# Any VAP Target arrow experts out there? Spine help?



## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

I've been using Bloodsport One arrows for a while, but the 800 spine with 100 grain points (31" arrow shaft, uncut) have always been a bit stiff. These arrows are a little uncommon, so I'm wanting to switch to something a little easier to get. I've got to get some new arrows and thought I'd go for Victory VAP Target V3 shafts because I need the length. http://www.victoryarchery.com/vap_target

The specs: 31.75" AMO Draw Length (so arrows will be uncut, full-length), 30.5# draw weight (on the fingers), 70" overall bow length, 8125G string, Cartel Midas riser, and Win & Win WinAct carbon/wood limbs. 

What I really would enjoy is some advice on the spine to order and the point weight to start with. I was thinking either 900 or 1000 spine with 100 grain points. 

If anyone has experience with these shafts, I'd love to know what your opinion is on what spine would most likely be correct and what point weight would most likely be right. I suspect they're similar to many other shafts in this spine range (and similar diameter), so chime in if you have an opinion.

-Kent W.


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## Kumikaine (Dec 9, 2012)

Vaps are usually one spine stiffer than they should be. 30.5# with a 31" shaft and 100-110 grain points I believe you will need a 600 spine vap. I also suggest you use Top-Hat points. This is just my experience.


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

I'm a bit skeptical about 600 spine. If, as you say, they're one spine stiffer (IE: 800 spine is really more like 700), then I should definitely go with the 1000 spine, since 800 spine arrows are already a bit stiff. Or did you mean that you buy one spine stiffer (IE: you buy 600 spine to get actual 700 spine)?


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## Kumikaine (Dec 9, 2012)

I meant that 600 spine is really more like 500 spine. Using the the Victory arrow selection chart as guide, I usually go with one spine weaker than what they recommend.


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## anmactire (Sep 4, 2012)

Oddly, at those specs it seems you should need a 600 spine according to the victory selection charts I could find. Other chart selections for similar arrows like the carbon one suggest similar specs, as do the carbon express charts. Trusting that you're correct about your current arrows and their dynamic spine, maybe you would do well to grab a few single vap v6 arrows of different spines to test. More expensive than just getting the right ones straight away, but cheaper than getting a full dozen of the wrong ones only to replace them. Sorry I can't be of better help than that. Typical arrow chart speculation.


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## Last_Bastion (Dec 5, 2013)

Agreed that they can run a little stiffer than they should. I shoot the V1 600's and I have to use the softest spring on my plunger to get them to work. But if I shoot my 700 CX's (both with the same length and point weight) they tune a lot better.

For 30.5# DW and those W&W limbs, I would think the 900's would be best with either a 90 or 100gr point.


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## Kristjon (Feb 19, 2013)

just got my new order of shafts and Vap has now got Top Hat to make the points for them. I bought the 90-110grain from this sight and man.. the fit is smooth, no lip to catch in the target.

http://www.bowhunterssuperstore.com....html?osCsid=66eb12c7431ac8a93ce6fac9406ce41b


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

Kristjon, thanks for the heads-up. I had noticed that Top Hat points were available and had thought I'd use them. 

Right now I'm leaning toward the 900 spine shafts with 120 grain points. Any other opinions out there?

-Kent W.


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## abbykristine (Jul 26, 2013)

I am currently using Vaps V6 (Also work in a proshop so I got to test them out before actually buying them).

My first set of shafts were 23 3/4 in at a 700 spine and used 80g points (if I remember correctly) and I was shooting about 30-36lbs of weight.
I have extended 2 inches. 
Now I have my shafts cut at 25 3/4 in at a 600 spine with a 100g point and still am around the 30/36lb area.

VAPs are definitely trickier to figure out the spine area, but seeing the specs you've given and going off the chart Victory provides, you might do fine with 600, maybe the 500.
I mean I have a small draw and shoot not that much poundage and have a spine of 700.
But my specs are with the lesser straight arrow of the V6 and I'm not completely in the know of how different V3s and V1s are from the the V6. But I hope some of this helps.


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

abbykristine said:


> I am currently using Vaps V6 (Also work in a proshop so I got to test them out before actually buying them).
> 
> My first set of shafts were 23 3/4 in at a 700 spine and used 80g points (if I remember correctly) and I was shooting about 30-36lbs of weight.
> I have extended 2 inches.
> ...


Are you by chance a compound shooter?

Because if you shoot recurve then you are massively overspined at that DW and DL.

-Grant


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

Well, here's the end of the story for now. I looked on Lancaster and the 800 spine Bloodsport arrows are being clearanced out for a ridiculous price ($7 per shaft for 0.003 straightness, not that straightness is the most important spec). I bought the last 7 shafts in 800 spine. To help compensate for the slight over-spining, I grabbed 120 grain points, which should help. Although they're not quite as nice as the VAP arrows, they'll do for now until I increase my limb draw weight (bolts are almost maxed out now).

I'll deal with the uncommon shafts for now - the savings was substantial. Maybe when I up my draw weight I can go for some more mainstream arrows, but these will suffice for quite a while. Also, working on improving my release and follow-through has made my arrows fly a little better too.

Abbykristine, have you bareshaft tested that arrow setup? I'd be interested to know what a good, rigorous bareshaft test shows with your setup. That's really the best way to determine if your arrows are properly spined and tuned with a recurve. Also, straightness is not the most important characteristic to worry about with respect to carbon arrows, which is really the only difference between the V1, V3, and V6 VAP arrows, according to Victory. Check out this great article by an Olympic Gold Medalist, Rick McKinney : http://www.carbontecharrows.com/main/arrow-spine-weight-and-straightness/ 

-Kent W.


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## abbykristine (Jul 26, 2013)

My last post, I checked my arrows last night my recurve VAPs are 700 and my compound set is 600. So to answer Grant, I do both. They shoot amazingly well and I tell shot other spines. 800 didn't fly that great with my set up, I'm not exactly why, but when I moved into a 700, I received way better results. Got a couple of almost perfect bullet holes with my recurve, got complete bullet holes with my compound. So as to it being way over spines, I don't see a problem in it at all. 

I did bare shaft shooting before I bought the arrows and fletched them. That's what helped me pick out the spine. We did look at the chart and did a comparison. 700 spine apparently works really well with what I'm set up with. I have a few arrows cut but not fletched, so I can try bare shaft shooting again before I fletch them. Last night I went through my form and went through tuning my bow which I'll have to do again when I make my strings but so far, I've had no flight trouble other than noticing my plunger was was too stiff and once that was fixed, everything was dandy.

If you are interested in seeing what my set up does with my arrows, I can definitely check it out, Monday or Wednesday (my days off). Just give me a list of what you want to check out or look out for and I'll do what I can.


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## knotdodger (Oct 2, 2005)

I am using v3 Vap's at 36 lbs. 29 inch arrow. And 800.s tune good for me. 27.75 inch draw. But I am no expert.
Using a 18 strand, 8125g string, with 62xs center seving, 68 inch bow.


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