# Backyard Bow & Arrow Shooting Ban



## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

I am not writing this to get you excited, but to make you aware of why it is important that the archery community...and that includes our compound friends(wink )stay united.

This morning I was making my way down the hall to my office past our company's kitchen (as I always do)when I noticed the a picture on the cover of the Minneapolis Star Tribune of an archer. Upon closer inspection it was the owner of an arcery shop I frequent. The title under his picture says "Should Shooting Arrows in Backyards be legal?" NOW THAT GOT MY ATTENTION! I read on........

The story was about a man named Lewis Anderson of Roseville, MN who hit the roof when he saw two teenage boys shooting compounds next door. His issue was that his wife and son had been just outside playing nearby.

The article goes on to talk about the growing number of Minneapolis suburbs banning bow and arrow shooting in back yards. The reason they site in the article is the growing number of suburb residents in smaller spaces (i.e. More people and houses in closer proximity).

I was shocked to learn how many cities in Minneapolis and across the U.S. have already ban backyard bow and arrow shooting..... and our dear Mr. Lewis seems to be on a campaign (hence the article in the paper) to see that his city of Roseville get a "full" ban.

This has got to stop! Where does this all end? We talk alot on this forum about what is or is not traditonal, we talk about our distinction from compound shooters, we talk about lots of things that divide us and build larger and thicker walls. Well....its time we "ban" together! Its time we use the power of the internet and put your pent up energy for blasting someone on a post to good use.

Write your city council, post this article on other forums and fight for your rights....unless you agree with the ban! If you think this will not happen to you in your area and to your kids.....think again. Its only a matter of time before enough people in our sport sit silent. Silence is our worse then any Animal Rights Group.


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## NOX (Mar 1, 2007)

I am lucky, I do not have such a ban, but, I have no home behind me , but three other sides do, and if there was one behind me, I would not shoot in that direction......, one messed up release and errant arrow into a three year old kid and we are in big trouble....., better safe than sorry.....

Common sense always comes first


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

dc - 

In NYS it's illegal to discharge a weapon with 500' of a dwelling and a bow is considered a weapon, imagine that.

If you're fairly out of sight and have taken reasonable precautions, most police officers will look the other way, However, if one neighbor (or anyone else) makes a complaint, the police have no choice, but to take action.

In all honestly, I agree with that rule. I'm sure you are a great shot and your kids are respoinisble young citizens and would NEVER do something even slightly reckless or possibly have an accident but there are people who aren't so careful . 

Getting people out of their back yards and on to real archery ranges, not only provides a safer environment, but exposes new shooters to more experienced archers which in turn produces better archers. I keep hearing folks say that there aren't aren't any ranges where they life. I thought so too, until I checked. 

Viper1 out.


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## NDTerminator (Nov 6, 2006)

I read the Star-Trib on line every morning and saw this. What surprised me about it was there are towns/cities over in MN that *still* allow bows to be shot outdoors within city limits...

In point of fact, it's almost universally illegal to shoot a bow outside of an archery range/park within a corporate city limits in ND/MN. Here in ND we have 11 "major" cities (I'm a PD supervisor in the smallest of the 11, with a population of 7,500), and it's illegal in all of them.

To me, this is a common sense public safety issue and I fully support this law. I believe waivers should be allowed on a case by case basis if a landowner has enough acreage to provide a specified safety buffer between any adjoining property or public accessable areas...


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## John Millard (Aug 2, 2007)

In Orange County CA. last year both outdoor archery ranges were sold or reassigned for development. A very successful JOAD/FITA club had developed many good shooters, worked with the Boy Scouts and had awakened many to the sport of archery. Left without a range the club has all but died. There have made multiple attempts to acquire, lease or rent property without success. It seems everyone is afraid of dangers and liability issues. Presently one has to travel an hour to shoot legally. It's sad and frustrating in a state that has year round shooting weather. Hope everyone out there in cyberland can retain their shooting areas.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

I will have to respectfully disagree. 

If you have a postage stamp size of a lot then shooting in the back yard may not make sense, but my point is that there are solutions without an knee jerk reaction. We seem to slap a "ban" on everything as a solution. 

