# Is there a bow brand you will NOT purchase?



## Monkeybutt2000 (May 7, 2009)

Don't have to give a reason,but feel free. For me, Obsession and Elite.


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## PostalRandy23 (Sep 23, 2017)

Why not Elite?


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## Mathew Lyman (Feb 25, 2017)

Bowtech


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## JMart294 (Feb 2, 2012)

It was bowtech... but own a REIGN 6 and it's awesome.


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## frog gigger (May 4, 2007)

Yes.


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## johndeere87 (Sep 10, 2009)

3-4 years ago if it wasn’t a Hoyt. I wasn’t going to own it. Now I try and give them all a fair shake. But Bowtech has a bigger hill to climb for me personally. I had one come unhinged right behind me at the range a few years ago. I liked the RealmX When I shot it this year while testing bows. But I did wince a little when I drew it back.


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## sean1 (Dec 5, 2009)

Bowtech


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## psychobaby111 (Mar 23, 2008)

Bear comes to mind


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## AntlerCRAZED (Oct 12, 2009)

Hoyt because I can't afford their flagship bow and even if I could I don't think they out shoot some of the bows that are $500 cheaper.I love the look and the feel,I just have never been able to get over the recent prices.Few years ago I would have owned one when they were slightly more affordable


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## page xt (Mar 26, 2011)

Bowtech till I bought a realm x, now I won’t be without one the best holds well and is very smooth


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Anything Wildgame, cuddeback, tenzing! Does that count?


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## hoyt fo life555 (Jan 31, 2005)

Can't say " I never will " ,because I did, But never will again, bowtech.


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## The Old Guy (Mar 28, 2017)

PSE, stems from many years ago. They used to be very “twangy.” Might not be that way anymore.


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## webenic (Sep 15, 2012)

I'll give anything a try if its priced right!


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## Trevor02TA (Sep 8, 2009)

New breed and Obsession for me.


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

I can say I probably wouldn't buy a Bear, Martin, APA, Obsession, Darton and maybe some other smaller brand bows. Not because they aren't good bows, I just think that the big guys have their designs refined to a point beyond the others. 

Bowtech, Hoyt, Elite, PSE, and Matthews are far enough out ahead, imo, I don't think I'd consider anything other than those. I thought Elite was off that list until this year. 

The one small batch bow I would try would be Xpedition. Nice risers, hybrid cams, and a I've seen a lot of guys shooting them in person. 

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## nvcnvc (Jan 27, 2009)

I'll try anything... you don't know whats out there unless you try things...
Now, the only thing I will never, ever buy, is an electric car...This is where draw the line


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## 1faith (Dec 8, 2010)

Obsession, Hoyt or Prime, I've owned multiple models of each but no more.


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## AntlerInsane83 (Jun 28, 2016)

I’ll try anything once.


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## nelovec (Jun 20, 2016)

I think I miss the point of this thread....


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## bowtech2006 (Apr 1, 2006)

Obsession for me owned 4 not anymore tho


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## big44a4 (Dec 23, 2016)

This thread would be of some help if you briefly mentioned reasons for not going with a particular brand anymore...


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## HbDane (Sep 13, 2013)

Gearhead...... I don't think I need to give a reason do I?


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## The Dog Man (Dec 31, 2017)

I wouldn’t purchase a Bear for myself... but I’d lovingly accept a Kuma as a gift!


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## tialloydragon (Mar 14, 2013)

I'll try anything that is innovative or just plain "different" regardless of what company puts it out.

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## sawtoothscream (Apr 19, 2008)

Anything strother starts. Won't buy from a startup until they are around a few years neither.


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## Bearpawx4 (Apr 20, 2013)

The Old Guy said:


> PSE, stems from many years ago. They used to be very “twangy.” Might not be that way anymore.


Their not any more...


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## Bearpawx4 (Apr 20, 2013)

Hoyt, Mathews,


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## Blackwidow25 (Apr 20, 2015)

For me it’s Bow tech & PSE. & Bear


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## icemanls2 (Mar 15, 2007)

Mathews, I can't get over the initial "catch us if you can" solocam era. I worked at a pro shop, the axle holes in the limbs were wearing out in a hurry and they weren't standing behind them and treating customers like crap. I have a good memory.


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## edthearcher (Nov 2, 2002)

bowtech


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## john197244 (Oct 9, 2017)

No I think they are all good now but all shoot a little different


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## shootstraight (Apr 28, 2005)

sawtoothscream said:


> Anything strother starts. Won't buy from a startup until they are around a few years neither.


..and yet you shoot a Bowtech, kinda funny.


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## MIKEY CUSTOM-G (Oct 5, 2002)

The Old Guy said:


> PSE, stems from many years ago. They used to be very “twangy.” Might not be that way anymore.


Funny you wrote this ! Lol

I’m a long time PSE lover. I dropped them when Hoyt went carbon and been with Hoyt since.

Last week my brother who was the one pushing me to Hoyt, buys a PSE Evolve.

The bow is smoking fast, 328 @ 28 inches mid mods. He states the factory strings are as good if not better than any custom string you can find. He states ? ZERO vibe or twang , hits a bullethole thru paper on the 3rd shot and slinging darts  out to 40 yards and says I NEED to try one to believe it.

He’s a staunch die hard Hoyt man the last 10 years I’d say.


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## ppkaprince98 (Mar 13, 2008)

Elite


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## Easttxbowman (Oct 23, 2015)

Prob won’t do obsession again..


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## Early Ice (Mar 18, 2008)

sawtoothscream said:


> Anything strother starts. Won't buy from a startup until they are around a few years neither.


Sir, you shoot a bowtech.

For me it would be a Mathews. Can't stand them, won't shoot them. I hate Elite too but if I dropped my bow from a tree and their was an Elite shop near, i'd buy one. If it were a Mathews shop, i'd just go to walmart and buy a big knife.


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## deadquiet (Jan 25, 2005)

No and IMHO if you think that way you are too caught up in brand names. What if next year a brand you have sworn off for whatever reason makes a great model that fits you like a glove? Will you bite your nose off to spite your face? Will you not even try it? 

I'm so glad I have the freedom of mind to buy what I want............lol. People have asked about my "truck has no stickers" phrase in my sig......this is exactly what I mean about it. It's a poke at the brand loyal blinded boaster. 

People get so caught in in names and bashing other brands they lose site of reality. So if you have a big giant Mathews sticker on the rear window of the truck HOW can you shoot anything else.........lol


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## Early Ice (Mar 18, 2008)

icemanls2 said:


> Mathews, I can't get over the initial "catch us if you can" solocam era. I worked at a pro shop, the axle holes in the limbs were wearing out in a hurry and they weren't standing behind them and treating customers like crap. I have a good memory.


My thoughts exactly...I live in WI, strong Mathews cult here obviously


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## long7349 (Dec 21, 2017)

big44a4 said:


> This thread would be of some help if you briefly mentioned reasons for not going with a particular brand anymore...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I second that.


Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk


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## bowman757 (Oct 30, 2017)

Hoyt for me...not that they're not good bows but I personally don't like the looks and the only Hoyt I owned was a VTEC and it gave me and my dealer fits!!! 2 sets of limbs from the factory. Sent back to factory to get fixed and came back worse. 
My dealer said "that bow is possessed"! Get rid of it. I did!
The only thing we could think of is it had a bent riser. Which the factory claimed it didn't.


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## Whitetip Hunter (Jul 27, 2006)

Afraid to even draw a Bowtech.


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## highwaynorth (Feb 17, 2005)

Strothers
New Breed
High Country
Martin
Bear
Apa
Expedition


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## savage 14 (Sep 19, 2010)

gearhead


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## norsemen (Feb 22, 2011)

It is to everyone's advantage to keep an open mind in regards to brands. Things change. I have two bows at present. Both are different brands. One for hunting and one for play. Five years ago I wouldn't have considered either, due to the brand and what they were offering at the time.


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## Daave (Jul 22, 2005)

-Oneida
-Limbsaver
-Golden Eagle

I know Golden Eagle is not in business but i listed them because i will never buy from anything other than the top brands because of Golden Eagle. They came out with some good bows, or so i thought, and sold them with a "lifetime warranty". Six months later my bow needed repair and when i went back to the dealer he told me golden eagle were out of business. I owned two limbsavers they were both awful! You would think coming from a company that makes silencing equipment their bows would be silent, but they are loud as a .22, the only thing to quiet my two bows were a 766 grain arrow. Oneida, just sucks all around.


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## pottergreg (Mar 20, 2015)

I tried to like Obsession (bought2), I just never could shoot them as well as some other brands, other people love them? Feels cheap to me and had weird flyers?
I'm warming up to Bowtech, looks like their limb problems are behind them. (used to be on the no fly list)
Mathews always felt heavy weight forward to me, needed a back bar with 14 ounces!
There are so many bow companies out there, some are very hard to try out, but glad I tried Prime They look/feel like quality and hold!


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## Boatman71 (Jul 16, 2013)

Mathews


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## reelsnow (Sep 5, 2014)

Wildgame , had a couple of their trail cams and they did not last very long at all.They did replace camera when it crapped out but the replacements didn't fair any better.I think I went thru 3-4 cameras that summer and none ran for more than a couple months.Hopefully they are better now but I will never buy another.


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## Early Ice (Mar 18, 2008)

highwaynorth said:


> Strothers
> New Breed
> High Country
> Martin
> ...


you forgot Athens, Hoyt, mathews, Darton, whisper creek, parker. LOL


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## skynight (Nov 5, 2003)

Anything sporting a riser bridge or binary cam.


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## luciogod (Feb 9, 2015)

Mathews for me.
I'm sure they are good bows but can't get past their fugly designs.

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## AntlerInsane83 (Jun 28, 2016)

I’m a little surprised at all the dislike for Bear Archery. Admittedly I have owned almost every brand under the sun but I have found Bear to make a really nice bow, especially lately.


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## highwaynorth (Feb 17, 2005)

Early Ice said:


> you forgot Athens, Hoyt, mathews, Darton, whisper creek, parker. LOL


No, I did forget Oneida though. Whisper Creek and Parker don't even cross my radar as a bow brand. lol.


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## Boatman71 (Jul 16, 2013)

highwaynorth said:


> No, I did forget Oneida though. Whisper Creek and Parker don't even cross my radar as a bow brand. lol.


Pearson
OK Archery 

LOL!


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## SHPoet (Nov 13, 2009)

PSE. Not because of quality but because of the owner.


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## highwaynorth (Feb 17, 2005)

Boatman71 said:


> Pearson
> OK Archery
> 
> LOL!


Pearson, nope. I would maybe try an OK if I got a good enough deal on one. Pretty much anything with a small to non existent dealer
network is off my list.


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## lees (Feb 10, 2017)

Speaking for myself, it's easier to say *what* would be a showstopper for a particular brand/company. For me, it's two things:
- poor/nonexistent parts availability and factory support
- rapid planned obsolescence or turnover in the product line (models discontinued after a very short time).

The most important thing about any compound bow is keeping it together with parts. Unlike a typical recurve which has no moving parts, compounds have bearings, axles, bolts, circlips and so on that wear out, strip, pop off and get lost in the shop and are susceptible to damage and need replaced from time to time. 

No matter how good quality it is, it's worthless if you can't get parts for it over its entire service life and at a reasonable cost in a reasonable time frame. 

So for me, that rules out a bow-only purchase for all of the major brands for me. I have it on some authority that Mathews and Elite continue to support all of their bow lines, even though they both suffer from the rapid-turnover problem too. The Elite Victory and the Mathews Conquest seem to still be around in one form or another, but even these two manufacturers are still throwing away perfectly good bows every 2 or so years on a repeated basis. I won't even go into the other major brands, which are just as bad if not worse with orphaning even their high-end bows very rapidly and have very short memories when it comes to supporting the older bows a few years down the road. 

