# Warning-do Not Buy The Carter Evolution



## tbailey (Feb 25, 2004)

I always feel that somebody's watchin' me
And I have no privacy
I always feel that somebody's watchin' me
Is it just a dream?


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

tbailey said:


> I always feel that somebody's watchin' me
> And I have no privacy
> I always feel that somebody's watchin' me
> Is it just a dream?


i know what your thinking....i do....lock the door:wink:


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## tbailey (Feb 25, 2004)

onebowtie said:


> i know what your thinking....i do....lock the door:wink:


Will you leave my head once my very own Evolution arrives?  Chris says it's shipping tomorrow!


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## cgchris99 (Apr 10, 2003)

I'll be there waiting for the UPS guy to show up with the Evolutions. Boxes are already prepared. All I gotta do is just drop in the release and tape them shut and slap on the UPS tag.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

tbailey said:


> Will you leave my head once my very own Evolution arrives?  Chris says it's shipping tomorrow!


all will be ok....soon


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## tbailey (Feb 25, 2004)

cgchris99 said:


> I'll be there waiting for the UPS guy to show up with the Evolutions. Boxes are already prepared. All I gotta do is just drop in the release and tape them shut and slap on the UPS tag.


My very own Sigmund Freud to the rescue!

OBT must've really been training with the Taliban on his trip overseas. He's out to destroy us spottie wannabe's. :mg:


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## Nito (Aug 17, 2005)

OBT: stop this NOW, i still havent got mine,:wink:


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## Hemingway (Sep 7, 2005)

Got mine in on Monday, its going back to Carter tomorrow. I guess I'll have to give up on Carter EVER making a release for those with small/slender hands.  The three finger design was more like a four finger for me and frankly it felt like a brick in my hand. I LOVE the principle that the release is based on and I know that being a Carter, the mechanism would be butter. I just REFUSE to shoot a release that is made for an ape. I buy a bow that fits me, pick my arrows to fit my setup, etc... it would be silly of me to force myself to use a release that doesn't fit  I did shoot it a few times and found that everything good OBT has said about this release is true. It really makes me sad that I can't have one in a "mini me" size. Oh well, when you come to your senses Carter, and realize that we "little guys"/women/youth need releases too, maybe I'll reconsider. Until then I'll stick with what fits and shoot my Stan. :wink:


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## ursonvs (Sep 19, 2003)

I've shot this release several times since january when it was in "research mode" and i do agree with mike on this. even tried it in different handle styles than the one now offered and i think jerry and forrest picked the better handle for it.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Nito said:


> OBT: stop this NOW, i still havent got mine,:wink:


here's your chance....buy the one hemmingway is sending back


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## JoBob (May 24, 2005)

Arghh....do they make one for BIG hands ???


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## boojo35 (Jul 16, 2005)

Thanks for the heads up..................... I sure would'nt want archery to be a stressful thing.................. To have expectations would be a pitiful thing...............300 vegas rounds...............I just can't bear to think of it.........


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

boojo35 said:


> Thanks for the heads up..................... I sure would'nt want archery to be a stressful thing.................. To have expectations would be a pitiful thing...............300 vegas rounds...............I just can't bear to think of it.........


finally somebody understands the stress this darn release has caused....

i was fine with my 292-294 vegas average with 12 or so X's....but no, now i am shooting 298-299 with 19-22 X's ...and do you realize the sweat, nervousness, anxiety i am having to go through.....thankfully i keep missing on the first few ends and dont have to worry about that 300 game....but its hard to still knock off those rounds of 298-299 ......


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## GOT LUCKY (Apr 30, 2005)

*I can see the headlines right now……


“Archer found Dead…Reason Unknown….Investigation Ongoing”

No appearance of trauma on victim….only a wide grin..:teeth: 

Evidence at Crime Scene….1 Carter Evolution Release….Target with perfect score.


"PREGO"...It's in There!!!*


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Stay tuned.....im going to show you a before and after target face.....

WARNING....not for faint of heart.....

the following pictures may not be suitable for young children or people who are easily panic'd

turn off your computer screen if ugly target faces offend you......

can you tell which target face is before i EVOLVED


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

are you ready to go from this target face to another? :faint:


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

:cocktail: sit back....relax...... and enjoy the ride


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## rdneckhntr (Oct 23, 2005)

OBT im willing to take your suffering away....pm me and ill send you my address.....:wink:


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## PUG (Nov 3, 2002)

*Sweet!!*

The there is some good shootin OBT!....I can't wait to get my hands on an Evolution....should be soon...

OBT speeks the truth...this release is gonna open some doors for a lot of people....

PUG


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## JawsDad (Dec 28, 2005)

OBT,

I'll give it to you, you certainly do a good job promoting the products you support. I believe you have, in a subliminal nature, coherced me to buy most of these products (except for those winners choice strings :wink: ). 

You ever thought of forming a cult? Perhaps beginning your own religion?

I'm not sure how old you would have been, but I'm guessing you had the Kool-Aid stand and provided the goods to Jim Jones. :darkbeer: 

:chortle: :chortle:


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

JawsDad said:


> OBT,
> 
> I'll give it to you, you certainly do a good job promoting the products you support. I believe you have, in a subliminal nature, coherced me to buy most of these products (except for those winners choice strings :wink: ).
> 
> ...


JD....you hurt me ......you still dont have the winners choice .....ill tell you what.....seeing how im a man of word:wink: ...i need to know what strings you have on your bow right now.....and than ill make you a little offer/wager/dare........

for the record.....there are still some leftover cups of koolaid:darkbeer:


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## BIG ARCHERY NUT (Oct 24, 2003)

Originally posted by Hemingway


> Got mine in on Monday, its going back to Carter tomorrow. I guess I'll have to give up on Carter EVER making a release for those with small/slender hands.


