# Hunter killed by buckshot



## granny

deer drives are not safe & buckshot should be against the law in every state.


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## BigBirdVA

Oh come on it's perfectly safe. That's why VA. in it's infinite wisdom removed the long standing 3 shell limit in shotguns. 

Sad to hear of anyone getting shot but when you have a inherently bad game plan eventually something bad is going to happen. Lining up people on the ground and chasing deer through the line is eventually going to result in something going wrong. Then add many projectiles per shot instead of one and you increase the danger.


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## nicko

Deer drives are as safe or unsafe as the individuals who participate in them. It's not the drive that is unsafe so much as the people who start blasting away without thinking of their line of fire or properly identifying their target. 

"*Shooters are typically standing on the ground and many times have been known to fire into moving bushes and cover without even seeing what they are shooting at. I had a friend that was almost killed (crippled for life) by a shooter that "thought" he was a deer and fired away.*"

Again, this goes back to the shooter who starts blasting away without thinking of their line of fire or properly identifying their target. It's not the ammo, it's the individual. 

Buckshot is a 30-40 yard ammo, tops. I'm not endorsing it and I have never used it. But like with any ammo or weapon, the responsibility for it's safe use falls on the individual.


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## chuckl

> It is with a heavy heart I write this update...
> 
> The young lady that lost her life is the sister of a friend of mine from High School, we were good friends through school and have hunted together a number of times over the years since. This is a true freak accident not only him and his family but the people they hunt with very safe hunters.
> 
> At this time I will not go into great detail other than to say she was by where the trucks where parked and suffered a pellet wound to the head. There were no other pellets found in the area as this was a ricochet from a shot taken in a different direction. SO at this time this appears to be a true freak accident, not a case of not knowing what is beyond your target. As I learn more I will update.
> 
> Everyone please keep this family and all those involved in this in your thoughts and prayors as the are in need of it!


this is a true freak accident and tragedy and the best i can tell the whole reason for posting it was to be-little those that use buckshot and to throw in the words deer chasers and how somthing should be banned that you dont like.........what the heck is wrong with you?

and may i throw in the fact that in virginia more people have been killed by a single RIFLE bullet than buck shot


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## WNYBuckHunter

Are you guys a bunch of anti hunting dingbats? Calling for a ban on buckshot? That kind of crap is what is going to end up getting all hunting banned. 

While I dont use buckshot, I would never call for it to be banned because its "dangerous". Id be willing to bet money that percentage wise, there are less buckshot injuries and fatalities each year than slug or rifle injuries and fatalities.


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## BigBirdVA

chuckl said:


> ..........and may i throw in the fact that in virginia more people have been killed by a single RIFLE bullet than buck shot


Got anything to validate that claim? Or it is just another "Chuck says" post?

Couldn't find any VA data in a quick Google search but found this in NC. NC is another chaser state and they allow rifles in a lot of areas if one is elevated. I'm sure the data for VA is pretty close as the hunting methods are similar, terrain similar and both have deer with hounds. 



> Then I started looking at total numbers of accidents involving shotguns versus rifles. Over those 3 years that I have full data at hand to review, there were 60% more accidents involving shotguns than there were involving rifles.


http://rule-303.blogspot.com/2009/10/shotgun-only-rationale-for-deer-hunting.html


Your turn...........

For the record buckshot is fine if it's used in the correct setting. People lined up on the ground and following a fast moving target with a projectile that will kill a human at well over 100 yards isn't the brightest idea. It's ok until that big buck and an anxious hunter come together. I've heard lead go by and I've heard of others that complained about X hunter on a hunt that made a bad shot.


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## granny

hunting will never get banned because the states make too much money from us.
.......lots of "anti hunting dingbats "on this site.........NOT.....
Grow up with the name calling !


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## superbuckeye

blanket statements suck. this one isn't worth the effort.


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## Yellowfin

Moonkryket said:


> A Virginia women was recently killed when she was hit in the head by a buckshot pellet, fired by another stander in her group. Whether you agree with it or not, 12 gauge buckshot is by far the most dangerous and inhumane method of killing deer and should be banned. Shooters are typically standing on the ground and many times have been known to fire into moving bushes and cover without even seeing what they are shooting at. I had a friend that was almost killed (crippled for life) by a shooter that "thought" he was a deer and fired away. The typical 12 gauge shotgun loaded with 5 rounds eek of 00 buckshot (total of 60+ copper projectiles) that ricochet off trees, down highways, etc. I feel much safer in counties where I know hunters are off the ground 10 to 15 feet with scoped rifles but you know the old traditions "die" hard .................like chasing deer with dogs.


