# What did you do today???



## ride394

Thought it would be interesting to have a spot where people could post what they are working on everyday or week. Got this idea reading where people were talking about wanting to hear what works for them to fix an issue rather than a cookie cutter answer. 

This could be a running log of sorts. And a place where maybe people can read what your doing and possibly copy or modify what you're working on to help their training. 

I'll start. 

This week I setup my Supra from 3D to indoors (yes, i know, I'm late). The past 2 days have been spent really dialing in my DL and form and working on shot execution. Shot about 100 arrows each day blank bail and blind bail to work on my execution. Trying to work on bleeding out some extra tension in my release hand. 

What are you guys currently doing?


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## Lazarus

Good topic. 

Today, So far, I have shot 30 arrows with little intent but to stretch things out since I haven't shot in three days. That's it. 

Then, opened a "shooting" book written by a very good friend of mine because I've committed to re-reading it, again, in the next day or so. I found a portion in the book that somewhat explains the "relaxing" part of my shot process because I was having a hard time explaining it over on another topic. I intend to post a pic of the paragraph or two shortly on the topic. 

The rest of the day will be spent talking about or researching archery. Then shoot another 30 arrows or so before bed. 

On paper, pretty boring really. But it's what I do. Most days.


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## SonnyThomas

I'm being nice, staying inside...Shotgun deer season is in for 4 days and the wife is hunting.

Yesterday I was walking to my target bales and not 30 feet from the house were deer tracks. Our house sits in the middle south end of our 31 acres. I've taken 35 plus deer with a bow since 2000, dozen with a shotgun and 5 with a pistol. The wife has taken near a dozen with her shotguns. Productive little 31 acres.


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## cbrunson

Great idea. It will be cool if it can be followed. Of course I'm skeptical, but I'm willin to give it a shot. I think it would be beneficial to post results to your own issues as well. It would be super-great, if you could keep out the, "That won't work, do this", comments. 

Here's my current issue:

The 7th end. Sometimes the 8th. Last night I went into the 7th end -2. Both were no more than 1/16" out of the baby X. The first arrow of the 7th end barely busted the ten line. I knew it wasn't there, but started the shot anyway. (BAD BAD BAD) The next arrow went out to pasture between the 9 and 10 rings because I didn't make myself shake off the previous shot and settle back in. 

I settled back in after that miss and shot clean the remaining ends. I know It’s game pressure messing with my head. I know it’s not going away without learning to power through it. I am not the guy that can convince myself that I need to forget about the game. It’s just not happening. I prefer to practice like it counts, and my competition scores closely match my practice scores. 

What I am going to try to work on for the next couple weeks, is to slow down and go back to basics with conquering each shot under pressure. It will involve a lot more let downs, even when I know it’s close enough to still be an X.


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## ride394

cbrunson said:


> Great idea. It will be cool if it can be followed. Of course I'm skeptical, but I'm willin to give it a shot. I think it would be beneficial to post results to your own issuesas well. It would be super-great, if you could keep out the, "That won't work, do this", comments.
> 
> Here's my current issue:
> 
> The 7th end. Sometimes the 8th. Last night I went into the 7th end -2. Both were no more than 1/16" out of the baby X. The first arrow of the 7th end barely busted the ten line. I knew it wasn't there, but started the shot anyway. (BAD BAD BAD) The next arrow went out to pasture between the 9 and 10 rings because I didn't make myself shake off the previous shot and settle back in. I settled back in after that miss and shot clean the remaining ends. I know It’s game pressure messing with my head. I know it’s not going away without learning to power through it. I am not the guy that can convince myself that I need to forget about the game. It’s just not happening. I prefer to practice like it counts, and my tournament scores closely match my practice scores. What I am going to try to work on for the next couple weeks, is to slow down and go back to basics with conquering each shot under pressure. It will involve a lot more let downs, even when I know it’s close enough to still be an X.


That's what I'm hoping this thread turns into. I will definitely update as I progress. I know what needs to happen with my release hand, just need to figure out how to do it.


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## cbrunson

ride394 said:


> That's what I'm hoping this thread turns into. I will definitely update as I progress. I know what needs to happen with my release hand, just need to figure out how to do it.


I hear ya. Me and one of the guys I shoot with had a related conversation last night.


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## Rick!

Worked on 10yd drills. My focus is on a perfectly repeatable full draw position.

With all the mention of soft hands and hard hands I played with drawing with relaxed hands. Draw cycle is smoothed out with relaxed hands with the side effect of blowing it out the top. Keeping some tension in the back of my draw hand sends it down the middle with a longer shot break time and more energy used. Finding the right balance along with understanding why shots end up 1-2 shafts high is paramount for me.


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## jpotter

Just recently discovered this site. Coming from hunting,3d, target has to me seems like, a lot of money spent for reasonable results. A common demonator seems like the shot/release is the main technique to work on, universal maintenance, for me still researching release sequence and repeatablility is a constant journey for me. Have been shooting the same new to me ringer release(4 months) and finally gotten to the point that I have different firing engines to explore. So much fun!


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## Deputy Archer

Working on release execution, been working on shooting a hinge for the last 8 months. Some days are awesome others I can't seem to relax my release hand and will just pull till I am blue in the face and have to let down. 

Today was productive maybe 80 arrows from 30 yards on the 15 to 30 field face. Hand full of misses, but I was able to identify what went wrong with the shot. Also was getting my honey 3 speed set, just got it back from carter, all new guts for 27$ , what a deal.


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## EPLC

I frustrated myself on the blank/blind bale for about an hour this morning. I'm working on developing a "one shot" execution but can't seem to find the sweet spot. With my eyes open I can't seem to get the same feel as with them closed and visa versa. I think this may be a confidence issue. I've also never really had a specific "one shot". While my basic form is always close, my actual execution varies, sometimes from shot to shot. As a result, sometimes I shoot very well and sometimes I don't. The venue doesn't seem to matter, nor does it seem to matter if it is competition or practice. I'd love to blame my age but the truth is that this demon has always been with me.


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## Atascaderobow

Deputy Archer said:


> Working on release execution, been working on shooting a hinge for the last 8 months. Some days are awesome others I can't seem to relax my release hand and will just pull till I am blue in the face and have to let down.


I like the "pull till I am blue in the face" comment. Sounds like exactly what I am going thru. Many, many blank bale shots and working on forcing myself to let down. Letting down when required is probably my biggest hurtle. But, I am slowly getting over the "Letting down is a sign of weakness mentality" I seem to have started out with.


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## ride394

What I found when I was pulling til I was blue in the face was that I was pulling with my arm and not my back. If your're pulling properly with your back your elbow will rotate around and the release will fire (with a hinge), unless you're death gripping the release with your index finger and no pressure on the middle and ring fingers.


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## ILOVE3D

Deputy Archer said:


> Working on release execution, been working on shooting a hinge for the last 8 months. Some days are awesome others I can't seem to relax my release hand and will just pull till I am blue in the face and have to let down.
> 
> This was me until I learned how or what degree of hot/cold to set up the release so it went off without undue trouble. For a while I thought I was going to tear my rotator cuff trying to get that dang thing to go off. I finally saw a video of how Griv sets up his hinge releases with the click. Important thing here is that it is set up to click just as you come to full draw and anchor in. Long story short I love shooting my hinge now with the click and never have to pull all that hard anymore.


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## ILOVE3D

Sorry, forgot to post about today. I am fighting a sinus infection with terrible allergies so practice is out of the question. Headache, stuffy nose, coughing so practice shots would not be the best therefore no need to practice bad shots, I do enough of those already.


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## Deputy Archer

Thanks for all the advice. I am figuring it out, really enjoy shooting the hinge. The good shots feel so good. Then there are those days where I struggle. Had definitely taught me to let down when the shot is deteriorating. 

Got the speed on the honey 3 dialed in. I feel like I am kind of cheating the back tension purpose if I set the speed to hot.


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## jbeasleyshoot

I changed anchor points about a week ago and finally felt confident enough to go shoot a 300 rd and did ok. I had been anchoring behind my ear but seemed to always get a lot of right and lefts. I now hit my jaw bone. Just a lot more practice and getting comfortable with a new engine. After the 300 rd I know im going to have to speed up my hinge because as I get tired it seems like im pulling till I run out of air then let down. practice, practice practice but if the first round is any indication the new anchor took care of some right and lefts.


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## bseltzer

Today? Seriously? I spent a good part of the day hammering the FedEx tracking site, watching as my new-to-me Hoyt Pro Comp elite XL slowly matriculated through all the FX centers between Abilene, TX and here. When I wasn't face down in my laptop, I was working the BowTrainer as part of my program to reinforce my shooting platform. What else? Hmm, spent some time trying to develop a firing sequence using my old bow and the new Stan MoreX hinge release that I can reproduce consistently. After more than a few bug eyed grunting, efforts to get the bloody thing to go off during which I discovered every possible way to "punch" a back-tension release , I think I now understand what you guys have been saying about relaxing the release hand while taking up the slack that creates with back tension. The motion is so subtle I had to set the release really slow to exaggerate the motion enough to recognize clear what I was doing. Doing that made all the difference between understanding how this hinge release works amd "pulling 'til I'm blue in the face". It feels like letting the tension out of my drawing forearm while simultaneously building tension between my shoulder blades. Or at least that the best description I can give for what sets the release off reliably in a way that just feels right. There's a lot more to be sorted out, but I feel like this is a good thing.

Other that that, I've been watching the rain, the glorious rain coming down here in NorCal where it's been so dry for so long.


