good points, the Tech at my preferred shop refuses to visit AT because of many of the reasons you highlight.
> Anyway back to the original thread question, Hoyt will have a solid line-up that appeals to many in 2019.


I agree. The grip improvement this year alone was almost ignored, where so many others build horrible 2x4 grips or have used the same grip for years.

The new hybrid system will be tweaked slightly to improve on it's already simple tuning design. I've never seen bows tuned so quickly and easily as these are.

The balance designed in these bows are often overlooked as well. It's just something we've come to expect with Hoyt. My friend of mine was setting up a new bow (not Hoyt) last night and wow is it top-heavy!

I will agree with some that the weight issue needs addressed. Carbon should be lighter. Its always easier to add weight than to remove it.

Hoyt always offers a solid line-up and this year will be no different. It will also be expensive, but I'ma firm believer that you get what you pay for in life, and in your hobbies.

I would love to see a longer ata parallel limb target bow...maybe a 37" Hyper Pro

I would also love to see a longer ata carbon turbo. I've fell in love with lighter poundage without losing speed with the turbo models, but I would love to see one like the Ultra or Double X.


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

Predator said:


> Gotta love Cliff. And that suggestion is an interesting one. I actually take the opposite approach. I almost always go into archery shops and play dumb, so to speak, because I like to see what they know or what wisdom they'll want to impart on me. 90% of the time I'm underwhelmed or disappointed. It's unfortunate because there are a lot of guys who walk into those shops that are somewhat clueless (yes, I used that word again despite the apparent sensitivity some around here have to it -lol) and looking for help and I feel like it's the blind leading the blind in some of these shops. If you go to the archery section of a big box store it's far worse. I've seen some scary advice and assistance provided to beginner archers at those places.



I think you missed the point, or inadvertently proved it?



rattlinman said:


> Oh, I have no doubt you are always the smartest one in the room Predator.
> 
> I personally enjoy the AT guys that come rolling into our shop like Cliff on Cheers, telling us that we should be shooting a 825 grain arrow to get the FOC correct, bareshaft their bows out to 100 yards, and shoot 1" groups while doing so. We are always in awe of the knowledge that AT brings to the table. :wink:


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Predator said:


> Agree completely and that was my exact point about being able to share opinions without getting personally attacked for them. Not being a crybaby - trying to encourage more appropriate behavior around here. Dale has a blunt approach but the personal attacks that guy endures are ridiculous. I've been subject to more than my fair share but nothing compared to Dale. That's the immature behavior we don't need around here. Just let Dale be Dale. If you want to debate with him about an archery topic go for it - but the name calling and personal attacks are for sure the acts of people with the maturity of a 2 year old.


I agree and I want to thank you for not getting offended at my comments toward your opinions. I don't know you personally but I enjoy our agreements of opinions on some things and our differences of opinions on a few subjects.

Take nothing I state as a personal attack on you and I will do the same. A healthy debate is always welcome IMO!


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

IN_Varmntr said:


> Wrong. I stated it is quite comical that folks believe that AT alone is responsible for changing the directions that manufactures go. Again, I said nothing regarding you sharing your opinion on this forum. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion. Nowhere in my post did I even say opinion.


Fair enough on your other comments. We don't need to belabor the point beyond this but I did want to comment on the above. Who here ever stated a belief that "AT alone is responsible for changing the direction that manufacturers go"? I certainly don't believe that and I never saw anyone else here make that assertion. You made that comment after some of us simply shared our opinions on areas of improvement for Hoyt which, in the absence of any direct assertion by anyone that we believe Hoyt is thus going to do exactly what we say because we are from AT, suggests you've incorrectly inferred we hold such a ridiculous belief and thus should stop sharing our opinion about Hoyt product under the delusional assumption that they'll somehow follow our advice. That's the only reasonable way I could interpret your comment. If that's not what you meant then I apologize for my interpretation but might also suggest you choose your words more carefully.

While I obviously don't believe AT drives the decisions of the archery companies I do think AT is a significant source of customer feedback from a group that, on average, is far more dedicated to and knowledgeable about archery than the masses. I do believe most of them are paying attention. Having worked for several branded companies I can tell you that only a very poorly run company would pay zero attention to something equivalent to AT. I may well be wrong but I don't believe I am and I'll keep sharing my opinions and desires for any brand I care so spend time commenting on with the belief there there may be people listening at these companies and with the knowledge that there are other AT members listening and who are interested in feedback from others that may have had more experience in general or with a specific product than they have. I've received countless IMs confirming that to be the case and I, myself, have benefited greatly by the opinions (positive and negative) of others here.

Some (not you) want to make the whole of AT out to be a bunch of idiots, crybabies, know-it-alls, etc. - insert whatever adjective you'd like - but I find there is a lot of valuable information to be shared and gained here and if people would just act a little more civilized it would be easier to enjoy those benefits.

In any case, I appreciate your well thought out response and wish you the best.

I'm also very interested in seeing what Hoyt (and others) have to offer and I ALWAYS want every one of these brands to show continuous improvement and come out with awesome products as we all benefit from it.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

rattlinman said:


> I agree and I want to thank you for not getting offended at my comments toward your opinions. I don't know you personally but I enjoy our agreements of opinions on some things and our differences of opinions on a few subjects.
> 
> Take nothing I state as a personal attack on you and I will do the same. A healthy debate is always welcome IMO!


Thank you as well. Deal. I always appreciate everyone's opinions on archery topics - whether I agree or disagree. I often like to debate topics and I'll happily go to the mat, so to speak, on a debate about archery topics. When people start getting personal it loses its appeal quickly and you find yourself in personal defense mode which typically just derails threads - annoying but it happens all too often around here.

Have a good one and BTW, rather than quoting your other post above, I will agree 100% on the balance comment. As stated before, I used to shoot a lot of Hoyt bows. Their balance was always tops in the industry and it's one of the things that has kept me away from Mathews for so long as they seem to have really struggled in that area over the years.


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## BIP (Apr 30, 2013)

What is so tiresome about AT at times is the continual necessity to separate the wheat from the chaff.... I appreciate the pearls of wisdom that are cast before the swine, but dread wading through hip deep threads to find them.


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## 4IDARCHER (Jul 1, 2006)

BIP said:


> What is so tiresome about AT at times is the continual necessity to separate the wheat from the chaff.... I appreciate the pearls of wisdom that are cast before the swine, but dread wading through hip deep threads to find them.


This is true, but I find on most of the social media sites such as the facebook archery pages that you have to wade through even more. At least here the general populace understands basic things such as having a quiver full of the same arrows, or that the price on used bows drops quickly, or at least the VERY basics of tuning. I find when I venture elsewhere I am speaking to a group of people who have zero knowledge of basic archery and bowhunting concepts. I understand we all have to start somewhere but I come here to bypass that learning curve and gather what I can from those that know here on AT.


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## BIP (Apr 30, 2013)

4IDARCHER said:


> This is true, but I find on most of the social media sites such as the facebook archery pages that you have to wade through even more. At least here the general populace understands basic things such as having a quiver full of the same arrows, or that the price on used bows drops quickly, or at least the VERY basics of tuning. I find when I venture elsewhere I am speaking to a group of people who have zero knowledge of basic archery and bowhunting concepts. I understand we all have to start somewhere but I come here to bypass that learning curve and gather what I can from those that know here on AT.



True, but if you stick with the proven people who want to truly mentor via social media (Levi Morgan, John Dudley, Aron Snyder, etal) it shortens the path as well.....


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

BIP said:


> True, but if you stick with the proven people who want to truly mentor via social media (Levi Morgan, John Dudley, Aron Snyder, etal) it shortens the path as well.....


They have some great nuggets but, as I believe 4IDARCHER already pointed out, some of their opinions and comments are VERY tainted by the manufacturers who sponsor them. If you listen to Levi Morgan exclusively (and I'm a big Levi fan) you would have thought Mathews was the best and only bow on the planet. Then you would have thought he changed his mind and found the new best and only bow on the planet in elite. Then you would have thought he yet again changed his mind and once again thought Mathews was the best and only bow on the planet. You'd also think the Triax is the best fitting bow for all people regardless of DL or preferences (never mind the fact that he had to change his anchor to shoot the bow and it's much shorter than his prior (voiced) preferences would have indicated). If you take everything Dudley has to say as gospel we should all be running out to buy HECS suits and we'd be idiots if we didn't. Anyway, you get my point. There are multiple sources of good archery information and to 4IDARCHER's point, you'll find a lot more unbiased (by a big sponsor check $$$) but very experienced archers on AT.


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## Kris87 (Sep 12, 2003)

For the record, I'm always right too.


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## Kris87 (Sep 12, 2003)

Sorry, couldn't resist....


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Kris87 said:


> For the record, I'm always right too.


Well, there was that 1 time you thought you were wrong, but then your realized you were wrong about being right.....:mg:


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

Predator said:


> They have some great nuggets but, as I believe 4IDARCHER already pointed out, some of their opinions and comments are VERY tainted by the manufacturers who sponsor them. If you listen to Levi Morgan exclusively (and I'm a big Levi fan) you would have thought Mathews was the best and only bow on the planet. Then you would have thought he changed his mind and found the new best and only bow on the planet in elite. Then you would have thought he yet again changed his mind and once again thought Mathews was the best and only bow on the planet. You'd also think the Triax is the best fitting bow for all people regardless of DL or preferences (never mind the fact that he had to change his anchor to shoot the bow and it's much shorter than his prior (voiced) preferences would have indicated). If you take everything Dudley has to say as gospel we should all be running out to buy HECS suits and we'd be idiots if we didn't. Anyway, you get my point. There are multiple sources of good archery information and to 4IDARCHER's point, you'll find a lot more unbiased (by a big sponsor check $$$) but very experienced archers on AT.


BUT, archerytalk is filled with a lot of people who don't know what they are talking about. Like, alot of them. THis is very important when new archers come on and ask questions or when they just read what others say. This is how we end up with things like people shooting whisker biscuits.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

friedm1 said:


> BUT, archerytalk is filled with a lot of people who don't know what they are talking about. Like, alot of them. THis is very important when new archers come on and ask questions or when they just read what others say. This is how we end up with things like people shooting whisker biscuits.


Oh I agree. You do have to figure out who's providing you information and whether they actually know what they are talking about. I love the whisker biscuit comment - lol! The only purpose I've ever seen for a whisker biscuit is for a demo bow at a pro shop and even then I'm annoyed by them.


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## Gamover06 (Aug 20, 2014)

Ta think I was checking this thread for Hoyt rumors. Hahaha. Not going to lie when I see threads that have 3 or more pages I check them out to see how they derailed. Its like playing telephone back when you were in school, the teacher were would tell a student something and then it would get passed thoughout the class.


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## Punch_Master (Jul 24, 2002)

I'd like Hoyt to make a parallel limbed, carbon risered, target bow ~ 38" ATA and 7" BH with a smooth draw cycle and no cam lean.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

Still no concrete release date?


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## Schambo (Sep 5, 2015)

Gamover06 said:


> Ta think I was checking this thread for Hoyt rumors. Hahaha. Not going to lie when I see threads that have 3 or more pages I check them out to see how they derailed. Its like playing telephone back when you were in school, the teacher were would tell a student something and then it would get passed thoughout the class.


Lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

Punch_Master said:


> I'd like Hoyt to make a parallel limbed, carbon risered, target bow ~ 38" ATA and 7" BH with a smooth draw cycle and no cam lean.


Heck at this point I'll just take one with some decent nock travel! Lol 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

PAKraig said:


> Still no concrete release date?


If I had to put money on it, I'd say the 22nd or 23rd. Last year I think was the 20th and with no little teasers this week, I'd say its the following week. But who knows!

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

I think it may leak the 19th... :wink:


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## whack n stack (Dec 23, 2007)

Summit3 said:


> Heck at this point I'll just take one with some decent nock travel! Lol
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


That's no joke!

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

It kind of is though. Their bows tune EXCELLENT every year ,and every model but one... (one time)


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## centershot (Sep 13, 2002)

Punch_Master said:


> I'd like Hoyt to make a parallel limbed, carbon risered, target bow ~ 38" ATA and 7" BH with a smooth draw cycle and no cam lean.


I'll take one of those in camo.


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## whack n stack (Dec 23, 2007)

THE ELKMAN said:


> It kind of is though. Their bows tune EXCELLENT every year ,and every model but one... (one time)


They all tune just fine fine, sure, if that includes having your nocking point set up below 90°. Lots of them tune at 90° to the string, but lots tune lower than 90°, including this years bows. Looks like crap set up...vanes must barely miss launchers.

Like I said Hoytman, I love Hoyt, but my love isn't blind. 



Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


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## psychobaby111 (Mar 23, 2008)

My rx1 tuned up nice and shot great. I just didn't like the splitter.


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## rmscustom (Mar 7, 2011)

whack n stack said:


> They all tune just fine fine, sure, if that includes having your nocking point set up below 90°. Lots of them tune at 90° to the string, but lots tune lower than 90°, including this years bows. Looks like crap set up...vanes must barely miss launchers.
> 
> Like I said Hoytman, I love Hoyt, but my love isn't blind.
> 
> ...


Truth^^^ 
Rx1 nock low tunes are grip related imo. While they might feel warm and fuzzy they’re kinda fussy. Meanwhile their competitors grip that feels like a brick or a 2x4 just shoots without thinking about it.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

whack n stack said:


> They all tune just fine fine, sure, if that includes having your nocking point set up below 90°. Lots of them tune at 90° to the string, but lots tune lower than 90°, including this years bows. Looks like crap set up...vanes must barely miss launchers.
> 
> Like I said Hoytman, I love Hoyt, but my love isn't blind.
> 
> ...


They DO NOT tune like that this year. Nor did they last year. (Or the year before that for that matter unless it was a 34 #2 cam) They tune perfectly level. I should know I've set up one or two...


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

Just about the last 3-4 years have consistently tuned 1/8" nock high at our shop. Love Hoyts but compared to a Binary Overdrive or say PSE's quad track binary cam, Hoyts have much room for improvement.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Summit3 said:


> Just about the last 3-4 years have consistently tuned 1/8" nock high at our shop. Love Hoyts but compared to a Binary Overdrive or say PSE's quad track binary cam, Hoyts have much room for improvement.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


True...


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## nutshopsquirrel (Nov 30, 2017)

So... Whats the scoop? This week or what???


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## Summit3 (Sep 23, 2018)

nutshopsquirrel said:


> So... Whats the scoop? This week or what???


Nov 1 its sounding like.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## Kris87 (Sep 12, 2003)

I shot Hoyts for 10 years. I loved Hoyt and still do. Then I decided to go with the PSE simply because I loved the Evolve cam. I've always said, if I could build a dream bow, it would be a Hoyt Carbon 34" bow, 6" BH, with the small Evolve SE cam. You want to talk about a sweet a** bow, that would be it.


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

Kris87 said:


> I shot Hoyts for 10 years. I loved Hoyt and still do. Then I decided to go with the PSE simply because I loved the Evolve cam. I've always said, if I could build a dream bow, it would be a Hoyt Carbon 34" bow, 6" BH, with the small Evolve SE cam. You want to talk about a sweet a** bow, that would be it.


I heard this year Hoyt will have 31" & 34" carbon and aluminum.


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## Times Tunnels (Sep 19, 2011)

Summit3 said:


> Nov 1 its sounding like.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


Is that set in stone or just a guess?


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

Times Tunnels said:


> Is that set in stone or just a guess?


probably a hypothesis.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

It's going to be the best hoyt ever. I am sure.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

That_TN_Guy said:


> I heard this year Hoyt will have 31" & 34" carbon and aluminum.


Nothing earth shattering or surprising about those specs. It's going to be all about the cam system for Hoyt. If it's the same 'ol, same 'ol people aren't going to get excited about the specs. If they find a way to make a material improvement in the cams (or just pay PSE to use the evolve cams - lol) their will be some noise around the release. That's my thoughts anyway.


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## Times Tunnels (Sep 19, 2011)

trial153 said:


> It's going to be the best hoyt ever. I am sure.


Well that sucks. That means everything they make in the future isn't going to be any better.


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## schmidtlein7 (Aug 11, 2018)

Not yet...


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## mrbirdog (Oct 17, 2009)

Times Tunnels said:


> Well that sucks. That means everything they make in the future isn't going to be any better.


Stop it youre killin me ...way to funny LOL


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## Times Tunnels (Sep 19, 2011)

mrbirdog said:


> Stop it youre killin me ...way to funny LOL


I'm glad you got a laugh out of it but its not that funny


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## Paddylad (Dec 13, 2017)

30" and 34" Carbon, 30" Alum ... just ordered a couple of the 2019 preview bows ....also a new camo - Gore Optifade Elevated II ! I'm picking they will probably drop the Under Armour camo since they are getting out of the hunting market ...


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## Tiggie_00 (Jul 18, 2009)

Sounds like a Mathews Triax 



CSchelk2 said:


> This was posted today by a friend of mine on facebook; he is a head tech at a hoyt shop.
> 
> View attachment 6617153


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## 4IDARCHER (Jul 1, 2006)

Paddylad said:


> 30" and 34" Carbon, 30" Alum ... just ordered a couple of the 2019 preview bows ....also a new camo - Gore Optifade Elevated II ! I'm picking they will probably drop the Under Armour camo since they are getting out of the hunting market ...


Wondered when the EVII info would leak out. Hopefully it is applied well.


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## Tiggie_00 (Jul 18, 2009)

The Hoyt 2019 Catalog Leaked...

https://s3.hoyt.com/uploads/images/...8056afb6-bbe31cf805fecc55c9e611e276c4f011.pdf


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

Predator said:


> Nothing earth shattering or surprising about those specs. It's going to be all about the cam system for Hoyt. If it's the same 'ol, same 'ol people aren't going to get excited about the specs. If they find a way to make a material improvement in the cams (or just pay PSE to use the evolve cams - lol) their will be some noise around the release. That's my thoughts anyway.


the rx-1 cams were my favorite of any 18's I shot, easiest draw of any of them I shot. not as smooth as the triax, but not as stiff either (if that makes sense) reminded me most to the realm x on comfort. I do realize it should be an easy draw cycle due to the speed they put out, but nonetheless, it was my favorite draw cycle of all I shot.

