# PSE SUMMIT as starter bow?



## dhend25 (Dec 30, 2009)

I'm getting back into recurve archery after a brief time in the compound world.

I posted a question a few days ago regarding "draw length vs. poundage", because I have a short 25" DL, and received several very helpful replies from several of the forum members. 

My question now involves the type and brand of bow to purchase. I have found a bow from PSE called the "Summit", which can be ordered up to 66" in length, and up to 36 pounds in draw weight. It is also "ILF" rated. The riser is 23", but appears solid in the pictures, so I'm not sure how you would mount a sight on it.

This bow is only $200 and looks perfect for my initial start-up. There is precious little information out on this product, good or bad. I know their "Optima" line is referred to by most as "Twisted Limb" junk.

If anyone knows or has had any experience with the "Summit", your thoughts or comments would be appreciated!

Thanks,

DH


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

DH -

The Summit is relatively new in the PSE line-up and would be an excellent "intro" bow for someone either on a budget or not really sure if this is something they really want to get into. It is an ILF rig, and so will accept limbs from any other manufacturer. Our local range has sold several so far and no complaints. (I've shot it as well, as was pleasantly surprised.)

It has the AMO std sight mounting hole opposite the sight window, for a side mounted sight.

If you KNEW you were going to get into this more seriously, I'd steer you towards a Hoyt Excel rig, but it will be close to twice the price for a new one. (It has a little better balance, grip (really like the grip!) and finished a little nicer, but that's about it.)

Viper1 out.


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## dhend25 (Dec 30, 2009)

Thanks "Viper 1" for your very helpful reply to my question.

I was hoping that you would respond, because I had seen one of your previous posts where you had recommended this bow to a newbie like myself.
Just not very much information out there yet on this bow. 

Maximum poundage is 36, so I'm guessing with my 25" DL I'd be looking at pulling somewhere around 28 -30 pounds, which is probably going to be ideal for a small statured beginner like myself. I'm also assuming that the longer version of 66" would be correct for me also. I'm 5'6" and 187 pounds (with short arms).

As you seem to be the resident expert in this area, what sort of inexpensive target sight would you recommend for this bow? I guess I will also need an arrow rest and more importantly, ARROWS! Any advice here would be really appreciated!!!

Thanks in advance for all your helpful suggestions!

Best regards,

DH
Springfield, Virginia


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

DH - 

Don't guess on draw length, it can fool you! If you're close, going with 34 - 36# limbs is a good call. 

To be safe, I'd start off with full length 1716s, in whatever "color" you like (the Jazz or Blues are fine). Either NIBB type target points or RPS screw-in will work for now, as we're still in the "discovery" stage.

Yes, even if the longest setup might not be the most efficient for you, it will be the easiest to learn on - so definitely go that way. 

That bow is ready for an arrow rest and plunger. (IIRC, it comes with a basic rest). You can get a WW/KAP magnetic flipper and a Cartel plunger for about $25 and they work pretty well. 

Once you get started, that bow will like a stabilizer, but you can get entry level ones at Lowes / Hope Depot - we can tall later on that if you like.

Hope that helped.

Viper1 out.


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## dhend25 (Dec 30, 2009)

Thanks again "Viper 1".

If my DL is 25" with a compound, I might be a 24" with a recurve. If that's the case, is it possible that I would wind up "under bowed" with a 36# Summit? I'm not a big fan of having to work to pull a bow string back, but if my short DL leaves me with only 24 to 26 pounds, will this be adequate to learn with?

Also, could you suggest an inexpensive target sight for this bow?

Also, do you like tabs or gloves for beginners?

What about a good bow stringer?

Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks again for your helpful advice!

DH


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

DH -

You really can't be under-bowed in a learning situation. going "too" light will in a worst case scenario make you more aware of mistakes sooner. I'd rather have my students under-bowed than over, even if it means buying new limbs sooner rather than later. 

Again, we can't see your form. If you're shooting your compound with a bent bowarm and a long string loop, your DL on a stickbow "may" actually be longer - just can tell from here. 

I wouldn't skimp on a sight, unless you're really unsure about doing this. The Sure-loc Contender and Shibuya Dual Click are good choices. Some of the Cartel sight are decent, but IMHO, stay away from anything with plastic or nylon. If you're just "thinking about it" use your compound sight.

Definitely tabs. Which one depends on what you plan on doing:
For STRICT Target work - Cavalier Elite, hands down!
For more general stuff - The Bateman tabs or similar are fine.
For More hunting oriented stuff, the SAM (Super Archery Mitt) is my favorite. 

Most bow stringers are decent and do the same thing. I prefer two pocket stingers as long as the limb tips are big enough to allow string nock access. The friction block types are fine, so it's really personal preference.

Given the direction it sounds like you're heading, you might get more suggestions in the FITA forum. 

Viper1 out.


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## dhend25 (Dec 30, 2009)

Thanks some more, "Viper 1"!

I have a "Toxonics" 1400 on my compound with a single pin sight. I didn't know it would work (or fit) on a recurve.

You've given me so much useful information to digest! 

Did I read, in a recent post, that you have a book that can be purchased? If so, I'm buying it!!! Let me know the title.

I'll also take your suggestion to check out the "FITA" forum.

Thanks again, I'll let you know what I end up with.

best regards,

DH


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

DH -

Sight holes are spaced to AMO standards, so it should fit. Given it's weight, without a stab of some sort, it will really upset the balance of the bow. 

