# Samick Sage Setup



## caliusoptimus (May 15, 2018)

Hey Folks,

my name is Cale and a couple weeks ago I picked up my first bow, a 40lb sage and some budget arrows arrows. I've been spending a good amount of time shooting and toying around with the bow and I've noticed a few things I don't quite understand.









I found out pretty quickly that 40lbs was too much and picked up some 25lb limbs. I had a feeling my 30" 500 spine arrows (the longer one) were going to act differently at 25lbs but I was quite surprised when the arrows were flying almost sideways for the first 10ft. I went to my local archery shop and explained what was happening, and they let me try a few different arrows. I walked out with a six pack of the other arrows in the photo, which are PSE razorback 1000 spine. These arrows solved the issue and my groups are better than ever! I'm still a bit confused about what was happening with the larger arrows, as they come out of the bow at around a 15-20 degree angle, with the tip pointing to my left (my bow and I are right handed). Seems like a pretty drastic problem! Is this just the result of an incorrect spine, or is something else going on here? And no, they don't do this at all with the 40lb limbs.

I noticed that the center line of the bow is not always aligned with the string. The limbs and pockets have a good bit of play, and the center line can move a good 1/2" from one side to the other. What is the ideal alignment for this? Should the string be directly in line with the arrow, or off to one side? If off to the side how much? What effect does this have on the shot? I'd like to find the ideal position for this so that I can shim the limb pockets to where any time I take down the bow it will go back to the correct position.
















Since I got the bow I've put at least a few hundred arrows down range, and this rest is already looking a little haggard. I'd like to get something more durable like a magnetic rest, and maybe even a plunger so that I can make some minor adjustments. Is the center on this bow cut deeply enough for a plunger? I feel like putting a plunger in as-is would point the arrow way off to the left.


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## woof156 (Apr 3, 2018)

I have a Samick Sage started out with 40# limbs too and quickly (withing weeks) dropped to 30 #- the 40's really did a number on my shoulder. I don't think any play in the limb pockets is normal?? Mine are solid as a rock so if yours are moving (if I understand what you are describing) then something is not normal and may be a defect??? I have a plastic arrow rest and have shot 1000s of arrows with it- summer through cold below zero winter and my rest still looks great not damaged like your picture at all. I used Beiter limb gages to check the centering of my string with the limbs and it was dead on. I adjusted my rest so when strung, arrow knocked, string centered, the arrow tip was pointed off to the right by about a string width. I shot 500 spine arrow with the 40 and 30 # and they seem to fly OK maybe not perfect but pretty well (probably 600 might be better at 30??)-- could you be plucking the string a bit on release?? My Samick has been a great bow and have had no problems at all, hope others might have better suggestions and hope you get yours working well. Best.


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## caliusoptimus (May 15, 2018)

woof156 said:


> I have a Samick Sage started out with 40# limbs too and quickly (withing weeks) dropped to 30 #- the 40's really did a number on my shoulder. I don't think any play in the limb pockets is normal?? Mine are solid as a rock so if yours are moving (if I understand what you are describing) then something is not normal and may be a defect??? I have a plastic arrow rest and have shot 1000s of arrows with it- summer through cold below zero winter and my rest still looks great not damaged like your picture at all. I used Beiter limb gages to check the centering of my string with the limbs and it was dead on. I adjusted my rest so when strung, arrow knocked, string centered, the arrow tip was pointed off to the right by about a string width. I shot 500 spine arrow with the 40 and 30 # and they seem to fly OK maybe not perfect but pretty well (probably 600 might be better at 30??)-- could you be plucking the string a bit on release?? My Samick has been a great bow and have had no problems at all, hope others might have better suggestions and hope you get yours working well. Best.


Funny you mention shoulder problems... that's exactly why I went with the 25lb limbs. My right arm is shaky at 40lbs, but no pain. My left arm is shaky too, but with a nice sharp nerve pain :embara:.

The limb pockets look great, but pretty far from a precision fit. Both the limbs in the pockets and the pockets on the riser have a good 0.5mm in clearance on the side. Probably just par for the course on a $120 bow, and something I can fix easily, just need to figure out the correct alignment.

As far as plucking the string goes it's definitely not out of the question. I'm sure my form leaves much to be desired but this sideways arrow thing happens consistently. Just a curiosity at this point. The new arrows fly fine with the 25lb limbs... well... they fly more accurately than my aim anyway haha!

Also on the rest, maybe my cheap arrows have some of that special chinese abrasive sauce built in! Eroding away my rest with every shot :tongue:


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## Hank D Thoreau (Dec 9, 2008)

Your stiff arrows were probably crashing into the rest. That is a common problem. If you are destroying rests it is probably either form, bow set up, or more likely, both. Did you have a knowledgeable person set up your bow?

There are foam spacers that usually come with the plastic stick-on rests. They are used for setting up the correct "center shot" of the bow. 

I cannot tell what is going on in your pictures since you do not have the arrow nocked.


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## caliusoptimus (May 15, 2018)

Hank D Thoreau said:


> Your stiff arrows were probably crashing into the rest. That is a common problem. If you are destroying rests it is probably either form, bow set up, or more likely, both. Did you have a knowledgeable person set up your bow?
> 
> There are foam spacers that usually come with the plastic stick-on rests. They are used for setting up the correct "center shot" of the bow.
> 
> I cannot tell what is going on in your pictures since you do not have the arrow nocked.


I set it up initially, and two different people at the shop gave it a once over. They both OKed the nock point, rest and the measurement between the string and grip (i forget the term). I explained how the limbs have a lot of slop side to side, unfortunately they didn't offer any real advice. In the photos I am holding the arrow square on the riser. In the left photo the limbs are pushed all the way to the left, and to the right in the right photo.