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## cbrunson

cbrunson said:


> Here's my current issue:
> 
> The 7th end. Sometimes the 8th. Last night I went into the 7th end -2. Both were no more than 1/16" out of the baby X. The first arrow of the 7th end barely busted the ten line. I knew it wasn't there, but started the shot anyway. (BAD BAD BAD) The next arrow went out to pasture between the 9 and 10 rings because I didn't make myself shake off the previous shot and settle back in.
> 
> I settled back in after that miss and shot clean the remaining ends. I know It’s game pressure messing with my head. I know it’s not going away without learning to power through it. I am not the guy that can convince myself that I need to forget about the game. It’s just not happening. I prefer to practice like it counts, and my competition scores closely match my practice scores.
> 
> What I am going to try to work on for the next couple weeks, is to slow down and go back to basics with conquering each shot under pressure. It will involve a lot more let downs, even when I know it’s close enough to still be an X.


Last night was unsuccessful. 5-spot leauge night so I had to switch over to the blue. I was a little rattled early do to an unrelated incident, but I powered through to shoot clean for the first five ends. I had a few line cutters on the X-ring, but most were inside. Then on the 6th end number two spot, I pushed up from a low settled dot and didnt wait for it to settle again, pushing it out the top of the X about 1/8". I did the same thing the next end on one spot, then cut one loose low for the third miss the following end. The 9th - 12 the ends I shot clean. I finished with 300-57X with 47 I/O. I need to conquer that mid-game brain fart thing. I don't have any more competitive shoots for about seven days, so I'm going to really try to focus on the middle of the game.


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## Ned250

I love this idea for a thread :thumbs_up

*cbrunson *- Its interesting that you have the mid-shoot hang-ups. Maybe we can help each other as I'm struggling with the beginning/end. It's the middle where I'm strongest.

I haven't shot in a few days (shooting 2x week right now), but will be getting more into daily training starting next week. I'm running a marathon tomorrow - hoping to qualify for the Boston marathon. After that, all eyes are on indoors and indoors only.


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## Mahly

A little late, but from Sunday
Short range drills 8 yards
Trying out Sugru mod, adjusted side stab up, sped up release (just for position, still using same click)
Shot much better....but I still have to learn to make the call to let down sooner....the miss on the 2nd target, I KNEW was not right, and I decided to let down....JUST as I decided that, it fired ruining the target LOL!

Before 11/15(7 yards 30 arrows)










After 11/29 (8 yards 30 arrows)


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## cbrunson

Ned250 said:


> I love this idea for a thread :thumbs_up
> 
> *cbrunson *- Its interesting that you have the mid-shoot hang-ups. Maybe we can help each other as I'm struggling with the beginning/end. It's the middle where I'm strongest.
> 
> I haven't shot in a few days (shooting 2x week right now), but will be getting more into daily training starting next week. I'm running a marathon tomorrow - hoping to qualify for the Boston marathon. After that, all eyes are on indoors and indoors only.


I'm thinking it's all a brain thing for me. Possibly that I am relaxing too much and letting laziness habits creep in because the game is going good. Then after a miss, I go back to focussing hard and shoot well. I tend to shoot better with the pressure on. Or, I am sub-consciously telling myself I need to miss one, so I can relax the rest of the game. Either way, I need to get my head right, knowing I usually struggle through those shots.

Even when I shoot a 300 (Vegas), my missed Xs are usually concentated in the 5th to eighth ends. If I can get to the ninth end clean, I know I'll get that 29-30x game. Tiny battles, right? 

I'm going to pay close attention to what I'm thinking about while I'm shooting over the next week.


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## Rick!

Three arrows into a Block at thirty yards and went hunting.


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## Padgett

I have had a layoff from shooting for almost 3 weeks so I went in last night and got in a good 50 or so shots and shot better than I expected, I did have a couple misses but I had a good mental approach to the night and didn't let it bother me. After those 50 shots I twisted my bow string and reduced my draw length over a quarter inch, it had stretched over the past few months and I had been needing to fix it. I did feel much better after shortening.


Tonight I am going to continue getting in some volume shooting because I just don't feel right yet, I hate coming off of peeking and having awesome shooting and then having a multi week break because I loose that edge that I had where my feel is just spot on and I can just relax and bang x's.


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## Carbofastdirect

Tonight I sat on the sofa in pain with a trapped nerve in my left shoulder with shooting pains up my neck, old injury not archery related but time to get it sorted!! Haven't shot my bow in 2 weeks, not the ideal practice for vegas!!


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## EPLC

Today RI-Mike and I took a ride up to X-Spot Archery in North Attleboro, MA and shot for about an hour. While I didn't shoot for score I was very pleased with my shooting today. I've opened my stance from neutral and switched to a ST-360 release. Mush improved hold and arrow placement.


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## ride394

Last night I was stuck at the in-laws so I didn't get to shoot and tonight I had my son so we were doing the whole Christmas tree thing, but I did sneak in one shot when I went to shut the garage. I'll take it...


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## Deputy Archer

Not got a couple dozen arrows down range today. It takes me a couple dozen to warm up and get my left right dialed. Any one else have that issue, left and right vary by 1-3 inches each time you shoot? I group great just need to give and take some clicks each new day, some days no change.


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## SonnyThomas

Well, if I ain't doing archery I'm thinking archery. Wife still hunting so I thinking archery. Thinking about draw length; different cams, twist string, d-loop, longer draw mods. Thought about shooting in garage, but I don't want to shoot 7 yards or 8 or 9 or 10 yards (door open).

Break in the action  My ATV is fixed. Blown side case gasket, but no big deal other than the engine has to be pulled. Scary time, cracked carburetor bowl. It's been this way, but pulling the engine got it to leaking. You don't buy bowls separate from the main body of the carburetor. $420.00! Can't weld, can't seal with J&B weld, mechanic says nothing works when gas is present. Call Wiz Kid, my brother. "I got just what you need." Ultra Bond. Nobody has it and asks, what is it. NAPA doesn't have a clue. Two packs of it brought in from Missouri, $42.00. Tad bit of grinding to get depth in crack. Apply Ultra Bond. Two days. Mechanic take ATV out for a test hop. I tell him not to baby it. "Man, your ATV screams." No leaks, completely dry. The stuff works! Mechanic and Kaw Dealer go nuts! Buys the second pack and orders more. Whew! Pick up Monday after shotgun season.

Back to thinking about archery. Tim Gillingham is always good for something. Facebook, (gloom). On Dial Up you get to hating Facebook. Tim is playing with d-loops, 1/16" at a time. From picture, he leaves no stone unturned.

You have to follow Tim, so not all is here, but a good start of understanding. 
Tim; Take off d-loop and measure and make different lengths until you find what fits you the best. The release length will fit into the equation. You may have to raise or lower your peep slightly, but when you find perfect then use a draw board to duplicate it on every bow you have.
Well, I read this from John Dudley's articles years back - so Tim was memory shaker. I've done this with my prior bows with d-loops, shortened some, stretched others, made other when too short. 

450/44X says Tim is on track. Doesn't look it, but I ain't questioning the big guy.


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## field14

SonnyThomas said:


> Well, if I ain't doing archery I'm thinking archery. Wife still hunting so I thinking archery. Thinking about draw length; different cams, twist string, d-loop, longer draw mods. Thought about shooting in garage, but I don't want to shoot 7 yards or 8 or 9 or 10 yards (door open).
> 
> Break in the action  My ATV is fixed. Blown side case gasket, but no big deal other than the engine has to be pulled. Scary time, cracked carburetor bowl. It's been this way, but pulling the engine got it to leaking. You don't buy bowls separate from the main body of the carburetor. $420.00! Can't weld, can't seal with J&B weld, mechanic says nothing works when gas is present. Call Wiz Kid, my brother. "I got just what you need." Ultra Bond. Nobody has it and asks, what is it. NAPA doesn't have a clue. Two packs of it brought in from Missouri, $42.00. Tad bit of grinding to get depth in crack. Apply Ultra Bond. Two days. Mechanic take ATV out for a test hop. I tell him not to baby it. "Man, your ATV screams." No leaks, completely dry. The stuff works! Mechanic and Kaw Dealer go nuts! Buys the second pack and orders more. Whew! Pick up Monday after shotgun season.
> 
> Back to thinking about archery. Tim Gillingham is always good for something. Facebook, (gloom). On Dial Up you get to hating Facebook. Tim is playing with d-loops, 1/16" at a time. From picture, he leaves no stone unturned.
> 
> You have to follow Tim, so not all is here, but a good start of understanding.
> Tim; Take off d-loop and measure and make different lengths until you find what fits you the best. The release length will fit into the equation. You may have to raise or lower your peep slightly, but when you find perfect then use a draw board to duplicate it on every bow you have.
> Well, I read this from John Dudley's articles years back - so Tim was memory shaker. I've done this with my prior bows with d-loops, shortened some, stretched others, made other when too short.
> 
> 450/44X says Tim is on track. Doesn't look it, but I ain't questioning the big guy.


