# Spigarelli Zen Initial Impressions



## chase128 (May 29, 2015)

Hello all, 

I recently picked up one of the new Spigarelli Zen risers and would like to share my initial impressions. I am hoping to update this as I get it set up, but for now just some pics and details that I couldn’t find online before purchasing.









What comes in the box:
- Anodized riser
- A blue riser specific bag
- An extended clicker plate
- *A Spigarelli Spigarest 2, NOT A ZT REST like other Spigarelli risers.
- A generic and a riser specific manual
- Stickers / buttons
- Various Allen Keys
- A 2-stage clicker

*This actually surprised me as I was expecting it to come with a ZT rest like the 650 club.

Note that the Zen does not include any riser mounted weights! You have to buy them separately, but they are the same cylindrical weights that work with the other Spigarelli risers like the BB, 650, etc. All three holes in the Zen can mount one of the standard 210g Spigarelli weights.
I did purchase some of the weights, they do mount in the holes like you would expect. 
Unfortunately the surface around the holes for the bolts to hold in the riser mounted weights isn't seated or entirely flat, so I think the bolt edges will bite a little into the surface of the riser over time. One looks like this mounted:









Interesting bits:
- It has a max turn tiller bolt restriction screw. I haven't see this before, but it has a screw limiting the tiller bolts to only be loosened to this max amount. No need to remember how many turns out you have left?
- Very light, I haven't had a riser this light since my old hoyt horizon. I think this may be a good start light (1100g) -> add weights until BB heavy for those wanting to start with a nicer riser and grow with it.
- I has really nice machining and finish, including machined reference marks for limb adjustment in the pocket and on the back side of the pocket. 

Tiller bolt restriction screw:








Finish on limb pocket:








My initial impressions are positive, so far it seems good for it's price point at $350. (<- Price from UK seller) I will update once I have done the setup process and shot it a little. I know it is intended for a dual use olympic / barebow, but I will be setting it for barebow to start. If you have any questions let me know.


----------



## TheElBow (May 18, 2015)

Very nice ... the report and its subject of course!
What about the balance without additional weights? 
Is the center of gravity exactly at the pivot point? 
Or should you install at least one extra weight for shooting with sight and stabilizers? 
I ask because a clubmate is looking for a light riser for Olympic Recurve.


----------



## Crunch (Nov 28, 2002)

I'm surprised about the Spigrest2. Like you I assumed ZT. Looking forward to your shooting review.
Thanks


----------



## chase128 (May 29, 2015)

TheElBow said:


> Very nice ... the report and its subject of course!
> What about the balance without additional weights?
> Is the center of gravity exactly at the pivot point?
> Or should you install at least one extra weight for shooting with sight and stabilizers?
> I ask because a clubmate is looking for a light riser for Olympic Recurve.


Hi, I got it set up but haven't gotten a chance to shoot it yet. The balance though is pretty top heavy. With stabilizers it would probably be fine, but to get it to sit on the pivot point I had to add a 210g weight to one of the lower weight slots. I imagine for OR you would need a little more weight on the front rod to counteract the top heavy.


----------



## mikeyboy (Nov 16, 2018)

I'm anxious to hear your review. I'm new to barebow and deciding between this and the Gillo G1. 30" draw so I don't think I need the 27" Gillo riser.


----------



## JimDE (Aug 3, 2008)

The price difference is significant between buying overseas and in the USA and that is definitely something to consider. It’s about $150 usd difference.... no reason for that big a difference.


----------



## EvilGarfield (May 30, 2018)

The max tiller screw is a nice touch. However, seeing that it has no counter screw, I hope they added some locktite or that screw will come loose very fast. 

Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk


----------



## chase128 (May 29, 2015)

Ok, so I set it up and have have been shooting it for a couple weeks, here are some observations.

- The overall finish and QC is very good. It actually looks better out of the box then my Epik or MKX10. Nearly all of my high-end risers came with small-moderate machining / anodizing imperfections or scratches (to the point where some were sent back) and the Zen just looks clean. This was true for both my Zen and another that I set up for a student.

