# Did anyone go to the PGC Crossbow Meeting??



## ArbutusBucks (Sep 24, 2007)

I atteneded the discussion yesterday for about three hours. The discussion was not as heated as I initially expected it to be. Obviously there was also today and tomorrow for everyone to speak, but I didn't see the fireworks. Did anyone see anything at the discussion today that was worth noting. 

Personally, I would rather not have them included in the season. I have seen every argument for and against, but just feel the hunting pressure in PA is not like any other state. However, I can see both sides of the coin and empathize with the x-bow advocates. Please don't turn this into a pie throwing contest I just want to know if anything happened at the meeting this afternoon.

- Arbutus


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## ArcherAdam (Nov 27, 2007)

I wanted to go bad. Unfortunately I could not get out of work. I am against the inclusion.


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## FDR (Dec 8, 2008)

Too late OP. I think this one may get a couple pages, I hope not.:zip:


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## LAMADMAN (Aug 17, 2006)

This was the first year in Louisiana that everyone could hunt with an xbow. I dont think it had as big of an impact as we archers thought it would. Sure some of the guys made some kills but alot found out what we knew would happen, "this aint as easy as I thought". I know of alot of missing going on. Gun hunters turned xbow hunters had the same excuses that are why they only gun hunted before. Like it`s too hot,or too many skeeters and they found out how bulky and clumbsy those things are. Anyway, I wouldnt get all worried about it cause it takes a couple years for a gun hunter to change into a bow hunter. By that time alot of the new xbow guys will have given it up. Thats my opinion on it.


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## FDR (Dec 8, 2008)

We don't have the heat you fellows do down south or our archery season. Skeeters neither. We do have 1 million hunters, how many do you have in LA?

I would guess that would make a difference in the addition of crossbows if it was in your state with those numbers.


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## Viper69 (Feb 4, 2003)

I have a good solution to the problem. Legalize crossbows for the 2 week firearm season and ban rifles during that time. In other words no firarm season! One can dream...:tongue:


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## ArcherAdam (Nov 27, 2007)

It is posted on HuntingPA.com under the General forum that it passed in favor of inclusion 4-3.

No magnifying sights permitted and there is a sunshine provision until 2012.


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## Viper69 (Feb 4, 2003)

Hes right it passed 4-3. This really sucks. Im sure if your not familular with hunting Pa you may not understand what this will mean for Pa bowhunters. The pressure that will now be in the woods for the whole 6 week archery season will be unbelievable.(at least in my area) It will be like the 2 week rifle season with a hunter behind every tree. You should hear some of the rifle hunters that Ive talked to about if crossbows were legal. (and now they are) There seems to be a sense that these things are like rifles and will just knock a deer down and that there is no real limit to how far a shot can be taken. They love the fact that they wont have to practice prior to hunting. I know that this was done for $$$ reasons to sell more archery tags but what a shame. I guess it could be worse and I could be a diehard rifle hunter and now there will be no deer left come rifle season. I guess I could go buy a crossbow now but I would rather stick with my compound or give it up completly. Its a sad day to say the least..:angry:


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## HoytHunter4 (Jan 17, 2007)

Great just what we need!!:angry:


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## ArbutusBucks (Sep 24, 2007)

Fabulous


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## willie (Jul 2, 2003)

I was there is "spirit". :wink:

Fellers,

It is *MUCH ADO ABOUT NOTHING.*

2 or 3 years (if that long) from now we will all ask "why did we even argue about it?"


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## skinner2 (Aug 16, 2006)

*pgc*



Viper69 said:


> I have a good solution to the problem. Legalize crossbows for the 2 week firearm season and ban rifles during that time. In other words no firarm season! One can dream...:tongue:


We can dream but don't think it will ever happen. I for one would like to see it at least in the areas that I hunt.


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## GOLDTIPBZ (Aug 28, 2005)

*yes*



Viper69 said:


> I have a good solution to the problem. Legalize crossbows for the 2 week firearm season and ban rifles during that time. In other words no firarm season! One can dream...:tongue:


thats what i'm talking about. great idea.


