# scores are up for alabama



## 06bowtech (Mar 9, 2008)

ibo website has scores posted for alabama! great job ibo, now if we can do something bout spm/mbo shooting hunter class that wood be great!


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## 06bowtech (Mar 9, 2008)

would. lol


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## 06bowtech (Mar 9, 2008)

ttt


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## jwolfe78 (Mar 10, 2006)

06bowtech said:


> ibo website has scores posted for alabama! great job ibo, now if we can do something bout spm/mbo shooting hunter class that wood be great!


What do you mean by that???


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## 1tex3d (Jun 13, 2002)

jwolfe78 said:


> What do you mean by that???


I think he is referencing the fact that Travis Lunsford, whom has shot Semi-Pro and K50 at ASA Pro/Ams very successfully shot in the Hunter Class and won. Not the Advanced Hunter Class but the regular "Hunter" class which is intended for less experienced archers. 

No rule that says he can't do that I don't think, but IBO is usually very proactive on eliminating "Sandbagging" from their shoots. It should be interesting how this all plays out


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## jjf41380 (Mar 26, 2005)

I beleive the IBO ruling on dropping down from one class to another states that a shooter can not drop more then one class at a time. Meaning that someone who shot semi pro could only drop down to MBO unless he took an entire year off between dropping more than one shooting class.


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## jjf41380 (Mar 26, 2005)

I just looked up the name mentioned above and he hasnt done anything against IBO rules. He didnt shoot any IBO National shoots in 2010


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## 1tex3d (Jun 13, 2002)

jjf41380 said:


> I just looked up the name mentioned above and he hasnt done anything against IBO rules. He didn't shoot any IBO National shoots in 2010


I agree, I don't believe that it is illegal for him to shoot HC, but as in life there is a difference between illegal and immoral. I'm personally on the fence about HC being a move-out class. I think that it would easily be the biggest class in the IBO, especially if they consolidated AHC and HC back into one class.


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## 200racing (Aug 30, 2009)

this was my first 3d event
i thought hunter class would be....hunters shooting their hunting bows. one guy i shot with shot a z7 he had killed deer with,but another group i was in was all long ata anodized target bows with target sights, rest and stabilizers. did not look like anything that you would carry hunting imo. 
it was alot of fun and hope the shoot is held here again next year.


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## 1tex3d (Jun 13, 2002)

200racing said:


> this was my first 3d event
> i thought hunter class would be....hunters shooting their hunting bows. one guy i shot with shot a z7 he had killed deer with,but another group i was in was all long ata anodized target bows with target sights, rest and stabilizers. did not look like anything that you would carry hunting imo.
> it was alot of fun and hope the shoot is held here again next year.


 Glad to hear that you had a good time. 
To me the best way to think of "Hunters" class is this. The class should not solely be based on the type or especially color of the equipment used, but more about the style of shooting that is being done. Everyone shooting in the HC, is in fact practicing and more than likely improving their ability to shoot bows setup with multiple fixed pins, and shorter hunting-type stabilizers. I bet you learned alot about having to shoot odd yardages with your pins, and the challenge of being able to accurately hold your pins on and off of your desired shot placement. I hope you continue to shoot 3-d tournaments this spring/summer, come this fall you will feel more prepared to execute better shots under a wide variety of different terrain,weather, shooting conditions and distances than you ever have.


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## CowboyJunkie (Oct 9, 2008)

jjf41380 said:


> I just looked up the name mentioned above and he hasnt done anything against IBO rules. He didnt shoot any IBO National shoots in 2010



Your right he did not shoot any IBO in 2010 however he DID shoot K45/K50 in ASA last year which is FAR from a Hunter Class shooters skill level. If I shot Open Pro is ASA I would be forced to shoot PMR


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

I sure think if you shot semi pro you need to at least shoot advanced hunter. There needs to be an advanced and hunter class. Pretty easy to figure out why!
DB


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## gatorhunter (Mar 14, 2008)

How is this a problem? It seems to me that Travis shot his hunter set up and there are no rules stating that he couldn't compete in this class.........Travis only won a trophy so why are people making this an issue??????? Maybe some of us enjoy shooting our hunter set up and if you recall this is the place where we can achieve this. No money was taken out of anyones pocket it was a trophy for gods sake........Shooting this hunter set up is fun, but it seems that some of the shooters have forgotten about the fun and its all about the bad mouthing,trash talking and whos who............