If it isn't in the mail yet I will PM you my address.:wink: 

I would love nothing else for this old man to pound a few more X's in front of the young guns at our club.


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## Doc (Jun 10, 2003)

JoBob said:


> Arghh....do they make one for BIG hands ???


JoBob, this will fit those mitts of yours unless you can actually palm a Yugo. Measure the diameter of your ring finger and we'll see if it will fit....my $ says it does.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

BIG ARCHERY NUT said:


> Originally posted by Hemingway
> 
> 
> If it isn't in the mail yet I will PM you my address.:wink:
> ...


hey old timer.....did you not heed my warning.....:tongue: .....unless your pace maker can operate double time.....DO NOT RISK the adrenaline rush the evolution will cause you:wink:


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## 3dmama (Sep 25, 2002)

Hemingway said:


> Got mine in on Monday, its going back to Carter tomorrow. I guess I'll have to give up on Carter EVER making a release for those with small/slender hands.  The three finger design was more like a four finger for me and frankly it felt like a brick in my hand. I LOVE the principle that the release is based on and I know that being a Carter, the mechanism would be butter. I just REFUSE to shoot a release that is made for an ape. I buy a bow that fits me, pick my arrows to fit my setup, etc... it would be silly of me to force myself to use a release that doesn't fit  I did shoot it a few times and found that everything good OBT has said about this release is true. It really makes me sad that I can't have one in a "mini me" size. Oh well, when you come to your senses Carter, and realize that we "little guys"/women/youth need releases too, maybe I'll reconsider. Until then I'll stick with what fits and shoot my Stan. :wink:



Have you tried the Carter Little Big Horn....I love this release...Its made for small hands


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Doc said:


> JoBob, this will fit those mitts of yours unless you can actually palm a Yugo. Measure the diameter of your ring finger and we'll see if it will fit....my $ says it does.


hey, im not doubting that hemmingway is uncomfy with the size of the release.....im guessing he has shot a hand held for along time and is used to a smaller size.....

honestly, the evolution isnt big or small...its kinda in the middle.....i dont have big or small hands(you know-sorta like my feet-just right:wink: ) yet the release seems to fit fine for me.....

hopefully in time, carter will indeed make a smaller and larger version for those who are used to that style.....hang in there hemmingway....ill keep chewing in jerrys ear for different versions


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## cgchris99 (Apr 10, 2003)

OBT, that's a very impressive change in target patterns and scores.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

cgchris99 said:


> OBT, that's a very impressive change in target patterns and scores.



the sad thing is....its actual .....man.....i use to think the old target face scores were as good as they would get for me....


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## Grey Eagle (May 23, 2002)

Bowtie, this thing gonna fit my mitt??? Or am I going to be wearing it like a wedding ring that won't come off


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## Hemingway (Sep 7, 2005)

onebowtie said:


> hey, im not doubting that hemmingway is uncomfy with the size of the release.....im guessing he has shot a hand held for along time and is used to a smaller size.....
> 
> honestly, the evolution isnt big or small...its kinda in the middle.....i dont have big or small hands(you know-sorta like my feet-just right:wink: ) yet the release seems to fit fine for me.....
> 
> hopefully in time, carter will indeed make a smaller and larger version for those who are used to that style.....hang in there hemmingway....ill keep chewing in jerrys ear for different versions


Yep, right again OBT. It really isn't a HUGE release, but my mitts say its a no-go. I hope no one takes my post as a bash on Carter, cause that wasn't the intent. I was just hoping that for once I could find a Carter that I could make work. :sad: Oh, and please do encourage them to make some different sizes... if they do, I'll be first in line!!


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## Hemingway (Sep 7, 2005)

BIG ARCHERY NUT said:


> Originally posted by Hemingway
> 
> 
> If it isn't in the mail yet I will PM you my address.:wink:
> ...


your just a little too late... Nito has already contacted me, and the release is going to him. Sorry...


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## tbailey (Feb 25, 2004)

cgchris99 said:


> OBT, that's a very impressive change in target patterns and scores.


Darn tootin!

Hemingway's got me worried though. I've switched to the medium Stan SuperX and Zenith BT releases after being a long time Carter fan because of this reason.

Us pygmies need to join forces and demand us little guys be heard. Is anybody listening? Is that the same voice I keep hearing in my head. OBT, don't, stop.....must resist.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Hemingway said:


> Yep, right again OBT. It really isn't a HUGE release, but my mitts say its a no-go. I hope no one takes my post as a bash on Carter, cause that wasn't the intent. I was just hoping that for once I could find a Carter that I could make work. :sad: Oh, and please do encourage them to make some different sizes... if they do, I'll be first in line!!


i dont think anyone took your post as a bash at all.....at least i took it for exactly as it was.....

i know exactly how you feel....i cant use certain golf clubs if they dont have the right size grip for me....

i will be offer carter some suggestions on the size thing...especially for the more popular release's.....

good post hemingway......we all enjoy a honest evalution.....and im glad that another at'er was able to snag that off .....


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## Ivorytooth (Jan 22, 2004)

I am glad you sufferers have evolved. 

Can't say I have ever, ever suffered.  Thank goodness!!!


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

tbailey said:


> Darn tootin!
> 
> Hemingway's got me worried though. I've switched to the medium Stan SuperX and Zenith BT releases after being a long time Carter fan because of this reason.
> 
> Us pygmies need to join forces and demand us little guys be heard. Is anybody listening? Is that the same voice I keep hearing in my head. OBT, don't, stop.....must resist.


medium will work....medium will work......