I realize they also had some issues, but that isn't too surprising with any company, Mathews and elite did too. I know they aren't worth the extra money to most, but I think the RX-1 was really under rated, I think it's a great bow. really good natural balance, and maintains that well with accessories. most hate it because of the price, not because how it shoots and handles.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

roosiebull said:


> the rx-1 cams were my favorite of any 18's I shot, easiest draw of any of them I shot. not as smooth as the triax, but not as stiff either (if that makes sense) reminded me most to the realm x on comfort. I do realize it should be an easy draw cycle due to the speed they put out, but nonetheless, it was my favorite draw cycle of all I shot.
> 
> I realize they also had some issues, but that isn't too surprising with any company, Mathews and elite did too. I know they aren't worth the extra money to most, but I think the RX-1 was really under rated, I think it's a great bow. really good natural balance, and maintains that well with accessories. most hate it because of the price, not because how it shoots and handles.


With Hoyt it's more about the tuning than the draw cycle.


----------



## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

Tiggie_00 said:


> The Hoyt 2019 Catalog Leaked...
> 
> https://s3.hoyt.com/uploads/images/...8056afb6-bbe31cf805fecc55c9e611e276c4f011.pdf
> 
> View attachment 6633953


Common Tig...you've got to do better than that. I expected you to photoshop the whole '18 catalog into a '19 one.


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## RavinHood (Sep 17, 2015)

Predator said:


> Common Tig...you've got to do better than that. I expected you to photoshop the whole '18 catalog into a '19 one.


 You guys are hilarious


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Predator said:


> With Hoyt it's more about the tuning than the draw cycle.


They tune very well, and very easily. Anyone who is struggling with these cams is a novice at best... (I agree though, Hoyt needs to bring something genuinely "new" to the market or they are lagging)


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## Kris87 (Sep 12, 2003)

THE ELKMAN said:


> They tune very well, and very easily. Anyone who is struggling with these cams is a novice at best... (I agree though, Hoyt needs to bring something genuinely "new" to the market or they are lagging)


I honestly heard like two or three years ago they bought (or were buying) a binary patent or paying someone to use one. That never materialized, but I thought it was going to happen.


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## hunter9264 (Mar 7, 2018)

Lot of Hoyt haters here.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

hunter9264 said:


> Lot of Hoyt haters here.


they are the most prolific of all brand haters. I have not owned a hoyt since my carbon element, and have not even shot any the last few years, but I certainly will give them a fair shake this year. after shooting all of the rx-1's this summer, I was pretty bummed I didn't shoot them before buying a triax. 

I am not well versed on hoyt, but my buddy's ultra tuned easy and stayed that way. I bet most of the hoyt haters have not even handled one (like any other brand haters) if I had bought an rx-1, I wouldn't be bow shopping again this year.


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## Tiggie_00 (Jul 18, 2009)

I retired. I'm getting too old to have Hoyt knocking on my door saying shame on me for hacking their website. Lol  



Predator said:


> Common Tig...you've got to do better than that. I expected you to photoshop the whole '18 catalog into a '19 one.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Dealers will have them in house before the release. That is what they delayed for.


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## Spency (Oct 29, 2009)

This was part of my thinking. After all of the complaining the past couple years about availability, think they'll focus on doing a better job this year.


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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

Tiggie_00 said:


> The Hoyt 2019 Catalog Leaked...
> 
> https://s3.hoyt.com/uploads/images/...8056afb6-bbe31cf805fecc55c9e611e276c4f011.pdf
> 
> View attachment 6633953


Lol looks like the 2018 one


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## jmann28 (Nov 22, 2010)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Jimmyno13 (Mar 20, 2016)

Tiggie_00 said:


> The Hoyt 2019 Catalog Leaked...
> 
> https://s3.hoyt.com/uploads/images/...8056afb6-bbe31cf805fecc55c9e611e276c4f011.pdf
> 
> View attachment 6633953


If only!


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## HighwayHunter (Feb 21, 2018)

THE ELKMAN said:


> They DO NOT tune like that this year. Nor did they last year. (Or the year before that for that matter unless it was a 34 #2 cam) They tune perfectly level. I should know I've set up one or two...


I shoot a pro defiant 34 and I’m shooting slightly nock low. Had some troubles tuning it but it think I’ve finally got it set right. Been finicky. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## enkriss (Apr 10, 2009)

Tiggie_00 said:


> The Hoyt 2019 Catalog Leaked...
> 
> https://s3.hoyt.com/uploads/images/...8056afb6-bbe31cf805fecc55c9e611e276c4f011.pdf
> 
> View attachment 6633953


Wow.... they must be struggling!...:wink:


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## HighwayHunter (Feb 21, 2018)

Can’t wait for the 2019’s to come out so I can buy a cheap RX-1 ultra[emoji41]


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Paddylad said:


> 30" and 34" Carbon, 30" Alum ... just ordered a couple of the 2019 preview bows ....also a new camo - Gore Optifade Elevated II ! I'm picking they will probably drop the Under Armour camo since they are getting out of the hunting market ...


That elev 2 should look great in that washed out dippin process!! lol
Step up Hoyt, pse did on their finish process!


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Paddylad said:


> 30" and 34" Carbon, 30" Alum ... just ordered a couple of the 2019 preview bows ....also a new camo - Gore Optifade Elevated II ! I'm picking they will probably drop the Under Armour camo since they are getting out of the hunting market ...


The elev 2 outta good great in their washed out finish! We can only hope.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

Did admins freeze this thread?


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Don't seem like it


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Don't seem like it


Must've been something with my settings. I couldn't see page 10 til I posted that 

So the new cam system is a "new" Hyper ZT? Or a single cam on a new entry-level bow?

Edit: I had to grab a picture of mine and put it side-by-side with the "leaked" picture of the 2019. Now I see it. New one looks like a Halon cam :mg:


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

A smooth drawing 342fps, even more quiet and deader in the hand than the Triax 


That’s what I heard.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

173BC said:


> A smooth drawing 342fps, even more quiet and deader in the hand than the Triax
> 
> 
> That’s what I heard.


If so, I'm in. I liked the Triax but not the grip or the balance. I'm a big fan of the new Xact grip and the RX1's draw with 80% mods. Very interested in the new one....and maybe an RX1 Turbo for 3D and back up hunting. :wink:


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## whack n stack (Dec 23, 2007)

173BC said:


> A smooth drawing 342fps, even more quiet and deader in the hand than the Triax
> 
> 
> That’s what I heard.


That has my interest piqued. 

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


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## huntertroy (Feb 16, 2010)

There's suppose to be a new vibration and dampening system I dont see on the leaked photo


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## Bshale79 (Feb 23, 2018)

Heard Tuesday is the big day


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## azscorpion (Feb 12, 2010)

Bshale79 said:


> Heard Tuesday is the big day


Thursday November 1st is what I heard


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

huntertroy said:


> There's suppose to be a new vibration and dampening system I dont see on the leaked photo


mercury in the carbon tubes.... kinda like a bench rest rifle:wink: mercury tubes are high class recoil reduction. I think Mathews uses lead to reduce vibration, so Hoyt is outta luck there


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## huntertroy (Feb 16, 2010)

roosiebull said:


> mercury in the carbon tubes.... kinda like a bench rest rifle:wink: mercury tubes are high class recoil reduction. I think Mathews uses lead to reduce vibration, so Hoyt is outta luck there


Very interesting


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

THE ELKMAN said:


> I think it may leak the 19th... :wink:


I was 7 days late on this ^^^___ (But the release pushed back 7 days too, so...)


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

huntertroy said:


> Very interesting



That MAAAY be a joke...:mg:


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## huntertroy (Feb 16, 2010)

THE ELKMAN said:


> That MAAAY be a joke...:mg:


Yes, I forgot to add the lol to my comment... lol


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## arctic hunter (Sep 7, 2004)

Whatever they come up with, I hope it doesn't require adapters to use my LCA press. That is a hassle.


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## arrowblaster (Feb 9, 2004)

173bc said:


> a smooth drawing 342fps, even more quiet and deader in the hand than the triax
> 
> 
> that’s what i heard.


:roflmao:


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

arrowblaster said:


> :roflmao:


I guess we’ll see. 

One of us is going to be looking for a good crow recipe.


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## Adamsdjr (Aug 17, 2015)

173BC said:


> A smooth drawing 342fps, even more quiet and deader in the hand than the Triax
> 
> 
> That’s what I heard.


Turbo?


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## SHPoet (Nov 13, 2009)

I know, I know, I know!!!!!!

But I can't tell......


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

Adamsdjr said:


> Turbo?


I’m not sure, that’s all I was told. From what I hear the aluminum riser Hoyt is increadible. I didn’t hear about the carbon riser, i imagine it’s using the same Cam though. I think the success of the Triax has the industry focused on smooth, vibe free bows.


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## enkriss (Apr 10, 2009)

THE ELKMAN said:


> I was 7 days late on this ^^^___ (But the release pushed back 7 days too, so...)


You may want to take a pregnancy test...


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

I heard even the accessories have all been redone, sights, quivers, everything.


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## sambone (Mar 12, 2014)

There will be a new Carbon Riser... 31" and 34" (or 35"?) There will be a Turbo also. 

My guess is limbs will be the same as RedWrx. I still don't know if it will be the Redwrx cams, or new cams on the 2019s.. 

The goal is to get as vibe free as possible because the TRIAX killed it last year. Hope HOYT came up with something sweet because $1600-1700 is a lot for a bow.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

sambone said:


> There will be a new Carbon Riser... 31" and 34" (or 35"?) There will be a Turbo also.
> 
> My guess is limbs will be the same as RedWrx. I still don't know if it will be the Redwrx cams, or new cams on the 2019s..
> 
> The goal is to get as vibe free as possible because the TRIAX killed it last year. Hope HOYT came up with something sweet because $1600-1700 is a lot for a bow.


I'll be interested in the 31 if there's no vibration. That's my only minor gripe about the RX1 is the little bit of handshock I just can't tune out.

I'll be on the lookout for a leftover RX1 Turbo as well maybe, I liked the 65 lber I had.


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## sambone (Mar 12, 2014)

PAKraig said:


> I'll be interested in the 31 if there's no vibration. That's my only minor gripe about the RX1 is the little bit of handshock I just can't tune out.
> 
> I'll be on the lookout for a leftover RX1 Turbo as well maybe, I liked the 65 lber I had.


That Redwrx Turbo was their best offering last year, IMO. The draw cycle was so close to the regular 32" Redwrx and you get the extra performance, I was surprised everyone didn't go Turbo.

Im looking forward to seeing the new HOYT bows. Im trying to stick to my guns this year and Not buy a new bow. I am loving my Xpeditions so much I don't think I can do better for a hunting rig, but nonetheless I get stoked every year to see what comes out. 
I am impressed with the new PSE evoke 31 and 35. Really nice offering


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Havent owned a hoyt in 3 years. We shall see.


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## 0nepin (Sep 16, 2009)

If they can solve the hand shock issues and lack of speed and then made it lighter hoyt would have a winners


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## HighwayHunter (Feb 21, 2018)

0nepin said:


> If they can solve the hand shock issues and lack of speed and then made it lighter hoyt would have a winners


Lighter than the RX-1?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

0nepin said:


> If they can solve the hand shock issues and lack of speed and then made it lighter hoyt would have a winners


i'm guessin' you hate it....just a hunch:wink:


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

80% mods fixed the speed issue. Mine is close to 343 IBO with the 80s


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

0nepin said:


> If they can solve the hand shock issues and lack of speed and then made it lighter hoyt would have a winners





roosiebull said:


> i'm guessin' you hate it....just a hunch:wink:


Hate isn't even close. He's closer to Cesar Sayoc obsessive hate. Just do a post search on him. He jumps on every Hoyt thread to bash.

If Hoyt hits a homerun, they might want to avoid their mail.


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

PAKraig said:


> 80% mods fixed the speed issue. Mine is close to 343 IBO with the 80s


And a bow technician who knows how to tune a bow takes care of the hand shock.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

173BC said:


> And a bow technician who knows how to tune a bow takes care of the hand shock.


Not so far, but I haven't yet handed it to my buddy who has offered.


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## ClinEastwood (Feb 28, 2015)

I always liked Hoyt. But I’m surprised that their new bows have barely improved over the years other than looks. Which is debatable


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## naterb (Apr 7, 2014)

rattlinman said:


> Hate isn't even close. He's closer to Cesar Sayoc obsessive hate. Just do a post search on him. He jumps on every Hoyt thread to bash.
> 
> If Hoyt hits a homerun, they might want to avoid their mail.


Hahaha I was bored and went down this rabbit hole. More like @Hoytroll

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## bradywk (May 31, 2018)

Confirmed Nov. 1 release by Hoyt's social media accounts.


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## drew154 (Jan 21, 2017)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ohiohunter02 (Mar 23, 2005)

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Hoyt new cam system will have a wide limb platform top and bottom similar to the halon series. The next generation hyper zt cam system will mimic the pse evolve cam and mathews cross centric cams with no yokes and a 5pc string set. That seems to be the route that all top manufacturers are going with nowadays. 

Just my 2 cents...

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

That limb may break...:zip:


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

THE ELKMAN said:


> That limb may break...:zip:


Wrong brand.....


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## ILLBUCK (Jun 19, 2017)

drew154 said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Says right there in their add new carbon and aluminum riser! Its half carbon, half aluminum!


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## MNarrow (Nov 10, 2009)

OMG a Carbuminum riser!!!


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## chris51992 (Mar 26, 2015)

ILLBUCK said:


> Says right there in their add new carbon and aluminum riser! Its half carbon, half aluminum!


True statement.


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

MNarrow said:


> OMG a Carbuminum riser!!!


Hopefully that will be a lot cheaper than the Unobtanium they've been using...


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## bigbucks170 (Feb 2, 2006)

wow they just don't have a grip ...they have a whole grip system on a bow...everything is new... Amazing


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## ILLBUCK (Jun 19, 2017)

Top half carbon so it's not so top heavy perhaps?


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## jfin4480 (May 4, 2015)

I have heard a lot of people with knocks on hoyts for some things and knocks on Mathews for some things, and all bow companies for that matter. However, I feel this is the first comment I have seen about hoyts being top heavy! Guess everyone has their own opinion.^^^^


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## ILLBUCK (Jun 19, 2017)

I have a hoyt hyperforce...it's not top heavy. I also have a halon 32...it's top heavy!!! Didn't mean it as a complaint on hoyts just maybe a reason it could or would be half carbon half aluminum!

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## bigbucks170 (Feb 2, 2006)

it can not be half carbon half aluminum ....its 1/4 Glue too, to give it that legendary toughness


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

All the Hoyt carbons have been a mix of carbon (center) and aluminum (at the ends). As best I can tell, it's the same basic concept, just a new design.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

I will be verrry interested in what direction they go with the new "riser technology". 

I hadn't thought of the mix of carbon/aluminum, similar to a ACC or Full metal jacket arrow. would it make it lighter or heavier? 

I know someone else promoted the idea of adding a dampening medium inside the tubes, but I would assume that would add weight as well.

Just so I don't sound completely like a "koolaid drinker" (even though I am), I will be surprised to see a smoother yet faster cam system. That usually is a trade-off in the cam dynamics, although I hear alot of remarks about the RealmX being smooth and fast, so maybe it's do-able?


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## ILLBUCK (Jun 19, 2017)

I just think in the pic, the bottom half(below grip) looks aluminum and top half looks carbon..?


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## gymrat70 (Apr 13, 2006)

ohiohunter02 said:


> I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Hoyt new cam system will have a wide limb platform top and bottom similar to the halon series. The next generation hyper zt cam system will mimic the pse evolve cam and mathews cross centric cams with no yokes and a 5pc string set. That seems to be the route that all top manufacturers are going with nowadays.
> 
> Just my 2 cents...
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


If they change the cam system to this it will blow everyone's minds. Would be a great move for Hoyt.


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## ILLBUCK (Jun 19, 2017)

rattlinman said:


> I will be verrry interested in what direction they go with the new "riser technology".
> 
> I hadn't thought of the mix of carbon/aluminum, similar to a ACC or Full metal jacket arrow. would it make it lighter or heavier?
> 
> ...


I just picked up my first PSE (Evoke 31) a couple weeks ago and I would call it smooth and fast!! Faster than my hyperforce just going off of what sight tapes I used. So far Im really liking that Evoke!!


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

ILLBUCK said:


> I just think in the pic, the bottom half(below grip) looks aluminum and top half looks carbon..?


It's not, otherwise the riser itself would be threaded. The picture shows aluminum "nuts" inserted into the riser, just like the current carbon risers.

I think everyone is reading into the ad WAAAYYYY too much. New carbon riser tech and new aluminum riser tech. 2 separate ideas that some marketing guy mashed together incorrectly.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

ILLBUCK said:


> I just picked up my first PSE (Evoke 31) a couple weeks ago and I would call it smooth and fast!! Faster than my hyperforce just going off of what sight tapes I used. So far Im really liking that Evoke!!


And that would possibly require them to move toward a binary type cam? I'm partial to the hybrid cam myself and they've done alot of innovation in the Hyper cam, so it will be interesting......


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

rattlinman said:


> I will be verrry interested in what direction they go with the new "riser technology".
> 
> I hadn't thought of the mix of carbon/aluminum, similar to a ACC or Full metal jacket arrow. would it make it lighter or heavier?
> 
> ...


The Realm X is the pinnacle of smooth draw and speed. In performance setting it transitions to full draw so well that you would expect it to want to rip your arm off, but it doesn't. It's a short valley but very obvious. Impressive bow. 

Even the RX1 draws very nicely. I'd prefer a bit stiffer backwall, like the Realm, but it's still very nice. 

Excited to see the new release from Hoyt on Thursday.


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## ILLBUCK (Jun 19, 2017)

PAKraig said:


> It's not, otherwise the riser itself would be threaded. The picture shows aluminum "nuts" inserted into the riser, just like the current carbon risers.
> 
> I think everyone is reading into the ad WAAAYYYY too much. New carbon riser tech and new aluminum riser tech. 2 separate ideas that some marketing guy mashed together incorrectly.


