# PSE Achieve target recurve prototype spotted at ATA



## stbullard (Jul 17, 2014)

Both models on the floor were 66” with 25” risers and short limbs; plans are for left and right handed in several colors.

MSRP was being bandied around as 1100-1200 for the full bow, but that may be significantly higher or lower (700-1400) by the time it reaches production. Yes, that’s a wide range. I’m not sure how much of that is riser vs limbs, but I was told the riser machining is particularly time consuming and accounts for much of the current expected cost.

Nice to see PSE getting back into onshoring recurve design and production, even if it’s a bit spendy.

No word on availability date.


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## fango0000 (Mar 16, 2011)

It looks very similar to the old Samick Masters back in the day.

I wonder what the weight of the riser is. PSE was able to find a niche for light aluminum risers with the x-appeal for slimmer ladies who can't shoot a heavier GMX well and want to avoid formula. I wonder if this will also be on the lighter side for that audience. 

1100-1200 seems a little spendy for recurve stuff from a manufacturer that doesn't have a reputation like win/hoyt/mk/samick. 1400 even more so. 

I am excited to see more options on the market though, especially US made.


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## AR720 (Jun 28, 2016)

fango0000 said:


> It looks very similar to the old Samick Masters back in the day.


Or, you know, almost exactly the same as the Masters Max.

http://www.merlinarchery.co.uk/samick-masters-max-recurve-riser.html


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## toj (Aug 22, 2012)

Looks quite plain for pse.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

i was a big fan of the X-factor and had 5 of them pass thru my hands and this new one does not look original at all..


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

I'm designing one.


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## Gregjlongbow (Jun 15, 2016)

Love the X Appeal, but it looks like they abandoned the limb adjustment system that was SOOO great about the X Appeal. Too bad. Looks good, but yeah bland and identical to the Masters. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

toj said:


> Looks quite plain for pse.


This was my first thought. So this is basically post-Kronengold PSE then.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Gregjlongbow said:


> Love the X Appeal, but it looks like they abandoned the limb adjustment system that was SOOO great about the X Appeal. Too bad. Looks good, but yeah bland and identical to the Masters.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That limb adjustment system was my least favorite part of the X-appeal, just as the limb adjustment system was my least favorite part of the X-factor before it.


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## Rael84 (Feb 22, 2016)

I wish there was a better shot of the limbs. Hard to tell what they are made of and what their profile is.


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## Gregjlongbow (Jun 15, 2016)

limbwalker said:


> That limb adjustment system was my least favorite part of the X-appeal, just as the limb adjustment system was my least favorite part of the X-factor before it.


Really? Oh man I love it. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

I'm glad someone does!


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## Seattlepop (Dec 8, 2003)

limbwalker said:


> That limb adjustment system was my least favorite part of the X-appeal, just as the limb adjustment system was my least favorite part of the X-factor before it.


I never did understand the alignment locking grub screws going directly into the alignment screw threads. I had to replace the alignment screws and tap out the alignment block threads on mine at one point.


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## Cuthbert (Nov 28, 2005)

I think it looks pretty solid if not a bit conservative. I think that is a good thing post X-Appeal. The finish looks good and all the edges seem to be radiused. I'd like to see what is under the limb. It looks like they're keeping the same grip template as before. Can't see if it has back bushings or make out too much detail on the limb bolts. Would like to see a profile shot, but I suppose that will be soon enough.


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

It’s about to get easier.


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

A few months back I noticed Samick had updated their website and had two new risers listed: the Max-Pro and the Ultra-X. The site is now updated again and the only one remaining is the Ultra-X. The gold riser pictured above looks remarkably similar to the Max-Pro. The Max-Pro seems to be getting slowly removed from existence on the Internet, but have a look at this link, where it still shows as of January 2018.

http://k-archery.com.au/p/9268063/samick-max-pro-riser.html

Look familiar? Yeah, and the Max-Pro looks pretty much identical to the Masters Max, as pointed out above.

PSE has re-branded other companies' recurve risers many times over the years, including Samick, so it's not surprising at all. 


-Kent W.


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## Lumis17 (Jun 9, 2003)

I’m glad PSE is staying in the recurve game, even if it’s re-branded equipment (which they’ve done before). I’ve always had good luck with their risers and limbs and have had good experiences with their customer support.