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## 1cbr_guy (Oct 30, 2005)

I just hope it is big enough for my club-hand. Right now, for a release, I use a catchers mit with a wire coat hanger sticking out the front. Not really. LOL I have one of these on order.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Ivorytooth said:


> I am glad you sufferers have evolved.
> 
> Can't say I have ever, ever suffered.  Thank goodness!!!


now toothy....there is a flip side to this suffering......

you see toothy...before....my 292's with 8-12x's didnt bother me or cause any anxiety.....

however...now that im banging on the door to 300....the flip side is...YOU WILL SUFFER...many loses and defeats at the hands of those who are evolving......

think about it toothy.....it has nawed away at you ever since you lost that foot race.....and it wont be no different this year at vegas....once you realize...you were beat by OBT.....you will have to suffer for at least another year......

so while those of us evolve....the irony of it all....our suffering is temporarily...yours and others like you...will be long term:wink: 


for the record....i will shoot a 300 in las vegas....THIS YEAR


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

So....how does this dream machine work. Is it like the Loesch or HHA, where you set it a lil above your holding weight and pull through or is it a different beast?


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## Doc (Jun 10, 2003)

onebowtie said:


> for the record....i will shoot a 300 in las vegas....THIS YEAR


Noted and recorded:wink:


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

WDMJR3DBOWGUY said:


> So....how does this dream machine work. Is it like the Loesch or HHA, where you set it a lil above your holding weight and pull through or is it a different beast?


as i havent shot the loesch or hha....im told that there similar in function

the carter is exactly as you say...set the weight slightly higher than your holding weight....and simply pull and when it goes....who knows:wink: ...surprise surprise.....


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## 1cbr_guy (Oct 30, 2005)

WDMJR3DBOWGUY said:


> So....how does this dream machine work. Is it like the Loesch or HHA, where you set it a lil above your holding weight and pull through or is it a different beast?


I'm told "yes". Its just in a neater, cleaner package.


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## Hemingway (Sep 7, 2005)

tbailey said:


> Darn tootin!
> 
> Hemingway's got me worried though. I've switched to the medium Stan SuperX and Zenith BT releases after being a long time Carter fan because of this reason.
> 
> Us pygmies need to join forces and demand us little guys be heard. Is anybody listening? Is that the same voice I keep hearing in my head. OBT, don't, stop.....must resist.


I shoot a medium frame Stan Super X myself. The Carter is considerably larger than the medium frame Stan's. Not saying it would be too big for you, but it IS bigger than your Super X


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## Ivorytooth (Jan 22, 2004)

onebowtie said:


> now toothy....there is a flip side to this suffering......
> 
> you see toothy...before....my 292's with 8-12x's didnt bother me or cause any anxiety.....
> 
> ...


No more exhibitions for you.  Now you have to pay to lose.  

I hope you shoot a 300, I really do.  Better have an X count to go with that or you still sign.  I ain't gonna fall for the kward trick more than once.  LOL!


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Ivorytooth said:


> No more exhibitions for you.  Now you have to pay to lose.
> 
> I hope you shoot a 300, I really do.  Better have an X count to go with that or you still sign.  I ain't gonna fall for the kward trick more than once.  LOL!


one more shall it be said...shall it be done item of note....

OBT will make the cut at lancaster this year:wink: ...so i feel strongly that the X count will be there....


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## Ivorytooth (Jan 22, 2004)

onebowtie said:


> one more shall it be said...shall it be done item of note....
> 
> OBT will make the cut at lancaster this year:wink: ...so i feel strongly that the X count will be there....


I hope you make the cut.....but against me, you get cut.  

Careful, you are starting to talk like the Rob.


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## Bob_Looney (Nov 17, 2003)

I too shoot the med stan super X but also have the evolution. The pinky hole in the stan is .800" and the evolution is .920". not much difference but yes, they are different.
The biggest differrence between the two is the hand/finger position. If you put your fingers together and turn the finger tips toward the palm, the stan will fit perfectly. My middle and ring fingers still touch when holding the med. super X. The evolution has more gap between all three fingers, spreading out your hand. That's why it feels "large". Very close to the "large" super X.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Ivorytooth said:


> I hope you make the cut.....but against me, you get cut.
> 
> Careful, you are starting to talk like the Rob.


im really going to enjoy having you watch me and cheer for me as i shoot on while you scratch the back of your head asking yourself (how did OBT make the cut, and i didnt):tongue:


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## BIG ARCHERY NUT (Oct 24, 2003)

Originally Posted by Hemingway


> your just a little too late... Nito has already contacted me, and the release is going to him. Sorry...


Well maybe that's for the best. onebowtie has warned me about the affect it may have on me. Still just watching the looks on the young "Gun's" faces as the X's kept coming would have been worth the risk.  

Don't worry about the bashing. Like you said Carter makes a great product and a release that fits everyone. Maybe they couldn't get all of the components into a smaller release. I feel some of the Truball releases are a tad big for a bare hand but fit nice when I wearing a glove for hunting.


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## Nito (Aug 17, 2005)

onebowtie said:


> here's your chance....buy the one hemmingway is sending back


DONE!!!!!!!!!!!


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

So size wise...I have an Insatiable 2....how is it compared to it. I wanted to see it at the ASA classic, but carter wasnt there and lancaster hadnt gotten them.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

BIG ARCHERY NUT said:


> Originally Posted by Hemingway
> 
> 
> Well maybe that's for the best. onebowtie has warned me about the affect it may have on me. Still just watching the looks on the young "Gun's" faces as the X's kept coming would have been worth the risk.
> Don't worry about the bashing. Like you said Carter makes a great product and a release that fits everyone. Maybe they couldn't get all of the components into a smaller release. I feel some of the Truball releases are a tad big for a bare hand but fit nice when I wearing a glove for hunting.


you do have a point....so go ahead....get on the waiting list with somebody...and get you one of these coming.....

hehe...wait till tonight...ill post up the newest target face.....:wink:


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## BIG ARCHERY NUT (Oct 24, 2003)

Originally Posted by onebowtie



> you do have a point....so go ahead....get on the waiting list with somebody...and get you one of these coming.....
> 
> hehe...wait till tonight...ill post up the newest target face.....


