# Am I legally allowed to practice in my backyard in downtown TO?



## On_Target

If you're in an open area, with a safe backstop, I'd say go for it. That being said, I know in London (Ontario), you cannot shoot a bow or firearm within the city unless at a specified range.
Another option is, how long is longest point in your house? If you have a long open hallway with no windows, just don't miss :wink:


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## gclay9999

There's a no discharge law here in orillia but I was told not to worry about it until a cop shows up and says to stop. I'm building a range in my backyard, empty 60' wooded lot on one side and 120' lot on other side with house on farthest end. Backstop is going to be 1/2" plywood, I only have a 40# recurve so I'm not worried about going through. 

I'd say go for it, worst is a ticket, or just a warning.

Oh yeah what part of TO, I'm from Scarborough.

Gerald


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## Iron Mike

Stratford has the same by-law; it's a no go.....but it took me a while to find it in the book.

I have done it because like yourself I asked a Police "friend" first from the SPD shortly after moving into town and he said the same...."I think it'll be fine" (or something like that.) Where we lived prior there was no issue but it had been a while since I'd lived in the 'burbs so I thought I'd ask.

I like to practice safety first so I stick to my basement if I can't get to a more suitable location.


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## Baldini

I would be fairly sure that Toronto has a no-discharge by-law and a map that shows the affected area. I know Ottawa does and they just updated the map a couple years ago. That being said, they have to catch you in the act of discharging. Holding a bow with arrows in the target in front of you is not enough to charge you with according to the conservation officer that taught my hunter safety course.


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## DssBB

It not so much that you could be breaking the law, you also need to consider should something go wrong and you accidentally fire the bow while drawing and the arrow sky rockets out of you property and into a neighboring house or even hits someone passing by, then you will be up the creek so to speak. I shoot in my garage with the doors close and against a wall where there is no possibility of a miss fired arrow ever leaving my garage or penetrating the exterior wall. I also leave the garage door closed to prevent any distractions from neighbors.


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## viktorsmash

Luckily at the end of my backyard there is a 2 story brick wall with no windows, but I know there's the risk of an arrow going sky high if something were to go wrong. definitely something to keep in mind.

As far as taking the "shoot till i get caught" route. The fine for discharging a firearm is $5K, so no thank you. But the knowledge that they need to catch me in the act is good to know.


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## gclay9999

Wow, I wasn't told it's a 5k ticket.


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## Bigjono

I live in a rural town with 30 miles of bush and farm fields behind me so I shoot in my backyard all I want. I've never actually checked to see if there's a bylaw but my neighbors all know I do it and don't mind. That might be an idea for you. Inform your neighbors that you are going to practice there, who knows, they might want to join you.


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## viktorsmash

Bigjono said:


> I live in a rural town with 30 miles of bush and farm fields behind me so I shoot in my backyard all I want. I've never actually checked to see if there's a bylaw but my neighbors all know I do it and don't mind. That might be an idea for you. Inform your neighbors that you are going to practice there, who knows, they might want to join you.


I thought about that but don't want to end up in a situation where I bring it up and they say they aren't cool with it. Then I'd feel like I'm antagonizing them to call the authorities if they see me.


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## Bigjono

If they're not cool with it they will no doubt do that anyway. My neighbors boys used to watch me, then I taught them for a bit, now they have bows and shoot too.


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## viktorsmash

Bigjono said:


> If they're not cool with it they will no doubt do that anyway. My neighbors boys used to watch me, then I taught them for a bit, now they have bows and shoot too.


Very true and a great story.

Think I might have to try it out and see what happens.


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## cc46

Mid 70s in Scarborough, I built a target and shot on my driveway for several month. Had a 10ft by 12ft net to stop stay shots. Shooting 35lb recurve and scoring 530s-540s at 18m on 40 cm face. Never missed the butt. 

And then a neighbour called the cops. 

The boys in blue parked at the end on my driveway and watched for 30 minutes, while on the radio with someone. Then they stepped out and said we want you to stop. We cannot charge you but your neighbours are worried. I was 15 or 16 at the time and agreed to stop. Packed up my bow and put it away. 

Never shot there again.


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## Ravenhunter

Just shoot. If someone complains then stop. But shoot safely (solid backstop etc etc) But it is illegal to discharge a firearm in city limits.