You do NOT need to remove the d-loop and make another one 1/16" longer and reinstall!!!
You can lengthen the d-loop right on the bow in increments smaller than 1/16", up to a point, that is. All you have to do is measure the d-loop opening with a set of calipers (take 3 measurements and toss out the ringer), and then, using your d-loop pliers stretch the d-loop a nudge, and re-measure it, normally you can get up to about 1/8" or a nudge more by doing this, assuming that you haven't already stretched your d-loop too tightly the first time. Even then, however getting 1/16" more length right on the bow is pretty easy!
Once you have the d-loop opening set, then you need to measure that opening with a set of calipers and write it down. It is also wise to make sure you make up several pre-measured lengths of d-loop material to match what you now have on the bow, too. I'd wager that most shooters don't even know the "starting length" of the d-loop rope before they install it on the string...let alone what the measurement of the opening is...and thus, they mess up their anchor point something terrible when they have to install a new loop!
Then, when you reinstall a new d-loop, you simply cinch it up until the caliper measurement matches what was written down before you changed the d-loop! 0.001" isn't a big deal...but when you are talking 0.100 or more, then it IS serious! All too many people just cinch 'er down and haven't a clue what the length of that opening was before they just tore things apart... and then wonder why the bow "feels" differently or their anchor doesn't feel right...>DAH!
I always know where that d-loop belongs, both on the bow string and the size of that opening down to the nearest 0.001"!
field14 (Tom D.)


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## Joe Schnur

Swapped my upper left for lower right and resighted in changed things quite a bit.took 30 shots to get it back close but still tuning at least the last 5 were good x's . Coach changed my release form and it is obviously playing havoc with things. Head still needs to focus on the release form. This makes aiming suffer a lot for now then back to automatic.


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## Ned250

Spot on, field14!! That's exactly what I do and can tell the difference when I move it 0.05". I'm sure most will think that's BS, but it's true. I've spent way too much time and money messing with loop lengths. It's one of the most overlooked things....


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## ILOVE3D

Still battling a sinus infection, stuffy, coughing etc but I finally managed enough to get out and shoot some. Thirty arrows at 8 yards, nine at 20 and then finished up with 20 just blank baling. Reinforcing my shot and the hinge firing process. I think the last 20 were the best practice in terms of what I was gaining during practice today.


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## ride394

I went to the range and shot a Vegas 450 round. This week is going to be a lot of up close blank bailing for sure.


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## Mahly

Went to the range an archery club has for a tournament... Spent the entire time getting my bow back to where it was (roughly) before I tried a bunch of different things.
I ripped off the Sugru grip, and removed my torque indicator.
Moved my stabs back to something resembling where they once were. Not to get them where they once were, but it seems I had a pretty good reason for having them where they were.
In the end, I had only to remove 1 weight, and rotate my side bar up to closer to horizontal (steep angle down made sense, but it held better where it is now).
I never even turned in a scorecard 
NONE of these issues showed their heads shooting at 8 yards.
Kinda flustered in that is all resulted in the worst shooting I have done in years.
I think I am just trying to compensate for a bow that doesn't fit me well. It's not the DL, but the string angle and the grip... or more accurately, the shape of the shelf.
Starting to look for a 40" bow.


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## Joe Schnur

I loved my vantage w spirals just a great shooting bow


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## cbrunson

I developed. identified, and conquered a problem Saturday and Sunday. I started pulling differently on the release and didn't realize it at first. I'd have about one out of three drop low, some out of the ten ring. I swapped releases for a few ends and it went away. Then I switched back and all was good.


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## Bees

Mahly said:


> Went to the range an archery club has for a tournament... Spent the entire time getting my bow back to where it was (roughly) before I tried a bunch of different things.
> I ripped off the Sugru grip, and removed my torque indicator.
> Moved my stabs back to something resembling where they once were. Not to get them where they once were, but it seems I had a pretty good reason for having them where they were.
> In the end, I had only to remove 1 weight, and rotate my side bar up to closer to horizontal (steep angle down made sense, but it held better where it is now).
> I never even turned in a scorecard
> NONE of these issues showed their heads shooting at 8 yards.
> Kinda flustered in that is all resulted in the worst shooting I have done in years.
> I think I am just trying to compensate for a bow that doesn't fit me well. It's not the DL, but the string angle and the grip... or more accurately, the shape of the shelf.
> Starting to look for a 40" bow.


sucked into the trap..... 
your supposed to be working on your form issues, and your overall shooting process.
not how to make a bow shoot good at 8 yards. 
As for the bow, just get yourself an older Hoyt Protec or Ultra Tec or the newer PSE Supra or Dominator.
if you can't score with those bows then your really lost. 

Oh I work on my shot process, trying to increase to my rhomboid range of motion, daily exercise...
I haven't adjusted the bow in years.... I just shoot them until they break, then pull out another one..


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## Rick!

Worked on blind bale on a target at 20yds. Stance is ok, release process needs work. Going back after work to confirm stance/dl alignment and then work on blind baling.


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## Mahly

I was working on form. 
I was working on my grip as well. 
Everything looked good at close range, but at distance it didn't translate.
Not saying the short game screwed me, but it's easy to make changes and not see problems.

Got my eye on a PCE XL and Vantage Elite plus


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## Padgett

Saturday turned out different than I thought it would, I showed up to the indoor range and a 14 year old bow that I shoot indoor with was there. Before I even got 6 warm up shots out of my bow I noticed he was totally in a state of target panic every single shot and he was missing the entire 5-spot target with some of his shots. He is capable of shooting around 300 50x when he is shooting good and for me to see him missing the entire target was a sign for me to step in. I suggested that we go up close and finish our warm up at 5 yards or so and he agreed.

I told him to just relax and run your firing engine smoothly and let the engine fire the hinge and within minutes he was doing much better. I did notice that he had a huge amount of rotation in his hinge to get it to fire and so I suggested to him that we work on his hinge speed and grip on the hinge. he was drawing the bow with his index finger and thumb only and then taking up the slack with the other fingers after coming to anchor. So we did my hinge setup routine for about 10 minutes and he really liked the feel of drawing the hinge with all fingers instead of just the two. After that he was getting tired so we stayed up close and shot a few more arrows with his new hinge grip and speed setting and his shooting really started to look nice. 

I did get in some good close range shooting with my hinge but helping a buddy was much more fun.


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## EPLC

Saturday evening I shot a RIFAA shoot (300 round) at X-Spot Archery Lanes and stunk up the place. The thumb trigger didn't work out. I went back to my Sweet Spot II and shot another competition (same round, same place) on Sunday and won my class with a 300 37X. The X count was low but my focus was on trusting my process and from that perspective I saw some improvement. Today I'm resting a very tender shoulder... Sometimes things just hurt.


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## cbrunson

EPLC said:


> Saturday evening I shot a RIFAA shoot (300 round) at X-Spot Archery Lanes and stunk up the place. The thumb trigger didn't work out. I went back to my Sweet Spot II and shot another competition (same round, same place) on Sunday and won my class with a 300 37X. The X count was low but my focus was on trusting my process and from that perspective I saw some improvement. Today I'm resting a very tender shoulder... Sometimes things just hurt.


Great job! On game day I'd rather shoot a 300-0x, than a 299-59x


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## Fury90flier

The weather hasn't been very forgiving here in Houston the past few weeks and in my free time I've been moving machinery, benches etc from a garage shop to storage....for me today will just be a fun day. 

So, for my compound, I'm still working on my Supra...at 47# it's just too nice to shoot. I'll be working on 70M grouping today--paying attention to float, pull through and this bad float that just came up. Ok, not really working on, just paying attention to.

I've got an old Root Archery (actually Archery Research) Golden Eagle I'll be playing with...put a new string on so I can have fun--the other one is dead (many bows, many thousands of shots). The GE needs a sight pin...will need to make one from a paper clip today. Too bad Greater Houston Archery is closed...had several that I know would fit...

If I have time, I'll fling some from the Oly rig

so just a fun day.


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## jpotter

Shot tourney yesterday noticed in shoot I was not firing the release as well as in practice, did a personal best though which was a big plus, today at practice @ 4o yds I (concentrating a little harder and relaxing more-non-competition situation) was shooting great, duh
way more on focus of technique, read firing engine, to get it to where it is just habit. Not there yet just the fun part of working it out. Love it.


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## WildWilt15

After a long day of work I pulled out the new bow fired a couple shots out of her. Now I sit here typing this while I warm up I might head back out in a bit. I'm trying to get use to this Elite bow which is not taking very long at all. but I don't even have 100 shots out of it yet.


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## hollywood88

Decided to start fine tuning my bow today. I'm shooting a rytera seeker 365 so I started out by fine tuning my draw length and grip angle. After that I started working on setting up my hinge. This isy first bow with limb stops in a long time and so far what I have found is that my shot feels better with the release set stone cold instead of hot like I usually set them. Will update more as I progress with this setup.


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## pwyrick

Finished setting up and tuning a new bow over the last week. Built new arrows a couple days ago. So today, I shot horizontal and vertical lines to get a sight tape just right. I can't really relax until I get stuff like that done (its my compulsive head thing). Then, I just shot volumes in order to start getting used to the personality of the bow and how my shot process works with it. Got lazy after awhile and, while thinking that I was using strong back pressure, was barely holding the stops against the wall. Got into an aggressive frame of mind with my back pressure and discovered that this bow really likes that. Pin started to settle and get really still for longer than is normal for me. Lots of back pressure and patience resulted in some very nice shots. Made a note in my journal to give this bow what it wants; lots of back pressure through the shot. I switched to a Whalens Hooker (2 finger) about six weeks ago. The release fires with very little effort. This may have contributed to my laziness today. So, I set it slower so that the release is more in harmony with an aggressive finish in my shot.


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## Fury90flier

Just an update on last night.

I shot both the Golden Eagle and Supra and though I didn't have long to shoot I had a great time and learned a couple things.

1. I'm much happier with my grip and owe that to have that ONE thing be my focus for a while. My L/R issues that were caused by grip are significantly diminishing....but I have a float issue. Not sure if it's tuning related or DL... I'll eventually figure that out.