So if I were buy another compound bow of any make today, I'd only get one that I could buy a stock of spare parts for at the same time as I could buy the bow itself. Another criteria would be if it's easy to make strings for, but as far as brands go, I wouldn't trust a single one of those companies for long-term parts and support. So I'd get the bow, as well as at least one set of spare cams, bearings, axles, and bolt sets along with it.

lee.


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## XxOHIOARCHERxX (Jul 17, 2013)

Bowtech,, no way


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## whack n stack (Dec 23, 2007)

Gearhead is the only bow I wouldn't be too interested in.


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## Dickenscpa (May 2, 2015)

Easttxbowman said:


> Prob won’t do obsession again..


I was gonna say Obsession as well, but you are who I traded my Obsession to so now I feel like crap. LOL! If it's any consolation I no longer have the Mathews you traded to me.


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## Easttxbowman (Oct 23, 2015)

Dickenscpa said:


> I was gonna say Obsession as well, but you are who I traded my Obsession to so now I feel like crap. LOL! If it's any consolation I no longer have the Mathews you traded to me.



Don’t feel bad lol! I gave it to my brother so he could get started and he won’t put the thing down to even consider a new bow! He’s killed so many pigs with that k34. It does like chewing on cables though! No problem on the Mathews lol, it wasn’t close to my heart.


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## Alaska at heart (Aug 25, 2009)

Not sure why several of you are down on Obsession? I just started shooting the Phoenix XL late last summer and liked it enough to pick up a new 17 this winter. Is it the buy-out from Arcus which seems to have lowered the CS?


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## Jollyarcher (Feb 8, 2010)

I didn't count them all, but add 1 more to the "Never again BowTech" list.

Reasons - QC and CS avoidance.

Never again.


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## Bearpawx4 (Apr 20, 2013)

AntlerInsane83 said:


> I’m a little surprised at all the dislike for Bear Archery. Admittedly I have owned almost every brand under the sun but I have found Bear to make a really nice bow, especially lately.


I agree, had an Arena 30, and do really like it. Buddy shoots an Anarchy, lives it, and shoots very well.
Don't currently own one but would again. Maybe the Kuma in the future?


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## buckmaster27 (Feb 4, 2005)

Martin for me


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## hunter9264 (Mar 7, 2018)

None comes to mind for me, if it works for me I am going to shoot it.


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## dnv23 (Feb 8, 2011)

highwaynorth said:


> Pearson, nope. I would maybe try an OK if I got a good enough deal on one. Pretty much anything with a small to non existent dealer
> network is off my list.


Obsession?


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## dnv23 (Feb 8, 2011)

Alaska at heart said:


> Not sure why several of you are down on Obsession? I just started shooting the Phoenix XL late last summer and liked it enough to pick up a new 17 this winter. Is it the buy-out from Arcus which seems to have lowered the CS?


Its not the bows, they shoot great when they are properly put together and the parts are machined correctly. They have the absolute worst CS I have ever delt with. Nothing but problems with my K34 until my pro shop took it apart and fixed all of their mistakes. The fact that they flat out lie about the performance of their bows doesn't help either.


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## sawtoothscream (Apr 19, 2008)

shootstraight said:


> ..and yet you shoot a Bowtech, kinda funny.


Yup, he didn't design this one and isn't with them. Wasn't 06 his last year with them?

Should have said any company he starts and owns, pretty much post KK.


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## 173BC (Mar 10, 2010)

I'm thinking Elite and maybe Bowtech.


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## jacobh (Jun 7, 2009)

Hoyt.... terrible CS. Every Hoyt I've owned limbs splinter pro shop couldn't tune one bow sent it back to Hoyt came back arrow sitting way off side Hoyt says that's fine. Never again


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## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

Hoyt.

I like to check out the smaller programs. Many times they are not constrained from trying new technology. They don't always hit a home run, but neither do the big boys.


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## Alaska at heart (Aug 25, 2009)

dnv23 said:


> Its not the bows, they shoot great when they are properly put together and the parts are machined correctly. They have the absolute worst CS I have ever delt with. Nothing but problems with my K34 until my pro shop took it apart and fixed all of their mistakes. The fact that they flat out lie about the performance of their bows doesn't help either.


I guess I have been fortunate and so has my buddy who owned 3 before I gave them a try. My two Phoenix XL's tuned easy with new Catfish Custom strings and have stayed in tune. Sorry to hear that others have not done so well.

If there is a brand that I have a knee-jerk resistance to it would be Mathews because of all the fan-boy-ism that goes along with the different models. Then later on you read of this bow or that bow having issues that few admitted when they were current flag ship models. Bowtech of course has the limb reputation, but the newer versions seem to be turning a corner. My nephew shot a Guardian for a few years and really liked it, then went to Prime for several years before buying a used Reign early this winter. I shot it and it is a nice bow.....hopefully with longevity.


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## tibbes (Feb 12, 2013)

Boatman71 said:


> OK Archery
> 
> LOL!


To each his own but I can`t think of anything better. I stick with OK archery for life...


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## jrex2506 (Apr 3, 2014)

Last few years i shot only the little companies. But...i went back to mathews just only new bow i could get into liking. Nothing wrong with the smaller guys. I just hate the cult like following from the big companies. Wont buy from the other big brands, hoyt, bowtech or pse. 

Dont knock gearhead til you shoot one. Look stupid, shot great. 

From what ive seen, if u dont back up your products or have good CS, people remember for a long time. As present in this thread. 

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## bucco921 (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm not really close minded, I'd buy just about any of them under the right circumstances.. Gearhead is one I'd love to try, never understand why they get dismissed so quick. Besides cost and looks I don't get it??


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## chevy_freak (Sep 27, 2015)

Bowtech. Not because of their prior limb problems, but because of the way they handled the limb problems. Doesn't help their draw cycle is horrible IMO.

Mathews. Only thing I have against them is the way they treated my local dealer who then dropped them. They don't have any bows that really made me want to spend $900 either.

I couldn't get myself to hold a gearhead. Unless they've started making different draw lengths I'm not interested in a 10" release.

My buddy is a Hoyt diehard, so I do have fun ridiculing him about it when I beat him with a setup that is 1/2 the cost. Nothing against them and I'd try one if I wasn't forking out $1500+.

I've shot damn near everything else, and there are some hidden gems from the smaller companies. Lack of support and ownership transitions were the only reason I went away from Martin. I'd love to try their new stuff but when I don't have a single stocking dealer in state it's not happening. 

After getting my xpedition setup I don't think I'll be changing for awhile anyways. I'll pick up a perfexion at some point for spots, but the denali is killing the 3d course.


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## JRHOADES20 (Jul 11, 2012)

Obsession for me.


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## maxxis88 (Apr 3, 2010)

Oneida


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## rossi9s (Sep 25, 2005)

Based on what i read on the internet, because its always true -right.
I'll not shoot a bowtech.


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## MIKEY CUSTOM-G (Oct 5, 2002)

This day, I can’t see any reason to not buy any bow.

Years past ? I’d say anything Kevin Strother would make money from, I’d stay away, and did. But he finally tried to make amends to the people he absconded money from and ran with it to declare BK with his K&K company.

Speaking of which, I’d never buy a K&K bow with its original cam system brain fart, irregardless how many people claim theirs tunes ( yeah right ! ). Lol 


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## GrooGrux (Jun 3, 2009)

Xpedition

Not not that may never shoot one of their bows again, but I've owned 2 & I just can't get along with their grip. Plus being a small company, with DLS cams, their resale sucks. The atr chewed the crap out of s brand new set of fury strings on an X7, I had pics & every kind of evidence needed, yet the company still refuses to admit their is a problem or do anything about it & continues using it. BCY seemed fine. But even my Xplorer started showing more wear than normal. 

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## WYelkhunter (Mar 26, 2006)

Mathews. they have never had a bow I even wanted to try out.


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## gibber (Apr 11, 2015)

PSE and Elite.


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## 45er (Jan 18, 2009)

GrooGrux said:


> Xpedition
> 
> Not not that may never shoot one of their bows again, but I've owned 2 & I just can't get along with their grip. Plus being a small company, with DLS cams, their resale sucks. The atr chewed the crap out of s brand new set of fury strings on an X7, I had pics & every kind of evidence needed, yet the company still refuses to admit their is a problem or do anything about it & continues using it. BCY seemed fine. But even my Xplorer started showing more wear than normal.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Is your Xplorer for sale?

Also, to the OP's question, I'd "never say never" on something like this. However, I just can't get in sync with how PSE bows _look_. I've heard their new Evolve cam system is awesome and I have no reason to believe their quality isn't right in line with everyone in the business, but that "Darth Vader" look just doesn't appeal to me.


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## GrooGrux (Jun 3, 2009)

45er said:


> Is your Xplorer for sale?
> 
> Also, to the OP's question, I'd "never say never" on something like this. However, I just can't get in sync with how PSE bows _look_. I've heard their new Evolve cam system is awesome and I have no reason to believe their quality isn't right in line with everyone in the business, but that "Darth Vader" look just doesn't appeal to me.


It was a few months ago. But it sold. 

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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

Bowtech/Diamond. While working for a shop for several years, they were the absolute worst customer service we had to deal with. Always eager to blame the owner for obvious warranty problems. Always playing dumb like they had never heard of common problems with their equipment, even if we had told them about the issues multiple times already. Always slow to send parts. It was enough to turn me off of them forever.


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## Had a Hoyt (Nov 28, 2006)

Blowtech


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## Monkeybutt2000 (May 7, 2009)

Good responses.and the reason I didn't include why I won't buy a particular bow brand has already spelled itself out. Totally subjective. I will cover a few bows I like and the ones I listed.

Bowtech: I believe I'm on #11 with the X. I strayed away for a year to see how the new limbs held up. I never had an issue,but an RPM I sold my BIL had a limb de-laminate.
PSE: They just fit me, from the original X-Force to my current Decree HD. They can be a pain to tune sometimes,but after you get them right they are shooters.
Xpedition: Nice bows,top notch machine work. Stiff draw but man are they fast! You WILL take a bath on resale,so that's something to consider.
Elite: I bought a barely used GT500 off here in 09'. The bow shot well,but the draw cycle was terrible. It felt 10# more than it was 60#. Funky grip too.
Obsession: The clown explosion colors when they first came out, way short reports of meeting IBO speed. I've only seen them once at an R100 a few years back. I've never shot one,nobody local carries them.
So there you have it, these are just MY opinions about some brands :wink:


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## DJO (Dec 5, 2008)

GrooGrux said:


> Xpedition
> 
> Not not that may never shoot one of their bows again, but I've owned 2 & I just can't get along with their grip. Plus being a small company, with DLS cams, their resale sucks. The atr chewed the crap out of s brand new set of fury strings on an X7, I had pics & every kind of evidence needed, yet the company still refuses to admit their is a problem or do anything about it & continues using it. BCY seemed fine. But even my Xplorer started showing more wear than normal.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I agree. I could never get comfortable with the grip. Difficult to tune because I would get a right tear, tune, get a left tear, tune, get a right tear tune....The ATR chews through strings, tough to watch your brand new strings get torn up after 100 shots. You almost have to give the bow away in the classifieds. On the plus side, I did like the fit+finish and my Xcursion 6 was shockingly fast. The draw cycle and valley was decent for the speed.


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## frog gigger (May 4, 2007)

GrooGrux said:


> Xpedition
> 
> Not not that may never shoot one of their bows again, but I've owned 2 & I just can't get along with their grip. Plus being a small company, with DLS cams, their resale sucks. The atr chewed the crap out of s brand new set of fury strings on an X7, I had pics & every kind of evidence needed, yet the company still refuses to admit their is a problem or do anything about it & continues using it. BCY seemed fine. But even my Xplorer started showing more wear than normal.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


I knew someone would come along and detail why I answered yes to this thread.