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## Drake691

If they fine you or using a "firearm" you can fight it. If it flies under 500 fps its not considered a firearm


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## Ravenhunter

Bigjono said:


> I live in a rural town with 30 miles of bush and farm fields behind me so I shoot in my backyard all I want. I've never actually checked to see if there's a bylaw but my neighbors all know I do it and don't mind. That might be an idea for you. Inform your neighbors that you are going to practice there, who knows, they might want to join you.


Ive had neighbour's see me standing ontop of my travel trailer shooting into my back yard. They asked if I was allowed to do that, I said yes. Lol


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## Ravenhunter

Drake691 said:


> If they fine you or using a "firearm" you can fight it. If it flies under 500 fps its not considered a firearm


A bow is considered a firearm, so yes it is illegal to shoot in populated areas. But again the police are likely to ask you to stop and not charge you the first time.


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## Ravenhunter

There are so many laws if you want a clear answer call a lawyer. The police do not know all laws and can be wrong. Not theyre fault just far too many to memorize them all.


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## roughneck1

Ravenhunter said:


> There are so many laws if you want a clear answer call a lawyer. The police do not know all laws and can be wrong. Not theyre fault just far too many to memorize them all.


Won't be a lawyer issuing the citation. It's what the cops 'think' that matters.


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## JDoupe

I live on the same block as the police department in my city.

I shoot in my driveway into my garage. I have the police stop at least half the time I am shooting to tell me I shouldn't be shooting.

I politely tell them that our local by-law allows me to shoot on my property. Some of them are happy with that and that I know our local laws......others continue to tell me that I can't and explain to me that I am responsible if anything goes wrong.

I don't shoot in my yard as much as I used to just to avoid the hassle.......but this summer is going to be different. I plan on shooting more as I need to practice.

I am safe about it, and I know that I am legally allowed to.


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## Bow bandit

Just remember you are in a city full of hunting and gun hating Liberals, the call is going to be made to the police that someone is in your back yard with a weapon. The police will arrive on seen as such and depending on the officer you could be fine or find yourself in handcuffs trying to explain your situation. My advise is make sure you know your neighbors well and let them know what you are doing is safe and that you don't have any unwanted spectators.


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## Stash

It's rare that I agree with Bow Bandit on anything D) but this time you should listen to what he has to say.

I lived in Toronto a bit over 10 year ago and used to shoot in my driveway into my garage. Driveway was narrow, between the houses, so I drew a curtain across it so people on the street couldn't see. Neighbours didn't mind. One day I had an arrow nock break, the arrow went sideways though the neighbour's wooden fence into his yard. Nobody saw it, but I stopped shooting immediately. Just not worth it.

Just a note re the bow being a firearm - it is NOT considered a firearm under the Criminal Code. If you do something stupid with it you can be charged with a weapons offense, but not a firearm offense. A bow IS considered a "firearm" under the Hunting Regulations though, so you need to consider it as such when hunting - encased when traveling, hunting after dark, shooting across a road, all that stuff.


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## CLASSICHUNTER

catch 22 here buddy of mine used to shoot in his drive way on baseline rd in Ottawa 4 lanes cops there all the time ...he was never charged as not a true fire arm and he was proficient at it ... not kids shooting squirrels or street lights... do it out of sight and don`t piss the neighbours off...


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## Crimson_Arrow

If you have checked with the local by-laws that apply to the area that you live in and there is not a specific clause that includes the discharge of a bow or crossbow or considers them as being the same as a "firearm" ( which by definition under the Criminal Code is a barreled weapon capable of....etc... a bow is not a firearm under the CCC, and is only a firearm under the FWCA while in the act of hunting ) then the only consideration is to the immediate area and circumstances. IF you are able to establish a safe area ( backstop ) and are not infringing on anyone elses property then you are fine. As always, no matter where you shoot, you are responsible for every projectile that you launch and any collateral damage that occurs as a result. Also, as stated , optically if a passer-by or neighbour see's you shooting and does not know what you are doing, they may make a complaint of some kind. Be prepared to explain to the Offier(s) who investigate the complaint and demonstrate you are safe and competent ( price you pay for living in a densly populated area without alot of privacy - like it or not).


