# Field Archery Shooters:



## WV Has Been (Aug 9, 2002)

Why are you not at the National Outdoor?


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## WVDBLLUNG (Feb 8, 2008)

Due to massive layoffs within my company I am now forced to run both our Charles Town, WV office and the Leesburg, VA office - too much time being split to practice and compete right now. In this market you have to do what is needed to keep your job.

Best of Luck to Randy "Hinkelmonster" Hinkelman, Tom "TC" Coblentz and all the other Tuscarora Members who did make the trip.


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Has Been, there's not a choice that fits my situation. :wink:

I've not been shooting Field long enough nor are my scores good enough "justify" going to a National Shoot. Once I have a bit more experience, I'd surely have to take into consideration the "reasons" you listed, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't go.

Lee


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

Too much going on this summer for me......so it's a money/vacation time thing.

See you next year though:wink:


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## WrongdayJ (May 22, 2008)

What Hornet said. . .me too.


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## WV Has Been (Aug 9, 2002)

pragmatic_lee said:


> Has Been, there's not a choice that fits my situation. :wink:
> 
> I've not been shooting Field long enough nor are my scores good enough "justify" going to a National Shoot. Once I have a bit more experience, I'd surely have to take into consideration the "reasons" you listed, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't go.
> 
> Lee


Next year the Outdoor Nationals are in Mechanicsburg PA about the same distance you traveled to the HillBilly. The shoot runs Wed - Sun. The only mandatory day is Friday the animal round. You can shoot your field round on Wednesday or Saturday and your Hunter Round on Thursday or Sunday. The other option is to shoot all five days and you best Field and Hunter counts for your total of 28 Field, 28 Hunter and 28 Animal.

It will be at least three years before the Outdoor National hits the East Coast again.

Are you going?


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## BOWGOD (Aug 11, 2004)

WV Has Been said:


> Next year the Outdoor Nationals are in Mechanicsburg PA about the same distance you traveled to the HillBilly. The shoot runs Wed - Sun. The only mandatory day is Friday the animal round. You can shoot your field round on Wednesday or Saturday and your Hunter Round on Thursday or Sunday. The other option is to shoot all five days and you best Field and Hunter counts for your total of 28 Field, 28 Hunter and 28 Animal.
> 
> It will be at least three years before the Outdoor National hits the East Coast again.
> 
> Are you going?


i'll be there next year, we just shot at mechanicsburg over the week end they have a real nice course (or i should say courses) i can't wait for next summer.:tongue:

so why aren't you at nationals brian? you ask all these questions of everyone else but here you are sitting on archerytalk with the rest of us?


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

WV Has Been said:


> Next year the Outdoor Nationals are in Mechanicsburg PA about the same distance you traveled to the HillBilly. The shoot runs Wed - Sun. The only mandatory day is Friday the animal round. You can shoot your field round on Wednesday or Saturday and your Hunter Round on Thursday or Sunday. The other option is to shoot all five days and you best Field and Hunter counts for your total of 28 Field, 28 Hunter and 28 Animal.
> 
> It will be at least three years before the Outdoor National hits the East Coast again.
> 
> Are you going?


If nothing happens between now and then, I see no reason for me not going. As I said, experience/scores could not "justify" the items listed in your poll. But, if the Nationals are close by, I'd really have no excuse not to go even with my limited experience/scores. Not that I'm made of money, but I have plenty of vacation time left over every year, got a 35+ MPG car, and might can even scrape up a tent by next year. Besides, just how much shooting with Jarlicker & Mac can one take without meeting new folks. :wink:


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

BOWGOD said:


> i'll be there next year, we just shot at mechanicsburg over the week end they have a real nice course (or i should say courses) i can't wait for next summer.:tongue:
> 
> *so why aren't you at nationals brian*? you ask all these questions of everyone else but here you are sitting on archerytalk with the rest of us?


He actually answered that in his response to his poll - Vacation time & too long.


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

For me...a 5 day format doesn't work. As I've said *MANY* times before...I just can't justify taking a whole week of vacation for an archery tournament.


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

mdbowhunter said:


> For me...a 5 day format doesn't work. As I've said *MANY* times before...I just can't justify taking a whole week of vacation for an archery tournament.


I've taken a whole week off to go fishing and came home with not much more than an empty wallet and a sun-burn. :wink:

At least with archery, I'd have my score, be it good or bad. :tongue:


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## mdbowhunter (Oct 22, 2002)

pragmatic_lee said:


> I've taken a whole week off to go fishing and came home with not much more than an empty wallet and a sun-burn. :wink:
> 
> At least with archery, I'd have my score, be it good or bad. :tongue:


I hear ya. I'll take a week to go deer hunting too. :wink:

But shooting my bow 5 days straight...in a tournament? Sorry, just doesn't interest me.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

mdbowhunter said:


> I hear ya. I'll take a week to go deer hunting too. :wink:
> 
> But shooting my bow 5 days straight...in a tournament? Sorry, just doesn't interest me.


