# Squeezing the trigger and calling the shot



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

So a index release? If so, I'm going to say, Yes, but in a different manner. It's using back tension. It's learning process. First, place your finger on the trigger and forget it - Okay, your index finger is touching the trigger and that's all. You need X amount of back tension to help hold at full draw. Added back tension then fires the release. Biggest thing to over come is not thinking about the index finger. 

You should set the trigger so you can touch it - most have creep adjustment. My Scott Mongoose, if checked on a trigger scale, will fire around - just say hair trigger. Still, I got use to mine and placed and won a bunch at local and State NFAA events. A few index releases have tension adjustment, not many that I know of. 

Finger shooters are different. It's a sort of pull and relax the fingers thing. I haven't used fingers in years, but was pretty good.

Calling the shot... Well.... I'm not a spot shooter, quit years ago. Indoor is a 20 yard game and a 300 game is usually not had by the average joe. I've shot a hand full of 300s and few 299s. Outdoor (900) is 60,50 and 40 yards - never saw a 900 game - I think my best was 879. Field is as short as 20 feet and as long as 80 yards. 560 possible and the best I ever did was a 548 (So says RW).


----------



## dorkbuck33 (Sep 12, 2011)

Interesting thread caught my eye , welcome to AT by the way . I learned something this year after decades of shooting a rifle . I had the trigger in the first crease , knuckle and that is wrong ! Just like my trigger release for archery . Rifle you want the meat of the tip of the finger on it . Guys that do that with archery are reaching to far and slap it so to speak . Guy showed me i was pulling at the rifle range . Archery i had it right . I try to do as Sonny says . ^ i still struggle with getting that back tension to send it but that is proper . tagged for more info .


----------



## lees (Feb 10, 2017)

peholden said:


> You can probably tell from my title that I've spent much of my life in the world of rifle target shooting. Now that I'm into archery I'm wondering if the same skills apply. When using a release, am I supposed to squeeze the trigger a little bit at a time so that I don't really kow when the arrow will be released? AND, when shooting a gun, the proof of good technique was whether or not the shooter can call the shot -- can tell where the bullet hit on the target. Is that true with archery. When I'm doing everything right, I can see the arrow leaving the bow and I know where it will land. Is that how good target archers think also.


The short answer is no, not really and some do and some don't.
An alternative short answer is, "well it depends".

The long answer is as follows:

There's not a real consensus on what 'correct technique' actually is on the compound bow (at least not yet). But there are two major camps on the issue of whether the release should be a "surprise": one asserting it doesn't matter, the other asserting it does matter. The central issue there is anticipation issues, their causes and their results - target panic - and whether or not the "surprise release" is an effective treatment for target panic. I'm in the camp that asserts that it can be proven that a surprise release is the only effective, durable treatment for anticipation issues associated with the release of the bowstring. I also assert that not every shooter that "command-releases" (meaning maintaining control over the instantaneous timing of the release) comes down with anticipation problems, but the reverse - that shooters with anticipation problems virtually always also command-release and that that's the underlying cause of the TP - is true. 

All that is just the long way of saying that a lot of bits have been typed on this forum and others on the subject of anticipation issues and the surprise release, as well as the various techniques for achieving the surprise release. You won't find a lot of agreement on how to implement it, though there are some broad categories under the name "back tension" and others. However, if you look for a consensus on what "correct technique" is on the compound bow, you won't find one. 



> Oh. When shooting without a release, does a finger shooter basically do the same thing?
> 
> Thank you, Pete


The short answer is no.

The long answer is as follows:

Finger shooters have to command-release, just as a pure matter of definition. The shooter simply must time the instant of the relaxation of the fingers with basic finger releasing. However, a variant of the surprise release is available with finger shooting through the use of a draw check device (AkA the clicker). It provides a method for an external timing of the release not under the explicit control of the shooter. So depending on whether you use a clicker or not, the "correct technique" opinions will probably correlate in general with the same opinions on the compound bow. 

Anyway, that's a lot of gobbledy-**** to basically say there actually isn't a straightforward answer to your questions in a general way. I can assert my own experience and give you very definite yes's or no's, but that only starts fights and whining and complaining in the threads where I do so. I'll save the forum the agony of that and just not offer my experience unless asked. 

I would say you probably have to do more reading and research to get the big picture and then proceed from there....

lee.


----------



## Stash (Jun 1, 2002)

You don’t want to “squeeze the trigger a little bit at a time”. The idea is to activate the release with a steady and continuous repeatable movement, which depends on the style of the device.

Regardless of the type of release you're using, it should take almost the same amount of time on every shot from the beginning of the activation to the actual release, and if it doesn’t, there’s something else wrong with your shot sequence or thought pattern.