Still looks aluminum to me. Might just be an aluminum nutsert so in the event of it getting stripped out it could be replaced and not have a ruined riser perhaps?? Thats just the machinist in me coming out... fixed way to many stripped aluminum threads in my time!! LOL


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

ILLBUCK said:


> Still looks aluminum to me. Might just be an aluminum nutsert so in the event of it getting stripped out it could be replaced and not have a ruined riser perhaps?? Thats just the machinist in me coming out... fixed way to many stripped aluminum threads in my time!! LOL


I've used a few stainless bolts to "rethread" a few attachment points so your message hasn't fallen on deaf ears!

I just know that the aluminum riser Hoyts don't look like the "leaked" pictured bow.


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## BuLzEyE (May 22, 2002)

bigbucks170 said:


> wow they just don't have a grip ...they have a whole grip system on a bow...everything is new... Amazing


maybe a magnetic or clip in grip so you can change between panels or full wraparound?


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

rattlinman said:


> I will be verrry interested in what direction they go with the new "riser technology".
> 
> I hadn't thought of the mix of carbon/aluminum, similar to a ACC or Full metal jacket arrow. would it make it lighter or heavier?
> 
> ...


looks probably have little to with how a cam functions, but it looks like the new cam will not be as easy to draw, I honestly don't give a rats rear about "smooth" I like easy drawing bows. my triax IS smoother than the RX-1, and it is also smoother than my chill r was, but the rx-1 and chill r have a really similar draw, and the weight comes really easy on both compared to my triax. 

I like the rx-1 draw much more than my triax pound for pound. I have my triax at 69lbs (had a broken rib when I bought it, it tops out at 73# and maxed it out at a later date and liked it better at 69#) the triax has a stiff draw. my chill r I shot at 73lbs, and thought it would be a very manageable bow at 80lbs.


people touted how smooth the HTR was too, I hated that draw! I don't like smooth drawing, I like easy drawing bows, I really hope Hoyt doesn't go more towards the crosscentric feel. it's a great cam in it's own right, but I like the RX-1 MUCH better. it was my favorite draw cycle of 18'... I do realize it's all personal preference. 


one nice thing about it, the RX-1 line will not vanish into dust when the new Hoyts come out, i'm really hoping to like Hoyt best this year (either the new ones, or the RX-1 line) as of now, if I was buying today, I would go shoot an ultra vs a turbo and buy the one I like best, but it would certainly be an RX-1. I can't believe how many folks don't like them. a couple cheap and easy mods and they are very quiet, and plenty "dead in the hand"


Predator was always talking crap about "dead in the hand" being a useless marketing term, it took me shooting some other bows to realize it, but he's right. a little buzz at the shot has no negative effect, doesn't effect the shot or hurt, why is it such a big deal? if you build a 28" bow that weighs 4 and a half pounds, it better be dead in the hand!


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

ILLBUCK said:


> Still looks aluminum to me. Might just be an aluminum nutsert so in the event of it getting stripped out it could be replaced and not have a ruined riser perhaps?? Thats just the machinist in me coming out... fixed way to many stripped aluminum threads in my time!! LOL


I think the part you are referring to probably IS aluminum. did you see the other thread about carbon bows being carbon and aluminum? those parts that look aluminum to you probably are the aluminum "caps" on the end of the risers, someone mentioned all carbon bows are that way, some caps are bigger than others... makes sense, but I didn't know that


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## chris51992 (Mar 26, 2015)

PAKraig said:


> It's not, otherwise the riser itself would be threaded. The picture shows aluminum "nuts" inserted into the riser, just like the current carbon risers.
> 
> I think everyone is reading into the ad WAAAYYYY too much. New carbon riser tech and new aluminum riser tech. 2 separate ideas that some marketing guy mashed together incorrectly.


At least one if not all of the new carbon bows will have some sort of “hybrid technology” that mixes aluminum and carbon together. Carbon above the grip and aluminum below the grip. If I’m lyin’ I’m dyin’


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

chris51992 said:


> At least one if not all of the new carbon bows will have some sort of “hybrid technology” that mixes aluminum and carbon together. Carbon above the grip and aluminum below the grip. If I’m lyin’ I’m dyin’


Read the post right above yours. I've owned a few carbon Hoyts and the portion that the limb pockets bolt to has always been aluminum. The risers have always been a good bit of carbon in the middle with aluminum ends. Nature of the beast.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

ILLBUCK said:


> Still looks aluminum to me. Might just be an aluminum nutsert so in the event of it getting stripped out it could be replaced and not have a ruined riser perhaps?? Thats just the machinist in me coming out... fixed way to many stripped aluminum threads in my time!! LOL


There's a transition near the end of the riser from carbon to aluminum, I would expect it to be that way at both ends of the 2019 risers, just as it has been for every "carbon" Hoyt.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

nestly said:


> There's a transition near the end of the riser from carbon to aluminum, I would expect it to be that way at both ends of the 2019 risers, just as it has been for every "carbon" Hoyt.


:thumbs_up


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## ILLBUCK (Jun 19, 2017)

nestly said:


> There's a transition near the end of the riser from carbon to aluminum, I would expect it to be that way at both ends of the 2019 risers, just as it has been for every "carbon" Hoyt.


I will buy that...the part below the transition line you drew on the 2019 eiser is what I was talking about being aluminum!!

Sent from my moto e5 supra using Tapatalk


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

roosiebull said:


> looks probably have little to with how a cam functions, but it looks like the new cam will not be as easy to draw, I honestly don't give a rats rear about "smooth" I like easy drawing bows. my triax IS smoother than the RX-1, and it is also smoother than my chill r was, but the rx-1 and chill r have a really similar draw, and the weight comes really easy on both compared to my triax.
> 
> I like the rx-1 draw much more than my triax pound for pound. I have my triax at 69lbs (had a broken rib when I bought it, it tops out at 73# and maxed it out at a later date and liked it better at 69#) the triax has a stiff draw. my chill r I shot at 73lbs, and thought it would be a very manageable bow at 80lbs.
> 
> ...


How can 2 people on totally opposite ends of a country agree soooo much!! Good call roosie!! 

I never really thought about it, but yeah, "easy to draw" and "smooooooth" are not the same same thing. The DFC on my RX-1 is much nicer than the Triax I owned for a week which was VERY stiff up front, but ok after that. Have you shot a Hyper ZT w/ the 80% mods on it?? To me, that DFC is perfect, and not big drop into the valley, just a nice transition making it smooth and easy. One of the easiest to draw 2018s though has to be the PSE Expedite w/ the fast modules on it. I didn't care for the back wall at all though, the bow could've needed a tune


----------



## HoosierArcher88 (Jan 10, 2013)

ILLBUCK said:


> I just think in the pic, the bottom half(below grip) looks aluminum and top half looks carbon..?


almost looks like the bottom half is indeed aluminum and the left side of the upper half appears to be as well, with carbon tubing fused to the other side and bridging out.


----------



## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

HoosierArcher88 said:


> almost looks like the bottom half is indeed aluminum and the left side of the upper half appears to be as well, with carbon tubing fused to the other side and bridging out.


I agree, and this may be the use of aluminum inner lining similar to an ACC arrow may come into play. Inner strength of aluminum with an outer, lightweight weight carbon shell to cut down on weight, increase stiffness, and allow them to avoid using the aluminum pocket transitions?

Verrry interesting if this is the case.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

can the 1st hurry up and get here?!


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## hoytman2979 (Apr 4, 2009)

I am hoping for 33 plus ata and 7 in Plus brace height. The rest can be worked out.


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

hoytman2979 said:


> I am hoping for 33 plus ata and 7 in Plus brace height. The rest can be worked out.


Copy that!

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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

can some of you notice the difference between 6 and 7" brace height? I have had a few of each, and just never noticed any difference.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

roosiebull said:


> can some of you notice the difference between 6 and 7" brace height? I have had a few of each, and just never noticed any difference.


My personal experience is it depends on your draw length. 28" or less, never notice the difference IMO.


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## hoytman2979 (Apr 4, 2009)

I see a big difference when I am late season bow hunting.


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## Rhyno_09 (Dec 5, 2012)

rattlinman said:


> My personal experience is it depends on your draw length. 28" or less, never notice the difference IMO.


I'm at 30" and never noticed a difference. But with that being said I did try a 5" brace height (Mathews Halon 32) and did not care for it. 

I would say I an inch should not make a difference, but then again, my wife might disagree


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

rattlinman said:


> My personal experience is it depends on your draw length. 28" or less, never notice the difference IMO.


makes sense. i'm between 28-29" (depending on the bow) and I have tried to notice a difference but just haven't, maybe there is, but it's certainly not obvious to me.


another thing that may matter is I have NEVER bow hunted in the snow, it's rare to get cold weather here (below freezing) so I am usually not in heavy clothes, and the majority of my archery hunting is elk, and there is NO chance of snow here in Sept. we go years between getting snow that sticks more than a day, haha.


when I archery hunt deer, it can get cold late season, but not cold to most. I know at some point it matters, so I assume any decrease in brace height matters some.


if brace height didn't matter, we would see lots of bows under 5" just for speed. anything above 6" brace height seems the same to me, just curious what others thought.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

PAKraig said:


> How can 2 people on totally opposite ends of a country agree soooo much!! Good call roosie!!
> 
> I never really thought about it, but yeah, "easy to draw" and "smooooooth" are not the same same thing. The DFC on my RX-1 is much nicer than the Triax I owned for a week which was VERY stiff up front, but ok after that. Have you shot a Hyper ZT w/ the 80% mods on it?? To me, that DFC is perfect, and not big drop into the valley, just a nice transition making it smooth and easy. One of the easiest to draw 2018s though has to be the PSE Expedite w/ the fast modules on it. I didn't care for the back wall at all though, the bow could've needed a tune


And it's even smoother with the 75% pegs...


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

roosiebull said:


> can some of you notice the difference between 6 and 7" brace height? I have had a few of each, and just never noticed any difference.


That brace height "issue" is 100% between a persons ears. It has been proven that lock time is irrelevant. What people notice (And should) is the riser geometry on a lot of the lower brace bows. If the riser is highly deflexed it will be A LOT more difficult to shoot accurately/ie. less forgiving.(Because of riser deflection issues) But if you achieve said lower brace with limb length/angle and keep the riser fairly neutral, no human can react fast enough to jack it up. And with string stops now present on everything, if you are shooting the correct draw length and properly fitted/tuned bow you will be able to shoot a 5 inch brace bow in a polar bear suit...


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

hoytman2979 said:


> I see a big difference when I am late season bow hunting.


Your draw length is wrong then...


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## brokenlittleman (Oct 18, 2006)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Your draw length is wrong then...


So why do target archers shoot longer bh bows then?


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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

brokenlittleman said:


> So why do target archers shoot longer bh bows then?


Yeah agree not many 5" bh bows on the line there or 28“ ata bows but it doesn't matter per ELKMAN


As for me i can tell the difference between some 6, 7 and 8 bh bows, but i will say i shoot an elite pulse 6" bh bow probably the best even over my hoyt 8" bh bow. Where i can tell the difference is when i think i made a poor follow thru the 6" are usually a couple more inchs out compared to when i feel that way compared to an 8" bh. 7 and 8 are really the same for me and some 6 are to but there were a couple 6" bh bows i did poor with when my form wasn't completely perfect


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

brokenlittleman said:


> So why do target archers shoot longer bh bows then?



Target archers shoot outside in the winter when it’s cold?


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## brokenlittleman (Oct 18, 2006)

173BC said:


> Target archers shoot outside in the winter when it’s cold?


What are you talking about? Elkman says there is no difference in shooting shorter bh bows as long as geometry is good. I asked why the target archers shoot longer bh bows.


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## trimantrekokc (May 16, 2006)

you might learn the difference between deflex/reflex.....reflex risers are inherently by design more difficult to shoot than a deflex riser. reflex shortens BH and moves limb pockets in front of grip where deflex lengthens bh and limbpockets are more in line with grip....there is a reason you see very few 6" reflexed riser bows on the lines at Vegas.

and a longer bh bow will be more forgiving of form issues so it's not all between the ears




THE ELKMAN said:


> That brace height "issue" is 100% between a persons ears. It has been proven that lock time is irrelevant. What people notice (And should) is the riser geometry on a lot of the lower brace bows. If the riser is highly deflexed it will be A LOT more difficult to shoot accurately/ie. less forgiving.(Because of riser deflection issues) But if you achieve said lower brace with limb length/angle and keep the riser fairly neutral, no human can react fast enough to jack it up. And with string stops now present on everything, if you are shooting the correct draw length and properly fitted/tuned bow you will be able to shoot a 5 inch brace bow in a polar bear suit...


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

trimantrekokc said:


> .....reflex risers are inherently by design more difficult to shoot than a deflex riser. reflex shortens BH and moves limb pockets in front of grip where deflex lengthens bh and limbpockets are more in line with grip....


I would have to disagree about the reflex being "inherently" more difficult to shoot. The important geometry is represented by the red lines below, and those don't necessarily change just because the riser is reflexed/deflexed.

(click the image if the animation does not work)


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Guys guys guys, don't derail this thread trying to argue bh! It's been beat to death on here many times.

Waiting for someone to post official pics of the new Hoyt!


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

trimantrekokc said:


> you might learn the difference between deflex/reflex.....reflex risers are inherently by design more difficult to shoot than a deflex riser. reflex shortens BH and moves limb pockets in front of grip where deflex lengthens bh and limbpockets are more in line with grip....there is a reason you see very few 6" reflexed riser bows on the lines at Vegas.
> 
> and a longer bh bow will be more forgiving of form issues so it's not all between the ears


Sorry my bad that was purely a Type-O. I meant to say reflex... (Pretty sure you knew that though)


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

brokenlittleman said:


> What are you talking about? Elkman says there is no difference in shooting shorter bh bows as long as geometry is good. I asked why the target archers shoot longer bh bows.


Because there is zero reason for them not to. It's that simple. Speed is irrelevant on a target, and let's be honest that is what the manufacturers are building on the target side...


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

rattlinman said:


> Guys guys guys, don't derail this thread trying to argue bh! It's been beat to death on here many times.
> 
> Waiting for someone to post official pics of the new Hoyt!


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

rattlinman said:


> Guys guys guys, don't derail this thread trying to argue bh! It's been beat to death on here many times.
> 
> Waiting for someone to post official pics of the new Hoyt!


We can't argue about the new bows once we see them... until then we have to argue about other stuff


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

nestly said:


> We can't argue about the new bows once we see them... until then we have to argue about other stuff


So true.


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## trimantrekokc (May 16, 2006)

then please explain why reflex riser bows are not dominate in the target world where accuracy is key? in the hunting world where accuracy and repeatability is not the focus reflex can get by. all manufactures produce deflex and straight risers for accuracy, even Mathews has gotten away from high reflex risers for most of their hunting bows (halon and triax for example compared to the older single cams). I wish Hoyt would straighten theirs up.


ps, there are no red lines



nestly said:


> I would have to disagree about the reflex being "inherently" more difficult to shoot. The important geometry is represented by the red lines below, and those don't necessarily change just because the riser is reflexed/deflexed.
> 
> (click the image if the animation does not work)


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## bigbucks170 (Feb 2, 2006)

there is if you click on the image


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

I will say this, shot the rx1 in 50 lb limbs, and the ultra in 60 lbs.
Loved it! Needless to say pumped about 2019.
Lookin like i will get one in 60 lbs.
Wish they offered 55 lb limbs.

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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

Is the release supposed to be tomorrow?


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

bowtech2006 said:


> Is the release supposed to be tomorrow?


Yep

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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

Shinigami3 said:


> Yes, unless you're one of the ppl that got the private Facebook invite thing.


Nope i don't even have fbook, maybe they sent me one tho lol


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

With a release tomorrow I though bow shops might be getting them in today in which case you'd think more info would be leaking. Perhaps the shops won't have them at release?


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

You would think someone involved with this thread could tell us....


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## coptor doctor (Aug 25, 2003)

I am guessing something to go against a Triax.. 32" Proforce? with a new cam and more speed.. Can't wait till tomorrow


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

this is when you know that all the people in the know where just blowing smoke the entire time. 1 day left and nothing has popped up.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

trimantrekokc said:


> *then please explain why reflex riser bows are not dominate in the target world where accuracy is key?* in the hunting world where accuracy and repeatability is not the focus reflex can get by. all manufactures produce deflex and straight risers for accuracy, even Mathews has gotten away from high reflex risers for most of their hunting bows (halon and triax for example compared to the older single cams). I wish Hoyt would straighten theirs up.
> 
> 
> ps, there are no red lines


They actually do. If you draw a straight line between the rear most contact point between the riser/pocket and the limb on the upper and lower limbs, the grip is typically behind that point for most target bows, meaning the riser is reflexed. It's a simple matter of components. You have a limb and a cam, and a fairly narrow brace height window to work within. You attach the limb as far forward or rearward as needed to get the desired result (Hoyt Podium show for reference)

The Triax is far from a "straight" riser. Even with the short limbs, they have to keep the limb pockets forward because of the massive cam.



The previous image is an animated gif, forum software seems to limit the size of inline animations, but it should animate when clicked and opened in it's own window


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Predator said:


> With a release tomorrow I though bow shops might be getting them in today in which case you'd think more info would be leaking. Perhaps the shops won't have them at release?


My local shop thought they would get a couple sneak peak bows tomorrow.
She said some shops already have a few.
Just won't reveal till tomorrow.

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## MNarrow (Nov 10, 2009)

friedm1 said:


> this is when you know that all the people in the know where just blowing smoke the entire time. 1 day left and nothing has popped up.


RX34 and RX30??


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

MNarrow said:


> RX34 and RX30??


RX33?

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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

deer310sg said:


> I will say this, shot the rx1 in 50 lb limbs, and the ultra in 60 lbs.
> Loved it! Needless to say pumped about 2019.
> Lookin like i will get one in 60 lbs.
> Wish they offered 55 lb limbs.
> ...


My RX-1 Ultra is a 60 lber set at 58 lbs and its wonderful to shoot.


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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

deer310sg said:


> RX33?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk


Rx34. Rx36??


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

bowtech2006 said:


> Rx34. Rx36??


Why did you have to do that!!! I'm perfectly happy with my RX-1 Turbo....but if they introduce a 35-36" Ultra Turbo.....


