# Weird anchor point or normal?



## Bowgren2

If you are working with a coach at your club either trust him or find someone that you do, and follow their advice. If you draw length is 30" and the bow is 28", what you have stated makes sense. A proper anchor that is consistent for every shot is very important to accuracy. Corner of the mouth or chin bone are very common anchor points.


----------



## Moebow

I find nearly all you are describing very confusing. I would suggest that Bowgren2"s recommendation to stick with the coach or find one you can connect with is the best idea. As a beginner, you MAY be trying to accomplish too much too fast.

In one place you mention the under the jaw anchor associated with a sight shooter, in another area you mention cupping the jaw with the "C" of the hand and finger to the corner of the mouth. The first is the target with sights anchor, the second is the side of face anchor usually associated with bare bow techniques. So as I say, I'm confused.

IF under the jaw, then the index finger lays under the jaw bone, the thumb lays on the throat, and little finger on the collar bone. Then, the string will hit and center on the nose and the corner of the chin.

IF side of face, then the "C" can cup the back of the jaw with the thumb UNDER the jaw bone, index finger knuckle is under the cheek bone and a finger (index OR middle) will be on or near the corner of the mouth. String will be in the center of the pupil of the eye and NOT on the nose.

SEE?? very confusing and we here really need to SEE. BUT!!! still better to work with a coach in person, since we CAN"T see.

It also SOUNDS like you are arbitrarily choosing an "anchor" point. BUT, I think your facial references are a result of getting the bones lined up and accepting your string hand location based on that not the other way around.

Arne


----------



## nuts&bolts

tharkun said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I started archery a few weeks back. I do Recurve with a sight and tab and shoot split finger. I have a 66" bow at 25# (at 28" but my draw length is more like 30") and I shoot 32" arrows. I have glasses and I am a right handed shooter with a right dominant eye. I can place the arrows in the gold pretty consistently at 10 meters depending on what I do. However I'm still trying to find the proper anchor and other things.
> 
> So the coach at our club (who is not there every time I can go and we wont meet for a few weeks now which is why i am turning to you here) told me to put the string on my nose. So far so good. My problem is that I can't really do that if I try to anchor under the chin like its shown everywhere. I have to pull the string back further to get the string to my nose without tilting the head forward. It seems to me that my arms feel less stress when I anchor further back. Anchors that are more forward like under chin make me hold the weight with my arm muscles I think. I can't seem to push down my back shoulder when I try to anchor that far forward. Sidenote: I can't pull my right arm back as far as I can my left arm. E.g. if I lie straight on my back, and angle my arms at 90 degrees at the elbow then try to put my hands on the ground towards the head not the feet then I can do that with my left hand but not with my right hand.
> 
> As you can see I am also trying to get proper back tension, which I seem to only be able to get if I pull the string back further than under the chin as well.
> 
> The anchor point that naturally seems to work for me is when I sort of cup my jaw with the "crease" of my string hand (between the thumb and pointer). I can put the string on my nose easily in this case. Putting a finger in the corner of the mouth feels weird and inconsistent. My arms seem to feel less stress I.e. I don't have the feeling that I am only pulling with my arm if I do this even though this will probably make me pull more like 30# instead of the rated 25. Is that a normal/good anchor? Am I maybe doing anything else wrong that makes me have to do this?


25# limbs at 30 inches of draw length, will have roughly 29 pounds on the fingers.
Center of chin anchor, for Olympic recurve shooters, using a sight.










Index finger UNDER the chin works for Olympic recurve shooters, cuz the UNDER the chin anchor gives you more distance on the sight.










recurve barebow anchor. This is the top of index finger jammed into the cheek bone. Arrow nock is tight to the side of the nose, so the aiming eyeball can line up over the top of the arrow tube, just like pointing a rifle barrel. This is a HIGH anchor. See how the string is actually behind the nose.










I call this the PICK YOUR NOSE anchor, cuz the top of the nock is just under the nostril. You could call this a medium high anchor, not jammed up under the cheekbone, but a little below the cheekbone. Just touch the nock to the side of your nose. Barebow shooters do this, and same idea, line up the aiming eyeball, over the top of the arrow tube, and point the arrow like a rifle barrel.










Tip of index finger to corner of mouth, is a common anchor for beginning recurve folks.


----------



## tharkun

Thanks, that's very helpful.

To me this is not confusing as I don't equate different anchors with a particular style. I merely state what I've tried and found. I understand how that can confuse you guys who associate these with a particular style. That was not my intention 

The coach is nice and all but also a bit set in his ways e.g. wouldn't discuss different stances and will only teach if using Olympic recurve with a sight no barebow etc.

And you are right I wasn't choosing a particular anchor. The coach just said "put the string on your nose". Nothing else. So then I looked at where my hand went naturally if I do that trying to keep the head straight and all and the " C" seems to kind of be cupping that back corner of the jaw where it turns upwards. When I talked to some other guy to help with putting on a nock onto a new string he was like "you MUST put your hand under the chin to anchor" and there was no discussion to be had there. So I hope you see how I seek the help of internet strangers now  the anchor I described is where I can get the string on my nose and put my hand into a pretty consistent place while also not feeling too much stress in the arm muscles. That's why I tried keeping that not because I shoot barebow or sight (I use a sight).

I have since also experimented with different drawing techniques and drawing to my chest instead of straight back seems to work best for my arm muscles (kind of like Valabont does). Drawing high works too but I am afraid I'd be getting into illegal draws easily there (yes I've been watching and reading on archery a lot lately . I will try and see if the anchor you mentioned as the one associated with a sight works better if I draw like that. So far I still used the "C".

I am wondering though how I would get me little finger onto the collar bone. I just tried and I have to overextend my hand until it hurts to accomplish that. Am I just doing it wrong?

