# Dying Breed, believed, but ready to face



## zestycj7 (Sep 24, 2010)

Don't give up, keep shooting what make you happy. Down here in So. Ca. we get about 5-8 shooters every shoot.
If you are a member of CBH come down to Lodi in May for the State 3-D Broadhead Championships, it's a blast. there are about 15 shootes in the Adult Bowhunter class, not counting the Senior ans Master Senior classes.
They call it the Non-Sight class.
That amount was for when it was down here, not sure what the turnout will be up in Lodi.
I will be there.
Don.


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## T2SHOOTER (Feb 26, 2014)

Thanks; I am member; a master senior, but won't shoot broadheads. And I did hear about that event from one of our club's Barebow shooters. Have fun.


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## Supermag1 (Jun 11, 2009)

I shoot barebow (it's probably more of a bowhunter setup but whatever) and I shot in two good sized indoor shoots this weekend. On Saturday, I had to enter in the hunter class because that's about as close as it would get to my equipment and I know it was pretty much just a fun shoot for me since I would've had to shoot 10 up at least to be anywhere near the winners. Then on Sunday I was actually able to shoot MCU (compound unaided) but I was the only one in my class. Other places I end up getting put in with the sighted finger shooters. The funniest one was when 3 of the 4 of us that shoot fingers, no sights at a number of tournaments (all 4 of us have never all shot the same tournament as crazy as it sounds) were at the same shoot and we all were in different classes (one bowhunter, one barebow and one master senior barebow).

It happens and it's just something we all have to deal with when shooting our style but I wish we didn't.


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

World Archery has it figured out. 3 classes:
Recurve, Compound and Barebow.

If you shoot a recurve with sights and/or stab, you are in Recurve.
If you shoot a compound, you are in Compound.
If you shoot a non-sight recurve or longbow, you are in Barebow.

Their tournament numbers are high and the competition at the National level in Europe is massively well attended by all 3 divisions.

-Grant


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## T2SHOOTER (Feb 26, 2014)

Well Grant, while World Archery and Europe have it dialed, it won't do us any good. Smile. I did enjoy the shoot and met many new friends. At the awards presentation many came up after they noted I was only one in class and said, "I'm considering dropping my gear to get in my class." Funny, the 3D events, at least with our group, are non-stop laughter and chatter--not present in others observed. We had five shooter: BHFS (one female and male), BHFSL(one male), one FS (male), and me. The group just in front was a recurve and a two longbows (male), and they were lights out. Very impressive shooting, and since they could shoot the Trad stakes, the 60,80 and 95 yarders were set at 50 for them--still, they shot lights out. The 28 targets shooting 3 arrows took six hours. Not sure how many were there, and the back-ups weren't too bad. I'm sure the Redding tournament will have more in my class with 1500+ archers. Smile.


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## Finger Bow (Jul 22, 2012)

The problem, in my mind is that the fingers classes aren't competitive. Our smalls numbers are exacerbated by the increasing number of classes. At our state indoor shoot there were five finger shooters each shooting in their own class. Going to an all compound class would pretty much end competitive finger classes, But I'd like to see them consolidate some of the small turnout classes. I think Vegas has the right idea by making just one fingers compound class.


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## Supermag1 (Jun 11, 2009)

I agree on the too many class thing and that Vegas has the right idea in regards to barebow. I know there was at least a small push last year to combine bowhunter and barebow but there was a lot of push back from both classes on a combined set of equipment rules.


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## T2SHOOTER (Feb 26, 2014)

Can't use Vegas a model. My own opinion since shooting 3D and Field event requires longer shots than 20 yards. Big difference with a compound at 40 yards up to 80, or the 95 I shot this last weekend. Keep the recurves and longbows alone, and 50 yard max. The Bowhunter, compounds can be a fun class if there were more competition. The Barebow, compounds and Bowhunter can be in same class--just saying. But maybe like they do in other sports, if there isn't enough in one class, at least three, then put them together, but not mix compounds and recurves--bit difference at longer shots and totally not fair. I heard this weekend where there was a 50 yard max for the Trad classes, Redding makes them shoot compound distances. While everyone is shooting the same and it seems fair, and I wouldn't mind, a 20# to 30# trad recurve shot at 60+ yards is beyond challenging. Smile.


