# Both eyes open problem



## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

I have no problem shooting with both eyes open until I put a 4X or higher lens in my scope.

What's up with that?


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Just recently? If so, maybe getting use to. Maybe needing a different size peep.
.
.
Sure some one is pointing you in the right direction of the target


----------



## nswarcher (Apr 16, 2015)

Agree with sonny, can you wink your non dominant eye to refocus or does your brain refuse to let you see correctly?


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

carlosii said:


> I have no problem shooting with both eyes open until I put a 4X or higher lens in my scope.
> 
> What's up with that?


I have the same problem. The eye with the least strain wants to take over. I didn't have an issue for almost two years shooting with a 4X lens, but then it just started happening. 

I don't like squinting or closing my left eye, so I use a blinder on my bow. Works great. I don't like the hat blinders, so I use a makeshift one attached to my riser. You can buy ones that mount on your scope.


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Blockers, that on the scope or bow. Some organizations don't allow, so I'd check.

My eyes are wreck. I am left handed, left eye dominant, but shoot a bow right handed. Glasses; Top left, straight. Top right, slight magnification. Left bifocal, 175. Right bifocal, 150. Need glasses to set my sight frame. Have take glasses off to shoot.

Suggested training/practice/getting use to; Squint or close off eye, let sighting eye take command, let off eye do what it wants (squint or open).
I never really had to practice all that much, a day, a little to start each time and then like any one else with both eyes open.


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

SonnyThomas said:


> Blockers, that on the scope or bow. Some organizations don't allow, so I'd check.


I have and haven't found one.


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

I couldn't get FITA rules to download, but found the below. Skipping through AT there is also mention of blockers not allowed by FITA.
If by below, then also NAA and FITA
."It is the decision of the Technical Committee that the bow sight cover/visor device shown
in the photo below, or any device like it, is not legal in any division of World Archery.
This decision is due to reasons of safety. Regardless if the device may come under
controversy as a ranging device or other means of judging distance, the issue of safety
supersedes all other concerns. The device creates a substantial visual impairment of a
large section of the archery field and greatly limits the archer’s ability to see people,
animals or other safety issues within the area blocked by the cover/visor. As such, the
device is determined to be illegal in all divisions of World Archery due to safety
concerns."

Picture shown was that of scope with a card attached that blocked seeing the target.


----------



## Pete53 (Dec 5, 2011)

shot 2 eyes open for 50 some years, but then age gave me problems with my dang eyes, so now its just easier to shoot one eye for me. good luck


----------



## vito9999 (Jun 30, 2009)

Depends on scope peep comb. Been wearing glasses siince1964 so kinda used to them my bifocals added a new twist 20 years back. I have noticed the better quality lens (Brian's Custom) have given me better 2 eye focus @ 4x than other companies. I switched left to right in 2009 still have the left eye trying to take over especially in low light. Been thinking of getting a blinder. If my glasses slide down my nose just right I can get 4 targets to choose from, that's when I have to start all over.


----------



## lacampbell2005 (Feb 17, 2015)

Clarifier may help?


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

SonnyThomas said:


> Skipping through AT there is also mention of blockers not allowed by FITA.
> If by below, then also NAA and FITA...


Pretty much explains where you got the idea.

I looked into it last year before going to Indoor Nationals (NAA) which follows FITA rules and found no such thing. I had my bow and arrows inspected at the tournament. At the inspection, they asked me what it was for. No issues.


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

I got through Google. www.archery-forum.com

Also, montigre told of the rule sometime way back in this forum - found it http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2463495&p=1072882151#post1072882151


----------



## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

You know, in the last year I have really suffered with this other eye trying to take over. In the beginning I thought it was my contact lens just blurring out as I aimed but then I finally realized that my non aiming eye was trying to take over and this caused my vision of the target to blurr. It does affect my 3d a little but it absolutely kills my indoor, It usually happens about the time my shot is going to break and I will see my black dot vanish and then the entire target begins to fate and it all happens really quick and many many times my shot fires and this is when my misses happen. Why? Because my float was awesome and I had no reason to be ready to let down and then since the shot is right on the edge when the fade does start there is no time to do anything. 

This winter I have struggled keep my focus on the aiming eye and not let the other eye take over and in the last few weeks I have been doing better.


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

SonnyThomas said:


> I got through Google.



If in doubt go straight to the source. Rules link from USA Archery page------> https://worldarchery.org/Rules

Rules apply only to using an eye blinder on your face or glasses, and even then there are just limitations. There is nothing saying blockers or blinders are not allowed.

