# Just venting



## .454 (Apr 12, 2009)

viper33584 said:


> I don't post much, as a matter of fact this might be my first one. I usually read, watch, learn, and nothing more. I was just on Outdoor Channel, and I was disgusted at the sight. We wonder how people in Washington can get signatures to ban hunting, why so many are against it, well here is a good example.
> The show was a man sitting in the snow, with a preprogrammed call for Coyotes. He had a heck of a set up, gun and scope, he had it zeroed in for long distance shooting. He called in 3 coyotes, shot all three before they could leave the area, and then stood, raised his arms and shouted, triple. I don't care if it was 1 1/2 miles away, uphill, in a 40 mph crosswind at dusk. Coyotes and wolves look like dogs. people love there dogs, I love my odg, ask Micheal Vick how much we love dogs. He isn't going to eat them, it was sport, not a fair sport, only one side can win at his game, but to him it was sport. Deer, Moose, Elk, even Bear if hunted in wide open spaces, not high fences, to me is considered sport or hunting, high fences, baiting, and coyotes and wolves have no place in the TV world. It made my wife cry. She left and said how in the world do you sit there and watch that. If we are ever going to have the freedom to hunt and fish and be left alone and respected by the populace we have to ban that type of behavior from TV and the internet. Just my opinion, not looking for a pat on the back or a kick in the ass, just had to say something to people who might be in a position to stop this crap.























> 5/8/8 Lake Arrowhead, CA Coyote Drags Toddler From Front Yard. Animal Releases 2-Year-Old Girl When Mom Appears; 3rd Incident In 5 Days. A coyote grabbed a 2-year-old girl by the head and tried to drag her from the front yard of her mountain home in the third incident of a coyote threatening a small child in Southern California in five days, authorities said.
> The coyote attacked the girl around noon Tuesday when her mother, Melissa Rowley, went inside the home for a moment to put away a camera, the San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department said in an incident report.
> Rowley came out of the house and saw the coyote dragging her daughter toward a street. She ran toward her daughter, and the animal released the girl and ran away, said sheriff's spokeswoman Arden Wiltshire. ---snip--- Full article here. Another article here. Video here.
> 
> ...


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## .454 (Apr 12, 2009)

> 7/12/2005 Coyote bites country club security guard in Mashpee.
> MASHPEE, Mass. - A security guard at a Mashpee country club was treated for rabies as a precaution after being bitten by a coyote last week.
> A guard patrolling the grounds of Willowbend Country Club was bitten on Thursday night after apparently disturbing the coyote as it was rooting through some bags of illegally dumped household trash for food, Mashpee's animal control officer said.
> "It was over food apparently," Officer June Daley told the Cape Cod Times. "It did break the skin on his leg, so he was treated for rabies as a precaution." ....snip.... News story here.
> ...


 Source here

Conclusion: tell your wife coyotes are NOT dogs. They are not cuddly and playful, nor they can be domesticated. They are an invasive species that used to be spread only in the South-Western part of the United States and Mexico and in less than 100 years took over the entire North American continent. They are vermin who attack livestock, pets and children as well decimating ground nesting birds, rabbits, deer (by killing fawns) and all other sorts of wildlife. Oh, and did I mentioned they are the #1 carrier of rabies in North America?
The man who you are complaining about wasn't shooting dogs, he was shooting vermin from an invasive and dangerous species and doing everyone (people and wildlife) a favor. Instead of whining about "what it looked like" he was doing and complaining he is giving hunters a bad name, maybe you should try educate some of your bleeding heart liberal friends about what coyote hunting is all about.


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## Scotsbowhunter (Mar 26, 2008)

Coyotes are pests and their numbers need to be controlled.

They are nothing like dogs behaviour wise, their not domesticated just like our foxes.

They need to be hunted.


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## SHOOT-N-STAB (May 23, 2009)

Another emotionally based statement. Information and facts are the only way to dispell myths. Well done .454


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## .454 (Apr 12, 2009)

SHOOT-N-STAB said:


> Another emotionally based statement. Information and facts are the only way to dispell myths. Well done .454


Thanks.

Video: Coyote in broad daylight - St George Street, *Los Angeles* CA 90027
Another one roaming in an unnamed city here
Two coyotes roaming in Silverlake here. For those of you who don't know where Silverlake is, that's on the other side of the 101 Fwy, a 5 minutes easy walk from downtown Los Angeles.

