# Adjusting Peep Rotation



## JAVI

Thought this might help a few folks...

Adjusting Peep Rotation
By 
Mike (Javi…) Cooper​
When installing a new string, I recommend shooting approximately 50 shots through the bow before installing the peep. After installing the peep, make a note of which way the peep is facing you will use this as your guide. Nock an arrow, point it safely at the target butt and shoot; notice that the peep has rotated from its earlier position. The string will creep and settle for the first few shots. Once the string has settled, you’ll notice the peep will be in exactly the same position after the shot. It could take as little as twenty shots or as many as a few hundred, depending on the quality of the manufacturing processes and the material used in making the string.

Once the string has settled you can tune the peep, make sure that it is set to the correct height and begin by nocking an arrow and drawing the bow slowly, watch how the peep moves as the string goes through the draw cycle. This is will tell you what to do with the peep. If your peep rotates from left to right, press the bow and twist the string a ½ twist in the same direction. I recommend that you twist from the bottom cam end. Now shoot the bow several times to settle the peep. If it still does not roll into the proper position, repeat the process. Always shoot the bow several times to settle the peep before checking for position. If the peep settles exactly opposite, then just flip the peep to face you. Relax the string in the press only enough to be able to get the peep out and turn it a half turn. Remember that each time the bow is in the press you must shoot the bow several times to settle the string. 

Occasionally the peep will settle just a little off no matter what you do. At this point any adjustment moves the peep too far; it is the time to flip strands. Relax the string again. Look carefully at the direction of the string twist. For example, if the normal twist of the string is clockwise, and your peep must move to the left a ¼ of a turn, take two strands from the top left side and flip them to the bottom right side. Then take two strands (make sure they aren’t the same two strands) from the bottom right side and flip them to the top left side. This will pull the peep over to the direction you want. If you want to move it the other way, just do the same steps in the opposite direction. Note: more strands will mean more movement. 

Shoot the bow to re-settle the string and repeat as necessary… If you have the patience this will work…


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## andy_smaga

Thanks Javi :thumbs_up


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## ffwildcat

awesome post

belongs in the tech tip library..........

thanks javi.


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## harleyryder

Good advice javi , thank you


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## ISAA_Archer

great post will be very useful


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## 2thepoint

great post.....thanks for sharing.


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## Jose Boudreaux

will this work on McPherson and Hoyt bows?????


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## archery1

I fall into the "occasionally no matter what you do...." group. I'm not following the strand thing, can you re word that for me?

Thanks


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## ssssssnake

Seems like you lost them so let me try to assist you in the "strand thing". Lets assume that you want the peep to move jus a tad toward the right as you look at the bow from the rear. (The way you see it when you shoot it.) First press the bow thus taking the pressure off the string. Using something smooth and blunt (Such as the end of the lever part of a pair of fingernail clips....they do make a tool for this but you nor I probably have one  ) and segregate one single strand of the string on the right of the peep and move it across the FRONT of the peep placing it on the left. Then take another string from the left and move it across the BACK of the peep and place it on the right side. (Be careful not to take the string that you just moved to that side.) Take the bow out of the press and shoot it a few times then look at it closly to see if you moved it enough. If not, repeat the process. If the peep is even further off than it was to begin with you are going the wrong way sooooo reverse the process and start over.

What you are doing is walking your peep one strand at a time through the string. It ain't quick but it can be used to fine tune the peep.

Good luck

SSSSSSSsssssssssnake and the stringwalker


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## Jose Boudreaux

> SSSSSSSsssssssssnake and the stringwalker


your sigs at the end of each post has this idiot laughing like crazy....man that is some good stuff.....JB


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## PLASTIC PAUL

Snake, very nice clarification, i have ha dto do this frequently in the past.

Luckily not on my current string (got lucky)


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## Popapi

AWESOME thank you Sir!!! Gone


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## Swychbak

thanks for the advice :thumbs_up


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## P.L. Archery

JAVI,!!!

What did you post this for? Now poeple won't pay me to do that for them anymore. AARRGGHH

LOL


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## WilliamsTD

Jaiv

Thanks for the information, this is going in my bow tuning folder.


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## mlbright

Javi: Just one question that might help someone doing this for the first time, do you have to serve the peep in each time after making the twist adjustments and the strand movements? Can you shoot the bow to settle it in and check the adjustments you just made without without serving in the peep. Will the peep stay in place?


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## karday

mlbright, if you tie the half hitch knot (10 rings)above and below the peep you can slide them away from the peep when removing and towards the peep when shooting in. Once the peep is settled and stable then you can serve it in place.


