# IBO Rules Change on Arrow Weight ??



## NY911 (Dec 12, 2004)

Good question, I was wondering as well...........


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## Matt / PA (Feb 21, 2003)

To me the 5grs lb rule still applies but they are also stating that they don't RECOMMEND that a shooter go under their own manufacturer stated limits just to push the 5grs lb competition limit.........for example if someone is trying to compete with an older bow that the manufacturer puts a 6 or 7grs per # recommended limit on then that person can't come to the IBO and say "Hey the IBO says 5grs lb so you are the reason why my bow exploded"
:wink: 
It should also keep an unsuspecting bystander from possibly eating shrapnel from someone trying to get more out of their bow than the factory designed into it.


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## jonnybow (Aug 27, 2002)

I have read this new rule over and over again and it makes no sense to me. Why change a rule when it contradicts the intent of the original rule?? Why would you make the weight consistent with the maximum draw weight instead of true draw weight??
If this is the case, I'll have to swap out the 70# limbs turned down to 62# for a set of 60# limbs maxed out. I hope this isn't the case.


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## Ohio_3Der (Jul 19, 2002)

*my interpretation*

Maximum weight equals the maximum weight during the draw stroke, not the potential of the bow. 

I think this rule is just there to say the exact same thing the old rule said, but in a way that takes liability off of the IBO's shoulders by not encouraging going under five grains per pound. 

Read it the same as the old rule, if you are adhearing to five grains per pound, go as fast as you want.

If you aren't going with at least five grains per pound, you can only go up to 280 fps.


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## gollie15 (Feb 25, 2003)

Matt / PA said:


> To me the 5grs lb rule still applies but they are also stating that they don't RECOMMEND that a shooter go under their own manufacturer stated limits just to push the 5grs lb competition limit.........for example if someone is trying to compete with an older bow that the manufacturer puts a 6 or 7grs per # recommended limit on then that person can't come to the IBO and say "Hey the IBO says 5grs lb so you are the reason why my bow exploded"
> :wink:
> It should also keep an unsuspecting bystander from possibly eating shrapnel from someone trying to get more out of their bow than the factory designed into it.


That's the way I was leaning Matt, until I got to this note.



Note: With this change please note the grain allowance for arrow weight is removed[/QUOTE said:


> That's when I got confused.
> I posted the same question on the IBO forum & if I can get an answer, I'll relay the reply.


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## monty53 (Jun 19, 2002)

gollie15 said:


> *IBO 2007 rule changes and more
> IMPORTANT CHANGES FOR 2007
> 
> III. EQUIPMENT
> ...


If I read this right, I think the grains per pound rule is dead.


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## Matt / PA (Feb 21, 2003)

> With this change please note the grain allowance for arrow weight is removed


I think this refers to an allowance given for variation in scales........in other words I think a certain % of variation was accounted for on arrow weight which has now been removed.
Example: If my arrow weighs exactly 350grs on MY scale but comes up 345 on the IBO's scale then the IBO is simply going to go by thier measurement without a +/- variation.

I think since there is some allowance built into the rule for variation in draw weight that they didn't need to also have one for arrow weight?

Somehow I don't think this all needs to be quite this confusing?


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## monty53 (Jun 19, 2002)

ttt


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## monty53 (Jun 19, 2002)

Here are the rules. It means at the "set" weight.

III. EQUIPMENT 
A. GRAINS PER POUND AND ARROW SPEED


1. Arrows must weigh at least five grains per pound of the bow’s maximum shooting weight unless the archer’s equipment qualifies for the exception set out in paragraph 2 below. Shooting weight is defined as the bow’s maximum draw or thrust weight, whichever is greater. A variance of 2 pounds of draw weight shall be allowed for bow scale variation. Equipment qualifying in this paragraph (A)(1) shall have no limit on arrow speed.

2. In the case where an archer’s equipment, when shot at five grains per pound, does not generate 280 fps, that archer may shoot arrows weighing less than 5 grains per pound. However, equipment qualifying under this paragraph (A)(2) shall not exceed an arrow speed of 280 fps. A variance of 3% will be allowed for chronograph variation.

3. Draw weight shall not be adjusted after entering the shooting course. Adjustments can be made only after equipment is checked at the conclusion of a range. Doing so will be considered poor sportsmanship and subject to disqualification. 