2. I giggle when I shoot the GE. Oddly that recurve that is about 40 years old is smoother than my modern rig. I'm debating on keeping the bow as is and having it be my bare bow. Between my Win Win, Hoyt Gold Medalist w/Kaya tropics and Cartel Fantom with KAP limbs....I'll take the GE over any of them based on pull alone....though I'll have to put the heavier limbs to reach 70M

I hope I can make it out there today...but should probably do some xmass shopping instead


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## EPLC

I'll do no shooting today as I'm giving my shoulder another day of rest. I have a string/cable set to make for a friend's E35 anyway.


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## bullzeye2

Since I'm joining late I'll give you my past few days. On Saturday I went to my first indoor 3D of the season (and first with this bow AND first shooting a hinge). Solid first round but not my best, came in at 5th after first 20 targets. Second round we were flighted and I shot what felt like a worse round but ended up improving my score by 2 points (funny how that happens). End of the day ended up making a surprise jump from 5th to 2nd (good thing I stayed for the medals!)

Sunday I went to a FITA 600 indoor and had a phenominal couple rounds, taking first. Safe to say that after switching to a hinge about a month ago, it has really paid off in my shooting style and performance!

Monday was my relax/regroup day.

Today I'm out at work (I'm an industrial paramedic) and then I help coach our local Junior Archery class (I'm also a Level II certified coach) followed by some play time for me. I'll be working on fine tuning my firing engine (I found I had some trouble during the 3D when the pressure was on getting my release to feel the same) as well as going over my whole shooting process to solidify it.


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## EPLC

Mahly said:


> I was working on form.
> I was working on my grip as well.
> Everything looked good at close range, but at distance it didn't translate.
> Not saying the short game screwed me, but it's easy to make changes and not see problems.
> 
> Got my eye on a PCE XL and Vantage Elite plus


Welcome to my world.


----------



## montigre

Still working the short game and going through a low period where I feel like gravel tuning the bow....erg! Maybe not enough sleep, maybe shooting area too dark, maybe subconscious mind working on other things in the background, who knows... Noticing an annoying up/down bob entering into the picture; think I will lengthen the ol' d-loop a tad and give myself a little more room to stretch out some. Will see if that does not settle things down a little and take a day off from practicing before playing with the harness. 

Shot a few at 20yards to verify my sight marks and did okay even with the bob--a few Xs, a couple of close 10s and a just outside 9. It's there, I just have to find it again.


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## pwyrick

Worked on form today, mostly just my back half. I looked at the wall just enough to make sure I didn't miss it and worked on making strong, consistent, smooth releases. Patience, patience, patience. And, patience is not one of my virtues.


----------



## Deputy Archer

Shot a Vegas 300 round at league yesterday, 297 17 x, not too bad for me. Still working on the hinge, really struggle on the #2 dote when I move to the top bale, I am 5'5 feels like I am shooting an up hill field target. Thinking of shortening the draw through my bus cables to help it out. Flung some arrows at 20 at the Vegas face, they go off so easy when you aren't scoring. Had a newbie friend work with the hinge at close range too, think he is hooked!


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## Rick!

More blind bale and 20yd blind bale with a target before work. 10yd 3spot round after work with a few ends at 20yds to finish. Also reading a few chapters of field 14's book.


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## Fury90flier

Shot the Supra again today 70m...found my DL isn't as far off as I thought...form isn't as bad as I thought (pointed out by a trusted shooter...maybe a coach soon) and I saw where I have a grip issue- though not as bad as I thought. 


I wish my pics showed my form a bit better...this was the last shot where I was a bit pissed...but hit baby X. What is it about getting mad that makes me focus? I had a few choice words then...WAY opened my stance since I noticed I was closing up too much...and smack- 10.

I still have plenty of work to do but all in all a good day.
















love the slow roll at the target


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## CoolRide

I worked on everything thing that came into my conscience thought on line this weekend - Hand placement , how to pull , committing and not aiming - ( aiming is way overrated ) 
Not so much as I worked on these items as I worked on how well I do them . No need to second guess -


----------



## cbrunson

cbrunson said:


> I'm thinking it's all a brain thing for me. Possibly that I am relaxing too much and letting laziness habits creep in because the game is going good. Then after a miss, I go back to focussing hard and shoot well. I tend to shoot better with the pressure on. Or, I am sub-consciously telling myself I need to miss one, so I can relax the rest of the game. Either way, I need to get my head right, knowing I usually struggle through those shots.
> 
> Even when I shoot a 300 (Vegas), my missed Xs are usually concentated in the 5th to eighth ends. If I can get to the ninth end clean, I know I'll get that 29-30x game. Tiny battles, right?
> 
> I'm going to pay close attention to what I'm thinking about while I'm shooting over the next week.


Another failure last night. Vegas league at the range brought big numbers with guys practicing hard for the big shoot this weekend. It was good for the first half of the first game. I was clean until the fourth or fifth end, then I dropped a couple Xs. I dropped a couple more the next two ends. Then came the eighth end miss. It was just barely out. A thin yellow line between the shaft and ten ring. Second game I dropped two. One was an accident, the other........ end seven. 

I've got to conquer this one arrow syndrome. I know it's a thought process issue.


----------



## EPLC

cbrunson said:


> Another failure last night. Vegas league at the range brought big numbers with guys practicing hard for the big shoot this weekend. It was good for the first half of the first game. I was clean until the fourth or fifth end, then I dropped a couple Xs. I dropped a couple more the next two ends. Then came the eighth end miss. It was just barely out. A thin yellow line between the shaft and ten ring. Second game I dropped two. One was an accident, the other........ end seven.
> 
> I've got to conquer this one arrow syndrome. I know it's a thought process issue.


I don't shoot as high as you but I can't help noticing that you are fixating on this and perhaps making an issue where none really exists. You "ARE" a 300 30X shooter, you just haven't accepted it yet. Stay within your process and you'll be popping them out like crazy.


----------



## cbrunson

EPLC said:


> I don't shoot as high as you but I can't help noticing that you are fixating on this and perhaps making an issue where none really exists. You "ARE" a 300 30X shooter, you just haven't accepted it yet. Stay within your process and you'll be popping them out like crazy.


I believe you're 100% correct. I keep telling myself that right up to the spot I blow it on. Perhaps experience will iron it out. Going back up tonight to try again. The pressure will be off a little, so I might work on tightening my acceptable sight picture.


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## jpotter

Like so many here, working on consistant release. Discovered at tourney this wkend, was aggressively releasing on the longer targets, 35 to 50 yds. At training today I was working at longer ranges after some 20yd. my idea of blank bailing, warm-up shots and was working at that range,Im curious if it is ok to let it be an aggressive shot at longer ranges or to just let the shot happen, more passive sequence. Any opinions welcome.


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## pwyrick

Sat in the recliner and sipped some Kentucky Bourbon laced egg nog. My float has never been better.


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## duckdawg1

i just started shooting a hinge last week so went to the shop today and tried to pull through the shot. I've been cranking it back pretty hard and the shot goes bad. It's a carter honey do. I'm trying to pull through the wall but when the shot doesn't happen, I just rip it. When I pull through the shot, it's at least a 10. My 9s are coming from cranking it back. Also did some long range at the house and get some great groups when pulling through. Overall, I love my hinge. I wish I didn't spend a year with my thumb release.


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## Mahly

Finally set up a range in the garage.
Started over using Padgett's hinge set up guide and firing engine.
Made a BIG change to the grip ( yeah, I know... Change one thing at a time... But why learn a new hinge technique from scratch and then later, change your grip?) and worked on the whole "spectator shooting" thing.
Didn't shoot awesome... Didn't expect to set any records, but I see potential in ALL the changes made.
Encouraging day, lots to learn, but now I can at least shoot and practice more often.


----------



## RCR_III

Played around with a 10 degree quick disconnect some. Shot some short game in my garage too. Starting back at indoor and having to keep reminding myself to just stand there and be "bored" till the shot goes off.


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## RCR_III

duckdawg1 said:


> i just started shooting a hinge last week so went to the shop today and tried to pull through the shot. I've been cranking it back pretty hard and the shot goes bad. It's a carter honey do. I'm trying to pull through the wall but when the shot doesn't happen, I just rip it. When I pull through the shot, it's at least a 10. My 9s are coming from cranking it back. Also did some long range at the house and get some great groups when pulling through. Overall, I love my hinge. I wish I didn't spend a year with my thumb release.


Something for you to try. When you're pulling through the shot, let the top of your hand relax and extend at the base knuckles. It won't take much. That little bit of extension combined with a slow pull will keep you from needing to jerk through a shot. You won't just be relying on the rotation of the pull that way.


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## duckdawg1

^^^^ this is what I'm working on. The hardest part of relaxing the knuckles or hand is making sure I don't let go of the release. I find it easier to use 3 fingers then all 4. It feels like a lot less movement.


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## RCR_III

You're trying to relax the whole hand/fingers. What I do is make a "U" shape out of my fingers that wrap around the release handle. During my execution I make sure to keep this "U" and when I start to let the back of my hand stretch and yield, my finger's tension stays there. The way the hand's muscles and bone structure works allows the index finger to elongate from the base knuckle to the first knuckle more so than the middle and ring fingers. That elongating is giving the rotation needed to fire the release. 

Between 3 and 4 finger releases. I found that I can use a 3 finger hinge easier than a 4 because of the same elongating I was talking about before. The pinky finger is generally quite a bit shorter than the other three fingers on your hand. So when the hand stretches and pivots on the first knuckles, the pinky finger is already almost or fully extended. So you do not get any movement from it. So, depending on how you execute this can make things harder. You're also getting a lot of hand into the release using all 4 fingers, so the hand is more rigid and not as flexible to work with.


duckdawg1 said:


> ^^^^ this is what I'm working on. The hardest part of relaxing the knuckles or hand is making sure I don't let go of the release. I find it easier to use 3 fingers then all 4. It feels like a lot less movement.