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## trimantrekokc (May 16, 2006)

the hoyt you showed is a target bow....they do have more of a straight riser. their hunting bows such as the hyperforce and RX have a dramatic reflex to them that's why I said I would like to see them get away from reflex in their hunting bows, more than even the triax you showed. BTW- the triax is a hunting bow...

the triax...it is reflexed but even it doesn't have as much as the power max or hyperforce. and in reality the triax has less reflex than the Z3 older design thus it reinforces my claim that even it has gotten away from the highly reflexed risers.



nestly said:


> They actually do. If you draw a straight line between the rear most contact point between the riser/pocket and the limb on the upper and lower limbs, the grip is typically behind that point for most target bows, meaning the riser is reflexed. It's a simple matter of components. You have a limb and a cam, and a fairly narrow brace height window to work within. You attach the limb as far forward or rearward as needed to get the desired result (Hoyt Podium show for reference)
> 
> The Triax is far from a "straight" riser. Even with the short limbs, they have to keep the limb pockets forward because of the massive cam.
> 
> ...


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

nestly said:


> I would have to disagree about the reflex being "inherently" more difficult to shoot. The important geometry is represented by the red lines below, and those don't necessarily change just because the riser is reflexed/deflexed.
> 
> (click the image if the animation does not work)


you must shoot mechanicals? seems like the arrows are a tad short for fixed heads, and I don't want to tell a man his business, but it may be time for as new set of cables. how do you like the nitrux so far? does it tune ok with the limb bolts backed out?

nevermind, obviously just a shop demo with just a rest....

whatever shop you use should at least put cables on before letting customers shoot it. maybe they are just trying to make it seem smoother drawing than it really is, you need to find a new shop, not cool


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

trimantrekokc said:


> the hoyt you showed is a target bow....they do have more of a straight riser. their hunting bows such as the hyperforce and RX have a dramatic reflex to them that's why I said I would like to see them get away from reflex in their hunting bows, more than even the triax you showed. BTW- the triax is a hunting bow...
> 
> the triax...it is reflexed but even it doesn't have as much as the power max or hyperforce. and in reality the triax has less reflex than the Z3 older design thus it reinforces my claim that even it has gotten away from the highly reflexed risers.


your as wrong as you could be, Nestly tried very nicely to explain it to you, but you dont want to see it. The fact that a Triax riser is straight has no impact on how reflexed it is. we shouldn't spend anymore time on this, this thread has already been completely hi-jacked by people making up bows that will be released.


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## trimantrekokc (May 16, 2006)

dude....learn reading comprehension....I said the triax is NOT as reflexed as previous hunting models for mathews.....it is still reflexed.....I also said I would like to see HOYT straighten their risers out some and get with the program like other companies have.....so in fact you are the only 1 that is wrong.



friedm1 said:


> your as wrong as you could be, Nestly tried very nicely to explain it to you, but you dont want to see it. The fact that a Triax riser is straight has no impact on how reflexed it is. we shouldn't spend anymore time on this, this thread has already been completely hi-jacked by people making up bows that will be released.


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## Prouder27 (Aug 10, 2015)

Whatever it is it’s going to be to overpriced for me to even give it a test drive, let alone buy.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

trimantrekokc said:


> dude....learn reading comprehension....I said the triax is NOT as reflexed as previous hunting models for mathews.....it is still reflexed.....I also said I would like to see HOYT straighten their risers out some and get with the program like other companies have.....so in fact you are the only 1 that is wrong.


unfortunately your words mean nothing and you have ruined the thread and maybe the sight. please see yourself out and have a blessed day.


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## trimantrekokc (May 16, 2006)

your words mean the same........bye felicia



friedm1 said:


> unfortunately your words mean nothing and you have ruined the thread and maybe the sight. please see yourself out and have a blessed day.


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## NYyotekiller (Dec 7, 2011)

I can't believe that nothing has leaked other than the photo of Nick Mundt's bow. I thought for sure that we would have seen something this week.


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

NYyotekiller said:


> I can't believe that nothing has leaked other than the photo of Nick Mundt's bow. I thought for sure that we would have seen something this week.


I know right! They must have threatened the hell out of Dealers this year.


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## brokenlittleman (Oct 18, 2006)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Because there is zero reason for them not to. It's that simple. Speed is irrelevant on a target, and let's be honest that is what the manufacturers are building on the target side...


 That goes both ways. If there is no reason for them not to shoot long bh then there also be no reason for them not to shoot short bh per your claims yet they dont do it. If accuracy is just as good someone should be shooting a short bh bow.


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## TheKingofKings (Sep 25, 2006)

Is the release at midnight?


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

TheKingofKings said:


> Is the release at midnight?


I'd expect somewhere around noon.... Hoyt time (Mountain time)


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## NCBuckNBass (Mar 5, 2005)

I will be shocked if anybody cares.............I hope I'm wrong and it's not the same old spec shuffle.......but Hoyt is not what they used to be years ago.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

NCBuckNBass said:


> I will be shocked if anybody cares.............I hope I'm wrong and it's not the same old spec shuffle.......but Hoyt is not what they used to be years ago.


none of the companies, they're ALL better:wink: if they weren't, everyone would be shooting 15yr old bows


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## Moose39x (Feb 23, 2017)

That_TN_Guy said:


> NYyotekiller said:
> 
> 
> > I can't believe that nothing has leaked other than the photo of Nick Mundt's bow. I thought for sure that we would have seen something this week.
> ...


i know from a hoyt dealer telling me is the dealers got a nasty email from hoyt when they had people leak the nitrux earlier this year. Bet they sent the same emails recently. But in my mind youd think theres someone out there that dont care what hoyt says. Especially if they arent a dealer yet knows what it is. Seems to be the case every year


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## jmike00 (Jan 6, 2018)

deer310sg said:


> I will say this, shot the rx1 in 50 lb limbs, and the ultra in 60 lbs.
> Loved it! Needless to say pumped about 2019.
> Lookin like i will get one in 60 lbs.
> Wish they offered 55 lb limbs.
> ...


Good news is they do! My RX-1 Ultra has a weight range of 45-55# on a 150 deflection limb. Had to be custom ordered but there was no upcharge.


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## AntlerInsane83 (Jun 28, 2016)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Your draw length is wrong then...


Incorrect...


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## bigbucks170 (Feb 2, 2006)

I am set for bows for a bit ...but I get excited to see the new ones when they come out ...they did build some suspense 
for me anyway not having any leaks ....


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

jmike00 said:


> Good news is they do! My RX-1 Ultra has a weight range of 45-55# on a 150 deflection limb. Had to be custom ordered but there was no upcharge.


Can those limbs be custom ordered with any RX1?

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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Today is the day!

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## Bowtech321 (Jun 17, 2018)

Does anyone know what time? 


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Bowtech321 said:


> Does anyone know what time?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Someone posted noon mountain time.
That would put us at 2 in midwest if math is right. 

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## hunter9264 (Mar 7, 2018)

Been checking the Hoyt home page since October and continued checking even though I heard it would be in November so I hope they release the news soon. One thing I have learned her on AT from last year to this year especially now when the new bow are about to come out Hoyt is the most hated bow on this site. Personally I never owned a Hoyt but I have perchance 2 of them, a Hoyt youth bow back in the early 90's for my son and the Hoyt PowerMax last year I bought for my wife. Enough said, come on Hoyt lets see what you have to bring to the Table for 2019.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

were really close to the time where all the people who said they knew what was being released will be shown to be idiots. i hope the risers are super RE FLEXED.


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## Prouder27 (Aug 10, 2015)

$2000 3/4 carbon relabeled hunk of junk, I can’t wait!


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## Hoyt'Em10 (Sep 14, 2014)

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## ShootingABN! (Nov 1, 2005)

LOL Haters gonna Hate


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## Prouder27 (Aug 10, 2015)

Hoyt'Em10 said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Lol was I right or was I right.


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## Jeremy K (Oct 16, 2013)

Is that a glued together riser painted with bed liner? Looks expensive.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

its crazy hot would come out with a 3 foot long bow.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

I just knew it would be the best Hoyt ever.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

Funny thing is the comments will be exactly the same regardless of what the bow actually looks like. lol


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## norsemen (Feb 22, 2011)

"Like nothing you have ever experienced"............... I guess they have already used the word "Revolutionary" too many times.


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## NYyotekiller (Dec 7, 2011)




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## NYyotekiller (Dec 7, 2011)




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## bowhuntermitch (May 17, 2005)

The horizontal movement of the grip is going to be awesome, IMO!


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## HoosierArcher88 (Jan 10, 2013)

I'm intrigued. I've never owned a hoyt. but this one may break that dryspell.


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## Prouder27 (Aug 10, 2015)

So they put a dampener on the bottom and you can change the grip? 


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Introducing the more Triax-y bow we've ever built. Smooth, quiet at the shot, available in the same colors, and we even moved our rubber thingy out front just to make sure we get all the benefit of the royalties we paid.


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## NYyotekiller (Dec 7, 2011)

https://youtu.be/N2KnvHUJ3GQ


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## rojapar (Sep 11, 2007)

Looks like they Rhino-lined it.


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## jbrout (Jan 1, 2015)

Any prices yet ? 


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## TheBozz (Aug 30, 2018)

Prouder27 said:


> So they put a dampener on the bottom and you can change the grip?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


can't even be bothered to watch the video before you criticize it? Classy


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## Prouder27 (Aug 10, 2015)

TheBozz said:


> can't even be bothered to watch the video before you criticize it? Classy


I already watched it on Instagram before I did comment. All that really stood out to me. Same specs as the rx1. 


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## CSchelk2 (Sep 26, 2017)




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## AntlerCRAZED (Oct 12, 2009)

Looks like a sweet bow and I've always thought Hoyts looked sweet and some that I shot I really liked.But whats the point of carbon if its still gonna weigh 4lbs bare bow and cost $1500.I will be shooting it to try it out soon as my local shop gets their hands on one none the less and give it an honest try


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## MNarrow (Nov 10, 2009)

Helix


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

I like the looks of them. Especially the rx3 and its specs. I wonder if the weight is accurate out of the bow, or if it's really 4.2 or 4.3........


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## TheBozz (Aug 30, 2018)

So the new string vibration dampener thing... Telling me i can only shoot factory strings now??


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## songer121 (Oct 6, 2015)

wow looks like that leaked image was TRUE after all.... someone will get in trouble over that one i bet lol...


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## CSchelk2 (Sep 26, 2017)

Aluminum teaser is up


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Love the adjustable grip idea!

Forward weight design will be interesting to play with as far as stabilizer weight and length.

String dampening o-rings in the string....maybe a litttle gimmicky.

I'll be interested to see how the cam draws differently from my RX-1.


If the Kolorfusion rumor is true....now that's a HUGE deal.


Looks great on paper and in video. Can't wait to shoot one.


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

rattlinman said:


> Love the adjustable grip idea!
> 
> Forward weight design will be interesting to play with as far as stabilizer weight and length.
> 
> ...


I am surprised it's taken this long to implement the grip system like this as they have had a similar system on their recurves before


----------



## jmike00 (Jan 6, 2018)

deer310sg said:


> Can those limbs be custom ordered with any RX1?
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk


I don't see why not since they all use the same limb. Should apply to the Hyperforce too


----------



## cowdocdvm (Apr 24, 2011)

The ultra specs look very nice to me.


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

The Helix is very meh.

Didn’t even get more than a 1 minute promo which gives more credence to the idea that the aluminum line has essentially become their economy line bow.

The carbon line gets the premium tech.

If I’m paying $1k I want the best tech that company has. Not hand me downs. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CSchelk2 (Sep 26, 2017)

Aluminum Helix Video is up on facebook. 30.5" and 34", same speeds as the Rx3.


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## Reed (Jun 18, 2002)

x-hunta said:


> I am surprised it's taken this long to implement the grip system like this as they have had a similar system on their recurves before



guessing they had to wait for the PSE patent to expire as you could do the same thing with pse syenergy grip in the 90's:wink:


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

joffutt1 said:


> The Helix is very meh.
> 
> Didn’t even get more than a 1 minute promo which gives more credence to the idea that the aluminum line has essentially become their economy line bow.
> 
> ...


And I want a Ferrari for the same price a Honda Civic too.


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

x-hunta said:


> And I want a Ferrari for the same price a Honda Civic too.


Except the difference between a $1k now from another company and a $1600 carbon bow isn’t remotely as far apart, or at all, from how a Ferrari and civic is. 

But yeah, go with that. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

joffutt1 said:


> Except the difference between a $1k now from another company and a $1600 carbon bow isn’t remotely as far apart, or at all, from how a Ferrari and civic is.
> 
> But yeah, go with that.
> 
> ...


The Carbon line is their top line, what more do you expect? Besides there isn't much offered on the carbon line that isn't included in the aluminum bows...


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

joffutt1 said:


> Except the difference between a $1k now from another company and a $1600 carbon bow isn’t remotely as far apart, or at all, from how a Ferrari and civic is.
> 
> But yeah, go with that.


Well a Ferrari also cost a bit more than 1.6x as much as a civic as well.
Ferrari ~$250K
Civic ~ $20K


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## centershot (Sep 13, 2002)

bowhuntermitch said:


> The horizontal movement of the grip is going to be awesome, IMO!


Not so much for the shop owners/tuners dealing with people moving the grip every other day then wondering why their 6" BH bow is out of tune........could be wrong, guess we will see.


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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

nestly said:


> Well a Ferrari also cost a bit more than 1.6x as much as a civic as well.


It's also called an exaggeration for the sake of a metaphor


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## mod10g (Dec 18, 2006)

Looks like they copied a PSE carbon air, not that that's a bad thing.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

centershot said:


> Not so much for the shop owners/tuners dealing with people moving the grip every other day then wondering why their 6" BH bow is out of tune........could be wrong, guess we will see.


I agree with this, you can already move the rest and the limbs (via yokes) to get perfect arrow flight, being able to move the grip is likely to cause more problems than it solves.


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

x-hunta said:


> It's also called an exaggeration for the sake of a metaphor


If you have to exaggerate to make the metaphor applicable then it no longer applies.



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## x-hunta (Mar 10, 2010)

joffutt1 said:


> If you have to exaggerate to make the metaphor applicable then it no longer applies.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It still applies if you have basic reading comprehension. You're wanting their top line model for the price of a lower model. The metaphor still apples.


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## zekezoe (Dec 3, 2007)

mod10g said:


> Looks like they copied a PSE carbon air, not that that's a bad thing.


How do you figure they copied pse??


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

x-hunta said:


> It still applies if you have basic reading comprehension. You're wanting their top line model for the price of a lower model. The metaphor still apples.


False. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

mod10g said:


> Looks like they copied a PSE carbon air, not that that's a bad thing.


Yeah, except the PSE carbon is already a copy of all current and previous Hoyt carbons.... lol


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## midnight_f150 (Jul 4, 2009)

x-hunta said:


> The Carbon line is their top line, what more do you expect? Besides there isn't much offered on the carbon line that isn't included in the aluminum bows...


But no turbo cams for the aluminum bows.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

I have to hand it to Hoyt they out done themselves this year. The copied both PSE and Mathews. That is quite the accomplishment. I had no doubt they would build the best bow ever.


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## jbrout (Jan 1, 2015)

Real question is... where’s the rx 2 ? 


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

jbrout said:


> Real question is... where’s the rx 2 ?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


thats is the Bowtech copy...its in the werks


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## vmals (Jul 24, 2018)

jbrout said:


> Real question is... where’s the rx 2 ?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


So advance and revolutionary they blew past 2 and went straight to 3.


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## Kris87 (Sep 12, 2003)

I was hoping for a different type of cam system.


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## jbrout (Jan 1, 2015)

Kris87 said:


> I was hoping for a different type of cam system.


I think that was on the rx 2 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TheBozz (Aug 30, 2018)

Where are people seeing the 2k price that people are *****ing about on Instagram? i can't find anything


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## alex.vogel99 (Apr 1, 2014)

nestly said:


> Yeah, except the PSE carbon is already a copy of all current and previous Hoyt carbons.... lol


^^^he's right, you know.


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## jlcaudle (Oct 10, 2018)

PRICE IS HERE https://hoyt.com/compound-bows/carbon-rx-3


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## Prouder27 (Aug 10, 2015)

TheBozz said:


> Where are people seeing the 2k price that people are *****ing about on Instagram? i can't find anything














Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Hoyt'Em10 (Sep 14, 2014)

Prouder27 said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


They just keep getting more ridiculous. 


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Thats steal at that price. 1700$$$ nice !!!Good work Hoyt. If you bought both the PSE and at the Mathews that they copied you be into them for about 2K total for both....so the way I look at Hoyt saves you 15%.


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## TheBozz (Aug 30, 2018)

Wow they did away with the hyper Force after one year?


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## kravguy (Oct 12, 2006)

I liked the bows, till I saw the price. Every year, the price hike.... why?


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

Kris87 said:


> I was hoping for a different type of cam system.





jbrout said:


> i think that was on the rx 2
> 
> 
> sent from my iphone using tapatalk


lol


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## Larry brown (Aug 17, 2013)

https://youtu.be/Oe86px8SoS4


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## brendan's dad (Feb 21, 2013)

If the bow got smaller, why didn't it get lighter?


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## Oakes (Sep 4, 2018)

Isnt the purpose of the whole carbon bow craze is that its supposed to be super light (like less than 3.5 pounds)? How does 3.9 pounds justify 1700 price tag? That weighs almost as much as an aluminum bow....


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## ekimox (Oct 13, 2017)

kravguy said:


> I liked the bows, till I saw the price. Every year, the price hike.... why?


Because they know the sheep will pay for it at any price. Until people stop paying these ridiculous prices the price on their bows will continue to go up.


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## Hoyt'Em10 (Sep 14, 2014)

Oakes said:


> Isnt the purpose of the whole carbon bow craze is that its supposed to be super light (like less than 3.5 pounds)? How does 3.9 pounds justify 1700 price tag? That weighs almost as much as an aluminum bow....


China is hiking up the price of the risers in response to Trump


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## onedawg69 (Sep 9, 2014)

Hoyt'Em10 said:


> China is hiking up the price of the risers in response to Trump
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I don't think it's that!! But nice try. It's like ekimox said, as long as people will continue to pay for them they will keep raising the price.


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## vmals (Jul 24, 2018)

Oakes said:


> Isnt the purpose of the whole carbon bow craze is that its supposed to be super light (like less than 3.5 pounds)? How does 3.9 pounds justify 1700 price tag? That weighs almost as much as an aluminum bow....