That's right. Continue to tempt us until we just break down and order one.:wink: 

Give them a couple of weeks and they will be in the classifieds.

Bring on the X's:darkbeer:


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## JUMPMAN (Jun 5, 2005)

Alright Obt. Being as How Ive been doing the back tension thing for the past couple of years, not having a single problem with holding and aiming along with the follow through and the suprize release. Do you feel it would be an advange to invest in one of these there thing a majigs...


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

JUMPMAN said:


> Alright Obt. Being as How Ive been doing the back tension thing for the past couple of years, not having a single problem with holding and aiming along with the follow through and the suprize release. Do you feel it would be an advange to invest in one of these there thing a majigs...


ok...so far you've given me half halfs...

what are your scores doing....as far as are you at the wall....what is your average round......

because i dont understand.....if your not having any issues with aim, hold, and follow through...i dont see why your not actually shooting top scores (that is if your not)

im going on a limb and say your release aint your problem...its in your other setups...

bow, arrows, tuning issues.....something


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

BIG ARCHERY NUT said:


> Originally Posted by onebowtie
> 
> 
> 
> ...


your right....there probably will be a few bail early on it....there loss....your gain:wink:


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## JUMPMAN (Jun 5, 2005)

onebowtie said:


> ok...so far you've given me half halfs...
> 
> what are your scores doing....as far as are you at the wall....what is your average round......
> 
> ...


Dont shoot the spots anymore...the last spot I shot was a screw off round with a 299 25X (vegas) 6 months ago....its 3D or bust...I will tell ya since going to the back tension the scores have went up, placed in the top three at every 3d Ive been too....:wink: 

I'm wondering how this release will perform in the wind compared to a back tension (can you punch it off). Ive been known to let down 10 different times on one target....


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## cav84 (Apr 20, 2006)

*like my blue Evo*

I have had the loesch for awhile, the Evo came today. Well 20 rounds down 
range and the Evo is making me happy. My hands are small but it fits well and
the hasp is closer then the loesch. The safety is a big plus on the Evo. My loesch has play in the safety and a long travel. The shot is very crisp and short. I'll keep my old loesch but the Evo seems to have set the mark up.


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

JUMPMAN said:


> Dont shoot the spots anymore...the last spot I shot was a screw off round with a 299 25X (vegas) 6 months ago....its 3D or bust...I will tell ya since going to the back tension the scores have went up, placed in the top three at every 3d Ive been too....:wink:
> 
> I'm wondering how this release will perform in the wind compared to a back tension (can you punch it off). Ive been known to let down 10 different times on one target....


if you pulled hard and fast..you would trigger this quick....or if you simply pulled into the wall....as soon as you let off the safety it would go

sounds to me your there man....i think you got game on right now.....


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

cav84 said:


> I have had the loesch for awhile, the Evo came today. Well 20 rounds down
> range and the Evo is making me happy. My hands are small but it fits well and
> the hasp is closer then the loesch. The safety is a big plus on the Evo. My loesch has play in the safety and a long travel. The shot is very crisp and short. I'll keep my old loesch but the Evo seems to have set the mark up.


there you go....from someone who has two similar...yet differnt releases....

thanks for the post and comparison....


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## Bob_Looney (Nov 17, 2003)

Here is my review. I shot a dozen shots out of it yesterday and thought it wasn't going to work for me. Then today, I have a 45 minute run time on the CNC so I've been trying this out. I got mad twice and put it away only to grab it again. 
Third time was a charm. Draw length has to be right. I ran home and lengthened mine 3 twists on the control cable (1 too many it seems). You have to set the hand the same too. You can't be out on the finger tips one time then deep into the knuckles the next cause you'll change the holding weight. Once I got those two things set I've been shooting 30's since. I haven't quite steadied down all the way cause I normally relax the shot off but they still hit the 10 ring. It aint pretty but I'm not complaining.
The release body seems to be made to mimick the old stan. Heavy on the index finger, not much pressure on the middle and ring finger. If you shoot the old 1/2 moon stan this will fit right in from what I've seen.
My regular release is a med super X so this release feels larger and way different at anchor.
If I had one suggestion it would be to put these guts in a med frame with the super X geometry for the trigger guys that are used to even tension on all 3 fingers at anchor. The med super X is by far the most comfortable release I've had in my hands in 30 years. 
Time to go shoot some more 10's


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Bob_Looney said:


> Here is my review. I shot a dozen shots out of it yesterday and thought it wasn't going to work for me. Then today, I have a 45 minute run time on the CNC so I've been trying this out. I got mad twice and put it away only to grab it again.
> Third time was a charm. Draw length has to be right. I ran home and lengthened mine 3 twists on the control cable (1 too many it seems). You have to set the hand the same too. You can't be out on the finger tips one time then deep into the knuckles the next cause you'll change the holding weight. Once I got those two things set I've been shooting 30's since. I haven't quite steadied down all the way cause I normally relax the shot off but they still hit the 10 ring. It aint pretty but I'm not complaining.
> The release body seems to be made to mimick the old stan. Heavy on the index finger, not much pressure on the middle and ring finger. If you shoot the old 1/2 moon stan this will fit right in from what I've seen.
> My regular release is a med super X so this release feels larger and way different at anchor.
> ...


excellant descriptions.....you are more technical than me.....i said from the get go...this is a very personal release.....meaning...you have to get down and dirty with it...your bow.....draw length.....and anchor point.....once you mesh them all....you will not find a better concept brought to reality....period


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## t8ter (Apr 7, 2003)

Wow sure glad I got mine ordered today.