I hear ya...but I am the other way....95% of the time I would rather shoot 5 days straight then deer hunt 5 days straight.

That 5% falls during and around the rut:wink:


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## str8arrow (Jul 25, 2002)

None of your choice's work for me either! I have the money and the time to go. I't not even that far away, but someone needs to watch the little one. That the kind of sacrifice you have to make. See you next year!


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Brown Hornet said:


> I hear ya...but I am the other way....95% of the time I would rather shoot 5 days straight then deer hunt 5 days straight.
> *
> That 5% falls during and around the rut*:wink:


The deer rut or the Hornet rut? :tongue:

Couldn't help but think of you yesterday when I witnessed an archer running full speed from behind the 80 yard target. Seems he encountered an in ground "Hornet" nest.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

pragmatic_lee said:


> The deer rut or the Hornet rut? :tongue:
> 
> Couldn't help but think of you yesterday when I witnessed an archer running full speed from behind the 80 yard target. Seems he encountered an in ground "Hornet" nest.


The deer 

 I have had that happen before....not fun having family fights in public:wink:


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## Ode1891 (Aug 30, 2006)

*why I'm not going*

Reason number one: Too far away and it requires too much of my vacation. Also, this is my first year in field so I'm getting the kinks out of my stuff and deciding what arrows and sight to get for 09. Not that I have hopes of winning anything, but I do want to have my set up right etc before I take time off for shoots. I'd like to give it my best. 


I've made 6 Field shoots so far this year, and will probably get another 4 in before September 7. 


I'll shoot the Nationals in 09 since I can drive up every day if I choose, and I'll shoot all the 2009 local shoots too.


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## WVDBLLUNG (Feb 8, 2008)

I do plan on going next year - I have a full year to get work in order and practice and compete more before the tournament comes around.


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## Dave T (Mar 24, 2004)

Much as I would love to shoot the Nationals I have a disability that makes travel difficult, even painful and limits me to at most 3 days of shooting. Even if I could manage to shoot for 3 full days I then would be in no shape to make the trip home.

Dave


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## huntelk (Jan 11, 2004)

*I was there for the 3-d*

I'd shoot the field, but the Minnesota State Director shoots in my class (BHFS) and would find a way to cheat the rest of us out of contention one way or another. -Even if he has to take his Regional Director on a hunt to sway the vote:secret:


I guess I could "play the game", and offer to take the NFAA Prez on a private land Kansas Whitetail hunt-but that's not how I roll! Guess I'll just have to stick with the 3-d orgs and may have to try FITA:tongue:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

huntelk said:


> I'd shoot the field, but the Minnesota State Director shoots in my class (BHFS) and would find a way to cheat the rest of us out of contention one way or another. -Even if he has to take his Regional Director on a hunt to sway the vote:secret:
> 
> 
> I guess I could "play the game", and offer to take the NFAA Prez on a private land Kansas Whitetail hunt-but that's not how I roll! Guess I'll just have to stick with the 3-d orgs and may have to try FITA:tongue:


Wanna put some $$ on it that he doesn't finish in the top:wink:

But your post makes zero sense in all honesty.....:embara:


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Brown Hornet said:


> Wanna put some $$ on it that he doesn't finish in the top:wink:
> 
> But your post makes zero sense in all honesty.....:embara:


BH, you're spending way too much time "working" and not enough time keeping up with the events on AT. 

See this thread
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=723343


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## huntelk (Jan 11, 2004)

Brown Hornet said:


> Wanna put some $$ on it that he doesn't finish in the top:wink:
> 
> I hope he gets blown out of the water:set1_punch:-but who are the other contenders I should be rooting for:RockOn:?
> But your post makes zero sense in all honesty.....:embara:


I'm sorry, you would have to been involved in the midwestern sectionals to understand.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

pragmatic_lee said:


> BH, you're spending way too much time "working" and not enough time keeping up with the events on AT.
> 
> See this thread
> http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=723343


What is the title of that forum....I ain't a Pro so I don't go in there but once in a blue moon:wink:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

huntelk said:


> I'm sorry, you would have to been involved in the midwestern sectionals to understand.


He will get beat....trust me.:wink:

But everything is clear now:wink:


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## Spoon13 (Feb 20, 2007)

WV Has Been said:


> Next year the Outdoor Nationals are in Mechanicsburg PA about the same distance you traveled to the HillBilly. The shoot runs Wed - Sun. The only mandatory day is Friday the animal round. You can shoot your field round on Wednesday or Saturday and your Hunter Round on Thursday or Sunday. The other option is to shoot all five days and you best Field and Hunter counts for your total of 28 Field, 28 Hunter and 28 Animal.
> 
> It will be at least three years before the Outdoor National hits the East Coast again.
> 
> Are you going?


