# Lens power choice.



## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

Easier to put the dot in the middle and just have it sit when you have a little less target definition.. But more it's about not having to use clarifies- I love my six, but not having to dick with clarifiers in the cold, wet, dark, etc is nice


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## bigHUN (Feb 5, 2006)

N7709K said:


> ...But more it's about not having to use clarifies- I love my six, but not having to dick with clarifiers in the cold, wet, dark, etc is nice...


I still like to use x5 or x6 with smallest peep aperture, and my 9" Shibuya sight extension is all the way out at 7....somehow got used to this.....


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## Joe Schnur (Mar 22, 2012)

I have been using a 6x too works well


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

4X is a better all round choice. Most can use 4X without a clarifier. A clarifier will fade pins if not having good light or a light for the pin. For 3D, 4X is nearer correct for binoculars used, that being the mostly used 10X binoculars. At one time, before the IBO made rule changes, lots of people used 3X to better match the Rule of 8X maximum binoculars. A bit farther of "correct," the distortion of "reference" size between a lens and binoculars is/was deemed less. 

Magnification is nice, but it also shows more movement. I have two glass 6X lens and they are excellent for clarity without a clarifier - for me, not some one else. I rarely use either, but on my rare good days they are great. This for indoors. If outdoors and longer distances I have to use a clarifier. I sold one and it's on it's way back because of what I noted, pin fade with a clarifier, too much movement. Spoke with him today on the way back home from a local indoor practice range. The person's eyes are that he had to use the #2 (green) clarifier to clear up the target which gave even more pin fade according to him.


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## jmann28 (Nov 22, 2010)

N7709K said:


> Easier to put the dot in the middle and just have it sit when you have a little less target definition.. But more it's about not having to use clarifies- I love my six, but not having to dick with clarifiers in the cold, wet, dark, etc is nice


You said dick


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

jmann28 said:


> You said dick


Mind out of the gutter, please. Internet & Text Slang Dictionary Glossary of terms, Dick; "mess with."


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## jmann28 (Nov 22, 2010)

SonnyThomas said:


> Mind out of the gutter, please. Internet & Text Slang Dictionary Glossary of terms, Dick; "mess with."


I guess we're in the no fun zone when you're in a thread


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

I was thinking of the women in here....


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## Joe Schnur (Mar 22, 2012)

Most are tougher than us guys I worry more about the yuts


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

We gots yuts in here?!


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## Mahly (Dec 18, 2002)

Good stuff, back to topic please.


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## N7709K (Dec 17, 2008)

i'm not saying that low mag are the only way to go; i know quite a few guys shooting 6x and a few shooting 8x with very good success on a national and international level... but there are some tricks you need to know and you have to play around a bit more to find something that works for all the lighting conditions you'll find indoors(if that bugs you... personally all i need is to be able to distinguish the middle from the rest of the paper and bale) and for the faces that you'll shoot. If you shoot the same setup for a long time its very hard to change; but after shooting the same setup for such a long time change isn't always the best option.

If you run the exact same setup for the majority of all the faces you'll encounter if not all the paper that you'll encounter a lower mag will pay off.... some of it is due to not needing a clarifier and not needing to mess with finding the right mix of aperture size and clarifer power; more its due to the field of view being a bit larger and not needing to worry about shooting in the rain and the cold (again i'm not saying that a 6x with a clarifier doesn't work in the rain and the cold; i've shot plenty of 700's with mine at -25 and in the pouring rain... its just a little easier with a 3x).


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## Joe Schnur (Mar 22, 2012)

Yuts was a movie reference to youths


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## ron w (Jan 5, 2013)

essentially, our brains all work the same, certain things get tried and considered not necessary by trial and error, over long enough periods of time that develops a favorable trend. 4 power has been found to be the best compromise between enough magnification to get a good view of the target and the amount of magnification that causes us to go into the "over control the float" situation. of, course there are always individuals that push either end of this "acceptable spectrum", by saying they prefer 2 power just as at the other end, where 6 or even 8 power is preferred, but the mid point of that spectrum, is where 4 power and the largest sample of preference, sits.


