# Weight ratios



## Caden (Jun 14, 2018)

What's everyone running for stabilizer setups?


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## Dino757 (Jul 2, 2016)

30" front w/ 8 oz on a straight disconnect. 12" Rear w/ 20 oz.


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

outdoor WA 1440/720 

33" - 4 Oz front 
10" - 13 Oz side

Gota shoot what works for you and particular bow at the time, stabilisers are a constant evolution with your progress and changes.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

You asked of ratio. Most have a 1:3 or 1:2. Most is depends on length of stabilizers. 

Front stab is 30" and 31.25" counting quick disconnect. My back bars are 12" and 14.5" counting "V" mount and quick disconnects.
So 31.25" with 7 ounces and left 14.5" back bar with 12 ounces and right 14.5" back bar with 3 ounces. 
So 7 ounces to 15 ounces is a bit more than a 1:2 ratio. 

George Ryals, aka Griv, has a formula.
Formula is as follows is still just a in the Ball Park…..

"length of front bar times weight on front bar = "X"

Then:
"X" divided by length of back bar = weight on back bar.

example:
27" Front bar length times weight of 4 ounces = 108
108 / 12" rear bar length = 9 ounces for the rear bar.

You then take the 9 ounces, put it on the rear bar. If you do a true V bar, you split the weights between the two bars. If you do a side bar, you do it on the solo side bar.

You then add or remove weight on the rear bar only. Aim for the X. Remove or add weight until your side to side "misses" are down to a nice, ragged oval that basically kills the X."


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## Rick! (Aug 10, 2008)

1:1
18oz both front and rear, plus about 4-5 5/16" fender washers one each, both indoors and out.


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## 1tiger (Jan 24, 2005)

5 oz front 33 inch
13 oz 15 inch side


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## tristansdeleon (Feb 1, 2019)

30” front with 4 oz 12” back with 16 oz


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Back pain seems always I tried more balance. Still 7 on the front, 12 oz on back left and 9 oz on back right. So a 1:3 ratio


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

After some badly needed bow tuning, then tuning for groups with my stabilisers now i'm 5 oz on a 33", still 13 oz on side

shows if one things changes, you need to re visit your stabilisers/weights


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## legion_archery (Mar 4, 2014)

Front 30" BeeStinger Premier Plus w/5.5oz 

Back 12" BeeStinger Premier Plus w/16oz

I also have the 10° down quick disconnect on the front

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

^^^ Forgot. I have a 10 degree down front quick disconnect and both back bars are set right at 10 degrees down and about 30 degrees out......


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## RCR_III (Mar 19, 2011)

I've gotten away from the ratios all together at this point. After researching what was being done by some of the top pros and talking with them I started adjusting my bars and found that a more front weighted system works extremely well for me. It decreased my dip bangs and also promotes a strong shot and tells you very quickly if you're letting up. 

Right now I have a 30 inch front bar with 10 degree down angle running 8 ounces and a 15 inch rear bar running 13 ounces. This is on a PSE PerformX3D that is very front weighted on its own as a bare bow, just meaning it'll fall forward pretty aggressively when held in the hand instead of backwards like most bows will be.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Really want to know how well your stab/weight is holding try longer distance holding, 40-50 yards.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

To me this is a simple couple weeks of shooting, you get yourself 30 to 50 ounces of weight and lay it on your 3d stool at 50 yards. With the bars stripped down to no weight at all take a few shots to feel a bow with zero ounces and then start adding weight to the rear and the front. As the shooting session goes on pay attention to:

1. the bow and how it feels

2. Pin Float

3. Hold

4. Dip Bangs

As the week of shooting progresses jot down on paper the combos that really feel good as a first impression and then each day visit each of them and narrow down which setup really compliments your overall shooting. For me believe it or not 20 up front and 33 oz in the rear on my 33 inch front and 15 inch rear bar worked the best, I shot with that combo for years and it just gave me a very nice feeling bow. Right now I am using 9 up front and 21 in the rear. That combo was one of the ones that I had heard many people using and it was one of the front runners each time I tested and this winter I got a new bow and just went with it and havent but back on my old setup. Since I have a new bow I will probably lay out all my weight and test again to see what combo fits good to this bow.


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## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

One thing I would stay away from is one ounce changes, when you are going through this kind of process you need more than enough weight to play with and when you load up the bow with weight load a bunch. You need to feel the shock to your system to feel the real differences. having 4 up front and 10 in the rear and just putting one more ounce on the front just isn't going to teach you much.