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## Grey Eagle (May 23, 2002)

Well............ not being on the "A" list........ I had to settle for digging out my Loesch release today. Hadn't shot it in about 6 months. The principle works great....... though I'm betting that the Carter is an easier release to shoot. Meaning that I think the idea of letting off the safety, as oppossed to pushing it in, will be easier to master.

Hopefully when Jerry gets done filling orders south of the 49th, I'll get my mitts on one


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Shot mine today, and learned a lot quickly.

First....do NOT try to pull back your bow using the same method you do with your Thumb Trigger release...you know....with the thumb OFF the trigger...We all learned with trigger releases the "*DNTTFT*"..or Do Not Touch The Frickin' Trigger on the way back. :tongue:  

Second. OBT hit it right on the head, you gotta get down and personal with it, and DO NOT LET UP once you hit anchor...just like with any back tension release...or you WILL struggle with this one too...the only difference is that it won't fire when you try to "wrist it" or do some dumb stuff to get it to go...it just won't go. The draw length has got to be there, and you need to make sure you draw the bow back and anchor the same....hand position isn't as critical, but how far into the stops you pull IS CRITICAL...to light and you are gonna pull your guts out...too hard into the stops, and it will fire quicker than you want it to, but fire it will.

At least you don't have to put the thumb in the same place on the release each time and rotate the release and all that fancy stuff....set things and get with the program.

Third..Don't CREEP forward....cuz if you hit the "front" of the valley..it WILL fire (obviously).

Fourth...don't think for a minute you can "outsmart" this release and set it so that when you let up on the safety it will fire...you will end up with your groups looking like you sprayed the target with 00 buckshot at long range! You will NOT group well if you try to set it too light!

However, I'm telling you, it is a short learning curve with it (other than dumb ole me drew ONE shot back and didn't engage the safety...didn't get very far drawn before the arrow went off, hahahaha). Put that site on the dot, keep the back tension running, drop off the safety, and PULL...it WILL fire cleanly.

People are gonna love this release once they get it set with their particular setup.

For SAFETY SAKE, however, always ask someone that wants to try it what their HOLDING WEIGHT IS, for obvious reasons.

Carter has themselves a real winner here! Thanks Jerry & Forrest.

field14:darkbeer: :darkbeer:


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## JoBob (May 24, 2005)

Doc said:


> JoBob, this will fit those mitts of yours unless you can actually palm a Yugo. Measure the diameter of your ring finger and we'll see if it will fit....my $ says it does.



Oh great!! Now where am I gonna find a Yugo to see if it fits :wink: 

My ring finger is about 1" across where you would wear a ring, about 15/16" between the first and second knuckle.
Bird finger goes about 1 1/8" above the second knuckle and about 1 1/16" between the first and second knuckle.
Index finger is about right between the other two :wink:


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Seems like the hole in the release is slightly smaller than a Just Cuz, but larger than the Fits-Me...if that helps any?

A little large for my small hands, but not a problem to engage it correctly at all. SUPER LARGE hands....well it might be tight.

field14:wink:


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## HotLZ (Jan 20, 2003)

Posted this on the thread in the manuf. forum, but I'll put it here too.

I've shot a red one for a few days now. A few thoughts:

The release feels very comfortable. No problems there.

I had to peg the adjustment screw all the way down for it not to go off when I took the safety off. Not a big deal, but it makes the release very hard to cock that way, and it feels rough when I cock it. I can't use it at all on my 
3d bow unless I get a heavier spring put in it. According to the included sheet, you will need the heavier spring if you hold more than 20 lbs. It comes preset for about 16 lbs.

You have to be pulling into the wall the exact same every time, or the timing of the shot will get screwed up, or worse, it will go off when you take the safety off if you're pulling into the wall too hard. Not into the wall hard enough, and you really have to pull, and my shot timing gets screwed up and I start to break down on the shot. I haven't got this exactly nailed down yet, but I'm working on it.

Overall, it has potential. A better way to do it IMO would be rather than have a set weight that it goes off at, have it take say two more pounds of pull from when you take the safety off. Then the wall factor wouldn't be much of an issue, and you could let others shoot the release, or use it with another bow if you wanted to.


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## Grey Eagle (May 23, 2002)

HotLZ said:


> Overall, it has potential. A better way to do it IMO would be rather than have a set weight that it goes off at, have it take say two more pounds of pull from when you take the safety off. Then the wall factor wouldn't be much of an issue, and you could let others shoot the release, or use it with another bow if you wanted to.


One of the benefits of a release of this nature is that it trains you to be more consistent with your form.... and thus your holding weight.

I cannot see how any manufacturer could build in a variance in holding weight as you suggest.

Give the release a chance......... you'll end up being a better archer for it.


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Therein lies the main problem with the hard wall setups of today...

I found out, thru experimentation, that you CAN EASILY vary your drawlength by at least 1/4" with a hard cam bow! Totally dependent upon just how hard you come into the stops...just hitting them or HARD into them...and vary 1/4" on drawlength you will do!

Being an old recurve shooter and then a wheelie bow shooter, I've pretty well learned back tension and how to control draw length. But I never shot by "feel" alone...Clicker on the recurves, and just to the back of the valley (with the use of draw tapes on the cables) with my wheelie bows...and it took care of it.

However, MOST of the shooters that started within the past 10 years have little to ZERO experience with the "valley" bows or the round wheels...so I think these people, having not shot a long time with anything but the HARD CAMS are at an advantage, since that is what they learned with...they deal with it better, cuz they don't know any better.

What has worked for me, after just recently going back to it is the placement of draw tapes back onto my cables so that I can re-develop the muscle memory of HOW FAR TO DRAW THE BOW into those stops....It takes a glance at the tapes after you get them set right, to match them up as you anchor, but the muscle memory comes quickly that way.