- The grip is pretty good, it is very similar to the new Hoyt Composite grip (on the X, Alero, etc) but wood instead of plastic. This is a stock grip I can shoot without immediately wanting to modify it. (Will be doing a side by side test comparing it to the Jager Spigarelli CMS grip next week)

- The overall balance is pretty top heavy. If trying to shoot without stabilizers or weights this would bug me, but with stabs / added weight it balanced fine. Just don’t expect it to sit vertical with just the three in-riser Spigarelli weights. With just the three inline weights, at rest it tilts back towards my head at about a 30 degree angle.

- Depending on your arrow, the shortest-stem (17.5-23) beiter plunger with a wrap around rest may be a little short (as it has to go through both the riser and ZT). I ended up using the slightly longer beiter plastic tip to get a good center-shot. The shibuya plunger (which I tried first) worked fine, I swapped to the beiter to make trying different arrows easier.

- I added some small plastic washers to keep the bolts holding in the internal weights from scratching up the back of the riser. Without this, I think eventually the top internal bolt could end up scratching the anodization a little.

- Overall (and I realize this is subjective) the Zen for the same limbs, string, arrows, weight, etc felt “softer” each shot to me than the Epik. Two other long time "riser collectors" I shoot with also noted the soft feel specifically. 

- Speaking of limbs, I also noticed the Zen uses a bit thicker of a tiller bolt post, so took some elbow grease (moderate elbow grease!) to get my limbs in and seated the first time. This was true for both the SF Axiom+ and Uukha VX1000 limbs I tested with. 

Here is how I set it up initially to get it:
1) To weigh as much as my other barebow rig, a Hoyt Epik with a 650g ArcTec doorknob (5.8lbs overall)
2) To sit perfectly vertical when in my hand / after the shot.

It has two 210g (7.4oz) weights inside the lower riser slots, then a 210g weight in the lower front bushing, and a 12oz weight in the front central bushing. (Yes this clears the 12cm ring) 

Initial set up:








As of 1 week ago, new string for better nock fit and swapped in a beiter instead of the shib plunger:









Here is my general impression so far, but please keep in mind for BB I am comparing this to my Epik, which is literally twice as expensive ($350 vs $700). So this impression is based on how good is it for a riser that is around half as much as the top offering from Hoyt, or W&W, and Gillo:
- I think this would be a good dual duty riser for OR/barebow, or a good lightweight competitive level barebow-specific riser. (My top pick for value for mid-range OR specific riser is still the SF/WNS Forged) I fell the Zen is light enough that someone could start very light and build up to more weights / rods, but with enough adjustment options / bushings to customize it for a high level.
- It sucks that it doesn’t come with a ZT, but as this is positioned for OR as well, the Spiga 2 and dual stage clicker makes some sense.
- I also like that it has aftermarket grip options available, for those of us using the same aftermarket grip style on all the bows they shoot for consistency.
- Adjustment is easy, and the finish and QC were very good. If only getting one riser for life, I would still probably end up with a high level $600-700 riser, but it is a good competitive level riser with barebow specific options for a very reasonable price. (If purchased at $350)

Where would I rank it compared to Gillo 25” riser lines? In my opinion, I would put it above the G2, on par with the G1. I haven’t shot a GQ yet, but at $610-$680 I imagine the GQ is pretty nice. Probably the largest difference between the Gillo and Zen options would be the stock grip and stock weight. The stock grips are * very* different (personally don't like the stock plastic printed Gillo grip, but the Jager Gillo CMS grip is great), and the stock G1 is about a half pound heavier than the stock Zen. 
I think Zen vs G1 would come down to how heavy the person wanted the bow to be, if shooting OR/BB/both, and their budget. And speaking of budget, for those that do prefer riser internally mounted weights, I bought 3 of the Spigarelli standard internal weights for $12 each, where the cheapest weighted cover Gillo makes is about $74 (and at least $82 for 590g or more)

Let me know if you have any questions! I plan on shooting this bow the rest of indoor season, and will update again once I have a couple thousand arrows through it.


----------



## Crunch (Nov 28, 2002)

Great review Chase128. Thanks.


----------



## mikeyboy (Nov 16, 2018)

Thanks chase128!


----------



## spiz (Sep 15, 2018)

That is good weight for a riser. I am using Uukha. I am quite happy but I would also like to buy a light aluminum riser.


----------



## Karnov (Feb 9, 2018)

Are the bushings raw aluminum or do they have stainless bushings/inserts?


----------



## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Actually, a limb bolt limiting screw is a very old design. I believe some of the older Hoyt risers had a similar feature although it was a bushing that interfered with the limb bolt rather than a screw.