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## JeffPaHunter (Jan 13, 2004)

You had to figure it was going to pass.

1) Increased license sales.

2) Pressure from the manufacturer's.


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## deismech (Jan 29, 2008)

Viper69 said:


> Hes right it passed 4-3. This really sucks. Im sure if your not familular with hunting Pa you may not understand what this will mean for Pa bowhunters. The pressure that will now be in the woods for the whole 6 week archery season will be unbelievable.(at least in my area) It will be like the 2 week rifle season with a hunter behind every tree. You should hear some of the rifle hunters that Ive talked to about if crossbows were legal. (and now they are) There seems to be a sense that these things are like rifles and will just knock a deer down and that there is no real limit to how far a shot can be taken. They love the fact that they wont have to practice prior to hunting. I know that this was done for $$$ reasons to sell more archery tags but what a shame. I guess it could be worse and I could be a diehard rifle hunter and now there will be no deer left come rifle season. I guess I could go buy a crossbow now but I would rather stick with my compound or give it up completly. *Its a sad day to say the least*..:angry:


How about instead of pouting about them finding away to get more people involved in hunting, you just be glad that they arent cutting your season or heaven forbid make you enter a draw to hunt. We make it real easy for anti's to take our hunting *privledges* when we start attacking each other. If you don't like the amount of hunters or the pressure... go somewhere else :wink:


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## Cold Weather (Dec 17, 2008)

Good news! I am sure a lot of verticle bowhunters will now have the option of using an xbow as well.

I enjoy all archery-all bowhunting-from stickbows-compounds-and xbows. It opens the door for women who can't pull a compound bow-or children.

it's a win-win for everyone.

Cold Weather


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## One eye (Jun 22, 2003)

Cold Weather said:


> Good news! I am sure a lot of verticle bowhunters will now have the option of using an xbow as well.
> 
> I enjoy all archery-all bowhunting-from stickbows-compounds-and xbows. It opens the door for women who can't pull a compound bow-or children.
> 
> ...


Talk to me when they cut tags and seasons. I realize this is hard to understand for many people from states that do not have lots of hunters. Pennsylvania and Michigan have more bowhunters than many of your states have total hunters combined.

You will not see a growth in hunters from this, but simply a switch of gun hunters to pre-rut bowhunting seasons. If you do not believe this, then why are the crossbow states losing hunters still?????

I guess losing opportunity does not matter to many of you, but it does to me. I would like to meet a woman or child of legal hunting age that cannot pull a compound of sufficient weight for hunting.
Dan


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## ghost1 (Mar 1, 2007)

I love how people in other states WHO have never even been to Pa let alone hunt there or know our seasons have somthing to say about our regs:angry:


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## One eye (Jun 22, 2003)

willie said:


> I was there is "spirit". :wink:
> 
> Fellers,
> 
> ...


Coming to a season near you. Good luck with keeping your seasons with this stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FdWkBJ4sdU


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## irishbowhunter (Nov 26, 2008)

I hunt in bucks county and its such a big deal here they bin using crossbow here for about 3 years now . but that just my 2 cents 

And it did get my wife in to hunting but now she is using a compound bow now


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## greatwhite (Oct 19, 2004)

Heres my thoughts.......

Just gonna have to deal with it. Its not gonna change the way I hunt. It will affect the pressure on the deer. And as previously stated before it may get more hunters into the woods to enjoy the sport that we love so much. I know my wife will probably be one of them. We have tried the compound bow and it just dont work for her and she has wanted to bow hunt for a while now and now she will be able to. 

So I guess what Im saying is that we just need to put our big boy panties on and deal with it.


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## nicko (Feb 17, 2006)

This is no different than when traditional equipment was the only game in town and then compound bows came along. 

I live in the SE part of Pennsylvania and crossbows have been legal here for a few years now. I know people use them but I have yet to see somebody hunting with one on my hunting grounds. 