If'n the Lord is willin' I'm gonna make that trip. My grandfather lives in Camp Hill and I can get free room and board. I will have to get a few more rounds under my belt but a National Tournament so close to free, I can't help myself.


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Spoon13 said:


> If'n the Lord is willin' I'm gonna make that trip. My grandfather lives in Camp Hill and I can get free room and board. I will have to get a few more rounds under my belt but a National Tournament so close to free, I can't help myself.


GrandPa got an extra room in the hay loft? :tongue:


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## The Swami (Jan 16, 2008)

It would cost more than I can afford, so it is a money thing. I would also have to say location. Didn't know I could vote more than once.

The location means it costs a lot of money to get there. Better location, less money it takes.


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## huntelk (Jan 11, 2004)

*Who are you betting on?*



Brown Hornet said:


> He will get beat....trust me.:wink:
> 
> But everything is clear now:wink:


I need to know who my new hero is going to be!

I know the man formerly known as Heinze57 would put in on him like he did at sectionals!

I shot with 57 at the sectionals-OMG was he on fire!


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

simple economics


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

huntelk said:


> I need to know who my new hero is going to be!
> 
> I know the man formerly known as Heinze57 would put in on him like he did at sectionals!
> 
> I shot with 57 at the sectionals-OMG was he on fire!


The one and only Phantom15.....or as I like to call him Tim-may 

But his real name is Timmy Ewers....he has been shooting very well lately....just shot a 556 a couple weeks ago....:wink:


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## WV Has Been (Aug 9, 2002)

Brown Hornet said:


> What is the title of that forum....I ain't a Pro so I don't go in there but once in a blue moon:wink:


I sent a request to have that thread pulled from the pro forum. I guess I dont have any pull.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

WV Has Been said:


> I sent a request to have that thread pulled from the pro forum. I guess I dont have any pull.


You just need to send a hornet up the right pants leg:wink:

Next time report the thread and you will more then likely have much better results.


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## huntelk (Jan 11, 2004)

WV Has Been said:


> I sent a request to have that thread pulled from the pro forum. I guess I dont have any pull.


It seemed to be the right place to put an "NFAA" issue-sorry to offend you, I guess "Joe's" like me aren't allowed on there???


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## WV Has Been (Aug 9, 2002)

huntelk said:


> It seemed to be the right place to put an "NFAA" issue-sorry to offend you, I guess "Joe's" like me aren't allowed on there???


Don't take it personal. I took the time to research to see what it had to do with professional archery. No relevance so I asked that it be moved.:wink:


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## huntelk (Jan 11, 2004)

WV Has Been said:


> Don't take it personal. I took the time to research to see what it had to do with professional archery. No relevance so I asked that it be moved.:wink:


I agree, it has nothing to do with "professional Archery", but for that matter neither do 90% of the other posts in that forum. It is more realistically an "NFAA member forum".


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## Jbird (May 21, 2002)

*Yep*

The wife and I and our son will definitely be at Mechanicsburg. We will also be attending the Nationals at Darrington in 2010 if Darrington gets the bid.
Darrington last year was the most expensive Nationals (airlines, lodging, rent cars, etc.) we have attended but some things are just worth it and Darrington is one of them. Watkins Glen is another. Hope they get back in
the mix soon. Will we go back to Yankton? Maybe. I still don't like the way Darrington was treated when Yankton got the bid two years in a row. Will wait to see what our friends have to say when they get back from Yankton this year. Nothing against the good people of Yankton, I just don't like to see people get steam rolled so others can get their way.
Jbird


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

huntelk said:


> I agree, it has nothing to do with "professional Archery", but for that matter neither do 90% of the other posts in that forum. It is more realistically an "NFAA member forum".


And the survey says....EEEHHHHHH

It isn't an "NFAA members forum" it may have turned into that because most of the PROs aren't posting at all in there.....

BUT the description is under the name of the forum....it's pretty clear to me and I agree with WV....."_A place to discuss everything related to professional archers and archery_"

But don't take everything so personal.......:wink: Everyone isn't going to agree with you all the time...and you aren't going to be correct all the time. It's nothing personal....


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## huntelk (Jan 11, 2004)

Brown Hornet said:


> And the survey says....EEEHHHHHH
> 
> It isn't an "NFAA members forum" it may have turned into that because most of the PROs aren't posting at all in there.....
> 
> ...