For those that "think" they are drawing the same exact place every time...have another look...you might well be totally surprised that you ARE NOT drawing EXACTLY to the same place in those stops every time you anchor.... Put those tapes on your cables and check yourself out...you are going to be surprised!

The Carter Evolution will let you know this really, really quickly....even better than the "normal" back tension release will. Come in soft...you will struggle to get it to fire...come in too hard (1/4" longer), and it will fire too fast. This is going to make you pull into those stops the same every time, or you will NOT get a good shooting rhythm going. 

You cannot CHEAT this release like you can a thumb trigger, and just "touch off" or "wrist off" the shot...the release doesn't work that way.

If you are set too long on your drawlength...you will find out quickly with this release, cuz you won't get the BT you need to increase the holding weight enough to fire the release. If you lighten up the "holding weight requirement", then it will fire when you let off the safety...which forces a collapsed shot.

THIS release WILL make you shoot consistently as far as getting the draw into the stops the same everytime, or at least MUCH CLOSER than what you are doing with your thumb trigger or pinky trigger releases, or first finger releases.

field14:wink: :wink:


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## SPECTRE (Aug 20, 2003)

field14 said:


> Therein lies the main problem with the hard wall setups of today...
> 
> I found out, thru experimentation, that you CAN EASILY vary your drawlength by at least 1/4" with a hard cam bow! Totally dependent upon just how hard you come into the stops...just hitting them or HARD into them...and vary 1/4" on drawlength you will do!


I think that depends a lot on limb configuration. I can't even get close to an extra 1/4" out of my constitution............ but my lack of horizontal mass might have some effect on that...........  

But I do agree that this release is the perfect "back tension" release. You can't cheat it with any semblance of accuracy...........


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## tbailey (Feb 25, 2004)

field14 said:


> What has worked for me, after just recently going back to it is the placement of draw tapes back onto my cables so that I can re-develop the muscle memory of HOW FAR TO DRAW THE BOW into those stops....It takes a glance at the tapes after you get them set right, to match them up as you anchor, but the muscle memory comes quickly that way.


field,

I don't mean to stray from the release topic, but what type of tape works best on the cables? White electrical tape? I've been meaning to give that little trick a try. :tongue:


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## ishootbear (Jan 12, 2006)

onebowtie said:


> :cocktail: sit back....relax...... and enjoy the ride



What distance???????


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

tbailey said:


> field,
> 
> I don't mean to stray from the release topic, but what type of tape works best on the cables? White electrical tape? I've been meaning to give that little trick a try. :tongue:


Electrical tape slips too much and you can't get it to stay put. 

Masking tape, about 1/8" wide and about three layers worth around the cables...you can either match them up side by side, or top edge to bottom edge (more accurate), or use 3 tapes,with two of them on one cable and the third on the other...then pull the odd one in between the other two for the "match". It ain't absolutely perfect, but is only there for muscle memory development...you'll be surprised at how much better you get at draw length control...ESPECIALLY outdoors on the uphill and downhill.

I get them set,and then glue them down on the cable with fletch tite glue...haven't had them move once I've done that.

field14:tongue:


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## tbailey (Feb 25, 2004)

Thanks field. You're a gentleman and a scholar!


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## HotLZ (Jan 20, 2003)

Grey Eagle said:


> I cannot see how any manufacturer could build in a variance in holding weight as you suggest.


HHA already has, so I'm told. You simply draw back, take the safety off at anchor, and regardless of poundage, it will fire at one pound heavier than what the poundage was at when the safety was disengaged. 

I haven't shot one to verify that's the way it works, but that's what I've been told. IMO that's the best way to implement the whole idea, but they need to make the weight adjustable to more than 1 pound to get the release to fire.

That way you could use the release with different setups without having to readjust the weight.


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## DarrinM (May 21, 2002)

tbailey said:


> field,
> 
> I don't mean to stray from the release topic, but what type of tape works best on the cables? White electrical tape? I've been meaning to give that little trick a try. :tongue:



Use the white elec tape or I have even tied a 3 to 5 knot nock point to use as references.....

I used to draw the bow back and then have a friend mark the point with white out or a silver sharpie. I then tie my mini nok sets and slide them up and down until they are where I like them at full draw.... When set a drop of BriteSite glue holds them fast....


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

HotLZ said:


> HHA already has, so I'm told. You simply draw back, take the safety off at anchor, and regardless of poundage, it will fire at one pound heavier than what the poundage was at when the safety was disengaged.
> 
> I haven't shot one to verify that's the way it works, but that's what I've been told. IMO that's the best way to implement the whole idea, but they need to make the weight adjustable to more than 1 pound to get the release to fire.
> 
> That way you could use the release with different setups without having to readjust the weight.


if this concept works for HHA...than it should be a good release to do exactly as you state...take from one setup to another.....thats a pro for the release

however...for me...the carter has done what nothing or anyone else could do for me...make me release the difference between a "normal-good shot execution" and one that varys....

many good releases...sounds like this concept will "evolve" into things even bigger down the road....


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## BIG ARCHERY NUT (Oct 24, 2003)

> Originally Posted by field14
> Electrical tape slips too much and you can't get it to stay put.
> 
> Masking tape, about 1/8" wide and about three layers worth around the cables...you can either match them up side by side, or top edge to bottom edge (more accurate), or use 3 tapes,with two of them on one cable and the third on the other...then pull the odd one in between the other two for the "match". It ain't absolutely perfect, but is only there for muscle memory development...you'll be surprised at how much better you get at draw length control...ESPECIALLY outdoors on the uphill and downhill.
> ...


After reading about the draw marks I had to check your profile. I figured we had to be close in age. I did the same with the tape. After I had the marks set I used white paint but back then it was on steel cables. The round wheeled bows had no wall. I use to use the block type draw stops and would put two sets on to create a wall.