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## 1tex3d (Jun 13, 2002)

gatorhunter said:


> How is this a problem? It seems to me that Travis shot his hunter set up and there are no rules stating that he couldn't compete in this class.........Travis only won a trophy so why are people making this an issue??????? Maybe some of us enjoy shooting our hunter set up and if you recall this is the place where we can achieve this. No money was taken out of anyones pocket it was a trophy for gods sake........Shooting this hunter set up is fun, but it seems that some of the shooters have forgotten about the fun and its all about the bad mouthing,trash talking and whos who............


I agree with you, I also think everyone has forgotten that this is supposed to be both competitive and fun. I think back to when I started shooting along time ago,and shooting was all about fun. 

I think the issue is that some of the Hunter class guys feel a little bit cheated. I honestly could care less about winning a trophy, but it used to make me feel like a million bucks back in the day. I'm sure you have a stack of trophies in a box somewhere too. I can see this from both sides, and honestly I don't have a dog in this hunt. I wasn't there and I don't shoot in the HC. I have been shooting long enough, as have you and Travis to know that something like this is only going to stir the pot. We don't need to discourage newer archers from wanting to travel to venues like the STC, because they know that there is virtually no chance for them to win, even a trophy.

Could you imagine if Levi or any of the top Pro's showed up in Monroe and said they were going to shoot Open B because it was less stressful and more fun! Same difference here I think. 

It's supposed to be fun, and it's supposed to be a game. I think it has become more of a "competitive sport" to many people, myself included. If it was just for fun, I think everyone would stay at home and shoot club tournaments. They are usually the most laid back and fun anyways.

I think what is done is done. There is no rule that says Travis or anyone for that matter can't shoot HC. I hope everyone can let this one go, and get back to shooting and having fun!
Danny Gomez


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## 3Dobsessed (Jun 11, 2004)

he only won by 2 points!... bahahaha!...what about the other 2 or 3 that drove for hours from up north to sandbag...Travis you suck!!...obviously you're not as good as they're making you out to be!!...HEHEHEHEHE


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## 1tex3d (Jun 13, 2002)

3Dobsessed said:


> he only won by 2 points!... bahahaha!...what about the other 2 or 3 that drove for hours from up north to sandbag...Travis you suck!!...obviously you're not as good as they're making you out to be!!...HEHEHEHEHE


Ouch... Wait til the National Triple Crown comes around. I'm interested in seeing how many people jump at the chance to win that big money that Elite Archery is paying out in the HC at those 3 shoots and IBO world. I think its a cool grand for 1st. I might even need to get an Elite before those come around:dancing:


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## Devine Shot (Mar 17, 2008)

gatorhunter said:


> How is this a problem? It seems to me that Travis shot his hunter set up and there are no rules stating that he couldn't compete in this class.........Travis only won a trophy so why are people making this an issue??????? Maybe some of us enjoy shooting our hunter set up and if you recall this is the place where we can achieve this. No money was taken out of anyones pocket it was a trophy for gods sake........Shooting this hunter set up is fun, but it seems that some of the shooters have forgotten about the fun and its all about the bad mouthing,trash talking and whos who............


If he is shooting for fun go to a fun shoot. Not a national competition.


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## CowboyJunkie (Oct 9, 2008)

Devine Shot said:


> If he is shooting for fun go to a fun shoot. Not a national competition.


This is my thought exactly. I know of a few people who planned on shooting ALL the STC shoots and the National Triple Crown shoots but now have said they are not going to because they are NOT going to COMPETE against a Former Pro/Semi-Pro archer. They now feel they have wasted their past weekends entry fee's and personally, I dont blame them for feeling this way as well as cheated.