Nothing that can be done about this issue now. Suck it up and move on guys. Crossbows are here but they are not the end of the world or our archery season for that matter. For those that think crossbows are like shooting rifles, think again. They have the same effective range as a compound, and they *do require practice *to be shot accurately.


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## willie (Jul 2, 2003)

One eye said:


> Coming to a season near you. Good luck with keeping your seasons with this stuff.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FdWkBJ4sdU


*OMG!!* He has an ASSAULT CROSSBOW! BAN IT! BAN IT! BAN IT!

LOL...

My son shot this at the ATA show and he said it is HEAVY, LOUD, LONG AND CUMBERSOME. Not really something one would want to pack into a deer woods. Just your every day crossbows are bulky enough.

I went to the SHOT Show in Orlando and was overwhelmed by the amount of paramilitary stuff. Obama is in for a surprise. :wink: I'm sure a number of these "men in black" will be buying this crossbow as most already own the lower units. It will be a novelty for them, but I do not see it having much of a following in the hunting circles.

It will meet the same fate as the Bowtech Stryker because of its weight and length. 

Come back in a couple years and report on how your deer hunting is. My best guess is NOTHING will change for you.

Much ado about nothing....


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## doebyc (Mar 9, 2006)

I bought one figuring it was going to pass, it all comes down to money. If they don't increase the sale of doe tags, what difference could this possibly make. You may get a few "rifle" hunters who think it will be like the first day of buck season for the whole 6 weeks, but we all know that is not true, they will all give it up soon enough. It is still "Archery" hunting after all.
CHAZ


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## Cold Weather (Dec 17, 2008)

One eye said:


> Talk to me when they cut tags and seasons. I realize this is hard to understand for many people from states that do not have lots of hunters. Pennsylvania and Michigan have more bowhunters than many of your states have total hunters combined.
> 
> You will not see a growth in hunters from this, but simply a switch of gun hunters to pre-rut bowhunting seasons. If you do not believe this, then why are the crossbow states losing hunters still?????
> 
> ...


OneEye

I work part time as an archery technician for one of the largest outdoor stores in the world.

I sell all archery equipment-and I meet lots of hunters-and lots of bowhunters.

I have gun hunters all the time coming in to buy a COMPOUND BOW. I have BOWHUNTERS coming in to buy tackle.

Let me tell you-most are very uneducated. There are guys right now out there-carrying a compound bow-just there for the opportunity.

They do not know how to tune a bow-don't know how to match arrows to a bow-don't know how to adjust their bow.

So, following your logic-we should ban compound bows as well.

here's the bottom line-bowhunting-shooting arrows-is a recreational sport-nothing more.

People with heavy work commitments may not have the time to be profecient with a regular bow-for women and children-an xbow delivers the arrow with more power-more humane.

Cold Weather


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## FDR (Dec 8, 2008)

Can you explain "uneducated"? 


Do you mean they don't know how to work on their equipment or that they are morons?


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## Cold Weather (Dec 17, 2008)

FDR said:


> Can you explain "uneducated"?
> 
> 
> Do you mean they don't know how to work on their equipment or that they are morons?


FDR

if you work in retail-you would know. I've seen it all..

I had one guy come in to get set up for bowhunting season. Now, he's a BOWHUNTER. In the back I have a 10 yard range and a target that stands 5 feet high.

his first arrow-6 feet above the target-had to get a ladder to pull it out

his second arrow-he shot about 2 feet above the target into back wall

his third arrow-he shot one foot above target-drove thru syrafoam-into back wall

he was going hunting the next day.

I've had guys come in-fletching falling off-arrows mismatched. Had two guys show up carrying 30 year old bows..

one of them was an old York bow I think-bought a wisker bisquet rest-then got mad when it wouldn't fit his bow.

I said, "why don't you upgrade?" He told me that since he only used his bow for BOWHUNTING he didn't want to spend the money.

too long of a draw...etc..

trust me...there are LOTS of guys out there carrying a compound bow who are just like what you think these xbow hunters are like..

I talked to one retailer I know-told him my stories-he told me this:

2 guys put in for an elk tag-and these guys weren't bowhunters-but tried for the tags......