With a thumb or index finger release, you start to gradually increase pressure on the trigger until it goes off. With a hinge release, you start to rotate it, either with your wrist, or by squeezing your 3rd and 4th fingers to rotate it, or by increasing your back tension thus causing the rotation. Lots of ways to describe this, but basically they all are different ways of rotating the release until it goes off. With a resistance release you increase the pull until the holding weight reaches the release point.

You can make this activation a fairly fast movement (which some people call “command” release) or a fairly slow movement (surprise). But either way, you’re not impulsively jerking on the trigger, you’re starting a steady constant movement. And you’re also not just standing there aiming until something miraculously releases the trigger. 

And yes, if you’ve done it properly you should be fully aware of where your sight was pointed at the instant of release, and therefore you can call the shot.


----------



## dmattingly (Jul 29, 2019)

I have found I do a better job of shooting back tension on a index release if the release is adjustable. some of the cheap releases are set so heavy and don't have any adjust that I had a tendency to just punch the trigger. there are plenty of releases that wont break the bank the have trigger sensitivity adjustments.


----------



## peholden (Nov 27, 2019)

Wow, thank you all for such helpful and thoughtful answers. Oh, and by reading all your comments I'm also picking up some new vocabulary in the archery sport. I think I'm too old (75) to try to do a command release as I've got a lifetime of trigger squeezing experience and I know myself. If I try to shoot a target rifle or handgun "on command" my whole body reacts just ahead of when the gun fires that I pull the shot wild. One skill I know I have to work on is to use my back muscles. 

Ha. Speaking of muscles and bones, etc., I've developed a pain in the center of my clavicle which I identify (by looking at a diagram of the shoulder) as an irritation to the ligament attaching the clavicle to the scapula. Oh well, at my age something is supposed to hurt. ;-)

Again, thank you
Pete


----------



## mgx1138 (Mar 29, 2019)

So I am also a long time rifle competitor. I am pretty new to archery and have been shooting an Olympic recurve bow for about a year now. I've asked similar questions here about transferring rifle shooting techniques to target archery, but I haven't gotten many useful answers. I don't think that there are many folks here who've done both disciplines. What I have found though, is that many of the techniques and skills that apply to the rifle DO transfer to the bow, with some small modifications. Calling you shots DEFINITELY is a good skill for the bow as well as the rifle. Also, all of the breathing and shot sequence techniques that you perform with the rifle are adaptable to the bow too. You will figure out what stuff transfers well for you, but shooting the bow is a LOT like shooting offhand with the rifle. Enjoy the process!


----------



## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

I've shot small bore silhouette.
Silhouette is similar to shooting freestyle compound. Both require setting up a stable shot then breaking the trigger (index, thumb, hinge, no difference) smoothly without disturbing it.

The recurve disciplines are closer to pistol shooting. More float, more muscle, a bit faster tempo to avoid breaking down and a more aggressive execution.


----------



## 1/2 Bubble Off (Dec 29, 2016)

peholden said:


> You can probably tell from my title that I've spent much of my life in the world of rifle target shooting. Now that I'm into archery I'm wondering if the same skills apply. When using a release, am I supposed to squeeze the trigger a little bit at a time so that I don't really kow when the arrow will be released? AND, when shooting a gun, the proof of good technique was whether or not the shooter can call the shot -- can tell where the bullet hit on the target. Is that true with archery. When I'm doing everything right, I can see the arrow leaving the bow and I know where it will land. Is that how good target archers think also.
> 
> Oh. When shooting without a release, does a finger shooter basically do the same thing?
> 
> Thank you, Pete


My perspective, as I also came to archery from a rifle and pistol background. You can transfer that methodology into archery and you will shoot well.... 

Conventional archery wisdom is to focus on the target and just kind of let your front sight get in the way. I use this method when I shoot spots with a lens and a dot and I've put up some very respectable numbers. This was the hardest thing for me to "learn" in this sport and initially my scores went down when I first switched to a dot. Once I learned to change my focus to the target and just let the dot cover the spot I wanted to hit, my scores shot up.

I was taught to shoot rifle and pistol by focusing on the front sight post with a fuzzy target in the background. When I shoot pins (hunting and 3D) I use this method. I've been unsuccessful thus far in training myself to shoot pins any other way. (This probably is the reason I struggle the first few practice sessions of 3D/Spot season when I first pick up the other bow.) 

For both flavors of archery, I don't consciously "pull the trigger"... It just kind of happens. If you have good trigger control with a precision rifle, you can use the same method to fire an index release. It will take some time to find the "right" release for YOU and then some more time to adjust it to make it perfect. Shooting "back tension" as I understand is the method to teach people not to punch the trigger. But, if you have good trigger control, you can shoot quite well squeezing an index finger release.

My advice to you is this.... Use what you know and are comfortable with. If you decide to make some changes, make 1 change at a time until it becomes second nature.