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## Monkeybutt2000 (May 7, 2009)

frog gigger said:


> I knew someone would come along and detail why I answered yes to this thread.


And once again I'll swoop in to "defend" Xpedition. I had 5 X bows,NEVER had an issue with the ATR. I know some have had issues. Secondly, X bows don't have draw specific cams.


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## GrooGrux (Jun 3, 2009)

Monkeybutt2000 said:


> And once again I'll swoop in to "defend" Xpedition. I had 5 X bows,NEVER had an issue with the ATR. I know some have had issues. Secondly, X bows don't have draw specific cams.


My bad, correct, not dls cams. Module based. But when competitors allow you to rotate a mod after simply loosening 2 screws, it may as well be dls, especially after you factor in how far & few their dealers are located. 

I won't argue the atr, we all know its a problem. Maybe with just some string material and/or builders, but it's a problem. 

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## bowcrete (Dec 29, 2008)

New Breed, Obsession,been there done that


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## Supersteeb (Mar 4, 2015)

Obsession for me, you can thank Dennis Lewis and Kevin strother for that. They both attempted to bash my Mathews bow when I was 16 at an outdoor show. I was taking it to another friend of mine at the show to have it worked on and they stopped me on the way to my friends booth and attempted to tell me how my bow was a big piece of junk and to get rid of it and get their flashy new obsession.(it was the ugliest bow I’d ever seen). But that alone made me not even try one let alone ever want one. Then Kevin strother piped in telling me about hunting and stories and such all while wearing black eyeliner and spiked bracelets, my dad and I just laughed at them and walked away. That stil sticks with me today.


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## DeerCook (Jan 23, 2006)

I will just never own another bow that isn't from a major company, None of them Ever hold any resale value. Even Prime doesn't do very well in the resale category. I'll stick with the Bigs from now on.


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## Ozzwald782 (Mar 19, 2018)

Pse


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## Ybuck (Apr 21, 2007)

can't think of any


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## big44a4 (Dec 23, 2016)

DeerCook said:


> I will just never own another bow that isn't from a major company, None of them Ever hold any resale value. Even Prime doesn't do very well in the resale category. I'll stick with the Bigs from now on.


Primes issue with resale is DL specific cams.


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## williston716 (Jan 22, 2018)

Bought my first Mathews in February, Halon X, really nice bow, but I won't buy another Mathews because of their c/s and them always sending me back to dealer for everything, for example when I asked for string and cable lengths it was given to me hand written on a scrap of paper by the dealer on my next visit, bow came with no owners manual, and no published information on their website.

I was considering an Elite purchase and when I googled "elite tuning" I found a model year specific tuning guide, published by Elite, that include all specs and tuning information. Why wouldn't Mathews have something like this?


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## deadbuck98 (Apr 3, 2016)

Pse! I've shot several of them and I'm always shocked at the small valley and vibration. My Halon is just sooo much nicer!!!

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## talon1961 (Mar 13, 2008)

Neither Bowtech or Mathews for me ever again.


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## bowcrete (Dec 29, 2008)

talon1961 said:


> Neither Bowtech or Mathews for me ever again.


I tried the Mathews love, instant divorce lol


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## Bourbon Boy (Mar 18, 2013)

Never thought I would own a Blowtech, but it's now my favorite bow. I wouldn't buy a Martin, Obsession, or New Breed, not that they are bad, but the resale stinks. You have to pay someone to take any of them, they loose way more than half the price in less than 6 months. A friend sold his New Breed for $300, not a scratch, 3 months old.--BB


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## Simpleiowaguy (Jan 10, 2011)

I’d Have to say a Hoyt. Their prices are getting ridiculous. I buy whatever feels right otherwise. I tend to always go back to bowtech though. Their tunability is awesome.


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## Mallardbreath (Dec 7, 2007)

Used to not consider Bowtech, but it seems their limb issues are behind them. I would definitely consider one now. Also never really like PSE much, but their Evolve cam has my interest. Probably wouldn't buy a Bear, Martin (used to have a Bengal), and definitely not a Gearhead. Of the top bows, I am least interested in Mathews right now. Short and heavy just doesn't do it for me. Loved the Drenalin I had though.


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## erichall84 (Aug 20, 2013)

Used to be bowtech and bear but I ended up buying a Reign 6 last fall as it was the best feeling bow of all for me. 

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## Dewboy (Apr 19, 2005)

Yes, but not all for the same reasons. It may change with time, but for the past 10 years or so, I have only purchased two brands. I know some folks buy some brands just trying to be different from their buddies, but that LAST reason for me to buy a certain brand would be just to have something "different". Like the silly or horrible looking "color kits", being different for the sake of being different seems silly to me. I've even outgrown the multi-color custom string craze. Just give me a bow that performs well that I can shoot well, without breaking the bank and some good quality black strings and black accessories and I'm good!


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## IClark (Feb 12, 2013)

I'll go try any bow and if it wows me then I'll purchase. I don't really have a hate for any bow but I will say the last four bows I've owned have been mathews and elite. Both mathews and my elite ritual had to be shimmed, my synergy tuned just fine. Shimming really irks me. I'm really wanting to try a bowtech realm x or prime logic or centergy.


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## da white shoe (Mar 10, 2009)

deadquiet said:


> No and IMHO if you think that way you are too caught up in brand names. What if next year a brand you have sworn off for whatever reason makes a great model that fits you like a glove? Will you bite your nose off to spite your face? Will you not even try it?
> 
> I'm so glad I have the freedom of mind to buy what I want............lol. People have asked about my "truck has no stickers" phrase in my sig......this is exactly what I mean about it. It's a poke at the brand loyal blinded boaster.
> 
> People get so caught in in names and bashing other brands they lose site of reality. So if you have a big giant Mathews sticker on the rear window of the truck HOW can you shoot anything else.........lol


I go through trucks faster than bows... still, no stickers in my window.


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## westaushunter (Nov 25, 2013)

PSE. Had terrible experience with customer service or lack of


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## Pine Hawker (Mar 17, 2005)

I love all the bows, I just won't do bowtech


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## tcking1953 (Feb 14, 2014)

Well, not that I wouldn't, but in 40 years of shooting archery. Martin, Jennings, Carrolls, Wing, Olympus, Golden Eagle, Pearson, Hoyt, PSE, Matthews, Elite, Xpedition, Bowtech. No Bears, never saw one I liked.

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## azscorpion (Feb 12, 2010)

Gearhead
Liberty


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## vito9999 (Jun 30, 2009)

Had an issue for years, would not own ore even shoot a Mathews. Now this was not because of the company but the danged cocky shooters out west as there was a clique of Mathews shooters in Central California that would just make the hair on the back of my neck stand anytime they were around. It was like my consensus was warning me "don't do it they are not worth the jail time". Now that I live in the SE their following is not as obnoxious and I have since owned a Halon X, mighty fine shooter with a grip I hate.


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## westaushunter (Nov 25, 2013)

vito9999 said:


> Had an issue for years, would not own ore even shoot a Mathews. Now this was not because of the company but the danged cocky shooters out west as there was a clique of Mathews shooters in Central California that would just make the hair on the back of my neck stand anytime they were around. It was like my consensus was warning me "don't do it they are not worth the jail time". Now that I live in the SE their following is not as obnoxious and I have since owned a Halon X, mighty fine shooter with a grip I hate.


What is it about Mathews that draws obnoxious fanboys. I love the brand and the bows they put out year after year but the fan boys are worse then Hoyt.


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## Huntinsker (Feb 9, 2012)

vito9999 said:


> Had an issue for years, would not own ore even shoot a Mathews. Now this was not because of the company but the danged cocky shooters out west as there was a clique of Mathews shooters in Central California that would just make the hair on the back of my neck stand anytime they were around. It was like my consensus was warning me "don't do it they are not worth the jail time". Now that I live in the SE their following is not as obnoxious and I have since owned a Halon X, mighty fine shooter with a grip I hate.


Can't stand the grips or the fanboys either. They're definitely the worst when it comes to cocky and obnoxious that I've run into for sure and I've never held a Mathews in my hand that had a grip that was worth a damn.


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## westaushunter (Nov 25, 2013)

Few years ago I would have thrown bowtech into the mix too. But they have turned that around by bringing limb production in house. The realms look and feel mint


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## arcteryx112 (Apr 11, 2011)

Bearpawx4 said:


> Their not [poor quality] any more...


 Too bad they [PSE] put their name on such bad products in the past. They don't hold their value well either. They should have changed their name after upping their quality.

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## arcteryx112 (Apr 11, 2011)

Martin, bear, pse

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## Sagittarius (May 22, 2002)

No comment on the bows I wouldn't buy.


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## turkeyhunter60 (Apr 19, 2010)

Bowtech...Hated the short valley i had on mine along time ago, sold it...And with all the problems you guys had with them over the years on here...


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## Mathias (Mar 21, 2005)

Pse


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## 300remum (Mar 27, 2010)

i don’t have any problems with any brands, but i will probably won’t buy
any Parker or Pearson or similar. 
bows that don’t have any Yokes either. so easy to tune with yokes instead of spacer kits...
a couple years ago Bowtech would have been on the list but since they seem to have solved their 
limbs problems they will be high on my " to try " list. they feel great and offer tunability and performance.

right now i love both my xpedition. like the cam system and how i can make it feel they way i like.
hated the ATR at first because it did eat the cable after a while, but now most string builders serve the area with .007 halo
or i do it myself with 15lbs poeerpro fishing line and it solve the problem without changing the feel of the bow. love the finish of their bows and also their performance and weight.
as for their resale value, i see it this way. i can buy a Hoyt carbon Turbo for 2000$ (in Can$) or a Xpedition Xcursion for 1100$
the Xcursion will weight the same, be faster, have at least the same quality built. if i keep it 2 years i might have 900$ for the Hoyt with a little luck. i could then give away the Xpedition and the money lost would be the same...


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

arcteryx112 said:


> Too bad they [PSE] put their name on such bad products in the past. They don't hold their value well either. They should have changed their name after upping their quality.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


There's no need. They're still doing well selling inexpensive bows at the big box stores. Guys still look down on them. But now they make some of the top bows on the market, as well. 

The X-Force changed the industry and is still the grandfather of most of today's bows. 

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## arcteryx112 (Apr 11, 2011)

Ingo said:


> There's no need. They're still doing well selling inexpensive bows at the big box stores. Guys still look down on them. But now they make some of the top bows on the market, as well.
> 
> The X-Force changed the industry and is still the grandfather of most of today's bows.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


You raise 2 good points, box store market and xforce origin. I wanted to buy the xforce back in the day but couldn't bring myself to pay the price of a top end bowtech, hoyt, or mathews.

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## BarefootBow (Apr 15, 2018)

Bowtech, PSE, Mathews, Elite, Diamond etc. dont know why just don't feel them, every bow line has their own theme unique theme and these don't suit me well


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

arcteryx112 said:


> You raise 2 good points, box store market and xforce origin. I wanted to buy the xforce back in the day but couldn't bring myself to pay the price of a top end bowtech, hoyt, or mathews.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


When I bought my first new bow I was led to believe that the X-Forces were hard to shoot. I bought a Bowtech Tomkat with an 8-3/4" brace and 29" ATA because it was a "beginner's" bow. Even though I was coming from shooting a 1990's 80lb PSE Fireflight Express. I just listened to the shop Fudd.

It was more critical than anything else I owned after it including the Allegiance which had the same cams and less brace height. 