I bought into the hype and first got a carbon air 34 and then a rx1 turbo. My next bow will be aluminum for sure.


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## MNarrow (Nov 10, 2009)

Mtn Ops box for $1699 value was just the bow lol


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## Jeremy K (Oct 16, 2013)

They gotta pay for all the celebrities they give bows to somehow ,price is ridiculous.


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## Hoyt'Em10 (Sep 14, 2014)

onedawg69 said:


> I don't think it's that!! But nice try. It's like ekimox said, as long as people will continue to pay for them they will keep raising the price.


Just sarcasm lol. I don’t blame Hoyt for driving the price up to further fund their already ever successful marketing campaigns. There’s a fool born every minute, and Hoyt does a great job getting them to buy bows. 

I’ve got two 2018 flagship bows that I bought used here. Both of those bows loaded with high end accessories is what one of these would set me back with decent accessories. . .


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## onedawg69 (Sep 9, 2014)

I figured it was, but a lot of people out there don't see it that way. I hear ya on the price tag, it's hard to justify a new bow every year when they depreciate to almost half in one year!!!


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

Possibly back on track, we shall see.
Been waiting to add a Carbon again

Unfortunately price hike is inevitable with carbon and aluminum going up a fair amount. 
For that matter, everything is going up. Just my working overhead has gone up a fair share in my business. Not to mention labor and material climbing. My prices have to be raised to offset the difference 


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## efey (Oct 16, 2013)

My dealer just told me rx3 ultra is $1599. Same as the rx-1s were for me.


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## mossycreek (Nov 25, 2012)

Oakes said:


> Isnt the purpose of the whole carbon bow craze is that its supposed to be super light (like less than 3.5 pounds)? How does 3.9 pounds justify 1700 price tag? That weighs almost as much as an aluminum bow....


Not exactly, the advantages is that they can make a crazy stiff riser by bridging it caging it etc where they need to and still maintain a weight of just at or under 4lbs even at 34’ ata bow. Mathews did the same thing making an ultra stiff riser with the triax but doing that with aluminum results in a 28’ ata bow weighing nearly 5 lbs although still an awesome bow but the advantages are obvious. So many don’t understand advantages of using carbon. They are not trying to make the lightest bow on the market.


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## AntlerCRAZED (Oct 12, 2009)

mossycreek said:


> Not exactly, the advantages is that they can make a crazy stiff riser by bridging it caging it etc where they need to and still maintain a weight of just at or under 4lbs even at 34’ ata bow. Mathews did the same thing making an ultra stiff riser with the triax but doing that with aluminum results in a 28’ ata bow weighing nearly 5 lbs although still an awesome bow but the advantages are obvious. So many don’t understand advantages of using carbon. They are not trying to make the lightest bow on the market.


For $1600 it should be the lightest and most quietest bow on the market.I think thats everyone's gripe with them is they use all this technology, release a bow that does't shoot any better than similar spec'd bows from other companies but charge you $700 more


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## kravguy (Oct 12, 2006)

ontarget7 said:


> Possibly back on track, we shall see.
> Been waiting to add a Carbon again
> 
> Unfortunately price hike is inevitable with carbon and aluminum going up a fair amount.
> ...


While this may be the case for this year, bow prices have steadily gone up every year. One can argue that this year wages, materials, etc have gone up. There have been plenty of years where that wasn't the case, sometimes with material prices even going down. You never see a price decrease on bows to match. 

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


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## RandomElk16 (Mar 2, 2018)

I mean the RX-1 and 3 are in their own on price... So people expect a lot! 

I am more curious how Hoyt followers feel about the 4.6lb $1200 aluminum bow that copies one they bashed last year....


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

RandomElk16 said:


> I mean the RX-1 and 3 are in their own on price... So people expect a lot!
> 
> I am more curious how Hoyt followers feel about the 4.6lb $1200 aluminum bow that copies one they bashed last year....


Meh... Not impressed


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

Heading to test drive now


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## Mathias (Mar 21, 2005)

PAKraig said:


> Heading to test drive now


Awesome. Post up a separate review.


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Meh... Not impressed


Did your account get hacked or something?


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## kravguy (Oct 12, 2006)

PAKraig said:


> Heading to test drive now


Where are you headed? Didn't know someone would have these already. I'd kind of like to shoot the carbon line even tho I'm going to complain about the price every step of the way

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


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## simplefaith1 (Mar 27, 2009)

I want to see a laser torque test. Wont be winning me back this year. Customers service wouldn't replace a Hoyt sticker last year.


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

kravguy said:


> While this may be the case for this year, bow prices have steadily gone up every year. One can argue that this year wages, materials, etc have gone up. There have been plenty of years where that wasn't the case, sometimes with material prices even going down. You never see a price decrease on bows to match.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


Or, vehicle tires 
Lots of things are this way until a particular market falls out the bottom 




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

efey said:


> My dealer just told me rx3 ultra is $1599. Same as the rx-1s were for me.


Website says MSRP is $1749 though I understand dealers often sell less than the MSRP.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

i just got my hands on both the carbon and aluminum models. The refinements are a step in the right direction. They ditched the cable tube housing and went to a more Mathews-esque batwing cable loop. The cams are noticeably bigger and have more of a teardrop shape going. i wont waste my time saying how they shot, but if you liked last years you will like this years. They made some changes, but didn't re-invent the wheel. Still not a fan personally of the grip. Also, MSRP is $1600+ in New Jersey.

the real talk was that two major bow companies are on the verge of closing their doors.


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## RandomElk16 (Mar 2, 2018)

friedm1 said:


> and went to a more Mathews-esque


That describes most of the bow




friedm1 said:


> the real talk was that two major bow companies are on the verge of closing their doors.


Do share....


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## jbrout (Jan 1, 2015)

the real talk was that two major bow companies are on the verge of closing their doors.[/QUOTE]

Don’t say that if you don’t say what ones lol 


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## tjd60449 (Jun 30, 2012)

2019 HOYT REDWRX CARBON RX-3: https://youtu.be/N2KnvHUJ3GQ


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## efey (Oct 16, 2013)

joffutt1 said:


> Website says MSRP is $1749 though I understand dealers often sell less than the MSRP.


Well the Ultra says $1,699 but my price is confirmed through my dealer in Louisiana. $100 cheaper at dealer.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

RandomElk16 said:


> That describes most of the bow
> 
> 
> 
> ...


honestly, the only thing Hoyt and Mathews have in common right now is the camo they use. The Triax and RX series are not very comparable. You can still yolk tune these hoyts, the grips are very different angles and profiles and i will say the RX3 is more top heavy. The new aluminum model is where its at, you get the cams and cable and limb pockets of the RX but the price of aluminum. Not sure what the MSRP is, but im sure they will sell for under $1000 when its all said and done.


i hear Obsession is preparing to wind things down and i hear bowtech either has to drop Excalibur all together or come up with a new game plan. The Realm saved them but they would need a record year.


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

RandomElk16 said:


> I mean the RX-1 and 3 are in their own on price... So people expect a lot!
> 
> I am more curious how Hoyt followers feel about the 4.6lb $1200 aluminum bow that copies one they bashed last year....


THIS X1000!

The value of a Triax went up today.


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## TREESTANDSNYPER (Jan 17, 2003)

They look like really nice bows, nice specs and design features. I think if I was in the market for a new bow these would definitely be worth checking out. Nothing big enough to make me switch if I was already shooting an RX-1 though. 


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## NC longbow (Aug 18, 2010)

Not replacing my RX-1 but might consider the standard RX-3 for a possible replacement for my 14' CS-30.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

Mathias said:


> Awesome. Post up a separate review.


https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=5544999&p=1108898957#post1108898957


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

vmals said:


> So advance and revolutionary they blew past 2 and went straight to 3.


:set1_rolf2:

I asked the same thing on another thread! Where did we miss #2?


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

efey said:


> My dealer just told me rx3 ultra is $1599. Same as the rx-1s were for me.


I hope that's true. that's a lot for a bow as it is, another Benji to an already expensive bow is tough to swallow. on the other hand, can't wait to shoot them, and I won't let 100 bucks change my mind if I love it. 


the ultra looks like a winner to me, but i'm not convinced it will be my favorite of 19' to me, it looks like Hoyt built a sweet freakin' line of bows. if they are indeed better than the rx-1 (which I love) then it will be worth the sticker shock to me. 


a new discounted rx-1 turbo or ultra are still in the mix, as well as the stealth EF. i'm certainly not let down by the rx-3 line, looks like it is slightly refined, the turbo is right on the edge of too short for me this year, but I will not rule it out either before shooting it.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

*Good Lord guys! If you can't afford it or simply don't want to pay that for one, then don't! Quit crying like little babies about the price. You sound like the people in this country who want everything given to them for free. 'Merica!*

Anyway, I'm intrigued with the adjustable grip and how that will pertain to tuning and consistency in hand placement.

Interested to see how virtually the same cam has been tweaked for a different "feel" I don't know how the #3 cam could be any smoother.

I also am curious about the weight forward design and if stabilization will be affected.

Cool things for sure. And IMO, they just get better looking every year. Nice job Hoyt!


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

joffutt1 said:


> THIS X1000!
> 
> The value of a Triax went up today.


that is good news:wink: because i'm about to have one for sale, haha. just have to wait for bowtech and Mathews to drop their bows and go shoot the ones i'm interested in. don't want to be bow-less though


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

looks like a different range of draw lengths for the new cams?


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

anyone know the weight on the helix?


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

rattlinman said:


> *Good Lord guys! If you can't afford it or simply don't want to pay that for one, then don't! Quit crying like little babies about the price. You sound like the people in this country who want everything given to them for free. 'Merica!*
> 
> Anyway, I'm intrigued with the adjustable grip and how that will pertain to tuning and consistency in hand placement.
> 
> ...


It's AS SMOOTH, but it's not quite as "easy" to draw. Just a tiny bit stuffer on the front end.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

roosiebull said:


> anyone know the weight on the helix?


Halon 32 heavy. And it FEELS like it. Listed at 4.6 lbs on the website


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

PAKraig said:


> It's AS SMOOTH, but it's not quite as "easy" to draw. Just a tiny bit stuffer on the front end.


I saw another thread that said they went to 85% let off mods. Could you tell>?


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

PAKraig said:


> Halon 32 heavy. And it FEELS like it. Listed at 4.6 lbs on the website


well.... that's out! thanks good looking bow, but certainly trying to compete with the triax… even in mass weight I guess:mg:

I feel like we are in a "dead in the hand" phase right now, people chasing that thing that doesn't matter, and adding an extra .5-.7 lbs to a bow for no reason. at least there are still lots of other options.

I didn't think I was interested, now I know i'm not


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## AZSpaniol (May 6, 2012)

rattlinman said:


> *Good Lord guys! If you can't afford it or simply don't want to pay that for one, then don't! Quit crying like little babies about the price. You sound like the people in this country who want everything given to them for free. 'Merica!*
> 
> Anyway, I'm intrigued with the adjustable grip and how that will pertain to tuning and consistency in hand placement.
> 
> ...


What makes this bow, or the RX1 worth their price tag though? Typically when you pay more for something, you get something in return. Or that’s how I’ve always thought things go. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

PAKraig said:


> Halon 32 heavy. And it FEELS like it. Listed at 4.6 lbs on the website


4.6 lb is for the 34" Ultra.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

AZSpaniol said:


> What makes this bow, or the RX1 worth their price tag though? Typically when you pay more for something, you get something in return. Or that’s how I’ve always thought things go.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Well, I can give you my opinion, but you all will just "AT it apart". 

I'm just amazed how many people of here live to dislike things without ever laying their hands on one.

-The carbon tube technology for rigidness, strength, and stiffness cannot be disputed.
-The grip is the best in the business.
-The bullet proof limbs designed by Hoyt have to be the most dependable on the market.
-The purposeful weight distribution design makes Hoyt bows point and hold rock solid.
-The limb pocket design firmly holds the limbs for perfect consistency, shot after shot.
-Each year they seem to tweak just enough come up with a better product, but always in the Hoyt theme. 

They just make a well built, time proven, no worries bow. I literally quit keeping a back-up bow once I started shooting Hoyt.

There ya go. Now, is it better than my RX-1? Maybe, we'll see. Is my RX-1 better than my Matrix? Absolutely. No comparison. Worth every penny


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## fountain (Jan 10, 2009)

999.95 for aluminum 
1399.95 for carbon


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## ekimox (Oct 13, 2017)

[/QUOTE]For $1600 it should be the lightest and most quietest bow on the market.I think thats everyone's gripe with them is they use all this technology, release a bow that does't shoot any better than similar spec'd bows from other companies but charge you $700 more[/QUOTE]

This. This. This.


----------



## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

For $1600 it should be the lightest and most quietest bow on the market.I think thats everyone's gripe with them is they use all this technology, release a bow that does't shoot any better than similar spec'd bows from other companies but charge you $700 more[/QUOTE]

This. This. This.[/QUOTE]

I don't want a lighter bow. I add weight on to mine. The carbon makes it more rigid and stronger than aluminum. If you want light only, then go buy Bowtech's carbon/plastic bow.
How quiet is "quietist"? Who makes the "quietist" bow currently?
I say it does shoot better than rigs with similar specs. Prove me wrong. My RX-1 Turbo was worth every penny I spent on it. What did you pay for yours?


----------



## chaded (Jan 15, 2011)

Haven’t had a hoyt in awhile but that carbon is tempting.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

friedm said it earlier in the thread, if you like RX1, you'll like the RX-3 just a little bit better. 

Are they offering 80% mods? Will my RX1 80s fit on the RX3 cam??


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## Heavy hoyt man (Oct 26, 2013)

Wish I could get 90# limbs.....


----------



## Jeremy K (Oct 16, 2013)

rattlinman said:


> For $1600 it should be the lightest and most quietest bow on the market.I think thats everyone's gripe with them is they use all this technology, release a bow that does't shoot any better than similar spec'd bows from other companies but charge you $700 more


This. This. This.[/QUOTE]

I don't want a lighter bow. I add weight on to mine. The carbon makes it more rigid and stronger than aluminum. If you want light only, then go buy Bowtech's carbon/plastic bow.
How quiet is "quietist"? Who makes the "quietist" bow currently?
I say it does shoot better than rigs with similar specs. Prove me wrong. My RX-1 Turbo was worth every penny I spent on it. What did you pay for yours?[/QUOTE]

As opposed to hoyts plastic /carbon ?


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

fountain said:


> 999.95 for aluminum
> 1399.95 for carbon


Where at?


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## fountain (Jan 10, 2009)

S Ga


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## 500 fps (Oct 13, 2002)

I've never been a Hoyt guy, but a carbon turbo in Storm could make its way into my possession.


----------



## NCBuckNBass (Mar 5, 2005)

Another typical Hoyt introduction thread............'looks awesome...........I need to shoot it to see if it's an improvement over my 2016' You guys don't think that sound odd for a bow that costs what a good semi custom rifle and scope costs?

Looking forward to the Bowtech unveiling....It would be hard be to this bad.


----------



## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Buy a kimber and z3 and hoyt r3x ...come back in 5 years and see what they are worth. Too bad I don't hunt with a rifle ....

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


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## AntlerCRAZED (Oct 12, 2009)

rattlinman said:


> For $1600 it should be the lightest and most quietest bow on the market.I think thats everyone's gripe with them is they use all this technology, release a bow that does't shoot any better than similar spec'd bows from other companies but charge you $700 more


This. This. This.[/QUOTE]

I don't want a lighter bow. I add weight on to mine. The carbon makes it more rigid and stronger than aluminum. If you want light only, then go buy Bowtech's carbon/plastic bow.
How quiet is "quietist"? Who makes the "quietist" bow currently?
I say it does shoot better than rigs with similar specs. Prove me wrong. My RX-1 Turbo was worth every penny I spent on it. What did you pay for yours?[/QUOTE]


The point is it should offer something so great and ground breaking for $600-700 more money bare bow.The Realm,Realm X,and Elite Ritual both are way better price pointed bows for the guys who don't like short bows like the Mathews.Hoyts are great bows but so are a lot of the other bows.There is no way someone can shoot a Triax,Ritual,Realm,Realm X,etc etc and tell me the Hoyt is the absolute best most accurate bow far and away better to the tune of is price point.Thats just my honest opinion and I do like Hoyts I think they look sweet and shoot very well just not $1500 well vs my $850 well bow.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

AntlerCRAZED said:


> The point is it should offer something so great and ground breaking for $600-700 more money bare bow.The Realm,Realm X,and Elite Ritual both are way better price pointed bows for the guys who don't like short bows like the Mathews.Hoyts are great bows but so are a lot of the other bows.There is no way someone can shoot a Triax,Ritual,Realm,Realm X,etc etc and tell me the Hoyt is the absolute best most accurate bow far and away better to the tune of is price point.Thats just my honest opinion and I do like Hoyts I think they look sweet and shoot very well just not $1500 well vs my $850 well bow.


You can make that argument about virtually any type of product (ex. clothing, tools, televisions, vehicle, watches, furnature, arrows, etc) There are usually multiple levels of products that pretty much perform the same task, and there's a market for all of them. If someone doesn't think a particular product is worth it's price when there are other options, that's their decision to make, but the constant need to justify that decision by some kinda sounds a bit like a lack of confidence. 
Everyone knows that paying twice the price for a product doesn't necessarily buy you a product that's twice as good... there's no need to keep droning on about it.