Is practicing baseball or golf safe in a back yard? How about hockey? Yet many of my neighbors blast these things around. Should we ban this too and just keep it to designated sport parks? How about dirt bikes......my neighbors kids ride those in the back yard and what if they hit one of my kids?

The article did go on to talk about bans of archery even in some parks. If that is what you want then stay silent and accept this ban......I will not. I am open to solutions, but not simply banning something.

Have you rread about some cities banning Christmas lights because it offends other ethnicities? How about spanking your child? Thats ban in some cities. Its getting out of hand and for me this issue about the bow and arrow hits close to home. Pretty soon the only thing you will be able to do is sit in your house and look out the window or garden.

I purchased an acre of land to be able to enjoy my property and that includes shooting my bow.


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## Wyvern Creations (Sep 20, 2006)

As a retailer, the main issue is the expense of opening an indoor range vrs the potential income. At an average of $10.00/sqft to rent a building and the issue of finding a building that allows at least 20yrds of unobstructed length not including room for target backings and standing room behind the lane this becomes a task. You have to have it on a main route just so people will find it, spend $25000.00 on a 3D simulation, then have enough customer flow to warrent the expense. Given the option around my area, where you can shoot in your back yard, most people will not cough up the $8.00 and hour to shoot indoors unless the weather is REALLY bad and then they do nothing but complain about the price. It is typical...everyone wants the availability of an indoor range, with air conditioning and heat and lots of lighting and a video 3D range, but are not willing to spend the money to support it. We have had several great locations die because they only had business in the winter.

Sad really...

Wyvern

( and yes, I have seriously looked at opening one around here, but just cant justify it...)


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

I think the issue is not the expense, but the overcrowding. Have you gone to a shooting range with a traditional bow? You need a bit more room then the shoulder to shoulder range provides and trying to teach a kid at those indoor ranges is near impossible.


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## Wyvern Creations (Sep 20, 2006)

I 100% agree...and that extra room equates to expense. I have one retailer near me that has a "hallway" that he jammed 4 lanes into. if you hold in your breath 3 guys "may" be able to shoot there, but not if one of them is swingin a long bow...

Wyvern


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

dc -

Wrong on (almost) all counts.

Several of the indoor ranges around here have JOAD/Kids' league times set aside so there's proper supervision. ADULTS shoot at their own risk, IF there's room.

As far as "trad" shooters needing more space than compound guys, pure BS, learn how to shoot. Most of the old (pre-compound) indoor clubs I belonged to gave you 2' of line space during a match. All those stickbow guys didn't seem to have a problem with it. 

Most of us would rather shoot with plenty of room, but sometimes what we want and reality needs to be two different things.

I know it sucks when you plan on doing something and the rug gets pulled out from under you. You can ***** about it or deal with it. 

Wyvern -

I've thought about setting up a local range as well. The trick would be to use it as a club, not a commercial range and find a church, school or similar building's basement big enough for the required distances and reasonable rents. NFAA has links to affordable insurance

Ya know the DART / 3D systems are nice, but stacks of cardboard are all you really need. It's the people that make the club, not the window dressing.

Gents -

Ya know, I gotta tella ya, given some the the yahoos I see at our local ranges, both "trad" and compound guys, I'm glad these rules are in place. It seems that some people are more "accident prone" than others.

Even the good shooters do miss occassionally. and who is to say that little Johnny next door or rover will never get curious sometime while you're busy buring a hole in your target? 

Viper1 out.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Of course you would disagree Viper....you like to be right.

Learn how to shoot? Really.....thats your come back? I shoot a recurve and shoot it quite well. I shoot instinctive which requires that I get the arrow under my eye which requires that I hold the bow on a cant. Come on Viper....you are the big "know it all" in archery you should understand that.

As far as kids programs go they are very few. If you have a club that has one going all the time then good for you, but you know as well as I do that when you go to an indoor archery range (which is usually at a shop) it is filled with adults shooting shoulder to shoulder and 98% are compound shooters. Really not a place for young kids or a place to instruct young kids.

So I am not "wrong" on all accounts......that is your opinion. I have been in archery for over 20+ years and have many accomplishments so don't fill me with your BS. That crap may work on newbies, but not me.