I wouldn’t mind if those Achieve limbs were updated Samick Masters limbs. Never ended up getting a pair in the past cause I never had trouble with my old Pro Elites and X-Pression limbs (and W&W Synergy limbs which I miss a ton).


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## archerynooblol (Nov 6, 2010)

williamskg6 said:


> PSE has re-branded other companies' recurve risers many times over the years, including Samick, so it's not surprising at all.
> 
> 
> -Kent W.


I'm curious, which ones specifically?


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Personally, I'm sick of all this re-branding. If a company doesn't produce something, they shouldn't be allowed to put their name on it IMO.


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## AR720 (Jun 28, 2016)

archerynooblol said:


> I'm curious, which ones specifically?


http://sagittarius.student.utwente.nl/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2094

http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2375725


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## Cuthbert (Nov 28, 2005)

Cuthbert said:


> I think it looks pretty solid if not a bit conservative. I think that is a good thing post X-Appeal. The finish looks good and all the edges seem to be radiused. I'd like to see what is under the limb. It looks like they're keeping the same grip template as before. Can't see if it has back bushings or make out too much detail on the limb bolts. Would like to see a profile shot, but I suppose that will be soon enough.


On closer examination of the photo, I think I can see full sized screws attaching the grip to the riser rather than the pass-through screw so that might be a tell if they are rebranding since they have used the same grip template for everything made in house back to the Zone. Does seem a bit suspicious at any rate.


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

archerynooblol said:


> I'm curious, which ones specifically?


The Kaya K3 = PSE X3. The PSE Theory is now being sold as the Galaxy Tourch and was also sold as some other brand too, if memory serves (Kinetic? Core?). The PSE Summit = Cartel XPert. Now, PSE has made a few excellent ILF recurves of their own design, but it seems entry level stuff in ILF-land has been mainly a re-branding exercise for a while. I'd love to see a new higher-end PSE-designed riser, but they make most of their money off compound bows.

I sort of agree with limbwalker. They didn't design it and they didn't manufacture it, so it should have the manufacturer's name on it instead of PSE's, and tacking on a price premium just for PSE's name seems a little misleading. On the other hand, PSE has enough confidence in the design and manufacture that they're willing to put their name on it and distribute them. Some of these products aren't available from other USA sources. 

-Kent W.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

i believe there is a difference between straight re-branding vs having another manufacturer make products of your design and specs and putting your brand on it..

SF used to have win&win make their products for them and this is also done in other industries like golf equipment, apparel,and other sports equipment..

i used pse elites and expressions for a long time and never had any problem with them and also the winces and winexes which were also top-notch..

am not sure how much inputs pse has on these newer offerings but assuming they did have some proprietary inputs i have no problem with it..

if they have no original inputs at all then therein lies a problem..

PS: i thought the expressions were just rebranded winexes until i had them both and saw they weren't..


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

I'm in OEM business for electronic products since more than 30 years already and consultant for Private Lables design and management in various fields since more than 25 years. Yes, I have done other things than archery only,but this another story. 

Adding a label with your brand on any item you can buy and sell is the easiest way to make a "propertary" product. The lowest level of OEM business
Then you can change cosmetic/graphic/color of the product, design your own package, and you are at the second level. 
The third level is reached whe you ask OEM maker to modify the product to fit some specific needs. Then, you are already in real manufacturing area. 
When you design all parts and assemble them in a final product, than you are a manufacturer

Private labeles are common in consumer market for any product, from pasta and frozen pizza, to high perfomance computers. Private label for distributing companies protects owner from direct competition when selling. No one can sell your labelled products at cheaper price. Some other times, a company simply does not make or has no interest in investing to make a specific product that is requeste from its customers, so simply decide to buy existing products from OEM makers and lable them. For example, ages ago I have sourced from China for Daewoo Electronics (at that time a famous Korean company) Europe a full range of Audio products as dealers wanted to sell audio products with Daewoo brand, but they were directly making TV and VCR's only. 