Like I said, I went to the tournament instead of going by what someone said on a forum.


Padgett - that's pretty much how it went for me. It started with the right side of the target and got worse. I tried a hat blinder and didn't like that very much, so I made one with a cut out fro a target and have used it successfully for about two years now. When I get out my hunting bow I have no issues. It probably has a lot to do with focus clarity and not having one eye heavily dominant over the other. I remember even as a kid doing the hole in paper thing to test which eye was dominant, it would go to either side.


----------



## lacampbell2005 (Feb 17, 2015)

I shoot FITA competitions at Lancaster Archery and had to remove my blinder...


----------



## Padgett (Feb 5, 2010)

Yeah, for me it has been devestating. From a competitive standpoint shooting leagues and the midwest open I was having at least 6 of them per vegas scoring round and that is where I would drop a couple 9's. 4 out of the 6 would stay in the 10 ring but I would usually miss the baby x. For me being a amateur and on a day when I don't have the problem I can shoot a 323 or 324 vegas it will drop me to 299 20x in a hurry.


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

lacampbell2005 said:


> I shoot FITA competitions at Lancaster Archery and had to remove my blinder...


What was it? According to LAS rules stated here: http://www.lancasterarchery.com/archery-classic-format/#header they go by NFAA rules which are linked a few paragraphs down the page. The only thing I found was in Bowhunter limited where the only thing in the sight window can be your rest and scope. Nothing for freestyle. 

That doesn't mean an equipment inspector didn't make you take it off, but I would ask them to show me where it is in the rules if I could. (granted, I know lines are long at equipment inspections and they may refuse, but all the same, I would make every effort).

If anyone else has a verifiable source showing any organization that does not allow a double vision blocker, please post it. I honestly want to know because I do use one and compete in some. I've read through WA, USA Archery, and NFAA. Similar to what sonny said, if I google FITA rules it brings up WA and USA Archery.


----------



## lacampbell2005 (Feb 17, 2015)

cbrunson said:


> What was it? According to LAS rules stated here: http://www.lancasterarchery.com/archery-classic-format/#header they go by NFAA rules which are linked a few paragraphs down the page. The only thing I found was in Bowhunter limited where the only thing in the sight window can be your rest and scope. Nothing for freestyle.
> 
> That doesn't mean an equipment inspector didn't make you take it off, but I would ask them to show me where it is in the rules if I could. (granted, I know lines are long at equipment inspections and they may refuse, but all the same, I would make every effort).
> 
> If anyone else has a verifiable source showing any organization that does not allow a double vision blocker, please post it. I honestly want to know because I do use one and compete in some. I've read through WA, USA Archery, and NFAA. Similar to what sonny said, if I google FITA rules it brings up WA and USA Archery.


I believe the FITA shoots follow USA Archery rules (The Classic is different). However, I agree there is no specific rule that I can find barring a blinder attached to the scope. I will ask the equipment inspector next competition I attend as I like to use a blinder, too.


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

cbrunson said:


> If in doubt go straight to the source. Rules link from USA Archery page------> https://worldarchery.org/Rules
> 
> Rules apply only to using an eye blinder on your face or glasses, and even then there are just limitations. There is nothing saying blockers or blinders are not allowed.
> 
> ...


Can you read? "I couldn't get FITA rules to download."

I had a blank page and my network performance running a 90% for about 8 minutes. I'm on Dial Up. Out in the country, 220 feet down. DSL isn't available and wireless can't reach up...


----------



## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

cbrunson said:


> If anyone else has a verifiable source showing any organization that does not allow a double vision blocker, please post it. I honestly want to know because I do use one and compete in some. I've read through WA, USA Archery, and NFAA. Similar to what sonny said, if I google FITA rules it brings up WA and USA Archery.


https://extranet.worldarchery.org/documents/index.php/html/?dir=62

Looking through their 2014 rules interpretations...Seventh one from the bottom...."Sight"


----------



## lacampbell2005 (Feb 17, 2015)

Bobmuley said:


> https://extranet.worldarchery.org/documents/index.php/html/?dir=62
> 
> Seventh one from the bottom...."Sight"


Thanks. I think that is the rule barring the blocker. Dang, I was hoping to get back to using one. Appreciate you finding it.


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

.......


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

Bobmuley said:


> https://extranet.worldarchery.org/documents/index.php/html/?dir=62
> 
> Looking through their 2014 rules interpretations...Seventh one from the bottom...."Sight"


Good find. Interesting. I would've never looked in interpretations Thanks.