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

dc -

Dude, I am usually right, deal with it LOL :darkbeer:

Anywho, too many cross eye-dominant instinctive shooters to disprove that "have to cant" or "have to bend at the waist" to get my eye over the arrow thing. Hummm, I though "trad" bowhunters were supposed to shoot from any position??? I guess that means any position except upright??? If that's what you WANT to do, then either start your own range, see if you can set up a trad night (most of the ranges around here have that) or learn to adapt. This is the reality most of us have to deal with.

If there are enough kids at you indoor ranges, then talk to the owners about setting aside some time for them. A few hours won't hurt business and might actually help. You might even volunteer to help. 

Sorry, I can't solve al the logistcially problems for every shooter in every town, but the rules, as they stand, are there for a good reason, and as you're finding out, most people agree with them.

You can keep complaining or do something constructive about it.

BTW - if you've been going this for 20 years, then the odds are you have no idea about what archery was all about before this "trad" non-sence started. We all shot in somewhat tight quarters and did quite well.

When you have something positive to contribute, I'll respond, till then, it's been real.

Viper1 out.


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## Wolf among dogs (Jan 5, 2007)

The time it takes to argue here a phone call or a visit to the local Government office could have been made..I just called mine.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Viper,

See admitting to your problem is the first step to recovery. :darkbeer:

I know......you are older then dirt and know everything there is to know about archery. Why don't you start your own forum. You can be like a genie where we pop a coin in and ask Swami Viper for the right answer.

Yep...."accept and adapt".....thats what this country was built on or should I say will evolve to.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

And by the way Viper......if you are as old as you claim to be "Dude" should not be part of your vocabulary. :wink:


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## Warbow (Apr 18, 2006)

dcwhite55044 said:


> I know......you are {Ad hominem attack}and know everything there is to know about archery. Why don't you start your own forum. You can be like a genie where we pop a coin in and ask Swami Viper for the right answer.
> 
> Yep...."accept and adapt".....thats what this country was built on or should I say will evolve to.


My, my. I disagree with Viper on the backyard shooting issue but I don't take it personally. The man is knowledgeable, reliable and amazingly even tempered in his posts. If you don't care for "Swami Viper" I'd say it's your loss...


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## longbowdude (Jun 9, 2005)

It happened ages ago in my area. Heck, people look at me like I am a terrorist when I pull out my pocket knife at work. The problem goes much deeper than any saftey issues.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Never said Viper was not intelligent nor did I say he does not have value to provide me or others.....but even tempered I will have to disagree. He is only even tempered when he feels he has the upper hand in a discussion or confident that he is right.....otherwise you get the "Dude"and things like "Wrong on (almost) all accounts."

Viper has an opinion.....no doubt, but so do I and sometimes they clash. :wink: I respect his knowledge, but as you can see from his last post he doesn't respect mine. Give no respect.....get no respect and I don't care how smart you are.


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## Zen Archery (Jul 27, 2004)

banned in my suburban hell due to one archer! 

neighbor asked him not to shoot when his kids were running around in backyard. he commented that it was his backyard and he could shoot whenever he wanted. way to go friggin moron!

it was brought before city council and yea no one knew about the bill until it was passed.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

A guy comes into a bar and gets hammered then beats a patron to death.....do we ban drinking for all? Drunk driver runs over a kid playing in the street......do we ban driving? A Hunter goes on a rampage and kills a bunch of people in the woods.....do we ban hunting?

You can put all the laws down you want and say "now we are safe", but the act of a bonehead should not be a generalization for all. If that were the case then we should ban all guns.


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## Warbow (Apr 18, 2006)

dcwhite55044 said:


> A guy comes into a bar and gets hammered then beats a patron to death.....do we ban drinking for all? Drunk driver runs over a kid playing in the street......do we ban driving? A Hunter goes on a rampage and kills a bunch of people in the woods.....do we ban hunting?
> 
> You can put all the laws down you want and say "now we are safe", but the act of a bonehead should not be a generalization for all. If that were the case then we should ban all guns.


A kid buys a live grenade at the local explosives store and then uses it to blow up the rival high school football team...do we ban kids from buying grenades? Oh, wait, we do.

Some things are too dangerous to be allowed and we do have to draw a line. I don't think backyard archery is that line, but I do think that some regulation is necessary. For instance, a common fence is not a sufficient back stop (as it seems happened in Zen's neighbor's case). So, I don't know how such things should be regulated, but it shouldn't be a complete free-for all either, where you can set up a target on your sidewalk and shoot at it from your kitchen window as kids walk by.