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Really liking the specs on the RX3 ultra. For sure gonna shoot one as soon as pro shop gets them in. 
Hopefully tomorrow. Anyone gets their hands on a elev II camo, post up pics please.
By looks of pics, the finish has come a longs ways.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

NCBuckNBass said:


> Another typical Hoyt introduction thread............'looks awesome...........I need to shoot it to see if it's an improvement over my 2016' You guys don't think that sound odd for a bow that costs what a good semi custom rifle and scope costs?
> 
> Looking forward to the Bowtech unveiling....It would be hard be to this bad.


it's all relative, you buy a 2018 rx-1 for 1600.00, shoot it all year, go shoot the rx-3 and like it more.... want it. sell the rx-1 for 1100.00 and buy your rx-3... like every single other bow. how is it worse with a hoyt? the initial cost of the 2018? makes no sense to me why that is worse than a Mathews shooter.... or whatever brands people shoot.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

500 fps said:


> I've never been a Hoyt guy, but a carbon turbo in Storm could make its way into my possession.


sharp looking color indeed! I would probably stick with camo, but the storm would be tempting


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## wildernessninja (Aug 9, 2013)

Man hope my shop get a helix ultra in to shoot.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

nestly said:


> You can make that argument about virtually any type of product (ex. clothing, tools, televisions, vehicle, watches, furnature, arrows, etc) There are usually multiple levels of products that pretty much perform the same task, and there's a market for all of them. If someone doesn't think a particular product is worth it's price when there are other options, that's their decision to make, but the constant need to justify that decision by some kinda sounds a bit like a lack of confidence.
> Everyone knows that paying twice the price for a product doesn't necessarily buy you a product that's twice as good... there's no need to keep droning on about it.


exactly right, and they still have an aluminum bow that is the same price as other companies. it's funny folks seem to make it seem personal like hoyt said "this is our bow, and you have to buy it!"

don't like the price, specs, technology? don't buy the damn thing! it's that easy, and there are tons of other options to serve everyone well (was gonna say make them happy, but NOTHING will make a hoyt hater happy):wink:


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

deer310sg said:


> Really liking the specs on the RX3 ultra. For sure gonna shoot one as soon as pro shop gets them in.
> Hopefully tomorrow. Anyone gets their hands on a elev II camo, post up pics please.
> By looks of pics, the finish has come a longs ways.


I’ll shoot you some pics tomorrow of the Elev II


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## 0nepin (Sep 16, 2009)

No worries bow ??????? You mean the Rx1 that’s under recall right now ??? Crazy hoyt fan boys


rattlinman said:


> Well, I can give you my opinion, but you all will just "AT it apart".
> 
> I'm just amazed how many people of here live to dislike things without ever laying their hands on one.
> 
> ...


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## 0nepin (Sep 16, 2009)

Yes it does .


Jeremy K said:


> Is that a glued together riser painted with bed liner? Looks expensive.


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## 0nepin (Sep 16, 2009)

Well they look good and they got to have less hand shock than the rx1.i see they have gotten rid of the lower yoke barrel .i will shoot them but I’m so happy with my stealth that I’m not In the market for a new bow .besides I’m not real confident in hoyts R&D department after the rx1 recall ..


CSchelk2 said:


> View attachment 6640651
> 
> View attachment 6640647
> 
> View attachment 6640657


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

ontarget7 said:


> I’ll shoot you some pics tomorrow of the Elev II
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sweet, thx Shane!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk


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## BucksnBass525 (Feb 21, 2009)

I don't care who you are, the vid (although I have seen before) of the Hoyts being dry fired is Impressive to say the least.
You won't do that with any other bow, I think it does say something to how tough they are. I am interested in a storm RX-3 Turbo or Helix.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

drew154 said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It had been pointed out before that this was mainly a bunch of marketing fluff so let's review.

New riser technology? Idk about that but they are definitely different risers but that's pretty much true of every brand every year (except maybe Xpedition who has had a history of using the exact same riser for different bows over multiple years). And ironically people are saying the carbon risers look like knock-offs of the PSE carbon risers which look like knock-offs of the first generation Hoyt carbon risers. So maybe it's "new" old technology.

New noise dampening? Looks like about the same rubber with a Triax knock-off bull nose placement of a riser dampening module. Ok.

New faster smoother cam system? There's no new cam system here. It's the exact same cam system - just a different variation of the cam. Doesn't seem faster but there are some early reports they may have smoothed out the cycle just a bit (not that anyone was complaining about the RX-1 draw cycle as I recall).

Finally, all new grip system. Optics tell you and reviews confirm that the grip is essentially the same. The difference is you can move the grip into two additional positions - one to the left and one to the right. Seems silly to me and I wouldn't think I'd have any desire to move my grip pressure off center but there are people with really jacked up grips that torque the bow a lot and for some of them who can actually figure out which way to move the grip to help somewhat compensate for their deficiency I suppose there could be some value.

So yep....pretty much nothing more than marketing fluff.

That said, looks like a solid lineup of (perhaps overpriced) bows.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

My thoughts, other than those on the marketing fluff above, are as follows:

Pretty much a typical Hoyt release. Slight tweaks made to bows with nothing earth shattering and no real "new" technology - despite what the advertising might lead you to believe. But a solid lineup of nice bows with some attractive specs that will meet the needs of plenty of people. I don't love the whole redwrx thing with the aluminum bows being sort of the budget variety ($1200 is the new "budget" for Hoyt) that are almost afterthoughts as evidenced by the release and the release videos (just compare the Helix video to the Redwrx - no contest). The prices are frankly insane. I can afford them and might even pay them if I were really convinced the bows were that much better than anything else out there but I don't see it. Maybe I'll change my mind after eventually shooting one. Either way though, the prices have simply gotten out of control especially when you think about how much these things depreciate.

So I'm not remotely blown away by the release but I was not remotely expecting to be blown away by the release as I'm almost never blown away by the Hoyt release. This is another typical year for Hoyt.


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## trucker3573 (Feb 14, 2010)

Prouder27 said:


> I already watched it on Instagram before I did comment. All that really stood out to me. Same specs as the rx1.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Oh come on it has to be three times better. After all they skipped the rx2 and went right to the three right?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## efey (Oct 16, 2013)

I am constantly in awe at the need to "redesign" or offer new "groundbreaking" technology. Folks mad about not seeing a new cam system? Completely ignoring the additional cost of constructing a quality riser from carbon over CNCing Al? The price of these carbon bows have changed very little since their inception of the spyder line. Why is this still an issue? NO, they don't owe you anything that is leaps and bounds above the rest for the additional cost. It's like a kevlar hull on a poling skiff. Is the extra 8 grand worth saving an inch of draft to you? No? Then move on! I like to shoot carbon because it feels better to me, its warmer so I don't have to hunt with a glove on my bow hand up north, and I get the added rigidity in the riser. I am not a Hoyt fanboy although I currently do shoot a Hoyt. That may change this year if I shoot something I like better. But, dayuummmm, no one gets hate like Hoyt. And I think it is unfounded. They have no obligation to you with their designs. Most people whining probably aren't even in the market for a new bow, but rather just like to spoil it for everyone else.


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## leftee (Nov 15, 2005)

4.6 lbs for Helix?
My oh my,what next?


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

I will say this. They are VERY quiet, and shock free. Balance is perfect.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Predator said:


> My thoughts, other than those on the marketing fluff above, are as follows:
> 
> Pretty much a typical Hoyt release. Slight tweaks made to bows with nothing earth shattering and no real "new" technology - despite what the advertising might lead you to believe. But a solid lineup of nice bows with some attractive specs that will meet the needs of plenty of people. I don't love the whole redwrx thing with the aluminum bows being sort of the budget variety ($1200 is the new "budget" for Hoyt) that are almost afterthoughts as evidenced by the release and the release videos (just compare the Helix video to the Redwrx - no contest). The prices are frankly insane. I can afford them and might even pay them if I were really convinced the bows were that much better than anything else out there but I don't see it. Maybe I'll change my mind after eventually shooting one. Either way though, the prices have simply gotten out of control especially when you think about how much these things depreciate.
> 
> So I'm not remotely blown away by the release but I was not remotely expecting to be blown away by the release as I'm almost never blown away by the Hoyt release. This is another typical year for Hoyt.



Agreed. But just for reference: What bow manufacturer release are you typically blown away by? (their aluminum lines weight is leaving a HUGE hole in their line up)


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## Adamsdjr (Aug 17, 2015)

efey said:


> I am constantly in awe at the need to "redesign" or offer new "groundbreaking" technology. Folks mad about not seeing a new cam system? Completely ignoring the additional cost of constructing a quality riser from carbon over CNCing Al? The price of these carbon bows have changed very little since their inception of the spyder line. Why is this still an issue? NO, they don't owe you anything that is leaps and bounds above the rest for the additional cost. It's like a kevlar hull on a poling skiff. Is the extra 8 grand worth saving an inch of draft to you? No? Then move on! I like to shoot carbon because it feels better to me, its warmer so I don't have to hunt with a glove on my bow hand up north, and I get the added rigidity in the riser. I am not a Hoyt fanboy although I currently do shoot a Hoyt. That may change this year if I shoot something I like better. But, dayuummmm, no one gets hate like Hoyt. And I think it is unfounded. They have no obligation to you with their designs. Most people whining probably aren't even in the market for a new bow, but rather just like to spoil it for everyone else.


Why would someone else not liking the RX3 as much as you do spoil it for you?


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## MORifleman (Apr 7, 2018)

NCBuckNBass said:


> Another typical Hoyt introduction thread............'looks awesome...........I need to shoot it to see if it's an improvement over my 2016' You guys don't think that sound odd for a bow that costs what a good semi custom rifle and scope costs?
> 
> Looking forward to the Bowtech unveiling....It would be hard be to this bad.



I definitely don't understand this line of thinking. I have $4000-5000 custom rifles with nice optics. They are for long range target shooting/fun. I don't hunt with them. I hunt with a bow 95% of the time and shoot year round. Why would I be afraid to spend $1400 street price on something that's going to get more use than all my guns combined? Yes it's expensive. Yes, I've tried other brands. I shoot Hoyts the best and I know they are as tough as nails. 

Not really sure what would make you happy. All bows are $499, dead in hand, weigh 3 pounds, and shoot 360 FPS.


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## 48archer (Mar 19, 2009)

MORifleman said:


> I definitely don't understand this line of thinking. I have $4000-5000 custom rifles with nice optics. They are for long range target shooting/fun. I don't hunt with them. I hunt with a bow 95% of the time and shoot year round. Why would I be afraid to spend $1400 street price on something that's going to get more use than all my guns combined? Yes it's expensive. Yes, I've tried other brands. I shoot Hoyts the best and I know they are as tough as nails.
> 
> Not really sure what would make you happy. All bows are $499, dead in hand, weigh 3 pounds, and shoot 360 FPS.


In a few years your guns will hold there value or go up, that wont happen with any compound bow.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

MORifleman said:


> I definitely don't understand this line of thinking. I have $4000-5000 custom rifles with nice optics. They are for long range target shooting/fun. I don't hunt with them. I hunt with a bow 95% of the time and shoot year round. Why would I be afraid to spend $1400 street price on something that's going to get more use than all my guns combined? Yes it's expensive. Yes, I've tried other brands. I shoot Hoyts the best and I know they are as tough as nails.
> 
> Not really sure what would make you happy. All bows are $499, dead in hand, weigh 3 pounds, and shoot 360 FPS.


Show me a quailty rifle or handgun that is worth 50% of its value a year after it is produced, and 30 percent of its value 5 years after its produced.

I'll wait. 

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

THE ELKMAN said:


> Agreed. But just for reference: What bow manufacturer release are you typically blown away by? (their aluminum lines weight is leaving a HUGE hole in their line up)


Nope, you are correct. I'm never blown away. Sometimes I am impressed by the meaningful improvements I see made. I'll give a couple of examples. I think the Realm series was a meaningful improvement with the Reign's being a step in the right direction fixing the limb issue but the grip, riser and limb pocket changes were all meaningful improvements IMO. Additionally, when PSE came out with the evolve cam system that was frankly huge. I didn't appreciate how much so at the time but after finally breaking down and buying an evolve 31 (which I hunted with last year and then sold) I came to appreciate the evolve cam system as the best speed to draw ratio out there and still reigning champion by a clear margin IMO. And I think the improvements they made with the evoke series this year (new caged riser design and no goofy batwings plus an improved grip and an improvement to the cable retention system with served cables) addressed the weaknesses I saw in the evolve which I find meaningful. We'll see what Mathews does. Was I "blown away" by any of these? No, but somewhat impressed. I don't see a very meaningful improvement in the Hoyt lineup and frankly like the ATA specs of the RX-1 better but they are nice looking bows. The aluminum just has nothing on anything else out there and the Hoyt cam system is underwhelming to me. You heard almost zero praise for that system over the past year (despite it being new) vs the evolve, OD Binary, Cross-centric systems which have a LOT more love shown for them. The Hoyt carbons look very nice but I have a hard time justifying the price difference for specs that are no better, a cam system that is fine but sort of lackluster by comparison and not much else going for it other than a "warm touch" which I find to be grossly overrated (but then I wrap my handles with tennis grip tape and have no problem wearing a thin glove in colder weather and using a hand muff in super cold weather. The convenience of a "warm touch" doesn't seem to justify an extra $500.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

Predator said:


> Nope, you are correct. I'm never blown away. Sometimes I am impressed by the meaningful improvements I see made. I'll give a couple of examples. I think the Realm series was a meaningful improvement with the Reign's being a step in the right direction fixing the limb issue but the grip, riser and limb pocket changes were all meaningful improvements IMO. Additionally, when PSE came out with the evolve cam system that was frankly huge. I didn't appreciate how much so at the time but after finally breaking down and buying an evolve 31 (which I hunted with last year and then sold) I came to appreciate the evolve cam system as the best speed to draw ratio out there and still reigning champion by a clear margin IMO. And I think the improvements they made with the evoke series this year (new caged riser design and no goofy batwings plus an improved grip and an improvement to the cable retention system with served cables) addressed the weaknesses I saw in the evolve which I find meaningful. We'll see what Mathews does. Was I "blown away" by any of these? No, but somewhat impressed. I don't see a very meaningful improvement in the Hoyt lineup and frankly like the ATA specs of the RX-1 better but they are nice looking bows. The aluminum just has nothing on anything else out there and the Hoyt cam system is underwhelming to me. You heard almost zero praise for that system over the past year (despite it being new) vs the evolve, OD Binary, Cross-centric systems which have a LOT more love shown for them. The Hoyt carbons look very nice but I have a hard time justifying the price difference for specs that are no better, a cam system that is fine but sort of lackluster by comparison and not much else going for it other than a "warm touch" which I find to be grossly overrated (but then I wrap my handles with tennis grip tape and have no problem wearing a thin glove in colder weather and using a hand muff in super cold weather. The convenience of a "warm touch" doesn't seem to justify an extra $500.


Agreed


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

trial153 said:


> Show me a quailty rifle or handgun that is worth 50% of its value a year after it is produced, and 30 percent of its value 5 years after its produced.
> 
> I'll wait.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


No question whatsoever that a firearm is a MUCH better financial investment than a bow. I guess, however, if you are using a bow WAY more and aren't dumping it for a new bow every one or two years, a sizable investment in a bow that you'll use a lot for say 4 or 5 years minimum isn't a bad investment from a use/enjoyment perspective (but still fails to be a great "financial" investment).


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## Alchemist_PhD (Sep 2, 2018)

As far as a slight price increase, is any of it attributed to import tariffs if these carbon bows are produced in Asia? Normal increases every year are expected, but are these subject to additional tax due to manufacturing locations? I don’t have a clue so just opening it up for discussion.


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## MORifleman (Apr 7, 2018)

trial153 said:


> Show me a quailty rifle or handgun that is worth 50% of its value a year after it is produced, and 30 percent of its value 5 years after its produced.
> 
> I'll wait.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


You're going to be waiting forever. That's why I said I don't understand the argument. Guns have always held their value better than bows. That's not new and that's not ever going to change. Why compare the two? 

If I shoot my bow for 5 years, take 20 animals, and shoot 50 tournaments with it, and then sell it for $400 bucks, I'm not going to lose any sleep over it. With your logic, no one should ever by bows new because they are a bad investment. So don't.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

AntlerCRAZED said:


> This. This. This.


The point is it should offer something so great and ground breaking for $600-700 more money bare bow.The Realm,Realm X,and Elite Ritual both are way better price pointed bows for the guys who don't like short bows like the Mathews.Hoyts are great bows but so are a lot of the other bows.There is no way someone can shoot a Triax,Ritual,Realm,Realm X,etc etc and tell me the Hoyt is the absolute best most accurate bow far and away better to the tune of is price point.Thats just my honest opinion and I do like Hoyts I think they look sweet and shoot very well just not $1500 well vs my $850 well bow.[/QUOTE]


*No worries brother - I want to make this clear that I'm not bashing other bow companies or folks choices. Once again, 'Merica! Thankfully we have the right to choose!

But, I have shot ALL of the bows you mentioned and I can absolutely say that the RX-1 was the most accurate, easier to tune, and far and away the better choice FOR ME. And it's my wife's money so I can spend it how I want.

-Realm X - won't even go there due to previous limb issues. I need proven reliably, not promises of new limbs staying together. When I'm dragging my bow through brush stalking muleys in Wyoming, I need to trust it will stay together.
-Elite Ritual- hate the limb stops, too solid of a back wall for me. I compete and hunt with a hinge and I need to "feel" the wall.
-Mathews Triax- not my cup of tea. Too short and blocky.

So there ya go!*


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

efey said:


> I am constantly in awe at the need to "redesign" or offer new "groundbreaking" technology. Folks mad about not seeing a new cam system? Completely ignoring the additional cost of constructing a quality riser from carbon over CNCing Al? The price of these carbon bows have changed very little since their inception of the spyder line. Why is this still an issue? NO, they don't owe you anything that is leaps and bounds above the rest for the additional cost. It's like a kevlar hull on a poling skiff. Is the extra 8 grand worth saving an inch of draft to you? No? Then move on! I like to shoot carbon because it feels better to me, its warmer so I don't have to hunt with a glove on my bow hand up north, and I get the added rigidity in the riser. I am not a Hoyt fanboy although I currently do shoot a Hoyt. That may change this year if I shoot something I like better. But, dayuummmm, no one gets hate like Hoyt. And I think it is unfounded. They have no obligation to you with their designs. Most people whining probably aren't even in the market for a new bow, but rather just like to spoil it for everyone else.


I don't see a lot of hate going on here (a little maybe, yes). I mostly see fair observations and opinions. I laugh when people try to label any comments that aren't "sunshine and roses" as "hate". It's silly really.

As for a new cam system, as I pointed out, there's not a lot of love for the Hoyt cam system and Hoyt themselves (in their "fake news" advertising) set up the expectation for a whole new cam system. The combination of these two factors is bound to create a little disappointment when they roll out the same 'ol, same 'ol cam system.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

0nepin said:


> No worries bow ??????? You mean the Rx1 that’s under recall right now ??? Crazy hoyt fan boys


There you are! 20 pages and no trolling from you had me worried something had happened! 