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## Robertxxx

Shot a few at low poundage and close range, been doing this for a few weeks. Coming back after 3 year layoff due to shoulder problems. Made a few adjustments, but most of it is coming back. Still need to build up endurance. I have been studying my float as suggested by Padgett. I think the more familiar and comfortable you are with it , the less it will distract you when shooting. Hold is descent, just some trouble with the firing engine. I doubt I'll be in shape in time for Lancaster or Vegas, but good luck to those who make it.


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## jpotter

Went to shop yesterday and shot a vegas, was first in a while, shot really not so good, working on experimenting w/ relaxed hand extension and relaxed fingers, pulling through like yur suppose to and was all over the place. Luckily hit a good combination and was shooting rather well for me once I settled on which one to use. The good thing about sticking w/one release you can tinker w/the way you can fire it. Good stuff. Love it!


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## montigre

Advanced my top cam a smidge after realizing that the harness settled some and was at the root of the slight vertical bob I had just started experiencing. I slowed the Stan hinge down a bit and then shot up close into a blank bale with lots of distractions around me working on zoning in, execution, endurance, and timing. Back muscles are a bit stiff and uncomfortable right now-- I will probably repeat something similar tomorrow.


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## ride394

Shot a vegas round after making some changes to my draw length and loop this week. Score stayed the same but with less X's. Need to shorten my loop back up a smidge.


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## erdman41

Finally managed to shoot a 60X.


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## Mahly

Congrats!!!! Good shooting!


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## TNMAN

:set1_applaud: :77: :cheers: :thumbs_up


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## montigre

Congrats, erdman!!


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## Padgett

Awesome, that is something you will always remember and really special getting that first 60x. Congrats.

For me the last few days have been creeping up on me, I listen to so many guys ask questions and you can see that they are ignoring all the solid advice being given and there is just no getting through to them. Well, it ended up being me. For the millionth time in my 45 years I was so hard headed that I couldn't see the simple things being offered to me, I finally listened and got to enjoy the last two days of shooting at a new level that I had never experienced before. 

For the last two years I have been from a 18 to 21x vegas little x guy and only a few times have I ever shot more than that and I think my best was probably 26x. Today I shot 29x and I was only one shot from getting my first 300 30x. In the years that I have shot indoor vegas targets have always been something I shot but never honestly felt like I could defeat, basically you have to put 30 inside out shots together.


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## Padgett

The more I think about it I am now over the hump, for so long I have been shooting and every once in a while I would feel that perfect shot. Then I would try and make that perfect shot happen again and I would fail and simply not be able to do it, now I am to the point where almost 100% of my shots are perfect and the bad ones are simply gone, only the marginal ones still exist. For me my training right now is going to be focused on executing that perfect shot 100% of time and eliminating the marginal ones. Today one marginal shot where I let my mind wander cost me my first perfect vegas round.


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## Ned250

erdman41 said:


> Finally managed to shoot a 60X.


Congrats!


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## Garceau

I shot my first scored practice Vegas round of the year. ....yikes is only way to explain it.


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## ride394

Did a lot of thinking yesterday. My scores are not reflecting how I usually shoot. May try my black eagle challengers as I seem to be getting a lot of flyers with these platinum plus 2315s.


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## montigre

Garceau said:


> I shot my first scored practice Vegas round of the year. ....yikes is only way to explain it.


Is that a good yikes?


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## Garceau

No...definitely not.


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## unclejane

I experienced a whole new level of shooting too; I actually hit the target butt. A couple times. Amazing given that I could hardly see my pin (my aperture I'm using has got to go, I can see a darn thing with it). 

But in this case, it was with my PSE Supra Max bottomed out at 30lbs. I've discovered I'm almost strong enough to shoot it without aggravating injury - that's the big accomplishment for me. Today is a rest day and I'll see what I'm in for in terms of pain, but fingers crossed it looks like my upper body may permit me to return to archery after many years layoff. I may only ever be able to shoot 30lbs but at least it looks like I may be able to start shooting.

Here's a check on my tune at 20 yards with my new GT ultralight arrows; the bare shaft is grouping with fletched, so I'm in the ballpark.


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## Rick!

I started out like this yesterday! 








Then reality set in.








Upper right shots 9&10 went out at 2 o'clock, shots 2,3, & 4 on the bottom were at 3, 9 and 11 o'clock. Working on a clean shot break. Over aiming with a soft back end isn't going to get me where I want to be. A strong shot with balanced front and back gets it down the middle with less deviation, at least this morning it did.


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## unclejane

Ah, now see? After I post my shots, now you're just bragging... I hate you... 

LS


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## Mahly

Got more time in on my short range.
Liking new grip style, just getting it to be my new normal.
Also working Padgett's firing engine and hinge set up.
Set up like that, I shoot MUCH faster (a good thing).
Enough so that I actually have to change the breathing part of my shot sequence. With this new technique, I'm getting the shot off an easy 2 seconds earlier. Much less "hanging up".
Making progress.


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## N7709K

I'm playin the sidelines a little bit for a few day... managed this little gem late saturday night. Down to the bone, shaved a bunch of tissue back to the top of the knuckle and a bit of nerve damage... Doesn't really hurt, more sore from being bruised than anything else. 

Congrats on your first 60x bud, you won't ever forget that one.


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## Mahly

Ouch! WTH did you do?


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## ILOVE3D

Man Jacob, you keep hurting yourself, first, clobbering your nose and eye shooting the boom stick, now trying to amputate your finger with a dull instrument? You need to take it easy so you can get down to some serious practice before Vegas. Congrats erdman, still waiting for my first 60X. Rick, what yardage was that damage done at?


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## ILOVE3D

Today I shot both my Supra ME and my Dominator max. First thing I noticed was way too often, perhaps 1 out of 4 arrows would be high and left shooting at 20 yds. Instead of a X on 5 spot those shots were usually outter white still a 10 but flirting with the 4 ring. During those shots I also noticed my hand wanted to slide to the left side of the grip. I shoot right handed, open fingers/hand with a finger sling. I don't care how careful I was the bow just moved ever so tiny on those shots. Both bows painstakingly set up with exact same DL and weight of each is 53 and 54 respectively. Stabilizers set up pretty much the same as well within just an ounce or two. With my Dominator I never had the slip or movement. I'm almost ready to get rid of the Supra. Yes, it was chilly out and riser was cold but the same on both bows and yet no trouble with one.


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## N7709K

Hey now, it's easier to shoot with a broken nose than a cut up hand... 

I was shootin pool with a couple friends... Cue ball was just my side if mid table, 8 was down at the far rail. I choked up on the stick when I shot and caught my finger between the stick and the edge of the table


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## ILOVE3D

I don't care how you did it, those type of wounds always hurt me more than they should for a couple days. Hopefully you had a couple beers to help take off the edge.


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## Rick!

ILOVE3D said:


> Rick, what yardage was that damage done at?


10yds, all my practice is at 10 with 3-4 ends at 20 to make sure what I've learned works there too. Someday I'll have just three holes in the middle...


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## SonnyThomas

Congrats, erdman!!


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## SonnyThomas

What did I do today? Woke up scared to death.... Don't know how, slept on my wrist wrong or something is really wrong. Woke up and my bow hand wouldn't move. Turned on the light and floored.. My bow hand was bent over so bad I could almost touch my fingers to my arm, Probably could, just didn't try it I was so scared. Took like forever, but got my hand back in place...Dislocated wrist? Right in the top middle of my wrist still hurts some. Flexing it and all, but damn.... This is the wrist that had the bone removed years back and only scar tissue and some gel pack making up for the bone. Think I'll wait a bit before shooting....or call the doctor. At least it isn't swelled, just feels a bit thick...


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## RCR_III

That would probably scare me to death too! I'd say see the doc if it hasn't free'd up well by morning for sure. Sorry to hear about the fright.


SonnyThomas said:


> What did I do today? Woke up scared to death.... Don't know how, slept on my wrist wrong or something is really wrong. Woke up and my bow hand wouldn't move. Turned on the light and floored.. My bow hand was bent over so bad I could almost touch my fingers to my arm, Probably could, just didn't try it I was so scared. Took like forever, but got my hand back in place...Dislocated wrist? Right in the top middle of my wrist still hurts some. Flexing it and all, but damn.... This is the wrist that had the bone removed years back and only scar tissue and some gel pack making up for the bone. Think I'll wait a bit before shooting....or call the doctor. At least it isn't swelled, just feels a bit thick...


----------



## Padgett

A couple weeks ago I found out that my string had stretched and my draw length had grown to 29.5, so I had swisted my bow string and shortened it at least 1/2 inch a couple weeks ago but I still felt a little stretched out so even though I had shot awesome last friday and saturday I decided to shorten up my draw length a little more. I put 5 complete twists in the bow string and rotated the cams so that they are on the front timing mark and this took just over 1/8 inch out of the draw length and for the first time in a long time I really felt spot on at full draw. Cool thing was that it didn't change my poi at all and I warmed up and was able to shoot a 5-spot scoring round with only 10 warm up shots.

I noticed right off the start within 2 warm up shots that my hinge speed had changed and gotten faster by shortening my draw length and in fact on my second end of practice I dropped a x because every shot was going off about 1 second after releasing the thumb peg and I had really only started settling in on the x when it was firing. I went ahead and started the scoring round and ended up shooting the ugliest 300 60x I have ever shot, I think I counted 8 shots that hit on the outside edge of the x and all of them were solid but had fired just after releasing the thumb peg. 