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## arcteryx112 (Apr 11, 2011)

Ingo said:


> When I bought my first new bow I was led to believe that the X-Forces were hard to shoot. I bought a Bowtech Tomkat with an 8-3/4" brace and 29" ATA because it was a "beginner's" bow. Even though I was coming from shooting a 1990's 80lb PSE Fireflight Express. I just listened to the shop Fudd.
> 
> It was more critical than anything else I owned after it including the Allegiance which had the same cams and less brace height.
> 
> ...


I upgraded to 07 Allegiance from a Martin Jaguar....biggest jump in technology I've ever done, and it's not even close.

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## whack n stack (Dec 23, 2007)

I have to add Hoyt to my list now. They're good bows, not knocking their performance. What irks me about them is their lack of pride in finishing a bow. Unless a solid color, they are very unrefined finishes. 

Yes, a bow is a tool, concerning the Hoyt SS Gestapo. My point is I want a clean, new looking product. Allow the consumer to put scratches in them.


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## judge1029 (Mar 21, 2018)

All of the big bow names have good features so I can't say never on any of them.


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## judge1029 (Mar 21, 2018)

I agree for the price they should be flawless


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## tcking1953 (Feb 14, 2014)

tcking1953 said:


> Well, not that I wouldn't, but in 40 years of shooting archery. I've owned Martin, Jennings, Carrolls, Wing, Olympus, Golden Eagle, Pearson, Hoyt, PSE, Matthews, Elite, Xpedition, Bowtech. No Bears, never saw one I liked.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk




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## tater0 (Jun 14, 2015)

bowtech


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## 1 2 NV (Oct 7, 2016)

I'd have to say bowtech due to the years and years of limb failures. 
The close second would be Hoyt. Theyre priced too high and too many fanboys praise them.


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## USCG_Bowhunter (Jun 10, 2017)

Ingo said:


> I can say I probably wouldn't buy a Bear, Martin, APA, Obsession, Darton and maybe some other smaller brand bows. Not because they aren't good bows, I just think that the big guys have their designs refined to a point beyond the others.
> 
> Bowtech, Hoyt, Elite, PSE, and Matthews are far enough out ahead, imo, I don't think I'd consider anything other than those. I thought Elite was off that list until this year.
> 
> ...


The same guy who designs the xpeditions designs the obsessions, just saying 


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

USCG_Bowhunter said:


> The same guy who designs the xpeditions designs the obsessions, just saying
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Strother may have helped with the riser design, or whatever but I don't really care who designs things. Xpedition is a wing of an aerospace engineering/manufacturing company. 

I've been around a few guys shooting Xpeds recently and I've been impressed. Shot a Denali and Perfexion, recently. Anecdotally, the only Obsession I have ever been in the presence of exploded into 50 pieces when the kid shooting it dry-fired it next to me at indoor 3d. 

But mainly, there are no dealers for Obsession here that I know of. I also like hybrid cams more than Binary. 

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## bowhunter52881 (Apr 22, 2017)

Mathews, bowtech 


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## perryhunter4 (Jan 30, 2008)

Obsession. Worst customer service I have ever experienced! If you can't work with your customers, I don't want associated with you.


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## lamby66 (Jun 10, 2015)

I would have to say elite. After two bows (V37 and E35) I just cant get them to tune for me. I need to add too much torque to the riser to shoot them well.


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## nochance (Nov 27, 2008)

lamby66 said:


> I would have to say elite. After two bows (V37 and E35) I just cant get them to tune for me. I need to add too much torque to the riser to shoot them well.


I find that surprising, my 35 and 39, my shop just set the center shot, nock just a tad high and shot bullet holes.


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## lamby66 (Jun 10, 2015)

It's probably just my grip. There are lots of people that shoot elites and swear by them. I could not bareshaft tune it to save my life. My bowtech and pse boss have been perfect, so I must just not be compatible with Elite's grips.

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## big44a4 (Dec 23, 2016)

lamby66 said:


> It's probably just my grip. There are lots of people that shoot elites and swear by them. I could not bareshaft tune it to save my life. My bowtech and pse boss have been perfect, so I must just not be compatible with Elite's grips.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


I think that’s most overlooked aspect of a bow...how the grip fits your hand/style. Has to be comfortable/repeatable. Sure you could torque it like you said but it’s not consistent 


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## GVDocHoliday (Jan 20, 2003)

Pse


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## jframe3 (Dec 16, 2012)

deadquiet said:


> No and IMHO if you think that way you are too caught up in brand names. What if next year a brand you have sworn off for whatever reason makes a great model that fits you like a glove? Will you bite your nose off to spite your face? Will you not even try it?
> 
> I'm so glad I have the freedom of mind to buy what I want............lol. People have asked about my "truck has no stickers" phrase in my sig......this is exactly what I mean about it. It's a poke at the brand loyal blinded boaster.
> 
> People get so caught in in names and bashing other brands they lose site of reality. So if you have a big giant Mathews sticker on the rear window of the truck HOW can you shoot anything else.........lol


This


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## griffwar (Nov 15, 2012)

I just give them all a go, I don't think there is a bow out there I would not buy once! If I like it great if not there not hard to get rid of all brands have there fans.


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## samson99 (Oct 24, 2012)

I highly doubt I will buy another Hoyt. Too many good choices out there that shoot just as fast or faster with smoother draw cycles and they don't require special press fingers.


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## tibbes (Feb 12, 2013)

big44a4 said:


> I think that’s most overlooked aspect of a bow...how the grip fits your hand/style. Has to be comfortable/repeatable. Sure you could torque it like you said but it’s not consistent
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Grips can also be too comfortable. Some do fit so well that you do not notice when you torque the bow. I prefer a neutral grip for that reason.


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## BowhunterT100 (Feb 5, 2009)

Mathews and elite for me.


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## tibbes (Feb 12, 2013)

Oh, and when you do notice you torque the bow, than suddenly that comfortable grip isn`t that comfortable anymore.


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## big44a4 (Dec 23, 2016)

tibbes said:


> Grips can also be too comfortable. Some do fit so well that you do not notice when you torque the bow. I prefer a neutral grip for that reason.


Being repeatable is #1, sometimes goes with being comfortable, but not always true. I’ve never had a grip that’s too comfortable but I understand the possible issue. You have to know that each day the feeling of a great shot will not be the exact same as yesterday. Some days will be similar and others not. That said Mathews would need to change their grips for me to own one of their bows. 


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## Headhunter43 (Jan 21, 2011)

Monkeybutt2000 said:


> Don't have to give a reason,but feel free. For me, Obsession and Elite.


Why not Elite?










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## stillern (Feb 1, 2005)

Mathews. I understand they make great bows. I’ve owned 3 in the last 15 years. Got rid of every one due to the grip. It just doesn’t fit me unfortunately. I’m not really with the new offerings, but the Monster series were amazing. Just can’t get past the damn grip. I wish manufacturers would find a way to make truly modular grip systems. Maybe for the $1,100 msrp they can find a way.

Kudos to Bowtech for their grip this year. I’ve shot Elite the past 7...they lost me with this year’s grips. If PSE has s grip like Bowtech I think they would have some of the best bows ever made.


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## csalodge (Jun 12, 2014)

I understand being pissed about customer service or quality issues and black-listing a brand. However I think that not considering an entire brand due to a single issue with a single model (i.e. short valley or grip), which changes with almost every model and year is a bit naive. Bow companies listen and they adapt. I understand that not everybody can shoot all bow models each year. I think some of the responses would be different if we could. I've sworn off a few brands only to shoot their new offerings a year later, eat my words and open my wallet. Same with CAM type ("I'll never own a Binary"). I have 2 now. These days brand is just a name to me (assuming I haven't been screwed by quality or service issues in the past). If a bow does what I want in my price range, I'll buy it. Having said that, bows with DL specific cams need not apply for residency.


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## AntlerCRAZED (Oct 12, 2009)

stillern said:


> Mathews. I understand they make great bows. I’ve owned 3 in the last 15 years. Got rid of every one due to the grip. It just doesn’t fit me unfortunately. I’m not really with the new offerings, but the Monster series were amazing. Just can’t get past the damn grip. I wish manufacturers would find a way to make truly modular grip systems. Maybe for the $1,100 msrp they can find a way.
> 
> Kudos to Bowtech for their grip this year. I’ve shot Elite the past 7...they lost me with this year’s grips. If PSE has s grip like Bowtech I think they would have some of the best bows ever made.
> 
> ...


I like the bowtech grip as well but to me all it is the same as shooting off the riser.I used to do that with my MR6.Took grip off and put some colored tape on riser.Felt great and I shot it well.


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## one.eyed.red (Sep 14, 2017)

Prime and bowtech make me a little nervous


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## Mauvilla (Aug 10, 2017)

No more PSE for me. Started with a PSE in the 90’s loved it bought one a couple years ago was total junk. Couldn’t figure out what was going on until I took it to a bow shop and the screws that’s were in the van had came loose . That was enough for me. Been a Hoyt fan since


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## Olink (Jan 10, 2003)

It's not so much what brand I won't buy, but what type of cam I won't buy. For me, solo cams are out (but they are just about done anyway), as are hybrid cams (think Hoyt) and binaries without yokes (think Elite and Athens).
Funny thing is that I used to be a real big Hoyt guy, but the hybrid cam that Hoyt refuses to let go of has been outdone by newer cam systems. Today my favorites are the Dual Sync binary (Darton, PSE) and the OD binary (Bowtech). With today's bowstring materials, I would even buy a bow with true dual cam (but as of right now there are no decent options available).


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## THE ELKMAN (Jan 2, 2013)

As of right now I would not own a Maaathews if they gave it to me. (Last 10 years) Other than that I think most of the major manufacturers have something I would play with...


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## KS Bow Hunter (Nov 22, 2013)

For me, BowTech. I just don't think that they have their processes and engineering down...too many issues with the product, and too many issues with how the company handles it, for ME to spend that much on something...I realize others love them, and have had good results, but my life is already too crazy busy to deal with self-inflicted issues...


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## Mikesheating (Oct 4, 2005)

Anything Basspro shops sells


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## traveler05 (Aug 14, 2009)

Matthews, good bow, way to much hype.


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## BUSHfire (Jan 6, 2010)

Mathews!!!


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## prohuntress (Jun 7, 2007)

I will not use a Mathews no matter how good, bad or otherwise they are.


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## jangiolinin (Jun 13, 2017)

Hoyt due to being over rated over priced and customer service sucks!! Bought a tribute as I shoot fingers and asked for advice on changing from accuwheels to cams and answer was "if you dont like the feel of the bow buy something else"!! REALLY!!


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## Dorobuta (Oct 14, 2013)

Like they say, we don't choose our bows, they choose us.

I won't rule out any bow. Currently I shoot a Bowtech reign 6 and have no desire to replace it any time soon.


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## fiddler green (Apr 11, 2013)

PSE
Piss poor service is just the start...........


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## llatpoh (Jun 25, 2003)

*Mathews:* 42 bows ago I was heading west for my first pack-in elk hunt. I wanted a backup bow to carry into the woods, in case anything went wrong. For those of us who are archery impaired (short draw length) ordering a bow is the only route, so I spoke to my dealer about ordering a second Mathews bow in May of that year for an October hunt. He was told that I would need to call. I called and the answer I received was that Mathew would not commit to delivering a bow with the appropriate cams by mid-August and if I wanted one, that I should just order the bow. I told the customer service rep that I didn't find that a good answer, but respected the answer. I then told him that I would never buy a Mathews. Great bows and great engineering, unacceptable customer service. Hoyt and Bowtech appreciate the business. That is my two cents,


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## Artem256 (Mar 30, 2018)

Anything no name, the cheap chinese stuff(amazon, or ebay sketchy looking).