If you see the first part of my post that you quoted, the "I agree" part, that pretty much says it all. We are on the same page and I am not taking our discussion personal at all. To often it is hard to express the "all is good, no harm/no foul" in written words.

1. We agree-That forum is not being used for what it was intended.
2. We agree-I am in error for following the suit of the majority
3. We probably agree-Our off-topic discussion has hyjacked this thread (i'm sorry)
4. Hopefully we agree-No harm+no foul+all is good


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## VA Vince (Aug 30, 2005)

I voted on all but the money. 5 days is just too long for a shoot. That will burn up most families vacation. I still think they should have multipule locations... not sure how they would "handicap" the different ranges though.
All in all, with a 3 day event most would have to take 2 days off for travel. Money is tight for most and I dont see this economy getting better.


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## rock monkey (Dec 28, 2002)

not gonna say a thing.......already got 3 demerits, dont need any more.


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## tabarch (Sep 20, 2006)

I will be at next years Nationals but this year I have the problem of NO finances available. I don't have a problem with the location or vacation time, I'v got almost three months of time saved up, and for shooting three days or five it doesn't really matter I will be taking enough time off to allow for travel and would probably be there on Tuesday and leave on Monday any way it goes. Sure hope Sarge comes next year I want to try some of his home brew:darkbeer: I'v been reading about.


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## swerve (Jun 5, 2005)

str8arrow said:


> None of your choice's work for me either! I have the money and the time to go. I't not even that far away, but someone needs to watch the little one. That the kind of sacrifice you have to make. See you next year!


And that by itself is cool. The little ones are worth it.:thumb:


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## X Hunter (Jan 11, 2007)

*Too Far!!!*

Bring it to the East and then i'll go!!!!!

Like next year!!!!:wink:


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## sharkred7 (Jul 19, 2005)

I put Vac time. Closest thing to my dilema. Our aniversary is July 25th So far the "Hey Honey why don't we go to South Dakota in the hottest part of the year and celebrate our anniversary!" line hasn't cut it! Any other Ideas:tongue:
John


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## ROB B (Oct 30, 2002)

*iS IT NOT 5/3 DAY?*

Is this Nat not the 5/3 day format? Even so I wanted to go BUT work and money cut me out. Archery is getting to be a rich man's sport, I can save for a bow BUT the gas will drain me


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## WV Has Been (Aug 9, 2002)

VA Vince said:


> I voted on all but the money. 5 days is just too long for a shoot. That will burn up most families vacation. I still think they should have multipule locations... not sure how they would "handicap" the different ranges though.
> All in all, with a 3 day event most would have to take 2 days off for travel. Money is tight for most and I dont see this economy getting better.


Vince I understand your philosophy on the travel but it does not affect the attendance at Redding or Vegas. 

I shot the Vegas shoot on one day of missed work leaving Baltimore Thursday Evening and flying out of Vegas Sunday evening. I was a bit tired on Monday at work but it beat not going at all.

Also the shoot moving from West coast to Central to East coast gives allot of Archers the opportunity to drive to the event. This is especially true when the shoot hits the middle of the East Coast.


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## SuperX (May 21, 2002)

ROB B said:


> Is this Nat not the 5/3 day format? Even so I wanted to go BUT work and money cut me out. Archery is getting to be a rich man's sport, I can save for a bow BUT the gas will drain me


Correct - this is a 5/3 shoot not a 5 day shoot.


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Jbird said:


> The wife and I and our son will definitely be at Mechanicsburg. We will also be attending the Nationals at Darrington in 2010 if Darrington gets the bid.
> Darrington last year was the most expensive Nationals (airlines, lodging, rent cars, etc.) we have attended but some things are just worth it and Darrington is one of them. Watkins Glen is another. Hope they get back in
> the mix soon. Will we go back to Yankton? Maybe. I still don't like the way Darrington was treated when Yankton got the bid two years in a row. Will wait to see what our friends have to say when they get back from Yankton this year. Nothing against the good people of Yankton, I just don't like to see people get steam rolled so others can get their way.
> Jbird


Jay.
Yep. BUT...>I'd betcha if the shoe was on the other foot and Yankton got rebuffed and DARRINGTON got it two years in a row...you'd be dancing to a different drum. Bet you'd be praising Darrington this and Darrington that....

AND...if for some reason Mechanicsburg got it two years in a row...you wouldn't "howl" about that either. You'd be praising Mechanicsburg this and Mechanicsburg that.

OR, if Sugar Hill got back into the mold and Watkins Glen got it two years in a row....you wouldn't spend a second whining about having it in one location two years in a row...