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## mlbright

Thanks for the info Karday.


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## Deezlin

Great posting Javi!!!!!!!!


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## thndrr

great post Mike ! :thumbs_up


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## Jose Boudreaux

> If you have the patience this will work…


well I'm screwed.....


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## JAVI

Jose Boudreaux said:


> well I'm screwed.....


I know you have no patience..... I thought you didn't use a peep....


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## Jose Boudreaux

JAVI said:


> I know you have no patience..... I thought you didn't use a peep....


I don't until my sight runs of windage due to the no-peep bracket and the other bracket for LP light....

sad day in the Jose household...I got a bloody peep on my hunting bow  

I am about to shoot to set it in...then walk some strands.....should be done by 5 in the morning.....

moron + no patience= all nighter for a peep

I really lucked out on that Protec earlier this year cause man I had that sucker set in no time...


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## Jose Boudreaux

just about got it

that string walking is cooler than moon walking...

when it comes to something new I'm like a glue sniffer in b/n bottles  

no wonder my marriage lasted 20 months.....


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## karday

*Peep String walking*

Javi:

I have never had much luck with this individual strand roulette to tune a peep. I was holding class at the club on Wednesday and was talking with some members about this peep install thing. One of th eold timers said he makes his strings and winds half one direction and the other half the other direction and makes sure to give them their own space on the string post. He then marks the exact middle of the strand bundle with pape, wood etc. Finishes the string and installs it. Once he is ready to install the peep he draws the bow to indicate the exact degree and direction the paper rotates. Installs the peep and draws to check. Does the shoot in and if it needs adjuting then does it. Not a lot different but he too strives to get the peep indicator positioned into 90 degree rotation positions so 1/2 turn of the string loop at the cam brings it into alignment. Since reversing the windings he experiences much less fiddling to get the correct peep alignment. Now his experience has been that doing the reverse wind in the manufacturer of the string greatly reduces peep rotation to begin with. The one ***** in his success is that he shoots fingers and admits he has more control over the peep alignment than with a release. I am going to try this on my next string and see if it reduces this iterative peep tuning effort. ANy thoughts?


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## jim p

If you are going to shoot the bow the peep needs to be served in. There have been cases of the peep coming out of the string and this could damage your eye. I use the half hitchs above and below the peep and then tie the tru peep in with a couple of wraps of dental floss. When you need to reposition the string on the peep just cut the dental floss and you are in business. I don't like to slide the half hitches on the string because often just moving the half hitches will affect the position of the peep.


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## Shooters Edge

*I don't think so....*

Well, rule number 1, never move a strand on string. Put the peep in the center of the string and leave it alone. Any adjustment is always accomplished by taking the string off the peg and putting one twist in or out, only one, not a half. For one cams make sure to do both sides of the strings the same amount and direction, you may have to flip the peep over once or twice until it settles down....Now wasn't that easy.


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## JAVI

Shooters Edge said:


> Well, rule number 1, never move a strand on string. Put the peep in the center of the string and leave it alone. Any adjustment is always accomplished by taking the string off the peg and putting one twist in or out, only one, not a half. For one cams make sure to do both sides of the strings the same amount and direction, you may have to flip the peep over once or twice until it settles down....Now wasn't that easy.


Before you become # 24

Just let me say… thanks for setting me and several thousand others straight. 

I bow to your obviously greater knowledge of all things archery….. 

By the way for $27.00 you can download a copy of the ASTM/ATA/AMO standards for measuring strings.... and trust me you need to read them....

*CLICK*


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## MikeK

After following Javi's expert recommendation to shoot a new bowstring at least fifty times before installing a peepsight, with exceptionally good luck it is possible to situate the peep and have it seat perfectly perpendicular to your line of vision without any adjustments. And with a well made string it will stay that way -- until you serve it in, which almost always will misalign it a few degrees.

With reasonably good luck, a few twists of the bowstring will correct that slight but annoying deviation. And if twisting doesn't do it, swapping strands from one side of the peep to the other (according to Ssssnake's instructions) is the way to make a fine adjustment. And with a little bit of luck the peep will align with just a few tries.

By _align_ I mean perfectly perpendicular alignment, which is absolutely necessary with a 1/16" peepsight aperture. (A few degrees of misalignment is tolerable with a larger aperture.) But I have never been able to achieve perfect peepsight alignment by twisting a bowstring and swapping strands. I was able to come close, but serving the peep (properly) always knocked it right off. 

I believe patience is a virtue, and that sufficient patience will eventually yield the desired result. But I am pushing seventy and don't have too much time left, so I've opted for the following shortcut alternative.