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## ride394 (Oct 16, 2006)

You guys and your no clarifiers! I have to shoot a #2 with my 3x lens!


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

ride394 said:


> You guys and your no clarifiers! I have to shoot a #2 with my 3x lens!


Not all eyes are created equal  Neither are all lenses. The acrylic, plastic, composite material are nice, but glass seems better to me. I have both and prefer the glass, but the composite I bought this year is outstanding.

I am one that can not shoot with glasses, the frames being the most part of. My eyes are different than others have. First, I am one of those that can see plastic lens as in there's something in front of my eyes. So, I have glass glasses. I also have what shows to be stigmatism, oval iris or something. Twice I've had eye doctors try to fit me with corrective lens. They were wrong. I felt 10 feet tall and the ground right under my nose. Walking was dangerous! A room's upper walls looked to be curved inward, about to fall on me - I was ducking! I even got sick.

My glasses; left upper lens, straight. Lower left, 175. Right upper lens, some magnification. Lower right, 150.

I have used clarifiers with my 4X lenses. Without, a normal target at any distance. With, a target super clear, but seemingly too sharp and worst, I have pin fade something awful and different pin colors don't help, red, green, yellow, blue.


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## ride394 (Oct 16, 2006)

SonnyThomas said:


> Not all eyes are created equal  Neither are all lenses. The acrylic, plastic, composite material are nice, but glass seems better to me. I have both and prefer the glass, but the composite I bought this year is outstanding.
> 
> I am one that can not shoot with glasses, the frames being the most part of. My eyes are different than others have. I have what shows to be stigmatism, oval iris or something. Twice I've had eye doctors try to fit me with corrective lens. They were wrong. I felt 10 feet tall and the ground right under my nose. Walking was dangerous! A room's upper walls looked to be curved inward. I even got sick. My glasses; left upper lens, straight. Lower left, 175. Right upper lens, some magnification. Lower right, 150.
> 
> I have used clarifiers with my 4X lenses. Without, a normal target at any distance. With, a target super clear, but seemingly too sharp and worst, I have pin fade something awful and different pin colors don't help, red, green, yellow, blue.


I have astigmatism as well and wear contacts. I also have problems trying to wear my glasses, I can get by with them but it feels like I'm drunk lol. I've never tried shooting with glasses or without contacts. 

I don't think my 26.5" DL helps the situation either as I can't run a really small peep. I am using a CBE large scope with CBE lens and a 1/8" peep. I may play around with that setup once I start shooting indoors though.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

ride394 said:


> I have astigmatism as well and wear contacts. I also have problems trying to wear my glasses, I can get by with them but it feels like I'm drunk lol. I've never tried shooting with glasses or without contacts.
> 
> I don't think my 26.5" DL helps the situation either as I can't run a really small peep. I am using a CBE large scope with CBE lens and a 1/8" peep. I may play around with that setup once I start shooting indoors though.


I'd suggest another doctor, opinion. Most go with the doctor orders. I complained, ripped the assistant when she said I had to get use to my glasses. Glasses are to correct, not give other problems.

As for peeps and matching pin or scope housings, try everything. I can well go without a orifice in my Super Peep, centering the housing within the peep. I can use down to 3/64" for both inside and outside, centering just the pin. I have my scope set out to where I see the clearest, but have shortened it for other scope housings and lenses. I've even made my own peep size opening where one size was too small and the next size up was too big. As peeps run, 1/32" is .031" in diameter. 3/64" is .047". My made peep measured .040". The sight frame was the problem, not even out to give what I wanted for a sight picture. I no longer have that sight frame.


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## Rick! (Aug 10, 2008)

ride394 said:


> I have astigmatism as well and wear contacts. I also have problems trying to wear my glasses, I can get by with them but it feels like I'm drunk lol. I've never tried shooting with glasses or without contacts.
> .