BE THANKFUL, my friend...that from this year forward...if the NFAA either gets zero bids for the Outdoor Nationals, OR...if some "club" or "group" puts in a preposterous and expensive, ridiulous bid with lots of demands....the NFAA Outdoors WILL be held....in Yankton. No more will the NFAA be held hostage to the expensive whims of a group or club seeking to make a fast buck or ramrod something thru. Ram-rodding, with regard to the NFAA Nationals took a turn in favor of the ORGANIZATION.

Get used to it...cuz YANKTON WILL be the host site one year out of every three...and more often if appropriate. iF FAIR and resonablebids are not received from the "outside" sources...back to Yankton we go...but at least we know there will always be an NFAA Outdoor Nationals...as long as the NFAA is in business.

You should have shot down in South Carolina several years ago.....HOT, HUMID, and full of yellow jackets (the stinging insect, that is, ha! Beautiful place, too...but HHYJ almost killed a few people out on the ranges that week!

Where it is, is where it is; people choose to go or choose not to go. Thanks heavens, at least for now, we have the choices and the freedom. Because if we continue to sell off our land, our railroads, our banks, and our major businesses to foreign investors....then America will cease to exist sooner than one may suspect! No wonder the dollar is near worthless....everyone else from OUTSIDE our own country owns more of it that WE do!

Get ready for the Budweiser Kleisdales to be replaced by the Lipenzeimer stallions, or perhaps some polka band now that Anheuser Busch is no longer AMERICAN owned....are you up on your polka steps?:wink::tongue:

field14:tongue::wink:


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## Jbird (May 21, 2002)

*F14*

You are nuts if you think I would condone the non sense that resulted in Yankton getting it instead of Darrington in 2006. Yea, it is a positive thing that Yankton is always there as a fail safe. I just hope it never comes to that. As far as any of the others in the rotation demanding ridiculous money or ridiculous conditions to take the bid, I don't think that is going to happen nor do I think it has happened. The NFAA on the other hand has made some ridiculous demands on the clubs like demanding an extra range be built in two weeks time when the club already is providing the number of ranges in the contract. Or changing the venue (animal round) at the last minute. Any plumber knows that the crap flows down hill and seldom runs up hill.:wink:
Jbird


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Jbird said:


> You are nuts if you think I would condone the non sense that resulted in Yankton getting it instead of Darrington in 2006. Yea, it is a positive thing that Yankton is always there as a fail safe. I just hope it never comes to that. As far as any of the others in the rotation demanding ridiculous money or ridiculous conditions to take the bid, I don't think that is going to happen nor do I think it has happened. The NFAA on the other hand has made some ridiculous demands on the clubs like demanding an extra range be built in two weeks time when the club already is providing the number of ranges in the contract. Or changing the venue (animal round) at the last minute. Any plumber knows that the crap flows down hill and seldom runs up hill.:wink:
> Jbird


It wasn't Darrington or Watkins Glen that made some "impossibly ridiculous" demands for an NFAA Outdoor National bid...but MORE THAN ONE club/organization HAS put in bids that were way out of line as for the club's "take", etc...and I have THAT on RELIABLE information, from an extremely reliable source! IT HAS HAPPENED, and more than once...but it won't happen again...not with Yankton being "in reserve" if something like that develops!

We nearly lost having a couple of NFAA Outdoor Nationals...but fortunately more reasonable heads prevails and it was avoided.

The NFAA will never again be held "hostage" when a club is the only bidder and their bid is way out of line.

The NFAA has also got to look out for their estimated number of shooters.
So, pre-registration is about the ONLY thing the NFAA has to go on in planning..>Thus, if another range is needed based upon "pre-registration" what else is to be done but to ask the host club to put up another range? This may not be the reason for the situation above....but the NFAA would NOT have demanded another range be put in without GOOD REASON. Oftentimes a club will give all their side of the issue...and fail to tell the "rest of the story", leading the shooters into believing that ALL the blame falls on the NFAA. Been there and seen that one more than once. 

Sure the alternative is to put 6 or 8 in a group and have them all shoot at the same target on the 40 yarders and up? You and I both would howl over that scenario...but...I've shot 8 in a group several times over the years...but ONLY if a range is double butted, I've shot with double grouping and THAT isn't a problem. The one that first comes to mind is the Great Lakes Sectionals either two or three times in the 1970's....at a range in Toledo Ohio...5-star course 3-28 target ranges ALL double butted so you could shoot 8 in a group. BUT...shooting definitely was slower due to this, but at least we weren't trashing arrows unnecessarily!

You gotta look at the "reasoning" behind the demands as well....I've been in the position of running many a field and indoor shoot as chairman, and there have been times when "demands" had to be made of the club based upon the best information available PRIOR TO the event....and pre-registration is there for many reasons....and SPACE LIMITATIONS is a big reason for it!

field14


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## TCR1 (Dec 22, 2004)

I had read that this year would be a straight 5 day shoot and discounted going. It was only today that I learned that it was the 5/3 format. I could have planned and gotten there for the weekend. So, me trusting the information I got here too concretely is at fault. 