 Common ingredient to all that which you're really mad at is HUMAN STUPIDITY. Be honest about it. It isn't the buckshot. It isn't the driving, though I hate that too. It's the STUPID factor. I also tend to think someone hunting deer not from a stand unless they're in Wyoming, Montana, etc. is stupid, but the whole not identifying your target 100% and knowing what is beyond it is the entirety of the problem. Nannyism is just as wrong, though. Ban this ban that is just what our enemies want. Don't be them.


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## WNYBuckHunter

granny said:


> hunting will never get banned because the states make too much money from us.
> .......lots of "anti hunting dingbats "on this site.........NOT.....
> Grow up with the name calling !


Awwww, did I hurt your feelings or touch a nerve?

Youd be surprised at the tactics that antis use. Joining a hunting or shooting related website is far from beneath them, its probably close to the top of their tactic list. And didnt your mother ever tell you to never say never? I bet someone said just that about guns being banned in Europe, right before they banned them.


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## granny

WNYBuckHunter said:


> Awwww, did I hurt your feelings or touch a nerve?
> 
> Youd be surprised at the tactics that antis use. Joining a hunting or shooting related website is far from beneath them, its probably close to the top of their tactic list. And didnt your mother ever tell you to never say never? I bet someone said just that about guns being banned in Europe, right before they banned them.


No you did not hurt my feelings or touch a nerve.
Why would you think that ?
All I am saying is that people can get their point across better without name calling.
I didn't know about the gun ban in Europe, good point.


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## Moon

*Granny*

Don't be offended by the loud mouths here that do nothing but hurl insults. It's a common thing for those that feel their toes are being stepped on and have no meaningful or logical response. I knew this would happen and I told a friend it would and sure enough...........................

I find it sickening that at a time like this when a person's life has been taken by an accident, some people let that go right by their feeble minds and jump into a rant about me being anti-deer chasing (which I am after 40 years of being involved in it).

I see what the combination of shotguns/ buck shot and so called "hunters" (really they are shooters and standers) can lead to and yes, it ties back to dogs chasing deer. Any dim wit that can't see that.................

And you people from NY and other states jumping in with your comments in defense of buck shot, you've obviously not heard how horrible ricocheting buckshot sounds when going by YOUR heads. I know. That's why I don't do it anymore and stay as far away from it as I can.

To prove how inhumane buckshot is in the hands of typical deer "shooters" around here, Since 1963 when I first started bowhunting, I would estimate that about 25% of the deer I've taken with the bow had buckshot under their skin or embedded in their bodies. How's that for humane kills??? Also, the dozens of deer I've seen running across fields with one of their legs dangling like a limp dish clothe due to being almost blown off by buckshot.................

With a rifle shooting one bullet, being aimed typically with the use of a scope, the shooter is aiming at a spot and the shooter is typically shooting from an elevated stand. With a shotgun, the shooter is pointing the gun in the direction of the deer, not knowing where any of the shot will hit the deer. It sounds like this.............pow.........pow...........pow
.............pow ..................pow. Yes, 5 shots, not knowing where any of the pellets are going. Defend it all you want by insulting others and it won't change my mind.


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## Moon

*And this one................................*

*"Are you guys a bunch of anti hunting dingbats? Calling for a ban on buckshot? That kind of crap is what is going to end up getting all hunting banned". *

You are totally wrong. Ending the kind of "crap" that hurts hunting will SAVE hunting. Get it?????? I didn't think so


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## BigBirdVA

chuckl said:


> this is a true freak accident and tragedy and the best i can tell the whole reason for posting it was to be-little those that use buckshot and to throw in the words deer chasers and how somthing should be banned that you dont like.........what the heck is wrong with you?
> 
> and may i throw in the fact that in virginia more people have been killed by a single RIFLE bullet than buck shot


You know you're probably right. But it does happen. To almost all of us at some time or another. Isn't that right Chuck? 