4. IBO recommends that archers do not exceed manufacturer’s recommended limits on arrow weight and draw weight.


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## 3dbowmaster (Sep 16, 2005)

Does this mean I can shoot the Speed Pro Max arrows out of a High Country.:wink: 

Its not under what the manufacturer (High Country) recommends!!!!


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## jonnybow (Aug 27, 2002)

monty53 said:


> Here are the rules. It means at the "set" weight.
> 
> III. EQUIPMENT
> A. GRAINS PER POUND AND ARROW SPEED
> ...




This is far too confusing......in blue above, the word MAXIMUM is what is making this all so confusing. 10 different people are getting 10 different impressions of this "new" rule. Unfortunately I read this as the maximum weight of the limbs which means I'm screwed...I shoot a 70# bow turned down to 62#. I shoot 320gr arrows which (I believe) would be below weight if they are saying what i think they are saying........what happened to the easy rules?


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## old shooter (Jun 1, 2005)

3dbowmaster said:


> Does this mean I can shoot the Speed Pro Max arrows out of a High Country.:wink:
> 
> Its not under what the manufacturer (High Country) recommends!!!!


yes you can shoot the speed pro but they limit it to 280 fps IBO is just sucking up to bowtec[ comander 66lbs 29" draw 335 gr arrow 315fps legal ] tell me that dosent nock the heck out of yardage estimating. I e-mailed and they confirmed this [except the sucking up] there is no advantage to the speed.


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## jonnybow (Aug 27, 2002)

old shooter said:


> yes you can shoot the speed pro but they limit it to 280 fps IBO is just sucking up to bowtec[ comander 66lbs 29" draw 335 gr arrow 315fps legal ] tell me that dosent nock the heck out of yardage estimating. I e-mailed and they confirmed this [except the sucking up] there is no advantage to the speed.


You emailed IBO and got that answer?? If so, that will answer all of our questions. It is based on draw weight you are using, not MAXIMUM available bow weight.


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## 3dbowmaster (Sep 16, 2005)

Actually there is an advantage in speed!!! But you have to be accurate as well. And todays equipment, you can achieve this fairly easily. I do believe you'll see several PSE's (the one that shoots 350fps)in the IBO circuit this year.


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## old shooter (Jun 1, 2005)

jonnybow said:


> This is far too confusing......in blue above, the word MAXIMUM is what is making this all so confusing. 10 different people are getting 10 different impressions of this "new" rule. Unfortunately I read this as the maximum weight of the limbs which means I'm screwed...I shoot a 70# bow turned down to 62#. I shoot 320gr arrows which (I believe) would be below weight if they are saying what i think they are saying........what happened to the easy rules?


At the qualifer this past weekend they said that the bow is pulled on the club scale and the arrow is weighed on the club scale and that is what they were told to do or you can shoot the meter your choice. also you better check it before the shoot because if you fail your choice when they ask you can't change {disqualified}


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## jonnybow (Aug 27, 2002)

"I do believe you'll see several PSE's (the one that shoots 350fps)in the IBO circuit this year."

There was several last year, the year before that and on and on......Does the name Eric Griggs ring a bell?


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## old shooter (Jun 1, 2005)

3dbowmaster said:


> Actually there is an advantage in speed!!! But you have to be accurate as well. And todays equipment, you can achieve this fairly easily. I do believe you'll see several PSE's (the one that shoots 350fps)in the IBO circuit this year.


I agree and I'M waiting [impatiently] on my stiletto. Old ,messed up, shakey, half blind, needing all the help i can get.


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## gollie15 (Feb 25, 2003)

old shooter said:


> At the qualifer this past weekend they said that the bow is pulled on the club scale and the arrow is weighed on the club scale and that is what they were told to do or you can shoot the meter your choice. also you better check it before the shoot because if you fail your choice when they ask you can't change {disqualified}


So, shooter, you're saying the rule is exactly the same as it was...they just worded it different? 
70 lb bow shooting a 340 gr. arrow....279 fps..legal
70 lb bow shooting a 350 gr. arrow....302 fps..legal
70 lb bow shooting a 340 gr. arrow....285 fps..illegal
70 lb bow pulling 65 lb. shooting a 325 gr. arrow...302 fps..legal??