Thanks Arne!


----------



## nuts&bolts

Rotational Draw. By Coach Arne Moe. Give this a whirl. tharkun. Time to find a coach who will work with you, and explain how and why. The folks you are "working" with, are not very impressive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6c8_-96h6BY


----------



## nuts&bolts

Another one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7N3gJePX4I


----------



## tharkun

Thanks. Looking at Arne there in those videos he draws straight back maybe sliiightly low to come up to the anchor. If I try that I can do it but I feel the muscles at the back of my arm doing the work when I'm fully extended. When I hold the bow straight at the target but then pull to my chest, so way down vs. Arne there (like Valladont youtub mEcrpdWf7oI cant post links) then I don't feel it at the back of my arm and I think I am using the back muscles.

Its great to see all those pictures of anchors. The thing is, if I put my hand/fingers in that position the string is quite far away from my nose and I have to move my head forward to get it on the string while it naturally squishes my nose when drawing to the C. I've noticed that I seem to not completely cup with the C as that squishes the nose a lot or the string can also push past my nose. I think I stop a little short of a full cup as soon as the string is on the nose. Again not saying that's what I want to do because of a particular reason or something just observation of what happens if I do certain things.

Could the string not hitting the nose with other anchors simply be because I have a 66" bow vs another size? Does it depend on brace height too? Could it be posture I.e. I'm leaning back maybe (I know not easy without a picture or video but just asking if that was a possibility)? I don't feel comfortable posting those on the great wide internet so please bear with me.


----------



## Moebow

REALLY hard to help without seeing what you are doing!!! It STILL sounds like you are mixing and matching different anchor techniques. Side of face has different requirements and touch points than the target style under the jaw. You NEVER!!!!!! move your head to the string!!! You BRING the string to your STILL and UNMOVING head.

Arne


----------



## tharkun

Thanks Arne, that's what I read too so that's why I wanted to pull further back instead of moving the head to the string. I'll see if I can try some more with the under jaw later and see if I can find a way that I can get the string on the nose with that. Can't be that I'm the only guy in the world that can't do it eh? 

I appreciate all the help knowing its very hard without pictures. If this forum can send pictures in PM I might be OK doing that at some point in the future if the picture doesn't make it anywhere outside of the PM.


----------



## Moebow

You are welcome to email me directly IF you want. [email protected]

Arne


----------



## tharkun

Thanks Arne. I may come back to that offer. Been a bit busy lately but I have found some time to try things in the garage.

One thing I did figure out while reading is that some of my issues might be from having glasses. I always wondered why some of the guys I see on pictures didn't turn their head all the way. I have to turn it all the way to see and even then I have to anchor just right to be able to see properly through my glasses. Still experimenting 

I have also found that some issues came from the tab. I've made my own tab now from a piece of leather that I trimmed just right. Its no longer interfering with the way I hold the string (it started hurting with the cheap tab I had and I caught myself 'compensating' for it).

One thing I do have to figure out still is an anchor where I have the string on the nose, can see the sight and have a specific bone on bone anchor without having the string go across my cheek as I'm worried that will make the string go in different directions each time. I guess I might be able to anchor like on the pictures above if I had a 70" instead of a 66" bow.


----------



## tharkun

Well good news and bad news I guess. Doing a lot of archery seems to help with general agility and posture  I have been filming myself a bit and I think anchor wise it's not too bad now. My fingers aren't all the way at the front like on the pictures above but I would say close to how Brady Ellison looks on this picture archerycoach.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/brady-e-at-anchor.jpg?w=300&h=202 just for where the fingers end vs the chin.

Now this may be bad to do (I feel it is given what I read about relaxing the hand and arm muscles) but I have found that I can anchor relatively consistently when I use the thumb to feel the end of the jaw bone. I have had my most consistent shots with that. However my arms are still hurting. I watched and rewatched the rotational draw videos and tried to find other videos about it with not much success and I can't seem to get it done.

Yesterday I was trying it out just with my Theraband and sometimes I think I was feeling how a muscle on my back would engage at some point in the pull. I couldn't get that done consistently though. Today I tried with the bow and I'm not sure if I do it right at all. I try to stretch my bow arm out as if at anchor but I have the arrow pointing left because I hold my string arm out to the right. In that position there is either quite a bit of pull involved already or I have to reach forward quite a bit with my string arm and shoulder. I think that contorts my upper body way too much to do things right however. I can also feel that I am using my arm muscles (because they hurt when they engage ) when pulling still. I also have the feeling that I can pull the Theraband much further than the bowstring and thus engage the back muscles better. Is that possible? I say that because with the band I don't have to worry about being able to see through a sight or pulling too far back on the face and arrow wise.


----------



## Moebow

Good news is always "good." Still need to see video to help much more. Your listed location of "here" doesn't help with trying to help you find a coach but you can look at the coach locator on the USA Archery website for coaches in your area.

You seem to be still trying to draw to specific locations you have decided are your facial references rather than letting your draw determine the location. The anchor points (facial references) are a RESULT of the draw, NOT a target for the draw.

Arne


----------



## tharkun

Thanks everyone so far. Especially the insistence on local coaching. I've talked to the coach about trying different things and that certain things are also just taught differently depending on where you are and I think he has opened up more to discussing various things and the pros and cons vs just insisting I do exactly as he says without any explanations. 

I use an open stance now which helps me with doing the rotational draw as shown in Arne's videos. My arms no longer hurt either.

I've found an anchor that I can be consistent with and that makes my draw length comfortable I.e. it feels right and I don't have a chicken wing sticking out which was the case with some of the suggested anchors nor do I get string slap all the time any more. For now I'll keep working on making that more consistent and having my coach point out where I need to improve. 

Thanks everyone for all the great advice (hint USA archery won't help me where I am


----------