THEY GOT THE TAGS

so, they show up at his shop to buy a COMPOUND BOW-ONE COMPOUND BOW-which they would use back and forth between each other-alternate days-bowhunting ELK.

now that doesn't work...

you get a job working in an archery shop and you'll see. Not all bowhunters are the dedicated ones you see on this forum.

Cold Weather


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## FDR (Dec 8, 2008)

I hope you don't call them morons when you are trying to sell them something. But understand what you mean, they are in all seasons with bad equipment and the animal is the one that ends up paying for it.

I have seen more questionable ethics and actions in rifle season than anywhere else. And downright dangerous stuff as some have seen also I'm sure.


FYI PA hunters- the PA legislature had a bill in favor of crossbows prepared to push through last week if the vote this week didn't pass. What does that mean? Companies/manufacturers with vested interests in the multi-million dollar future sales got influence in the legislature somehow. It was decided before the meetings.

I personally hunt in an area that has a crossbow legal archery season and I have no problems hunting with other good/ethical people whatever they use. The state government action is the one that is questionable and should be pointed out for what it is: WRONG


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## smokeykeit (Apr 17, 2008)

*X bow now the poachers choice weapon*

Just think how many good old boys from pa will be wackin deer in the lights now!!


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## Cold Weather (Dec 17, 2008)

FDR

no, of course I don't call them morons...but I've seen it all.

I've fielded firearm questions as well..

had one guy phone in-complained to me that his rifle chambered in 308 Winchester was not set up properly by one of the guys-he bought a scope and we installed it for him-and BORE SIGHTED IT

well, with that he went MOOSE HUNTING and shot at a moose-he said 100 yards and MISSED.

phoned and complained what a lousy job we had done.

well, bore sighting only puts you on paper at 25 yards-HE THOUGHT WE SIGHTED HIS GUN IN FOR HIM..

Getting back to archery-I've had guys come in with D LOOPS that must have measured 2-3".

Had a guy come in with a 1975 Bear Polar LTD-wanted to buy arrows to go bowhunting. Wanted alluminum arrows-which I sold him. I offered to cut them to length-at no charge-he insisted that he shoot them full length.

I've seen guys come in with bows with the WHISKER BISQUIT REST-but the rest is mounted on the very front of the bow-not on the back where it should be..

seen bowstrings never waxed..dull broadheads..

When I started working there it was a shock-like you I am very serious about archery and bowhunting-and tend to surround myself with people who have the same outlook.

I go to 3D shoots-mix with those who frequent pro shops-write on this forum.

But this isn't the dynamic that is out there-and they carry compound bows-so when someone starts telling me crossbows are for the lazy-the less dedicated-I don't think they really know..

I own a crossbow-I have a Excalibur Equinox-and I own compounds from Mathews, PSE, Hoyt as well. Well, with my Equinox at 20 yards, with a Varizone Scope I don't shoot any better than my compounds-and I'm a fairly good shot with a compound.

Cold Weather


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## Cold Weather (Dec 17, 2008)

smokeykeit said:


> Just think how many good old boys from pa will be wackin deer in the lights now!!


SmokeyKeit

let's think on that one for a moment..

now crossbows are legal to own RIGHT NOW-and we are talking about criminals.

so these criminals are waiting for crossbows to be legalized for bowhunting seasons to poach-but they are already legal to own

that makes sense to you?

they could be "wackin them" right now-nothing stops them-and they could be using compounds or recurves.

In our paper there was actually TWO incidents of Canada Geese being shot-OUT OF SEASON-and those were arrows out of a compound.

Cold Weather


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## Big Country (Apr 25, 2003)

Never hunted with a crossbow, and the good Lord willing, I never will.

That said, crossbow inclusion will NOT hurt a darn thing here. They offer no overall advantage over compounds.

What will and does hurt us in PA, and other states is hunters attacking fellow hunters.


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## meyerske (Dec 26, 2004)

Big Country said:


> They offer no overall advantage over compounds.