Summarizing, labelling OEM designed products is for Distributors/Hypermarkets chains and/or for filling empty slots in a manufacturer's ranges. It is happening in Archery too, since tens of years already. Nothing new, nothing strange.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

Vittorio said:


> I'm in OEM business for electronic products since more than 30 years already and consultant for Private Lables design and management in various fields since more than 25 years. Yes, I have done other things than archery only,but this another story.
> 
> Adding a label with your brand on any item you can buy and sell is the easiest way to make a "propertary" product. The lowest level of OEM business
> Then you can change cosmetic/graphic/color of the product, design your own package, and you are at the second level.
> ...




thanks for that excellent explanation on the different stages of the OEM business..

i'm hoping PSE might be in the third level or else they're just re-branding..


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

It's really unfortunate IMO that a company like PSE doesn't think enough of recurve archery to make their own products. I grew up a PSE fan. My first hunting bow was a PSE compound (brackets, wheels, steel cables and all). But then I ventured into PSE recurves and realized that Pete's interest lies nowhere near the recurve realm. I would rather they didn't produce a recurve at all, than to just rebrand a foreign bow with "PSE" on it. What purpose does that really serve? 

This is where I have to give some props to Hoyt and to Jim at SKY for at least caring enough to produce an American-made world class recurve. It's pretty unbelievable to me that those are all we have to choose from for American made products anymore. I was hoping someone like Elite would get into the game. Seems that limbs are the big roadblock, with nearly everyone sourcing their limbs from Korea or China anymore. Reminds me of the binoculars world where even Vortex and Leupold have given in to Chinese manufacturing for their top end optics. There simply seems to be no pride anymore in making sure something is truly made in the USA.


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## toj (Aug 22, 2012)

There was a time "made in aisia" simply meant sub standard.
Those days are long gone


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

toj said:


> There was a time "made in aisia" simply meant sub standard.
> Those days are long gone


I have no problem with products made in Asia. I have a problem with American companies just flat "giving up" and sourcing products from overseas because it's the cheaper, easier alternative.


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## TheElBow (May 18, 2015)

As noted, we are now living in the world of total "brand capitalism". Only the value of the brand counts. R&D and manufacturing are at the lowest cost to the quality that is necessary in order not to endanger the brand image and thus the brand value. The simple, uninformed customers are blinded and fooled by product advertising all the time.

I take my hat off and pay respect to companies like Gillo, who are trying to establish their own business with mainly their own products under these circumstances.

In extreme cases, the brand is the one and only "product" of a company. Stick a label with such a brand name on your product, and you can charge twice the price without real service. (I've heard that this should be the business model of the currently most powerful man in the world ...)

So PSE does not just give up, they just play the game that everyone plays.


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## Tbarkeriii (Jun 24, 2016)

https://www.fieldandstream.com/why-bow-bubble-could-kill-local-pro-shops

Interesting article that speaks to the issue of manufacturing archery equipment in the United States. Not only does the following paragraph apply, but factor in regulatory compliance, health insurance, 401k, sick and vacation costs, etc. 35-40% overhead cost per employee is not unusual. (One of the reasons for the migration to more AI and robotic manufacturing.). Granted the labor costs are narrowing vs overseas manufacturing and there is the terrible cost of shipping and distribution from Asia, but Asian manufacturing is still attractive and popular. My view is American manufacturing is quite good, a thoroughbred race horse if you will. The problem is the race horse has a 300 lb jockey.

‘But does this justify the price hike? “It’s complicated,” Strother explains. “CNC machining time is expensive, and materials have gone way up.” In our litigious society, the price of ideas has also skyrocketed. “The patent office is issuing frivolous patents for everything,” he adds. “Companies now have to pay for technologies I was using 20 years ago. Sometimes you have to buy your own idea back. Attorneys have to research that stuff, and it’s all a part of your $1,200 bow.”’


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## toj (Aug 22, 2012)

I'd be surprised if there's such a thing as an American company excluding the very small cottage industries.
From foreign investment to foreign ceo's and board members to manufacturing and assembly right down to the machine that makes the parts and immigrant work force.

We're in a global age and all of these companies do things that produce the biggest margin.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Well at least don't feed us the same exact product under multiple names, and expect us to believe it. I sometimes wonder if these companies think the typical consumer is just that dumb. Maybe they are. I dunno.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

there is a saying in marketing that "you can only sell a bad product once"..

it is obvious that those who do straight re-branding believe THEIR product is not bad..