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## rmarchand

a bow is only a firearm under the provincial fish and game act, under the federal criminal code of Canada, archery equipment is not considered a firearm hense the reason for not requiring a FAC or PAL, whatever they call that now. If the discharge of a firearm is forbidden in town I believe it would have to specifically include archery equipment. Just my two cents. by the way, I shoot in my back yard constantly, safely and with an open conscience


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## mprus

Is it really worth the risk, just join the closest range!


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## Mr. RoC

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/bylaws/2004/law0087.pdf

You decided what's best for you and your situation:

*Authority: Board of Health Report No. 1, Clause No. 1, adopted as amended, by the City of
Toronto Council on January 27, 28 and 29, 2004
Enacted by Council: January 29, 2004

CITY OF TORONTO
BY-LAW No. 87-2004
To adopt a new Municipal Code Chapter 463, Firearms, to permit an agent of the City to
discharge a firearm in order to carry out contracted services.

WHEREAS under section 119 of the Municipal Act, 2001, the City may, for the purpose of
public safety, prohibit or regulate the discharge of guns or other firearms, air-guns, spring-guns,
cross-bows, long-bows or any other weapon; and
WHEREAS the former municipalities’ by-laws prohibiting or regulating the discharge of
firearms and other weapons have not yet been harmonized;
The Council of the City of Toronto HEREBY ENACTS as follows:
1. The City of Toronto Municipal Code is amended by adding the following chapter:

Chapter 463
FIREARMS

§ 463-1. Definitions.
As used in this chapter, the following terms shall have the meanings indicated:
FORMER MUNICIPALITIES’ FIREARMS BY-LAWS – The following by-laws:

A. Former Borough of East York By-law No. 17-94, “To prohibit the discharge of
guns or firearms”, as amended.
B. Former City of Etobicoke Municipal Code Chapter, 130, Firearms.
C. Former City of North York By-law No. 366, “A By-law to regulate the discharge
of guns and other firearms.”, as amended.
D. Former City of Scarborough By-law Number 22959, “being a by-law to prohibit
the discharge of firearms in the City of Scarborough”.
E. Former City of Toronto Municipal Code Chapter 186, Firearms.
F. Former City of York By-law No. 1043-71, “To Prohibit the discharge of guns in
the Borough of York”, as amended and as codified in Chapter 865,
Firearm - Discharge in the former City of York Municipal Code.2

City of Toronto By-law No. 87-2004

§ 463-2. Discharge by City agent.

Despite the former municipalities’ firearms by-laws, an agent of the City, who holds the required
licences under the Firearms Act (Canada) and the Fish and Wildlife Conservation Act, 1997, and
otherwise complies with those Acts, may discharge a gun or other firearm in the course of
carrying out his or her contracted services for the City, with the prior written consent of the City
official responsible for the contract or the official’s designate.

ENACTED AND PASSED this 29th day of January, A.D. 2004.

DAVID R. MILLER, ULLI S. WATKISS 
Mayor C*

If you decide to practice in your backyard please do so with common sense for safety for your fellow neighbours. The last we want is bad publicity from the media, It's bad enough that handguns, rifles and shotguns are frowned upon and socially unacceptable by the general public.

Or head over to the free public archery range behind the Ontario Science Centre and practice worry free. https://www.facebook.com/torontoarchery


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## JDoupe

mprus said:


> Is it really worth the risk, just join the closest range!


What's the risk? Upsetting the police? If you are safe....with a good backstop, and you are legally allowed......why wouldn't you?

Trust me.....I'm not a "screw the police" kind of guy.....far from it. But I'm also not going to let them hassle me into not doing something.

If you don't want to upset the people around you, that's one thing.....each to his own......but if I want to partake in a legal activity in my property, that does not affect people around me......then I will be doing it.

When the police talk to me, I am always polite and respectful. It just pisses me off when someone, police or otherwise, try and act as bigger and better than me and try to "persuade" you into doing what they want.

(You may hear a touch of sarcasm in my tone.......it's because I have had to deal with a select few idiots in my area. No disrespect to the rest if the good, upstanding police officers that are around out province).


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## crazymoose

In the City of Oshawa the by-laws specifically state that you are NOT permitted to shoot a bow at your place of residence. 
The by-laws specifically state that you can not discharge a rifle,shotgun,handgun,spring gun or compressed air or gas, pellet rifle,longbow or cross bow within the city limits.
By-Law 126-97 section 1.01(e) for further definitions.