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

Padgett said:


> One thing I would stay away from is one ounce changes, when you are going through this kind of process you need more than enough weight to play with and when you load up the bow with weight load a bunch. You need to feel the shock to your system to feel the real differences. having 4 up front and 10 in the rear and just putting one more ounce on the front just isn't going to teach you much.


This is surprising to me, I can tell and see the difference in groups with just an extra half ounce on my 33", and 1 ounce on my 10"?

I suppose it can depend how close to your limit you are regarding your total mass weight, or how you hold the bow/shooting style


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Padgett said:


> One thing I would stay away from is one ounce changes, when you are going through this kind of process you need more than enough weight to play with and when you load up the bow with weight load a bunch. You need to feel the shock to your system to feel the real differences. having 4 up front and 10 in the rear and just putting one more ounce on the front just isn't going to teach you much.


Have to agree....I've been trying different amounts of weights and it takes more than 1 ounce to feel a difference. I dropped weight again to 6 oz on the front and dropped to 15 oz on the back - total weight removed 7 ounces. My actually feels as balanced side to side and perhaps a bit of tipping forward (down), but nothing what I'd call drastic. I was up right at 8 3/4 pounds which just proved too heavy and still balance was good. 
today the wind blowing a bit harsh to show anything. I think going back to two back bars was the right thing to do.


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## RCR_III (Mar 19, 2011)

*SWITCH said:


> This is surprising to me, I can tell and see the difference in groups with just an extra half ounce on my 33", and 1 ounce on my 10"?
> 
> I suppose it can depend how close to your limit you are regarding your total mass weight, or how you hold the bow/shooting style


I’m the same. I tell a difference in small height changes for my back bar even.


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## FD3S (Jul 1, 2018)

I'm a year into target archery (well, archery in general) and stabilizer bars, so maybe I have no business asking this questions yet. I feel a huge difference between having stabilizers and not. 
But, what specific effect are you looking for when adjusting stabilizer weights? (besides where the arrow hits the target)  What benefit/effect is "felt" by moving weights around that I should look for? 
Apologies in advance if it's too noob of a question. Just want to understand some of the technical aspects of this really addicting sport. Thanks.


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

FD3S said:


> I'm a year into target archery (well, archery in general) and stabilizer bars, so maybe I have no business asking this questions yet. I feel a huge difference between having stabilizers and not.
> But, what specific effect are you looking for when adjusting stabilizer weights? (besides where the arrow hits the target)  What benefit/effect is "felt" by moving weights around that I should look for?
> Apologies in advance if it's too noob of a question. Just want to understand some of the technical aspects of this really addicting sport. Thanks.


hey welcome, not a stupid question at all and no apologies needed.

stabilisation is a complicated beast and a few quick searches should turn up a lot of threads on the subject.

generally more longrod weight will slow down your scope float, providing you don't go above your strength limit for mass weight. You can tune your vertical groups by changing weights/length of rod.

The side rod or rods can be used similarly to tune your horizontal groups, and again improve your hold/scope float.

Nuts n' bolts has some good posts on this subject.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Padgett said:


> One thing I would stay away from is one ounce changes, when you are going through this kind of process you need more than enough weight to play with and when you load up the bow with weight load a bunch. You need to feel the shock to your system to feel the real differences. having 4 up front and 10 in the rear and just putting one more ounce on the front just isn't going to teach you much.


Nice day yesterday. Still looking for that little bit. Added 1 ounce to each back bar, 2 ounces, to make my bow not tip so much forward and still have side to side balance. So 17 ounces on the back to the 6 ounces on the front.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

FD3S said:


> I'm a year into target archery (well, archery in general) and stabilizer bars, so maybe I have no business asking this questions yet. I feel a huge difference between having stabilizers and not.
> But, what specific effect are you looking for when adjusting stabilizer weights? (besides where the arrow hits the target)  What benefit/effect is "felt" by moving weights around that I should look for?
> Apologies in advance if it's too noob of a question. Just want to understand some of the technical aspects of this really addicting sport. Thanks.


General info; No doubt a 30" front and a 12 to 15" back are lengths most used, not that shorter won't work. Best is start out with nothing on the stabs and look for balance, forward, backward, side to side. Add 1 ounce to the front 2 to 3 times that on the back - just ball park stuff here. You can hold on the target and see what jiggle you may have, up and down, wandering.
Still a good read is that of George Ryals, aka Griv; https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=453862

General Archery Information forum should be read by many....Great information. The Great Oxford put together the best forum ever.