As far as my shooting, I did a good job of relaxing and accepting the situtation. I simply drew back and settled in on the x and I released the thumb peg very smoothly every shot having a very nice transition from being on the peg to off the peg and then I ran my engine. I accepted mentally that some of the shots were going to go off really early and that it was ok. I did have a good 35 perfect shots that felt like last friday and saturday but the other 15 shots were marginal because they were happening way to fast, this issue did add some extra stress to the scoring round because of the extra effort to make sure I was on the x perfect before releasing the thumb peg and I didn't like it but I did handle the slight amount of stress well.

Tonight I am going to slow down my hinge very slightly to get back to where I was last weekend, right now I am not having hardly any little issues in my shooting that I feel like I need to tweek or eliminate so I am going to get my hinge speed corrected and continue shooting scoring rounds and work on having good perfect executions every time I draw the bow.


----------



## SonnyThomas

RCR_III said:


> That would probably scare me to death too! I'd say see the doc if it hasn't free'd up well by morning for sure. Sorry to hear about the fright.


Doing fine. Wrist is moving okay. Still, I can't believe my hand was bent that far over. You know, you hold your forearm straight up and let your hand fall over the back of your hand is angled up ??? 33 degrees, I guess. The back of my hand was angled down 30 degrees at least. Moved my arm down so, like the palm of hand should be and slowly...like forever my hand went...went back in place is best I describe it and with just a...thump...not a clunk, just a soft thump.


----------



## Carbofastdirect

Booked my flights and hotel for Vegas. Haven't shot in 4 weeks due to a trapped nerve between my shoulder blades 
Fingers crossed I'm better in time for some practice!


----------



## Carbofastdirect

Booked my flights and hotel for Vegas. Haven't shot in 4 weeks due to a trapped nerve between my shoulder blades 
Fingers crossed I'm better in time for some practice!


----------



## duckdawg1

Shot last nights league and my DL felt long since switching over to a hinge. Ended up putting the A mod back in and felt really short so I ended up putting the B mod back in and left the draw stop in the A slot. Re-timed and feels real good now. The L/O went from 11.5# to 15.5#. Shot sub par Vegas rd. this morning then Gave it 20 mins. and shot another rd. and ended up with my highest score to date and highest x count. The hinge was breaking well through 8 ends and dropped 2 in the 9th and 2 pts. In the 10th. Shots didn't break and I didn't let down. I'm still happy with the score but know I have a lot of work ahead. I just started shooting Vegas spots about 5 weeks ago and I have had the hinge for 2 weeks. Back to the work.


----------



## SonnyThomas

N7709K said:


> Hey now, it's easier to shoot with a broken nose than a cut up hand...
> 
> I was shootin pool with a couple friends... Cue ball was just my side if mid table, 8 was down at the far rail. I choked up on the stick when I shot and caught my finger between the stick and the edge of the table


You should pick a safer hobby...bulldoggin' or bull ridin' :wink:


----------



## Padgett

Today I went over to the shop teacher across the hall and got a dial caliper and I sat at my desk and studied my longhorn pro. It only took about 5 minutes and I found a easy way to use the caliper to change my hinge speed down to the thousanth of a inch. This has been something I have disliked about my longhorn since I got it and now I can finally micro adjust it..


----------



## acesbettor

Padgett said:


> Today I went over to the shop teacher across the hall and got a dial caliper and I sat at my desk and studied my longhorn pro. It only took about 5 minutes and I found a easy way to use the caliper to change my hinge speed down to the thousanth of a inch. This has been something I have disliked about my longhorn since I got it and now I can finally micro adjust it..


Hmmm.. You think it would work with the backspin??


----------



## SonnyThomas

Padgett, .001" isn't that much and most don't know how little. I just now used my dial indicator and the cellophane on a pack of cigarettes checked less than .001". My Brown and Sharp micrometer shows something more than .0008" and less than .0009", but mostly .0009". I know my Brown and Sharp is pretty accurate, but hasn't been certified in many years and I haven't used in many years. Closest tolerance I ever had for +/- was .0003" and closet one sided tolerance was .000" + .0004". When they gave us +/- .002" we thought we had a "mile" to play with 

I had the TRU Ball Sweet Spot and the Gold and I disliked both, setting the moon, but back then I didn't have someone to show me. When I got my first Stan, the MagMicro Trio, I fell in love. Allen wrench moves the sear as little as you can tweak.


----------



## ILOVE3D

Padgett said:


> Today I went over to the shop teacher across the hall and got a dial caliper and I sat at my desk and studied my longhorn pro. It only took about 5 minutes and I found a easy way to use the caliper to change my hinge speed down to the thousanth of a inch. This has been something I have disliked about my longhorn since I got it and now I can finally micro adjust it..


Ok Padgett, are you going to let the rest of us know how it's done or keep it all to yourself? I have two of the brass longhorn Advantage pro's and I play with one while leaving the other alone. When I get one better than the other I shoot with that one then play with adjusting the other.


----------



## SonnyThomas

RCR_III said:


> That would probably scare me to death too! I'd say see the doc if it hasn't free'd up well by morning for sure. Sorry to hear about the fright.


Got brave and went out to shoot. Brrrrr. Ice forming on water and a slight breeze. Metal riser grips do get cold. Shot both my bows for a bit. Wrist seemed okay. Cold, grip cold, slight breeze, and no matter what it's shot execution. Release hand relaxed, but fingers hanging on and just aim and aim and aim and the shot happens and the arrow goes where it's supposed to. Didn't use the Slick Shot at all, not looking at the torque indicator on the MX2 and time and again the arrow found the 10 and baby X quite a bit with each bow. No, I wasn't perfect. I had some go out with MarXman. I lost sight of what I wanted, experimented some and trying to determine which bow felt better. And that's a problem. The MarXman rolls over and has this "sweet spot" of let off and the wall, but feels long on draw length, 28 1/2". The MX2 rolls over and doesn't have a "sweet spot" of let off. I have the wall and it wanting to go (I don't like), but feels better for draw length, 28 1/4". Both bows have near the same draw weight and virtually identical for let off. 
The MX2 seems more forgiving. About 20 or 25 shots for each bow and the MX2 never missed a 10 and at times I swore I wasn't on the 10.... Thank God my Lab started howling or I'd froze my bow hand. I put a new and longer cable on her and she managed to find something to wrap around, right up to her collar...


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## fanio

I had changed my hinge speed a bit. It's an HT Pro - I made it a tiny bit less hot (literally the smallest movement I could make with the Allen key - I doubt it would even be measurable with a caliper).

Shot for the first time in a couple of weeks, and shot a Vegas practice round: 297/15x. It was quite a frustrating round - starting pretty good in the first four ends (119/9x) but I was trying to work on a "strong front end" and perhaps tensed up a bit as groups opened right up (next 12 were 119/3x). At least I finished well with 3x. It was the first scored round I shot since October (which was a 299/18x).

My 9s were low and right; I had a few edgey high/high left 10s too. So a bit of a string like this \ I am guessing this probably the result of some "weak" shots due to consciously playing around with my front arm/shoulder.


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## montigre

Dang, Sonny, shooting outdoors when all things are freezing around you---you're really showing your TRUE SPOTS! 

Anyway, sounds like the more aggressive cams on the MX2 are causing you to stay in your shot instead of relaxing in the valley, thus improving your execution by making it more consistent. Less micro creeping = more baby Xs. Keep it up, Sonny.


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## Garceau

I shot 5 spot

60x 55 I o's

Ten yards. Pretty sloppy but a start. Really ran out of steam. 

Wasn't consistent with release hand/anchor or release elbow. 

But that's why we do it.....reps


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## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> Dang, Sonny, shooting outdoors when all things are freezing around you---you're really showing your TRUE SPOTS!
> 
> Anyway, sounds like the more aggressive cams on the MX2 are causing you to stay in your shot instead of relaxing in the valley, thus improving your execution by making it more consistent. Less micro creeping = more baby Xs. Keep it up, Sonny.


Ahem.... Well, I've shot out the 12 and 14 rings on all my 3D centers, to lazy to change the Vegas face target and too lazy to drive 30 miles to Presley's. Guys kept hammering about 3D targets and I ended up selling off what I had, 19 at one time. Kept one McKenzie Ram for broadheads - toughest core McKenzie ever made.


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## Padgett

I agree the micro adjust on the tru ball ht hinge is so nice and it makes getting a hinge speed dialed in but my problem has always been nothing fits my hand like a scott longhorn pro brass. With a longhorn it usually takes me a week or so to make a speed change because every time you try and move the moon you completely loose your current setting and you can't just go back to it and no matter how hard you try you can't just move it a little bit. So I just move it and shoot for a while and then move it again and shoot some more and sooner or later I find a good speed or I give up and just leave it where it is at. I haven't tried the caliper on the backspin yet because I am only shooting with the longhorn pro right now as I go through a peaking session so I am not playing around with releases. The only reason I am having to change this longhorn is because I had to shorten my draw length because of the tens of thousands of shot on this string set stretching out. I had the hinge perfect last week but I decided to go ahead and get my draw length back to perfect before I put another few days into my shooting and shortening totally changed my hinge speed.


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## Padgett

Hinge speed is a interesting subject and monday was a interesting day for me to say the least, sure I shot a 60x round which was cool but the fact that I had lost my perfect hinge speed that I had been shooting with really sucked. But, what monday really did a good job of was remind me of some of the decisions that I have made in the last couple years that have shaped me as a shooter.