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## buddyrip (Feb 1, 2015)

The sloppy limb fit would be a flaw in the bow. I would go back to the archery shop and have them check a couple of the other sage bows for the same flaw. My first sage riser had floppy limb fit as well as a twist. Had it replaced by the dealer and all was good. I have two sage risers and three sets of limbs that are all interchangeable now with snug fit and good alignment. Another common problem with the sage is limb bolt fit, that it threads in and out easily and aligns with the limb bolt hole. I checked this all out myself by assembling the bow at the dealer when puchasing my other sage. You can achieve very good flight with the sage set up with a plastic rest or off the shelf and the correct arrow spine. My guess would be 700 spine full length and +- 125gr tips.


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## woof156 (Apr 3, 2018)

I agree with Buddyrip limb slop is a bow flaw and it needs to be replaced either limbs or riser? When set up your string must be centered on both upper and lower limbs to make everything else work correctly..if not there is bound to be inconsistency. Good that you went with light limbs, you can always work you way up. I now shoot 38# (target) and won't go any higher because it will eventually cause shoulder problems and I get to the 50 yd target bales-- lots of work before I get real groups.






I use this arrow rest. I like it because it allow for easy lateral adjustment for getting center shot alignment. It has a crude plastic flipper on it that acts as sort of a plunger as well. On cold days the flipper is probably not as effective but then neither am I. I am not a competitive shooter and so love a simple set up. Unfortunately as I have been afflicted with "toxophillia" I now have 3 bows and face a difficult decision as to which one to shoot with on any given day. I hope you can get your limb problems solved and enjoy the flight of arrows and become a toxophilite too.


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## caliusoptimus (May 15, 2018)

buddyrip said:


> The sloppy limb fit would be a flaw in the bow. I would go back to the archery shop and have them check a couple of the other sage bows for the same flaw. My first sage riser had floppy limb fit as well as a twist. Had it replaced by the dealer and all was good. I have two sage risers and three sets of limbs that are all interchangeable now with snug fit and good alignment. Another common problem with the sage is limb bolt fit, that it threads in and out easily and aligns with the limb bolt hole. I checked this all out myself by assembling the bow at the dealer when puchasing my other sage. You can achieve very good flight with the sage set up with a plastic rest or off the shelf and the correct arrow spine. My guess would be 700 spine full length and +- 125gr tips.


Thanks for the info! I'll keep that in mind for my next bow purchase. For this one I was able to shim the pockets and limbs. With the arrow square on the riser the string is directly in line, so good enough for me.



woof156 said:


> I use this arrow rest. I like it because it allow for easy lateral adjustment for getting center shot alignment. It has a crude plastic flipper on it that acts as sort of a plunger as well. On cold days the flipper is probably not as effective but then neither am I. I am not a competitive shooter and so love a simple set up. Unfortunately as I have been afflicted with "toxophillia" I now have 3 bows and face a difficult decision as to which one to shoot with on any given day. I hope you can get your limb problems solved and enjoy the flight of arrows and become a toxophilite too.


Thanks for the tip! I'll try that rest. Cool how it threads in, I can take it out and shoot from the shelf. And I feel ya... if this hobby is anything like my others I'll have at least a few more bows before Christmas :teeth:


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## Brian N (Aug 14, 2014)

Something is amiss - The pocket has "rails" on either side and the limbs should exactly fit between, and then when you bolt them down they should be fairly solid. As for arrow spine, you are OK with the 1000 spine and light tip. For a right handed shooter a knocked arrow will have the point a tiny bit to the left of center, when you line up the string, and limb center. The plastic springy rests have different thickness adhesive pads that you can use for adjustment. On my first bow i shot thousands of arrows with the springy rest and it never looked like that. Another thing, I see your riser has a hole for a plunger, but no threads (unless the picture is not a a good angle). Go back to the shop, and make sure they address the limb situation. They sold you new arrows, but insist that if they want your future business, you would like the limb problem resolved. You should not have to shim up the limbs in the pocket. My two sons and I all started with inexpensive wood risers, the limb pockets were exact fit to the limbs.


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## Bow Rider (Jan 16, 2015)

Nothing matters if the limbs don't fit the bow. That amount of play in the limbs will never shoot consistently.


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## caliusoptimus (May 15, 2018)

Brian N said:


> Something is amiss - The pocket has "rails" on either side and the limbs should exactly fit between, and then when you bolt them down they should be fairly solid. As for arrow spine, you are OK with the 1000 spine and light tip. For a right handed shooter a knocked arrow will have the point a tiny bit to the left of center, when you line up the string, and limb center. The plastic springy rests have different thickness adhesive pads that you can use for adjustment. On my first bow i shot thousands of arrows with the springy rest and it never looked like that. Another thing, I see your riser has a hole for a plunger, but no threads (unless the picture is not a a good angle). Go back to the shop, and make sure they address the limb situation. They sold you new arrows, but insist that if they want your future business, you would like the limb problem resolved. You should not have to shim up the limbs in the pocket. My two sons and I all started with inexpensive wood risers, the limb pockets were exact fit to the limbs.


That's just the photo, threads are there and in good shape. I bought the bow on amazon so hands on support is out of the question. In any case I shimmed out the slop, everything fits nice and will stay put during use. I'll write a review and let others know this should be considered unacceptable.

I took some measurements when I had the bow apart. The 40lb limbs were about spot on 40.00mm wide where they meet the riser. The riser itself was also spot on 40.00mm wide. The H shaped brackets were about 40.30mm wide on both sides. The 25lb limbs were around 39.80mm wide and required thicker shims. Bout as tight as a hot dog in a hallway.

On another note I measured the draw weight and it came in at 26lbs with my ~29" draw, so at least that was on point.


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