----------



## chase128 (May 29, 2015)

Karnov said:


> Are the bushings raw aluminum or do they have stainless bushings/inserts?


The stabilizer / weight mounts are tapped into the aluminum as far as I can tell, seems to be the same as on the DMS. (Tested both the center and lower mounts with 23oz weights, seems to work / thread fine)


----------



## lskywalker918 (Apr 3, 2018)

thank you for the review! i've been eyeing this for a while now. my current barebow rig is a hoyt nexus. i hang out with a lot of OR people, so i might stray toward that path in the future hahaha.


----------



## Karnov (Feb 9, 2018)

chase128 said:


> The stabilizer / weight mounts are tapped into the aluminum as far as I can tell, seems to be the same as on the DMS. (Tested both the center and lower mounts with 23oz weights, seems to work / thread fine)


Thanks! They probably shaved a few grams (and euros) from not including those.

It’s funny you mention the SF Forged; the resemblance in the top half is uncanny.

I hope to see your follow up and any idiosyncrasies you find from it—From what I’ve heard it’s supposed to be pretty forgiving and calm.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## chase128 (May 29, 2015)

JimDE said:


> The price difference is significant between buying overseas and in the USA and that is definitely something to consider. It’s about $150 usd difference.... no reason for that big a difference.


Interestingly, recently the US price came down $100. So now it is only a bit more than the UK price plus shipping?


----------



## Karnov (Feb 9, 2018)

chase128 said:


> Interestingly, recently the US price came down $100. So now it is only a bit more than the UK price plus shipping?


Yes I noticed that too which is why my interest has perked up a bit. Plus with US sellers, any problems are much easier to solve.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Fly2High (Feb 25, 2019)

Has anyone else shot this riser? I know it is a personal thing but this reviewer uses more than 100+ gr more than say a Gillo G1? Does this bow need to exceed 2000 + gr to shoot well where other bows can get away with around 1900? I know it is a rather new bow but I am hoping there are more who use this bow happily.

Frank


----------



## Ashred (Apr 30, 2018)

Beautiful riser, waiting for a full review.


----------



## Fly2High (Feb 25, 2019)

I was curious which limb you ended up putting on the Zen? What draw weight do you have for the Zen?

Did you change the weights you have on the bow to better balance it?

I too am interested in the Zen, G1 and GQ as well. I am looking to see which will balance well and be at the lightest weight. I saw in the classifieds that a GQ has several bushings for stabilizer mounting where as the G! and Zen do not. In fact the Zen seems to have the least number of stab holes but the majority of OR archers only use the front stab mount beneath the handle and nothing else so this limitation is minimal.

I look forward to hearing more comparisons of these models and much more on how the Zen shoots. Since none of my local archery shops have these bows, I have to rely on posts to help me to decide which to purchase. 

Thanks in advance on the feedback.


----------



## chase128 (May 29, 2015)

Fly2High said:


> I was curious which limb you ended up putting on the Zen? What draw weight do you have for the Zen?
> 
> Did you change the weights you have on the bow to better balance it?
> 
> ...


To your first question, I have been shooting them with long 34lb limbs (SF Axiom+) for indoor, though I will be setting them up with one of my favorites (36lb Uukha EX1 Evo2) next week when I reconfigure for outdoor arrows. I haven't weighted my OTF (on the fingers) poundage, but with my 30" barebow draw I figure it would most likely be around 39.5lbs for the axioms and 41lbs for the EX1s. 

I have changed the weights but the balance is the same as my original configuration. I upgraded to a Yost Mojo and one of the new Avalon barebow weights to test them both out. I have the Yost Mojo 16oz weight in the center front bushing and the avalon 13oz weight in the front lower bushing. This still gets it to sit dead vertical in the hand after the shot. (<- as I said in the initial review, the Zen is top heavy without any weights.)