My hinge was way to stinking fast and the first thing that entered my mind was that I needed to keep the arrow on the target as I drew the bow because I REFUSE TO DRAW THE BOW WITH MY THUMB AND INDEX FINGER ONLY, this meant there was a high percentage chance that I was going to have a misfire. Every shot on monday that I took I drew my bow with my perfect grip on the hinge with equal pressure on all fingers, yeah I was very careful that I was setting up for the shot and drawing perfectly but again I will not give up fundamentals to just get the bow drawn.

The second thing that I had to do knowing that my hinge was going to fire very early in my shot was make the simple decision that I was ok with it firing early many times before I got my thumb released on the thumb peg completely. Instead of changing anything in my execution or finger pressure I just accepted what I already knew was going to happen and enjoyed my shooting.

It was a good day, I actually had enough good shots to tell that the 1/8 inch that I took off the draw length really got me into a perfect position and it also confirmed that I needed to slow the hinge down just a little to get back to perfect.


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## possum trapper

if you take a allen wrench the long end small enough to stick between the head and the half moon you can use leverage with the allen wrench to slightly move the moon one way or the other.there is NO need to loosen up anything on that release to adjust it.


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## EPLC

Padgett said:


> Today I went over to the shop teacher across the hall and got a dial caliper and I sat at my desk and studied my longhorn pro. It only took about 5 minutes and I found a easy way to use the caliper to change my hinge speed down to the thousanth of a inch. This has been something I have disliked about my longhorn since I got it and now I can finally micro adjust it..


This is exactly how I adjust my hinge... Works great!


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## RCR_III

Braving the cold and testing out bows. Sounds like the wrist should be holding up alright though, so that's a good thing. Glad to hear you're able to get out and shoot.


SonnyThomas said:


> Got brave and went out to shoot. Brrrrr. Ice forming on water and a slight breeze. Metal riser grips do get cold. Shot both my bows for a bit. Wrist seemed okay. Cold, grip cold, slight breeze, and no matter what it's shot execution. Release hand relaxed, but fingers hanging on and just aim and aim and aim and the shot happens and the arrow goes where it's supposed to. Didn't use the Slick Shot at all, not looking at the torque indicator on the MX2 and time and again the arrow found the 10 and baby X quite a bit with each bow. No, I wasn't perfect. I had some go out with MarXman. I lost sight of what I wanted, experimented some and trying to determine which bow felt better. And that's a problem. The MarXman rolls over and has this "sweet spot" of let off and the wall, but feels long on draw length, 28 1/2". The MX2 rolls over and doesn't have a "sweet spot" of let off. I have the wall and it wanting to go (I don't like), but feels better for draw length, 28 1/4". Both bows have near the same draw weight and virtually identical for let off.
> The MX2 seems more forgiving. About 20 or 25 shots for each bow and the MX2 never missed a 10 and at times I swore I wasn't on the 10.... Thank God my Lab started howling or I'd froze my bow hand. I put a new and longer cable on her and she managed to find something to wrap around, right up to her collar...


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## SonnyThomas

RCR_III said:


> Braving the cold and testing out bows. Sounds like the wrist should be holding up alright though, so that's a good thing. Glad to hear you're able to get out and shoot.


Well, it was a relief that there wasn't any pain or something stupid happening. So many times I've been told I would be able to shoot for my artificial wrist bone (scar tissue and get pack) and Cubical Tunnel surgery where strength is robbed somehow. I know some who have had the same surgery and can't use a bow now. They just can't keep the bow out there. My back muscles, which ever, ripped from shoulder blade to should blade from base of neck to about halfway down my back.... Turning diabetic didn't help, nothing but a blur out passed the hood of my truck going home. And turning 66 this coming spring. I feel lucky to just able to shoot.


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## Rick!

I started shooting a 5 spot at 20yds to change things up. A 5 spot X at 20yds feels huge compared to a Vegas inner X at 10yds.


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## N7709K

thats why i mark the moons; take a sharpie and run a line next to the head of the release on the moon... gives a "zero" to return to and gives a visual for how speed adjustments.


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## T2SHOOTER

A little moisture above, soggy ground below and two bows (?): grabbed the recurve and six arrows for a 28 target round at range. Decided no more than 50 yards shooting two, two and two--hunter/field/animal. Smile. Wasn't there ten minutes before someone wanted to change my style. Boo. Kept walking/shooting, and enjoyed my round--a lot of dead paper. Two targets were shot twice--hitting left??? Tomorrow will be compound; maybe longbow? Smile.


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## Ned250

Working on the Vegas spot at 12yds in my basement. I'm sooooooo rusty. My hole patterns have been vertical lines, so I took some mass weight off my bow, 3oz (I'm at a 1:2 front:rear ratio). Made a noticeable difference in my pattern, so I'll see how that goes for the next couple of weeks. 

At the end of today's session I finally started to get that "feel" back. Hope I can build on that in the coming sessions.


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## jpotter

Still working on consistant release,went to blank bailing to get consistancy up to snuff,if it wasnt such a thrill to do this sport and just perfect my technique, just have to be disaplined to get the basics habitual, thats the trick. Have to routinely work on blank bailing, thought I could bypass this discipline, but it bit me in the butt when I went to BT.


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## Mr.Moose

I worked on my Ho Model train setup....lol


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## cbrunson

Taking a break until after Christmas.


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## glennx

Started to shoot with an eye blinder last night. Shot two nines right off the get go. Had to run a couple clicks to the right. I think this will help out in the long run.Ended up with a 598 37x's. I still have a long way to go.


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## jbeasleyshoot

As a I detest shooting inside at only 20 yards I froze my butt off group tuning some diff arrows in the yard getting ready for 3D season. Seems like I am shooting better this year after working on form for the last couple of months. I really need to continue shooting at least one indoor round a week as to not loose what I have worked on all fall but I don't find it near as much fun as being outside.


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## SonnyThomas

Re-established release to hand and working on smoother execution, 4 fingers release feels promising. Experimenting with back tension, full and right side. Severely overcast and raining may put off today.


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## Mahly

Found what i feel is a break-through in my firing engine technique.
Less data from the hinge, more natural feel, less to think about.
Put a bunch of arrows through it today at short range.
Feel I have made a big stride after a lot of frustration.
Doing all of this at short range, and no scoring.
Zaps in my hand are getting better with every session. Guess it just needed to get use to hold the hinge in a new way. (WHEW!!!).
Bursa still gets ticked off at me when I practice in the cold... Hoping that will acclimate in time as well.


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## possum trapper

I didn't go hunting I went and shot a vegas round 300 26x had 3 just a fuzz out.....bummer


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## jpotter

Recieved great info from ron.w about aggresive shots vs punched ones, definition of diff between the 2.
Thanks ron


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## acesbettor

Well today I went to 29" mods on my indoor bow from 28.5". I just went to increased holding weight the past few days which definitely helped with hinge execution but it shortened me up a bit and my sight picture was really jumpy. I only fired a few shots with the new mods at close range but i felt much more relaxed and my bow shoulder wasn't as bunched up. I also feel like I got a better/more anchor reference now. Time will tell!!


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## stoz

Worked up close bb 30 arrows and 30 at 7 yards working on letting down on any shots that anything enters my head but aiming. Thanks ron w!


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## sharkred7

Yesterday lengthened my loop 3 mm to get draw elbow more in line, went to a different range and shot a Ia Proam round of 675 (358 and 317) and today shot a 678 Ia round (359 and 319). Which was also my first 300 Vegas round this year.

Also went back to the basics of my shot sequence and hitting all points. Shooting 2312's cost me several points today but I like the way they fly and don't want to have to switch back and forth for NAA NFAA.


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## jpotter

Bad day at blackrock, discovered small delam in limb, got RA# and it ll be a couple weeks till I get it back, life time warranty good stuff. Went to back up bow w/ wrist release, no problem just miss my favorite.


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## PSE Archer

I can tell you what I didn't do - I didn't change anything.


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## unclejane

Discovered this past Sat. that I was strong enough to draw my Supra Max (@ approx. 30lbs) with correct technique using the back muscles. Was able to do 15 or so shafts for a couple days that way. Very sore in draw shoulder area now but no recurrence of any pain in the original injury areas in the chest that I can detect. 

LS


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## sharkred7

Shot 2 vegas rounds today, had my highest X counts this year with 25 and 26 but did shoot a 9 in each game. Both just out but I let myself lose focus and that's what happens. All in all very happy where my shooting is going and I get to test out my new process with 3 tournaments in 10 days! Can't wait!

I shouldn't say new process, just tweaked draw length and string loop and went back to the basics of talking myself through my shot routine. I only have a 4 step routine, the rest is automatic from all my years of shooting, but I must hit these 4 points. As long as I do all four the shots end up in the middle and really boosts confidence.

John


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## SonnyThomas

Just back in....Shot until I dropped...well, other than a couple cigarette breaks. Kind of nice out for December. A bit of breeze would get me and that dang sunshine had me about to build a flat roof under our bigger evergreen. Yeah, get on target and the breeze would move the evergreen limbs and blaring sun would get me right in the eyes. Messed with anchoring, getting it to repeat regardless of bow - Yep, changing back and forth between the MarXman and MX2. So between playing around and the dogs all wanted petted and fussed over ever now and then I shot at least three 5 spot games. I had ten 4s and can't really complain with all that took place.


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## montigre

With the warm weather, I had to fight the urge to get a quick set of marks and shoot a field half with my fatter indoor arrows.... Anyway, I shot a blank bale for a while then shot a 296 Vegas round at 20 yards with relatively poor x count, but that's acceptable right now as I am not expecting to be Vegas or Nationals ready this season. The overall progress I am making on the short and blank bale are starting to pay off in baby steps and I should still be on target to be back in form for next year's outdoor season. 