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## PLUMBER007 (Jun 27, 2008)

Ingo said:


> I can say I probably wouldn't buy a Bear, Martin, APA, Obsession, Darton and maybe some other smaller brand bows. Not because they aren't good bows, I just think that the big guys have their designs refined to a point beyond the others.
> 
> Bowtech, Hoyt, Elite, PSE, and Matthews are far enough out ahead, imo, I don't think I'd consider anything other than those. I thought Elite was off that list until this year.
> 
> ...


Bear, Martin and Darton, If it wasn't for these 3 brands the bigger companies would not be where they are today! Just saying!


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## KAWABOY-ZX11 (Feb 22, 2004)

PSE, they screwed me around twice.


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## NWJon (Apr 2, 2017)

Mathews, because they will not back the Lifetime Warranty


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## askbowdaddy (Jun 27, 2009)

Here is the negatives of bows that I avoid. Elite,its a awesome shooting bow but every time I get one I have to change the mods,its 70 miles to the nearest Elite dealer and its about 65.00 a pop to change the draw.I have an obsession it is so quite and dead in the hands but no dealers that can work on them for miles.In defense of bow tech one of the best bows I have ever shot was an old patriot that that I got from a pawn shop.I shoot a cst and that will be my bow till I get too old to shoot.The only bow that I did not care for was Martin they always seemed harsh on the draw,and pse I have never shot very well with.A lot of have come and gone in last several years and I think one of the biggest reasons are lack of dealers,They want to stay in there own comfort zone and stick with the biggest names in bows.


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## 445 supermag (Dec 2, 2008)

Hoyt. I will Never ever own.again. 

But after owning my Obsession M7Z. I can't seeing owning anything else. Best bow I ever owned. DARTON Maverick a close second


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

PLUMBER007 said:


> Bear, Martin and Darton, If it wasn't for these 3 brands the bigger companies would not be where they are today! Just saying!


True. But that has nothing to do with why I would not choose those brands. They just don't have the refinement that the big companies offer and have small dealer networks. 

I'm sure Darton COULD have been a major brand if Darlington was inclined that way. Bear chose to focus on entry level. And Martin... Well, I'm rooting for a comeback. 

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## alex.vogel99 (Apr 1, 2014)

pretty much open to trying everything, and have tried quite a few different brands. one I just cant get myself to is bowtech, all the horror stories made me a scaredy cat I guess. maybe someday....


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## Yankee_1 (Oct 26, 2016)

Nope, I may not be able to afford some brands but I would not eliminate those brands if I had the funds. I shoot a Bear Arena 30 and it drives tacks at 60 yards all day long and can shoot out to 100 at least on targets.


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## Kevinski406! (Mar 29, 2018)

Bear, Parker, Obsession, Darton, Diamond, Bowtech , Mission, New Breed.

That leaves Elite, Hoyt, Mathews, PSE, Xpedition, Prime as the only brands I would ever buy a bow from in that order.


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## bigblock534 (Aug 29, 2008)

Only mainstream Bow I haven’t ever been interested in is a Bear. Only one I have ever tried and owned was my first Bow which was a bear whitetail 2.


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## KSmuleyhntr (Jun 4, 2015)

Bowtech. I bought a new Prodigy left over on line. The limbs came apart on me during Bowtech's period of limb failures. Since I was honest and told bowtech I bought it on line and not through one of their dealers stores they didn't not warranty anything. I had to pay for new limbs and pay a shop to put it all back together. I sold it and won't try another no matter what they come out with.


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## Cusack15085 (Jan 31, 2016)

Mission and Mathews


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## Elkrunner541 (Dec 3, 2016)

Mathews I just can’t stand their fat grip


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## spiralcamer (Apr 26, 2004)

Hoyt. After the #2 DFX cam in the 2016 and 2017 bows was untunable in some bows.


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## proarcher16 (Jul 22, 2008)

webenic said:


> I'll give anything a try if its priced right!


If the price is right and it looks well made, I'll try anything! 

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## CJDTMom (Mar 7, 2018)

I am a NEVER say NEVER kind of person... however, there are some brands out there that scare me, like Bear. I've seen too many of those blow up or come in blown.

For me it's not so much a brand as a place purchased. I would NEVER buy anything off ebay, Craigs List or any other online bid/sale site. The China knock offs are deadly and I have to say that is enough to turn me off.

A few years ago we never thought we would leave Mathews. After 6 years of loyalty, we went PSE Perform X 3D and it's a beautiful bow. Super fast and quiet. After shooting the C4 for so many years, this new PSE bow makes the Mathews seem antiquated.


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## Ileta30 (Dec 6, 2016)

I'm a Mathews guy by far easily the best shooting, best finish. Not that I have loved every single model. Probably wouldn't buy a Hoyt again mostly because of the look, partly I don't like the feel. Elite is a good shooting bow but the finish is poor in my mind. I have owned a bear, pse, Jennings, Hoyt, then got a Switchback and never looked back. Not I have an elite as a backup to try something different but not overly impressed. I think most are pretty good now days, boils down to looks and feel. Should care on price but it's my one hobby so I don't as much as I should, otherwise I'd own a mission personally.

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## tirving (Nov 3, 2013)

Prime - Could never get the 2 I owned to tune perfectly for me
New Breed - Quality control, limb issues (not getting poundage up), grips suck for me
Athens Archery - I busted 3 sets of limbs on 2 of them. Tunes OK, but shimming was required to do so.
Obsession - I just don't like the way they feel or shoot.

I ended up with a Realm X and Fanatic 3.0 this year and I can say that the quality, customer service and shootability has been top-notch with bowtech. I am a BIG fan of the ODB system, the butter-smooth draw cycle, and how easy it is to tune these bows. I had a Reign 7 last year, loved it, but the grip didn't work for me.


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## odin544 (Apr 6, 2016)

Bowtech. Couldn't give me a free one.


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## stixshooter (Mar 18, 2006)

Mathews 
Haven’t bought one since 2002
I Don’t even consider them 


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## bowscience (Jul 10, 2013)

Alrighty I was going to stay out of this because I know that I will probably ruffle some feathers here, not intentionally. But - principal means a lot to me so here we go. So far I have kept my word to myself by not ever purchasing a Mathews. Reason being is how they have treated the industry/customers. I have always considered them the mafia of archery. Mathews grew big overnight because they had the $$$ to invest in monumental marketing. Yeah they had a shootable bow but their marketing strategies worked. Until they decided to treat companies like dirt.
A few reasons why I feel this way:

- If you did not purchase thousands of dollars worth of bows from them then Mathews did not want to talk to you or give you the time of day. Example: the shop that I ran I primarily professionally tuned bows. Many and I mean MANY Mathews bows were brought in to me for tuning, repair, etc... I once had to contact Mathews to request a part, that I was willing to pay for to repair one of their bows that a customer brought in. Mathews literally told me that if I did not purchase bows from them then they would not sell me anything. I told them that I was doing them a favor by assisting their customers with screwed up bows or bows that other dealers could not tune or did not know how to tune. They said that didn't matter - goodbye sir. When that happened I let all my customers know that I would no longer be working on their Mathews bows and recommended that they purchase a bow from a company that gives a damn. I did not have this problem with any other bow manufacturer. If I needed parts I simply gave that company a call and they were happy to assist since I was assisting them by servicing their product. 

- If you have ever seen distributor catalogs Mathews always had the distributors put in their catalogs for things like rests, etc...with their camo - 'These products are for Mathews Dealers Only'. Once again, the conceited mafia of archery....or so they thought until now that they have went down hill.

- Mathews felt that because they were considered the big dogs that they should not attend the ATA shows. If you don't know what ATA is that is the Archery Trade Association where manufacturers display and sell their products each year for all the dealers to review and purchase their products for the year. All of the well known bow manufacturers always attend with each having shooting lanes so that we as dealers could try their bows out. I have never seen Mathews at any ATA show. I have not been to an ATA show is the past couple of years so if they happened to have a booth at that time then I was not aware. 

Mathews makes a decent bow. However they have always had problems making fast decent bows. There have been many other bows on the market that were fast, smooth and accurate. Each time Mathews tried this they were not able to compete with the shootability of the other fast bows. Before everyone starts screaming and ranting this is my opinion that I came to a conclusion of after tuning literally hundreds of bows. Hopefully Mathews has realized their ignorance and how much money they have actually lost from bad management.

And now for PSE. PSE has denied many problems that they were very aware of. I have seen PSE's jump track at mid draw and explode. When PSE was contacted they would deny that they were having any type of track problems and would not validate their warranty. I had to step in one time on a situation like this. I contacted a very well respected friend of mine that worked at PSE. I was able to resolve they situation through his help only and have PSE replace a customers bow. This PSE employee told me himself that he knew exactly why the bow exploded and that PSE was trying to deny this issue and lie to their customers to avoid replacing bows. So, due to that, I have no interest in PSE. 

For me it is all about principal. I have ran my own business and have always treated customers with the highest respect and did what I could to satisfy customers. I expect the same out of other companies. If that is not part of that company's mission then so be it. I will move on to another company.


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## popeyoung9 (Apr 20, 2012)

Shot Pse since 75'. The new evolve cam is great. No bowtech or Mathews for me. Poacher ted sits on the mathews board.


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## muleymantx (Oct 22, 2017)

I shot a Mathews since 2004 and finally figured out what a great shooting now should feel like after shoiting BOWTECH Insanity and the Experience. That Mathhews woul jump right out of my hand and horrible back wall.

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## createdoutdoors (Oct 13, 2017)

Hoyt for me


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## ggarcher (Sep 18, 2016)

I don't think I could say never to any bow brand, because some companies are weak on choices one year and then turn things around. For example: I would love to give the the 2018 Martin bows a try, but before they were bought by Big Jon Sports and moved to Michigan I really didn't like their bows. I am generally up for giving any bow line a chance to be considered, any given year. Love to see what new things come up!


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## Cusack15085 (Jan 31, 2016)

I have very good luck with TenPoint and Bear Customer Service, decent experience with Darton and can be very frustrating with Mathews on multiple occasions, nice people just don't ever buy used. I recently heard PSE has someone actively buying used bows at cheap prices to get out of the market. It was a good friend that owns a shop, but I can't verify.


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## felis (Oct 21, 2017)

PSE. Had a recurve wood riser split in half at full draw - scared the crap out of me.

Contacted them and they basically told me I should buy another one.


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## ravensgait (Sep 23, 2006)

I hate em all ! makes it possible to pick the ones I least dislike to keep around a while.
The only bow company I am wary of is Bowtech , last one I owned was a Destroyer when they first came out ,they were derailing/blowing limbs all over the place but I found someone who just had to have one anyway. Seems that after 10 + years they may have gotten that limb issue taken care of so maybe in a few years I'll check one out .
Mathews , I have shot a number of them but never liked one well enough to pay for it, dislike the grip and well they are ugly, lots of good looking bows out there no reason to have to look at an ugly one all day and now they are fat and ugly lol


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## thumper-tx (Dec 19, 2006)

PSE. Long before the current crossbow craze, PSE spent the last half of the 80's thru the mid 90's trying to cram crossbows into state archery seasons. They made a big push in Texas but they were not successful at that time. This was a time when no one except a few manufacturers were asking for crossbow seasons as a part of archery season. So, never have, never will buy a PSE.


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## apeterso66 (Apr 18, 2018)

I feel its soooooooooooooooooo individualized. When purchasing a bow you must try them all and pick the one that feels best for you. I never thought I would own a Bowtech, Yet here I am with a Reign 6.


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## Unclegus (May 27, 2003)

I would never just arbitrarily say there's one I wouldn't buy. But I can say that my days of buying the latest and greatest and paying way out the butt for a big dollar bow are way over.....Same for 300+ for a stabilizer...I learned long ago it's not the bow it's the indian.


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## fallhunter (Nov 23, 2010)

Mathews. And anything that is associated with Fieldlogic. 