I use duct tape in 1/8" strips just to hold my kisser button in place. Works great. Sticks right down into the string.

As far as varying the draw, maybe some bows you can't draw a 1/4" more but for this release I would agree what more of an accurate set-up/starting point for it.

Good suggestion field14. As soon as I get one I'm trying that trick.

Yes that's right onebowtie you got me dreaming of my own. I have an appointment tomorrow with my doc to make sure the ticker can take it.:banana:


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## boojo35 (Jul 16, 2005)

Stop this madness!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't wan't this stress that is caused by success.............I want to flush the toilet early and often in tourneys................I am there for the relaxation and good times............(plugging my ears) nah nah nah nah nah, I cant hear you..............


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

People with perfect form and consistency MIGHT be able to "get by" with the variances they have in how far into the stops they are drawing...but in my particular case, I'm not THAT good...and in my case, I KNOW for a fact that I WAS varying as much as 1/4"...and wondering why the "tale of the tape" was only marginal (creep tuning) and sometimes I could nail it down, and then a day later, I couldn't.

So, I went way back into my old bag of tricks and put the tapes back on, and immediately noticed the difference when I paid close attention to the tapes and quit trying to shoot totally on "feel" alone. The muscle memory is coming along really well...and before long, it will be an automatic thing that will only need close attention on the uphill and downhill courses/shots. Sure makes setting the scapula a LOT EASIER too...and with the Evolution release...setting the scapula correctly CAN fire the release if you haven't quite got it set right, which is a little premature for a good solidly executed shot.

Just an old man's way of trying to make sure I get more consistent is all. It might not work for everyone, and many might not NEED it at all...but it sure doesn't hurt to check yourself out and see if you ARE as good at it as you mightTHINK you are...nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Some Pros will read this and laugh their butts off as me being "old fashioned" and say things like "you and your old and archaic methods".... but doggone it, they WORK FOR ME, and that is all that really counts.:tongue: :wink: 

field14


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## Ivorytooth (Jan 22, 2004)

field14 said:


> People with perfect form and consistency MIGHT be able to "get by" with the variances they have in how far into the stops they are drawing...but in my particular case, I'm not THAT good...and in my case, I KNOW for a fact that I WAS varying as much as 1/4"...and wondering why the "tale of the tape" was only marginal (creep tuning) and sometimes I could nail it down, and then a day later, I couldn't.
> 
> So, I went way back into my old bag of tricks and put the tapes back on, and immediately noticed the difference when I paid close attention to the tapes and quit trying to shoot totally on "feel" alone. The muscle memory is coming along really well...and before long, it will be an automatic thing that will only need close attention on the uphill and downhill courses/shots. Sure makes setting the scapula a LOT EASIER too...and with the Evolution release...setting the scapula correctly CAN fire the release if you haven't quite got it set right, which is a little premature for a good solidly executed shot.
> 
> ...


I think that is why alot of shooters prefer the hard wall. It is harder to climb of the valley and shoot on the wall in different spots and different holding weights with today's harder walled bows. I still try to shoot in the middle of the valley and I usually am pretty good at it. With todays short valleys, creeping for me can be an issue, but never shooting off the wall. My bad shoots are shot on the slope more than anything. I relax to much sometimes and the creep happens. If I don't have the back set when I relax my arms etc, I will creep.


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Ivorytooth,
There. You have the issue I'm relating to for shooting the Evolution! If you creep too far...the release is going to fire. If you creep a little bit, then you will most likely NEVER get it to fire; Therefore, you need to learn, and learn you will in a hurry, to get to the SAME SPOT as closely as possible on the wall EVERYTIME...and your rhythm and shot consistency with this release will be there.

So it is clear that you are one that those tapes would help out a lot! It doesn't involve spending more money (tape is cheap..1/8" wide X 3" long will more than do the job), but does involve some TIME and PRACTICE drawing to the tapes, once set, the same everytime. Our muscles learn a "memory" quickly however, and in no time, you'll hardly need to watch them closely...excepting uphill and downhill shooting....assuming you have the CORRECT DRAWLENGTH that allows you to get it into your BACK MUSCLES and not be drawing with your arms and hands...hahaha.

This consistency, however doesn't come from HAND POSITION, or WRISTING IT, or SQUEEZING the RELEASE...it comes from BACK TENSION and actually increasing the holding weight to the point the release is set for...and THAT produces a STRONG SHOT and a true SURPRISE release.

field14


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## tbailey (Feb 25, 2004)

field14 said:


> So it is clear that you are one that those tapes would help out a lot! It doesn't involve spending more money (tape is cheap..1/8" wide X 3" long will more than do the job), but does involve some TIME and PRACTICE drawing to the tapes, once set, the same everytime. Our muscles learn a "memory" quickly however, and in no time, you'll hardly need to watch them closely...excepting uphill and downhill shooting....assuming you have the CORRECT DRAWLENGTH that allows you to get it into your BACK MUSCLES and not be drawing with your arms and hands...hahaha.
> 
> field14


I know what I'm going to be using to place mine on with the first time. :wink:


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## Ivorytooth (Jan 22, 2004)

field14 said:


> Ivorytooth,
> There. You have the issue I'm relating to for shooting the Evolution! If you creep too far...the release is going to fire. If you creep a little bit, then you will most likely NEVER get it to fire; Therefore, you need to learn, and learn you will in a hurry, to get to the SAME SPOT as closely as possible on the wall EVERYTIME...and your rhythm and shot consistency with this release will be there.
> 
> So it is clear that you are one that those tapes would help out a lot! It doesn't involve spending more money (tape is cheap..1/8" wide X 3" long will more than do the job), but does involve some TIME and PRACTICE drawing to the tapes, once set, the same everytime. Our muscles learn a "memory" quickly however, and in no time, you'll hardly need to watch them closely...excepting uphill and downhill shooting....assuming you have the CORRECT DRAWLENGTH that allows you to get it into your BACK MUSCLES and not be drawing with your arms and hands...hahaha.
> ...


