# OAA AGM October 25 - Easthill



## Big F (Aug 20, 2004)

AGM starts at 10am. Easthill is on Hwy 115/35 just south of Orono. 

Meeting will be held in the upstairs conference area of the Indoor range.


----------



## Topper1018 (Feb 19, 2013)

Is the AGM restricted to OAa members in current standing or is it open to sit in on?


----------



## Stash (Jun 1, 2002)

Members only.


----------



## Topper1018 (Feb 19, 2013)

Tough crowd


----------



## Robert Piette (Mar 21, 2012)

Why would a non-member want to attend and why would they think they could attend an associations Annual General Meeting of the membership? Seems kind of wierd question to ask.


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

you could just give any questions to a member that is going and have them ask if you want


----------



## Topper1018 (Feb 19, 2013)

No questions, no hostility, no intentions. Just a shooters curiosity. I don't see it as a weird question to ask, but hey not my ball not my court. Carry on.


----------



## rockin_johny (Oct 9, 2004)

Robert Piette said:


> Why would a non-member want to attend and why would they think they could attend an associations Annual General Meeting of the membership? Seems kind of wierd question to ask.


 Maybe to see if it is an association that they would be interested in joining and supporting... just a thought


----------



## Robert Piette (Mar 21, 2012)

The minutes of each AGM are posted on the OAA website. Wouldn't that provide a non-member with all the details that would allow them to make an informed decision about joining the association?


----------



## Stash (Jun 1, 2002)

The minutes are posted but you have to enter your OAA membership number and password to access them.

Look, this is a no-brainer. The AGM is the Annual General Meeting *of the Members*. It's a meeting for members to discuss the association's business - it is not the appropriate place for non-members to check out the association. 

You want strangers attending your family get-togethers? Is your high-school reunion open to anybody? How about your workplace Christmas party - can anyone who wants to come and see if they might be interested in joining and supporting your company just wander in? 

No. 

Same thing here. Members only, no hard feelings, just deal with it.


----------



## Topper1018 (Feb 19, 2013)

Sorry to have people get the claws out. I was just curious, my original thought was it might be open to anyone because of the OAa receiving some government funding and such. My mistake. No need for the hackles.


----------



## Stash (Jun 1, 2002)

I don't see any hackles or claws anywhere in this thread. Just questions and answers.

People read too much meaning behind what is just straight text. It shouldn't be necessary to throw a  down every time you disagree with someone to make sure they don't think you're angry.


----------



## wanemann (Oct 7, 2010)

Stash said:


> I don't see any hackles or claws anywhere in this thread. Just questions and answers.
> 
> People read too much meaning behind what is just straight text. It shouldn't be necessary to throw a  down every time you disagree with someone to make sure they don't think you're angry.


no, but it could never hurt


----------



## CLASSICHUNTER (May 20, 2005)

so what happened at agm and I have not received my membership or club membership yet.. any one else get theres


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

not much, new K30 for 3D with possible move out rule to be worked out by rules committee and target/field/indoors alignment with AC/WA. Rules committee to look at class reductions and or amalgamations depending on participation, New updated web sight should be ready by Dec 1 I believe.


----------



## CLASSICHUNTER (May 20, 2005)

cool any word on memberships paperwork have not received mine yet for club and personal


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

K30, really. What was the thinking there? From a club perspective I can see that getting expensive on target inserts. 70# compounds shooting fat carbons beating the snot out the 11 ring from 28yds.


----------



## postman99 (May 9, 2008)

Ya I agree whats the reasoning for the K30 class?


----------



## x-quizit (Mar 8, 2011)

K30 was brought up by some members as a *developmental class*. That is also why there is the move out rule being looked at. I believe there was also the rule of no crossbows in the K30, only because of target life and overall ability for crossbows, no matter who is shooting it, to be able to shoot out to 40 or 50 yards. 