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## Stash

http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2227190

Just another one of all too may such incidents from people thinking they were being safe and "it can't happen to me".


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## mprus

JDoupe said:


> What's the risk? Upsetting the police? If you are safe....with a good backstop, and you are legally allowed......why wouldn't you?
> 
> Trust me.....I'm not a "screw the police" kind of guy.....far from it. But I'm also not going to let them hassle me into not doing something.
> 
> If you don't want to upset the people around you, that's one thing.....each to his own......but if I want to partake in a legal activity in my property, that does not affect people around me......then I will be doing it.
> 
> When the police talk to me, I am always polite and respectful. It just pisses me off when someone, police or otherwise, try and act as bigger and better than me and try to "persuade" you into doing what they want.
> 
> (You may hear a touch of sarcasm in my tone.......it's because I have had to deal with a select few idiots in my area. No disrespect to the rest if the good, upstanding police officers that are around out province).


The thing is though I'm 99.9% sure it's not legal in Toronto!


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## hoody123

If you're not indoors in Toronto, you don't have a big enough back yard to be genuinely safe. Way too many ways for something to fail and cause complete miss of any and all backstops set up, then you're in for a world of hurt.


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## zu!

I thought a firearm is legislated to b capable of shooting a projectile at more than a certain number of FPS. A bow is NOT a firearm, which is why it does not fall under the CC of Canada. City bylaws a are another thing altogether and some cities have enacted no discharge of bows bylaws. These are fines. 

As you have checked with your city bylaws and they have said that there are no bylaws that say you CAN'T that means you CAN. 

Just be safe and have a large backstop. The joker who deflected off a tree wasn't being safe. I shoot in my backyard every single day that it's not raining.. Granted I'm not in Toronto, but like I said, firearms are under federal jurisdiction and a bow is not a firearm or you would need a PAL to own one. 

I shoot TOWARDS the house, so if I'm an idiot the arrow is going into my house. The idiots are the guys who shoot againts a fence that backs into a neighbours house or a road. That's not safe. 

I know someone else who shoots INTO his garage. He opens the garage door, stands at the end of his driveway and shoots into the garage. Perfectly safe.


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## Stash

zu! said:


> I know someone else who shoots INTO his garage. He opens the garage door, stands at the end of his driveway and shoots into the garage. Perfectly safe.


See my post #22 - that's what I was doing, shooting from my driveway into my garage. Perfectly safe...until something weird happened.

Just because something is legal doesn't mean you should do it. There is no "perfectly safe" in a residential area. A bowstring could break, a d-loop let go, a limb crack, and arrows have been known to bounce off things and come right back and hit someone behind the shooter.

Legal or not, I sincerely wish people would not shoot outdoors in a residential area. Period.


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## criss-p-bacon

had to do some big digging to find this info in my area..b.c....nobody seems to want to say a deffinate yes. took me a loooong time actualy find the official documents online myself. the city, the cops and c.o were no help, they just kept telling me to call the next dept. dont put your phone number in a contact section in our area then if your not the ones that have the say or the ones to ask....lol.
unless the city has a specific clause in the bylaw stating a bow is concidered a firearm, then it isnt. and then it needs its own bylaw and bylaw number to accompany that. thats the info i wanted..needed that specific bylaw number to protect what i wanted to do since the ones making the bylaw didnt even know about it. my area said to have certain acerage, certain distances to each property line., certain requirements for target and a back stop. i do have one close area that does have written in rules that bows are concidered a firearm. i also have to buy a special area licence and extra ins to discharge anything in my area....remember owning and discharging for having a pal is 2 diff things for a bow, a pal isnt needed but the city can still deny any discharges, and having a pal also doesnt make it ok if they say no discharge

get on google and dig for that bylaw..copy iut and keep on you to show them if they come to shut you down. ive had to a couple times for m hunting in the area. most think im not allowed..but with a bow i am if i follow the hunting rues...distances to roads and so on. i have a large enough green belt right in a residential area that is loaded with game.


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## CLASSICHUNTER

funny its illegal till a community assc or school wants me to give a archery demonstration and lessons to the kids...in the city...lol lol ...so axe throwing and knife throwing are legal lol lol in my back yard...


