# The purpose of bare shaft tuning.



## Deezlin (Feb 5, 2004)

A lot of archers are confused by the difference between bare shaft tuning for a fingers shooter and for a compound. Bare shafting for a finger shooter was mainly to help him determine the best spine to use for his stick or recurve bow. Compound shooters have several other ways of accomplishing this not available to the recurve shooter.

The main reason bare shaft tuning needs to be done for a compound is to achieve a linear nock travel or linear thrust. The idea is to produce a thrust acting completely down the axis of the arrow.

To demonstrate the effects of this let’s remove the nock from the end of an arrow. Now, we will drill a hole in the ground so it is perfectly straight down and place the end of the arrow in it. If you take a large punch and place in on the nock hole of the arrow end and strike it with a hammer straight down, you should be able to drive the arrow into the ground. Now, if you hit it off to one side, then the shaft will bend in that direction more and the force will not be applied squarely to the point.

Now, if you square up the arrow in the bow and get the center shot set, does this mean you have a linear thrust on the arrow shaft. No, it doesn’t. If the cam time is off just a little or there is a little cam lean, it can push the arrow slightly off center.

This slightly off center push will cause the spine of the arrow to flex a little bit more and will move the point slightly off center too. Now fortunately, we have fletching and this creates a drag on the arrow and brakes the arrow back into the axial line or flight path.

When shooting a bare shaft, there is no correcting drag. Therefore, if the nock is pushed left at launch then as the oscillation of the spine stops the arrow remains in nock left attitude. Now, what this does, is causes the shaft to wind plane to the right. If you have a fixed broad head on the arrow, the blades will intensify this wind planning.

The ideal launch from the bow would produce a level, straight arrow not particularly needing the fletching for guidance. If all launches were ideal, you could shoot arrows without fletching, however, in reality, most of us are not human “Hooter Shooters”. Bare shaft tuning does give a better launch to most compound bows and allowing the arrows launch to be cleaner and more consistent. Since the arrow’s fletching doesn’t induce as much drag, the arrow flight will be a little faster down range. In many cases, smaller fletching can be used, producing better down range flight speed without sacrificing accuracy.

Also, for the hunter, a better launch would tend to keep the effect of broad head wind plane to a minimal and would produce a straight entry and better penetration.


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## gpscoqn (Dec 10, 2004)

How far from the target shoud bare shafts be shot from?

I assume if the bare shaft groups with the fletched shaft then all is well, and no adjustments are nesecary.

At 30 yards my bare shaft was a little high and to the right of the group.


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## Deezlin (Feb 5, 2004)

gpscoqn said:


> How far from the target shoud bare shafts be shot from?
> 
> I assume if the bare shaft groups with the fletched shaft then all is well, and no adjustments are nesecary.
> 
> At 30 yards my bare shaft was a little high and to the right of the group.


I actually never shoot bare shafts and fletched arrows together. This is more the procedure for finger shooters.

In my opinion, shooting bare shafts beyond 20 yards has no practical tuning benefit. Even with mechanical releases and all the other niceties of the modern compound, slight variations of release will show too many variances.


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## MURRAYT (Nov 5, 2005)

*Deezlin*

That clears it up some for me but I now have other questions. I attempted bare shaft tuning the other day. My bare shafts impacted online (horizontal) with fletched but the point was right of fletched about 3 inches. The nocks of each were almost touching. IE the bare shaft was flying with a point right orientation. I had done walk back tuning out to 50 yards and was quite pleased with the results. The groups could have been tighter but the center of all groups were on the same vertical line. I'm thinking this is a spine issue. I am experimenting with GT UL 22 series arrows. They only come in 300 spine. I'm shooting a V-Tec @65lbs, 28" DL, 28" arrows, 75gr screw in points, no wraps, 3" dura vane 3D's. What would you suggest?


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## bow_hunter44 (Apr 20, 2007)

Deezlin said:


> I actually never shoot bare shafts and fletched arrows together. This is more the procedure for finger shooters.
> 
> In my opinion, shooting bare shafts beyond 20 yards has no practical tuning benefit. Even with mechanical releases and all the other niceties of the modern compound, slight variations of release will show too many variances.


I have wondered about this at time or two myself. What distance does provide meaningful information for bare shaft tuning? Do you shoot the bare shaft through paper or do you shoot for groups? Or just what, specifically?