Is there any chance you can put the HillBilly in somewhere close in time to Nationals (say the weekend before) next year. I would like to do both, but know I can't swing airfare twice (plus the travel time is a big drain for sitting around in airports and on planes).


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

TCR1 said:


> I had read that this year would be a straight 5 day shoot and discounted going. It was only today that I learned that it was the 5/3 format. I could have planned and gotten there for the weekend. So, me trusting the information I got here too concretely is at fault.
> 
> Is there any chance you can put the HillBilly in somewhere close in time to Nationals (say the weekend before) next year. I would like to do both, but know I can't swing airfare twice (plus the travel time is a big drain for sitting around in airports and on planes).


That isn't what I heard or read......I thought all 5 rounds were being counted this year...no throw away rounds for the 5 day guys.:noidea:

Also there is no weekend shooting....and that is what is stated on the flyer on the website that shows the schedule. The first field round was yesterday...the first hunter is today...animal tomorrow and then field and hunter rounds on Thurs and Fri.:noidea:

http://www.fieldarchery.com/depot/d...8 Schedule for 3D and Field Championships.pdf


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## TCR1 (Dec 22, 2004)

Brown Hornet said:


> That isn't what I heard or read......I thought all 5 rounds were being counted this year...no throw away rounds for the 5 day guys.:noidea:
> 
> Also there is no weekend shooting....and that is what is stated on the flyer on the website that shows the schedule. The first field round was yesterday...the first hunter is today...animal tomorrow and then field and hunter rounds on Thurs and Fri.:noidea:
> 
> http://www.fieldarchery.com/depot/d...8 Schedule for 3D and Field Championships.pdf


I still read that as being a 5-day only event. For some reason, I thought the shooting went through the weekend (Animal round Friday and then a field 28 and hunter 28 on Saturday and Sunday). After reading what you posted, that is obviously not the case. Don't mind me, I hit a few too many branches on my way out of the stupid tree:embara:


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## centerx (Jun 13, 2002)

I was all scheduled to go but cancelled last Thursday due to last minute work obligations. So I guess it get's down to money as in I need a job

However a 3/5 over a weekend would have allowed me to go as well

Again the "problem" is lost on the vast majority . This is not a location thing as Redding , Vegas, IBO Worlds and so on can attest to . Heck Vegas and Redding are about as far from most as Yankton but draws over a thousand shooters year after year 

This is plain and simple a "Product" problem J-Bird values the product that Darrignton puts out so he spends the big bucks. I value the product Yankton puts out as I DON'T have to fork out the big bucks . For me it makes no difference were it is . After spending a ton of money on tournaments earlier this spring AND my increased cost of living expenses come summer the only way I am going to this NFFA event is if I can drive to it cheap. OR I skip other NFAA tournaments and go to this one which probably is not the trend we want to see develop. The last way I would consider this tournament if I had to spend a lot of money and time off work would be if I received a lot of bang for my buck. This could be location that would allow me to engage and experience much more then shooting. Or it could be such things as a free seminar by a different pro every night of the tournament 

The current affairs of the outdoor nationals has nothing to do with one individual thing. The overall package needs to be overhauled.


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Brown Hornet said:


> That isn't what I heard or read......I thought all 5 rounds were being counted this year...no throw away rounds for the 5 day guys.:noidea:
> 
> Also there is no weekend shooting....and that is what is stated on the flyer on the website that shows the schedule. The first field round was yesterday...the first hunter is today...animal tomorrow and then field and hunter rounds on Thurs and Fri.:noidea:
> 
> http://www.fieldarchery.com/depot/d...8 Schedule for 3D and Field Championships.pdf


wow, there sure seems to be a lot of confusion about this year.

http://www.fieldarchery.com/depot/d...008 Unmarked 3D and OD Field championship.pdf

2008 NFAA NATIONAL UNMARKED 3-D CHAMPIONSHIP
July 19-20
NFAA 63rd ANNUAL OUTDOOR FIELD CHAMPIONSHIP
July 21-25, Yankton, SD
SPONSORED BY DELTA INDUSTRIES
3-D - 30 DELTA targets each day – Saturday (8am-3pm, casual start) & Sunday (shotgun 9am)
Field Championship – Monday thru Friday (7-8 am scorecards, 9 am shotgun start)
This is a 3 day/5 day tournament. Animal Round score plus best Field and best Hunter round determines
winner. Schedule for Field Championship is Monday: Field, Tuesday: Hunter, Wednesday: Animal,
Thursday: Field, Friday: Hunter. You may shoot 3, 4 or 5 days. Must shoot one Field, one Hunter and Animal
round on Wednesday.