Because it is so tiny, this device takes a bit of patience to install and adjust (be sure to use a sharp miniature Philips screwdriver). But once it's on it forces the peepsight into perfectly perpendicular alignment every time an arrow is nocked. 

I do not recommend using it to align major deviations (45 degrees or more) because of the torque it will impart to the bowstring. These major misalignments are easily corrected by experimentally twisting the string and swapping strands. But it works admirably to eliminate those stubborn minor misalignments at the final stage -- especially those which occur after serving the peep. 

The T.R.U. Speed-Nok is available from Lancaster or Cabela's for ten bucks.


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## lunghit

Javi just wanted to say thanks. For the first time I had a peep that just would not settle straight. I tried twisting and untwisting from the top and bottom peg and the peep would just always settle turned to the right. I had my draw lenght set exact and did not want to do any more twisting so I tried the flip strands trick. At first I flipped two on each side and it helped a lot. I shot and it moved to the right a very little so I pressed the bow and moved one more on each side and it is finally straight. Thanks again:thumbs_up


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## mdewitt71

A Bump for some great info.


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## mntngrown

*solo cam*

Maybe it's in here and I missed it, but what do you do with solo cams. Twist both ends of the string on the bottom cam in the same direction the peep is rotating as you slowly draw it back and watch it rotate? Just twist the shelf side post, or what. Sorry if I'm dense on this one.


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## JAVI

mntngrown said:


> Maybe it's in here and I missed it, but what do you do with solo cams. Twist both ends of the string on the bottom cam in the same direction the peep is rotating as you slowly draw it back and watch it rotate? Just twist the shelf side post, or what. Sorry if I'm dense on this one.


Stop and think....

From the peep to the idler and around to the cam is the top of the string... The bottom is from the peep to the cam.... 

Often times if you have put a bunch of twists in the string on a single cam it is best to remove the peep and (first mark the center of the string with a small piece of serving material) then shoot the bow several times until the loop stops turning... then put the peep back... The split where the peep is will often stop the twists in the string from evening out....


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## mntngrown

*solo*

OK, I think I get it. It's one continuous string supported by an idler so you don't have to take it off both posts as twisting one end will suffice, and shooting will even out the twists along the full length. It will even out quicker if you leave the peep out after adding twists and shoot it a few times?


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## mdewitt71

OK, Javi- another question:
2 color strings, do they need to be seperated by colors for the peep?

I got a set of 2 color strings and I can not get the peep NOT to rotate from left to right. 
I shuffled a three strands from one side to the other, put twists in and took twists out of but still a 20 degree turn from static to full draw every time. 

Is this just inferior string making, it came from a guy making em at home (I won't name names cause it could just be me)?


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## tclow

thanks.


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## mntngrown

*Thanks Javi!*

I have success! The peep is now settled and pulling straight back without rotation. It was a used bow that I put my cam etc on so it didn't take long. You are kind to donate your time.


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## JAVI

mdewitt71 said:


> OK, Javi- another question:
> 2 color strings, do they need to be seperated by colors for the peep?
> 
> I got a set of 2 color strings and I can not get the peep NOT to rotate from left to right.
> I shuffled a three strands from one side to the other, put twists in and took twists out of but still a 20 degree turn from static to full draw every time.
> 
> Is this just inferior string making, it came from a guy making em at home (I won't name names cause it could just be me)?


Probably the center serving...


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## r2t2

If one uses a Loop it be adjusted to consistantly alighn the peep. 

RT


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## MikeK

ssssssnake said:


> Seems like you lost them so let me try to assist you in the "strand thing". Lets assume that you want the peep to move jus a tad toward the right as you look at the bow from the rear. (The way you see it when you shoot it.) First press the bow thus taking the pressure off the string. Using something smooth and blunt (Such as the end of the lever part of a pair of fingernail clips....they do make a tool for this but you nor I probably have one  ) and segregate one single strand of the string on the right of the peep and move it across the FRONT of the peep placing it on the left. Then take another string from the left and move it across the BACK of the peep and place it on the right side. (Be careful not to take the string that you just moved to that side.) Take the bow out of the press and shoot it a few times then look at it closly to see if you moved it enough. If not, repeat the process. If the peep is even further off than it was to begin with you are going the wrong way sooooo reverse the process and start over.
> 
> What you are doing is walking your peep one strand at a time through the string. It ain't quick but it can be used to fine tune the peep.
> 
> Good luck
> 
> SSSSSSSsssssssssnake and the stringwalker


This explanation is about as clear as it gets. But of the many times I've tried it this way it has only worked twice -- but never perfectly. So now I eliminate major misalignments by half-twists and either use a D-loop to take up the remaining minor misalignment or install a T.R.U. Speed-Nok. (I really hate the tedious task of struggling with a peepsight that doesn't want to align.)