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## AKRuss (Jan 10, 2003)

I'm a finger shooter with compounds and trad bows and use bareshaft tuning quite a bit. Unless I'm really unsure of the setup, I generally shoot at 15 yards indoors (my garage) or 20 outside (my backyard, which is still snowy). If I haven't a clue on what's going to happen, I start at 10 yards or so to make sure I don't inadvertently get the neighbor's dog or something. I have read that Olympic recurve shooters actually bareshaft at range but that would be very difficult to accomplish and one would have to be very well dialed in. When I'm on the money bareshaft wise, I can shoot perfect holes in paper with or without fletching. I enjoy demonstrating this to compound release shooters who often seem to be shooting their arrows sideways. I also use cam creep, group (line?) and walk back (French) tuning to fine tune at range. I try not to obsess with any of these but rather work on my form and consistency which REALLY need help. What little experience I've had with bareshaft tuning at range wasn't pretty or safe but was expensive. What little I've tried bareshafting with a release aid didn't seem to get me anywhere though I have little experience with the things. Easton's "Arrow Tuning and Maintenance Guide" is the best source of information on bareshaft tuning that I've read and I see Ox has posted the url. There's little point to bareshaft tuning without also shooting fletched arrows. The object of bareshaft tuning is to fine tune your equipment so that your unfletched arrows fly straight and group with your fletched arrows at a given range with the hope that this will optimize your equipment. I suspect many (most?) shoots are won by archers shooting less than perfectly tuned equipment.


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## Deezlin (Feb 5, 2004)

MURRAYT said:


> That clears it up some for me but I now have other questions. I attempted bare shaft tuning the other day. My bare shafts impacted online (horizontal) with fletched but the point was right of fletched about 3 inches. The nocks of each were almost touching. IE the bare shaft was flying with a point right orientation. I had done walk back tuning out to 50 yards and was quite pleased with the results. The groups could have been tighter but the center of all groups were on the same vertical line. I'm thinking this is a spine issue. I am experimenting with GT UL 22 series arrows. They only come in 300 spine. I'm shooting a V-Tec @65lbs, 28" DL, 28" arrows, 75gr screw in points, no wraps, 3" dura vane 3D's. What would you suggest?


You are getting a nock left orientation with the impact point to the right. That would be normal. There might be some deviation in your release causing the nocks to almost be touching. Unfortunately with the Hoyt floating yoke system there is no practical way to tune this out.


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## AllenRead (Jan 12, 2004)

Deezlin said:


> Bare shafting for a finger shooter was mainly to help him determine the best spine to use for his stick or recurve bow Compound shooters have several other ways of accomplishing this not available to the recurve shooter.


Great post Deezlin, but what are these methods of spine tuning for compound release shooters? I've understood that if you have good nock travel and a clean release, spine is irrevelent as long as you don't get too weak.

Thanks,
Allen


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## MURRAYT (Nov 5, 2005)

Deezlin said:


> You are getting a nock left orientation with the impact point to the right. That would be normal. There might be some deviation in your release causing the nocks to almost be touching. Unfortunately with the Hoyt floating yoke system there is no practical way to tune this out.


I'm sure these is a lot of deviation in my release! I'm no hot shot that's for sure. That is why I try to get the most from my equipment. Some sort of complex I've been told. Thanks for the response.


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## Corsair (Nov 21, 2005)

*Deezlin*

Great information! Many thanks. 

One thing, if I may. I can understand how bare shaft tuning will assist in establishing correct nock height and therefore good verticla arrow travel but if your bare shafts are landing laterally away from your aiming point, what should you be adjusting first??

If the problem is cam or idler lean, it seems to me you should try correcting that first before moving your arrow rest laterally, even if cam or idler lean isn't readily apparent. 

I presume that any sideways travel would otherwsie have to be corrected using the lateral rest adjustment?

Sorry to seem dumb about this but it has always puzzled me.:embara:


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## rogbo (Jan 2, 2004)

I use bare shaft tuning, as a finger shooter, to check arrow spine and set my rough center shot. If I can get my arrows to group (fletched with bare) then I know that I am spined properly. Then I walk back tune to set my center shot more exact. Finally I shoot my broadheads against my field points. As primarily a hunter it is important to me that my broadheads and field points impact together (save any arguments here for another thread). This finalizes my centershot and nock height. Then we are good to go.