_Oh, but he is so cute! He looks just like my dog Fifi and I think my toddler would love to play with him!_

 Yeah, until he tears your Pomerainan Fifi jugular to pieces then grabs your toddler by the head and goes somewhere under a freeway bridge to feed on him.


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## kegan (Aug 28, 2006)

I've never seen coyotes in a natural environement. When I was young, local "farmers" in their 20's and 30's drove in on quads and used spot lights and semi-automatic weapons to kill every single one that lived in the small valley beside our house in one night. 

My gut reaction is to side with the coyotes there. But I know full well that if they were left unharmed, and were still around when I began bow hunting, I would have tried MANY times to transfix my share of them with an arrow. If it's there and legal, I'm going to at least _try_.

I understand where you're coming from- but I think the objection shouldn't be to _what_ is hunted, but _how and by whom_. I was recently given a DVD from a whitetail hunting show. I couldn't even watch the whole thing. Arrogance, disrespect, and a lack of sportsmanship made me sick. Men who cared more about the size of the deer's antlers, and having a big trophy than poor shots, ruined meat (one individual left his deer ungutted- even when he brought it back to a closed, warm room to show it off to others)? Is THAT what we want to show people? A man shot a small buck too far back and they showed it's read end give out as it struggled to the end. Of course I know that could always happen, no matter who's doing the shooting- but to follow that up with a close up of the man dancing in his stand hyperventialting, congratualting himself and _repeatedly_ saying this made it all "worth it"?

Hunting is an experience, not a trophy on the wall. Where are the videos of parents taking their kids out- just to _see_ wildlife within spitting distance? Where are the shows where you see the woods come to life as the sun stretches through the trees? For most people that's all we get. We get one or two shots at giant monsters in a life time- so we enjoy the calmness, the serenity, the _beauty_ of actual being out there to hunt. Of course, everyone wants to pay off their tags by putting somehting in the freezer, and maybe you live in an area where there are enough deer that you can happily pursue that wily old buck. But everyone real hunters knows that a head on the wall isn't all that matters- and yet that's not the idea these videos give people.

Know what I mean?


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## .454 (Apr 12, 2009)

kegan said:


> Know what I mean?


Yes I know, and I believe you are emotionally very confused. 
You are comparing apples to coconuts. We are not talking here about hunting the poor innocent and defenseless Bambi, OK?.
What we are talking about is dangerous vermin, an invasive species that not only harms humans and pets but also causes great damage to wildlife. Think of coyotes as dog sized rats who spread rabies, attack toddlers, pets, ground nesting birds and everything else they consider edible. They lost their fear of humans and are becoming more and more brazen and aggresive. 
You don't object to the Orkin man coming to your home and poisoning the rats, don't you? And the rats who are poisoned die a very slow, agonizing death while a coyote hit by a .223 bullet expires in seconds. That's humane pest control, if you didn't knew that.


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## kegan (Aug 28, 2006)

No, that's not what I was getting at. I have no more objection to coyote hunting than anything else. What I was trying to say was that alot of hunting programs don't show everything. It's one thing to kill something- it's another thing to dance on it's grave and pat yourself on the back in front of people who never saw just how wicked it is/can be, or (and here's my biggest objection to hunting shows) because the animal had a big set of antlers. That's why when I was little I thought there was nothing nasty about coyotes- because I never saw one. All I knew was that a bunch of drunken men cam way too close to a house with sleeping children to obliterate a local animal population. A person who has no hunting/wildlife experience would have very little more than that though.

So yes, I was comparing apples and coconuts, and no I didn't follow the same idea as the thread was started on. I guess I was just venting my own disgust over the way hunting shows seem to be going in general.

**Just for the record though: I _would_ object to the Orkin man- our house is small and I don't want our housecats to lick something and die (I hate the idea of home pesticides- it just freaks me out). And yes- if there was a large population of coyotes in the area you can bet I would be out there trying to hunt them. 

Did that help what I was trying to say or make it worse?