----------



## mgx1138 (Mar 29, 2019)

Hiya Matt... I am shooting Olympic recurve, so no "scope" and magnification... I was a Service Rifle shooter, so front site focus was drilled into me. With the recurve bow, I've tried both target focus and pin (or dot) focus. Both work, but I find myself mostly focused on the dot (front sight). Just like when shooting the rifle, when the dot is in the middle, I finish my expansion and the shot just goes. No conscious thought. Also just like the rifle, I call my shots and am rarely "off call." I agree... transfer the rifle skills that work for you with the bow... and be prepared for some things to be different. It's been really fun learning how to shoot the bow after 30 years of competing with the rifle.


----------



## mbriscoe91 (Apr 2, 2020)

I was in the same boat as you, i shot guns and always looked for the "suprise" when the shot was fired, i attempted to the do the same with back tension, i am way more accurate shooting a release with a trigger, i would recomend trying a thumb button. that worked well for me and allowed to to use both a button and have the back tension all in one.


----------



## merlinron (Mar 23, 2020)

when it running right, the shot breaks when you are concentrating the hardest on the x-ring. there are mental and physical drills that can be done to have that happen. in that you are looking at the target with the dot superposed on it, you can see where the dot is when the shot breaks and you can somewhat call the shot. it's usually something like,.." I drifted high and left just as the shot broke, so the arrow is not in the x-ring but is high and left in the bullseye" if you can do that 60 times in a row, you're doing just fine !.


----------



## Mr. Ken (Aug 6, 2019)

Back in the mid 80's, I shot bow hunter limited. That was fixed pins, short stabilizer and fingers. With fingers you do have to be a command shooter. You release the arrow when you are ready. There is no surprise shot going off. The last 14 years I shot rifle silhouette (air rifle, small bore, lever and high power). In silhouette shooting you also have to break the shot when you are ready. Now I am shooting freestyle with a thumb button release. I am a command shooter. When I get anchored, I have extra movement in my bow arm and bow hand. (My dad and grandma both had uncontrollable shakes in their hands. I guess it was passed down to me, but not as much). By having this movement, I have to command shoot the thumb button release. I know what trigger control is. I do not punch / slap the trigger. My thumb is on the thumb button and I do a controlled press of the thumb button to release the shot. 

Using back tension is just a different way to make a release go off.


----------



## Talks cheap (Jul 25, 2020)

In archery speak there are 2 primary ways to release a shot from a compound bow. ”There are more, don’t ask”. The two ways are a command shot and a dynamic shot. You are used to shooting a command shot with a rifle. Using this technique you can progress rapidly to 90 to 95% accuracy in my experience. Unfortunately this style of shooting doesn’t force you to develop proper form and it encourages target panic if your form isn’t good. The other method is shooting a dynamic shot. Dynamic means movement. The movement that they talk about is getting your trigger near the point that it will fire then trying to bring your shoulder blades together behind your back. At some point in this process there will be enough tension added to your trigger that it will release. This is what is known as a back tension release. If you don’t know exactly when it will fire that is known as a surprise release. The motion of your back is sometimes called internal motion because you may not be able to see it externally if you are watching the shooter. There are more dynamic shooters at the highest levels than command shooters by far, but command shooting when done properly can dominate. Tim Gillingham’s performances this year are a case in point. So in your case if you want to shoot at a high level I would recommend finding a coach and develoing proper form. Your experience with aiming will Move you ahead rapidly but if your form isn’t good you will plateau and have to go back and relearn everything.


----------



## Mr. Ken (Aug 6, 2019)

Talks cheap said:


> In archery speak there are 2 primary ways to release a shot from a compound bow. ”There are more, don’t ask”. The two ways are a command shot and a dynamic shot. You are used to shooting a command shot with a rifle. Using this technique you can progress rapidly to 90 to 95% accuracy in my experience. Unfortunately this style of shooting doesn’t force you to develop proper form and it encourages target panic if your form isn’t good. The other method is shooting a dynamic shot. Dynamic means movement. The movement that they talk about is getting your trigger near the point that it will fire then trying to bring your shoulder blades together behind your back. At some point in this process there will be enough tension added to your trigger that it will release. This is what is known as a back tension release. If you don’t know exactly when it will fire that is known as a surprise release. The motion of your back is sometimes called internal motion because you may not be able to see it externally if you are watching the shooter. There are more dynamic shooters at the highest levels than command shooters by far, but command shooting when done properly can dominate. Tim Gillingham’s performances this year are a case in point. So in your case if you want to shoot at a high level I would recommend finding a coach and develoing proper form. Your experience with aiming will Move you ahead rapidly but if your form isn’t good you will plateau and have to go back and relearn everything.


To whom are you replying to:


----------