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## nkybuck (Feb 16, 2009)

I haven't shot a TC shoot in six years this was my first one in a long time. I came in fourth and could have shot better I plan on going to the others as well no matter who is in the class.


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## Floridaboy (Dec 8, 2003)

Seems like if the IBO was worried about "Sandbaggers" they would look on the ASA website and see 
"who shoots what". The club I shoot at around here pretty much keeps track of what class you've been shooting' If I shoot Open A or Semi Pro at ASA and show up here and want to shoot Open B or Hunter the lady who runs the shoot is going to say "ARE YOU KIDDING ME".....and not let me play. IBO in the south for some reason just does not draw much of a crowd......they make the rules....he played buy their rules and paid the money they required and won a $2.00 trophy. I don't think that win will make or break his archery career. If he was dealing death and beating Dave Cousins....then that might be a different story.....but the underlying truth is he played by IBO RULES.


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

practice more, complain less


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## 3Dobsessed (Jun 11, 2004)

Floridaboy said:


> Seems like if the IBO was worried about "Sandbaggers" they would look on the ASA website and see
> "who shoots what". The club I shoot at around here pretty much keeps track of what class you've been shooting' If I shoot Open A or Semi Pro at ASA and show up here and want to shoot Open B or Hunter the lady who runs the shoot is going to say "ARE YOU KIDDING ME".....and not let me play. IBO in the south for some reason just does not draw much of a crowd......they make the rules....he played buy their rules and paid the money they required and won a $2.00 trophy. I don't think that win will make or break his archery career. If he was dealing death and beating Dave Cousins....then that might be a different story.....but the underlying truth is he played by IBO RULES.


I was there when he called and ask them if he could shoot the hunter class and they said "yes" as long as his equipment matched the class..k50 is not a pro class ..but Dave Cousins is shooting it!


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## 1tex3d (Jun 13, 2002)

3Dobsessed said:


> I was there when he called and ask them if he could shoot the hunter class and they said "yes" as long as his equipment matched the class..k50 is not a pro class ..but Dave Cousins is shooting it!


Stacy,
If that was done, then to me this is a pointless discussion. I think this topic has gotten enough attention, and hopefully we can just put this one to rest already. I hope that Travis continues to shoot great the rest of the STC, and hopefully he will go to the NTC and do well there too. 

Good luck to all of you guys!
Danny Gomez


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## Stillfingers (May 6, 2008)

I really don't care what class he wants to shoot in, rules are rules and meant to be followed. If I have to adhere to them, so should all. They weren't hard for me to find, so anyone else can find them to. Copied straight from their websites.

At the 2011 Florida ProAm, Travis Lunsford registered in and competed in the Professional – Known 50 class and finished in 11 place.

*ASA RULES
CLASSES:*
A.	*PROFESSIONAL* - Open Pros may roll back to Semi-Pro if they earned less than $500.00 in the previous two years. Competitors in all other Pro Classes that have not won any prize money in their most recent year of competition may request to be considered for the highest amateur class available for their equipment setup subject to the submission and approval of a written request to the Competition Committee. Competing in any Pro Class requires the payment of an annual ASA Pro Certification. 
1. Open Pro - No restrictions on age or sex. 50 yards, 280 FPS 
2. Women’s Open Pro – Open to female competitors only. 50 yards, 280 FPS
3. Senior Open Pro* - Age 50* and over, no restriction on sex. 50 yards, 280 FPS
4. Semi-Pro -	No restrictions on age or sex. 50 yards, 280 FPS
Anyone who competed in the Semi-Pro class in their most recent year of ASA Pro/Am competition, had at least two top-ten finishes, and earned over $2,000.00 in ASA Pro/Am earnings must compete in Open Pro. Anyone that won over $200.00 in Semi-Pro in their most recent year of ASA Pro/Am competition, competed in a Pro Class within the last two years, has career earnings over $5,000.00, receives sponsor support over $2,000.00 per year in products, equipment, services or cash, or had two top ten finishes and more than $600.00 in ASA Pro/Am earnings in Open A in their most recent year of ASA Pro/Am competition is required to shoot in Semi-Pro or Pro. ASA membership is required, Pro Certification optional. 
5. Known 50 Open – No restrictions on age or sex. Known distance only. 50 yards, 280 FPS