A lot more of Griv and stabilizer - long read, but worth it. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct.../stabilizers&usg=AOvVaw0lKB-IiDYPWGG5u1bsxTuW


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## RCR_III (Mar 19, 2011)

I’ve gone away from the ratios part but if you’d like to understand some stabilizer basics, how riser geometry plays a part, and finding ratios here’s a video: 

https://youtu.be/eADJF5YdqLw


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## Biggreendiesel (Apr 20, 2011)

I also subscribe to Grivs formula, at least it has always been a good starting point for me. I do use more weight than a lot of folks, I shoot a Prevail 40SVX , 33" front bar with 20 oz, 12" back bar with 54 oz. When I'm dialing in my setup I start with 4 oz changes and fine tune by 2 oz at a time..


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

Biggreendiesel said:


> I also subscribe to Grivs formula, at least it has always been a good starting point for me. I do use more weight than a lot of folks, I shoot a Prevail 40SVX , 33" front bar with 20 oz, 12" back bar with 54 oz. When I'm dialing in my setup I start with 4 oz changes and fine tune by 2 oz at a time..


Say what now?? 54 oz...geez

i'd expect that much weight to provide absolutely zero pin/scope float, how do ya score on say a vegas round? (if u shoot target)

I tried 11oz up front the other day, I could hold it fine but it shot like crapolla. maybe I shudda gone the full 20/54oz route, except I only have like 30oz tops


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## Biggreendiesel (Apr 20, 2011)

*SWITCH said:


> Say what now?? 54 oz...geez
> 
> i'd expect that much weight to provide absolutely zero pin/scope float, how do ya score on say a vegas round? (if u shoot target)
> 
> I tried 11oz up front the other day, I could hold it fine but it shot like crapolla. maybe I shudda gone the full 20/54oz route, except I only have like 30oz tops


Vegas face 299/300 with 22-24x, 5 spot average 300/56x. I am a command shooter, so less movement of the pin is beneficial to my scores. I'd love to be able to master a surprise release, but I haven't yet.
Shooting a bunch of weight isn't for everyone, but it has worked for me..


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## FD3S (Jul 1, 2018)

SWITCH, Thanks for that explanation. Makes a lot of sense. 

I'll search the topic and look up the threads by Nuts n' bolts.


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## Mahly (Dec 18, 2002)

Personally, I never pay attention to ratios.

Each of my bows want something a little different. Mostly because of the grip.

One of my bows wants a good bit of a side load, another wants virtually none.

Instead of ratios, I go by what “feels right”. 
I have a general idea on about how much weight I will use, based partly on the weight of the bow. But more importantly, I know what I am looking for in my hold, and I know how my bows react when they are “just right”.

For a basic, ballpark starting point, I know I want the bow to want to be level (I understand some prefer to have something to “push against”, I do not).
I also know that after the shot fires, the bow is going to tip forward. How much is hard to describe. More than a little, not a drastic amount. All that matters it I know what it looks like when it is pretty close.
I don’t set it up to do that, that is a side effect. But a side effect that has been on every single bow I set up to work with me optimally.
That said, if the weight feels right, and it tips forward after the shot... I know I can get to work making it perfect.
The next step for me is to adjust the weight on the front. 
The front bar provides the most feedback, and it is the bar that is going to make things easier, or make things harder.
Once I think my front weight is close, it’s time to adjust rear weight.
I generally guess as to about how much I want to start working with... and it’s usually pretty close.
The next step is finding where the bow wants side weight.
This is why I don’t follow a formula. I’m going to fine tune that side weight with changing the angle of the bar.
I’m not going to re-calculate my ratio every time I move the bar.
I’ll start with the bar out around 30 degrees out and down.
Move it in or out depending on what the bow asks for
Now that the side weight is close, I need to see what that did to my front/rear weight bias. I’ll raise or lower the bar to get where I need to be. Then double check that side balance.

It may sound like a lot of work, but it really goes pretty quickly. 

Instead of adding and removing washers, I just adjust angles on the mounts.

Once I get very close. I just stop and shoot... maybe for an hour, maybe for a few days.
I just watch what is going on.

When I see a trend that can be improved, I make an adjustment to the back bar. Then just shoot and watch.
The closer I get, the longer between adjustments.... and the smaller the adjustments will be.

I can’t tell you my ratio, because I don’t know it. I suspect my ratio is different for every bow I own, as I don’t own 2 of the same riser, or even 2 or the same grip.
I can’t tell you how much weight I am running without taking them off my bows. I normally make my own weights... then just add 1 or 2 pre-made ones if needed.
I really don’t believe the exact weight is that important, just that you match the bias to what the bow is asking for. (Within reason).