-Crossbows allow people who are less committed to hunting (i.e., less committed to practicing) to take to the woods and be still be effective. In other words, you don't have to practice as much and can still be effective. 

-They allow people who are less skilled or physically weaker to shoot longer distances. 

-They allow less movement before a shot and so there is less chance of spooking a deer.

Those statements are not meant to be derogatory, they are facts and they are advantages.

I fully support the use of crossbows by physically challenged people.


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## PALongbow (Mar 2, 2008)

When they shorten the season because too many deer are being taken in archery season then the bowhunters of PA will get off thier backsides and do something about it....until then our bowhunters will be complacent for the most part.


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## Nomad_Archer (Aug 27, 2008)

One eye said:


> I would like to meet a woman or child of legal hunting age that cannot pull a compound of sufficient weight for hunting.
> Dan


Well come meet my girlfriend. She cant pull the legal hunting weight in ohio (40lbs) she shoots about 35 lbs an shes 23. Get off the high horse. Crossbows wont be that big of a deal. I hunt both ohio (crossbow state) and PA. I cant wait to rut hunt with my dad now. And yes hes a gun hunter and also the best hunter I know who taught be the skills that allowed me to be the bowhunter I am today. I learned to shoot my bow he taught me the rest.


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## kitchbow (Dec 7, 2006)

*is the problem really crossbows*

I feel the problem is not the crossbows themselves -its just another choice of weapon to use ---- my feeling on it is the fact that it opens the door for anyone who normally would not be in the woods at that time,,,, i'll be really pissed the first morning I go to my stand in the dark and someone is already there and using a xbow 
For years now with a doctors note you could use a crossbow during the regular archery season,I know a few guys that are in that position and even they are pissed about this statewide deal 

WHAT WILL THE STATE CALL THE SEASON NOW SINCE ITS NOT ARCHERY SEASON ANYMORE ?????????????


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## willie (Jul 2, 2003)




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## BigBirdVA (Nov 5, 2002)

willie said:


> *OMG!!* He has an ASSAULT CROSSBOW! BAN IT! BAN IT! BAN IT!
> 
> LOL...
> 
> ...


You couldn't give me one if I had to lug it around. BTW I have the Stryker and it's a lug too. 

After the end of the first season they'll see it didn't matter one bit.


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## BigBirdVA (Nov 5, 2002)

willie said:


>


Nice pic! :wink:


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## Big Country (Apr 25, 2003)

meyerske said:


> -Crossbows allow people who are less committed to hunting (i.e., less committed to practicing) to take to the woods and be still be effective. In other words, you don't have to practice as much and can still be effective.
> 
> Members of AT live and breath bowhunting. We are NOT a good representation of the average bowhunter. Sadly, a big percentage of bowhunters do not practice anywhere near enough to be proficient.
> 
> ...


I fully support crossbows for ALL hunters.

I will be in the timber this year happily hunting with my............Martin Firecat!!:tongue:


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## Big Country (Apr 25, 2003)

kitchbow said:


> I feel the problem is not the crossbows themselves -its just another choice of weapon to use ---- my feeling on it is the fact that it opens the door for anyone who normally would not be in the woods at that time,,,, i'll be really pissed the first morning I go to my stand in the dark and someone is already there and using a xbow
> For years now with a doctors note you could use a crossbow during the regular archery season,I know a few guys that are in that position and even they are pissed about this statewide deal
> 
> WHAT WILL THE STATE CALL THE SEASON NOW SINCE ITS NOT ARCHERY SEASON ANYMORE ?????????????



Here is an idea for what to call the season now.......

Archery Season!!:thumbs_up Crossbows are archery.


BTW, would you be really pissed if you got to your stand and a guy/gal with a compound bow was already there? Sounds like you are worried that a crossbow hunter might be more dedicated? I`m just saying........