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## zillla (Feb 24, 2007)

My experience is that most municipalities do not allow the discharge of firearms within the city limits. Here that includes archery, as well as pellet/BB guns and firearms..


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Ah...Warbow we find common ground. :wink: I agree that there should be some regulations or guidelines, but an outright ban is also an extreme.


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## Warbow (Apr 18, 2006)

dcwhite55044 said:


> Ah...Warbow we find common ground. :wink: I agree that there should be some regulations or guidelines, but an outright ban is also an extreme.


Who knew it could happen?


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## AK in PA (Nov 30, 2002)

I think most urban areas and local parks in PA have local ordinances against shooting anything in your yard. Ordinance or not, when I lived in town, I never even considered shooting across my 20 yd lawn, even though I did have a detached garage at that end. If my fingers slipped, I blundered a shot, the arrow glanced, the nock or shaft broke, or whatever, one of my arrows very likely would have caused injury or damage to somebody or something. I gladly drove to a sportsman's club to shoot. If common sense would prevail, there might not be a reason for such ordinances. But sadly, there is.

The only time I'd object to such ordinances are when they apply to low density or rural residential areas.


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## NDTerminator (Nov 6, 2006)

DC, I grew up in Mn and the writing was all ready on the wall by the early 
70's. Maybe you should do what I did, get the hell out of the state. 

When I left Mn in the late 70's I never looked back. I moved to rural, outdoorsman friendly ND and never regretted it for a moment. Gave up some professional advancement & money, but have been reimbursed many times over in quality of life.

Perhaps the answer is to do what the skateboard kiddies do, get a bunch together and petition for a park area to do one's thing. That's what they did here. We require they sign a waiver to use it and "skate at your own risk" signs are prominently posted. Keeps the majority from congregating and causing a nuisance downtown.

BTW DC, what's with the snarky necking on Viper? That's the kind of thing the compound crowd does and not worthy of a Trad Brother.

Disagree sure, but check the attitude at the door...


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

_BTW DC, what's with the snarky necking on Viper? That's the kind of thing the compound crowd does and not worthy of a Trad Brother._

I can see Viper has a loyal following like the Greatful Dead. :wink: I will say this again and ask that you try to pull the "Viper love filter" off for a second. Viper has been around the block in archery as have I. I respect Viper's thoughts and advice and in many cases he has excellent perspective.

Where I do not respect him (look at his responses carefully) is his pompas attititude in his responses. Before you label me read his responses to me and others and do the same analysis you did to my responses. You will see what I am talking about.

I don't buy into "Trad Brother" or "Brother of the Arrow" crap. I don't care what you shoot....what matters to me is the respect you give others and if you are truly trying to help or build your following.

Many on this forum fall to their knees when Viper speaks and no one challenges him no matter how he responds. Viper has a lot to offer those in our sport and lots of knowledge to pass on, but in my opinion I think he is pompas. Maybe both Viper and I could check the "attitude at the door" and grab a cold beer. :wink:


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## hoyt3 (Apr 22, 2005)

I don't have this issue as I have some land, but I have heard of it. I'm sorry, but noone is going to tell me what I can do (within reason of course) on my own land, especially shooting my bow.


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Gents, and DC -

I usually don't bother reponding to threads like this, but since my name is being thrown around, here's my take on it.

First, I really appreciate the kind words and thoughts that you guys have shown me both now and it the past. That means more than you know.

As far as this thread is concerned, DC, simple truth is you got you panties in a bunch because it seems like the laws are going to change in your neck of the woods and you don't like. Do-do happens. I moved to an area with near-by rifle and archery ranges. Soon after, the rifle range closed and the archery range began having heating problems that made it impossible to use for the last two winters. (Hope this year will be better, but we'll see.)

If I seemed abrupt or uncaring about your situation, sorry, but some times you do have to call a spade a spade. Your situation is no different than a lot of others, myself included, and we find ways to deal with it. 

As I said, I personally agree with the laws, they make sense in the majority of cases, and I honestly don't think the local constabulary has the manpower or interest to look at each shooter on a case by case basis. Even if you are THAT GOOD an archer, what about your brother-in-law, who isn't? If you can you in your back yard, why can't he in his? What about him shooting in your back yard?