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## zu!

criss-p-bacon said:


> had to do some big digging to find this info in my area..b.c....nobody seems to want to say a deffinate yes. took me a loooong time actualy find the official documents online myself. the city, the cops and c.o were no help, they just kept telling me to call the next dept. dont put your phone number in a contact section in our area then if your not the ones that have the say or the ones to ask....lol.
> unless the city has a specific clause in the bylaw stating a bow is concidered a firearm, then it isnt. and then it needs its own bylaw and bylaw number to accompany that. thats the info i wanted..needed that specific bylaw number to protect what i wanted to do since the ones making the bylaw didnt even know about it. my area said to have certain acerage, certain distances to each property line., certain requirements for target and a back stop. i do have one close area that does have written in rules that bows are concidered a firearm. i also have to buy a special area licence and extra ins to discharge anything in my area....remember owning and discharging for having a pal is 2 diff things for a bow, a pal isnt needed but the city can still deny any discharges, and having a pal also doesnt make it ok if they say no discharge
> 
> get on google and dig for that bylaw..copy iut and keep on you to show them if they come to shut you down. ive had to a couple times for m hunting in the area. most think im not allowed..but with a bow i am if i follow the hunting rues...distances to roads and so on. i have a large enough green belt right in a residential area that is loaded with game.


You lucky devil you! I was all set to take my little girl grouse hunting up Burke Mountain...then I heard that City of Coquitlam completely BANNED hunting with a bow of any type!! In fact, I think they completely banned discharge of a bow anywhere within city limits. The only caveat being poco club, which has an archery range. 

Damn...u lucky devil you


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## justinb1981

Toronto does not specifically include bows in their no discharge bylaw, so as long as your backyard range is safe go for it. A copy of the no discharge bylaw can be found on the city's website, if you look under definitions it will show you what they consider a firearm for the purposes of the bylaw.


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## criss-p-bacon

zu! said:


> You lucky devil you! I was all set to take my little girl grouse hunting up Burke Mountain...then I heard that City of Coquitlam completely BANNED hunting with a bow of any type!! In fact, I think they completely banned discharge of a bow anywhere within city limits. The only caveat being poco club, which has an archery range.
> 
> Damn...u lucky devil you



ya there isnt much anyone is allowed to do once you head into the city area from mission, if your looking to take the kid out for a bow hunt try sumas mnt in abby..bow only area. need your fraser valley permits though is all out here


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## zu!

Bow only area eh...Didn't know that! Thanks bud! In the past few years I've bought the special Fraser Valley licence just as a matter of supporting conservation, never thinking of using it because it's mostly quite inaccessible. I'll have to look at Sumas mountain more closely then.


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## 4 Fletch

There are three reasons cops and bureaucrats won't tell you yes or no. 
1. They don't know. 
2. They're terrified of saying the wrong thing and having it come back on them. 
3. All property bylaws are moot unless the municipality owns or controls said property, and the cops and bureaucrats and judges and prosecutors all know that yes, it's true. 

Both the Ontario Municipal Act and Planning Act only allow corporations to regulate property owned or managed by the corporation. 

So if you have not signed over management of your property to the municipality, you can do whatever the hell you want on your property. 

Yeah, it's a p-off to discover those a**clowns have been bullshytting us all this time. 

If you want to know more, contact and join Ontario Landowners Association.


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## Bow bandit

Go ahead! Do something that could make you front page news! Just remember this is the same police dept that shot an unarmed teenager on a street car. Plus as soon as something does go wrong if you don't get shot by an over zealous cop they will make it included in the bylaw or worse lobby the government to classify them as firearms. My opinion, be safe go to a range or stay out of sight in your house.


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## criss-p-bacon

4 Fletch said:


> There are three reasons cops and bureaucrats won't tell you yes or no.
> 1. They don't know.
> 2. They're terrified of saying the wrong thing and having it come back on them.
> 3. All property bylaws are moot unless the municipality owns or controls said property, and the cops and bureaucrats and judges and prosecutors all know that yes, it's true.
> 
> Both the Ontario Municipal Act and Planning Act only allow corporations to regulate property owned or managed by the corporation.
> 
> So if you have not signed over management of your property to the municipality, you can do whatever the hell you want on your property.
> 
> Yeah, it's a p-off to discover those a**clowns have been bullshytting us all this time.
> 
> If you want to know more, contact and join Ontario Landowners Association.



lets see how far you`d get in the city fire a gun off on your own property.


