# Excessive wear / bear weather rest



## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

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## George D. Stout (May 11, 2005)

Yes....your arrows are much too stiff for your setup, so they drag along the rest since they don't have the softer spine to bend around it. a 2016 at 31" would be a better choice for proper dynamic spine with a 125 to 145 grain head. If you want to use 200 grain heads, then a 2114 would be a better choice. Rest wear is nearly always an issue of stiff spine. I've been doing this a long time..near 50 years..and have encountered that issue myself in the 1970's. For some reason nowadays, folks are getting arrows better suited to sixty pound bows and trying to use them on forty pounders.


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## Bender (Dec 6, 2006)

Whut George sed!

And of course the reason why we see this more often is probably due to so very, very, few archery shops knowing how to set up a new recurve/longbow shooter.

You know what would be interesting would be to see some sort arrow selection guide or chart that predates the invention of the compound bow.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

thanks for the reply, I have 33" 2020's now and with 100 gr points they are are acting too week.

Going to bow shop now to check poundage of my recurve and paper tune.


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## Jim Casto Jr (Aug 20, 2002)

What George said X3. 

Good luck with paper tuning. I never could pull it off.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

I just wanted to see if the 2020's are flying straight, they flew through the paper pretty good, a little weak... might try some sub 100gr tips

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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

deezdrama said:


> Ive setup my recurve (cartel triple riser with journey limbs) with a bear weather rest. Its 40# at 28" , im a 30" draw and been shooting 2117 and 2020 aluminum arrows, the 2117's are 30" with 200gr points, the 2020 legacy's are 33" with 100gr points.
> 
> I shot the 2117's for the most part for the past few weeks untill my legacy arrows came.... ive noticed the "plunger" tab part of the weather rest is wore down to nothing and a deep groove is wore into the base of the weather rest. I installed it without the extra foam shim and it is pretty much centered with the arrow tip being slightly left of center of the string.
> 
> ...


My guess way to stiff... :grin:


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## MacIndust (Feb 7, 2012)

I epoxy a broken toothpick as the strike plat on my weather rests as well. Holds up a little better and won't wear down thus changing the tune.


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## George D. Stout (May 11, 2005)

That 2020 is no way too weak....you are getting a false reading friend. Forty pound recurves, even at 30'' draw will never shoot 2020's well. Even a 2018 is probably too stiff. It would help to listen to those of us who have done this for near half a century. Just sayin.


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## Bender (Dec 6, 2006)

Again whut George sed. 

Do you happen to get any sort of clank, clunk, clink, whack, thwack, etc sort of sound upon release? If so it's most likely the nock end of the arrow whacking the riser. This drives the arrow sideways, resulting in a false weak indication.


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## northern boy (Aug 25, 2010)

a 600 spine should work well for you. try bare shaft test easy to do a works well strip feather off an arrow an test it against one with feather for a right handed shooter if the bare shaft hits right of feathered arrow arrows are weak less point weight or shorter arrow. if to the left of feathered arrow means stiff more point weight do the test many times about 20 yd,s is good then you can fine tune at longer diastance.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

The riser I have is known to make a noise because of the vibrations made by the loose grip, I dont notice any noise besides this, shooting the 33" 2020's from my same poundage sage -I dont notice any clank.... not to say the 2020's arent too stiff but according to the spine calculators they should be good (I know... calculators arent the holly grail) 

It just seems like when you get longer than 32" the spine is significantly weakened.

Its hard to find a set of aluminums at 32+... most are uncut at 31 or a bit more.

I'll keep testing if you guys think 2020's at 33" w 100gr upfront are too stiff.

I guess a bareshaft paper tune test is in order?

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## Jim Casto Jr (Aug 20, 2002)

Bare shaft group tuning might be a better option. I don't trust paper for finger shooting.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

Do you think the 2117's will be good to shoot from my 60# compound? Im using 55-70# allen carbons right now

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## longbowguy (Nov 14, 2004)

Yes, I think the 2117s will work from your compound. And I think the 2020s will tune to your recurve.

For the recurve, understand that this is confusing are hard to calculate. There are many, many variables and shooting long arrows out of a middle weight bow with a long draw is something most of us have limited experience with. I have some and I have some 2020s tuned to shoot well out of my 42 pound longbow, but my draw length is a bit shorter than yours and may arrows are cut shorter. I agree that paper tuning is often misleading with stickbows off the shelf. So is bareshafting unless you are very close to good tune. Getting your bow weighed at your draw length is not likely to help much either. 

First, I would go to the archery shop and get several different weights of field points to fit 2020- 125, 145, 160, even more if they have them, and a simple plastic armguard. I would collect all my different tabs and gloves. And I would replace that worn WeatherRest with a new one or else glue on a little piece of leather to build it back to original thickness and stay there- that is what I have done with mine. Then I would shoot outdoors with the sun low at my back at around 15 to 20 yards. By focusing my eyes a bit short of the target I can get to where I can see the arrow wigwagging and spinning through the air quite clearly. Then I would switch point weights and tabs until I got the best flight. 