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## swerve (Jun 5, 2005)

That's the way I thought it was also. You can dump 2 scores, if you shoot all 5 days.


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## jarlicker (Jul 29, 2002)

I will be at Mechanicburg next year. I dont care what the shoots format is.
The Outdoor Nationals is a great time.


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## south-paaw (Jul 3, 2006)

sharkred7 said:


> I put Vac time. Closest thing to my dilema. Our aniversary is July 25th So far the "Hey Honey why don't we go to South Dakota in the hottest part of the year and celebrate our anniversary!" line hasn't cut it! Any other Ideas:tongue:
> John




```

```
does she have a bow ?? hehehehe


if so, then ... well.... ummmm....i'll get back to you on that....:tongue:

i plan on making Nats next year.... but for me, its a matter of getting time 

off when i need it...:wink:


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## MEM35202 (Jul 24, 2008)

You need an "all of the above answer". I'll be playing next year in Mechanicsburg.


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

VA Vince said:


> I voted on all but the money. 5 days is just too long for a shoot. That will burn up most families vacation. I still think they should have multipule locations... not sure how they would "handicap" the different ranges though.
> All in all, with a 3 day event most would have to take 2 days off for travel. Money is tight for most and I dont see this economy getting better.


Well your butt is shooting 5 days next year:wink:


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

jarlicker said:


> I will be at Mechanicburg next year. I dont care what the shoots format is.
> The Outdoor Nationals is a great time.


You know what...5-6 days there....Sarge better start brewing now.:wink:


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## USNarcher (Oct 12, 2002)

Money #1 reason Vacation time #2. Hopefully I can swing it next year.


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

Brown Hornet said:


> You know what...5-6 days there....Sarge better start brewing now.:wink:


Sarge? The last word from him that anyone has heard was that he couldn't come to DCWC on Jul 10th - had to clean up the house before the wife got back. 

Or maybe he's house hunting and is looking for a house big enough to brew up a 5+ day supply. :wink:


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

USNarcher said:


> Money #1 reason *Vacation time* #2. Hopefully I can swing it next year.


What y'all talking about (vacation), doesn't your employer give you paid time off to go to archery tournaments?


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## Brown Hornet (Aug 8, 2002)

pragmatic_lee said:


> What y'all talking about (vacation), doesn't your employer give you paid time off to go to archery tournaments?


YES....and if I didn't have a wedding to go to that will have me out of town for 10 days I would have gone this year:wink:


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## target1 (Jan 16, 2007)

Brown Hornet said:


> YES....and if I didn't have a wedding to go to that will have me out of town for 10 days I would have gone this year:wink:


right...:wink:


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## Unclegus (May 27, 2003)

Well, I went. Left WV Friday morning got there Sat morning, rested Sunday, Shot three days, left right after the animals on Wednesday, and got home to get back to work so I wouldn't have to use all of my vacation. If I waited until I shot some really great scores, I'd never get to go. I have friends who say "I'd go, if I thought I had a chance to win." Anytime you go, you win.

Two of us drove 1230 miles straight thru, stayed in the Super eight @50.00/nite, ate pretty good food, and had a really good, but tiring time with the travel involved. Registration and all, We spent maby 650.00ea. 

I'd do it again.

And for those planning on Mechanicsburg, Better motels and places to eat in Carlisle than toward Harrisburg......


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## USNarcher (Oct 12, 2002)

pragmatic_lee said:


> What y'all talking about (vacation), doesn't your employer give you paid time off to go to archery tournaments?


Yep and it all went to Vegas and Redding. The other 5 days will be for elk hunting. :wink:


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## centerx (Jun 13, 2002)

While the reasons seem to be equally distributed it still comes down to the proper planning from the NFAA

Vacation time , money and a 5 day tournament to long can all be addressed with a well executed Fri-Sun shoot . Less time off work, Shorter tournament and less time on site is less money spend in lodging and food 

As I had said before make this a Fri-Sun and run the animal round daily on Friday and Sat right after the days field or hunter round. This opens up the greatest versatility in shooting. Who wants to spend an entire day of vacation , lodging and food on a single day dedicated to shooting 14 shots ????

That fact alone is a deal breaker for many. The solutions are so easy but the leadership so resistant to the changes necessary to develop the game


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## pragmatic_lee (Jan 19, 2008)

centerx said:


> While the reasons seem to be equally distributed it still comes down to the proper planning from the NFAA
> 
> Vacation time , money and a 5 day tournament to long can all be addressed with a well executed Fri-Sun shoot . Less time off work, Shorter tournament and less time on site is less money spend in lodging and food
> 
> ...


