# Brace Hieght of 70's era Bear Super Kodiak???



## jj141979 (Mar 4, 2006)

Does anyone know the brace hieght for this bow??? I really love the bow!! I bought it for $50!! It was painted camo, but now it looks like it just left the Bear factory What a beutiful little bow!!! Right now the brace comes out to 9.5". Is this too much???? Seems a bit to much!!!! It shoots really quite and shockfree. I mean the smoothest and quitest recurve I have ever shot!!!


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

This is whre I differe from some.... if you have a quiet bow, have a smooth bow, have an accurate bow, with your 9.5" brace height, why again would you want to change it? :grin:

I twist to quiet as a routine with my bows. I lose some speed yes, but everything else seems to benefit... so my question is why mess with success... 

Aloha...  :beer:


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## AKRuss (Jan 10, 2003)

What's the AMO length of the bow?


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## trapperDave (Mar 12, 2005)

7 1/4 to 7 5/8 and tune from there. I believe they were a 60 inch bow. I hope you went to confessional or something....you stole that bow


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## George D. Stout (May 11, 2005)

It is indeed a 60" AMO recurve. Start around 7 1/2 and go to wherever it feels good and shoots great (for you). Fred Bear liked a high brace height...check out some of his old videos. When I'm shooting the Super Kodiak, I like mine right around 8 inches, give or take a milimeter 8^).


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## AKRuss (Jan 10, 2003)

I have a 64" Grayling Super K that I prefer braced at 8". Great bow. Not sure what year Bear Archery stopped making them. If they made long ones today, I'd treat myself to a new one.


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## jj141979 (Mar 4, 2006)

AKRuss said:


> What's the AMO length of the bow?


It is suppose to be AMO 60". I measure tip to tip and it comes out to be about 57" Is this right???? The string is already untwisted as much as it can be. Could the previous owner put to short of a string on it???


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## jj141979 (Mar 4, 2006)

If the string is a little to short, will it hurt the bow????


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

not if it is a little short, but perormance will not be near optimal. If it is too short I'm told that you can damage the tips, though I don't know how, just passing on iformation I've heard over the years.

Aloha...  :beer:


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## Dave2 (Jan 24, 2003)

I have a Kodiak Hunter 60" AMO, it is 7" brace height


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## AKRuss (Jan 10, 2003)

Recurve strings are generally about 4" shorter than the AMO bow length, so a 60" AMO bow would have a string that actually measures about 56" under tension. The correct length string is one that gives you the proper brace height. As George previously stated, Bear bows seem to do better with higher brace heights. On a 60" Super K, I'd start at 7 3/4" and maybe try it a bit highter. What works for you is, of course, the best. I found the latching T/D Bear recurves want 8" before they quiet down, even the 60" versions. 

In any event, 9 1/2" is way to high a brace height and I'd get another string. You can certainly shoot the high brace and it won't hurt the bow. You may find that "factory" strings are made a bit short and I don't know why that is. I prefer strings that are slightly long so I can twist them a little to get my desired brace height. If you can't find a satisfactory string locally, I'd try a custom string maker to get the proper fit. Often you can tell them what bow you have, what brace height you want and what arrow nock you'll be using and get the perfect fit. Well worth the cost.


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

Why is 9 1/2" "WAY" too high if I might ask?

Aloha... Tom  :beer:


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## AKRuss (Jan 10, 2003)

Hey Tom, 9 1/2" is much higher than factory recommended height, although frankly I don't have that information handy. There's nothing really wrong with shooting a high (or low) brace height just that that bow will likely feel better and shoot better at a normal brace. The feel better part is that generally bows start "stacking" at some given draw length, that is to say they begin to increase the poundage per inch of draw faster than they do during the normal draw cycle so a bow with a very high brace will stack sooner than one with a normal brace. The performance part is that a very high brace cuts down on the force cycle of the bow or how long the string will be pushing the arrow, generally the longer the better. Although Bear bows are not known to be speed demons but then you really don't want to inhibit what they have, LOL. The flip side of this is a really low brace may feel better (lighter) but it's generally because you're not really reaching the full draw weight of the bow. Also a low brace will often make a bow noisey and creat or enhance wrist slap. Just rules of thumb and individual results may vary ... 