*IBO RULES
SECTION 1: ELIGIBILITY AND QUALIFICATIONS TO SHOOT AND AWARDS

C. Pro And Semi-Pro Classes*

1.	An archer who registers for a Pro or Semi-Pro class during any one IBO shooting year must remain in that class for the entire duration of that IBO tournament year except that an archer may move up to Semi-Pro, or a Semi-Pro archer may move up to a Pro class. Archers who move from Semi-Pro to Pro during the IBO shooting year may not drop back down to compete as an amateur or Semi-Pro at an IBO-sanctioned event for the remainder of that IBO tournament year.

2.	An archer who registers as a pro or semi-pro in another 3-D shooting organization must register to compete at the same or higher level at IBO-santioned events.

3.	A Pro or Semi-Pro archer must be an IBO member to participate in any IBO-sanctioned event.

*Evidently somebody screwed up.*


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## keb73 (Oct 15, 2003)

ASA K50 is NOT a pro class...


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## Stillfingers (May 6, 2008)

Then why is it listed under Professional and not Amateur?


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## keb73 (Oct 15, 2003)

Not sure..just know that it's not a pro class..Believe me,a certain bow manufacturer has said they will pull their sponsorship if ASA makes it a pro class..But that's a different subject..

Anyways no rules were broken but I do find it funny that he shot HC and not AHC.The guy is a good shot so what's 5 more yards?..


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## Green Monster (Nov 26, 2010)

I finished 29th with my 381 and that was mid pack for first shoot I was proud of that finish, but look out Travis cause im not giving up. Im gunning for you haha


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## Stillfingers (May 6, 2008)

If it's not a Pro class, then I'm mistaken in my post. I posted based on both organizations rules straight from their websites.

Ronnie, that's a great attitude! Keep it up!


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## Green Monster (Nov 26, 2010)

Thanks, 
I feel the only way to get better is to challenge yourself. Now I'm not going to just straight to the top but thats where I hope I'm headed.


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## Green Monster (Nov 26, 2010)

Does anybody know if Travis has a user name on AT? I would like to shoot with him in Milton. I think that would be a fun day. "He" might even pick up a thing or to. HaHa


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## Green Monster (Nov 26, 2010)

ttt


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## 3Dobsessed (Jun 11, 2004)

bowtech3d,cuss him out!!


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## 3Dobsessed (Jun 11, 2004)

why is there not anyone whining about these guys that have shot higher classes?
2nd place-steve isenhart-hc 4 years
4th place- warren jones -MBR
7th place-arron kilburn -semi pro
9th place-will nesbitt-advanced hunter & mbr
17th place-james wright-mbo & semi pro


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## Green Monster (Nov 26, 2010)

ttt


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

Why are you bumping this to the top?


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## Green Monster (Nov 26, 2010)

i like watching them whine:darkbeer:


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## Hopperton (Oct 30, 2005)

3Dobsessed said:


> why is there not anyone whining about these guys that have shot higher classes?
> 2nd place-steve isenhart-hc 4 years
> 4th place- warren jones -MBR
> 7th place-arron kilburn -semi pro
> ...


seems maybe they cant win in those classes so they drop down to where they have a chance rather than getting better. Shame on them. They have to live with it.

I have come to the conclusion that I MUST go out there to have fun I can only shoot to the best of my ability and let the cards fall where they may. If I have to shoop against sand baggers there is nothing I can do about it because the IBO is never going to change.