For smaller framed shooters and children, who find it both difficult to shoot the distance, and if they are new, somewhat intimidating, k30 was discussed as a good starting point. There has been a lot of talk about k50 being very good for the sport, but the distance of 50 yards both challenging and intimidating for new shooters, some children and smaller framed shooters. The move out rule is being looked at to ensure this would remain as a developmental class and not a permanent place for someone to compete because they are consistently winning.


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

also the K30 matched up with the white peg so no added work for the club


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

I suspect the move out rule will be something around 380-400 on a 40 target round or# of wins in the 3D/triple crown events over the current year


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

I'm not sure how a move out rule would work in the OAA as there is no central reporting done from open shoots. How will the OAA know if someone is shooting 400 week in week out and who tells them they are out of the class?
I thought the general feeling was that federations needed to reduce classes not add more, this seems to be a step in the wrong direction. Nothing stops beginners shooting non scoring from closer if that's their bag but adding classes to me is not required.


----------



## Robert Piette (Mar 21, 2012)

Bigjono said:


> I'm not sure how a move out rule would work in the OAA as there is no central reporting done from open shoots. How will the OAA know if someone is shooting 400 week in week out and who tells them they are out of the class?
> I thought the general feeling was that federations needed to reduce classes not add more, this seems to be a step in the wrong direction. Nothing stops beginners shooting non scoring from closer if that's their bag but adding classes to me is not required.


The move out rule would likely just be for the OAA Champs and Triple Crown. Also as mentioned above, they are going to look at class reductions and amalgamations based on participation.


----------



## x-quizit (Mar 8, 2011)

On the current website, Championships and Triple Crown results are recorded, so for these events, everyone can see scores and ensure the move out rule is enforced year over year. There was talk with the new website, having the ability to upload other scores as well. This would be the hosting clubs responsibility to upload, just as it is for all target events to ensure qualifying scores are submitted for team ranking. As long as the hosting club is doing their part and getting the information to the OAA, this information should then be available to everyone.

Also Bigjono, we all know in archery, and especially 3d it is a tight knit community and we are all quite aware of what each shooter is capable of shooting. This is not to toot my own horn, but just to make an example of myself and not point fingers at other. If I were to show up to a 3d shoot today and sign up for k30, a large majority of people there would know I have no business being in that class, and although in fun, would ridicule me to the point of changing classes.


----------



## JDoupe (Dec 9, 2006)

X-QUIZIT.......I wouldn't let you be ridiculed alone......I'll shoot it with you!!!!!


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

Robert Piette said:


> The move out rule would likely just be for the OAA Champs and Triple Crown. Also as mentioned above, they are going to look at class reductions and amalgamations based on participation.


Ok thanks. I guess the problem is, 90% of members don't shoot those so could stay forever in that class.


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

x-quizit said:


> On the current website, Championships and Triple Crown results are recorded, so for these events, everyone can see scores and ensure the move out rule is enforced year over year. There was talk with the new website, having the ability to upload other scores as well. This would be the hosting clubs responsibility to upload, just as it is for all target events to ensure qualifying scores are submitted for team ranking. As long as the hosting club is doing their part and getting the information to the OAA, this information should then be available to everyone.
> 
> Also Bigjono, we all know in archery, and especially 3d it is a tight knit community and we are all quite aware of what each shooter is capable of shooting. This is not to toot my own horn, but just to make an example of myself and not point fingers at other. If I were to show up to a 3d shoot today and sign up for k30, a large majority of people there would know I have no business being in that class, and although in fun, would ridicule me to the point of changing classes.


Toot away, you've earned the right Lol. It would be nice if the clubs did run tight shoots and post scores to the website but I have my doubts. Most don't even run the current OAA classes, most don't adhere to OAA rules so I'm not sure how bona fide scores could or would get posted. Back to the class issue though, if you compound types think it's a good idea then that's great, my concerns are target wear and the watering down of 3D.


----------



## x-quizit (Mar 8, 2011)

JDoupe said:


> X-QUIZIT.......I wouldn't let you be ridiculed alone......I'll shoot it with you!!!!!


JDoupe, it has been way too long!!!!!