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## 3D archr (May 17, 2014)

I shot a Hoyt Bow for many years and they shot well the reason I switched to a different Bow is they just got to high in price. I bought a Elite Victory 37 last year and it also shot well it just did not ever fill right to me now I am shooting a Obsession Fixation 7M and really like the Bow the only draw back is they are a little wrong on there posted speed rating other then that it shoots well:


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## daves custom (Apr 20, 2012)

Ok, i will bite. Mathews solo scam. I was the archery tech at one of the first stores to ever carry their product, so i shot and worked on everything they made from the mid 1990s up to the 2010 models (when i walked away from archery due to destroyed discs in my neck from shooting way too many bows ).
My biggest reason for my dislike of Mathews was their claims to the evolution of archery. They dumped massive dollars into an advertising campain , made simple equipment that lacked refinement, and convinced the public that you were paying for the bow when the fan boys actually paid more per bow for the advertising than the product. Genious but dishonest, imo.
The shooter program they had was ingenious too. Most of the guys they employed to run all over the country competing were excellent shooters, but they also knew how to stay on top of equipment out on the range to keep up with limb pockets shift and single cam cable stretch to be able to turn in a great score. Those that were just talented shooter either left the program or complained till they were dismissed. Those that saw problems and attempted to fix issues thereselves were warned to not make the modifications obvious so as not to tip off the public to issues.
They also had strict rules as to our protected territory to make sure we had an area all to ourselves. Well, unless one of their larger stores wanted to move in and sell a few, then they looked the other way and refused to acknowledge the problem even when we provided proof that it was going on !
If your a fan boy ( or girl ), im sure your happy with your equipment, or i hope you are anyway . Their bows have been in the hands of some great shooters and the record books dont lie . I just appreciate honest equipment and practicing what you preach . I found neither with that company. 
Whew ! It felt good to get that off my chest ........carry on, ladies and gentlemen .


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## e35shooter (Mar 26, 2018)

i would have to say xpedition.


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## CharlesBee (Apr 3, 2018)

PSE, just never had a good time using any product, not bad, but they're not good either


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## Goldenhornet (Apr 10, 2018)

Mathews. I the early 2000’s I had a Q2 and loved it but then I couldn’t believe it when they started making the ugly risers with the waffle looking designs. Yuck! Still disappointed and confused in the design direction they went. Im glad they abandoned that look. I will eventually get over it because they make excellent bows. I’m just still mad, haha.


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## Goldenhornet (Apr 10, 2018)

Update..I just looked at the Mathews website and saw the new Monster safari. Nooo! I get that the honeycomb is strong but that is hideous! I just got a Prime and I feel like I have a Farrari in my hand. It’s the total package.


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## bowscience (Jul 10, 2013)

Exactly what I was saying in my post about Mathews. Extreme dishonest company that thinks many are too stupid and illiterate to see how they operate.


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## ApostateTapir (Dec 13, 2017)

Hoyt. Since working in an archery shop, I've seen how craptastic their finishes are.


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## ravensgait (Sep 23, 2006)

thumper-tx said:


> PSE. Long before the current crossbow craze, PSE spent the last half of the 80's thru the mid 90's trying to cram crossbows into state archery seasons. They made a big push in Texas but they were not successful at that time. This was a time when no one except a few manufacturers were asking for crossbow seasons as a part of archery season. So, never have, never will buy a PSE.


I think Hoyt is the only major Bow manufacture that doesn't make and promote Xbows


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## daves custom (Apr 20, 2012)

ravensgait said:


> thumper-tx said:
> 
> 
> > PSE. Long before the current crossbow craze, PSE spent the last half of the 80's thru the mid 90's trying to cram crossbows into state archery seasons. They made a big push in Texas but they were not successful at that time. This was a time when no one except a few manufacturers were asking for crossbow seasons as a part of archery season. So, never have, never will buy a PSE.
> ...


I was under the impression that 10pt and hoyt were connected . Might be that my Hoyt rep was also my 10pt rep. Anyone know for sure ?


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## muliedrifter (Dec 18, 2016)

I will seriously look at any bow that is made in America!!!


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## Doofy_13 (Jan 2, 2012)

Just bought a new bow and the two brands I wouldnt consider were Bowtech andPSE. Ended up buying an Elite Tempo.


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## AntlerCRAZED (Oct 12, 2009)

In my opinion every major bow company can be labeled as dishonest.Marketing is an Indian word for dishonesty.


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## Unclegus (May 27, 2003)

AntlerCRAZED said:


> In my opinion every major bow company can be labeled as dishonest.Marketing is an Indian word for dishonesty.


 I can't find the like button anywhere....:wink:


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## CaptainBeauman (Feb 19, 2016)

Ringing Rocks Archery. Bought a longbow from them last summer; it arrived warped and was exponentially worse when strung - so much so that the limbs actually twisted in opposite directions. I didn't expect much for a you-finish bow, except for it to be safe enough to shoot. That one was not.

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## dnv23 (Feb 8, 2011)

deadbuck98 said:


> Pse! I've shot several of them and I'm always shocked at the small valley and vibration. My Halon is just sooo much nicer!!!
> 
> Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk


You must not have shot the ECS bows from the last couple years. They are smoother have a bigger valley and have more letoff than a Halon. They also have 3 different mods to make them fit just about any shooting style.


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## stillern (Feb 1, 2005)

Mauvilla said:


> No more PSE for me. Started with a PSE in the 90’s loved it bought one a couple years ago was total junk. Couldn’t figure out what was going on until I took it to a bow shop and the screws that’s were in the van had came loose . That was enough for me. Been a Hoyt fan since
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Felt the same way. You should strongly reconsider.


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## TTG (Aug 1, 2003)

Is this a trick question?
BowTech for sure


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## dnv23 (Feb 8, 2011)

Ileta30 said:


> I'm a Mathews guy by far easily the best shooting, best finish. Not that I have loved every single model. Probably wouldn't buy a Hoyt again mostly because of the look, partly I don't like the feel. Elite is a good shooting bow but the finish is poor in my mind. I have owned a bear, pse, Jennings, Hoyt, then got a Switchback and never looked back. Not I have an elite as a backup to try something different but not overly impressed. I think most are pretty good now days, boils down to looks and feel. Should care on price but it's my one hobby so I don't as much as I should, otherwise I'd own a mission personally.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk


Are you serious? Mathews finish is garbage compared to Elite. Mathews has one of the worst finishes in the industry. Elite may have the best, at least top 2.


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## Ileta30 (Dec 6, 2016)

dnv23 said:


> Are you serious? Mathews finish is garbage compared to Elite. Mathews has one of the worst finishes in the industry. Elite may have the best, at least top 2.


I have seen a pile of elites with chipped limb pockets, chipped cams. I see them for sale all the time with pictures of chipped paint,z7 and big chips. Ihave yet to have a Mathews chip anywhere maybe I'm the lucky one, but out of the 7 I have owned I have had 0 issues.

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## bakinslab (Oct 31, 2007)

mathews have known too many fan boys who were 100% sure these who didn't own Mathews were envious of those who did. don't care to be in that club, far as the bows they finally realized two cams are better than one.


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## mrp (Oct 13, 2007)

Mathews PSE Bowtech


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

mrp said:


> Mathews PSE Bowtech


You like-ah da Hoyt?

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## MuleHunter (Feb 24, 2018)

I own a Bear bow now and have sought help from the customer "service" people via email, lets just say I was less than pleased with their "service"...

Elite bows have been the nicest shooting bows I have ever used, I would take an Elite over my Bear right now any day. Their company name makes a bold claim, but every Elite I have shot definitely lives up to the name.

My bear is kind of a bear to shoot...not the best bow I've ever shot, not the best customer service...


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## tutone500 (Feb 19, 2009)

After owning an alphamax I’ll never buy a Hoyt again. Shoot Mathews and elites the most. I would like a pse with the evolve cam or a reign to play with.


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## Duned (Mar 23, 2018)

I would say Quest. I did not have good luck with a Quest hunting bow, as one of the mods partially stripped through light use, and yes it was tightened down. I normally would have said Hoyt in the past, due to their cost, but I just bought a Prevail 40 and can’t wait to shoot it.


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## Mathias (Mar 21, 2005)

Obsession.


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## BadgerND (Oct 4, 2009)

I won't count any brands out, but I have several brands that I avoid because of past experiences. I've had 2 Mathews blow up next to me, a relative's Parker blew up, had a friend that went through 3 Martin limb failures, and I've had a Bowtech and a Hoyt that were constantly breaking cables. Those are the ones I stay away from. My wife shoots a Diamond, which is basically a Bowtech, and she loves it.


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## shootstraight (Apr 28, 2005)

..and another thread that shows some people love every bow and some people hate every bow, for every reason out there. Same ole conclusion, shoot what you like, like what you shoot!


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## danceswithbow (Apr 7, 2004)

No obsession for me, had one, hated the grip angle, also won't own another bear


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## Cusack15085 (Jan 31, 2016)

How is it that Mathews continues to frustrate consumers with lack of CS or not standing behind warranty and yet they still have a large following. I have learned several times that they will not help with issues if you are not original owner even if it is a documented issue with a model. I have been less than impressed several times with them and at the moment very frustrated with them. I will say I have dealt with TenPoint and Bear on the phone and they have been very good. TenPoint takes the cake for customer service. If you get Bear on the phone they have been pretty good in years passed. I really liked the venue.


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## XxOHIOARCHERxX (Jul 17, 2013)

Cusack15085 said:


> How is it that Mathews continues to frustrate consumers with lack of CS or not standing behind warranty and yet they still have a large following. I have learned several times that they will not help with issues if you are not original owner even if it is a documented issue with a model. I have been less than impressed several times with them and at the moment very frustrated with them. I will say I have dealt with TenPoint and Bear on the phone and they have been very good. TenPoint takes the cake for customer service. If you get Bear on the phone they have been pretty good in years passed. I really liked the venue.


I’ve had nothing but fantastic CS from Mathews since 98. Only needed it twice though.


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## KS Bow Hunter (Nov 22, 2013)

I find it interesting that folks think marketing is some secret sauce, that causes you to buy and keep things you don't need. Like Mathews has you under some sort of hypnosis. You don't build a company like Mathews, and sustain it, on marketing. They are a great company, manufacturer, and innovator (they still get best selling bows out the door regularly - HTR, Triax) and they have sustained it by consistently improving and evolving. They make 300,000 bows per year, second maybe only to PSE.

Their dealings with dealers and trade events is completely understandable...if you can't buy enough to be relevant as a dealer, then it is better to have fewer larger dealers than a pile of small ones...just look at the auto sector and Toyota that has 700 solid dealerships vs. GM which has 4000 mediocre ones...and see who is winning. It is a smart business strategy. And trade shows are like a Mexican standoff. The big guys have to be there, because the first one to pull out leaves a void that others jump in...but everyone hates paying for them and understands that the ROI is difficult to calculate. So you keep going, even though you hate paying for it. The people that put on the trade shows are the winners in trade shows. And the cities that host them. Having your own events that are more tailored, and specific to your dealers, if you can, is again smart business.

I've been in multiple industries, and been to more trade events than I can recount, and no one loves them. Well, maybe the AVN show, but that is different discussion altogether. Mathews may not be the most cutting edge, or coolest, but the one thing you can count on is that they will be reliable, consistent, and have great customer service. I have emailed or called the VP of Sales more than once, and he always responds courteously. Can't say that for some other brands...


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## ducatian (Jan 31, 2018)

Hoyt. After a 6 week introductory course several years ago, it was time to buy a bow. The instructor/shop owner let me try out a Hoyt GMX riser. Don't know why but it felt awful. First impressions last.