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## itbeso (Jul 6, 2005)

T2SHOOTER said:


> Can't use Vegas a model. My own opinion since shooting 3D and Field event requires longer shots than 20 yards. Big difference with a compound at 40 yards up to 80, or the 95 I shot this last weekend. Keep the recurves and longbows alone, and 50 yard max. The Bowhunter, compounds can be a fun class if there were more competition. The Barebow, compounds and Bowhunter can be in same class--just saying. But maybe like they do in other sports, if there isn't enough in one class, at least three, then put them together, but not mix compounds and recurves--bit difference at longer shots and totally not fair. I heard this weekend where there was a 50 yard max for the Trad classes, Redding makes them shoot compound distances. While everyone is shooting the same and it seems fair, and I wouldn't mind, a 20# to 30# trad recurve shot at 60+ yards is beyond challenging. Smile.


Local shoots can make their own rules for distances. Redding is a trail shoot and National 3-d Marked distance Championship under nfaa rules. No getting by with a 50 yard max for the faint of heart.


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## T2SHOOTER (Feb 26, 2014)

Distance is a challenge(fun) and disadvantage for light weight bows(not fun), so we just forget about participation? What's the draw if it's not fun? Promoters want attendance, support their clubs, make it challenging, yet, when there's only singles, doubles in many classes, why not combine them by bow style: compounds no sights and fingers (age groups ), and recurves/longbows (age groups). I also think the A,B,C thing can be simplified: Not three in letter class, combine them. I know it's not going to happen, but when in a group of five archers four come away with a ribbon/medal because there's nobody in their class with 300-400 archers in the event, where's the challenge? Smile.


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## zestycj7 (Sep 24, 2010)

At the Vegas shoot all recurve and compound non-sight and fingers shoots in the same class.
When they were talking about combining Barebow and Bowhunter they were going to keep all the Barebow equipment rules in place and drop the Bowhunter rules.
They didn't want to make it so the Barebow shooters had to give up any if their equipment.
In a nutshell they were getting rid of the Bowhunter class and saying we have to shoot Barebow but we could shoot without all the goodies on our bows.
I guess there were more Bowhunters than Barebow shooters that voiced an opinion for the vote.
Don.


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

Shooting 70m barebow with a 30# recurve isn't an issue. The long shots like Redding can be a challenge but who cares if everyone is shooting the same equipment.

If we could just convince the NFAA to roll all of the non-sight classes into BB recurve then we'd be able to move onto actually competing instead of just getting a medal for showing up.

-Grant


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## twofinger (Feb 12, 2012)

Grant, I am a non sight compound shooter I am not going to put a release in my hand or a sight on my bow. I am not that great of a shot so if the recurve bare bow guys would let me play I would. but also I can not attend any of the big shoots so it really does not matter. I only shoot indoors mostly any way so I could adapt to the bowhunter rules no big deal. but to just push us aside is stupid. I thank the nfaa for not cutting the class. now it is up to us to show others how much fun non sighted shooting could be. with all of this talk about bare bow recurve and such it still comes down to give and take and nobody wants to give. if compound means release and such I guess I will have a bunch of equipment rotting away in the basement.


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## hankw_2009 (Apr 2, 2009)

here in my area i just place myself in the release classes i am out to shoot and well being the only finger shooter at most o the shoots here i do what i have to do.... tried the release thing for a year and found out i like the feel of the string on my fingers so got rid of all the releases i have had.... but on the other side at the IBO world shoots there are always a couple of diehards to shoot against and learn more ways to improve in the class....


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## T2SHOOTER (Feb 26, 2014)

Grant, how in the heck do you think compounds and recuves should mix? For the few recurve shooters that can hang with the compound Bowhunter class, that should make it so? Not. Sure, I'm thinking the recurve BB shooters don't want the compounds in their class either--I'm not talking a 20 yard event. Now, saying that, I have no trouble with BB compound shooters in the Bowhunter class. I'm thinking the only difference being string walking? After talking with a couple of Trad guys today, they want nothing but wood in their shoots. No metal recurves, no rests, and no carbon arrows. Now, to me that's a bit overboard: while I will agree having a rest and carbon arrows will or should improve scores, it's still a recurve. New archers coming out shouldn't be penalized just because they have a metal bow and carbon arrows as long as it has no sights, stabilizers and is shooting fingers. Yes, it's stupid to be one in class, but I fault the promoter. If there isn't three in class then move them. Should be posted on flyer and at registration. Love shooting fingers.