Really, a voluntary offering to fix an issue for free is the best gripe you got? Comeone, you can troll better than that!


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## 500 fps (Oct 13, 2002)

0nepin said:


> Well they look good and they got to have less hand shock than the rx1.i see they have gotten rid of the lower yoke barrel .i will shoot them but I’m so happy with my stealth that I’m not In the market for a new bow .besides I’m not real confident in hoyts R&D department after the rx1 recall ..


Since I have never really followed Hoyt I never heard about the recall. Would you mind pointing me in a direction where I could read more about before I jump I to unfamiliar water? Thanks!


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

Predator said:


> I don't see a lot of hate going on here (a little maybe, yes). I mostly see fair observations and opinions. I laugh when people try to label any comments that aren't "sunshine and roses" as "hate". It's silly really.
> 
> As for a new cam system, as I pointed out, there's not a lot of love for the Hoyt cam system and Hoyt themselves (in their "fake news" advertising) set up the expectation for a whole new cam system. The combination of these two factors is bound to create a little disappointment when they roll out the same 'ol, same 'ol cam system.


I will give you credit Predator, at least your comments are actually geared to your thoughts on the "innovations" and not just that company, which is the point efey is making when he uses the word "hate". 

Other than the complaint about price, which in my opinion is silly because it's just how the world works, some products cost more than others and as consumers we have to decide if we want to pay for extra amount. If Hoyt truly overprices themselves, the their market share will drop and they will have to make a decision to change, cheapen it up, or close. People whining means nothing to them if that are still selling bows. Same with every product out there. Obviously Hoyt seems to feel their market base is willing to pay for the product.

But as you stated, if the innovations don't measure up to the price, then buy something else. And your concise comments are valid in that you don't feel the innovations warrant the increase. I can respect that.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

500 fps said:


> Since I have never really followed Hoyt I never heard about the recall. Would you mind pointing me in a direction where I could read more about before I jump I to unfamiliar water? Thanks!


There hasn't been a recall. Hoyt sent a letter to their dealers stating that some of the bows were seeing unusual amount or wear due to something in the cam machining. They listed the bows models that COULD be affected and have offered to replace the strings and cam for free. MY bow was on the list, but I haven't seen any wear, so I told my dealer I would like to hold of until after season and he said "no problem."

If you own a new RX-1, contact the dealer you purchased it from and see if yours was listed.


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## efey (Oct 16, 2013)

Predator said:


> I don't see a lot of hate going on here (a little maybe, yes). I mostly see fair observations and opinions. I laugh when people try to label any comments that aren't "sunshine and roses" as "hate". It's silly really.
> 
> As for a new cam system, as I pointed out, there's not a lot of love for the Hoyt cam system and Hoyt themselves (in their "fake news" advertising) set up the expectation for a whole new cam system. The combination of these two factors is bound to create a little disappointment when they roll out the same 'ol, same 'ol cam system.


Don't see a lot of hate? Then you aren't looking. And it's not ANY comment that isn't "sunshine and roses". You're trying to generalize my comment to push your opinion. I agree that marketing for an "all new" cam system and rolling out a minor improvement of the previous year is not the best idea. I am ok with disappointment, as I don't expect their bows to fit everyone, myself included.


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

trial153 said:


> Show me a quailty rifle or handgun that is worth 50% of its value a year after it is produced, and 30 percent of its value 5 years after its produced.
> 
> I'll wait.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


well all of them are, but im more knocking your sentence structure. better point, show me one meatball parm worth 50% of its value once its a week old...


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

rattlinman said:


> There hasn't been a recall. Hoyt sent a letter to their dealers stating that some of the bows were seeing unusual amount or wear due to something in the cam machining. They listed the bows models that COULD be affected and have offered to replace the strings and cam for free. MY bow was on the list, but I haven't seen any wear, so I told my dealer I would like to hold of until after season and he said "no problem."
> 
> If you own a new RX-1, contact the dealer you purchased it from and see if yours was listed.


there is a recall and its posted on their website.

https://blog.hoyt.com/


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

efey said:


> Don't see a lot of hate? Then you aren't looking. And it's not ANY comment that isn't "sunshine and roses". You're trying to generalize my comment to push your opinion. I agree that marketing for an "all new" cam system and rolling out a minor improvement of the previous year is not the best idea. I am ok with disappointment, as I don't expect their bows to fit everyone, myself included.


I tried to "generalize" your comment? Seriously? Not sure I can further generalize your comment that "nobody gets hate like Hoyt". Talk about a generalization. I'm not picking on it to push my opinion by any stretch. There's no hate from me so your comment should have nothing to do with my opinion but I find the "hate" accusation (used by many more than just you about many more brands than Hoyt) to be a catch-all generalization used as a lame attempt to discredit any opinion that isn't sunshine and roses. Perhaps you weren't trying to do that but it sure looked like it. If not, I apologize but my observation regarding the use of the "hate" accusation stands.


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## efey (Oct 16, 2013)

Predator said:


> I tried to "generalize" your comment? Seriously? Not sure I can further generalize your comment that "nobody gets hate like Hoyt". Talk about a generalization. I'm not picking on it to push my opinion by any stretch. There's no hate from me so your comment should have nothing to do with my opinion but I find the "hate" accusation (used by many more than just you about many more brands than Hoyt) to be a catch-all generalization used as a lame attempt to discredit any opinion that isn't sunshine and roses. Perhaps you weren't trying to do that but it sure looked like it. If not, I apologize but my observation regarding the use of the "hate" accusation stands.


the generalization was saying that "any comments that aren't roses and sunshine are labeled as hate". I can't believe I am letting myself get sucked into doing this.... My comment was not a generalization. Hoyt gets a lot of hate. Which they do. Not a generalization. Wasn't talking about other brands or in comparison to any other brands. Not a "lame attempt to discredit" anything. It is an observation and an accurate one. And I am glad that you stand behind your observation. You absolutely should. As will I.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

rattlinman said:


> I will give you credit Predator, at least your comments are actually geared to your thoughts on the "innovations" and not just that company, which is the point efey is making when he uses the word "hate".
> 
> Other than the complaint about price, which in my opinion is silly because it's just how the world works, some products cost more than others and as consumers we have to decide if we want to pay for extra amount. If Hoyt truly overprices themselves, the their market share will drop and they will have to make a decision to change, cheapen it up, or close. People whining means nothing to them if that are still selling bows. Same with every product out there. Obviously Hoyt seems to feel their market base is willing to pay for the product.
> 
> But as you stated, if the innovations don't measure up to the price, then buy something else. And your concise comments are valid in that you don't feel the innovations warrant the increase. I can respect that.


Oh no, I have no hate for Hoyt as a company. I don't "hate" any bow brand. It's frankly a silly concept to me. Although I don't practice it, I understand the concept of a human hating another human. Hating a bow brand doesn't even compute to me - it's just plain nonsensical. I appreciate Hoyt as a company and what they've done over time. They have been HUGE in the target archery side of things around the world - both compound and recurve. I've owned a bunch of Hoyts as there was a time that's all I shot. They make very good bows and do so consistently. They've always been a little slow on the technology front and are rarely on the leading edge. Their carbon riser technology is the exception and that's what they've chosen as a differentiating factor. I appreciate that and it's not a bad idea and they would have a hard time differentiating in any other way. The prices are crazy given the depreciation of these things and their need to come out with new bows every year (which is partly what drives the depreciation). If they made a really great carbon bow and sat on it for several years it might make the pricing seem a little less ridiculous to many folks. Technically I'm the target market for the Hoyt Redwrx stuff as my income levels support making purchases of this magnitude, I'm addicted to archery and I've had a weakness for buying at least one (sometimes 2 or 3) new bows per year (a habit I really want to break) and yet they've not get convinced me to drop the significant extra $$$ to go that route. There are aspects of the line that are attractive to me and I'm not saying I won't buy one or would never buy one but my mind just hasn't gotten over that hump (and may never) because there's nothing remotely "logical" to me about pulling that trigger. In my mind it can be nothing but an emotionally based urge that would cause a person to ignore the logic involved and buy one of these and I tend to operate more on logic than emotion when it comes to stuff like this. But who knows, maybe I'll shoot one and get creative in coming up with a logical argument - lol.

I appreciate your thoughtful response to my thoughts on the bows as opposed to the approach some here on AT take by attacking people whose opinions they may not share. I may shoot them and share your opinion although it may take a bit as the knucklehead Hoyt dealer closest to me won't let anyone shoot his Hoyts. He thinks we should just buy them without shooting him but he's an old coot that's set in his ways.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

efey said:


> the generalization was saying that "any comments that aren't roses and sunshine are labeled as hate". I can't believe I am letting myself get sucked into doing this.... My comment was not a generalization. Hoyt gets a lot of hate. Which they do. Not a generalization. Wasn't talking about other brands or in comparison to any other brands. Not a "lame attempt to discredit" anything. It is an observation and an accurate one. And I am glad that you stand behind your observation. You absolutely should. As will I.


Fair enough. My generalization is absolutely a generalization but a largely accurate one in most cases. Perhaps not in your case. All brands get a lot of hate if you are looking for it. Have a good one.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Predator said:


> No question whatsoever that a firearm is a MUCH better financial investment than a bow. I guess, however, if you are using a bow WAY more and aren't dumping it for a new bow every one or two years, a sizable investment in a bow that you'll use a lot for say 4 or 5 years minimum isn't a bad investment from a use/enjoyment perspective (but still fails to be a great "financial" investment).


 I am not talking about investments. I invest in securities, commodities and real estate, not sporting equipment. Archery manufactures have created an Un-sustainable model that will and is killing middle retailers. Lets compare it to another manufactures sector that produces a poor " investment," but relies on middle retailer to move their products. Automobiles manufactures. 

What would happen if car manufactures discontinued models yearly rather then make incremental changes each model year with a total overall haul every several years? Existing inventory value would plummet each year and margins would shrink too low for retailers forced to move inventory ahead of new models. Nobody would be foolish enough to provide financing to a retailer so they could keep cars on a lot with a retail model like that. It would kill auto retailers, so much so that the manufactures understand this add incentives to prevent this. Its all done to protect retail margins so their retailers keep the doors open and continue moving the manufactures products. 

Compared that to a bow manufactures, in this case Hoyts yearly release. They put out totally new models, that have little to no measurable performance difference then the model it's was replacing, however it does devalue the retailers inventory and squeezes their margins to unsustainable levels. Long term this kills the middle retailer, pro shop and only serves to hurt then entry archery industry.


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## efey (Oct 16, 2013)

Predator said:


> Fair enough. My generalization is absolutely a generalization but a largely accurate one in most cases. Perhaps not in your case. All brands get a lot of hate if you are looking for it. Have a good one.


I for sure agree that all brands get it. I also, do not have any hate for any brand. Nor do I have any blind allegiance to any brand, although my first comment may have made it seem that way. You have a good one also.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

Predator said:


> It had been pointed out before that this was mainly a bunch of marketing fluff so let's review.
> 
> New riser technology? Idk about that but they are definitely different risers but that's pretty much true of every brand every year (except maybe Xpedition who has had a history of using the exact same riser for different bows over multiple years). And ironically people are saying the carbon risers look like knock-offs of the PSE carbon risers which look like knock-offs of the first generation Hoyt carbon risers. So maybe it's "new" old technology.
> 
> ...


cannot argue that. i didn't see "all new" happening, and i was hoping they didn't make too big of changes. will they be worth the high price tag to me? who knows, but i agree they are a slightly refined version of their previous (of course hoyt isn't the only one who does this)

i think i will like the rx-1 draw better by early reviews, but i will see for myself soon


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## Prouder27 (Aug 10, 2015)

In all reality it looks like a well developed bow. Definitely going to give it a test drive (especially the 34 ata). What’s wrong with building off last years flagship? That’s what they are doing here. Their engineers seem to have found a couple of tweaks to help tap into its full potential. Once the bow reaches its potential, discontinue. It’s what the top manufacturers do, and it’s the right approach. 
Everyone’s just looking for that new face, set of tits, and blonde hair every year. 


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## BucksnBass525 (Feb 21, 2009)

Prouder27 said:


> In all reality it looks like a well developed bow. Definitely going to give it a test drive (especially the 34 ata). What’s wrong with building off last years flagship? That’s what they are doing here. Their engineers seem to have found a couple of tweaks to help tap into its full potential. Once the bow reaches its potential, discontinue. It’s what the top manufacturers do, and it’s the right approach.
> *Everyone’s just looking for that new face, set of tits, and blonde hair every year. *
> 
> 
> Nailed it!!


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## jmike00 (Jan 6, 2018)

AntlerCRAZED said:


> The point is it should offer something so great and ground breaking for $600-700 more money bare bow.The Realm,Realm X,and Elite Ritual both are way better price pointed bows for the guys who don't like short bows like the Mathews. Hoyts are great bows but so are a lot of the other bows.There is no way someone can shoot a Triax,Ritual,Realm,Realm X,etc etc and tell me the Hoyt is the absolute best most accurate bow far and away better to the tune of is price point.Thats just my honest opinion and I do like Hoyts I think they look sweet and shoot very well just not $1500 well vs my $850 well bow.


They do offer something ground breaking for 6-700 more. It's called Carbon. People need to STOP comparing the aluminum Bowtechs, Mathews, Elite and PSEs to the Hoyt Carbons. Hell PSE even makes their own Carbon that somehow escapes the comparisons. Compare apples to apples. I really don't get it because people love to bash Hoyt and their aluminum bows are ripe for this since they dropped the Turbo option from them last year. 

I get it that people are going to bash the Carbon right of the bat for it's price. That's unavoidable and I dare say somewhat justified. But I do remember the praise of the Nitrum and Faktor before it. I remember the comparisons got even simpler when the aluminum shared the same name as the Carbon with the Defiant. For some reason when the Hyperforce came alongside the RX-1 it was ignored and this whole "*Hoyt's Carbon vs Everyone else's aluminum*" really gained traction to the point now the Helix isn't even being mentioned. Like I said put the Helix up against the competition and bash away for it being slower than the rest because according to Hoyt, the aluminum riser isn't strong enough for the Turbo cam. And if that's truly the case shouldn't that say the Hyperforce and Helix risers have been a downgrade from previous years since Turbo aluminums were never a problem in the past? I'd think that would be great ammunition for the haters.


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## rattlinman (Dec 30, 2004)

friedm1 said:


> there is a recall and its posted on their website.
> 
> https://blog.hoyt.com/


Sorry troll #2, not a single use of the word "recall" anywhere. Sounds like a good company offering up warranty work to me. A recall is a mandated requirement.

*At Hoyt, building the highest-quality archery products in the world is job number one. Not only do we have industry-leading product testing standards before a product is ever approved to go to market, but we also continue to test products in the field to ensure that our exacting standards are being met and that our customer’s experience is exceptional.

Through our continual product testing programs, we have discovered that the original #3 ZT Turbo Cams on the 2018 Carbon RX-1 Turbo bows may create pre-mature string wear. This pre-mature wear could lead to the string needing to be replaced sooner than otherwise expected. (Hoyt recommends that all bow strings be regularly inspected and maintained and that they be replaced after the earlier of two years or two thousand shots.)

To remedy this potential pre-mature string wear, Hoyt is committed to providing a free warranty replacement for the cams and the string on all 2018 Carbon RX-1 Turbo bows with the original #3 ZT Turbo Cams. If you have purchased or own a 2018 Carbon RX-1 Turbo with the original #3 ZT Turbo Cam, and even if you have not previously registered your bow, please visit your place of purchase or any other Authorized Hoyt Retailer to register your bow and have a new set of updated ZT Turbo Cams and string installed at no-charge. You can also contact us at Hoyt (1-801-363-2990) to be sure that your bow is registered and can send it directly to our Hoyt factory technicians for this free warranty replacement.

A specific marking has been placed on the updated #3 ZT Turbo Cam for easy identification. The updated cam features a ZT logo at the end of the cable track near the cable attachment. Any Carbon RX-1 Turbo bows with the updated cam will not need the free warranty replacement. See photo below for reference:

image
We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause but we are absolutely committed to ensuring your utmost satisfaction in your Hoyt product.

Sincerely,

Hoyt Product Testing and Quality Assurance Teams*


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## huntertroy (Feb 16, 2010)

Wow !!! The new bows look great. I cant wait to shoot the 34. I cant believe there still able to squeeze out new changes year after year to a stick and string. Definitely love that Hoyt gives you the option between carbon and aluminum. I'll most likely end up with another carbon cause I can afford it but if I couldn't it's nice to know there's a more affordable aluminum version with the same specs inline with the pricing of other manufacturers. Heck if I really wanted to I could just keep my 14 and 15 carbon turbos and buy nothing. Love this Country


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## friedm1 (Jan 31, 2007)

rattlinman said:


> Sorry troll #2, not a single use of the word "recall" anywhere. Sounds like a good company offering up warranty work to me. A recall is a mandated requirement.
> 
> *At Hoyt, building the highest-quality archery products in the world is job number one. Not only do we have industry-leading product testing standards before a product is ever approved to go to market, but we also continue to test products in the field to ensure that our exacting standards are being met and that our customer’s experience is exceptional.
> 
> ...


dude, stop being obtuse. They are offering a "free warranty replacement" even if your not the original owner. Is there any logical difference between a recall and a totally free, no questions asked replacement for every model in existence? Quit your BS, i owned two Hoyts this year, im just posting the literal hyperlink to the literal recall they are doing.

some people.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

friedm1 said:


> dude, stop being obtuse. They are offering a "free warranty replacement" even if your not the original owner. Is there any logical difference between a recall and a totally free, no questions asked replacement for every model in existence? Quit your BS, i owned two Hoyts this year, im just posting the literal hyperlink to the literal recall they are doing.
> 
> some people.


Yeah, they call it a warranty fix, but their warranty only applies to the original owner, I've been on the short end of that deal before, so I know how strict they are about it. This "warranty" repair sure does act much more like a recall than Hoyt's applicable warranty. I think it is a recall, but rattlinman is right that they are very careful to never call it that. Semantics? maybe...