Look at this post............ Now I wonder who posted that? :wink: 
Nothing better than unsolicited honest comments to prove a point. 



> I'm not sure what happened in this case but two years ago i was almost an accident. so close i heard the whirrr of single buckshot pellet.i promptly marched to the guy that had made the shot some 80 yrds up a logging road from me,hell bent on opening a can of whoop azz.long story short the majority of the buckshot was in trees at more than a 90 degree angle from where i was standing.the man appolagized to me all day long and till he was blue in the face but i couldn't see where he did anything wrong,just a weird ricochet,one in a gazillion freak thing.


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## Pine Tag

Man, y'all have some short term memories. Not a month ago there was a Ferrum college student killed and another injured by a still hunter with a rifle. By your logic, rifles should be banned huh? Come on. Any hunting accident is a tragedy but y'all are too quick to jump on the "ban it" bandwagon. It's no different than someone getting killed on an atv or bungee jumping. There is an amount of danger in almost all activities.

Like has already been stated, it comes down to the person making a bad decision and there are those that make bad ones in all groups.

That's the problem with our country now. The "I don't like that so I'm going to get it banned" mentality.


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## BigBirdVA

Pine Tag said:


> Man, y'all have some short term memories. Not a month ago there was a Ferrum college student killed and another injured by a still hunter with a rifle. By your logic, rifles should be banned huh? Come on. Any hunting accident is a tragedy but y'all are too quick to jump on the "ban it" bandwagon. It's no different than someone getting killed on an atv or bungee jumping. There is an amount of danger in almost all activities.
> 
> Like has already been stated, it comes down to the person making a bad decision and there are those that make bad ones in all groups.
> 
> That's the problem with our country now. The "I don't like that so I'm going to get it banned" mentality.


Uh wasn't he a criminal? Trespassing and no hunter safety and a big dose of stupid? Can't really lump criminals in with hunters can we?


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## Pine Tag

BigBirdVA said:


> Uh wasn't he a criminal? Trespassing and no hunter safety and a big dose of stupid? Can't really lump criminals in with hunters can we?


I'm curious what your response would've been if a hound hunter used your logic if the roles were reversed? If it were a "criminal" using a shotgun instead of a rifle y'all would be jumping all over it and say this is what we have to put up with in VA. Idiots with shotguns. In fact you just re-iterated my point for me when I said there are idiots in every group. This guy happened to be using a rifle.

Comical that this is your response.


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## BigBirdVA

You guys discount anything related to an inherit problem related to chasing. Above you have one of your own saying he was almost a statistic. I've had lead go by on the few chases I've been on. Not a lot but it has happened. I'll go on to say I've had lead go by in rifle country too. I'm surprised there aren't more than there are in the shotgun areas. 

When you take buckshot, a group of people on the ground and running game that's going through the line you have great potential for a problem. Most clubs are safe and not reckless. How much dangerous is buckshot? I have no idea but common sense will tell you the closer people are, the more people there are and the more the target is moving the greater chance there is of a problem. 

Lets do it this way. You have a guy shooting 3 shots with a rifle. 3 chances to get hit right? You have a guy shooting 3.5 shells of #1 buck, 3 shots. That's 81 projectiles vs 3. You do the math and tell me which has a better chance of missing you in an errant shot? 

I could care less what chasers shoot. I don't get near them any more than I have to. I only pass one road hunting bunch of Bubbas occasionally so my chances are very slim. Like I said I don't care to ban buckshot.


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## varcher

I don't understand a "deer drive". Call me what you will that is NOT hunting in my book. As far as 00 buck goes, I don't have a problem with it. 

I have NEVER taken a shot (bow or gun) that I didn't know for a FACT what it was I was shooting at. There have been times (early morning) when I was 99 percent sure it was a deer below my stand, but I would not take the shot because I was not absolutely sure. You simply cannot take the shot back after the trigger/release has been pulled...


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## 20ftup

I dont get all this chasing stuff, really whats wrong with usin a pack of hounds people rabbit hunt that way. Do you think rabbit hunting should be banned with Beagles? I just dont understand why when we have all the anti hunters breathing down our backs we are kicking our own teammates in the cracker jacks. You dont like hunting with hounds do like I do and dont do it but dont chastise those that do as long as its legal and they follow the law. I grew up listening to foxhounds now there is true country music too your ears


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## AR_Headhunter

The original person I posted this to didn't bother to answer the question so I'll pose this question to some of you others defending this practice.

