# VICTORY VAP Shaft selection charts



## Jim C (Oct 15, 2002)

I bought a bunch of these for my JOAD students when LAS discounted the older logo shafts. If you go to Victory's selection charts, they don't even list the 1100 and 1200 size shafts but their suggestions are for much stiffer spines than other brands. My students bare shaft tests indicate VAPs charts are wrong as well

example

I have a student-who is shooting a 27" shaft out of top of the line recurve holding 27 pounds on her fingers

Easton's shaft selection suggests a shaft (depending on the arrow) in the 880-920 range

Victory's suggestion for the VAP is 700-800/ 

she is using a 900 victory with 90G points with the bare shaft in the middle of the group 

another archer is shooting 26" VAP 900 at 28.5 pounds on her fingers Easton suggests 900-1000 (the weight range is 27-32)

VAP suggestion 800. again bare shaft is perfect at 20 yards.

anyone else experienced this with Victory shafts?


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## remyrw (Jun 7, 2017)

Victory's chart has the same flaw as the standard Easton chart. Not accurate at lower poundages. The low poundage easton chart is much better and I'm finding that Software For Archers does decently as well with the VAP's. I used that and the math worked out nicely to put bareshafts in with fletched.


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## Celeriter (Mar 20, 2016)

I am using VAP 1000s (27.5 in DL) for my ~33 - 34-pound bow. I talked to Victory at Vegas about this issue and they were aware of it. They said they are considering redoing their spine chart in the future. I am planning to follow up with them with an email to see if they can give a heads up if/when they do it.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

I use the limbwalker cx chart for all brands to get into the ballpark.


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## teebat (Oct 28, 2013)

Jim C said:


> I bought a bunch of these for my JOAD students when LAS discounted the older logo shafts. If you go to Victory's selection charts, they don't even list the 1100 and 1200 size shafts but their suggestions are for much stiffer spines than other brands. My students bare shaft tests indicate VAPs charts are wrong as well
> 
> example
> 
> ...


Caps are about one-third of a spine stiff.

Sent from my VS835 using Tapatalk


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## Chunq (Mar 2, 2018)

My amateur experience: I bought my first dozen of quality arrows recently, VAP Target Elite V1. I shoot 34 lb, so I got 600 spine arrows. I cut 2" off to get to my clicker. 

Bare shaft tuning arrows keep pointing and landing to the left at 20 yards. I'm struggling tuning partly because I'm not all that sure of what I'm doing, and also because I lost the lightest spring for my Shibuya DX and the spring screw is sticking out really far in my efforts. I'm going to try fiddling with my tiller to increase bow weight next, going off the Easton tuning guide.

Is that in-line with what's supposedly happening with the VAPs?


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

You aren't going to tune those shafts with less than 40-42# on the fingers.


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## Jim C (Oct 15, 2002)

Celeriter said:


> I am using VAP 1000s (27.5 in DL) for my ~33 - 34-pound bow. I talked to Victory at Vegas about this issue and they were aware of it. They said they are considering redoing their spine chart in the future. I am planning to follow up with them with an email to see if they can give a heads up if/when they do it.


Three emails to them went unanswered. I will write it off as them being busy. There is no doubt in my mind-given all the bows I have set up that a 26" VAP with 24 pounds on the fingers is going to result in a BS way left Stiff) for 800 spine like their chart shows. That is the draw and arrow length bb indoor cadet champion Charlotte Adams shot last year and 1200 spine VAPs were tuning well. 800 would have put the bare shaft in the bale to her left


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## 74f100 (Sep 17, 2017)

Chunq said:


> My amateur experience: I bought my first dozen of quality arrows recently, VAP Target Elite V1. I shoot 34 lb, so I got 600 spine arrows. I cut 2" off to get to my clicker.
> 
> Bare shaft tuning arrows keep pointing and landing to the left at 20 yards. I'm struggling tuning partly because I'm not all that sure of what I'm doing, and also because I lost the lightest spring for my Shibuya DX and the spring screw is sticking out really far in my efforts. I'm going to try fiddling with my tiller to increase bow weight next, going off the Easton tuning guide.
> 
> Is that in-line with what's supposedly happening with the VAPs?


How far left at 20?


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## Chunq (Mar 2, 2018)

Oh well. I'll keep trying, but I suppose I could sell the shafts, maybe the pins and nocks too. Try my luck with A/C/C or something.



> How far left at 20?


About 3-6 inches or so. I never felt like it was all that bad, just as if it were one or two adjustments away.


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## 74f100 (Sep 17, 2017)

PM sent, don't want to hijack the thread


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## ryan b. (Sep 1, 2005)

DONT EVER CUT YOUR ARROWS TO “LENGTH” BEFORE TUNING. 
I agree with grantmac; they’re never going to tune now. Much too stiff now. 
I’m shooting .600 with 140pt with 30lbs otf @32”. I can shoot 700 with a 100gn point.


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## ryan b. (Sep 1, 2005)

A good friend is shooting 800 full length and is 34lbs @ 30.5”draw with 110 points.