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

I'm sure my frustration with PSE is showing - that they let such a talent go and gave up on original recurve designs... For a decade or more, PSE had cutting edge risers and world class limbs built to their specs (by W&W) and supported the top women in the U.S. when nobody else would. I'm sorry those days are behind them.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

limbwalker said:


> I'm sure my frustration with PSE is showing - that they let such a talent go and gave up on original recurve designs... For a decade or more, PSE had cutting edge risers and world class limbs built to their specs (by W&W) and supported the top women in the U.S. when nobody else would. I'm sorry those days are behind them.


i fully understand your frustration John...

i was a great PSE fan and used their stuff for a long time and was even influenced by you when i chose the X-factors as my main riser more than 10 years ago and had 5 of them pass thru my hands..

i also used the Expressions and the Elites for some time plus the Winacts and Winexes and they all gave excellent performance..

i always felt however that they never gave their recurve section enough attention vs their compounds and even their catalogues hardly gave Olympic recurves space at all..

i guess it's all about the bottom line nowadays and aside from Hoyt i don't see any US manufacturers on the horizon that could give the Koreans and the Europeans a run for their money when it comes to Olympic archery equipment....pity.


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## Jim C (Oct 15, 2002)

limbwalker said:


> Personally, I'm sick of all this re-branding. If a company doesn't produce something, they shouldn't be allowed to put their name on it IMO.


back when PSE jumped into the Olympic recurve market in 92 or 93 with the CENTRA-they proudly proclaimed that their limbs were made by Earl Hoyt (basically the same things you shot in the 04 games-SKY JACKS) same with the bow I started shooting in 95/96 the UNIVERSAL. When the Intrepid and Zones came out-They had switched to WW IIRC-wood carbon limbs. By the time the XFACTOR and the Xpressions came out before the 04 olympic games (all three of our lady archers shot Xfactors IIC, though Janet and Stephanie shot YAMAHA at the trials) , the limbs were similar to the highly regarded WINEX by WW


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## Tbarkeriii (Jun 24, 2016)

David and Allan are great engineers and companies cannot just let that kind of intellectual capacity walk without serious consequences. Those two were a key competitive advantage for PSE, even as underutilized as they were.


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

jmvargas said:


> ....... and aside from Hoyt i don't see any US manufacturers on the horizon that could give the Koreans and the Europeans a run for their money when it comes to Olympic archery equipment....pity.


It is just a matter of market, and were the market is going. Recurve target market is NOT growing as needed to keep volumes increasing, apart in the low end. And low end is already dominated by cheap China made products, only. 
I have read with interest the article referred in another post, about companies making compound bows that are already dropping to the same situation. 
If potential number of customers does not increase (TAM= Total Available Market) at agood rate, a company to survive shoud ---> A) try to offer lower prices or B) try to offer innovative products, both in order to keep customers they have or to conquer new customers from compettiors. 
The extreme of this situation is shown by mobile phone companies (in both products and services) . In a world were everyone already has a phone, how can you get new customers? 
Innovation, Price, Brand image, Advertising. it is an aethernal wheel spinning in all markets. But the key to it is the development of the TAM, and TAM is NOT growing as needed to keep many large companies surviving. 
So, companies have to make decisions: the make/buy is the basic one, in terms of immediate result. You cut internal costs and transform your fixed costs to variable ones. But in the process, you will loose your know how in favour of your supplier, that soon or later will become comeptitor to you.
Happend for countless number of products, already. Do you have any TV still made in USA or Europe? Do you have any Mobile phone still made in USA or Europe? 
As far as Archery products are concerned, markets are already very very different in each Continent. Small manufacturers can still survive, as thay serve local needs, but those hoping in a global homogeneous need continuously increasing to get their sales groving can only but suffer, if they are not clever in choosing market segments and do not rapidly adapt their strategies to the changes occouring. Outsourcing products is just a temporary solution for makers. Moving their own factories to China (or Mexico) to profit of cheaper costs is the solution, if you have volumes to move. Bit, this is the problem.

P.S. ---> European makers are in the same situation, exactly same as US makers or even worse.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

vittorio..

..what you're describing is basically a supply and demand situation and is also the basis of the capitalistic model wherein the strong usually prevails..

demand for our type of equipment is just not enough to justify major investments in manufacturing and research..

the Korean manufacturers are probably more secure vs their competitors when it comes to market share hence their willingness to invest more....but who knows.


