# Tail high left tear



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Still no responses, but i thought I'd follow up anyway. I shot bare shaft through paper to rule out vane contact as I've never used a blade rest before. The bare shaft tears the same through paper. Moving the rest doesn't change the tear. I have had this experience with a bow before so I'm sure that I'm doing something to cause it although I can tune my Halon without issue.


----------



## tjdivo (Dec 16, 2017)

your left tear could be from arrows being too weak


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Thank you for the advice. I did try stiffer arrows on my bear that I couldn't tune and didn't see any change there. Maybe I'll try a 75 grain tip on my 500s with the Apex to see if that helps. 

I am leaning towards something I'm doing wrong g still, but I'll be trying the stiffer arrow as you recommended. 



tjdivo said:


> your left tear could be from arrows being too weak


----------



## 6bloodychunks (Oct 26, 2005)

what is the length of your arrows? and what arrows?


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

I'm using 27" victory v force gamer 500s with 100 grain tips. 



6bloodychunks said:


> what is the length of your arrows? and what arrows?


----------



## pottergreg (Mar 20, 2015)

According to the Victory chart you need a .450 spine at 27". can you cut the arrows down an inch? You might try turning the bow limbs down to test if you can. Lighter point is a good idea also!


----------



## redman (Feb 22, 2003)

Make sure you have no nick pinch at full draw


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

I have tried with stiffer arrows. A 400 and a 340. I didn't see a change there so I'm leaning away from spine a bit, but I may revisit it. Mostly I'm thinking I'm doing something consistently wrong to cause the tear. 



pottergreg said:


> According to the Victory chart you need a .450 spine at 27". can you cut the arrows down an inch? You might try turning the bow limbs down to test if you can. Lighter point is a good idea also!


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

I did tie nock sets in for pinch. Resting I left about a 1/16" gap so it looks good there, but how do I check it at full draw? Should there still be a little gap inside my nock sets?





redman said:


> Make sure you have no nick pinch at full draw


----------



## pottergreg (Mar 20, 2015)

What rest are you using? A mistimed drop away will give a high tear. Cam timing can do it too! Check your tiller and set it even. Check for vane interference with powder or lipstick


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

I'm using a blade rest. I did try shooting a bare shaft with the same results to check clearance. That was my initial thought too. 



pottergreg said:


> What rest are you using? A mistimed drop away will give a high tear. Cam timing can do it too! Check your tiller and set it even. Check for vane interference with powder or lipstick


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Maybe it is an issue with the setup though because I can tune my Halon with no trouble. The one I'm struggling with is a solocam if that makes a difference. 




Mike83350 said:


> I'm using a blade rest. I did try shooting a bare shaft with the same results to check clearance. That was my initial thought too.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## 6bloodychunks (Oct 26, 2005)

from running the numbers it would seem your arrows could be too stiff. 

ontarget says they are pretty stiff as is. 


do you have a longer arrow? or a very heavy point to try?


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Really? I wouldn't have thought that. I do have some 125 grain tips I can try. I also planned to try some lighter tips too. 



6bloodychunks said:


> from running the numbers it would seem your arrows could be too stiff.
> 
> ontarget says they are pretty stiff as is.
> 
> ...


----------



## 6bloodychunks (Oct 26, 2005)

Mike83350 said:


> Really? I wouldn't have thought that. I do have some 125 grain tips I can try. I also planned to try some lighter tips too.




if 125s lessen the tear slightly then you'll know you're headed in the right direction.


----------



## Macdoc18 (Dec 28, 2012)

I am no expert but I have heard of the lizard tongue bouncing up to hit the back of the arrow if it is too stiff a lizard tongue. It would also happen to a bareshaft. Search on here for sme threads regarding this. SOme have gone to a lighter or thinner rest others to less of a rest angle or even clipping some metal off the side of the lizard tongue.


----------



## ar1220 (May 18, 2014)

I'd be curious as the what the blade angle and blade thickness is and also total arrow weight


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

I estimate the arrows around 333 with the field tip and I'm using a .08 blade. There blade is set to about 37 degrees. 