I have shot some friend's G1 and G2s in addition to the Zen, and my Epik is set up for barebow as well. For mounts, I think there are more then you mentioned. (Just the GQ has nice separate piece bushings instead of some of the holes being directly tapped into the riser):
G1 and GQ: (2.97lbs and 2.88lbs) 
- 3 front bushings (high, middle, and low)
- 2 back bushings (mid and low)
- In frame options: 6 x in riser cylindrical slots for 1.07oz weights, and holes to mount the Gillo weight covers. 
Zen: (2.42lbs)
- 3 front bushings
- 1 back bushing (mid)
- In frame options: 3 x slots for 7.4oz weights

Honestly though if you want it to push the balance forward / get it to sit vertical, you will get the most effect from whatever weight you can mount high and forward (so front center bushing for many). So if going lighter on the overall weight, you wouldn't be likely to use the back bushings a ton anyway. I removed the in-riser weights and changed to a bigger front bushing weight to maximize the balance change per ounce added. Meaning even if you get a GQ, you may get more forward torque per ounce with a heavy weight in the middle front bushing (like a long Yost Mojo) then from the Gillo heavy covers. (Though the Gillo covers have the advantage of being more difficult to come loose)

For minimal weight total, I think in the end it the grand total would end up similar for all three risers. You start with less with the Zen, but may need to add more to get forward balance. How much? That depends on you and your preferences. You could also base your selection somewhat on the ability to get customer support/service, budget (including weights!!), and shot feel.

That being said you can get good balance and performance out of non barebow specific riser as well (just watch some of the lancaster classic barebow finals matches :wink
For instance, for me these balance the same:
25" Zen: 2.42lbs bare+ 16oz Yost Mojo + 13oz avalon = 4.23lbs
25" Epik: 2.9lbs bare + 650g ArcTec = 4.33lbs


----------



## Mizar (Feb 11, 2019)

hello, do you have any updated experience/feedback with your Uukha limbs setup on Zen? Since I am interested to use this setup as well, would like to know the feeling.


----------



## emerald123 (Aug 19, 2021)

For the last month I've been shooting my new 25" Zen riser paired with Uukha SX50 medium 30lbs limbs (68" overall)
Setup for barebow and string walking
Brace height set to Uukha specs = 218mm
Spigarelli Micro Click Button
Spigarelli ZT micro tuning rest
Flex Carrera 99R string
Yost tab
29" 680 spine Easton ACC arrows with 80g points and 3" gateway feathers
My draw length is 28"

To achieve a vertical position in the hand I have used 1 x spigarelli 210g weight in the bottom riser hole and 400g in the centre front bushing.
I purchased 3 of the spigarelli 210g weights, but found that using them all did not make the bow vertical in my hand, it needs that forward weight to make it vertical.
I also placed washers under the screws of the weights to stop damage to the riser. There are no steel inserts so you have to take care with all threads.

The grip felt unsanded initially, but has polished with use and I'm happy with the medium position. I did find a couple of lengths of electrical tape were needed under the grip as it moved very slightly.

I'd be interested to hear about other peoples experience with tiller.
To achieve neutral tiller of around 176mm for both top and bottom limbs I had to use
Top = 2 turns out
Bottom = 4 turns out
It seems odd to me that the number of turns wouldn't be nearly identical?
To achieve 4mm negative tiller (for string walking) I needed
Top bolt = 1.5 turns out, gives 174mm
Bottom bolt = 4 turns out, gives 178mm
I can confirm that there is some form of lock-tight on the bolts used to prevent the tillers being unwound too far, although one of mine did need tightening out of the box.
There is a total range of 6.5 turns of the tiller bolts before you hit the stop bolts.

I have the silver and the quality of the anodising is not perfect, but only visible up close and it is a beautiful riser none the less.

After about 2 weeks a buzz occurred while shooting and after stripping down the rest and other obvious culprits it turned out to be a nasty iron washer underneath the brass limb aligner. I'd recommend any Zen owner to check for it. I cleaned up the rust and replaced with a fibre washer which seems to work but welcome any thoughts on this. I include some pictures. 

This is my first bow so unfortunately I don't have comparisons to give, but other seasoned barebow archers (Gillo G2 and Spigarelli 650 owners) have used it and commented on its stability and lightness. I am really happy with the purchase and have already used it to break several club records.


----------



## chang (Sep 16, 2008)

I happened to bump into the OEM of this riser couple years ago. They are now making another structurally similar riser but with different cut-out..






best-oem-manufacturer-of-aluminium-handle-riser-aluminum-bow-rise-for-archery-bows-die-casting-and-cnc-machining


best-oem-manufacturer-of-aluminium-handle-riser-aluminum-bow-rise-for-archery-bows-die-casting-and-cnc-machining



chinese.alibaba.com


----------