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## Hopperton (Oct 30, 2005)

Stillfingers said:


> I really don't care what class he wants to shoot in, rules are rules and meant to be followed. If I have to adhere to them, so should all. They weren't hard for me to find, so anyone else can find them to. Copied straight from their websites.
> 
> At the 2011 Florida ProAm, Travis Lunsford registered in and competed in the Professional – Known 50 class and finished in 11 place.
> 
> ...


Looks cut and dry, right there in Black and Red.


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

Green Monster said:


> i like watching them whine:darkbeer:


 I think you can come up with something better to do...maybe practice?


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## gjstudt (Nov 14, 2005)

Hopperton said:


> Looks cut and dry, right there in Black and Red.


I have a question. So in ASA known 50... Is that a pro or semi pro class?

If not then how can people who have won $$$, or get $$$ support from archery manufactures compete in that class?

If it is a PRO class then you would have to shoot PRO in IBO.... 

Is that right? Please explain.


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## goofy2788 (Aug 14, 2005)

gjstudt said:


> I have a question. So in ASA known 50... Is that a pro or semi pro class?
> 
> If not then how can people who have won $$$, or get $$$ support from archery manufactures compete in that class?
> 
> ...




Excellant Question Gary, I'd like to know the answer as well. Who here is an ASA expert that might be able to explain this? I've never shot ASA myself and have no clue as to how their organization is run.


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## keb73 (Oct 15, 2003)

gjstudt said:


> I have a question. So in ASA known 50... Is that a pro or semi pro class?
> 
> If not then how can people who have won $$$, or get $$$ support from archery manufactures compete in that class?
> 
> ...


I hear what you're saying..But the K50 is still considered by ASA an amateur class.Yes folks that have won money in pro or semi can jump over and shot K50..But here is the kicker..The big contingency checks from major bow manufactures are not paid for a win or placement..So money from a win or placement is paid out like all the other classes in ASA that pay..by percentage of entry fees in that class.

The only true pro classes in ASA are Open Pro,Womens Open Pro.and Senior Pro..Contingency checks are paid in these classes as well as ASA money..


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## nickel shooter5 (Dec 26, 2009)

Who cares what he shot. I didn't hear this last year when a Guy went the whole NTC without shooting an eight. Someone new comes in and wins and people cry like 4 year olds. Just shoot!!!!


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## goofy2788 (Aug 14, 2005)

nickel shooter5 said:


> Who cares what he shot. I didn't hear this last year when a Guy went the whole NTC without shooting an eight. Someone new comes in and wins and people cry like 4 year olds. Just shoot!!!!


You didn't hear any of the whining....I heard a ton of it, then again it's the same stuff you hear every year associated with Hunter class. I still say if the IBO wants to end the sandbagging simply change the name to Beginner Hunter Class.


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## Hopperton (Oct 30, 2005)

goofy2788 said:


> I still say if the IBO wants to end the sandbagging simply change the name to Beginner Hunter Class.


How will this end anything unless there are regulations as to who is allowed to shoot it. Lets call it PEE WEE class does that mean it will end whining, no not unless there are stipulations.


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## goofy2788 (Aug 14, 2005)

Hopperton said:


> How will this end anything unless there are regulations as to who is allowed to shoot it. Lets call it PEE WEE class does that mean it will end whining, no not unless there are stipulations.


It takes the glory out of winning the "toughest" class in the IBO. To give a little background I've never shoot hunter class....my first year ever competeting in the IBO I shot MBO. I did this after only shooting 3 prior 3d shoots....needless to say I stunk up the course and realized that I had no clue how to judge yardage. So the next year I dropped down and shot advanced hunter. As it stands I'm staying there until I get better at both my form and yardage judgement. I shot with a ton of guys who are in the hunter class...5 of which drove from Ohio down to Alabama to shoot this shoot. The one thing I've heard from them over the course of the last 3 years is that hunter class is the hardest class there is, it's the toughest to win, the best shooters....blah, blah, blah....In otherwords they all feel that if they win hunter class then it's the next best thing to winning the pro class. In my eyes this is why we see the "sandbagging", "whining", and constant "controversy" pertaining to this class.

