# am i overdrawing my recurve ?



## uabdave (Mar 12, 2007)

how many grains per pound are you shooting? If you are too light, it could be causing undo stress on the limbs. Also, I doubt that overdrawing is the problem, as bowyers should have a safe range beyond the measured weight at 28" that the bow could be drawn safely. Maybe you should try longer limbs next time, instead of say a 60" bow maybe a 62'' would be more forgiving of your longer draw.

Dave


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

redrum slaref said:


> anyone had problems with limbs delaminating due to overdrawing. i have a samick recurve 28" draw i draw 30" i just had the second top limb delaminate . the dealer seems to think its because i'm overdrawing. also i want to buy another recurve to replace this one and i don't want to be faced with the same problem. any suggestions greatly appreciated.


I don't think in the case of the Samick, that the overdraw is the issue. That sayed, I've had Martins and Bears come apart, one spectacularly so because of what I think was my draw length... close to 31"... yup... drag on the ground.... 

Aloha... :beer:


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## redrum slaref (Feb 26, 2011)

uabdave said:


> how many grains per pound are you shooting? If you are too light, it could be causing undo stress on the limbs. Also, I doubt that overdrawing is the problem, as bowyers should have a safe range beyond the measured weight at 28" that the bow could be drawn safely. Maybe you should try longer limbs next time, instead of say a 60" bow maybe a 62'' would be more forgiving of your longer draw.
> 
> Dave


i'm shooting 23/64 woods at present no idea what grains per pound they are; longer limbs sounds like the future for me thanx guys for your input 
hope


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## rickstix (Nov 11, 2009)

IMO, it is a construction/glue-up issue and does happen with even the “big name” companies. Making it a draw length issue would be saying that if you only drew a bit shorter everything would be fine…NO…the limbs would merely be on the verge of imminent failure.

I have a long draw and have had many Bear bows and only had one set of limbs delaminate, years ago. Bear used to list their draw lengths as: “None”, which speaks to the integrity of what well-constructed laminated limbs should be. As gluing is a fairly “blind” operation the results should be tested to the extreme, i.e. the limb fails before the glue (and, FYI...30" is not extreme). That said, manufacturers’ serial number items to track failure rates, which help them pinpoint production issues.

Perhaps, you might find out something more (and what the manufacturer could be discovering) about what’s going on with what you have, if you just asked about delamination of a specific product, instead of tying the problem into long draw length…which is a smaller group to begin with. Good Luck, Rick.


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

rickstix said:


> IMO, it is a construction/glue-up issue and does happen with even the “big name” companies. Making it a draw length issue would be saying that if you only drew a bit shorter everything would be fine…NO…the limbs would merely be on the verge of imminent failure.
> 
> I have a long draw and have had many Bear bows and only had one set of limbs delaminate, years ago. Bear used to list their draw lengths as: “None”, which speaks to the integrity of what well-constructed laminated limbs should be. As gluing is a fairly “blind” operation the results should be tested to the extreme, i.e. the limb fails before the glue (and, FYI...30" is not extreme). That said, manufacturers’ serial number items to track failure rates, which help them pinpoint production issues.
> 
> Perhaps, you might find out something more (and what the manufacturer could be discovering) about what’s going on with what you have, if you just asked about delamination of a specific product, instead of tying the problem into long draw length…which is a smaller group to begin with. Good Luck, Rick.


My impressions of limbs coming apart with draw length are a little different. My impression is that with a long draw and improper form lead to stresses on the limbs that create a formula for a set of conditions that are ripe for breakage.

Aloha... :beer:


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## rickstix (Nov 11, 2009)

rattus58 said:


> My impressions of limbs coming apart with draw length are a little different. My impression is that with a long draw and improper form lead to stresses on the limbs that create a formula for a set of conditions that are ripe for breakage.
> 
> Aloha... :beer:


IMO, all bows have a limited number of shots “built-in”, so to speak. If constantly fired, stress is eventually going to win out. “Breakage” is a different issue than delamination…and, as I had alluded, the amount of faith put into glue/gluing should equate to total system failure before glue failure.

Black Swan archery has a page under the heading of “Testing” that shows a 62” bow drawn to (…and was repeatedly drawn to) 45”. The picture is reminiscent of similar ones taken way back in the day with other laminated recurves where the tips were brought as close to touching as you can get, to demonstrate the reliability of the glass-laminated method and how superior they were to many of the all-wood bows of the day, that would turn unacceptable draw lengths for each particular bow into kindling.