Field, I didn't have any issues with using this release. 

My issue is relaxing my arms before I set my back. That is how I creep. It isn't the draw length thingy. I just forget to set my back to hold the weight. 

I had this release firing no prob.


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Ivortytooth,
Great for you...just get it into your shot sequence to set your back first, and it will fire with even LESS of a problem AND the creep will be eliminated to boot...

But if you creeping, then you must be having to try to "restart" the back tension to recover the loss...and that can be very counterproductive and unsettle the site picture?

You might find that once you set the back muscles right away, you might have to set the release a bit stronger?

field14


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## Ivorytooth (Jan 22, 2004)

field14 said:


> Ivortytooth,
> Great for you...just get it into your shot sequence to set your back first, and it will fire with even LESS of a problem AND the creep will be eliminated to boot...
> 
> But if you creeping, then you must be having to try to "restart" the back tension to recover the loss...and that can be very counterproductive and unsettle the site picture?
> ...



I normally do it right. It hasn't been an issue since I have set up my bows with the proper draw length. I haven't been shooting alot and been leaving it out of my shot sequence. I have only shot the shoot in Australia and my state field since the first of June. I haven't touched a bow other than that so far this summer.

I just need to practice. It isn't a major concern.



> But if you creeping, then you must be having to try to "restart" the back tension to recover the loss...and that can be very counterproductive and unsettle the site picture?


Yeah. LOL! That is when I have to let down. The times I don't let down, that is where I dropped my points. If I don't let down, I get all out of whack form wise and anchor/peep wise. I lost a few points in Australia because of that and also in Redding. I need to shoot more to keep it engrained in my sequence. Probably cost me a 553 on my second field round in Australia. I ended up with a 549.


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## YankeeRebel (Dec 30, 2005)

Ok where can I get one of these Carter Evolutions? And what is the usual price? $150 shipped? Somebody help me out here. Thanx.:darkbeer:


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## Dado (Aug 1, 2004)

My dealer, michigander from AT, just PMed me that he got it and that my EVOLUTION will be on its way today!!!


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## r302 (Apr 5, 2004)

*I am so glad!*

I just bought a Carter Four for about $ 180.00 and cannot afford another release right now.

I was relieved to hear Carter has not started to make the Evolution for smaller hands yet.

By the time Carter has releases for smaller hands like mine, maybe I can afford a Evolution.


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## XSPLITTER (Apr 27, 2005)

what up with so called evolution doesn't fit small hands i have like a 6 and a half ring finger size and mine fits me great how small can these peoples hands be?


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## cgchris99 (Apr 10, 2003)

> Ok where can I get one of these Carter Evolutions? And what is the usual price? $150 shipped? Somebody help me out here. Thanx.


We should have our next shipment in a couple weeks. If you want one get your order in now. We sold our entire first shipment before they arrived and customers already have orders in for the next batch. Our price is $155 plus shipping.


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## IBDBOSS (Jul 27, 2004)

Is your price for the Evolution +? And can you specify a certain color? What colors do they come in?


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2007)

had one..but my best friend liked it.. now he has it.. ole lady has one... and now I have another...


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## Corsair (Nov 21, 2005)

I guess this is going to sound sacreligious but I bought a Carter Evolution and have been using it quite a bit and frankly I don't see what all the excitement is about. My bow has a hard wall and I pull to this, realease the safety and keep pulling and off it goes and that's it. The arrow goes where I aim it. 

I also shoot a Tru Ball Chappy Boss with thumb trigger. I simply pull to the wall, hold into it hard and simply squeeze my right hand and it triggers the release and the arrow goes where I aim it again. I just find the Chappy Boss is a whole lot less hassle so I won't be using the Carter as my main release.

What I WILL be using it for is windy days. What I have done is set the release light and I just keep the safety on and pull hard into the back wall as per the Chappy Boss and to fire I simply release the safety and off it goes - as a "relax" release. Great for easing tension on windy days when the bow is blowing all over the place.

I'm sure Carter never meant it to be used like this but in this form, I find it really great - but it still won't replace the Chappy Boss.


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## Lee24 (Apr 19, 2006)

The Carter is a fantastic release. Hey OBT, can you still buy Ban roll-on??


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## IBDBOSS (Jul 27, 2004)

Where is everyone buying their releases? How much are you paying? And what colors do they come in?


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

*I got mine yesturday*

Already talk to several in my area having good success with it. Im using mine as a training tool as suggested by my coach Dean Pridgen.

Thanks to the folks at Carter keep them coming and make this in a four finger that feels like my target four.:wink: 
DB


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## cgchris99 (Apr 10, 2003)

IBDBOSS said:


> Is your price for the Evolution +? And can you specify a certain color? What colors do they come in?


Our Evolutions are the Plus edition. I know we have Blue in stock right now. If you need another color, give us a call at 815-877-1212


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## OneBowTie (Jun 14, 2002)

Lee24 said:


> The Carter is a fantastic release. Hey OBT, can you still buy Ban roll-on??


clarify......why do you ask:wink:


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## niloc_king (Jun 10, 2009)

they do make a mini size. i just got my own because there have been 10 year olds shooting incredible scores with these things so im gonna give it a try. but after 7 years of a finger release it is going to take some time.


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## frankensteel (Apr 5, 2006)

What's the difference between "built for an ape" and "doesn't fit"?
You may have insulted a few apes.


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## cloquet (Jan 12, 2004)

Ttt


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## madball13 (Oct 28, 2014)

Great release


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## mw31 (Apr 23, 2007)

Been a long time since I've seen an OBT thread. Didnt know what was going on at first.


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