So based on that it's my opinion that if you change the name to beginner and take away the perception that winning hunter class means you're winning the hardest, toughest class out there you would see a decrease in the amount of guys that drop down to shoot in that class. As someone else stated why if you've already shot semi-pro, mbo, open A, etc. not drop down to the advanced hunter class...it's the same equipment as hunter and only 5 yards further in distance. Also it's the first listed Ametuer class in the IBO rule book. I know a big argument is that guys don't want to pay the extra cash but even that isn't valid since the IBO changed it to you can either pay to shoot and not shoot for a cash prize or you can put in the extra 15 bucks and shoot for money.


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## Stillfingers (May 6, 2008)

*Sorry Guys, I know this subject is like beatin a dead horse, but I just had to stick in another opinion (I know, everyone has one)…my earlier post was only from the respective organization’s rules.*

I agree Goofy! Either eliminate the Hunter Class (HC) or give it a two or three year participation limit as Beginner Hunter Class (BHC, 35 yds) with the current Hunter Class move up requirements also, and then have the Advanced Hunter Class (AHC, 40 yds) with the current Hunter Class move up requirements, and then Male Bowhunter Release (MBR, 45 yds) and the Male Bowhunter Open (MBO, 50 yds). I remember when all mens compound classes were 50 yds. But then attendance started suckin and they came out with the Hunter class for release and finger shooters and the migration was on! I had to suck it up in fingers class and shoot HF if I wanted any competition around here (not sayin I was better, just the only one in the MBF class). Then after a few years layoff due to some health and marriage problems, I came back to HF to get started again and just got lazy. Then IBO cuts HF yardage to kids stakes (30 yds) and I couln't take it anymore. MBF is where I started and where I should have stayed and will stay until the class goes away (which might not be too far down the road).

Light me up however you want, now that I’ve said my piece, I’m done with this subject.


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## Hopperton (Oct 30, 2005)

goofy2788 said:


> It takes the glory out of winning the "toughest" class in the IBO. To give a little background I've never shoot hunter class....my first year ever competeting in the IBO I shot MBO. I did this after only shooting 3 prior 3d shoots....needless to say I stunk up the course and realized that I had no clue how to judge yardage. So the next year I dropped down and shot advanced hunter. As it stands I'm staying there until I get better at both my form and yardage judgement. I shot with a ton of guys who are in the hunter class...5 of which drove from Ohio down to Alabama to shoot this shoot. The one thing I've heard from them over the course of the last 3 years is that hunter class is the hardest class there is, it's the toughest to win, the best shooters....blah, blah, blah....In otherwords they all feel that if they win hunter class then it's the next best thing to winning the pro class. In my eyes this is why we see the "sandbagging", "whining", and constant "controversy" pertaining to this class.
> 
> So based on that it's my opinion that if you change the name to beginner and take away the perception that winning hunter class means you're winning the hardest, toughest class out there you would see a decrease in the amount of guys that drop down to shoot in that class. As someone else stated why if you've already shot semi-pro, mbo, open A, etc. not drop down to the advanced hunter class...it's the same equipment as hunter and only 5 yards further in distance. Also it's the first listed Ametuer class in the IBO rule book. I know a big argument is that guys don't want to pay the extra cash but even that isn't valid since the IBO changed it to you can either pay to shoot and not shoot for a cash prize or you can put in the extra 15 bucks and shoot for money.


Gotcha, I understand your thougght on it. Yes maybe that would work. I dont personally dont think it is the hardest in terms of shooting ability by any means. 

If it is the hardest it is because there are alot more people shooting it so odds are worse, there are alot more people who dont really respect 3D and only shoot it to do something so they dont score properly or fairly.

How could it possibly be the hardest class? Every class above it requires better shooting ability form, consistancy, yardage.