I don't think those shafts will prove to be too low in spine, but if they are you could take an inch off to stiffen them. I believe your long draw will be enough to shoot those shafts properly, and I believe that with an armguard and more upright posture you could get another inch or more. 

Kindly let us know how it goes. - lbg


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

Heres a screenshot of dynamic spine calculator.... I know its not 100% accurate but just hoping it confirms I can tune these shafts to work.

2 of my recurves (samick journey, and a carsage) are 40# at 28".... both of these recurves measure 46-47# at 30" draw, my draw is a hair over 30" so I just entered 46# @ 30" in the calculator, results are the same if I just enter 40# at 28 and my draw of 30"

I wasnt sure of insert and knock weight so guessed but think its close.

The dynamic spine number is pretty close.

Ive shot a recurve for a few years but "just shot" em, im just now at a point where I can get a decent group at 20 yards and have my form down decent.

This is my first time really trying to tune my arrows to my bows and all the help is appreciated.

I have a tuning set of different weight points coming and hope I can get these arrows set right.

They seem to fly good but get groups that are less than spectacular while I feel my form and release are consistant.
I get mostly point to the right/fletching to the left from 20 yards but everyone says these 2020 shafts cant be too weak so I dont know.









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## WillAdams (Jun 6, 2009)

Not familiar w/that screen appearance...where/how'd you get it?

I usually use: http://www.heilakka.com/stumiller/

I'd letthe program calculate actual draw weight from the specs...


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

WillAdams said:


> Not familiar w/that screen appearance...where/how'd you get it?
> 
> I usually use: http://www.heilakka.com/stumiller/
> 
> I'd letthe program calculate actual draw weight from the specs...


Its the 3rivers calculator on their site.
Heres with factory length set









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## WillAdams (Jun 6, 2009)

Uses the same calculations / data and they attributed it to Stu Miller --- very cool.

All they need to do is integrate it into their inventory and interactive dynamic arrow builder.


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## MacIndust (Feb 7, 2012)

What type bow scale are you using? My 45# limbs (Sage) only stack up to 49# and i am drawing 30".... Your Journey limbs shouldn't be stacking at a higher rate than mine.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

Whatever digital scale they had at the bowshop, my journey came to 46 and sage to 47

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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

Built up the strikeplate area that was worn with velcro, shooting 10 to 20 yards, its always point-right and fletching-left with these 33" 2020's w 100gr upfront.... I know the experiences here says this shaft should be stiff but doesnt this arrow behavior dictate weak arrow spine?


















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## Destroyer (Sep 11, 2009)

deezdrama said:


> Any idea what this excessive wear is from?











Mine after a few weeks shooting carbons with a slick surface. With alloys (increased friction) the wear is worse. Could be spine making yours worse too but the weather rest isn't the best as far as wear resistance is concerned.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

Yeah, thats not too far off from what mine looked like...

I did probably shoot a few hundred or more arrows off mine, im sure the 2117's didnt help, even with 200gr upfront but they seemed to shoot decent.

These 33" 2020's seem to fly decent and dont hear them hitting the riser or anything but they always impact like in the pic , ill have my arrow tune point kit soon so can throw some sub 100gr on there and see if things get better, if not I have some 125gr and higher but I tried 125 and it didnt improve

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## MacIndust (Feb 7, 2012)

Here is what I started doing.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

Good idea, ill try a matchstick behind velcro next

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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

MacIndust said:


> View attachment 1773311
> 
> Here is what I started doing.


I tried the riser without the grip and like the position it puts my grip in but dont like the feel, do you get used to no grip?

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## MacIndust (Feb 7, 2012)

I went back and forth with it. I like my wrist a little lower so i just stuck without it


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## MacIndust (Feb 7, 2012)

Be care with riser+Velcro. It will push out past the flipper.


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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

Nah, had a pretty deep groove, shot a few dozen rounds with the single velcro strip, its compressed pretty good. I think a half shaved off matchstick or similar width of a sliver of hardwood under the soft velcro may do the trick

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## deezdrama (Aug 19, 2013)

But back to my arrow patterns.... would u guys agree its showing weak spine? 










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## WillAdams (Jun 6, 2009)

deezdrama said:


> Nah, had a pretty deep groove, shot a few dozen rounds with the single velcro strip, its compressed pretty good. I think a half shaved off matchstick or similar width of a sliver of hardwood under the soft velcro may do the trick


I've been using a broken off toothpick beneath my Bear Weather Rest, but have been debating switching to a feather rest.


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## MacIndust (Feb 7, 2012)

I love the look of a feather rest.


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## Jim Casto Jr (Aug 20, 2002)

deezdrama said:


> But back to my arrow patterns.... would u guys agree its showing weak spine?



I can't tell for sure by the picture, but if you're aiming at the center of the bag, it would indicate to me that you're either shooting left, or your arrows are too stiff, or both. The quickest and easiest way to find out IMO, is the remove the feathers from a couple arrows and see where they group in relationship to your fletched ones.


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