AGAIN, look at the reality. Most cases I've heard of where such laws were in place, the only times they were inforced were when a neighbor complained, or the shooter drew attention to himself. (Yeah, I'm sure there are exceptions, and I have a good story about one that happened in my neighborhood.) 

I don't know YOUR exact circumstances, they need to be your concern, not mine and if you think that's pompous, good thing I've never coached you, because I get a lot worse in person 

Viper1 out.


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## NDTerminator (Nov 6, 2006)

Having been on this forum but a month or so, I don't know Viper any better than I know you, DC. I would have said the same had you responded to anyone else in a like manner. It doesn't belong here. Likewise you don't know me, yet make a lot of assumptions about me, and voice them in a disrespectful manner. That tells me a lot about you.

For the record, I and clearly many others who post here *do* buy into the " Trad Brother crap" as you put it. 

Maybe you have been around the block, maybe not. Either way, judging by your responses it looks to me like you still have a lot left to learn.

In hindsite, I don't see what this particular thread has to do with Traditional Archery. Traditional archery wasn't even mentioned in the article...


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Viper,

I shed my "panties" for boxers some time ago so to be accurate my boxers are in a bunch. We can and have beat this horse to death and it should be ok to agree to disagree without the need for attacks on both sides. I'm not looking for your sympathy and I knew damn well when I posted this that there would be some that agree and disagree. Hell......we can't come to agreement on the style of shooting, the type of arrows, etc., etc. why would I think we would agree on back yard shooting.  You "deal with it" in your way and I will "deal with it" in my way......thats what makes America so beautiful. 

Listen, I too can be a lot more ferocious in person when I get hot (its my Italian / Irish New Jersey heritage) so thanks for the offer to be a coach....but I don't think us two together armed with "dangerous" weapons is a good idea (back yard or otherwise). :wink:


I do want to clear some facts up for you so your last response is accurate:

1 - My brother in-law does not shoot bow. If you were referring to my post on wounded animals it was my buddy's brother in-law.

2 - Since my concerns are not yours why respond at all if that how you truly feel?

3 - Through all the BS and mud slinging what I truly care about is the longevity of our sport. I would hate to see the day when outdoor archery ranges and 3D courses are eliminated. I see it happening more and more in my area and in fact my archery club had to fight tooth and nail to save our club from the City. Had our club laid down and "dealt with it" we would have no place to shoot at all except Gander Mountain..... and let me tell you how much fun that isn't!

4 - Do I believe you are pompas.....yes.... and I'm sure you have a few thoughts about me (So goes the world of cyber relationships or lackthereof). So it is what it is....lets move on with respect. Don't tell me what I know or do not know about archery and I won't tell you. My goal in participation in this AT forum is to learn (no matter how good you think you are) and to share what I have learned in the hope that I add value to others.

DC out - :wink:


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

NDTerminator,

Really? You would have responded the same? So then why didn't you jump on Viper? I believe you were the first to judge me....how have I judged you?

Help me understand


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

DC - 

Whew, I didn't know you were from NJ, well... that explains a lot .. LOL :wink:

:darkbeer:

(Relax guys, NY joke)

Viper1 out.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

LOL Viper!  You do know us NJ types! 

Well...gotta go and shoot in my back yard. LOL! :wink:


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## Wyvern Creations (Sep 20, 2006)

Ya know...about a year ago I saw an article about a cat that had survived being shot thru the neck with an arrow with a broad head. Was this an act of a "bad archer" missing the target and the cat getting in the way? Some kids being idiots? Of retaliation for the one too many "presents" that the cat had left in someones driveway? No clue. But we all have to remember that what we shoot, even with field points, is a deadly weapon. Laws are not written for the responsable adults out there, they are written for the idiots and A**holes the either dont know enough to be safe, or would not be safe even if they could. Does it bite for the rest of us??? yes. But in some of these high population areas I personaly feel better that I can drive down a street with the window open and not worry that I will get hit with a stray arrow. Living in denial that just because you think that it is your "right as an American" to do something is not going to stop someone from having you arrested because a law is passed that you dont agree with. Wake up...America is no longer the "home of the free". Your rural area will eventually have a Walmart in it and all the idiots that it attracts and those same idiots will enact laws to try to regulate another idiot down the street from doing something stupid. Hate to tell you DC, Viper is correct and we all better come to an agreement of exactly how we are all going to "deal with it" as a group because individualy it does not work.