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## FDL (Sep 7, 2008)

Its not the hardest class, its the hardest class to win. Think about it most, shoot a bow over 310fps with 2 pins. There is alot of great shooters in HC. Mix alot of great shooters
and short yardage and you have a very hard class to win. I say shoot it as is, let them fight it out. Why does this start every year. You dont like the HC rules, dont shoot it.
It pays no $. Just my 2cents


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

FDL said:


> Its not the hardest class, its the hardest class to win. Think about it most, shoot a bow over 310fps with 2 pins. There is alot of great shooters in HC. Mix alot of great shooters
> and short yardage and you have a very hard class to win. I say shoot it as is, let them fight it out. Why does this start every year. You dont like the HC rules, dont shoot it.
> It pays no $. Just my 2cents


You mean no money is won in this class? Just a cheap trophy/plaque? Wow, really people.....winning comes from practice, not entitlement.


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## 6rob4 (May 3, 2010)

i cant believe so many people can be so upset about a damn $2.00 trophy.if you dont want to be beat by someone who drops down to win a trophy spends less time crying about it on archery talk and spend more time practicing .the guy that beat you in bama didnt get there crying and he can be beat.and hunter class is not the hardess class i have friends that shoot it and thats the same excuse they use so they dont have to move up .they shoot it because 35 yards fast bows to lazy to practice judging yards and would rather b---h about getting beat by someone who puts time in.


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## FoggDogg (Jul 9, 2002)

When ASA came out w/ the two K classes, it was with the intentions of making K45 for amatuers and K50 for pros. It looks to me as if now, that's what they've done. If it's listed under the Pro category in their rules, seems cut and dry. Just because there's no contingency money offered from manufacturers doesn't mean it's not a Pro class. Just because the ASA is gearing it towards Pro shooters, doesn't mean manufacturers have to offer contingency money. They can choose to or not.

Here's my take on it, take it for what it's worth. This Travis guy chose to shoot his hunter set up. Cool. He should have shot the advanced class. He is obviously an advanced shooter. Anyone who has shot a hunter class for more than a couple years should be shooting an advanced class. ASA has a Bow Novice class. Same deal here. Shoot it to get your feet wet, and move on. Don't want to shoot a more "competitive" class, stay home and shoot a local shoot. People dropping down to win irritate the hell out of me, money or trophy.


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## ROSKO P (Mar 2, 2009)

ttt


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

FoggDogg said:


> When ASA came out w/ the two K classes, it was with the intentions of making K45 for amatuers and K50 for pros. It looks to me as if now, that's what they've done. If it's listed under the Pro category in their rules, seems cut and dry. Just because there's no contingency money offered from manufacturers doesn't mean it's not a Pro class. Just because the ASA is gearing it towards Pro shooters, doesn't mean manufacturers have to offer contingency money. They can choose to or not.
> 
> Here's my take on it, take it for what it's worth. This Travis guy chose to shoot his hunter set up. Cool. He should have shot the advanced class. He is obviously an advanced shooter. Anyone who has shot a hunter class for more than a couple years should be shooting an advanced class. ASA has a Bow Novice class. Same deal here. Shoot it to get your feet wet, and move on. Don't want to shoot a more "competitive" class, stay home and shoot a local shoot. People dropping down to win irritate the hell out of me, money or trophy.


Since paying the Pro Certification is not mandatory in K50 and Semi pro........they are amateur classes. All pro classes are required to pay the pro certification fee.


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## FoggDogg (Jul 9, 2002)

The only class that says "optional" is the semi-pro class accoring to what's printed above, and it's listed under the Pro section.


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## shooter74 (Jul 7, 2005)

*this is to funny*

what you guys are mad because u lost . what a bunch of crying babys. you guys are like i always say shout up and shoot your bow...


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## goofy2788 (Aug 14, 2005)

shooter74 said:


> what you guys are mad because u lost . what a bunch of crying babys. you guys are like i always say shout up and shoot your bow...


I don't think this has anything to do with losing....I think this has more to do with ethics. In my opinion a guy who is a seasoned competitor and drops down to shoot hunter class so he can win a trophy is no better then a guy who shoots his score using a pencil.