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## joffutt1 (Mar 23, 2008)

jmike00 said:


> They do offer something ground breaking for 6-700 more. It's called Carbon. People need to STOP comparing the aluminum Bowtechs, Mathews, Elite and PSEs to the Hoyt Carbons. Hell PSE even makes their own Carbon that somehow escapes the comparisons. Compare apples to apples. I really don't get it because people love to bash Hoyt and their aluminum bows are ripe for this since they dropped the Turbo option from them last year.
> 
> I get it that people are going to bash the Carbon right of the bat for it's price. That's unavoidable and I dare say somewhat justified. But I do remember the praise of the Nitrum and Faktor before it. I remember the comparisons got even simpler when the aluminum shared the same name as the Carbon with the Defiant. For some reason when the Hyperforce came alongside the RX-1 it was ignored and this whole "*Hoyt's Carbon vs Everyone else's aluminum*" really gained traction to the point now the Helix isn't even being mentioned. Like I said put the Helix up against the competition and bash away for it being slower than the rest because according to Hoyt, the aluminum riser isn't strong enough for the Turbo cam. And if that's truly the case shouldn't that say the Hyperforce and Helix risers have been a downgrade from previous years since Turbo aluminums were never a problem in the past? I'd think that would be great ammunition for the haters.


If it was a $300 upcharge nobody would complain and some would even argue for it, but where people make the stand is that you have to justify $700 more for a carbon riser which, unless I'm missing something, doesn't provide any real advantage to the shooter.

It's not that the Hoyt Carbons are bad bows. I think they may be some of the best in the industry, but where you lose me is saying that it's worth paying $700 more than the comparable flag ship from another company.


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

THE ELKMAN said:


> I will say this. They are VERY quiet, and shock free. Balance is perfect.


"They" both the RX-3 AND Helix?


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## 500 fps (Oct 13, 2002)

rattlinman said:


> There hasn't been a recall. Hoyt sent a letter to their dealers stating that some of the bows were seeing unusual amount or wear due to something in the cam machining. They listed the bows models that COULD be affected and have offered to replace the strings and cam for free. MY bow was on the list, but I haven't seen any wear, so I told my dealer I would like to hold of until after season and he said "no problem."
> 
> If you own a new RX-1, contact the dealer you purchased it from and see if yours was listed.


Thank you!


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## ekimox (Oct 13, 2017)

I'm most interested in hearing about reviews and feedback on the Helix Ultra. I really liked my Pro Defiant 34 (other than the vane clearance issues) so I'd definitely be willing to give it a try. Could be my next bow depending on what Bowtech does. Hoping for a longer ATA Realm.


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

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## 4IDARCHER (Jul 1, 2006)

Every time I about get sucked into new carbons, which is pretty often, I have to remind myself of the camo dipping (any camo dipping) and balance that with the cost. I know cost has been beaten to death on these bows as it should but I feel it is almost impossible for anyone to justify paying that amount of money for a finish that is one of the worst in the industry.


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## Adamsdjr (Aug 17, 2015)

ontarget7 said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Are these pics from a new bow?


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Thx Shane for the pics! How does that pattern look in person?
My shop got their rx3's in today. One in elev II.

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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

Adamsdjr said:


> Are these pics from a new bow?


Yes 


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Kind of crappy for an 1700 bow finish


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## kravguy (Oct 12, 2006)

trial153 said:


> Kind of crappy for an 1700 bow finish


Why can't they get this nailed down? It's been almost a decade. And number 2 complaint after the price would have to be the finish. Almost like their (Hoyts) reply to finish issues is, it is what it is....

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## Adamsdjr (Aug 17, 2015)

ontarget7 said:


> Yes
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Oh my, I don’t think I have ever seen a flagship bow with that poor of a finish. Hopefully there is some explanation for that and it will not happen again. I asked if it was new because it looked like it had been through a hunting season or two..


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## kravguy (Oct 12, 2006)

4IDARCHER said:


> Every time I about get sucked into new carbons, which is pretty often, I have to remind myself of the camo dipping (any camo dipping) and balance that with the cost. I know cost has been beaten to death on these bows as it should but I feel it is almost impossible for anyone to justify paying that amount of money for a finish that is one of the worst in the industry.


Careful here, or you will be labeled a hater or cry baby for bringing something like this up. 

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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Yea, just as i thought, bland, bland!
Although the rt edge looked decent.

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## That_TN_Guy (Oct 23, 2017)

Shane, could you take a pic of the bottom limb bolt nut on both sides?

Thanks,


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

4IDARCHER said:


> Every time I about get sucked into new carbons, which is pretty often, I have to remind myself of the camo dipping (any camo dipping) and balance that with the cost. I know cost has been beaten to death on these bows as it should but I feel it is almost impossible for anyone to justify paying that amount of money for a finish that is one of the worst in the industry.


the new storm may be a solution to that? or black... i do agree though, my Triax is the same though, as well as most. Mathews and Hoyt, 2 companies who have been in the "big 3" for MANY years, have the worst finishes.

i honestly don't expect for that many people to appreciate Hoyt carbons, but wasn't their original (matrix) almost as expensive as the rx-1 and 3's even back then? were the Hoyt carbons ever more affordable? (relative to aluminum)

it seems like this is beating a dead horse every year, we all know the price difference, and you aren't going to see a bow that is 33% better as the price may indicate. the bow may be a little better to a small group of folks, i also don't buy the warmer in the hand reason, but it's never that cold here, and i remember it was really cold one year here second season, i had a big herd of elk feeding to me, and before they got there, my bow hand got so cold i had to set my bow down.... and ended up getting busted trying to get the bow back up and hands out of my pockets...but it was cold! i don't think a carbon riser would have helped me.... but maybe.

i like the natural balance of the rx-1, and how it maintains that balance rigged to hunt, and the perfect mass weight (for my taste) i just didn't handle an aluminum 18' that had that same perfect feel to me.

i don't know if the actual materials had anything to do with it, but i sure like the rx-1's, and if i like the rx-3's more, and more than the rest of the bows i'm interested in, i'm buying one.

i'm looking for a bow to shoot for a few years, i don't want a new bow next year, i do better with equipment i'm really familiar with, and don't change. that is why i am still interested in the rx-3 (and possibly a new rx-1 still) i don't mind the crappy finish, because it will not effect performance at all, and i want to keep the next bow i buy.

i completely understand those who do care about the worst finish on the most expensive bow, as well as the price. i think it's a niche bow, like i think the triax is a niche bow. 

hoyt builds perhaps the toughest bows as well, always have. i am far from decided on what bow i will buy this year, but hoyt does have some things that i really like. i will be shooting the fast PSE stealth before doing anything, those specs are too good not to try (light carbon 33" bow, 350fps, 75% letoff) i would feel like a Hoyt fan boy buying an rx-3 without shooting the PSE, which is clearly more impressive in specs, balance and how it aims for me is more important than the specs, i'm worried about the grip, and i'm worried it's too light, but i have to at least rule it out.

Hoyt seemed to have a very predictable line this year, but i don't think that's a bad thing. someone mentioned everyone was looking for a new face, blonde hair, etc.... that sentence was very accurate i think!


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

If a carbon bow was faster, lighter, more stable and looked better.....I wouldn't give a rats ass it it 3k. I would own two. 
The arent and I dont.


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

deer310sg said:


> Thx Shane for the pics! How does that pattern look in person?
> My shop got their rx3's in today. One in elev II.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk


I like the look of them this year. Also feel great in the hand, shot is awesome and quiet.

Camo quality is not that good 


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

trial153 said:


> If a carbon bow was faster, lighter, more stable and looked better.....I wouldn't give a rats ass it it 3k. I would own two.
> The arent and I dont.


PSE makes a faster and lighter carbon.... not sure about stability, and looks....well, it looks better than a gearhead or APA:wink: i personally do like the lines of the RX-3, but that isn't high up on my list.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

ontarget7 said:


> I like the look of them this year. Also feel great in the hand, shot is awesome and quiet.
> 
> Camo quality is not that good
> 
> ...


Did you happen to get a mass weight for the RX3 out of the box? 

And I agree they do have some eye appeal less the finsh.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

roosiebull said:


> PSE makes a faster and lighter carbon.... not sure about stability, and looks....well, it looks better than a gearhead or APA:wink: i personally do like the lines of the RX-3, but that isn't high up on my list.


Call be silly but the looks is the only thing that stoped me on the carbon stealth....its fugly.


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

trial153 said:


> Did you happen to get a mass weight for the RX3 out of the box?
> 
> And I agree they do have some eye appeal less the finsh.


No

Was going to pull the trigger on it but need to verify I can clean up the vertical nock travel they were getting on initial setup. 




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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

Just got a report that the HDX is tuning on the money so I may pull the trigger. 
If I do, will keep you posted with tuning info

My hands will thank me for late season hunting


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

trial153 said:


> Call be silly but the looks is the only thing that stoped me on the carbon stealth....its fugly.


it's our money and we have piles of choices, no reason for any of us to "settle" whether it's looks or specs, buy the bow you like. i'm the same with vehicles, i'm gonna be stuck with it for awhile, so i'm getting one i LIKE.

it's only silly to those who don't care about looks, but they care about something, and that may seem silly to us:wink: they pretty much all shoot good enough, and they aren't cheap, get the variation we like.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

ontarget7 said:


> Just got a report that the HDX is tuning on the money so I may pull the trigger.
> If I do, will keep you posted with tuning info
> 
> My hands will thank me for late season hunting
> ...


that's good. can't wait to test drive one (ultra and turbo) what one did you shoot Shane?

how is the noise compared to the triax?


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## AntlerCRAZED (Oct 12, 2009)

nestly said:


> You can make that argument about virtually any type of product (ex. clothing, tools, televisions, vehicle, watches, furnature, arrows, etc) There are usually multiple levels of products that pretty much perform the same task, and there's a market for all of them. If someone doesn't think a particular product is worth it's price when there are other options, that's their decision to make, but the constant need to justify that decision by some kinda sounds a bit like a lack of confidence.
> Everyone knows that paying twice the price for a product doesn't necessarily buy you a product that's twice as good... there's no need to keep droning on about it.


Obviously you didn't get the point.I like Hoyt bows they look sweet and shoot decent.The point I was making is no one cares if someone buys a Hoyt cause thats the bow they like.People just get turned off by people trying to justify the purchase of an expensive bow like somehow Hoyt is discovering fire or something.Everyone should shoot what they like I just get tired of meeting people, we start talking bows, then they say they shoot Hoyt and when I say I shoot Mathews or any other brand I have shot and they chuckle.It has happen multiple times.Hell my taxidermist has the Hoyt buck tattooed on his body.I know I know there are fanboys of every single brand there is I do understand that so maybe its just the area in which I live but it sure seems like people feel the need to explain to me why their $1500 bow is better than mine.Thats all and just my opinion sorry if it ruffles feathers with anyone its not a knock on Hoyt as a brand cause I think they are great bows and I do still love a Carbon Spyder


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

trial153 said:


> Did you happen to get a mass weight for the RX3 out of the box?
> 
> And I agree they do have some eye appeal less the finsh.


I weighed the Helix, RX-3, RX-1, and Ritual30 today. All were bare out of the box with tags still attached.

Helix - 4.76
RX-3 - 4.45
RX-1 - 4.31
Ritual30 - 4.23

I guess it's now standard procedure for manufacturers to advertise the weight of the bow without any of the dampening or string weights installed?


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## 4IDARCHER (Jul 1, 2006)

nestly said:


> I weighed the Helix, RX-3, RX-1, and Ritual30 today. All were bare out of the box with tags still attached.
> 
> Helix - 4.76
> RX-3 - 4.45
> ...


I think this post should be front and center. It shows the truth hidden by the marketing.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

nestly said:


> I weighed the Helix, RX-3, RX-1, and Ritual30 today. All were bare out of the box with tags still attached.
> 
> Helix - 4.76
> RX-3 - 4.45
> ...


Thanks, appreciate the effort. 

The two aluminium riser bows are really close to their advised specs.....

But the RX3 is almost a half pound heavier? And I flipping reading that right? 

Its advertised at 3.9 pounds and you weighted it at 4.45 pound. 

What a crock of *****.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

trial153 said:


> Thanks, appreciate the effort.
> 
> The two aluminium riser bows are really close to their advised specs.....
> 
> ...


Helix is listed at 4.3, so .46 over
RX-3 is listed at 3.9, so .55 over
RX-1 is listed at 3.9, so .41 over
Ritual30 listed at 4.1, so .13 over
I wanted to weigh a Triax but got distracted and never got around to it.


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## NYyotekiller (Dec 7, 2011)

nestly said:


> I weighed the Helix, RX-3, RX-1, and Ritual30 today. All were bare out of the box with tags still attached.
> 
> Helix - 4.76
> RX-3 - 4.45
> ...


Hoyt lists the RX-3 as 3.9lbs...is there really 0.5 lbs of dampening and string weights on it?


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## PAKraig (Sep 19, 2005)

NYyotekiller said:


> Hoyt lists the RX-3 as 3.9lbs...is there really 0.5 lbs of dampening and string weights on it?


Yeah, probably


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

nestly said:


> Helix is listed at 4.3, so .46 over
> RX-3 is listed at 3.9, so .55 over
> RX-1 is listed at 3.9, so .41 over
> Ritual30 listed at 4.1, so .13 over
> I wanted to weigh a Triax but got distracted and never got around to it.


That's unreal, what a bunch liars.


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

NYyotekiller said:


> Hoyt lists the RX-3 as 3.9lbs...is there really 0.5 lbs of dampening and string weights on it?


Yeah, probably, there are 8 steel slugs in the lower shock pods and bunch of other rubber dampeners and brass speed nocks aren't light.

Having said that, the RX-s (both) balance so well they don't "feel" as heavy to me as other bows with the same actual mass weight. I'm not excusing the practice of misrepresenting weights to the customers, but I honestly could care less if a bare bow weights 4 pounds or 5 pounds, it's going to end up much heavier once I set it up anyway.


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## 138104 (May 14, 2009)

So much for carbon being lighter...


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## NYyotekiller (Dec 7, 2011)

nestly said:


> Helix is listed at 4.3, so .46 over
> RX-3 is listed at 3.9, so .55 over
> RX-1 is listed at 3.9, so .41 over
> Ritual30 listed at 4.1, so .13 over
> I wanted to weigh a Triax but got distracted and never got around to it.


That is a crock that they would lie through their teeth like that. Do they really think that no one will ever weigh them for themselves?

I could see them stretching the truth maybe a tenth or two a pound, but a half a pound is just obscene.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

Perry24 said:


> So much for carbon being lighter...


But but but ....its warmer!!! And the bone head crew has a hunt planned in south texas so you better buy one to help fund them !


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

NYyotekiller said:


> That is a crock that they would lie through their teeth like that. Do they really think that no one will ever weigh them for themselves?
> 
> I could see them stretching the truth maybe a tenth or two a pound, but a half a pound is just obscene.


Again, I'm not defending it, but apparently weighing the equipment stripped down is not uncommon. The shop manager who was there when I was weighing the bows said crossbow manufacturers do the same thing. Only the crossbow weight is advertised, but they are sold only as a package with scope, scope mounts, and quivers and those items are not included in the advertised weight.


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## muleydude (Jun 1, 2012)

I've seen two youtube speed reviews. One came in 20fps slow and the other 11fps.
70lb
30" dl
415gr
297fps

70lb
29"
410gr
301fps


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## muleydude (Jun 1, 2012)

That was the RX-3 31"


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

muleydude said:


> I've seen two youtube speed reviews. One came in 20fps slow and the other 11fps.


I shot a 70lb RX-3 at 27.5 and 29", both times with a 350 grain arrow. I'm not going to post the actual speeds because I didn't verify the DL, DW, or tune, but it appeared it would fall well short of the advertised speed at 70lbs/30"/350grains. Never-the-less, I was impressed with the way the bow felt, drew, held, shot, and sounded. at ~5grains per pound.


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

I like everything about the RX-3 initially but may wait and order it in a #2 cam 28” draw.

The camo quality is my only negative on my initial take. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## vmals (Jul 24, 2018)

Just weighed my rx-1 turbo WITH qad rest and peep/d loop/ brass nock - 4.4lbs on my last chance archery draw weight scale.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

nestly said:


> I weighed the Helix, RX-3, RX-1, and Ritual30 today. All were bare out of the box with tags still attached.
> 
> Helix - 4.76
> RX-3 - 4.45
> ...


dang! that is unfortunate. the rx-1 sure felt light compared to the triax last year, anyone ever get an accurate weight on the chubby triax? that truth does suck, i'm still gonna shoot it.


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## Predator (Jan 18, 2003)

Yikes, with bow weights that heavy, a finish as bad as what was shown in pics and a very so-so cam system it should be shocking that anyone would pay that kind of money for these things - and yet they will.


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## roosiebull (Oct 3, 2010)

Predator said:


> Yikes, with bow weights that heavy, a finish as bad as what was shown in pics and a very so-so cam system it should be shocking that anyone would pay that kind of money for these things - and yet they will.


i'm surprised that they are that heavy this year, seemed like that was a big complaint with the rx-1 line, that has to get back to them, surprised they went the other way.

really hoping i fall in love with the stealth EF:wink:


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## ontarget7 (Dec 30, 2009)

Here’s what I got right out of the box 
This scale peak weight matches identical to my drawboard scale as well. Have tested a few none item weights to verify also


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

That's the same as what we got^^


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## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

ontarget7 said:


> Here’s what I got right out of the box
> This scale peak weight matches identical to my drawboard scale as well. Have tested a few none item weights to verify also


That's interesting. I suppose it's possible the scale calibration is off on the scale I used, but that doesn't explain why the RX-3 reads 0.2 lbs heavier than a Ritual30 on the same scale. (Ritual30 is supposed to be 4.1) The shop has a mail scale in their shipping department, I'll figure it out next time I'm in.


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

We are getting what Shane is getting


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## 0nepin (Sep 16, 2009)

With it being heavier than the ritual on the same scale makes what you posting very interesting


nestly said:


> That's interesting. I suppose it's possible the scale calibration is off on the scale I used, but that doesn't explain why the RX-3 reads 0.2 lbs heavier than a Ritual30 on the same scale. (Ritual30 is supposed to be 4.1) The shop has a mail scale in their shipping department, I'll figure it out next time I'm in.


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## trial153 (Nov 27, 2011)

You can take these specs to the bank.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?ur...share_tid=110796&share_fid=45046&share_type=t


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