Macdoc18 said:


> I am no expert but I have heard of the lizard tongue bouncing up to hit the back of the arrow if it is too stiff a lizard tongue. It would also happen to a bareshaft. Search on here for sme threads regarding this. SOme have gone to a lighter or thinner rest others to less of a rest angle or even clipping some metal off the side of the lizard tongue.





ar1220 said:


> I'd be curious as the what the blade angle and blade thickness is and also total arrow weight


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Is there a recommended amount of angle? Maybe a correlation between angle and weight?




Mike83350 said:


> I estimate the arrows around 333 with the field tip and I'm using a .08 blade. There blade is set to about 37 degrees.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ar1220 (May 18, 2014)

Set the angle to 30 degrees....and still not sure on what thickness you have but I would try a .008 blade thickness


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

I am using a .08. I'll try 30 degrees and report back. 



ar1220 said:


> Set the angle to 30 degrees....and still not sure on what thickness you have but I would try a .008 blade thickness


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Okay I tried asking the angle to 30 degrees with no benefit and tried going up to 125 grain tip and down to a 75 grain tip with no difference. I'm thinking there's something I'm missing that's simple to fix, but I don't even know where to start.


----------



## DXTCLUE (Apr 4, 2010)

Check for Idler Wheel lean at full draw. Idler should be straight with string at full draw.


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Okay. Is there a particular way to check it at full draw?



DXTCLUE said:


> Check for Idler Wheel lean at full draw. Idler should be straight with string at full draw.


----------



## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Mike83350 said:


> Okay. Is there a particular way to check it at full draw?


This is a draw board. It's a pulling device that holds your bow at full draw. One end is a boat winch. Other end is a 3/4 pipe nipple, and a floor flange. You screw the floor flange to a 2x4. Then, you screw the pipe nipple into the floor flange plate. Wrap the 3/4 inch pipe nipple with electrical tape. This way, you don't scratch your bow. Mount the floor plate lower than your winch, cuz when YOU hold a bow, your bow hand is Lower than you Anchor. The hook on the boat winch is your release hand. So, now your bow is at full draw, held safely at full draw using a draw board. Now, find an arrow and squeeze the arrow tight to a flat section of the idler wheel. COMPARE the arrow to the bowstring. Is the arrow parallel to your bowstring? Like this?



















IF the arrow pinched to the side of your idler wheel is crossing under the bowstring, if the arrow pinched to the side of your idler wheel is running away from your bowstring, then, you need to work your yoke legs. Twisting one yoke leg, will change your cam lean, and will correct a crooked idler wheel. Untwisting the other yoke leg will also help correct a crooked idler wheel. You want the idler wheel straight, in line with the bowstring at full draw.

WHY did I twist tie TWO arrows to the top cam? Cuz a fella said that one side of his idler wheel was crooked like a taco, and that the other side was straight. Impossible.


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

That makes a lot of sense. Now I feel kind of dumb haha. 



nuts&bolts said:


> Mike83350 said:
> 
> 
> > Okay. Is there a particular way to check it at full draw?
> ...


----------



## DXTCLUE (Apr 4, 2010)

Draw the bow and look up to see if string is coming off idler wheel straight . or have someone stand behind you and look for you. or put the bow in a draw board and lay a arrow down the side of the idler wheel and alone the string to see if straight. If not twist or untwist yoke legs till straight.


----------



## Pekke (Jan 1, 2017)

If you have a stringstop try without it.


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Just a follow up. I haven't tried adjusting the yoke yet. Hard to get it done with out traveling. I'm thinking about getting one the bow master portable presses so I can do it myself. Might be a good learning experience.


----------



## Mike83350 (Mar 5, 2017)

Morning everyone. I did adjust the idler lean, but didn't find that to help. What actually made a big difference was syncing the cam. I still have a ever so slight tear, but haven't tried to work it out.


----------