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## kzz1king

How do you keep the d loop from having an effect on rotation while seeting the peep? How do I know if thed loop is bringing it in line or my twisting, I want to get it as close as possible and use the d loop to fine tune. Hope I am making sense,hard to explain.
Wayne


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## BowmanJay

if your D loop is dictating where the peep is winding up your D loop is tied wrongly. But in all actuallity it wont really. Your D loop should be in-line with the arrow shaft before the bow is drawn...


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## jhesse

What happens if one side of the peep has more string than the other side?


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## kzz1king

So how do you make the string loop not effect the peep position? It grips the string so it does effect rotation. What am i missing?


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## Tracker12

TTT
This is a great thread with invaluable information. I had trouble with my peep after tuning the bow. With the info from JAVI I was able to correct the problem in one attempt. Thanks to all that contributed.


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## pyroarch57

Here`s how i do it on my U`tec`s. After installing the peep i put a screwdriver through the top loop and pull hard, rotating the driver as necessary to get the peep aligned straight as possible - then carefully feed the top of the string around the cam onto the peg.
Usually it settles into the right position, if it doesn`t then all i do is to pull the loop back off the peg and rotate it 180 degrees without removing the string from the cam and drop back on. It always works fine.


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## rembrandt

This is one problem I'm having now with my Slayer. It is aggravating to have to adjust it after every shot and your not really sure it will be right till you draw it back. I've only shot mine about 10 times and I need to give it a workout before losing my patience with it. Eventually it will work and I need to dedicate a few days to let it settle down.


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## rich-allen

*Peep Rotation*

When I bought my Dren the dealer installed a G5 peep sight. The rotation problem started after I fired the bow 30 or so times.
Come to find out, the zebra strings aren't made for sights without tubing. Since I hate tube style sights I installed winners choice strings, fired the bow 30 times into a hay bail then installed the G5 peep.

I tied the sight to the string using dental floss and I've had no problems since.


Rich


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## Hoyt Smoke 1976

Help me out here guys,The part that I don't understand is this,
Occasionally the peep will settle just a little off no matter what you do. At this point any adjustment moves the peep too far; it is the time to flip strands. Relax the string again. Look carefully at the direction of the string twist. For example, if the normal twist of the string is clockwise, and your peep must move to the left a ¼ of a turn, take two strands from the top left side and flip them to the bottom right side. Then take two strands (make sure they aren’t the same two strands) from the bottom right side and flip them to the top left side. This will pull the peep over to the direction you want. If you want to move it the other way, just do the same steps in the opposite direction. Note: more strands will mean more movement. The way I understand this is,take 2 strands from the left and move them on the right?
I don't get the part where it says top left and bottom right,when the strands are divided in half on each side of the peep.


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## Dio

I'm so confused and starting to get a headache


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## polarbear06

JAVI said:


> Probably the center serving...



Can you explain how the center serving can effect peep rotation. Thanks in advance.


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## LBLDOG

I'm dealing with this same problem ony new Fred Bear.I'm still thinking on going back to the tube


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## Haggy50

Ttt


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## polarbear06

ttt


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## nuts&bolts

polarbear06 said:


> Can you explain how the center serving can effect peep rotation. Thanks in advance.


Hello polarbear06:

I have nowhere near the knowledge of JAVI,
but I will do my best.

A bowstring is basicaly a series of loops, really long loops.

Let's say we have a 22 strand bowstring.
Well, what we are really saying
is we have 11 loops of bowstring materials,
and the left side has 11 strands
and the right side has 11 strands,
and when we twist up the entire bundle,
we get a 22 strand bowstring.

Now,
we start spinning the serving tool
and make the end serving on top...

(we just locked in a particular amount of twist ENERGY...in the top end serving).


Now,
we start spinning the serving tool
and make the end serving on bottom...

(we just lock in a different amount of TWIST ENERGY...in the bottom end serving).

The difference will be small, but there is a difference in TWIST ENERGY.


Now,
we start spinning the serving tool
and make the center serving

(we just locked in another amount of TWIST ENERGY...in the middle serving).



When the bow is at rest,
the bowstring is under extreme tension....really tight.


When the bow is at full draw,
the cables take MOST of the tension,
and the bowstring tension is actually pretty lightweight...

meaning the bowstring is pretty RELAXED when the bow is at full draw.