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## doebyc (Mar 9, 2006)

my local paper had an article today about how nobody at all in PA wants crossbows legal. One guy was worried about all the wounded deer because the crossbow doesn't have the "knock down power" of a compound. They printed that, not as much knock down power! They talked to one handicapped sportsman who hunts with a crossbow but doesn't want anyone else to be able to. One guy said that archery hunters will be in their stands and have "10 or 12 guys with crossbows" driving by. I haven't seen 10 to 12 hunters in the woods together in any season since they killed all the deer off. If they are driving deer carrying a crossbow they aren't likely to kill any, but a guy like me set up in a tree might see more with them moving the deer around. No magnification sights are allowed, but apparently they are still deadly as a rifle at 50 yards. I bet half the people hunting in PA couldn't hit a deer target at 50 yards with their rifle if they pulled the scope off and shot iron sights. 

This is just stupid. It's legal, get over it. Of course if I was in print media I would probably take every chance I got to stir something up and sell some papers too.

CHAZ


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## aceoky (Mar 17, 2006)

> Pennsylvania and Michigan have more bowhunters than many of your states have total hunters combined.



Really?

HOW many bow hunters does Ohio have and how many does PA now have? (it's a trick question BTW) :darkbeer:


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## aceoky (Mar 17, 2006)

> I feel the problem is not the crossbows themselves -its just another choice of weapon to use ---- my feeling on it is the fact that *it opens the door for anyone who normally would not be in the woods at that time*,,,,


Fair enough........

WHY is that a "bad thing" in your opinion????

In case you aren't aware PA is also losing hunter numbers, at the rate of for every 100 leaving, only 60 are joining.....

WHAT do you "think" will happen IF that trend continues (or worsens even more?) to the FUTURE of hunting in PA and archery hunting in particular??


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## aceoky (Mar 17, 2006)

Cold Weather said:


> Good news! I am sure a lot of verticle bowhunters will now have the option of using an xbow as well.
> 
> I enjoy all archery-all bowhunting-from stickbows-compounds-and xbows. It opens the door for women who can't pull a compound bow-or children.
> 
> ...


Exactly!


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## FDR (Dec 8, 2008)

PA is losing hunters because the overall population is leaving for better job opportunities in other states. Plain and simple, don't treat it as some other anomaly.

Hunters here opposed the crossbow inclusion at a rate of 9:1. That is 900,000 hunters didn't want crossbows, but 100,000 did. Of course, that is going on the 1 million hunters we have which may be more or less. In reality, not many knew of what what on the table because they only hunt the 3-day rifle season. But crossbows were legalized anyway.

There will be NO jump in hunter registration in PA, only transplants from other seasons that think it will be easier from rifle to crossbow. 

Aceoky, you are a typical out of state wannabe who will never hunt here and will never understand the crush of 1 million hunters. I applaud your fervor for crossbows, but you have no idea how many hunters are here. Your from KY right?

How many hunters are there compared to how many hunters are here in PA per square mile?

People like you who don't EVEN HUNT WITH A CROSSBOW RUIN OTHER STATES HUNTING RIGHTS!!!!!!!!

Correct me if I'm wrong, you don't hunt with a crossbow but you advise other states to do so?

Weren't you instrumental in getting NJ to introduce crossbows? And aren't you targeting Michigan as your next trophy?


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## Cold Weather (Dec 17, 2008)

> hunters here opposed the crossbow inclusion at a rate of 9:1. That is 900,000 hunters didn't want crossbows, but 100,000 did. Of course, that is going on the 1 million hunters we have which may be more or less. In reality, not many knew of what what on the table because they only hunt the 3-day rifle season. But crossbows were legalized anyway.


I wonder how you know that...

doesn't matter though...the archery season belongs to the state and the state is free to make changes.

it just isn't a big deal-shouldn't be any deal. Just grab your bow-whatever bow you prefer-stop worrying about the next guy-and have fun in the woods.

this is such an immature argument-really it is...

Cold Weather


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## BigBirdVA (Nov 5, 2002)

Well then why do they worry about droves of hunters buying xbows and hitting the woods? Using their version of math if they see 100 bow hunters all season only 10 will have an xbow. They always want the numbers to go both ways. There will be too many xbow hunters but no one wants them. Too funny.