Be any/all of that as is may, in the interest of the OP it is still my opinion that receiving little to no use out of limbs because they delaminate with a 30” draw length points to a construction, not a user, problem. The OP has, not surprisingly, been misinformed. Rick.


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

rickstix said:


> IMO, all bows have a limited number of shots “built-in”, so to speak. If constantly fired, stress is eventually going to win out. “Breakage” is a different issue than delamination…and, as I had alluded, the amount of faith put into glue/gluing should equate to total system failure before glue failure.
> 
> Black Swan archery has a page under the heading of “Testing” that shows a 62” bow drawn to (…and was repeatedly drawn to) 45”. The picture is reminiscent of similar ones taken way back in the day with other laminated recurves where the tips were brought as close to touching as you can get, to demonstrate the reliability of the glass-laminated method and how superior they were to many of the all-wood bows of the day, that would turn unacceptable draw lengths for each particular bow into kindling.
> 
> Be any/all of that as is may, in the interest of the OP it is still my opinion that receiving little to no use out of limbs because they delaminate with a 30” draw length points to a construction, not a user, problem. The OP has, not surprisingly, been misinformed. Rick.


Got it... I was not making the distinction there.... 

Much Aloha... :beer:


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## BowmanJay (Jan 1, 2007)

I know others who know much more about bow making than I do have been saying this again and again..... You really should be getting a bow to match your DL. So to answer your question, yes you are overdrawing your bow. I know the samicks are very sensative to this type of thing....as far as bows having limited numbers of shots in them, not sure I agree there and who knows what that number is for each bow as they are and will be different? I know I put roughly 8000 shots or so a year on my bows and this has been going on for many many years, so Im thinking that number is very high to say the least.


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## redrum slaref (Feb 26, 2011)

rickstix said:


> IMO, it is a construction/glue-up issue and does happen with even the “big name” companies. Making it a draw length issue would be saying that if you only drew a bit shorter everything would be fine…NO…the limbs would merely be on the verge of imminent failure.
> 
> I have a long draw and have had many Bear bows and only had one set of limbs delaminate, years ago. Bear used to list their draw lengths as: “None”, which speaks to the integrity of what well-constructed laminated limbs should be. As gluing is a fairly “blind” operation the results should be tested to the extreme, i.e. the limb fails before the glue (and, FYI...30" is not extreme). That said, manufacturers’ serial number items to track failure rates, which help them pinpoint production issues.
> 
> Perhaps, you might find out something more (and what the manufacturer could be discovering) about what’s going on with what you have, if you just asked about delamination of a specific product, instead of tying the problem into long draw length…which is a smaller group to begin with. Good Luck, Rick.


thanks for that Rick i didn't believe it was overdrawing that was causing the delam. merely stating what the dealer had said .i thank all for your comments , advice.


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## Eldermike (Mar 24, 2009)

Second top limb. I am wondering why both were top limbs. I have a riser that has to be shimmed on the top limb for a proper setup of the bow. Is it possible the riser is the issue?


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## FORESTGUMP (May 14, 2008)

BowmanJay said:


> I know others who know much more about bow making than I do have been saying this again and again..... You really should be getting a bow to match your DL. So to answer your question, yes you are overdrawing your bow. I know the samicks are very sensative to this type of thing....as far as bows having limited numbers of shots in them, not sure I agree there and who knows what that number is for each bow as they are and will be different? I know I put roughly 8000 shots or so a year on my bows and this has been going on for many many years, so Im thinking that number is very high to say the least.




So,does that mean that I should not have been shooting this old recurve for all these years? I draw it to 31" but if I were to fully expand I would draw 33". Do they even make a recurve bow with a drawlength of 33"?
Maybe the OP might need a longer bow if it stacks on him which is unlikely at 30". But not likely the cause of the failure. He probably should be talking to the manufacturer about it.


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## redrum slaref (Feb 26, 2011)

FORESTGUMP said:


> So,does that mean that I should not have been shooting this old recurve for all these years? I draw it to 31" but if I were to fully expand I would draw 33". Do they even make a recurve bow with a drawlength of 33"?
> Maybe the OP might need a longer bow if it stacks on him which is unlikely at 30". But not likely the cause of the failure. He probably should be talking to the manufacturer about it.


well after some negotiation with the dealer he is going to take the bow back and refund my purchase price. he alluded to the fact they were having "problems" so now i'm in the market for a left hand t.d. recurve i'll post an ad in the appropiate forum thanx again fellas for your wisdom


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