Well look at it this way. In dog hunting your combining, numerous people, animals moving at a fairly high speed, dogs chasing those animals, people shooting at those animals at close quarters to other hunters. It just looks like a recipie for disaster to me. Actually not only does it look like it, it is! I know I've been there & done it. Thank god no one was killed during my time doing it but on 3 different occasions people got shot that I knew while hunting like this. How many innocent people have to die before the dog runners decide enough is enough. *Does it have to come down to some innocent family being shot while driving down the road not bothering a soul? Does it have to be like a guy I know who was shot for reporting illegal dog running? Or how about the private property owners who have been assaulted because they objected to deer dogs being ran across their land? *

Don't get me wrong, my heart goes out to anyone killed in a accident. There comes a point though when a accident is not so much a accident as a sheer act of stupidity. I've been around dog runners enough to know that stupidity runs rampant in those crowds when it comes to a deer. 

Now I'm not saying your stupid or anything like that but whats it going to take for you to stop blindly following the lead of dog organizations. I know your likely not a bad fella. I also hope one day you'll wake up & see the BS that goes on with dog runners in general before someone you love dies in a tragic accident that could have easily been avoided. *Your son looks mighty proud of his dad in the picture with the deer you posted but how would he look at "daddy" if you were killed or killed someone else in a preventable accident? How would you feel knowing that you helped support something that resulted in the death of a dear friends child? *Open your eyes MTN & think beyond the dog hunters blinders. 

As a matter of fact why don't we all take a moment just to think about the impact that killing someone on accident would have not only on our family but the family of the person killed......


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## AR_Headhunter

Pine Tag said:


> Man, y'all have some short term memories. Not a month ago there was a Ferrum college student killed and another injured by a still hunter with a rifle. By your logic, rifles should be banned huh? Come on. Any hunting accident is a tragedy but y'all are too quick to jump on the "ban it" bandwagon. It's no different than someone getting killed on an atv or bungee jumping. There is an amount of danger in almost all activities.
> 
> Like has already been stated, it comes down to the person making a bad decision and there are those that make bad ones in all groups.
> 
> That's the problem with our country now. The "I don't like that so I'm going to get it banned" mentality.


Your calling a criminal a hunter & expect us to buy into that.....


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## sits in trees

WNYBuckHunter said:


> Are you guys a bunch of anti hunting dingbats? Calling for a ban on buckshot? That kind of crap is what is going to end up getting all hunting banned.
> 
> While I dont use buckshot, I would never call for it to be banned because its "dangerous". Id be willing to bet money that percentage wise, there are less buckshot injuries and fatalities each year than slug or rifle injuries and fatalities.


thankyou! any shot, arrow, projectile, axe is only as safe as the person using it. and to ban a type of shot because someone was stupid and missused it is just fine with anti hunting groups! yea great they can just sit back and watch us destroy our ourselves over issues like drives, crossbows, buckshot, HF and all the other little dandies that keep us nicely divided for our enemy's:thumbs_do


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## rkswyo

*Buckshot is a 30-40 yard ammo, tops. I'm not endorsing it and I have never used it. But like with any ammo or weapon, the responsibility for it's safe use falls on the individual.[/QUOTE]*

#4 buck kills coyotes out to 65 yards. Iv'e done it many times. 00 or 000 will reach even farther. That being said, I would never want to see a ban on any kind of ammo. Once they get started it won't stop.


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## shooterspal

Well I'm not going to get in to this . My thought is with the family and friends of the girl and my Prayers are with them and God Bless .