On string length, measurements are taken under tension (I believe 100# is the standard but I may be wrong) with the loops over a 1/4" round, I believe. The old AMO standards covered this but they are now in the newer ASTM standards that cost money to look at, so I haven't. Can a more current string maker comment on this? I just measure string length while on the bow and braced.


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

Hi Russ.... 

Actually there are quite a few bows with brace heights at 9". Wing's are 9, many of the Martins string over 8 1/2", Hoyt bows have 9 1/2" with their long risers as standard as well. I get confused at this suggestion that brace heights need to be at 7" or so as standard when a couple of my bows shoot their best, are at their quietest at higher, rather than lower, brace heights.

Aloha... Tom  :beer:


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## AKRuss (Jan 10, 2003)

Tom, I was talking hunting recurves, I guess. I have a few bows that have high factory recommended brace heights. Forinstance, I have a set of Hoyt G3 limbs on a Best Zenit barebow riser that need about 9 1/2" to be happy. As you suggested, my Wing PI and PII prefer at least 9" too. Of course they're long 68 and 69" target recurves. My Bear hunting recurves seem to like 7 3/4 to 8". Black Widow recurves perform better at higher brace heights too. I think a lot of people overbow themselves with hunting rigs that are difficult to handle and then attempt to bleed off some weight by using a low brace height. Black Widow recurves get real noisey with a low brace as do the latching Bear T/Ds. Just my humble opinion(s) ...


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

Hi Russ,

I don't know the particular differences between target bows and hunting bows to comment on those brace heights or differences. I'm not sure I understand the idea of twisting down brace height to reduce the ultimate draw weight either. I would have assumed that the draw weight would be the same from wherever it was drawn, but then I'm really a neophyte into the intracasies of bows and behavior.

All I know, and I don't really measure my brace heights, but on my recurves and longbow recurves they are all above my typical fist plus thumb distance which for me would be about 7 maybe 7 1/2". I twist up to where my bow shoot smoothly and accurately without noise then retye my nocks.

Aloha....  :beer:


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## Viper1 (Aug 21, 2003)

Tom -

For the purposes of this discussion, target recurves are generally longer than hunting recurves. The bows you mentioned, typical of the offerings in the 70's, came in both hunting and target flavors, in a lot of cases, the only difference was the length! 

Therefore, an 8" brace height on a 60" bow may translate into a 9.5" brace height on a 70" bow. If you look at current issue target bows, you'll see as overall (AMO) length increases so does the recommended brace height. 
The "recommended brace height" for a given bow is based on a number of design and "dynamic" factors. The most important design factor is the amount of reflex or deflex in the riser and limbs, typically the more deflex in the riser the higher the brace height (that explains the rediculously high brace heights on SOME of the Red Wing hunters). The dynamic part has to do with the choice of arrow spine and we cover that in the last discussion. A guy who actually tunes his bow to shoot a stiffer than needed arrow will end up with a higher than expected brace height, to a certain degree.

As AK said, then there are the trade offs. The higher the brace height the less speed is produced due to the shortened power stroke, but some bows, like the old wood target bows becames more forgiving as the brace height was increased. The indoor spot guys liked that because over 20 yds, speed isn't a factor. The reason for the increased forgiveness is the same as the change in spine requirements, difference in degree of offset when the arrow disengages. 

Judging by what you described, you're half way there. Whether you want to go further is your call, but the next step would be formal tuning, aka bareshafting. That will tell you the real required brace height for YOU arrow and YOUR style of shooting. Just remember, that kind of tuning tests the archer as well as the rig!

Viper1 out.


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## rattus58 (Jul 9, 2007)

Viper1 said:


> Tom -
> 
> Judging by what you described, you're half way there. Whether you want to go further is your call, but the next step would be formal tuning, aka bareshafting. That will tell you the real required brace height for YOUR arrow and YOUR style of shooting. Just remember, that kind of tuning tests the archer as well as the rig! Viper1 out.


Ain't I a little old fer testing? :grin:

Aloha...  :beer:


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## jj141979 (Mar 4, 2006)

Alright I just got back from my local traditional archery shop. Great man, it was aparrent to him right away the string was too short!!! He measured it and determined it needed a 58" string not a 56", which was on it. Now the brace hieght is 7.5 inches and the bow shoots faster and a little quieter!!! It does slap my rist now but an arm gaurd will take care of that!! Thanks to all those who chimed it


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