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

Compound, Olympic Recurve and Barebow Recurve are all the classes anyone needs. World Archery has this figured out and their events show it with participation numbers.
If a person wants to shoot non-sight with fingers then get a recurve or shoot against all the other compounds, at least winning would mean something.

Shooting a compound with fingers non-sight vs. a recurve with fingers non-sight is the same process. If you are good with one you will be good with the other. My only conclusion is that people wish to maintain their small pond in order to keep pretending they are a big fish. As a result all we have are a bunch of small ponds.

-Grant


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## Supermag1 (Jun 11, 2009)

grantmac said:


> Compound, Olympic Recurve and Barebow Recurve are all the classes anyone needs. World Archery has this figured out and their events show it with participation numbers.
> If a person wants to shoot non-sight with fingers then get a recurve or shoot against all the other compounds, at least winning would mean something.
> 
> *Shooting a compound with fingers non-sight vs. a recurve with fingers non-sight is the same process*. If you are good with one you will be good with the other. My only conclusion is that people wish to maintain their small pond in order to keep pretending they are a big fish. As a result all we have are a bunch of small ponds.
> ...


You really have no clue what you are talking about. You obviously don't belong in this section so go back to the FITA forum and spout off there.


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## Pete53 (Dec 5, 2011)

i have always thought the main reason for so many archery divisions or classes is everyone wants a trophy or medal. so most clubs or organizations have all these divisions. i am kinda against all the classes except maybe by age the rest we all have the same options to buy and shoot.example is your 16 thru 60 years of age release or fingers - recurve or compound -sight or barebow you all shoot in the same class period . and for the ladies same thing except if there is 5 or more shooters you have a ladies class anything less they shoot with the man. the other two classes would be younger ones up to and thru 15 one class and 60 years of age and up. simple and easy way.


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## T2SHOOTER (Feb 26, 2014)

Promoters can eliminate a ton of classes by getting rid of the A,B, C thing. Just doing that would cut the board in half or more. The age thing works for me, but if there are less than five in the 60 and up, move them back down--I'm 72, and don't care. We need a little variety, and I don't need another ribbon, so we can put recurves/longbows/compounds fingers no sights one class, and anything with a sight/release in another. Smile. Won't happen, but nice thinking about it.


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## zestycj7 (Sep 24, 2010)

I like my small pond, I know everyone in it and they are all great people.
I can not shoot a recurve because of my crippled right hand, I tried and can not shoot more than a 15 pound bow. I can shoot a 57 pound compound only because of the 11 pound holding weight.
I will always shoot non-sights compound.
Don.


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## T2SHOOTER (Feb 26, 2014)

Just a thought after the last tournament: plenty of time to people watch. Smile. Recurve and longbow archers step to stake, locate mark, and shoot. I find I do the same. Now, this happened that day. Noticed several archers, step to mark, rangefinder in hand, put bow up, dial in scope, take 10 seconds to shoot, or pull the bow down two times and then shoot. Then take out binoculars locate arrow placement, and then do it again. Then there's the back up because this guy's stabilizer contraption came loose and yep more time wasted. Not only do I like our pond, but I came to shoot, not stand around all day watching absurdity. Smile. If I ever shoot in SoCal, I'll look for you.


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## twofinger (Feb 12, 2012)

I too over my archery life have shot every style but to me there is something that gets me really excited hitting the x shooting non sighted. This summer the league that I shoot in will be shooting outside 30,40 & 50 yards in the past when I have shot outside I have done so with sights with the encouragement from the rest of the gang I am going to shoot it bare bow also. (they told me they would bring the metal detector lol). The other night a man and his son came in because his son wanted to try archery. i had to laugh though because they kept pointing at me and i could hear them say he has no sights!!! and the son said and he hit the bullseye! but his dad got him to the line strap a release on him and tried to get him to pull a bow that was way way to much weight. i thought to my self get him a bow that he can pull back and put his fingers on the string. I too am like Don i can not shoot a recurve very long i have shoulder issues. has i said earlier i will continue to shoot leagues and if i do shoot in a tournament put me any where i don't care. i shoot to have fun now and having fun is shooting non sighted!


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## zestycj7 (Sep 24, 2010)

T2SHOOTER said:


> . If I ever shoot in SoCal, I'll look for you.


I will be shooting the Redding shoot. I should be there on Wednesday night, messing around and shooting with the fingers non-sight guys on Thursday on the front half of the range.

Don.


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