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## AR_Headhunter

I would not support a ban on buckshot per say but I would like to see a ban on idiot behavior in the field. If you shoot someone, anyone wile hunting then IMHO you should not be carrying a weapon for a bit. Maybe for life in some cases. Take the trespassing idiot who killed that college girl for instance. No matter what ever happens to that fella & guys like him should know that I take a *PRO-ACTIVE* stand when protecting myself around armed idiots. I do not support any kind of a ban on anything besides a ban on armed criminals. I know that does not make sense at first but if we could shoot armed criminals on sight then being a convicted felon would bring on a whole new outlook from law abiding citizens. I'll bet you would not find so many convicted felons carrying. Think about the percentages of armed robberies, rapes, carjackings, etc. that are committed by armed felons. There was a time in this country where you could kill a armed intruder in your home in America & the cops would go ummm ok! Now days if you'll fight to defend your home or property you can be held liable for any bodily injury a burglar receives during a illegal break in to your home or business. Something went seriously wrong with this country when you had to worry about defending your land, business, home, & family because the guy breaking in or robbing you & your family might be hurt & you could be held liable. ukey:


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## PennArcher88

Am i hearing this right? People complaining about chaseing? Dont do it if ya dont like it. Am I a chaser becasue I have two beagle that love to hunt bunnys and a Blue Tick that loves to chse raccoons? Well in that case, IM PROUd to be a chaser, there is nothing that compares to listening to my beagles chase a bunny in a thicket or the howlin of my **** dog in the night.


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## PennArcher88

AR_Headhunter said:


> I would not support a ban on buckshot per say but I would like to see a ban on idiot behavior in the field. If you shoot someone, anyone wile hunting then IMHO you should not be carrying a weapon for a bit. Maybe for life in some cases. Take the trespassing idiot who killed that college girl for instance. No matter what ever happens to that fella & guys like him should know that I take a *PRO-ACTIVE* stand when protecting myself around armed idiots. I do not support any kind of a ban on anything besides a ban on armed criminals. I know that does not make sense at first but if we could shoot armed criminals on sight then being a convicted felon would bring on a whole new outlook from law abiding citizens. I'll bet you would not find so many convicted felons carrying. Think about the percentages of armed robberies, rapes, carjackings, etc. that are committed by armed felons. There was a time in this country where you could kill a armed intruder in your home in America & the cops would go ummm ok! Now days if you'll fight to defend your home or property you can be held liable for any bodily injury a burglar receives during a illegal break in to your home or business. Something went seriously wrong with this country when you had to worry about defending your land, business, home, & family because the guy breaking in or robbing you & your family might be hurt & you could be held liable. ukey:


Agreed all the way!!!!!


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## SCswitchback

Anyone calling for buckshot to be banned doesn't have a clue? The person getting killed by it is definately a tragedy, but that doesn't mean buckshot should be banned. Maybe we should ban swimming pools, cars, rifles, treestands, cheeseburgers, cigarettes, mean dogs, broadheads, cancer, and fried foods?

As someone said, barring a freak accident, buckshot didn't kill anybody. Human stupidity killed them.

For the record, I hunt with buckshot very rarely. Dog hunting is very common in my state, but I don't do it. There are too many pansy's on AT who want to BI**h and moan about anyone who does things differently than they do. To them I say mind your own business.

And you anti-buckshot, anti-"chaser" people, you haven't answered the question about whether or not you're against chasing rabbits, squirrels, and ***** with dogs???


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## Moon

*sc*

You seem to be the one without a clue. I've hunted in SC and heard about the crap that goes on down there in some areas........from the people that LIVE there. 

Your name calling response is typical of folks that can't see past their deer chasing noses.


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## joracer

Buckshot should not be BANNED reguardless of who gets killed....
what If it was # 2 shot.........That hunter If you want to call
him that is totaly responsible. Accidents are described as a (non-
intended outcome). I'd say that fits the bill........More people
get killed driving down the road that you can count..........
Should banning Autos or Driving be held to that same logic....
Think about what you wish for very seriously, you may just get it...

I heard on the Radio today some wanted to ban cussing...I agree
cussing is bad but would you really want it banned?????Tip of the
Iceberg If you ask me.......

A typical liberal stance to anything.....Is to blame something, anything
but the person responsible.....example..... serial #s for all bullets...
Oh lets not convict a man for murder, lets convict him for using the
wrong bullets.........

While were banning things why don't we ban everything invented including
the wheel, that way it would save alot of lives,..................................
Oh wait a minute there's those (rocks) they need to be banned too....
and sticks those have to go also.......

I'd much rather see a law that keeps Dumb people from breeding.....
and making more even more dumb people who'd even think of shooting 
at an unknown target while hunting.....However accidents do happen....