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## RNT (Feb 28, 2007)

.454 said:


> Source here
> 
> Conclusion: tell your wife coyotes are NOT dogs. They are not cuddly and playful, nor they can be domesticated. They are an invasive species that used to be spread only in the South-Western part of the United States and Mexico and in less than 100 years took over the entire North American continent. They are vermin who attack livestock, pets and children as well decimating ground nesting birds, rabbits, deer (by killing fawns) and all other sorts of wildlife. Oh, and did I mentioned they are the #1 carrier of rabies in North America?
> The man who you are complaining about wasn't shooting dogs, he was shooting vermin from an invasive and dangerous species and doing everyone (people and wildlife) a favor. Instead of whining about "what it looked like" he was doing and complaining he is giving hunters a bad name, maybe you should try educate some of your bleeding heart liberal friends about what coyote hunting is all about.




Enough said. 100% agree!!!!!!!!!


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## BigBirdVA (Nov 5, 2002)

kegan said:


> No, that's not what I was getting at. I have no more objection to coyote hunting than anything else. What I was trying to say was that alot of hunting programs don't show everything. It's one thing to kill something- it's another thing to dance on it's grave and pat yourself on the back in front of people who never saw just how wicked it is/can be, or (and here's my biggest objection to hunting shows) because the animal had a big set of antlers. That's why when I was little I thought there was nothing nasty about coyotes- because I never saw one. All I knew was that a bunch of drunken men cam way too close to a house with sleeping children to obliterate a local animal population. A person who has no hunting/wildlife experience would have very little more than that though.
> 
> So yes, I was comparing apples and coconuts, and no I didn't follow the same idea as the thread was started on. I guess I was just venting my own disgust over the way hunting shows seem to be going in general.
> 
> ...


That's half the problem with hunting now. We've been told we're supposed to keep it on the hush or not be visible. We're supposed to hide in the shadows and not be seen. While the anti's do anything and everything to get their message out. I doubt that guys moment of joy is going to sway anyone one way or the other. 

Not sure if anything can be done about it but it sounds like you've got some peta genes in your DNA flaring up on you. A good dose of letting a few arrows fly into something warm and furry might snap you back to where you need to be.


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## viper33584 (Feb 20, 2004)

*can of worms*

Well as I said in my post, I was not looking for pats on the back or kicks in the ass. 454 did some severe ass kicking. He makes a valid point, I even agree with most everything he said, I was trying and failed to make a point. Regardless of shooting coyotes for stealing chickens or causing rabies, and stealing Fifi, it doesn't come across well on TV. Unless they read the posts, or had a large disclaimer on the screen, it makes us all look like we would shoot anything that moved. In 2004 at my local bow shop, the day I got my VFT extreme, two guys came in. They needed a dual cam timed, and were making small talk while the owner fixed it. They were going to leave there and go to Green Swamp. The shop owner asked what they were going to hunt, (wasn't deer season yet) and they said anything that moves. He fixed the bow and sent them on there way. He had told me he was going to let them go back on his place and try it out on some hogs, young hunters, but after hearing that he was disgusted. I agree, that kind of behavior is what hurts us all. Like it or not the PC crowd uses everything and anything it can to ban hunting. I was merely pointing out perception on the part of my wife, a non hunter. So my apology's to all I pissed off, I meant no harm, didn't want to get in philosophical debate. I can see some have compiled laundry lists of viewpoints on there own behalf. They are right I am wrong.


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## kegan (Aug 28, 2006)

BigBirdVA said:


> That's half the problem with hunting now. We've been told we're supposed to keep it on the hush or not be visible. We're supposed to hide in the shadows and not be seen. While the anti's do anything and everything to get their message out. I doubt that guys moment of joy is going to sway anyone one way or the other.
> 
> Not sure if anything can be done about it but it sounds like you've got some peta genes in your DNA flaring up on you. A good dose of letting a few arrows fly into something warm and furry might snap you back to where you need to be.


It sounds to me that you are of the mind set that "we all must stick together- no matter what." I'm not. So I doubt you and I would see eye-to-eye on this subject, regardless of what I say.

In my opinion, there's a big difference between what's shown on TV and what's real. As much in hunting as anything else.


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## sits in trees (Oct 9, 2006)

there are areas where yotes have destroyed the deer herd here in NY state


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## BMoeller (Jan 17, 2007)

I coyote hunt not a bigger rush around. They need to be controlled period. It might look easy, but so do the deer and turkey hunting shows. You don't always go out there play the caller and coyotes just jump in your lap. If you don't like it don't watch or do it. Don't slam people that do it if your any kind of a hunter yourself. Get over it. 

Nothing better than busting yotes and popping *****cats


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