Possibly those folks that just shot 112 arrows on each of the 2 previous days and are faced with shooting 112 arrows on each of the next 2 days. A day in the middle with only 28 arrows seems like it might could be a welcomed change in pace.


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

centerx said:


> While the reasons seem to be equally distributed it still comes down to the proper planning from the NFAA
> 
> Vacation time , money and a 5 day tournament to long can all be addressed with a well executed Fri-Sun shoot . Less time off work, Shorter tournament and less time on site is less money spend in lodging and food
> 
> ...


The animal round at the NATIONAL OUTDOOR is a full 28 targets. That is 28 to 72 shots....since if you "miss" on the first shot, you can shoot up to three shots per target....

The thinking on having the animal round last is for competitive purposes, sure, but also...it is a much quicker round to shoot and thus, the competitors are not out on the course the last day shooting for 5 or 6 or more hours...and they can get the round shot quickly. Then, the tournament committee can get the scores compiled, sorted, and posted in a timely fashion and set up the awards quickly.

The Wed-Sunday and 3/5 or the Fri-Sun 3-day format...with only ONE field score, ONE Hunter score, and the animal round "counting" for the final tally makes more sense that the continously tried and failed approach from 1939 of having 5 days, Monday-Friday keep bringing attendance DOWN instead of fostering MORE attendance by following the lead of "the wiser" organizations that have been highly successful for over 20 years with their Friday-Sunday format...and that is for WORLD championships, not just "national" championships too!

What makes the NFAA rounds "better" that they MUST have 5 scores anyways? Answer: Because it has "always" been that way....plain and simple...and the die-hards cannot get it out of their heads that times have changed.

field14


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## USNarcher (Oct 12, 2002)

Wed-Sun is still 5 days. Because you have Tuesday and Monday as travel days.


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## WV Has Been (Aug 9, 2002)

USNarcher said:


> Wed-Sun is still 5 days. Because you have Tuesday and Monday as travel days.


So are you saying the Mon - Fri Outdoor National fromat is the best and should be left alone???


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## Unclegus (May 27, 2003)

Regardless of when or where it is, geographically speaking someone will be disadvantaged, have vacation time problems, lack of funds, or a number of other reasons. Big reasons I'll probably never go to Darrington are dollars and vacation time. I just bite my lip everytime Darrington gets a bid, but it's only fair to the west coast shooters that they get one out there every now and then.

You can't please everyone all the time. If there's a better way than the 3/5 Wednesday thru Sunday that anyone has in their heads, then let's hear about it. Just getting to this point in my mind is almost a quantum leap as much resistance as their has been to change in the NFAA


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## centerx (Jun 13, 2002)

Whoops my bad. Only shooting 2 Nationals and missing this year I forgot it was 28 targets at nationals . Still not vary many arrows however. Of course still worth 3 hours or so of entertainment 

However if I can get my 28 in on Friday or Sat or in fact 14 on one day and 14 the other it still opens up options. Or with a new 3/day weekend format cut back to a 14 target Animal to be shot on any of the days . 

Or have a 5 day and a 3 day over the weekend . Keep the 5 day an equipment based class system to be shot as traditional and make the 3 day involving the weekend as well a NEW skills based class system. Let the game evolve over which ever method continues to draw shooters over the other 

Or start from scratch …………………………..


Step 1 ) The NFAA should developed a rating system for courses. This should take cuts , footing and other factors into consideration . While not perfect the course rating will give others a general idea of the quality and difficulty of the course .

Step 2) Any course that would host a "nationals" needs to have details about individual stations such as . "#14 is the 80 yarder with a 4 yard cut due to the 30 degree angle" This should be available on the clubs website, NFAA website or PDF that can be e- mailed upon shooter request

Step 3) Have multiple locations but run "nationals " over a 6 week period. Any host club can submitte a 'Bid" for nationals but must adhere to the rating systems and literature mentioned. Ideally if 3 or 4 clubs every week for 6 weeks are having a "National" tournament that would not be a bad thing People are well informed about the course they may choose to visit and can not complain if another competitor had an easier course to shoot on as they could have just as easily chose that course or one similar to it based on the data presented and available for all to review. If they feel like they got stuck with a bad weather day they can travel to and submit another score from another host site.

Not perfect but a few ideas to get the ball rolling . Personally something I think a group of dedicated field shooters can do regardless of the NFAA continued disregard for any real promotion of this style of shooting. It ultimately would not take much extra work

The NFAA can continue to have it's 5 day long "centralized" nationals and those that like that location can use it as one of the 3 days scores to submit to a 'NEW" organization that actually tries to grow the sport and works towards making attendance easier. Then a separate "multiple site tournament " Nationals awards can be granted as well. 

Dumb idea?? Maybe but it solves problems and keeps the only other Field organization playing nice with any new start up organization


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