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## criss-p-bacon

and we realy dont own anything when they can expropriate our land any time they want


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## Fisher_dude

I used to shoot in my highschool field with a big hill as my backdrop. I had lots of people stop, including cops, and ask questions but no one ever gave me ****. They were more interested in the sport than anything. I live in Kelowna and shoot in my backyard on a regular basis. I shoot off my deck and its impossible for me to sky an arrow as I have a full covered deck and it would go into my roof. I also have some pretty sweet neighbours too.


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## zu!

Geez guys, sometimes we're our own worst enemies. I can't, for instance, for the life of me, imagine a situation where a cop would come into your backyard, guns blazing, because you're shooting your burlap bag target. One can't live life afraid of all the little things that can go wrong with it...heck we'd be terrified of leaving our homes if that were the case! 

Be reasonable, be safe, and exercise good judgement. We're all adults here, what's the big deal? Geez, you'd think the guy was asking if he was "allowed" to rob a bank or something! Is Canada such a place where we're afraid of our own shadows? 

Take it easy. OP, exercise good judgement. It's your house. You should know what's best.


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## 4 Fletch

criss-p-bacon said:


> lets see how far you`d get in the city fire a gun off on your own property.


Anyone prepared for judicial battle will take it much farther in court than the authorities are willing. The late Bob Mackie found that out in his legal battle with the NEC. Nine times they refused to show up in court, because they knew they were wrong. He and his lawyer backed them so far into a corner that MNR took over the case --numerous lawyers and our unlimited funds and future borrowing ability paid for it. Last count the tab was over $500,000 of our tax dollars blown on that nonsense. 



criss-p-bacon said:


> and we realy dont own anything when they can expropriate our land any time they want


There's a difference between owning and controlling that is well worth learning.


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## CrossbowRookie

lol dont do it man.


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## criss-p-bacon

4 Fletch said:


> Anyone prepared for judicial battle will take it much farther in court than the authorities are willing. The late Bob Mackie found that out in his legal battle with the NEC. Nine times they refused to show up in court, because they knew they were wrong. He and his lawyer backed them so far into a corner that MNR took over the case --numerous lawyers and our unlimited funds and future borrowing ability paid for it. Last count the tab was over $500,000 of our tax dollars blown on that nonsense.
> 
> 
> 
> There's a difference between owning and controlling that is well worth learning.


go ahead, fire off some rounds in the city and let us know how it goes


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## cc46

crispy - 4 fletch 

those are 2 different scenarios. 

Bob Mackie's fight was with the Niagara Escarpment Land use because his neighbours claim arrows strayed to their adjacent property. The OP's question for this thread was about shooting in a backyard in a city...not the same.

If you defy a law and there's a complaint the authorities will take action. Most municipal by-laws are complaint based.
If there's a complaint regardless of which laws have jurisdiction or not in your town there will be cops investigating.

Don't be a crusader unless you want attention. 
Be safe. 

Many on this thread have shared their opinions and experiences. Don't shoot in the city. 

If you are my neighbour and a stray arrow lands in my yard I'll call the cops on you!


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## criss-p-bacon

no idea who bob was anyways...lol


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## 4 Fletch

cc46 said:


> crispy - 4 fletch
> 
> those are 2 different scenarios.
> 
> Bob Mackie's fight was with the Niagara Escarpment Land use because his neighbours claim arrows strayed to their adjacent property. The OP's question for this thread was about shooting in a backyard in a city...not the same.
> 
> If you defy a law and there's a complaint the authorities will take action. Most municipal by-laws are complaint based.
> If there's a complaint regardless of which laws have jurisdiction or not in your town there will be cops investigating.
> 
> Don't be a crusader unless you want attention.
> Be safe.
> 
> Many on this thread have shared their opinions and experiences. Don't shoot in the city.
> 
> If you are my neighbour and a stray arrow lands in my yard I'll call the cops on you!


All kinds of krap lands in my yard and I'd never think of ratting to the cops. I have the decency to first go speak with those I suspect to be responsible. 

Bob's evil assclown neighbor resorted to the false "arrows in my yard" accusation after his first appearance at a town meeting, during which his stupidity and selfishness were unveiled to all in attendance. It was nonsense, as was the reason the NEC disallowed the range -- archery is not specifically permitted in the Act. 