So,
if the peep sight is pointing STRAIGHT AHEAD,
when the bow is at rest
and the bowstring is super duper tight....

and

if the peep sight is pointing NOT STRAIGHT AHEAD,
when the bow is at full draw,
and the bowstring is pretty relaxed....

what does this mean?

This just means that the bowstring is OUT OF BALANCE,
and we need to get the bowstring INTO BALANCE...

which means,
whatever direction the peep sight is pointing,
when the bow is at rest (bowstring is super duper tight)

then

the peep sight will still be pointing the SAME DIRECTION,
when the bow is at full draw (bowstring is pretty relaxed).


So,
what usually happens is folks spend a lot of money
on a custom bowstring,
and then they tie in the peep sight
(probably changed the bowstring TWIST ENERGY balance again)...

and then,
they tie in a short length of serving near their string suppressor
(probably changed the bowstring TWIST ENERGY balance again)...

and then they wonder why the peep sight moves.



So,
I just did this this morning.


Peep sight looking ONE WAY when the bow was at rest,
and
peep sight looking ANOTHER WAY when the bow was at full draw...

namely,
the dreaded peep sight moving from start to finish of the bow draw cycle.


Basically,
this means the TWIST ENERGY above the CENTER SERVING
does not match the TWIST ENERGY below the CENTER SERVING.


Cuz the center serving is twisted tight,
it locks in the twists under the center serving
and the TWIST pressure expands out the top of the center serving
and
the TWIST pressure also expands out the bottom of the center serving.


Soooooo,
we have to twist the bottom end loop
to match the TWIST pressure coming out the bottom of the center serving.


Only two choices,
when twisting the bottom end loop.


1_ ADD twists to the bottom end loop
and shoot say 50 arrows at close range into your target
and then see if the peep sight stops moving from start to finish.

or

2_REMOVE twists from the bottom end loop
and shoot say 50 arrows at close range into your target
and then see if the peep sight stops moving from start to finish.



Since I don't know which direction your bowstring is twisted,
just try both directions.

IF you ADD twists to the bottom end loop,
and after 10 or so shots,
you notice the peep sight is MOVING LESS,
then you are going the correct direction.


IF you ADD twists to the bottom end loop,
and after 10 or so shots,
you notice the peep sight is MOVING MORE,
then go and REMOVE twists.


I always get my left and right mixed up,
so I had to try both directions 
(ADD and REMOVE twists from the bottom end loop).


Why do I say just adjust the bottom end loop?

Cuz, if we stick to just one end loop,
then no confusion,
and we will get to the balance point eventually anyway.

Soooo,
I finally figured out what direction to adjust the bottom end loop.

Bottom line,
the peep sight pointed ONE DIRECTION when the bow was at rest.

Bottom line,
the peep sight pointed the SAME DIRECTION when the bow was at full draw.


ONLY 1 Problem....

Peep sight was 90 degrees sideways, EXACTLY.

Peep sight did not move anymore.

Peep sight was dead solid.


So,
now what?



1_ take a loop of dental floss and tie it loosely
around the left hand bundle of bowstring on one side of the peep sight.

You can also use a paper clip.

This is so you can reference the STARTING POINT.


Since I have a 22 strand string,
which means I need 11 strands on one side of the peep sight....

AND

since my peep sight was now ROCK SOLID,
but facing 90 degrees in the wrong direction....

I had to grab 6 strands from the left hand existing bundle
and
I had to grab 5 strands from the right hand existing bundle.


1_Bow goes into the portable bow press.
2_I have a paper clip around the left hand existing bundle
3_I use a 2nd paper clip and grab 6 strands of the left side existing bundle
4_I use a 3rd paper clip and grab 5 strands of the right side existing bundle
5_I use some dental floss and tie around the two paper clip bundles

6_ I now have a NEW 11 strand bundle with 2 paper clips (new left bundle).
7_I remove the two paper clips.
8_I use some more dental floss and tie up the NEW 11 strand right side bundle

I reinstall the peep sight,
with the NEW 11 strand bundle on the left
and
with the NEW 11 strand bundle on the right.

Tie in the peep sight.
Fire 50 arrows.
Peep sight is STILL ROCK SOLID (no movement from beginning to end)
and
peep sight is now facing the correct direction.


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## x-it

Nuts and Bolts that was awesome. I been building strings and this is my problem the rotation is always consistent but I would rather have no rotation. So how do we build that string with no rotation. Whats the secret. I notice when I start putting on the servings is where I start getting that rotation.