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## grantmac (May 31, 2007)

Chunq said:


> Oh well. I'll keep trying, but I suppose I could sell the shafts, maybe the pins and nocks too. Try my luck with A/C/C or something.
> 
> 
> 
> About 3-6 inches or so. I never felt like it was all that bad, just as if it were one or two adjustments away.



Buy some 800s (V6 is fine) and unplug the arrow saw.


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## Chunq (Mar 2, 2018)

I have 110g points in em right now. I'll try the 120-140g points and see what happens as 74f100 helpfully suggested.


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## 65690 (Jan 21, 2007)

bobnikon said:


> I use the limbwalker cx chart for all brands to get into the ballpark.


Where can I find the limbwalker CXT chart please.
Thank you.


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## Chunq (Mar 2, 2018)

wannashoot said:


> Where can I find the limbwalker CXT chart please.
> Thank you.


http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2037374&page=2&p=1069179613#post1069179613

Looks like that one.


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## 65690 (Jan 21, 2007)

Chunq said:


> http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2037374&page=2&p=1069179613#post1069179613
> 
> Looks like that one.



Awesome!!!!!


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## arrowchucker222 (Jun 17, 2013)

I’ve found that the long shafts on the top hat points effectively shorten the arrow. When you stop 2 1/2” of arrow from flexing you just stiffened the spine a lot.


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## yegon (Aug 15, 2017)

hmm that cx chart seems to be way off for me - even with my cx arows - 420 shaft with 100gn points tuned for me where 660-600 is recommended by the chart, Id like to buy me some Victory 3DHV arrows and now Im a bit scared I wont choose the spine right


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## starground (Mar 5, 2018)

"I’ve found that the long shafts on the top hat points effectively shorten the arrow. When you stop 2 1/2” of arrow from flexing you just stiffened the spine a lot."

My experience, too. Going from 120 to 100 gn (break off's) didn't stiffen bare shafts at all on 20 yards...


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## Chunq (Mar 2, 2018)

Sometime in the last week Victory updated their chart page.

http://www.victoryarchery.com/arrow-guide/

The recommended spines are different on at least the VAP chart. There's also a magnification tool thing that annoys me since I'd rather just view the full image.

Still seems too stiff? I don't know.


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## alish (Jan 31, 2018)

Chunq said:


> Sometime in the last week Victory updated their chart page.
> 
> http://www.victoryarchery.com/arrow-guide/
> 
> ...


If I'm reading the spine chart correctly, they're saying these are the correct spines if you use a 140 grain point. So still stiff if you're wanting to use 100-110 grains up front. And I think the comments about the long shaft on the TopHat points (or Victory 140 grain points) causing a stiffer spine needs to be factored in as well. I ran into this with some points I got with some Carbon Pro arrows - the points extended a long way into the shafts and weighed 85 grains. They showed as being stiffer than when I switched to some Easton 70 grain points with a short section of steel extending into the arrow shaft (where the lighter points should have caused the shafts to be a tiny bit stiffer, in actuality it caused the shaft to behave like it was an inch longer, and thus less stiff).

I'm trying to decide on the right spine for some VAPs myself, and I think I'm going to trust the numbers that everyone is posting from personal experience rather than the Victory chart.


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## alish (Jan 31, 2018)

Chunq said:


> Sometime in the last week Victory updated their chart page.
> 
> http://www.victoryarchery.com/arrow-guide/
> 
> ...


Interesting too that at the bottom of the Victory spine chart it says to contact an authorized Victory dealer for help getting the right fit. Well, I did, and he recommended 600s for the VAPs (which is what the chart says), but based on all the info posted here and elsewhere online it looks like I need 700s, or possibly 800s. I think the dealer I talked to knows VAPs from the compound world and higher draw weights, and doesn't have experience with recurve and/or lighter DWs. So...something to consider when talking to a Victory dealer.


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## JimDE (Aug 3, 2008)

alish Victory charts like Easton and others tend to hedge to the stiff side........ 700 with 130g points will respond much like 800's with 90-100g points........ I tried 600's and they were too stiff even with 140gr points... a lot depends on other variables but to be sure just order a few of each from LAS and test them for yourself


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## alish (Jan 31, 2018)

JimDE said:


> alish Victory charts like Easton and others tend to hedge to the stiff side........ 700 with 130g points will respond much like 800's with 90-100g points........ I tried 600's and they were too stiff even with 140gr points... a lot depends on other variables but to be sure just order a few of each from LAS and test them for yourself


Thanks so much JimDE!!

Also, I just read on a different thread about VAP spine selection that Barebow recurve will typically need a full spine (or even two) stiffer than for an Oly rig. Thus further confusing much of the info on these spine selection threads. So I started a new thread specific to Barebow recurve (I know this thread was primarily about Oly and not wanting to derail it, but just wanting to help folks like me who were reading this thread looking for info, and then found out that the numbers I was reading here didn't really apply to me as a Barebow shooter). Anyway, if you're a Barebow recurve archer reading this thread, you might check out:
http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=5428301&p=1107720945#post1107720945

Hopefully this new thread can become a helpful resource for Barebow archers looking for info on VAP spine selection...

And thanks to everyone in the Archery Talk community who has shared so much great info across this whole site!!

Aaron


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