Dont blame the shot, the gun or the sport, put blame where it is due
to the person who did the shooting...Why don't this make sence to you?


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## BaxMaine

Moonkryket said:


> The typical 12 gauge shotgun loaded with 5 rounds eek of 00 buckshot (total of 60+ copper projectiles) that ricochet off trees, *down highways*, etc.


Buckshot is far from the problem, idiots who hunt are the problem. Those people aren't doing unsafe things because buckshot is in their gun, its because they are morons.


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## smartwick08

if u ban hunting with buck shot u are just startin the bans for all other types of hunting. cause once it starts it will not stop until there is no other form of hunting available. cause all of these anti hunters would rather spend billions of dollars each year to prevent the deer from breed through birth control methods or just sterilizing them then seeing anyone out there trying to kill the deer whether its from a 1000 yards with a rifle or 5 yards with a bow or even 0 yards with a spear


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## SCswitchback

Moonkryket said:


> You seem to be the one without a clue. I've hunted in SC and heard about the crap that goes on down there in some areas........from the people that *LIVE* there.
> 
> Your name calling response is typical of folks that can't see past their deer chasing noses.


I really don't care if you've hunted in SC or not. I *LIVE* in SC and see this type of hunting on a daily basis. People getting shot with buckshot is extremely rare down here. That's because most folks here are raised hunting and are very safe with guns. Sure there are a few bad apples in every bunch, but buckshot, itself, IS NOT the problem. It's the fact that it's in the hands of idiots many times. 

Tell me how I don't have a clue when the majority here is in agreement with me?

Your response is typical of a closet anti, or someone who doesn't know how to hunt with buckshot.


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## SCswitchback

joracer said:


> Buckshot should not be BANNED reguardless of who gets killed....
> what If it was # 2 shot.........That hunter If you want to call
> him that is totaly responsible. Accidents are described as a (non-
> intended outcome). I'd say that fits the bill........More people
> get killed driving down the road that you can count..........
> Should banning Autos or Driving be held to that same logic....
> Think about what you wish for very seriously, you may just get it...
> 
> I heard on the Radio today some wanted to ban cussing...I agree
> cussing is bad but would you really want it banned?????Tip of the
> Iceberg If you ask me.......
> 
> A typical liberal stance to anything.....Is to blame something, anything
> but the person responsible.....example..... serial #s for all bullets...
> Oh lets not convict a man for murder, lets convict him for using the
> wrong bullets.........
> 
> While were banning things why don't we ban everything invented including
> the wheel, that way it would save alot of lives,..................................
> Oh wait a minute there's those (rocks) they need to be banned too....
> and sticks those have to go also.......
> 
> I'd much rather see a law that keeps Dumb people from breeding.....
> and making more even more dumb people who'd even think of shooting
> at an unknown target while hunting.....However accidents do happen....
> 
> Dont blame the shot, the gun or the sport, put blame where it is due
> to the person who did the shooting...*Why don't this make sence to you*?



Because you can't teach common sense. It's called "common sense" because everyone is *supposed* to have it. And, I agree with everything you said.


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## Aim_Small

There is no need to ban buck shot or any other projectile. 

Negligent homicide is the same if it is cause by a weapon, a car or lawn dart. The degree of bad behavior, regardless of the device, should determine the sentence handed out by a judge on the individual when found guilty. 

Bad behavior of a few should not impact the majority.


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## target guy

I will try to answer some items here as best I can, although I know some will jump on it and some will call me names and a complete lunatic.

_Don't be offended by the loud mouths here that do nothing but hurl insults. It's a common thing for those that feel their toes are being stepped on and have no meaningful or logical response. I knew this would happen and I told a friend it would and sure enough..........................._ 

This is Archerytalk, many of the responses are the same as yours, passion for hunting and hunting rights are in everyone. Some may not be able to explain as well as others, and some are disrespectful, but all are hunters and want hunting to remain. It is a public forum so all walks of life will respond.

_I find it sickening that at a time like this when a person's life has been taken by an accident, some people let that go right by their feeble minds and jump into a rant about me being anti-deer chasing (which I am after 40 years of being involved in it)._

It is never good when person losses a life in an accident, but outlawing a certain type of weapon will probably not help future accidents. Accidents can only be avoided through education and people being aware of their surroundings.