How upset would people be if they got beat because someone gave themselves an 11 for every 8 they shot? How upset would they be if they got beat by someone who used a range finder? How upset would they be if they got beat by someone shooting from the youth stake and turning the score in as a hunter stake score? If this happened people would be furious and they'd have a right to be since it's cheating. 

I think people are missing the big picture when they say people are whining because they got beat...it has nothing to do with getting beat but more to do with getting beat by someone who has no right shooting in a Novice class when they are at least an Ametuer competitive shooter. 

As I stated earlier I shoot AHC. Had Travis dropped to my class and won then I'd be supportive of his choice to shoot his hunter set-up and praise him for his abilites on the course. However he choose to shoot an entry level class that's set-up at the shortest distance because he knew he'd have an advantage over the average hunter class shooter. Where's the morals in that? Where's the ethics? In my eyes this is no different then the guys who find other ways to cheat to win.

As I stated this is my opinion and the way I view things. We each have our thoughts on this subject and I'm by no means saying someone else's opinion is incorrect. However until someone can give me a good, solid reason why this shouldn't be viewed the same as cheating I will stand firm in my beliefs that it is and as such those who choose to sandbag will always be viewed by me as a cheater.


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## Hopperton (Oct 30, 2005)

reylamb said:


> Since paying the Pro Certification is not mandatory in K50 and Semi pro........they are amateur classes. All pro classes are required to pay the pro certification fee.


Forgot to mention, this is just your opinion.


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## Hopperton (Oct 30, 2005)

Cant believe this Travis guy has not chimed in to explain his reasoning. Makes me think he just wanted an easy shoot he new he could have a chance at winning. If that is not the case please chime in and let us know.


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## 3Dobsessed (Jun 11, 2004)

:roflmao:


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## Hopperton (Oct 30, 2005)

3Dobsessed said:


> :roflmao:


:iamwithstupid: NOT!


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## 3Dobsessed (Jun 11, 2004)

:Cry::hurt:


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## cookiemonster (Dec 4, 2006)

Stillfingers said:


> Then why is it listed under Professional and not Amateur?


IF a pro wants to shoot a known distance class it is the 50 you do not have to be a pro to shoot it.


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## cookiemonster (Dec 4, 2006)

Stillfingers said:


> *Sorry Guys, I know this subject is like beatin a dead horse, but I just had to stick in another opinion (I know, everyone has one)…my earlier post was only from the respective organization’s rules.*
> 
> I agree Goofy! Either eliminate the Hunter Class (HC) or give it a two or three year participation limit as Beginner Hunter Class (BHC, 35 yds) with the current Hunter Class move up requirements also, and then have the Advanced Hunter Class (AHC, 40 yds) with the current Hunter Class move up requirements, and then Male Bowhunter Release (MBR, 45 yds) and the Male Bowhunter Open (MBO, 50 yds). I remember when all mens compound classes were 50 yds. But then attendance started suckin and they came out with the Hunter class for release and finger shooters and the migration was on! I had to suck it up in fingers class and shoot HF if I wanted any competition around here (not sayin I was better, just the only one in the MBF class). Then after a few years layoff due to some health and marriage problems, I came back to HF to get started again and just got lazy. Then IBO cuts HF yardage to kids stakes (30 yds) and I couln't take it anymore. MBF is where I started and where I should have stayed and will stay until the class goes away (which might not be too far down the road).
> 
> Light me up however you want, now that I’ve said my piece, I’m done with this subject.


You have a guy that can out shoot his buddies in the backyard get the idea to go shoot a tournament and finds out that he up against better shooters than his friends and he can't handle it. i tell guys just starting out to give themselves a year to learn before expecting to win.


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## cookiemonster (Dec 4, 2006)

goofy2788 said:


> Excellant Question Gary, I'd like to know the answer as well. Who here is an ASA expert that might be able to explain this? I've never shot ASA myself and have no clue as to how their organization is run.


No look at the asa rules that is not what it says if a pro wants to shoot a known class it has to be the 50.


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