Wyvern

P.S. As both a Traditional shooter and a crossbow shooter, and a compound retailer I have to deal with the infighting between all 3 groups. The " Trad Brother crap" is not only needed, but needs to be vastly expanded to encompass all THREE forms of archery so ALL of us "archers" have not only a place to practice, but hunt if we so desire. I am personaly offended that my support for traditional archery and the joy I get from interacting with others who share my joy of the sport is considered "crap"


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Sorry you are offended, but you made my point with _"needs to be vastly expanded to encompass all THREE forms of archery."_ 

Do you think "Trad Brother" makes those that shoot compounds feel warm and fuzzy. No it segments and separates. Heck....evcen your beloved Viper doesn't subscribe to "Traditional" because he knows as I do that labels mean nothing and actually do more to damage the sport. I am an "archer" who shoots both targets and animals. I embrace all archers, and don't need to call myself a Traditional Brother. Look at what is in my hands when I shoot and you can figure it out in a hurry as to what part of archery I like to shoot.

My apologies for offending you and the rest who are offended by the Trad Brother Crap statement, but that my opinion.......you may have a different opinion and so the world goes round and round.


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## hawgslayer (Jul 20, 2004)

:darkbeer:

I am blessed!!!!!!!! My neighbores on both sides of me are from RUSSIA. I give them allot of deer and wild hawgs and they never say a thing about me shooting in the back yard. On nice evenings they are out there watching along with their beer and the VODKA.

HS


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

I always use safe shooting practices when in the back yard....thus I have implemented this backstop. :wink:


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## Wyvern Creations (Sep 20, 2006)

"Do you think "Trad Brother" makes those that shoot compounds feel warm and fuzzy. No it segments and separates"

"Trad Brother" simply allows archers of a similar style to join in a common interest. If I and a few of my "trad brothers" were standing around at a range, I would welcome any compound or crossbow shooter to join us in conversation of "archery". Perhaps even expand their interest into another aspect, or...heaven forbid...maybe get a trad guy into compounds or crossbows. There is no reason that "archery" cannot be broken down into smaller, more specific groups, and "trad brother" is nothing but that, but the animosity I have to deal with from trad guys that hate compounds, and archery organizations that hate crossbows is self defeating to the sport and IMO childish and selfish. 

Your initial post as to writing to the law makers and getting involved was great, but since you are the one who mentioned "respect" several times in your posts, you need to "respect" the fact that not all of us live in your part of the country. The laws and restrictions you are so fired up about are nessicary in some locations and those are the areas where some of these so called "archery organizations" need to focus their energy on instead of fighting amonst themselves. THAT is why I am a NASP instructor,and a bowhunter safety instructor, and offer free lessons and loaner equipment at events in my area. Because my area is growing too.. and it will not be too long before I will have to deal with backyard restrictions myself. When that happens, I sincerely hope that I will not have to read the bylaws of the local "archery clubs" before I aproach them for help to see if I cant mention the words Crossbow....or Compound....or Traditional.

Wyvern

P.S.
"your beloved Viper "....Viper is well respected and provides a ton of good information on this forum. Is he 100% right all the time?? No, none of us are, but seriously.....that comment was unnessicary....


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Well there you have it.....our common ground is the support of archery nd bringing more (especially kids) into the sport so let it go at that. 

As you also should have read I said that I did not expect everyone to agree with my post and as you can see many did not. Thats ok with me and it was interesting to see others perspectives. We debated, we did a little mud slinging and in the end we found common ground....now only if our politicians could do that. :wink:


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## jacobsladder (Apr 20, 2007)

*my .02*

"too many cross eye-dominant instinctive shooters to disprove that "have to cant" or "have to bend at the waist" to get my eye over the arrow thing. Hummm, I though "trad" bowhunters were supposed to shoot from any position??? I guess that means any position except upright???"