Since it sounds like you're going to a target scenario and already have a sight background, you have the options of going directly to a sight or learning to shoot bare bow first. The people I teach (in person) don't get a choice, they have to learn bare bow first. It builds confidence in what they and the bow can do and is, in some regards, less complicated. Basically they need to get their form down before going to a sight. There are other theories, but that one has worked for me over the years.

Thanks for asking about the book. It's called Shooting the Stickbow, and that's pretty much all I'm allowed to say about it 

Making another assumption, sounds like you might be more serious about this than first thought. If your budget can handle it, seriously look at the Hoyt Excel or Eclipse risers and Excel limbs. 

Viper1 out.


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## Flyers 1 (Feb 10, 2012)

*PSE Summit Starter Bow*

Viper 1
Thanks for the suggestion on the PSE Summit. I shot one a few times at my local club and decided to purshase it. So far so good.Thanks for your input.This is my first bow. My son is into JOAD like son like father.


The Summit is relatively new in the PSE line-up and would be an excellent "intro" bow for someone either on a budget or not really sure if this is something they really want to get into. It is an ILF rig, and so will accept limbs from any other manufacturer. Our local range has sold several so far and no complaints. (I've shot it as well, as was pleasantly surprised.)

It has the AMO std sight mounting hole opposite the sight window, for a side mounted sight.

If you KNEW you were going to get into this more seriously, I'd steer you towards a Hoyt Excel rig, but it will be close to twice the price for a new one. (It has a little better balance, grip (really like the grip!) and finished a little nicer, but that's about it.)

Viper1 out.[/QUOTE]


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## Dsx (Oct 6, 2012)

Thanks for your input Viper.
What would you advise as arrow for a setup similar to the Excel one you were talking about ?
Thanks...


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## BarneySlayer (Feb 28, 2009)

Viper1 said:


> It's called Shooting the Stickbow, and that's pretty much all I'm allowed to say about it


Oh, give me a break. I have no such constraints. It's a great book for archery, probably THE book to start with, in my opinion. There are lots of books out there worth reading, but for a clear, thorough, sensible explanation of the basic requirements and techniques, I know of no other book that even comes close. Don't stop with this book, and it's no substitute for practice, personal experience, and coming to your own conclusions about what works for _you_, but I'd suggest starting with it.


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Barney -

Thanks buddy.

Dsx - 

Arrows will depend on draw weight and draw length. 
As above, for a really tight budget, or if you're really not sure of the arrow size, 1/2 Easton Blues is a good bet. Once you have the details ironed out, then go with the Platinum Plus or X7 shafts, depending on the exact size you want or need.

Viper1 out.


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## Dsx (Oct 6, 2012)

Ok, thank you very much...
Any particular advice on vanes ? Or on points (ligther the better I guess) ?


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Dsx -

Feathers are a little more forgiving than vanes, but both can be used IF you know how to tune correctly. Size and shape are almost always a matter of personal preference than anything else. 

Head weight is another story and there are too many theories to count. I stay pretty much middle of the road, 100 - 125 or possibly 145 for hunting and less, usually about 75, for target. 

Viper1 out.


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## Dsx (Oct 6, 2012)

Thanks a lot for all the advices Viper.
I will have to get your book now I guess  ...


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## Dsx (Oct 6, 2012)

Two more questions for you Viper:
- All the arrows your have commanded are alluminium. We mostly shoot carbon here as they are more durable as we shoot both 3D and targets. Why this preference for aluminuim ?
- Do you recommand the use of a clicker ? If so, wich one to start with ?

Thanks again...


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Dsx -

I rarely if ever shoot pure carbon arrows. I have a dozen Carbon Ones, a have used composites (ACEs) in the past.

I haven't found carbons to be any more durable than aluminum for the type of shooting I do. I have to deal with arrow on arrow violence (busted nocks and side slaps) on a regular basis. With carbons, busting nocks easily equals busted arrows most of the time and side slaps can result in hair line fractures. I also typically find as many carbon arrows in our ranges "re-cycle" bins as aluminum. I can re-straighten most aluminum bends to spec with a little effort. 

Further, I find that most aluminum arrows are held to tighter specs/tolerances than most pure carbons, and I can more easily juggle spine, weight and diameters to specific purposes. 

For "most" trad shooters, a clicker is a last resort to treat target panic, only to be used AFTER the standard drills have failed.The For target/Olympic shooters, I try to hold off until the shooter is in the 260 - 270 range on the 300 target, unless there is evidence of TP requiring it to be introduced sooner. 

The clicker is NOT something to be taken lightly. It takes most Olympic shooters the better part of a year to fully understand and exploit it's function. Most trad shooters can "make it work" sooner, but it can be quite frustrating in the beginning. (The discrepancy between the time frames is due to how the clicker is being used in each case.)

For the trad bowhunter, you're limited to one of the limb clickers. They do work, but can be tricky since you can't get a visual check as you can with a blade clicker.

Viper1 out.


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## Dsx (Oct 6, 2012)

Ok thanks again for your patience...


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Dsx -

No problem, but please understand: I'm not telling YOU what to shoot, I'm telling you why I shoot what I do. 

Viper1 out.


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## jusoldave (Apr 28, 2012)

Viper1 said:


> Dsx -
> 
> No problem, but please understand: I'm not telling YOU what to shoot, I'm telling you why I shoot what I do.
> 
> Viper1 out.


And that's precisely why I, for one, value your advice so highly.


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