_I see what the combination of shotguns/ buck shot and so called "hunters" (really they are shooters and standers) can lead to and yes, it ties back to dogs chasing deer. Any dim wit that can't see that................. _

How one person chooses to hunt should have no bearing this argument. So if a hunter cannot use dogs on deer then they should not be allowed to use dogs for raccoon, pheasants, rabbits etc. In England one of the most popular ways to hunt pheasant is beaters and standers that is also practiced here in the US and is a blast to hunt that way. To say one way is better or not is up to each hunter.

_And you people from NY and other states jumping in with your comments in defense of buck shot, you've obviously not heard how horrible ricocheting buckshot sounds when going by YOUR heads. I know. That's why I don't do it anymore and stay as far away from it as I can._

I hunted in Wisconsin most of my life, buckshot is not legal there but when opening day of gun season starts it is like a small war. And yes I have had high powered bullet fly by during that time also. Buckshot had nothing to do with it.

_To prove how inhumane buckshot is in the hands of typical deer "shooters" around here, Since 1963 when I first started bowhunting, I would estimate that about 25% of the deer I've taken with the bow had buckshot under their skin or embedded in their bodies. How's that for humane kills??? Also, the dozens of deer I've seen running across fields with one of their legs dangling like a limp dish clothe due to being almost blown off by buckshot................._

I have shot many deer with broad heads stuck in them from the previous year; does that mean we now outlaw bow hunting to go along with buckshot? I have also seen deer running on three legs from rifle shots, so now we have to outlaw rifle bullets? I understand the passion you are showing, but I can’t agree with the logic.

_With a rifle shooting one bullet, being aimed typically with the use of a scope, the shooter is aiming at a spot and the shooter is typically shooting from an elevated stand. With a shotgun, the shooter is pointing the gun in the direction of the deer, not knowing where any of the shot will hit the deer. It sounds like this.............pow.........pow...........pow
.............pow ..................pow. Yes, 5 shots, not knowing where any of the pellets are going. Defend it all you want by insulting others and it won't change my mind. _

In many areas yes they are shooting from an elevated stand, but in others they are not. In the marsh lands of Wisconsin most hunt from the ground because there are not many good tress to climb in. And I have heard the pow..pow..pow..pow..pow from rifles many times.

When hunters fight each other then only the antis win


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## joracer

I agree with what target guy said. Fine! ban Buck shot for deer hunting,
but not Buck shot in gereral.........Or make chase hunters take a class
that'd be OK, But you can't ban everything everytime something goes
wrong, we'd have so many laws on the book it'd take the whole forest
system of trees to make paper to write 'em down, and who knows how
much ink.......
Here in Va they banned carrying Buck and fine shot at the
same time while you were hunting.....I did'nt have a problem with it....
It did stop me from trying to take a deer and turkey on the same day
in the fall.......I only shot 1 deer with 00 buck shot, it wasn't good...
2 shots dead on in the chest, lungs and ribs laying on the ground, the 
deer jumped down a bank into a river, Well after almost drowning and 
a boat ride later my friend recovered it for me......last time I used it for
hunting, but I still have it, and I still buy it from time to time. We can't
run deer with dogs here in Va. but we have so many you could probably
open season year round for bow, and not dent 'em much.We've hit with
our cars over 10 in the last 3 years, 3 times requiring trips to the body
shop, probably over 50 close calls, that could kill someone if you aint
lucky........
Think about this before you ban certain ammo or hunting.....I guess
someone gets killed turkey hunting every year with # 2 or #4 shot..
and probably someone gets killed with some other type of hunting
accident every year, should those stop also....???? Ban tree stands????
Ban 4x4 trucks, Ban Ice fishing???ban all forms of boating???????
If you ban Ice fishing it won't effect me in the least, at least not now..
but the result from a such a ban, could affect someone else, I'm willing
to stand up to such a ban for them, so one day they'll stand up for me...
Make since?????