----------



## CLASSICHUNTER (May 20, 2005)

that's why we have hunter class to 35 yds.....as I stated before k50 should of been k30.. as it was to save arrows.. well now people will shoot in their capabilities... k50 could be eliminated then.. as shooter becomes proficient...then they can move to open etc eyc


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

I don't think the people that shoot K50 have any interest in shooting unmarked but do like shooting 3D


----------



## CLASSICHUNTER (May 20, 2005)

60-70% of k 50 entries are switch overs from open class just look at the names that shoot it ..all or most are proficient open shooters.. entering this class.. .. was introduced at agm with comments like loosing arrows.. I think proficient shooting .. does this and confidence.. which is a 30 yd shot not 50 yds just my opinion.. k 30 is a move in the right direction for beginners


----------



## CLASSICHUNTER (May 20, 2005)

just a thought on k classes ... maybe make them a non award class to save clubs money .... then again would draw newbies as competitive shooters would enter trophy classes... then would also eliminate sandbaggers as no real bragging rights ..and no need for move outs


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

Ted, I think the K50 will become the biggest class soon. The good shooters have moved over and many others are following. I have no issues with K50 if the guys want to make it a pure shooting challenge, have at it. I don't agree with K30 though and can't see our club ever offering it judging by the chat about it. There are better ways to bring new shooters in than further watering things down but I do agree that if we have to have it then make it a guest class or something.


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

As it sits right now the K 50 looks like it is keeping participation as opposed to losing them, the K30 was introduced because even with it being marked some just cant hit or reach 50yrd effectively, the K30 should help that, when they do win or have a few high scores a move out rules would just put them into the K50 or what ever class they wanted. People switching from unmarked classes to marked classes isn't bad because they are still showing up to the events.


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

Does a K30 class exist anywhere else in archery or just here?
K40 from Hunter pegs may have been better.


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

that was discussed, the person that proposed the class just figured that using the existing white stakes was easiest for everyone and that a K40 wasn't enough of a difference from the K50 distance to actually account for new or beginning shooters


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

Couldn't K40 have just used Hunter class stakes?


----------



## FiFi (Dec 4, 2002)

Bigjono said:


> Couldn't K40 have just used Hunter class stakes?


yes but as stated the person that proposed it didn't think it was enough difference to account for new archrs


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

Well I guess we just need to see how it goes don't we.


----------



## ontario3-d'r (Feb 17, 2012)

Just something I need to get off my chest. This thread, and other threads, have made numerous references about their displeasure of the better shooters moving over to K50. I know that there was ALOT of negative talk about my participation this past summer shooting the K50 class. Personally, after all that I have done for the sport of archery in this province, how anyone would talk like that about me (behind my back, and not to my face) really hurts. Just goes to show who are really friends, and who only pretend to be when in the same room together. I really don't feel that I should have to defend my decision to shoot the K50 this past summer. The reason however, is very simple. None of the other OPEN shooters planned on making the journey to the tournament. I did not want to shoot as the only competitor, so I entered K50. Then, in order to complete the triple crown, I shot the other 2 legs as well. I did enter the BHO class last summer a couple of times as well in regular Sunday shoots, and received an unbelievable amount of flack for doing that too, so damned if I do, damned if I don't. It is absolutely no-ones business what class a competitor decides to participate in. The club, and the club executives, should just be grateful that the competitor showed up and spent $50 at their facility. Especially since there are very few weekends where there are not multiple choices about where to shoot. 

As far as the K30 goes, I think that you are really on to something here. If the goal is to bring the bow hunting community out to a 3D competition, then the K30 class will be perfect. As in a previous post, the K50 class is destined to become the largest category. I think the K50 class was limited in its ability to bring the bow hunting community out to an event. I worked archery retail for 24 years, and I can tell you that most people who are just bow hunters, do not shoot 50 yards, even in practice. Tournament shooters that hunt absolutely practice with their hunting equipment that far, but not the person who just bow hunts. 85% of successful whitetails bow hunters in Ontario, shoot at 25 yards or less. Those guys still would not come out to tournaments with the knowledge that they would have to shoot twice as far as they do in practice. The K30 WILL bring those guys out. Graduates of the K30 class will move up to the K50 in the years to come, making the K50 class grow even larger in the future. The K50 did a pretty good job at bringing target shooters to 3D, as was part of its intention.