This is my Prime. Solid weights on each stab. Rear stab as close to the cables as possible avoiding contact. Down 19.5 degrees










This is my Strother. More weights on the rear stab, and much more angle away from the bow. (The rear weight on this bow is larger than on the Strother) and down 31 degrees










My Alpine, the most rear weight (long weight plus 2 factory weights) close to the bow, and very close to horizontal at 14 degrees










Maybe those are the same ratio. Maybe not.
But this is just 2 bows that work for me. I’m not going to chase a ratio on my next bow.


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

@Mahly agreed, but I think your scopes are too far out :zip:


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## Mahly (Dec 18, 2002)

*SWITCH said:


> @Mahly agreed, but I think your scopes are too far out :zip:


And why would you say that?
Wait, don’t answer that... not here at least 

#saynotohighjacking


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

Biggreendiesel said:


> Vegas face 299/300 with 22-24x, 5 spot average 300/56x. I am a command shooter, so less movement of the pin is beneficial to my scores. I'd love to be able to master a surprise release, but I haven't yet.
> Shooting a bunch of weight isn't for everyone, but it has worked for me..


yeh sounds like that is working very well for you, tidy scores. i also command shoot, so agreed, steadier is better. what bars are you using to support that amount of weight?

pics of how you have stabilisers would be of interest if you have any?

At moment my side rod is right out, just under 90 degrees from riser with about 11oz so pretty sure 54oz on there not gonna work for me! :laugh:


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## Biggreendiesel (Apr 20, 2011)

*SWITCH said:


> yeh sounds like that is working very well for you, tidy scores. i also command shoot, so agreed, steadier is better. what bars are you using to support that amount of weight?
> 
> pics of how you have stabilisers would be of interest if you have any?
> 
> At moment my side rod is right out, just under 90 degrees from riser with about 11oz so pretty sure 54oz on there not gonna work for me! :laugh:


I was using B-stinger premiere plus bars, honestly they were a little weak for that much weight. I am now using Easton Z-Flex bars, they are excellent. Also I use shrewd bar mounts, they are very sturdy. Front bar is on a 10 degree down, back bar is in lowest mount hole on riser, fairly close to the bottom limb and angled down enough to not hit my leg on steep downhill shots. I also make my own weights to have a larger diameter so the stack isn't as long..


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Biggreendiesel said:


> I was using B-stinger premiere plus bars, honestly they were a little weak for that much weight. I am now using Easton Z-Flex bars, they are excellent. Also I use shrewd bar mounts, they are very sturdy. Front bar is on a 10 degree down, back bar is in lowest mount hole on riser, fairly close to the bottom limb and angled down enough to not hit my leg on steep downhill shots. I also make my own weights to have a larger diameter so the stack isn't as long..


74 ounces is a bunch...like 4 5/8 lbs.... I can feel my shoulder falling apart. What's overall weight, bow and all? Pushing 11+ pounds?


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## Biggreendiesel (Apr 20, 2011)

SonnyThomas said:


> 74 ounces is a bunch...like 4 5/8 lbs.... I can feel my shoulder falling apart. What's overall weight, bow and all? Pushing 11+ pounds?


I've never weighed the bow complete, but it's a Prevail 40, so bare bow is 5 pounds-ish. It must be close to 11 pounds I'd guess. My holding weight is 23.8 pounds, that helps a lot with the mass weight..


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

Biggreendiesel said:


> I was using B-stinger premiere plus bars, honestly they were a little weak for that much weight. I am now using Easton Z-Flex bars, they are excellent. Also I use shrewd bar mounts, they are very sturdy. Front bar is on a 10 degree down, back bar is in lowest mount hole on riser, fairly close to the bottom limb and angled down enough to not hit my leg on steep downhill shots. I also make my own weights to have a larger diameter so the stack isn't as long..


ok thanks. yeh I run 40mm diameter weights on side, noticeably better than the 30's. tungsten would be nice if price point was reasonable.

getting some useful info on this thread, like you can still do well with a cheap rod if you don't run too much weight and that Easton z flex are probably stiffer than the stinger prem plus.


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## *SWITCH (Nov 27, 2007)

Biggreendiesel said:


> I also subscribe to Grivs formula, at least it has always been a good starting point for me. I do use more weight than a lot of folks, I shoot a Prevail 40SVX , 33" front bar with 20 oz, 12" back bar with 54 oz. When I'm dialing in my setup I start with 4 oz changes and fine tune by 2 oz at a time..