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

jmvargas said:


> demand for our type of equipment is just not enough to justify major investments in manufacturing and research..
> 
> the Korean manufacturers are probably more secure vs their competitors when it comes to market share hence their willingness to invest more....but who knows.


Behind d successfull companies there are visions of specially talented people that can see the future and live in an environment that allows them to develop their visions. 

Steve Job could not make Apple if he was born in Tunisia, Park Kyung Rae could not make Win & Win if he was born in Venezuela and Doug Easton could not create aluminium arrows if born in Madagascar... 

Korean manufacturers are not secure of anything, but the environment (finance labour cost, technology, work philosophy) is ok to start new businesses. Only one weak point they have: they don't have adomestic significant market for archery products, and they are suffering from this. 

But then again, you have got the main point: *demand for our type of equipment is just not enough to justify major investments in manufacturing and research
*


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## Montalaar (Jan 26, 2008)

limbwalker said:


> I have no problem with products made in Asia. I have a problem with American companies just flat "giving up" and sourcing products from overseas because it's the cheaper, easier alternative.


Bit late of a reply, but you probably noticed (or not) that Martin Archery moved everything back to parts made in USA. One guy of their CS posted a very nice explanation why this is, at least for the volume and products they make, a cheaper and better solution. 

Eventually you get what you pay for, even in china. If you want a really good product you have to pay a higher price. If you outsource to china to save money you will end up with products of less quality. In case of Martin that meant that around 50% of their parts where not working, falling apart or simply of really low quality. Moving everything to the US means a higher cost of the individual part, but also only a very small failure rate. Plus having people produce something in the local area means less costs and time for shipping, making the assembly more flexible. And local jobs = potential buyers.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

Montalaar said:


> Bit late of a reply, but you probably noticed (or not) that Martin Archery moved everything back to parts made in USA. One guy of their CS posted a very nice explanation why this is, at least for the volume and products they make, a cheaper and better solution.
> 
> Eventually you get what you pay for, even in china. If you want a really good product you have to pay a higher price. If you outsource to china to save money you will end up with products of less quality. In case of Martin that meant that around 50% of their parts where not working, falling apart or simply of really low quality. Moving everything to the US means a higher cost of the individual part, but also only a very small failure rate. Plus having people produce something in the local area means
> 
> ...



...does Martin still make or have Olympic recurves? 

i still have 2 of their hunting bows--Mamba and Stick--and also had an Aurora Olympic riser which i believe was outsourced from Italy..

the Aurora was a beautifully made riser but was just too heavy for me..


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## Tbarkeriii (Jun 24, 2016)

As usual, when Vitorio speaks, I listen. Excellent analysis.


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## Montalaar (Jan 26, 2008)

jmvargas said:


> ...does Martin still make or have Olympic recurves?
> 
> i still have 2 of their hunting bows--Mamba and Stick--and also had an Aurora Olympic riser which i believe was outsourced from Italy..
> 
> the Aurora was a beautifully made riser but was just too heavy for me..


No, unfortunately not. And given that their ownership changed multiple times in the recent years i do not believe that will ever change again. 

I am still looking for an Aurora riser, but those are extremely rare and seem to get more expensive.


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## fango0000 (Mar 16, 2011)

jmvargas said:


> i guess it's all about the bottom line nowadays and aside from Hoyt i don't see any US manufacturers on the horizon that could give the Koreans and the Europeans a run for their money when it comes to Olympic archery equipment....pity.


Even the Hoyt rep I talk to calls the recurve department a labor of love. They make so little money from the recurves they sell vs. the compounds (at least from the numbers he's able to see.) Even from a local archery shop perspective, they make so little from a recurve sale (either beginner or flagship) that they don't bother carrying anything in stock.


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

fango0000 said:


> Even the Hoyt rep I talk to calls the recurve department a labor of love. They make so little money from the recurves they sell vs. the compounds (at least from the numbers he's able to see.) Even from a local archery shop perspective, they make so little from a recurve sale (either beginner or flagship) that they don't bother carrying anything in stock.


this just reinforces the fact that demand for our type of equipment is really not enough to attract new players or investments..

..but no way Hoyt will ever abandon Olympic recurves in the future considering their major involvement in the Olympics and most if not all the major archery tournaments where Olympic recurves are used....