I will have to do more digging since mine is not attached to the sight and wouldn't meet that criteria. I can see how it could be open to interpretation however.


----------



## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

There's wasn't either. WA considers the whole thing the sight.


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

Bobmuley said:


> There's wasn't either. WA considers the whole thing the sight.


Mine is on the riser. I have complete field of view through the window. Saying mine is illegal could be saying shoot through risers are illegal. 

Interpretation. Certainly worth more digging. It passed inspection at indoor nationals.


----------



## Bobmuley (Jan 14, 2004)

Shoot through risers are specifically allowed. Book 3, Chapter 11, 11.2.1.

I would look at the reason for the decision and compare it to your situation. I think then that you could draw a logical connection as to what their decision would be. Have a picture? Is this a commercially available setup? Asking for the non-WA stuff.


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

Bobmuley said:


> Shoot through risers are specifically allowed. Book 3, Chapter 11, 11.2.1.
> 
> I would look at the reason for the decision and compare it to your situation. I think then that you could draw a logical connection as to what their decision would be. Have a picture? Is this a commercially available setup? Asking for the non


http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2440330&p=1072614760#post1072614760 A little different on my current bow but pretty much the same.

It's a strange conclusion they came to considering if you shoot with one eye closed, you are significantly more limited in your field of view.


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Picture to my post #7. Each organization has a different name for those making the decisions/interpretation. NFAA is R.I.C. 

I ain't looking it back up, but one of those with the Double Vision Blocker (their post) got banned and I thought it was one of them demanding a hard copy of the rule. Pretty sure rule got passed around 2010....maybe 2009


----------



## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

SonnyThomas said:


> Can you read? "I couldn't get FITA rules to download."
> 
> I had a blank page and my network performance running a 90% for about 8 minutes. I'm on Dial Up. Out in the country, 220 feet down. DSL isn't available and wireless can't reach up...





Bobmuley said:


> There's wasn't either. WA considers the whole thing the sight.
> View attachment 5393785


What are the dimensions of that blocker? Might try making one.


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Chuck, that appears to be a 1 3/4" scope housing. So take a guess. The Home site of Double Vision Blocker doesn't give the size. Might try Search in General Archery Discussion as there was talk of it and maybe someone gave the dimensions. Order, unless changed, is about $15 including shipping. I think you have to specify scope size.


----------



## nestly (Apr 19, 2015)

SonnyThomas said:


> Picture to my post #7. Each organization has a different name for those making the decisions/interpretation. NFAA is R.I.C.
> 
> I ain't looking it back up, but one of those with the Double Vision Blocker (their post) got banned and I thought it was one of them demanding a hard copy of the rule. Pretty sure rule got passed around 2010....maybe 2009


NFAA specifically approved the Double Vision blocker in the 2010 ruling as long as it's used as a vision blocker.


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

We weren't talking about the NFAA. It was the WA, NAA and FITA. Some confusion came because committee interpretations are elsewhere, not with the rule. No different with the NFAA. The is the rule and then the Rules Interpretation Committee ruling, which is located in under NFAA Policy Secton and not all are included. You have to go to the NFAA and ask for a full list.

About the same time frame of vision blockers ruled against by the WA, the NFAA accepted the vision blocker...Which came first I don't know...


----------



## lacampbell2005 (Feb 17, 2015)

I'll just stay away from the blocker so I don't become dependent on them...they are nice, though.


----------



## cbrunson (Oct 25, 2010)

Well the hat blinders must be okay. I just saw one on the bj live feed in Nimes.


----------



## SD-Archer (Jan 19, 2010)

SonnyThomas said:


> I couldn't get FITA rules to download, but found the below. Skipping through AT there is also mention of blockers not allowed by FITA.
> If by below, then also NAA and FITA
> ."It is the decision of the Technical Committee that the bow sight cover/visor device shown
> in the photo below, or any device like it, is not legal in any division of World Archery.
> ...



Going to be a humorous claim when a person with one eye takes the stage....


----------



## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

SD-Archer said:


> Going to be a humorous claim when a person with one eye takes the stage....


:lol3::lol3:


----------



## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

SD-Archer said:


> Going to be a humorous claim when a person with one eye takes the stage....


The rule stands whether you like it or not. As for a one eyed person, the eye sees more than the peep and the pin. Try this; Peripheral vision definition, all that is visible to the eye outside the central area of focus. Okay, the blocker blocks what peripheral vision one would have.


----------

