# A question for the pros (or better shooters) regarding DL changes with changing ATA



## CherryJu1ce (Feb 25, 2005)

Needless to say, when we shoot bows with different ATA lengths, the string angle at full draw also changes. My question is this...do you set your draw length the same regardless of the string angle and how close the peep is to your face?

What's more important? Should we be more concerned with anchoring the release hand in the same spot and keeping the same exact load and position of our draw arm/shoulder, or do we place more emphasis on eye-to-peep distance? 

I shoot a bow that is 40" ATA for indoors and target archery in general, and the string angle feels perfect. However, my 3D and hunting bows, with their shorter ATA lengths, really put the peep further from my eye at full draw, which ends up forcing me to kind of "lean" my head into the string to make it feel the same. The only way I can combat this is by setting my shorter ATA bows a half inch longer on the draw length. However, this ends up putting my draw shoulder into a different position, which makes it more difficult to produce a strong, consistent shot. 

So...the question has been posed. Thanks in advance.


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## I BOW 2 (May 22, 2002)

Nick, Dan McCarthy (sp) I think it is has an excellent article in the 1st or 2nd edition of "The Tournamnet Archer' magazine about that very subject. You probably should be getting those editions by now!!! :>) Ken


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## Unk Bond (Aug 1, 2004)

CherryJu1ce said:


> Needless to say, when we shoot bows with different ATA lengths, the string angle at full draw also changes. My question is this...do you set your draw length the same regardless of the string angle and how close the peep is to your face?
> 
> What's more important? Should we be more concerned with anchoring the release hand in the same spot and keeping the same exact load and position of our draw arm/shoulder, or do we place more emphasis on eye-to-peep distance?
> 
> ...



========================

Hello 
Don't know where i fit your classification of a bow shooter. Maybe a has been will do fine. 

Take your 40" ATA target bow that feels so good.And locate your TRU draw measurement.

Then mark this measurement on a arrow, for a reference arrow. Then any bow you buy. Buy that bow to fit your TRU draw measurement. If you have a used bow.
Set that bow up with your TRU draw reference arrow. And that might even take in changing your cams.
Also you can use this arrow to check your competition bow from time to time. To see if your settings remain the same.

TRU draw measurement is found by measuring from your bow string to the deepest part of your bow grip. After establishing this measurement,transfer that measurement on a piece of tape on your bow window. Now draw a arrow, And have some one mark that arrow where it lines up with your window tape line.That is your TRU draw length. 

Comment & point = if you were going to have Dave Barnsdale build you a bow. The first thing Dave would ask you. What is your TRU draw length. Then he would build the bow with the correct riser length, limbs and cams, to fit your TRU draw length. So now with this measuring arrow you can now tell a bow builder what your TRU draw length is. Your TRU once found never changes..[ later


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## CHPro (May 21, 2002)

Just personal opinion, but I prefer maintaining the same draw length in all cases with the same, identical hand/anchor position along my jawline. I'm a little different though D), because I've never really used the "nose to string" as one of my draw references. So even on my 40"-41" target bows I don't touch my nose to the string. Hence doesn't bother me to not touch on my 35" hunting bow either. Personally I think your form and being able to comfortably execute the same shot time after time is the most important factor. For me to do that I need to maintain the same draw length and anchor points on my face. I adjust peep aperture size to circle up the scope or pin guard housing. The peep alignment, solid, consistent anchor point and feeling the shot in my back consistently are sufficient for accuracy, imo. If a person can do those three things via while varying their draw length and anchor point then by all means do so.

>>------>


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## AT_X_HUNTER (Aug 10, 2005)

I always try to set the DL so I get the same anchor on all my bows. I want my draw hand position to be in the same place and my shoulders to be in the same position. This does not mean my bows are at the same DL. My hunting bow is a little shorter because the release I use has a longer neck on it. My hinge is shorter so I need the DL of my target bow to be a touch longer. I try to get myself in my comfort zone when I anchor so depending on the release I am using I have to change the DL of the bow to fit me.