Still confused


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## jonnybow (Aug 27, 2002)

gollie15 said:


> So, shooter, you're saying the rule is exactly the same as it was...they just worded it different?
> 70 lb bow shooting a 340 gr. arrow....279 fps..legal
> 70 lb bow shooting a 350 gr. arrow....302 fps..legal
> 70 lb bow shooting a 340 gr. arrow....285 fps..illegal
> ...


all legal from what I'm understanding. Over 5gpp= no speed limit, under 5gpp=280


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## gollie15 (Feb 25, 2003)

jonnybow said:


> all legal from what I'm understanding. Over 5gpp= no speed limit, under 5gpp=280


That's the way it's always been. Instead of saying the rule changed why not just say "we reworded " the following rule to say, because if you are correct there is no change to the rule other than there will be no +/- on arrow weight. It has to be on or under with no allowances.


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## jonnybow (Aug 27, 2002)

I don't know.....I wish someone from the IBO would just say what they mean!


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## Boarro10 (Jan 18, 2005)

BowPro is in Alabama for the first leg of the Southern Triple Crown. I have been at the Pro and Semi Pro check stations at the National Triple Crown and have checked hundreds of the Pro's bows. I attended the meeting when the directors changed the rule. The rule was changed so it is clear that you can not get arrow weight AND bow weight exceptions for scale variations. The scales used at each shoot are the official scale at that shoot. The bow is weighed on the official scale and that is the weight used. The arrow is weighed on the official scale and that is the weight used. You can then subtract 2 pounds from the weight of the bow for scale variations. Example, IBO weighs bow at seventy pounds and the arrow weighs 340 the equipment would be legal because of the 2 pound bow weight reduction for variations in scales. 68 X 5 = 340. If your arrow weighed 339 grains= DQ. 
Pete Banks 

I just copied this answer from the IBO site that I wrote before I came to this site. Nothing really changed except it is now clear that the only scale variation you get is the bow weight and not the bow weight AND the arrow weight. These rules only apply if you shoot over 280 FPS.
Examples
70# and 350 grain arrow @300FPS= legal
70# and 339 grain arrow @290FPS= illegal
70# and 330 grain arrow @280FPS =legal
You still get 2 pounds bow weight deduction for scale variation and 8FPS for chronograph variations.
Hope it is clear now.
Pete


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## gollie15 (Feb 25, 2003)

Thank you, Pete.
So as long as I don't go over 280 fps, I can shoot any weight arrow I chose.
But if I'm over 280 fps. I have to adhere to the 5 gr per pound of pull with 2 lbs. of allowance on the bow, but no weight allowance on the shaft...Correct?


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## jonnybow (Aug 27, 2002)

gollie15 said:


> Thank you, Pete.
> So as long as I don't go over 280 fps, I can shoot any weight arrow I chose.
> But if I'm over 280 fps. I have to adhere to the 5 gr per pound of pull with 2 lbs. of allowance on the bow, but no weight allowance on the shaft...Correct?


Crystal clear now!!


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## bluejacket (Dec 19, 2003)

Pete is absolutely correct. Just a little "why it was changed" info. With the old wording people often incorrectly thought they could claim an allowance for the bow scale and then compound that allowance by adding one for the grain scale. It amounts to 2 pounds draw weight allowance which would equal 10 grains of arrow weight. Trust me, noone is going to start cranking up your bow to see how much weight we can get on it. All that matters is what the weight is you are shooting it at.


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## 1tiger (Jan 24, 2005)

gollie15 said:


> Thank you, Pete.
> So as long as I don't go over 280 fps, I can shoot any weight arrow I chose.
> But if I'm over 280 fps. I have to adhere to the 5 gr per pound of pull with 2 lbs. of allowance on the bow, but no weight allowance on the shaft...Correct?


you can actually go to 288 because of the 3% varience adjustment for chronos. the reason for this rule is simple,it does not overly penalize little short farts like my self whos bows at 5 grains per lb wont do 280 fps.here is an example my 2007 pro-elite with c2 cams at 26.5 inch draw wont do 280 fps at my draw lenght. so i can shoot my 302 grain arrows at 64 lbs and still shoot 280 +/- 3% =285/286 fps and still be legal.


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