----------



## chrispol (Mar 26, 2008)

i would like to thank you all for destroying the true nature of a 3d shoot . The clubs could save thousands of dollars and put out butts and groups put out x targets pre marked for each target to be handed in at the end of the round instead of buying 3d targets . Really that's all these marked ranges amounts to is a glorified spot shot . The only reason new people don't come any more is the pure arrogance of the supposed better shooters , stupid comments and put down of equipment or skill . I used to attend six or more shoots depending on schedule . Now ZERO , not even my club shoots . And I really can't see the new trend beneficial. What made part of shooting 3d fun was estimating ranges and hitting your mark to improve skill . Now these glorified target rigs come out can't judge yardage and create a mindless class . But now they're a 3d shooter . As for distance there are generally three stakes to shoot from and at registration any concerns about distance can be addressed as well as class . I can go on but not now , I'll wait to see what follows.


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

Well as someone who shoots a "glorified" target recurve in 3D I face that kind of mindless prejudice all the time. There aren't target bows or hunting bows, there are just bows, period. I think turning up at 3D shoots wearing camo is dumb but if guys want to do it, that is their choice. 3D is not hunting or simulated hunting, it's a target event, nothing more.
My objection to K30 is not the range finder, again you have the choice, use one or don't use one, my objection is it's not offering any challenge to beginners and it will kill a clubs targets.


----------



## Pic (Sep 12, 2003)

So if the K30 is a developmental class, how are they going to regulate who shoots in it? After all, developmental class means newbie shooters striving to move on to bigger and better things...no?

Just curious.


----------



## peregrine82 (Aug 25, 2007)

3D archery like all things in life is a constantly evolving pursuit. It was started many years ago to offer challenging targets that simulated hunting scenarios. Targets were 2D then evolved to rudimentary 3D to the 

sophisticated targets we see today. In the USA the IBO ruled 3D archery until the ASA was formed in the South and look how that has taken off. The IBO is in decline because of a rigid mind set and a refusal to listen to its 

members. The ASA is constantly changing and adapting to changing times, as a result attendance has skyrocketed to the point where venues are struggling to handle the numbers. I believe we can either follow the IBO 

model and go into a death spiral or we can listen to new ideas and incorporate them in to our tournaments to see if it will work. I am a big believer in the premise that the market place dictates success or failure. If the 

archery community likes a clubs tournament structure they will support the event. To paraphrase Field of dreams, "build it and they will come". Tim was absolutely correct in his post, for others to ridicule him for entering

K50 was petty and unworthy of comment. Shoot what ever class you want, if you come to our club with your money and time we will welcome you with open arms and treat you with the respect you deserve. We try to 

provide a first class annual tournament and so far we have been rewarded with excellent attendance and favourable comments. If we can improve our event by listening to fresh ideas then by all means we will fly them and 

monitor the results. As I stated earlier the market place will determine the success or failure of the new K30 class.


----------



## peregrine82 (Aug 25, 2007)

I would be remiss here if I didn't mention Ted's Hospital charity shoot as an example of "If you build it, they will come". The Perth shoot has been a great shoot to attend for the last few years. Ted had a vision and with a 

tremendous amount of very hard work made the tournament a "must attend" destination. He certainly had his hiccups but learned from shooters input and made the necessary changes. There is no substitute for hard work

and vision, that is what Eric is attempting with his ONT3D venture and I certainly hope he is successful as it will only enhance all 3D in the Province.


----------



## Bigjono (Apr 21, 2009)

I think you have a good point there, good shoots attract shooters, both world class and newbies, average of poor shoots don't. We can add classes all day long but if the shoots themselves are poor it only puts people off.


----------