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## Deezlin (Feb 5, 2004)

Corsair said:


> *Deezlin*
> 
> Great information! Many thanks.
> 
> ...


I think the main purpose of bare shafting a compound is to adjust the nock travel. Adjusting the center shot has basically no effect on left and right or for that matter up or down. You do need to basically have the arrow square and a "rough" center shot setting. If you are getting high or low nock impacts, then you need to make timing corrections. In the case of a single cam this is not possible. Therefore, you will either or perhaps, both make a nock height change and/or tiller adjustment.

On bows with split yoke cables or the shoot through cables you can adjust the cam lean to correct left- right nock hits.



rogbo said:


> I use bare shaft tuning, as a finger shooter, to check arrow spine and set my rough center shot. If I can get my arrows to group (fletched with bare) then I know that I am spined properly. Then I walk back tune to set my center shot more exact. Finally I shoot my broadheads against my field points. As primarily a hunter it is important to me that my broadheads and field points impact together (save any arguments here for another thread). This finalizes my centershot and nock height. Then we are good to go.


This is one of the major differences between bare shafting. For a finger shooter, you are rolling the string from your fingers. This creates more of a left right movement of the string. Using a weak shaft in this case will induce more flexing and will change the final flight path more. The same would happen with a too stiff shaft but the arrow would tend fly in the opposite direction. My knowledge of finger shooting is quite limited anymore.

What I am doing with bare shafting is I am assuming I have a properly spined, shaft. Therefore these adjustment are being made to get just as much linear force down the center of the shaft as possible. This is basically what you are doing in a Hooter Shooter. The machine though is considerably more accurate.


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## Corsair (Nov 21, 2005)

Many thanks Deezlin. Much appreciated!


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## Deezlin (Feb 5, 2004)

^


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## CJT (Jun 8, 2007)

Deezlin,
If you were going to paper tune a bow , would you use a bare shaft or a fletched shaft ?
If you would use a bare shaft and it tuned good does this mean you dont have to worry about the fletched shaft ?


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## Deezlin (Feb 5, 2004)

CJT said:


> Deezlin,
> If you were going to paper tune a bow , would you use a bare shaft or a fletched shaft ?
> If you would use a bare shaft and it tuned good does this mean you dont have to worry about the fletched shaft ?


If I was going to paper tune, I would use a fletched arrow. I personally, can't tell very well where the nock went through otherwise. This is probably because of the paper I have used in the past.

If you can tune a bare shaft, then the fletched arrow should hit with the bare shaft. If it doesn't, you do have a spine issue.


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## Rambunctious (Apr 8, 2007)

Deezlin ( and others )

Thanks for all the info. I have a follow up question if you don't mind.

First, here's where I'm at after a few bare shaft tuning sessions...

My bare and fletched shafts are hitting at the same level vertically.

Horizontally, the point of impact of the bare shafts is about 3 inches to the left of the fletched, with a nock right orientation ( maybe an inch to an inch and a half right of the POI ) I can see the arrow plane horizontally as it travels down range.

The bare shafts are all touching together in the group, so I believe spine is fine. I've also verified this using OnTarget.

Here's my issue - I seem to have reached a point where additional twists in the right hand side of the split yoke do not move the bare shafts and fletched shafts closer together

So where should I go from here to bring the bare and fletched shafts together?

Any help you can offer would be greatly appreciated - thanks.


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## fletched (May 10, 2006)

Very well said deezlin. I also like to bareshaft. 
People need to keep in mind that it is part bow tuning and part shooter tuning. If an arrow flies tail left or right, it could be in the grip also. Just don't assume it is the arrow or the rest. I have had to readjust my grip a touch depending on the bow to acheive good bareshaft tuning results. Also, I have several different spined shafts and point weights to use. This helps determine if it is an arrow problem or rest adjustment problem.


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## Rambunctious (Apr 8, 2007)

Rambunctious said:


> Deezlin ( and others )
> 
> Thanks for all the info. I have a follow up question if you don't mind.
> 
> ...



Any suggestions out there?


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## PA.JAY (May 26, 2004)

try moving your rest A HAIR & I MEAN A HAIR TO THE right . It woln't affect your fletched as much as you think but your bare shaft it will .


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