So what? All kinds of things not specifically permitted in the Act continue on the escarpment, unmolested by government. As does the prohibited clear-cutting of the Escarpment and cutting of undocumented roads by a wealthy friend of the NEC board chairman. One of those roads caused the flooding of many homes below the escarpment. Nothing has happened to the person who ordered it cut, while hundreds of thousands of dollars in insurance claims were paid to the homeowners, and billed to all who pay insurance. 

When they swung their weight around, the appointed not elected old-boy network NEC members didn't realize Bob was going to back them so far into a legal corner they had to reach over the ropes and tag the MNR, with its unlimited tax and borrowing power, to come to the rescue. 

Fact remains that in Ontario neither the Municipal Act nor the Planning Act permit municipalities to control property unless that municipality owns or has been granted control over that property. Check it out. OLA has the info. 

Sadly, Ontarians have all been cowed into believing bureaucrats and politicians have power over our property. They don't. 

They do however, have control over us via the violence their enforcement gang can project.


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## Wardlow warrior

I shoot every night in my back yard in beautiful down town wardlow ab


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## adimo

Very interesting discussion. I've been shooting my bow in the basement since January when I bought it. It's only 8m long but I shot a lot of arrows in the wall and my groups just started to tighten so I think this was good practice. I was planning to try the range at the Science Centre later on. Fear of the neighbours keeps me in the basement - most of us "armed" people seem to be way more peaceful and accommodating than the "pacifist" crowd. I also shoot a CO2 pistol in my basement and pray nobody will complain about it. I choose not to say anything to the neighbours thinking that the doing it in the basement is enough compromise on my part and I don't need their approval.


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## fredf

Bow bandit said:


> *Just remember you are in a city full of hunting and gun hating Liberals,* the call is going to be made to the police that someone is in your back yard with a weapon. The police will arrive on seen as such and depending on the officer you could be fine or find yourself in handcuffs trying to explain your situation. My advise is make sure you know your neighbors well and let them know what you are doing is safe and that you don't have any unwanted spectators.


Yeah and I am one of them. But that doesn't mean I am opposed the careful use of archery or gun ranges.
No need to slander 'liberals', who from your comment, are likely what most of us would simply call 'sensible'.


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## zu!

I had a deckful of spectators the other day. My neighbour was sitting a bunch of kids and when I was out shooting she actually asked me if I minded a few spectators. Of course I didn't mind! 

Soon after, she started asking me about classes and all. It turns out her son was so interested that he's now taken up archery. I'm betting the other kids would be going home to tell their parents that they'd like to try it too. 

Hopefully we get a few new hunters from them.


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## cheaplaughs

There's a ycb member that lives in t.o. He shot in his back yard and it ended badly. He spent two days in jail they raided his home. Took over $50,000 cash from his safe. He paid $18,000 to his lawyer so far.he got his money and bow back but his pocket knife is still being dealt with in the courts. The police call it a switch blade so he needs a lawyer to prove it's not. He figured another $5000.00 or so for that. So if you want to try it go ahead. The police told him he should leave the city if he wants to act like that.


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## hoody123

I sometimes question the judgement abilities of the kids I teach daily - teenagers have a very difficult time judging potential outcomes of their decisions, consequences are rarely (if ever) factored in to their actions. In many ways, the people in this thread remind me of teenagers with their inability to grasp the potential consequences of something bad happening. If you've never seen something go seriously wrong while shooting a bow (all of those scenarios pointed out by Stash are a good starting point here), then take it from people who HAVE seen those things happen, when things break on a bow (and there is always a possibility they will), you have bordering on no ability to know where projectiles are going to be sent. 

Shooting into your garage, or against the wall of your house offers you substantial protection, but consider just how dire the consequences would be if something unanticipated WERE to happen - the downside is simply too great to risk shooting in an urban area.


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## ontario3-d'r

The question posted originally in this thread seems to have sparked up a lot of interest. The original question was "Am I allowed" not "Should I" which seems to be where this thread has gone. I absolutely agree with most of the posts here saying that it really is not worth the risk. Personally, if I lived in Toronto and I could be at the science center in 20 minutes or less, that is what I would do. Plus, a very high percentage of Police Officers are not hunters. The police officers that are giving people a hard time over this actually believe that what they are saying is the law. Police officers that do not hunt would not know that the bow is not a firearm when target practicing. They would assume it is a firearm, and talking to the shooter as if it was. They are just doing what they think is the law. Cut them a little slack. If you are respectful to the police that comes to your house, they may be happy to learn that the bow is not a firearm. They may not know that in the first place.