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## C Doyle 88 (Sep 1, 2007)

AT_X_HUNTER said:


> I always try to set the DL so I get the same anchor on all my bows. I want my draw hand position to be in the same place and my shoulders to be in the same position. This does not mean my bows are at the same DL. My hunting bow is a little shorter because the release I use has a longer neck on it. My hinge is shorter so I need the DL of my target bow to be a touch longer. I try to get myself in my comfort zone when I anchor so depending on the release I am using I have to change the DL of the bow to fit me.


YES---it will seem wrong from bow--to bow---but when you find it--that's what that bow want's---don't get stuck on a measurement--let you're groups/hold guide you 
Sometime 1/4" will make all the differance in the score


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## rossing6 (Jun 7, 2008)

Thought I'd throw this in there too. You are absolutely right that a shorter ata will put the peep further away, but what is really the issue is it puts the string away from your nose, assuming you put the string lightly on the end of your nose. There are two ways to fix this, one is to use a longer draw length, and in my case, I shorten the d-loop and the wrist strap (hunting bow only) to keep my anchor in the same spot, I went to a trigger forward release to keep my trigger in the same spot also. This is very commonly done, and works perfectly. The reason it works is if you have good form it keeps you in the exact form you shoot well with. The only other way to get your nose on the string is to raise where you anchor, and that changes your form....play around and don't get hung up on the numbers. My target bow is 40 5/8" and I shoot a Mathews DXT at 29 3/4" for hunting, 3/4" longer draw length on the DXT is my fit. But remember that good form is what you want and proper draw length is critical to the hold. Unless you experiment a lot, you won't know what the best draw length is for you and I would suggest getting a reputable coach to help you figure out a good starting place. Most people I coach are anywhere from 2-3" too long on draw length and have terrible form issues that can't be corrected until we get the right draw length. Send me a few pics of your form side and behind and I'll help you out if I can from that. Cheers and good shooting....aim hard and relax.


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## ruttinbuck (Mar 4, 2004)

I BOW 2 said:


> Nick, Dan McCarthy (sp) I think it is has an excellent article in the 1st or 2nd edition of "The Tournamnet Archer' magazine about that very subject. You probably should be getting those editions by now!!! :>) Ken


I thought that artical was a great read. This is his personal rule...For every inch shorter (axle to axle) that I am changing between bows, I'll need to shorten my loop 1/16 of an inch and lengthen my bow's draw length 1/16 of an inch. For every inch longer (axle to axle) that the new bow measures, you'll simply need to increase your loop length 1/16 of an inch and decrease the draw length of your 1/16 of an inch. This rule will keep your overall draw lenght the same, while also factoring the new string angle so the unfamiliar bow will fit your face comforably while you are anchored at full draw.


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## Unk Bond (Aug 1, 2004)

ruttinbuck said:


> I thought that artical was a great read. This is his personal rule...For every inch shorter (axle to axle) that I am changing between bows, I'll need to shorten my loop 1/16 of an inch and lengthen my bow's draw length 1/16 of an inch. For every inch longer (axle to axle) that the new bow measures, you'll simply need to increase your loop length 1/16 of an inch and decrease the draw length of your 1/16 of an inch. This rule will keep your overall draw lenght the same, while also factoring the new string angle so the unfamiliar bow will fit your face comforably while you are anchored at full draw.


==================

Hello
In your read . Also state the length of the D loop, starting out. Before his ajustments.. [ Later


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## wyoming4x4 (Mar 16, 2009)

I make adjustments to D loop also. shoot a 41" connie and my huntin bow is 36". D loop is a simple fix once you figure out what works for you. Same release on both bows and poundage, 60lb bows. great read and good question.


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## ProtecMan (Apr 14, 2003)

Good posts guys! You kind of answered my thread that I just started...
I was not/am not sure if people with a longer draw length >30" should be shooting 36" ATA bows due to the difference in anchor points and comfortablility. I've been shooting Limited Class with a Vantage Pro and will be switching to a release for 3D next year and am wondering if there is a benefit to shooting the shorter ATA bows.


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## DCON (Oct 5, 2007)

IMHO don't get caught up in " you have to have this dl or ata bow because you are this size bs", shoot what you shoot best and forget the rest. Relax and let it happen, your only competition should be yourself, find your groove and stay in it, set a goal for yourself and try to beat it!


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