I wear glasses for my old age eyes (presbyopia) and used to struggle with clarifiers. Now I shoot from 2X to 6X with a small peep and no glasses. Can't see f'all for definition but once I am in the scope, the target is clean and my rings are fuzzy. Putting contacts in just makes the rings on the lens clearer with a fuzzier target. Just for giggles, try aiming without your contacts and see what happens.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Rick! said:


> I wear glasses for my old age eyes (presbyopia) and used to struggle with clarifiers. Now I shoot from 2X to 6X with a small peep and no glasses. Can't see f'all for definition but once I am in the scope, the target is clean and my rings are fuzzy. Putting contacts in just makes the rings on the lens clearer with a fuzzier target. Just for giggles, try aiming without your contacts and see what happens.


Yes, by all means. No glasses, no contacts. I had a customer that shot with glasses and he had troubles. So I worked with him after hours. It didn't take long to see his glasses were a double pain. He was forever adjusting them after coming to full draw. "Take those dang things off." I had to stop him from adjusting his glasses that weren't there any more - no kidding. "Just make things fuzzy the same way each time." Before we were through he was doing a fantasic job of shooting where before he was all over the place. Said he couldn't remember shooting so good.

And then a blinder or eye patch covering the off eye may help. Gets the aiming working better sometimes and well enough that the blinder or eye patch is no longer needed.


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## wc651 (Apr 23, 2009)

Thanks for all the input. I currently use a 6 with glasses. I think after all the conversation, I will try a 4 with and without glasses. Never thought of shooting without glasses. Thanks.


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## Joe Schnur (Mar 22, 2012)

4 x there is a fellow here on archery talk makes very good lenses look him up worth the investment
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2218930&highlight=Lense

I give him very high marks high quality and honest man


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## Mr.Moose (Sep 15, 2011)

It all depends on your eyes, Period


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## Garceau (Sep 3, 2010)

The better your eyes are, the more you will need a clarifier.

Thats a very general rule. Glasses or contacts also come into play.

Reality is as stated, many factors come into play


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

The vast majority of people who use a lens have bad eyes?


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Reply incomplete for some reason; The vast majority of people who use a lens have bad eyes and don't require a clarifier?


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## bigHUN (Feb 5, 2006)

SonnyThomas said:


> Reply incomplete for some reason; The vast majority of people who use a lens have bad eyes and don't require a clarifier?


I am short sighted but I throw out a clarifier from the peep and I use a 0.140" pin to see it through a smallest aperture hole for a full depth of view....


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## youngbuck711 (Jan 31, 2007)

I shoot a 7x with no clarifier for vegas and NFAA and a ring. It's blurry, but that doesn't hurt anything because I'm just centering the ring around the white or yellow (5 ring and 9 ring respectively). I actually find this much more relaxing than being able to see everything. 

for indoor 3-D I use a 4x with a clarifier and a pin because I need to be able to see what I'm aiming at.


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## Kyudo Novice (Sep 9, 2014)

I've experimented with 2X, 4X, 6X, 8X lenses, aperture size and clarifiers on a 1-3/8" scope with a variety of* fiber optic pins at a 28" draw with slight stigmatizm and far sightedness.* Findings; for amost anyone viewing a target at any distance through a 4X using a 1/16" or smaller aperture is clear, larger apertures are less clear.* 6X is fairly clear with a #2 with 1/16" aperture, clear with #3 and #3 with larger apertures.** 8X is clear with #3.* Because pin fades with increased clarification and small aperture,* better performance from the pin lighting system is required,* and solved by LP Pin lighting kit.* It took a lot of practice to prove I was scoring slightly best at 8X with #3 @ 1/16" aperture.* I'm no expert and probably average accuracy for a 3 months novice of 60 arrows a day. *Try for higher magnification.*


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