Ok thought I would try a heavier set up for 50 and 30m, just to see, and I seem to like it.

Couldn't go really heavy on my front rod, a 30" plus 1" damper, that's at 6 oz at moment but may try small increases on that. Added 6 oz to riser and up to 21 oz on side rod which is way out to side maybe 70 degrees.

not particulary heavy compared to some and less than half what u have BGD, but total weight is now 33 oz compared to 21 oz before.

Bow naturally leans a lot to the left as you would imagine but dam if it doesn't hold like a rock through the whole shot process and on release.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Mahly said:


> Personally, I never pay attention to ratios. Each of my bows want something a little different. Mostly because of the grip.


I think the ratio thing came up just for a starting point.....

Back pain so-so I worked on weight placement and for the past 3 days not so bad. Checked bow weight and was a little amazed. Bow balances side to side very nice and a ever so slighty (tor) forward. Still 7 ounces on the front, but changed to 11 ounces on the back left and 7 ounces on the back right. Total weights, 25 ounces. Total bow weight, 8 1/2 pounds and it doesn't feel it, not at full draw. Seems to hold well on target. Leaving it for few days and a test hop at a ASA State Qualifier today, my first 3D of the year.

I just can't get going for something going wrong.....


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Bow shot great, bow held well and I sucked. Dang thumb hung onto the pulling twice for two 0s. Pulled high too many time, shot low of the 12 so dang many times and so close. Six 12s and two 5s. About target 17 my back was aching something terrible. So guys in my group pulled and scored for. All the trees in the world on the course and not enough to lean on to ease my back. Got through it though and I am one wore out tired puppy.......

First 3D of the year, first time shooting a full 3D using a hinge, alive at the end...so I guess I did okay.


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## Bow Rider (Jan 16, 2015)

I don't know what the ratio is. I have doinker fatty's. Tore them down and put in longer bolts. 21 fender washers out front spaced with tank washers, and 48 fender washers out back. Used this setup through three bows and happy with it. It may be ghetto, but seems to work for me.


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## IA3D (Feb 15, 2019)

I am running a 1:4 ratio. That may change due to switching to a longer front bar and longer rear bar later this week.


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## 1tiger (Jan 24, 2005)

1tiger said:


> 5 oz front 33 inch
> 13 oz 15 inch side


added more now
7 oz front bar
18 oz on side rod


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## the.pabst (Nov 6, 2014)

Hi,

since one year I have good results with 18oz on a 30" front bar and 24oz on a 14". I´ve tried very differnt ratios and weights... the heaviest combo was 22oz up frond and 30oz back. Super steady but on a 3d course too heavy. After long time aiming, when the bow drops a little bit down, the bow was way too heavy to bring it back. So I went back to 18 / 24
18-30, 24-14 is perfect for 3d and field, where you shoot 1 to 3 arrows at a time and then view minutes to relax. 
For FITA it is too heavy because of 6 arrows at a time and short breaks. After 9 sets I start with struggling with my bow. My scores are 343-345 @50m for the first 36 arrows, at the secound 36 arrows my score drops to 335. 
Nevertheless, I shoot only 3D and field, therefore the weight is perfect for me.


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## 1tiger (Jan 24, 2005)

1tiger said:


> added more now
> 7 oz front bar
> 18 oz on side rod


now up to 12 oz front 33 inch bar
and 20 oz on side 15 inch bar


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## 1tiger (Jan 24, 2005)

12 up fornt turned out to be too much for me. shot better at
8 oz front 33
18 oz on side 15 rod


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

I’m right around 1:2... I stay right around there usually. Sometimes the front is a little heavier. Right now I’m running 9oz roughly up front and 19oz on the back. 

But this setup is different from what I’ve run in the past as I’m now running AAE bars with a 10* mount up front and the 8oz big rig and one extra weight instead of the traditional stack. Last year I ran 19oz on my back bar and a 10-11oz stack up front. 

If I get over 20oz on the back bar things get squirrelly for me. Front weight doesn’t bother me as much. Just shoot what makes the bow hold the way I want it to without messing with my form. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## the.pabst (Nov 6, 2014)

I just changed my setup. The 14" back bar was a bit too long, because at downhill shoots I always touched the back bar with my body.
Therefore I changed to 12"
Now I run 16oz front 30 and 25oz back 12".
so far so good.... perfectly hold on target, good reaction after shoot. Slightly front heavy


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