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Jim C said:


> back when PSE jumped into the Olympic recurve market in 92 or 93 with the CENTRA-they proudly proclaimed that their limbs were made by Earl Hoyt (basically the same things you shot in the 04 games-SKY JACKS) same with the bow I started shooting in 95/96 the UNIVERSAL. When the Intrepid and Zones came out-They had switched to WW IIRC-wood carbon limbs. By the time the XFACTOR and the Xpressions came out before the 04 olympic games (all three of our lady archers shot Xfactors IIC, though Janet and Stephanie shot YAMAHA at the trials) , the limbs were similar to the highly regarded WINEX by WW


Actually Jim, the Xpression limbs came out after Athens. I remember David explaining to me how they asked W&W to manufacture a foam core limb with a honeycomb core on one side, and a solid foam core on the other. He sent me a couple pairs to use but they stacked a bit too much for my ape-like draw, so I returned them and continued to use my SKY's (which he had no problem with at all). Jenny used the W&W wood core competition limbs in Athens, as did Stephanie and I think Janet too.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

fango0000 said:


> Even the Hoyt rep I talk to calls the recurve department a labor of love. They make so little money from the recurves they sell vs. the compounds (at least from the numbers he's able to see.) Even from a local archery shop perspective, they make so little from a recurve sale (either beginner or flagship) that they don't bother carrying anything in stock.


I have no doubt that is true. The connection between the Easton family and the Olympics is no doubt what keeps Hoyt in the recurve business. Otherwise, they would have gone the way of PSE by now for sure.


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## dkard (Sep 25, 2004)

I have 2 Aurora Risers, One was Ed Eliason's bow with the adjustable rest they designed, The rest was wonderful but was too expensive to manufacture at the time so it never went into production.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

dkard said:


> I have 2 Aurora Risers, One was Ed Eliason's bow with the adjustable rest they designed, The rest was wonderful but was too expensive to manufacture at the time so it never went into production.


For those who have never shot an Aurora riser, they have no idea what they are missing. Easily one of my top 3. Limb alignment system was overly complicated, but oh the shot... I can still feel it. Stable and yet soft. A deadly combination.


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## Plucker (May 24, 2014)

dkard said:


> I have 2 Aurora Risers, One was Ed Eliason's bow with the adjustable rest they designed, The rest was wonderful but was too expensive to manufacture at the time so it never went into production.


Big fan of the Aurora, my biggest regret was not buying a 2nd one in silver when they where on sale years ago, but I have never seen the rest you mentioned, could you perhaps post a picture?


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## jmvargas (Oct 21, 2004)

with all this talk about the Aurora i now kinda regret getting rid of mine..

but i could never be able to use it anyway as it was about 1lb heavier than my x-factors..but it sure looked good!


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## Rael84 (Feb 22, 2016)

These are showing up on Ebay now: https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-PSE-Achieve-Olympic-Recurve-Riser-25-Blue-/152929514081


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## Jim C (Oct 15, 2002)

I have handled the new PSE-one of our very top archers in the midwest is shooting one now (Jason Pfister-one of the leaders of ACE Archers in Ohio). Its a Samick, the limb adjustment system is superb. I'd say its worth checking out if you are in the market for a new recurve riser.


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## Jim C (Oct 15, 2002)

jmvargas said:


> with all this talk about the Aurora i now kinda regret getting rid of mine..
> 
> but i could never be able to use it anyway as it was about 1lb heavier than my x-factors..but it sure looked good!


Have two still. I was one of the first people to have one since we were martin dealers and Ed showed me the prototype before it hit the market. I want to repeat a neat story about it-Mike Gerard-who was part of the team that designed the Aurora, after leaving Martin, sent me his Aurora and asked i find it a good home-I gave it to a boy who used to shoot for us who didn't have the funds for a top of the line recurve. I will never ever forget that.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Ed and Mike are the best.


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## fango0000 (Mar 16, 2011)

Hm, these look exactly like the Masters Max Samick risers that existed before Samick dissappeared for a few years.


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## AR720 (Jun 28, 2016)

fango0000 said:


> Hm, these look exactly like the Masters Max Samick risers that existed before Samick dissappeared for a few years.


http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=5356321&p=1106952531#post1106952531


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