This was not a very intelligent statement....As a traditional bowhunter i practice and shoot canted, upright, and even horizontal at times..... i have never seen a compound shooter shoot any way except upright.... canting the bow is the most comfortable to me.... and i assume shooting upright would be the most comfortable for the compound shooter...... and yes canting does require abit more room to shoot... but it is a great way to shoot under limbs to find the vitals of your target...I am not cross eye dominant but perfer to shoot canted. i guess i still have to learn how to shoot???? I dont judge anyone by their weapon of choice,I jdge them by the way they hunt and the respect they show towards the animal they are trying to harvest. I know this thread was about banning....so i'd like to put a ban on such rediculous statements.... steve


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## Wyvern Creations (Sep 20, 2006)

"We debated, we did a little mud slinging and in the end we found common ground....now only if our politicians could do that."

The trouble with pigs is that once they start rolling in the mud they enjoy it so much and find that they are VERY good at it that getting them to focus on anything else is next to impossible. Considering my dislike of every politician I have met or heard about I dont think we will see anything more inteligent from them than a few extra bubbles in the mud... At least us archers we can rise above that....

Wyvern


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## ohdeerhtr (Nov 28, 2007)

*Just my Opinion...*

I am no expert on much of anything, nor do I try to act like one, but it seems to me that the biggest weapon people who want to try to ban things, or try to force people to live how they think we should has is the people a proposed ban affects becoming divided and fighting amoungst themselves. Not litterally fighting, but dividing crossbow shooters, compound, etc. That is one of the things I feel will hurt us in the long run w/ anti-hunters, and others who feel the need to regulate law abiding citizens in their recreational pursuits, or even livelihoods in some cases. I shoot crossbow, and traditional, depending on what I feel like, I am average or maybe alittle better at best. I have some acreage here in Ohio, and I used 9 bales of straw to make a backstop in front of a hillside, AND I have taught my kids that a bow is a weapon, not a toy. So far we don't have any such bans in place(that I'm aware of), and I hope this doesnt change. But I feel we ALL, NATIONWIDE, need to work togethor to find common ground to keep our voice heard. Just my opinion...


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## Pa. Patriot (Oct 8, 2007)

Viper1 said:


> dc -
> 
> In NYS it's *illegal to discharge a weapon with 500' of a dwelling* and a bow is considered a weapon, imagine that.


Except I'm quite certain the law says ".... Unless you own/lease or have permission from the owner"

Very different law than the way you presented it.


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## Warbow (Apr 18, 2006)

Pa. Patriot said:


> Except I'm quite certain the law says ".... Unless you own/lease or have permission from the owner"
> 
> Very different law than the way you presented it.


And I'm pretty certain you aren't allowed to use your suburban backyard as a rifle range regardless of whether you "own/lease or have permission from the owner."

How about a citation for the law so we can stop speculating?


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Guys -

I'll try again to make this as clear as I can, and apologize up front if it sounds pompous.

I have about 1/4 acre and can easily set up a 40 yd range, which is well within my comfort zone with target bow. The property next to mine is situated so that an arrow passing into it would just bury into the ground. I'm sure the owner would say "no problem".

I won't do it because, 1. it's against the law (there are other properties with in a 500' radius, even though they are not in the line of fire) and 2. it's just not worth it, on the slight chance of a mishap. Yes, even I make mistakes 

More importantly (here's the pompous part) I don't want some idiot just learning to shoot playing with his new toy next to my house, my wife who likes to garden or me. I see these guys at the range every week and they scare the crap outta me. (My local indoor range has more holes in the ceiling tiles than I can count.)

Now if I had 5 or 10 acres and a nice hill for a backstop, different story and then this doesn't apply.

Viper1 out.


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## dcwhite55044 (Nov 6, 2003)

Just an update on the back yard ban. City Council and the City Police Cheif wrote me back. All positive news. As long as you are 200 ft. from a home you don't own shoot away and I was thanked for my letter. 

Oh....and guess what......guns and bows are not in the same category or statue except as it relates to hunting.


Guess it didn't backfire and guess I'm not the only one who sees guns and bows as very differnt weapons.


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## dogpound1 (Jul 22, 2007)

i live in the city and am not aloud to shoot in my yard even though im surrounded by abandoned houses seems the crack heads have more rights than i do so i shoot at my girl friends house its only 20 to the back of her house but the local cops said as long as i shoot towards the house im good to go i figure 20 yards is better than not shooting at all


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