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## MTNHunt

AR_Headhunter said:


> The original person I posted this to didn't bother to answer the question so I'll pose this question to some of you others defending this practice.
> Well look at it this way. In dog hunting your combining, numerous people, animals moving at a fairly high speed, dogs chasing those animals, people shooting at those animals at close quarters to other hunters. It just looks like a recipie for disaster to me. Actually not only does it look like it, it is! I know I've been there & done it. Thank god no one was killed during my time doing it but on 3 different occasions people got shot that I knew while hunting like this. How many innocent people have to die before the dog runners decide enough is enough. *Does it have to come down to some innocent family being shot while driving down the road not bothering a soul? Does it have to be like a guy I know who was shot for reporting illegal dog running? Or how about the private property owners who have been assaulted because they objected to deer dogs being ran across their land? *
> 
> Don't get me wrong, my heart goes out to anyone killed in a accident. There comes a point though when a accident is not so much a accident as a sheer act of stupidity. I've been around dog runners enough to know that stupidity runs rampant in those crowds when it comes to a deer.
> 
> Now I'm not saying your stupid or anything like that but whats it going to take for you to stop blindly following the lead of dog organizations. I know your likely not a bad fella. I also hope one day you'll wake up & see the BS that goes on with dog runners in general before someone you love dies in a tragic accident that could have easily been avoided. *Your son looks mighty proud of his dad in the picture with the deer you posted but how would he look at "daddy" if you were killed or killed someone else in a preventable accident? How would you feel knowing that you helped support something that resulted in the death of a dear friends child? *Open your eyes MTN & think beyond the dog hunters blinders.
> 
> As a matter of fact why don't we all take a moment just to think about the impact that killing someone on accident would have not only on our family but the family of the person killed......


I love the fact that AR headhunter believes he can lie and make up post that he wants people to believe that the person in question didn't answer his question...............below is my response to his question, clear as day. 

Nothing is beyond his ability BUT to STATE THE true facts of the matter:angry:

Quote:
Originally Posted by AR_Headhunter 
MTNHunt
When are you going to answer my questions? 

Hunting (whether with dogs or not) is a dangerous sport and tradegy could happen at any time, unfortunatly. I will teach my son all the responsibilities that go along with hunting correctly and I will make dam sure, to teach him not to be bias to others who don't hunt in the same manner as he might, as long as it is legal and ethical. Period.

I get up everyday and look in the mirror and know that I have alot of responsibility. And, I don't have to log onto AT to remember what they are. 
__________________


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## MTNHunt

SCswitchback said:


> I really don't care if you've hunted in SC or not. I *LIVE* in SC and see this type of hunting on a daily basis. People getting shot with buckshot is extremely rare down here. That's because most folks here are raised hunting and are very safe with guns. Sure there are a few bad apples in every bunch, but buckshot, itself, IS NOT the problem. It's the fact that it's in the hands of idiots many times.
> 
> Tell me how I don't have a clue when the majority here is in agreement with me?
> 
> Your response is typical of a closet anti, or someone who doesn't know how to hunt with buckshot.


+2, I agree with you 100%:thumbs_up


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## MTNHunt

MTNHunt said:


> I love the fact that AR headhunter believes he can lie and make up post that he wants people to believe that the person in question didn't answer his question...............below is my response to his question, clear as day.
> 
> Nothing is beyond his ability BUT to STATE THE true facts of the matter:angry:
> 
> Quote:
> Originally Posted by AR_Headhunter
> MTNHunt
> When are you going to answer my questions?
> 
> Hunting (whether with dogs or not) is a dangerous sport and tradegy could happen at any time, unfortunatly. I will teach my son all the responsibilities that go along with hunting correctly and I will make dam sure, to teach him not to be bias to others who don't hunt in the same manner as he might, as long as it is legal and ethical. Period.
> 
> I get up everyday and look in the mirror and know that I have alot of responsibility. And, I don't have to log onto AT to remember what they are.
> __________________


Here is the link, post #192 I answered the question. 

http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1102095


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## wis_archer

No one here should have ever given the OP what he was looking for [attention].


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## sits in trees

i didn't read thru this whole thread but back to the original post, if we ban buckshot for being too dangerous should we not also ban rifle bullets because they can kill well after the intended target also?


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## Cajun83

granny said:


> deer drives are not safe & buckshot should be against the law in every state.


have you completely baked your noodle?

Some lady gets killed by buckshot and it is the buckshots fault?

Excuse me Mrs. Pelosi (or is it Mrs. McCarthy) but we do not need your suggestions on what to ban. 

Lets all group together and blame inanimate objects! Woo!


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