The answer is actually pretty simple. Every municipality has there own set of bylaws. If it says in the bylaws - "no discharging of FIERARMS within city limits" then you are allowed to shoot your bow. The bow is only considered a firearm when being used for the purpose of hunting -period. If the town bylaws specifically says no firearms, including bows and crossbows, then you are not allowed. Check your local municipality bylaws. Every municipality has different rules. 

The topic of "Should I" is a great one. However, that is not what the original posted wanted to know.


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## criss-p-bacon

the bow is not a firearm when hunting..its still below speeds required to be called a firearms. went through that here with my bylaws for same subject. cant speak for toronto but my area their has to be a whole separate bylaw and number to match to make any law or ruling to discharge of a bow for any reason..hunting or practice. or the bylaw has to say in it that it also includes archery as chilliwack bc says in their laws. its the only place around me that includes bows as a firearm and states it

id like to see where it says a bow becomes a firearm once we hunt with it. now i need a firearm licence to hunt with a bow?..thats a new one to me


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## ontario3-d'r

Sorry criss-p-bacon. The bow is absolutely a firearm when used for hunting. It is legislated that way in the provincial fish and game act. It is also in the Ontario Hunting Regulations printed each year by the MNR. You are correct that you do not need a PAL to buy one. However, the reason it is legislated as a firearm when hunting is precisely to stop bowhunting within city limits. Cities do not allow discharging firearms within its limits, hence a bow is a firearm when hunting.


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## Stash

This is from the Ontario Hunting Regulations summary (page 23):


> Firearms include rifles, shotguns, air or pellet guns, bows and crossbows.


I'm sure every province has the same definition.


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## Mr. Bill

Stash said:


> This is from the Ontario Hunting Regulations summary (page 23):
> *I'm sure every province has the same definition*.



No they don't.


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## criss-p-bacon

ya it isnt that way out here. i live within my city limits and as long as i follow the hunting regs for distances to roads and building and so on i can fire my bw as hunting all day long. we have a whoe separate bow bylaw. thats why i told the guy dont take second hand news and find out the actual bylaw number that says he cant do what he was planning to do. any areas i cant shoot it off is also closed to any hunting period, npo mater the weapon of choice


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## criss-p-bacon

if they call it a firearm then id think you have to have a licence. law does state to operate or discharge a firearm you need a licence....or it woud say expect bows. thats how its been explained to me by our city and calling the conservation guy for my area. i didnt bother with asking rcmp as most have no clue on any of this around here.


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## AF4iK

Interesting topic. I'm a new shooter and plan to setup a target in my backyard. It just so happens the longest available space is also the safest place to put my target aside from indoors. The target will be placed behind the garage. It will have a brick wall behind and on one side. On the other side is a shed. I also plan to visit ET Seton as often as I can.


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## criss-p-bacon

cheaplaughs said:


> There's a ycb member that lives in t.o. He shot in his back yard and it ended badly. He spent two days in jail they raided his home. Took over $50,000 cash from his safe. He paid $18,000 to his lawyer so far.he got his money and bow back but his pocket knife is still being dealt with in the courts. The police call it a switch blade so he needs a lawyer to prove it's not. He figured another $5000.00 or so for that. So if you want to try it go ahead. The police told him he should leave the city if he wants to act like that.


curious why they would take cash from a safe for this offence. and how did they get the combo if its a safe?. have a warrant?


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## unleaded

my local bylaw calls bows firearms and i can't discharge in town - i just drive 5 minutes out of town and bring a target to shoot into. unless i shoot in my basement. lol


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## rdneckhillbilly

cheaplaughs said:


> There's a ycb member that lives in t.o. He shot in his back yard and it ended badly. He spent two days in jail they raided his home. Took over $50,000 cash from his safe. He paid $18,000 to his lawyer so far.he got his money and bow back but his pocket knife is still being dealt with in the courts. The police call it a switch blade so he needs a lawyer to prove it's not. He figured another $5000.00 or so for that. So if you want to try it go ahead. The police told him he should leave the city if he wants to act like that.


I believe it's safe to say....there has got to be more to that story.


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