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## aceoky (Mar 17, 2006)

> Aceoky, you are a typical out of state wannabe


You are a funny person for sure!

HOW many "out of state ANTI HUNTERS and ARA " had an instrumental role in NJ losing a bear hunt? MI losing dove hunting?

But it would seem that ALL "You" seem to see is out of state HUNTERS trying to fight FOR HUNTER'S Rights (and not against them ) as you're enemy?

Then as IF that were not "enough" , you then go on about "trophy states" etc. 

Some folks are so wrapped up in ancient ideals , they refuse to see the forest for the tress......

I'm NO "wannabe" anything that is certain FWIW...

I won't even touch on (for now anyway) all your other "assumptions" (with no data to back up anything stated as fact) .....I seriously doubt however than anyone has asked one million PA hunters anything lately, much less that 90% agreed on one topic.....



> it just isn't a big deal-shouldn't be any deal. Just grab your bow-whatever bow you prefer-stop worrying about the next guy-and have fun in the woods.


What they said ^


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## FDR (Dec 8, 2008)

First Aceoky, I am in total agreement that we hunters should stick together. That doesn't mean we all will agree all the time. Nothing in this world we will all agree on.

Second, I never said ONE WORD about a trophy state nor did I imply making any state into one. You said that and I have no idea how you twisted that into a point. PA and KY will never be trophy states and I think you'll agree on that one.

Third, you never answered any question I put forth. You have been integral in a few states crossbow inclusion yet you have never hunted there nor plan to. You have never hunted with a crossbow. You will never come to a state game land in PA and hunt alongside your "fellow hunters" but you choose to go on multiple message boards in different states to push for crossbow rights. You don't have a clue as to how many hunters there are in these areas or the deer population to support hunting(regardless of the season i.e. rifle, muzzleloader, etc).

Now, if you can answer the questions I put forth about your involvement in other states without putting words into my mouth......


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## FDR (Dec 8, 2008)

BigBirdVA said:


> Well then why do they worry about droves of hunters buying xbows and hitting the woods? Using their version of math if they see 100 bow hunters all season only 10 will have an xbow. They always want the numbers to go both ways. There will be too many xbow hunters but no one wants them. Too funny.


Well BigBird, I hunt in an area that has been legal to use crossbows in any season for 7 years. I guess that shows how much you know about PA laws. Anyway, I have seen 50-50 in terms of crossbows vs what you deem the same. The crossbow hunters are not the same fellows. That is not what the rest of the state might see, maybe more or less, but what do you care. I'm sorry, I hunt around Pittsburgh, so maybe it is just a regional thing, but I don't think so. This isn't Va or Ky but you guys want to make it out as if it is rural area where I hunt as the same in those states you live in and hunt. It isn't. Anyone who lives around the city I do would know what I'm talking about, but I'm talking to a bunch of hicks who think they know what's good for anyone, anywhere in the country without facts. 

I wonder if I am arguing with crossbow reps?:wink:


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## akacornelius (Jan 14, 2009)

FDR, I am trying to understand your basis in the arguement. It is a big topic im MI right now and need some opinion from both sides to make up my mind on the situation. Thanks


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## deerhunter11 (Aug 19, 2006)

*ha*

ive hunted with a long bow or compound all my life well20yrs of it and love it with all my heart and sole,in 07 i broke my neck and doc said sell them all.
now when you love hunting like i do thats devistating,so i got a cross bow,and i still get to enjoy my pation,but for the folks who think a crossbow is so easy you might want to give it a werl,i still only have 35-40 max comfert level and still shoot a arrow and this thing is 10 times as loud and i still practise every day,plus its around 8 pounds, my last mathews wayed 3.5 pounds.but i thank god for this bad boy because i still get to deer hunt.just my thoughts on the deal.enjoy hunting and its all good.


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## BigBirdVA (Nov 5, 2002)

FDR said:


> I wonder if I am arguing with crossbow reps?:wink:


Maybe I might qualify as one. I've got 2 free hats and a t-shirt from xbow reps. Dang I'm easy!


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