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## Cusack15085 (Jan 31, 2016)

I talked with Mike Olson and he was sincerely nice, but stood by what lower people decided. Delamination and cracking of limbs should be handled regardless if you buy new or used. Think Bowtech Insanity. Mathews dropped the ball. I too think they have great bows, but work with customers when they reach out.


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## Dickenscpa (May 2, 2015)

I had horrible customer service with Obsession I just refuse to buy another.

Mathews is my avatar still even though I've been shooting a PSE for a while. I had a bad experience with Mathews CS back in early 2016 and again this past January. I loved the HTR when I was left handed and then bought a RH one and it just didn't work for me as well. When my first 3 week old HTR exploded due to the recalled OMP bow scales, my dealer had OMP and Mathews on 3-way with me standing there and the OMP guy told the Mathews guy "make this guy whole again if it means a brand new bow and send us the bill."

My dealer told me to expect a new bow because even the riser was bent. I get the bow back in 8 days with brand new everything but riser. Mathews said the riser was good. Two sets of limbs later after the bottom right keeps cracking Mathews tells the dealer this is the last set of limbs even though there is lifetime warranty because the riser is bent. Well duh! It was bent when they had it to begin with. The dealer felt so bad he gave me a $500 credit and kept the bow.

This past November I needed 60# limbs for the HTR I had at that time. Hard to find used and when they came up they sold quick and I couldn't catch them. I go to the dealer and order new. I order on Wednesday and get a call from the dealer they shipped that Friday. Fast forward to January and still no limbs. They even accused the dealer of receiving them and selling them to another customer.

Late January I told the dealer to cancel the order it would be easier to just buy a new 60# bow. He calls Mathews and they said they no longer stock HTR limbs and they had to be made and they were focusing on the Triax at the moment. For a bow that was a flagship in 2015 and in production thru 2017, I would've thought they had a few limbs in stock.

After selling the HTR as a 70#'er and shooting my new bow a couple of months those limbs came in and I sold them quickly here and basically broke even so no huge harm done but frustrating dealing with them. In the end after ordering a set 60# set to change out my 70# limbs I waited all that time for another 70# set. They didn't look at the order apparently and see this was a straight up purchase not a warranty claim so they just made a set based off my serial number. Frustrating.


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## Cusack15085 (Jan 31, 2016)

Dickenscpa, I bought two used mxb 360 crossbows and within 30 shots the limbs started delaminating. I knew since I bought used that I would have to pay, but was hoping for some help. Help came in the form of $10 off each set even though multiple people on here have gone through several sets of limbs. I called them back and they went through several storage and use questions to determine reason for delaminating. They never called back. When I called dealer they told me, sales rep says that's all they are going to do. I would have rather them tell me to screw off. To spend the time and be told they would try to help out with the issues only to get a $10 discount was frustrating then to have them not call back and be told oh I thought dealer would have told you our decision. Sad, I think they are nice bows, but at this point they are off my list.


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## GCook (Aug 22, 2016)

Elite

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## GCook (Aug 22, 2016)

ApostateTapir said:


> Hoyt. Since working in an archery shop, I've seen how craptastic their finishes are.


I really like my carbon Spyder but that is a negative for it.

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## ApostateTapir (Dec 13, 2017)

GCook said:


> I really like my carbon Spyder but that is a negative for it.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


They're good, solid bows. But some of the finishes I've seen out of the box on the RX1 have been unacceptable for a $600 bow, let alone a $1600 bow. 

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## whack n stack (Dec 23, 2007)

ApostateTapir said:


> They're good, solid bows. But some of the finishes I've seen out of the box on the RX1 have been unacceptable for a $600 bow, let alone a $1600 bow.
> 
> Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk


I've been a big Hoyt fan for years. I agree with you on their finishes. It's the same on their aluminum line. Their camo dip finishes are lack luster. They cannot figure out how to dip, especially in riser cutouts. The camo fades to primer. Hoyt's solid colors are fine. 

They keep a strong customer base on the product performance and reliability, not finishes. Their bows just keep going.

I can't imagine what they would charge for a bow if they had perfect finishes.


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## csbcowboy (Jan 30, 2013)

PSE.....Pull....Shoot....Explode!


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## csbcowboy (Jan 30, 2013)

PSE....Pull....Shoot....Explode!


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## ravensgait (Sep 23, 2006)

shootstraight said:


> ..and another thread that shows some people love every bow and some people hate every bow, for every reason out there. Same ole conclusion, shoot what you like, like what you shoot!


I believe the thread was meant to be light heart'd , at least that was the way I took it and many others seem to have as well . IE entertainment


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## ravensgait (Sep 23, 2006)

daves custom said:


> I was under the impression that 10pt and hoyt were connected . Might be that my Hoyt rep was also my 10pt rep. Anyone know for sure ?


Looking at their site,have to admit I can't recall having heard of this company before. They started out as a family business and then were bought out by a British company(Horton) but MFG in the US . Then left the company and stared 10 pt lol but I didn't see any affiliation with Hoyt mentioned though one of the investors from the earlier company was on Easton's board back when it was Hoyt Easton etc .


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## skynight (Nov 5, 2003)

Had to Google AVN show. Got a little education there.


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## Ingo (Oct 16, 2008)

skynight said:


> Had to Google AVN show. Got a little education there.


Lol, yeah. 

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## elitearcher6 (Jul 4, 2014)

Mathews, not a chance I’ll ever own another one


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## KS Bow Hunter (Nov 22, 2013)

skynight said:


> Had to Google AVN show. Got a little education there.


ROFL


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## Manchild (Aug 19, 2017)

pse for me. Seen several of the old mach flite 4s explode like a bomb. Then when the x-force came out i went with a buddy to get one,they pulled it out of the box, and proceeded to set it up and the first time they drew it back to set timing on rest the top cam collapsed like an empty beer can.


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## Crazyheaven (Dec 12, 2017)

If Ken ever makes one I'll have something to add to this list.


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## BrushArcher (May 26, 2016)

I wouldn't buy a Hoyt to overpriced even tho they try to be a little competative w/ it. Its Just that you are paying for the brand/logo at this point. They are doing good w/ marketing/advertising campaign.


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## BrushArcher (May 26, 2016)

Probably since a lot of competative/Hunter archers and shoot well known individuals (ex. Joe Rogan) but respect for them.


BrushArcher said:


> I wouldn't buy a Hoyt to overpriced even tho they try to be a little competative w/ it. Its Just that you are paying for the brand/logo at this point. They are doing good w/ marketing/advertising campaign.


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## coastiehunter2 (Jun 27, 2011)

There is a few smaller brands I wouldn't buy, but I would buy and shoot any of the top brands elite, Hoyt, bowtech, Mathews, pse, all awesome bows! Also like the xpedition bows, and new Martins, forgot about prime very nice.


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## Mike2775 (May 16, 2017)

It just depends on what you're looking for in a bow

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## MrBallistic (May 13, 2015)

I have shot a lot of bows and recently I have seen manufacturer "copying".
That been said because of feel and how they shot I wouldn't shoot firstly Bowtech, secondly PSE.


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## Unclegus (May 27, 2003)

MrBallistic said:


> I have shot a lot of bows and recently I have seen manufacturer "copying".
> That been said because of feel and how they shot I wouldn't shoot firstly Bowtech, secondly PSE.


Look at all of their catalogs and see which patents they pay other mfg's to use.... You'll be surprised...


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## Rick63 (May 21, 2017)

I have seen a lot of bad reviews about Bear they are about the oldest archery company around and the Bear make some great bows with lifetime warranties , I love mine , I probably would not buy a Chinese knock off ! Everything else American is usually some good equipment !! Except for the super high prices !!


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## bdhouter (Mar 21, 2018)

At some point every high end bow is a great shooting bow. Just preference.


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## huntingfiend (Nov 29, 2009)

Won't burn anyones favorites, although there are a few top end bows I won't consider. Instead, I'll tell you what turns me off.

1. Spongy back wall - if it ain't as solid as a rock, they've lost a customer. This is a deal breaker for me. JMHO

2. Decent draw cycle - if I'm straining to get it back at reasonable poundage, it'll be tough to let down easily in the treestand. FWIW I've shot bows that I would buy @ 70lbs over another manufacturers 60lb bows... When 60 SEEMS heavier than 70, something is wrong. (fwiw I've had bows up to 80lbs... not a strength thing)

3. Minimal hand shock on the shot - the less shock, the more pleasant the shot...

All things considered, how a bow is balanced counts for a lot (this is more about stabilizers, etc.). When you're at full draw, you shouldn't be fighting to hold the bow on target. Again, JMHO

I'll give anything a chance (always do my research), but these preferences limit my choices...


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## trucker3573 (Feb 14, 2010)

Bowtech, Bear and definitely anything yeti

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## coloelk340 (Feb 10, 2018)

Bowtech , Diamond


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## Jeremy K (Oct 16, 2013)

Hoyt for sure.


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## laserbeam1001 (Jun 30, 2013)

I'm willing to give every bow company a chance to earn my money. That being said I have not bought a Mathews, Hoyt or Elite due to prices.

I've shot several of their bows, though very nice, in my head I can't justify paying the kind of money they are asking. Their are many bow companies making some great bows and to me Mathews Hoyt and Elite just seem over priced and paying for the name brand only. 

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## Kevin Duggan (Apr 27, 2018)

No, there's no brand of bow I wouldn't consider buying. Sometimes brands put out a bad model, while putting out a rally good one. Prime example is the bear Approach hc. It's about $450 barebow and it shoots like an $8-900 bow. There are other compounds in that list they released this year that've had a lot of issues. The kuma, which I didn't like, the Approach single cam, which I bought and is chewing up the serving and I don't like, another issue with a lot of the kumas. The Approach hc is better than all of them
And I haven't heard any issues about it, my buddy has one and loves it. When I shot it at a demo, and when I shoot my buddies, the whole shot process from the draw to the realease is just silky smooth. I couldn't believe that wasn't the flagship bow. so while someone may've had an issue with one bow out of a lineup from a brand, it doesn't mean the whole brand is bad. To me if it shoots and feels good,and it's well made, its up for consideration.


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## strayarrow (May 7, 2003)

It’s funny when reading ingo’s Post that mentions darton. Have you looked at a darton beside a pse? Wonder where pse got that design from, as have many other bow companies. 
I like bows. I like trying new bows and playing with all of the varieties of cam systems and grips. Those ‘cheaper’ bows with less engineering put into them will still shoot better than most peoples’ capabilities. 
For me not buying a brand of bow again is simply because it doesn’t feel right and match my shooting style. So instead of saying which companies I will never shoot again, I think I’ll say that I would still buy bows from Bowtech, darton, elite, Hoyt, Martin, Mathews, and obsession.


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## Hun10-freak (Feb 18, 2013)

Hoyt, Bowtech, and Bear.

I have loved every Mathews I've owned and my Obsession defcon 6 is lights out awesome...


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## optimal_max (Oct 26, 2010)

allen anything....


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## J.Apalategui (Jun 9, 2018)

Bowtech I've heard to many problems with limbs


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## Whaack (Apr 2, 2006)

deer310sg said:


> Anything Wildgame, cuddeback, tenzing! Does that count?


Ya that counts. Those clowns I can’t stand. 

For me Bowtech. Too many issues across multiple models for me back in the day. And their CS sucked. 


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## Mule Deer Gumbo (Nov 29, 2015)

At this point I'm not a fan of bows I can't yolk tune, which these days limits me considerably. I don't have a "permanent" never buy brand, but right now I'm pretty sold on the Bowtech tuning system and the way I can shoot them, although their reputation scares me. I haven't had good luck with Hoyts, but if the right specs came out on an aluminum riser I'd give one a shot again. No right now to Prime, shot a Centergy Hybrid for a day and it was pretty loud and particularly disliked my form.