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## x-it

Just wanted to share. I took what N&B said about the peep rotation and got to thinking about what he said and decided to try it. My string I built had rotation it was consistent but it bugged me. The string looked like it was twisted tighter between my idler and center serving where my peep is than below my center serving and cam. I already added a twist so I took out 3 whole twist. I drew the bow back several times each time the peep moved less and less. After about 5 draw backs the peep did not rotate at all through the draw cycle. I went out and shot no movement still no movement. It worked. Thanks N&B for a great post and to the orignal poster.


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## Rick9

*Peep rotation and temperature?*

Great thread - thanks to Javi and Nuts & Bolts especially.
One thing that has puzzled me about peep rotation is how it changes as the temperature changes. One of my bows is very sensitive to temp changes and the peep rotates almost 90 degrees from freezing temps to summer. On my other bow the change in rotation is minimal.
Is this a common problem?
Any insights on what causes this, or how to fix it much appreciated?
Thanks


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## dwagoner

Rick9 said:


> Great thread - thanks to Javi and Nuts & Bolts especially.
> One thing that has puzzled me about peep rotation is how it changes as the temperature changes. One of my bows is very sensitive to temp changes and the peep rotates almost 90 degrees from freezing temps to summer. On my other bow the change in rotation is minimal.
> Is this a common problem?
> Any insights on what causes this, or how to fix it much appreciated?
> Thanks


typical with the differnece in string materials, and the actual person making the string can cause one string to have no peep rotation and anothers string may have some. thats why you hear 8125 is faster but not as stable as say 452x, prolly a string thats 8125????? cant say, but thats why i use 452x, i prefer the stability over a few fps myself.


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## bjanzen

Okay.....so I bought a used Mathews solocam back in Dec. and the local shop did a wonderful job of re-serving and installing a nice peep and d-loop. He tried to fix the alignment and gave up and just told me to come back if it didn't work for me. 

Well.......I have been getting a consistent 90 deg. roll and used the d loop to align things so full draw was right.....well my perfectionist nature can't stand this. I read this thread last night and decided to build that $20 press and fix it myself 

Well.......it still is a mess. I have added three twists four times now. I have added a total of 12 clockwise twists and the peep still rolls 90 deg. clockwise. I shot is each time I twisted and kept aligning the D loop with the arrow. It would settle in about 10 shots and I would shoot 10 more and watch the peep. Never could get it to stop rolling. 

Should I re-serve the center?

Should I remove the peep and serving and see if I can settle it?

Should I remove 12+ twists and go the other way?

Should I just get a new string and start over?

My arm is shot for tonight.......shoulder is in pain......driving me crazy.

Thanks in advance,

Barry


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## bjanzen

FYI....I have serving and tool. Can re-do all if need be. The string has a little fibers showing but could be fixed with a good wax.


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## nuts&bolts

bjanzen said:


> Okay.....so I bought a used Mathews solocam back in Dec. and the local shop did a wonderful job of re-serving and installing a nice peep and d-loop. He tried to fix the alignment and gave up and just told me to come back if it didn't work for me.
> 
> Well.......I have been getting a consistent 90 deg. roll and used the d loop to align things so full draw was right.....well my perfectionist nature can't stand this. I read this thread last night and decided to build that $20 press and fix it myself
> 
> Well.......it still is a mess. I have added three twists four times now. I have added a total of 12 clockwise twists and the peep still rolls 90 deg. clockwise. I shot is each time I twisted and kept aligning the D loop with the arrow. It would settle in about 10 shots and I would shoot 10 more and watch the peep. Never could get it to stop rolling.
> 
> Should I re-serve the center?
> 
> Should I remove the peep and serving and see if I can settle it?
> 
> Should I remove 12+ twists and go the other way?
> 
> Should I just get a new string and start over?
> 
> My arm is shot for tonight.......shoulder is in pain......driving me crazy.
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Barry


Hello Barry:

First requirement.
The tension on the strands of the bowstring must be equal,
during the construction of the bowstring.

If the tension was not consistent,
when building the bowstring,
you cannot ever get the roll to stop and settle down.


It is possible,
that you have a quality bowstring,
and
that the center serving was not installed properly.


Only 1 way to find out.


Remove the center serving.

Put the string in a stretching device
and stretch it to about 300 lbs.

Burnish (rub the bowstring until your fingers get really warm),
while under tension.

Let it set under 300 lbs of tension overnight,
or maybe even longer.

Now,
install a new center serving,
with the tension set on the serving tool
so that the bowstring does NOT twist,
while you install the center serving.


Install the peep sight.

Shoot 100 shots.

See if the peep sight moves
when you go from at rest,
to full draw.

Let's say the peep sight rolls to your left,
when you get to full draw.