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## deer310sg (Feb 20, 2006)

Whaack said:


> Ya that counts. Those clowns I can’t stand.
> 
> For me Bowtech. Too many issues across multiple models for me back in the day. And their CS sucked.
> 
> ...


Hold on Whaack. These new bowtechs aint the oldies! The new limbs are awesome, in house builds! No laminating. Hopefully won't have to deal with cs! 

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## TimberGhost74 (Nov 22, 2016)

PSE. Got screwed over on a warranty deal while I was on active duty. Purchased the bow in Michigan, but had a warranty situation that arose while deployed, with no dealers within 300 miles. PSE refused to even discuss taking care of the issue even if I covered all shipping back and forth to them. Shop I bought it from went belly up (Anderson Archery, in Grand Ledge), and no other PSE dealers that I could locate would take care of the problem without billing me for the repairs. That bow was never shot again, and I enjoyed shooting that thing.


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## USPfan (Apr 15, 2018)

I cant discount any specific brand, that would imply bias. 

I'll buy whatever bows I deem to meet my standards of quality. If I were to say, "I'll never buy a bowtech because they have a reputation of limb delamination," then two years from now they make a genius bow, I'd want it. I'd also be a hypocrite.


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## loveeee7789 (Apr 9, 2017)

In my experience bowtech mad a few messed up bow, short string life., knot issues too.


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## NJ Trad (Nov 24, 2017)

Bowtech, after 2 personal failures on 2 different bows I'm done


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## tomvern85 (Jan 16, 2013)

I shoot a Mathews creed xs and will not switch until I find something that impresses me more than this bow.


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## TMarch20 (Sep 12, 2016)

PSE, I worked at a proshop and all three of us would hide when some one walked in wanting us to work on one.


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## Dilleytech (Dec 29, 2017)

Probably Hoyt. With the need for special fingers for presses on a lot of the models, overall ugly design and crappy draw and valley.


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## PeterM (Jun 24, 2005)

Blowtech...


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## MattThayer (Jun 30, 2018)

i literally came to say "blowtech" and the post before me did the work for me...


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## Davidhes (May 25, 2018)

Prime....THEY ARE LOUD... plus those tiny grips hurt my hand...I think they make them for people with little hands and bad ears.


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## fportillo21 (Jul 13, 2018)

Bowtech and Matthews are good ones, just personal preference ! Not a fan of Hoyt bows 


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## KGartside (Jul 4, 2018)

There’s bows I wouldn’t want to buy but that’s not based on a brand. If I had to pick tho I would say I wouldn’t buy Mathews because people see to get real but hurt when you say that.


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## muleymantx (Oct 22, 2017)

Owner of one old Hoyt which was fine for the day and owned a Mathews Outback which was good for the day with very jumpy back wall. Now own both the Experience and the Insanity BowTechs both are very smooth to draw never had a limb problem. Never owned a PSE. Bowtechs new limb design with the Realm should certainly eliminate the problems i have heard they have had. All these are good bows try them all and see what you like best what is fastest at your draw weight and most comfortable to draw.
IMO stick with these big 4. The Alpines
Expeditions etc are probably ok but don't have the reputation of the big 4 or will they be around in 3 yrs.

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## Gerd (Mar 1, 2017)

Bowtech & Hoyt.


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## enkriss (Apr 10, 2009)

PSE... had a couple blow up on me years ago. One the riser broke at the handle. Done with them...

Xpedition...


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## va limbhanger (Dec 12, 2008)

Nope!! I'm pretty much a "BOW W H O R E" and I'll give them all a look >>>>>------------------->


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## Elknutz_1 (Aug 17, 2016)

KGartside said:


> There’s bows I wouldn’t want to buy but that’s not based on a brand. If I had to pick tho I would say I wouldn’t buy Mathews because people see to get real but hurt when you say that.


Nice first post noob - come on here & run your mouth about Mathews owners. Maybe you just can handle the BEST bow out!:wink:

j/k man, I see it also. I love Mathews & Hoyt, my wife shoots Bowtech. I have no bias, as long as a bow suits my criteria I'm good with it.


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## juspassinthru (Oct 8, 2006)

Mathews. Owned 3 of them. Won't own another


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## stillern (Feb 1, 2005)

Mathews - always been the grip. Loved the Monster series, but why not offer a better grip?


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## smokin fast (Mar 19, 2010)

pse . It got so bad the shop here discontinued there line


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## OH_lungbuster (Sep 15, 2013)

Prime


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## Deerslayer3071 (Jan 24, 2012)

Elite,Mathews,Hoyt.


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## AntlerInsane83 (Jun 28, 2016)

Interestingly enough since my last post on this thread Bear Archery has been added to the “will not buy” list.
I expect better customer service, or at least customer service to begin with.


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## johnno (Apr 11, 2006)

I fail to see the purpose of this thread - just to start a poo fight...every bow ever made can claim to some problems, limb failure etc. Same as every vehicle. So what's the point?? I too used to work in a bow show - and we saw failures with Mathews, Hoyts and Bowtech...we didn't stock PSE. Does that imply that these bows are somehow inherently faulty - NO - it confirms that everything made by man is simply subject to failure.


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## Ferro (Sep 25, 2015)

They may have gotten better, but after I had my Bowtech Destroyer blow up on me twice, both times complete limb failure. Don’t think I will ever have trust to shoot a Blowtech again.


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## "TheBlindArcher" (Jan 27, 2015)

I would be curious to see how many of the "I wouldn't buy..." crowd would actually recognize that brand, or most of the brands for that matter, if it were handed to them while they were blindfolded... Sort of a blind test as it were- pretty positive some here would like the bows 'they would never own'


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## TREESTANDSNYPER (Jan 17, 2003)

Kinda funny when people act all surprised when someone says they won’t own a bow they personally like. Like why does anyone really care what someone else shoots? We all have our personal reasons why we buy and use anything...and that’s not just bows but everything. For some it may be a past negative experience or the bad reputation of a company and perhaps it’s owner. In the end no matter what anyone says we all have our biases and use what we are comfortable in shooting and where we spend our money. Personally if I don’t like someone I’m not giving my money to them. I’ve tried bows over the years from every rinky dink start up to the big boys and I know what works for me and what doesn’t. These days I won’t buy anything from these smaller companies. Just had too many small issues with them all and the resale on them isn’t what you get with a bigger name bow. 


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## Q2DEATH (May 12, 2003)

Bowtech. Unfortunately I bought 5 before I pulled my head out and realized it wasn’t worth the hassle.


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## Q2DEATH (May 12, 2003)

Why wasn’t there a poll attached to this?


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## zeee (May 19, 2018)

Matthews then Hoyt. They're just so annoying.

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## Q2DEATH (May 12, 2003)

I own 2 Mathews but I have to agree, the loyalists are pretty annoying.


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## rjack (Jan 14, 2007)

Elite

Bad design on the first run of Ritual cams causing serving wear. 
Elite redesigned the cam but won’t replace them unless you are the original owner. 

They recognized a bad initial design by fixing it but they won’t own their mistake. I won’t support poor R&D that is costing consumers money. 

Warning: Don’t buy a used Ritual unless it has upgraded cams.


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## steely5 (Dec 6, 2008)

Bowtech,seen to many blow up for different reasons over the years
PSE just look cheap to me.


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## TREESTANDSNYPER (Jan 17, 2003)

steely5 said:


> Bowtech,seen to many blow up for different reasons over the years
> PSE just look cheap to me.


Have to agree, PSE has always looked very cheap to me. I’ve shot them well, but overall compared to other high end bows they always look cheap. 


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## Wascallywabbit (Jul 22, 2013)

Bowtech, pse and obsession


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## Dafis (Jul 12, 2009)

Probably Bowtech, cause I know a guy who shoots one and cannot stand him....

Guy at the range had a Parker, he let me shoot it, as I did he with my bow, smooth and quiet


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## rjack (Jan 14, 2007)

Dafis said:


> Probably Bowtech, cause I know a guy who shoots one and cannot stand him....


Lol...now that’s some truth on how some people think. [emoji481]

I’d have to give up archery if I felt that way.


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## knarrly (Dec 21, 2004)

It has changed over the years, mostly the ones i wouldn't shoot had far more to do with company policies/adds than with their products. Usually ended up trying them after they stopped what i was annoyed with............but that was 5-10 years later.

There are so many quality bows out there that missing out on a manufacturer or two still leaves us spoiled for choice. That and my opinion is that what I do has far more effect on my getting better that what brand i shoot.


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## erichall84 (Aug 20, 2013)

JMart294 said:


> It was bowtech... but own a REIGN 6 and it's awesome.


Same here but The Reign is probably the best bow in just about every way that I’ve ever owned


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## Bucks & Bulls (Jun 8, 2011)

I like all the bows but like some more than others. I want a bowtech so bad but don’t want to take the risk of limb failure. Maybe someday but right now I would say I wouldn’t buy a bowtech.


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## muleymantx (Oct 22, 2017)

Bucks & Bulls said:


> I like all the bows but like some more than others. I want a bowtech so bad but don’t want to take the risk of limb failure. Maybe someday but right now I would say I wouldn’t buy a bowtech.


The new Realm has completely changed the Bowtech limb design. It's not lamenated it's wider and thicker. I don't see any issue with this design. They knew there was a problem an reengineered the limbs.

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## zeee (May 19, 2018)

I think some of it has to do with hunting shows on the Outdoor Channel at least it is for me anyway. Mathews and Hoyt are just so annoying.

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## MIKEY CUSTOM-G (Oct 5, 2002)

Wascallywabbit said:


> Bowtech, pse and obsession


Could you give us reasons why ? PSE been around forever ? Certain they’ve had their issues. Curious as to why these 3 ?

Thanks


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## Alaska at heart (Aug 25, 2009)

MIKEY CUSTOM-G said:


> Could you give us reasons why ? PSE been around forever ? Certain they’ve had their issues. Curious as to why these 3 ?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> ...


I own and shoot two Obsession bows and they have been great. The 16 XL has been with me for about a year now and has taken both deer and two turkeys. A guy gets one and has an issue or reads a gripe on AT and suddenly it is a limiting factor against the entire brand. If I wasn't shooting Obsession, I would likely be trying out an Evolve 35 by PSE. Bowtech has a ways to go in earning back general trust after all the limb issues....that one seems rather plain to me.


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## MIKEY CUSTOM-G (Oct 5, 2002)

Alaska at heart said:


> I own and shoot two Obsession bows and they have been great. The 16 XL has been with me for about a year now and has taken both deer and two turkeys. A guy gets one and has an issue or reads a gripe on AT and suddenly it is a limiting factor against the entire brand. If I wasn't shooting Obsession, I would likely be trying out an Evolve 35 by PSE. Bowtech has a ways to go in earning back general trust after all the limb issues....that one seems rather plain to me.




I know Obsession had some slow production initially as part of their growing pains. I know they had a few speed short falls to advertised speeds. I know their designer has had his share of legal and personal drama. However, other then maybe a cable slide, I’ve never heard of Obsession not performing well and quality always good. I love my Evolution myself. I wouldn’t by no stretch say I’m a Obsession shooter, but I ain’t selling my Evo. I got a good one and know a good bow when I get one ! Lol

Bowtech has had a few gripes since the sell off to Savage. I still like them nonetheless, don’t own one but came close last year.


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## trimantrekokc (May 16, 2006)

bowtech.....always thought I wouldn't own a Mathews however the halon is a nice feeling bow. still don't own one but might at least consider it now. won't even consider a BT


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## gridman (Aug 26, 2007)

Bowtech, mathews


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## V-TRAIN (Feb 27, 2009)

no, i don't think there is one now i would not buy. used to be Bowtech, but now that they have the limb issues solved, i think they are great.


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## WalleyeChop (Aug 23, 2017)

Not real big on bowtech and PSE.


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