When the bow is at full draw,
the bowstring tension drops way down,
and
if the peep sight is rolling left...

this means you do not have enough residual twist energy
in the bottom section of the bowstring,
so
you need MORE residual twist energy
in the bottom half of the bow string,
so you need to twist the bottom bow string end loop
to the RIGHT (opposite of the peep sight roll direction).

Add the twists to the bottom of the bowstring.


Shoot another 100 arrows.

See if the movement of the peep sight is LESS.

If so,
then you are going in the correction direction.


Add some more twists.

Shoot 100 shots.

See if the peep sight movement is less.


Eventually,
you will get to the point where the peep sight no longer rolls.


Now the twist energy
above the peep sight,
matches
the twist energy below the peep sight.


But,
the peep sight is not moving anymore,
but 
the peep sight is facing the wrong direction.


Now,
is when you start adjusting the strands.


Let's say you have 11 strands on the left bundle.
Let's say you have 11 strands on the right bundle.


Wrap a long piece of thread around the left hand bundle.
11 strands in this bundle.

Let's say the peep sight no longer moves,
but the peep sight is exactly 90 degrees off.


Take 6 strands from the 11 strand bundle,
and tie a long piece of thread around 6 strands from this bundle.


Separate out 5 strands from the right side bundle.
Feed the thread around these 5 strands.

Now,
combine the 6 strands from the left hand bundle
with
the 5 strands from the right hand bundle,
and you now have a new 11 strand bundle.


Reinstall the peep sight,
shoot 100 shots,
and then the peep sight will now be facing the correct direction.



IF this does not work,
then you need a new bowstring.


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## russdiggins

You spend some time with your equipment. I bet you are committed to shooting. Nice write up. I will stand on your shoulders to set my string next time. Thx.


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## Birdieman90

nuts&bolts said:


> Hello polarbear06:
> 
> I have nowhere near the knowledge of JAVI,
> but I will do my best.
> 
> A bowstring is basicaly a series of loops, really long loops.
> 
> Let's say we have a 22 strand bowstring.
> Well, what we are really saying
> is we have 11 loops of bowstring materials,
> and the left side has 11 strands
> and the right side has 11 strands,
> and when we twist up the entire bundle,
> we get a 22 strand bowstring.
> 
> Now,
> we start spinning the serving tool
> and make the end serving on top...
> 
> (we just locked in a particular amount of twist ENERGY...in the top end serving).
> 
> 
> Now,
> we start spinning the serving tool
> and make the end serving on bottom...
> 
> (we just lock in a different amount of TWIST ENERGY...in the bottom end serving).
> 
> The difference will be small, but there is a difference in TWIST ENERGY.
> 
> 
> Now,
> we start spinning the serving tool
> and make the center serving
> 
> (we just locked in another amount of TWIST ENERGY...in the middle serving).
> 
> 
> 
> When the bow is at rest,
> the bowstring is under extreme tension....really tight.
> 
> 
> When the bow is at full draw,
> the cables take MOST of the tension,
> and the bowstring tension is actually pretty lightweight...
> 
> meaning the bowstring is pretty RELAXED when the bow is at full draw.
> 
> 
> So,
> if the peep sight is pointing STRAIGHT AHEAD,
> when the bow is at rest
> and the bowstring is super duper tight....
> 
> and
> 
> if the peep sight is pointing NOT STRAIGHT AHEAD,
> when the bow is at full draw,
> and the bowstring is pretty relaxed....
> 
> what does this mean?
> 
> This just means that the bowstring is OUT OF BALANCE,
> and we need to get the bowstring INTO BALANCE...
> 
> which means,
> whatever direction the peep sight is pointing,
> when the bow is at rest (bowstring is super duper tight)
> 
> then
> 
> the peep sight will still be pointing the SAME DIRECTION,
> when the bow is at full draw (bowstring is pretty relaxed).
> 
> 
> So,
> what usually happens is folks spend a lot of money
> on a custom bowstring,
> and then they tie in the peep sight
> (probably changed the bowstring TWIST ENERGY balance again)...
> 
> and then,
> they tie in a short length of serving near their string suppressor
> (probably changed the bowstring TWIST ENERGY balance again)...
> 
> and then they wonder why the peep sight moves.
> 
> 
> 
> So,
> I just did this this morning.
> 
> 
> Peep sight looking ONE WAY when the bow was at rest,
> and
> peep sight looking ANOTHER WAY when the bow was at full draw...
> 
> namely,
> the dreaded peep sight moving from start to finish of the bow draw cycle.
> 
> 
> Basically,
> this means the TWIST ENERGY above the CENTER SERVING
> does not match the TWIST ENERGY below the CENTER SERVING.
> 
> 
> Cuz the center serving is twisted tight,
> it locks in the twists under the center serving
> and the TWIST pressure expands out the top of the center serving
> and
> the TWIST pressure also expands out the bottom of the center serving.
> 
> 
> Soooooo,
> we have to twist the bottom end loop
> to match the TWIST pressure coming out the bottom of the center serving.
> 
> 
> Only two choices,
> when twisting the bottom end loop.
> 
> 
> 1_ ADD twists to the bottom end loop
> and shoot say 50 arrows at close range into your target
> and then see if the peep sight stops moving from start to finish.
> 
> or
> 
> 2_REMOVE twists from the bottom end loop
> and shoot say 50 arrows at close range into your target
> and then see if the peep sight stops moving from start to finish.
> 
> 
> 
> Since I don't know which direction your bowstring is twisted,
> just try both directions.
> 
> IF you ADD twists to the bottom end loop,
> and after 10 or so shots,
> you notice the peep sight is MOVING LESS,
> then you are going the correct direction.
> 
> 
> IF you ADD twists to the bottom end loop,
> and after 10 or so shots,
> you notice the peep sight is MOVING MORE,
> then go and REMOVE twists.
> 
> 
> I always get my left and right mixed up,
> so I had to try both directions
> (ADD and REMOVE twists from the bottom end loop).
> 
> 
> Why do I say just adjust the bottom end loop?
> 
> Cuz, if we stick to just one end loop,
> then no confusion,
> and we will get to the balance point eventually anyway.
> 
> Soooo,
> I finally figured out what direction to adjust the bottom end loop.
> 
> Bottom line,
> the peep sight pointed ONE DIRECTION when the bow was at rest.
> 
> Bottom line,
> the peep sight pointed the SAME DIRECTION when the bow was at full draw.
> 
> 
> ONLY 1 Problem....
> 
> Peep sight was 90 degrees sideways, EXACTLY.
> 
> Peep sight did not move anymore.
> 
> Peep sight was dead solid.
> 
> 
> So,
> now what?
> 
> 
> 
> 1_ take a loop of dental floss and tie it loosely
> around the left hand bundle of bowstring on one side of the peep sight.
> 
> You can also use a paper clip.
> 
> This is so you can reference the STARTING POINT.
> 
> 
> Since I have a 22 strand string,
> which means I need 11 strands on one side of the peep sight....
> 
> AND
> 
> since my peep sight was now ROCK SOLID,
> but facing 90 degrees in the wrong direction....
> 
> I had to grab 6 strands from the left hand existing bundle
> and
> I had to grab 5 strands from the right hand existing bundle.
> 
> 
> 1_Bow goes into the portable bow press.
> 2_I have a paper clip around the left hand existing bundle
> 3_I use a 2nd paper clip and grab 6 strands of the left side existing bundle
> 4_I use a 3rd paper clip and grab 5 strands of the right side existing bundle
> 5_I use some dental floss and tie around the two paper clip bundles
> 
> 6_ I now have a NEW 11 strand bundle with 2 paper clips (new left bundle).
> 7_I remove the two paper clips.
> 8_I use some more dental floss and tie up the NEW 11 strand right side bundle
> 
> I reinstall the peep sight,
> with the NEW 11 strand bundle on the left
> and
> with the NEW 11 strand bundle on the right.
> 
> Tie in the peep sight.
> Fire 50 arrows.
> Peep sight is STILL ROCK SOLID (no movement from beginning to end)
> and
> peep sight is now facing the correct direction.


Hey nuts or anyone for that matter,

I have a question, I redid the center serving and had to basically tie my peep in backwards so when I draw the peep rotates all the way around to the correct way. I understand about the twist energy, but how do you take twists in or out of the bottom loop without affecting your draw length? #newtobowtuning 

Thanks!


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## milsy

Tagging. Thanks


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## Mitigator33

Having trouble with mine right now. Think it may be due to poor center serving.


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## Devilfan

Does the peep have to be in the "center" of the string? By this I mean if you have a 2 color string, does one color have to all be on one side and the other color all on the other? I am guessing so since flipping a few strands would eliminate that. What is the purpose of all the custom string builders putting a piece of floss or string to separate both sides of the sting?


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## sureshot516

One thing that corrected the ever so slight rotation i had was reverse the way the D loop was tied, if the top section of the d loop came off the string on the left side it kept the peep dead straight, if it came off the right side it aided the peep in rotating (no good)

the loops are still tied opposing each other as they should.


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## BOW TECH MAN

Tag


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