For me, it has very much been worth it, albeit also very difficult and sometimes boring, to forgo indoor competition this season.


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## Sasquech

If you are breathing you are vegas ready


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## montigre

LOL...last time I checked, yep, still breathing....


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## elkbow69

Have not shot the bow in about 3 weeks, so I decided to spark up the wood stove in the shop, turned on the lights, let it warm up good,
Then grabbed my vector32, put my home made 24" PVC stabilizer in there, turned it down to 60.2# grabbed 5 old xx78 2513's and shot a vegas round (short game @ 9 yards), scored a 297 and 15x's.


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## unclejane

I keep buying stuff until I shoot better - just one purchase away from being a good shot! That said, a new peep and scope with a lens was a mandatory xmas present to myself because, in between the last time I shot compound and now my eyesight has deteriorated to the point I can't see the target plus a conventional pin anymore. Shot today with a 3x lens and viola, I could see the target face. What a concept....

Also, I can now do about 25 shafts out of my PSE with good draw technique, tho I still quit cautiously after that. So the upper body is more promising all the time.... Looking for that elusive 60 shafts without tiring/hurting....

LS


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## SonnyThomas

Shot for about 2 hours. Just beautiful out for December 26th. Warm. Still shooting back and forth between the MarXman and MX2. Both accurate, each having their nice points. Really overcast this morning and looks like it's already rained a tad. Wanting to try a different arrow I have stored away. Might help me decide on another brand as Muddy Outdoors has discontinued the 400 .354" diameter HT3.


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## swwishooter

Yesterday I finally got my bow set for the way I want it with tune and equipment. Worked on developing some endurance by shooting past my peak yesterday, as I am way out of archery shape with not shooting for 2 weeks. Plan to work on some short games tonight, and my follow-thru, as that was my downfall last night once I started to get tired.


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## SonnyThomas

Just in. 2:59 PM CT. Both bows shot great, it's just me :sad: No, I did okay, but I can tell when I mess and again blaring sun didn't help. Don't know where my scope shade is so I hacked out pop can to fit. Works. Sure rattles. Done decided my MX2 is tad short on draw after I shortened it. At least I know it's a tad short. Will fix tomorrow....


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## pwyrick

Shooting a walking 3d range for fun with a friend. Got lazy and let the bow shoot me. I made a perfect release of an arrow. I really did release it. In fact, I set it free. Not sure that I'll ever see it again.


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## possum trapper

went hunting seen a lot of deer


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## Fury90flier

yesterday...flung about 30 @ 70m. Shoulder still giving me fits so I took it easy. Due to the shoulder injury I keep holding low...also having issues keeping the arrow on the blade. The good news is that I'm 100% better than a week or so ago...maybe in another couple weeks I'll be back to normal...trying not to over do it.

Today, finished cleaning out a garage full of archery equipment...well, not exactly finished. Just finalized separating trash from any equipment, machine/fixture parts etc. Still have some electrical that needs to be removed...hopefully this week.

Minor (very) instruction in helping get 4 new shooters flinging arrows. I wish I could have spent more time with them but that would have got into "coaching". Hopefully they'll be back soon and will be interested in learning a thing or two.

Hopefully tomorrow I can find some arrows for the light weight recurve and fling a few...I'm missing the recurve shooting.


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## Matthew Warren

I got off my butt and stuck a vegas target on a round hay bale at extended distances and practiced a bunch. My new BHFS/ MR set-up is treating me well.


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## sharkred7

Shot 2 more Vegas rounds after work this morning. Not necessarily the best way to practice after working all night but its better than not practicing. Ended up with a pair of 299's. Frustrating thing is my X count is good, just getting sloppy now and again. I try to let down every shot that doesn't feel right, still having a couple get away from me. Always low/low left, tells me I am not staying strong on those shots. Today the X count was 25 and 20. SHot both 9's in first or second end.

Its amazing to me the difference in skill it takes to consistently hit those couple extra shots that separate the great ones from the good ones.


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## swwishooter

Practice tonight went good, but still having follow-thru issues towards the ends of rounds. Playing with my draw length a bit, to see if I can slow down my movements a bit and create a more consistent float. Hoping to truly settle in tomorrow during practice.


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## Mahly

Bought a small 35k BTU heater for the garage.
Shot a 5 spot round at 8 yards. Still working on polishing new release technique, and grip technique (thanx to Alan and Padgett here for suggestions!).
Shot 60 inside out X with XXX arrows.
Started off a bit poorly (it IS only 8 yards...anything but the center of the X is questionable) but really started getting it about 1/2 way through.
Wasn't really keeping score as I knew they should all be Xs (but I did want at least I/O Xs) but was working on producing very good shots.
Took an extra moment or 2 after really good shots to actually ENJOY having shot them.
Worked on letting down when things aren't perfect.... getting better at that.
Heater helped as my bursa was fine until just the last couple rounds (hurts shooting in the cold).
Hand no longer getting "zapped" by whatever nerve was ticked off at my new hinge form.
All in all, not a bad day.


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## Padgett

Didn't get to shoot today but I worked with a few people on hinge shooting late last night and during the day today so it turned out to be a good archery day, I did screw up taking my muzzeloader out today because I had 5 does come in to 10 yards and it would have been a awesome archery shot for my destroyer. I did get some back straps hung up in the garage though.

I did do some reflecting on my shooting yesterday because it was a really good shooting day for me, it wasn't the most accurate day I have ever had but I felt so good and solid drawing the bow and at anchor executing the shot. I have been working on some guys with polishing up their shot routine from the time they load the arrow to the time they follow through and working with these guys has helped me really become solid.


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## ArcherXXX300

Tore apart pro edge elite that's giving me fits...re timed and put on new strings, set center shot to 13/16th, releveled sight, blank bailed shooting maybe 20 shots setting string, put peep in, tied peep in. Must say spiral x peg 1 hole short feels soooo much better and having equal timing on draw stops...we'll see if it'll tune tomorrow...well later today when I wake up if I can go to sleep ever. Waiting on the podium X still....


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## SonnyThomas

Eye issues again....Don't understand what's going on. Wearing my last new glasses I'd get disoriented ever so often. Taken them off and come out of it. Started using the cheapo department store glasses for reading. Yesterday when shooting I was fine. Started go out for another practice session and had to take my cheapo glasses off. I could see perfectly. Got side tracked. Got on the computer and still had to take my glasses off. I could read everything perfectly. Got up the this morning and back to wearing glasses....Heck if I know what's going on.....


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## SonnyThomas

Just back in. Hey, it's cold out there. Just checked the local weather. Temp, 25 degrees. Wind Chill, 19 degrees.
Didn't stay out long. Shot a half round on the 5 spot, 150/29 Xs. That dang arrow that went high, I got it in "jail"  Teach the sucker...

I thinks it's colder than the weather station says. Just now getting thawed out and sweatin' while typing this.....


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## swwishooter

I'm currently shooting out at the shop and I am noticing a trend. On my first arrow, I am consistently shooting straight high by 1" and cutting the 9-8 line on my Vegas target. The next 2 arrows I will hit the 10 or x. I believe I am pulling harder into the wall on the first arrow each end from being "fresh". Any advice on how not get yourself to relax a bit more on the first arrow?


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## Mahly

Perhaps a let down drill to warm up? Draw, anchor, aim, maybe just watch your float, then , good or bad, just let down. Repeat until your brain is ready.

Might just have to try that myself!
Today I hit the garage for some before work shooting. Inexplicably, my 2nd arrow was WAY left. Clear outside the X! Worst bit is I can't say why! The shot even felt good, and the float was inside the X! Frustrating those are. Times like that you wish you had a coach to see what went wrong.
I WAS working on polishing my draw... it's always been weird, decided there is a reason (other than old shoulder injury) that others don't draw like I do, and did find something.
After a few rounds, I did start to get settled on the X.

I don't like to change my stabs very often, but I was noticing a recurring theme of my level being a bit off, and having to correct it. Moved the side stab in a bit, and all was good again.

After that, the last few rounds were AWESOME! Outside of the arrow always touching the actual letter X.

Bursa got pissed sooner ( shot last night, and it was colder today) but I quit before it became an issue.


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## SonnyThomas

swwishooter said:


> I'm currently shooting out at the shop and I am noticing a trend. On *my first arrow*, I am consistently shooting straight* high by 1"* and cutting the 9-8 line on my Vegas target. The *next 2 arrows I will hit the 10 or x. *I believe I am pulling harder into the wall on the* first arrow each end *from being *"fresh". *Any advice on how not get yourself to relax a bit more on the first arrow?


If I'm understanding this correctly warming up won't help. So you're shooting, 3 arrows with first arrow high and 2 in. Of the next 3 the first arrow high and next 2 in? You said "end" and a end is 3 shots.


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## Mahly

Yep, I mis-read that. I thought it was first arrow of first end, not each end.


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## swwishooter

Mahly said:


> Yep, I mis-read that. I thought it was first arrow of first end, not each end.


Don't worry, it still is a feel thing. The drill is still helping me feel the correct location.

Ended up having company out at the shop, and shot a full round with the owner. Ended up shooting a 306 w/ 12x's and had an 8 get thrown in their somehow. Hope to drop my 9's down and try to keep it to 1 or 2 at a max during a round.


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## ILOVE3D

Went down to the indoor range due to being windy outside. Stuck up a 5 spot and switched dominator over to a wide blade and shot 2712's first time out of it. Not thrilled with results but no 4's. Didn't shoot a complete round of 60 arrows due to archery shop pro had indoor class for kids in there. Overall it was good practice due to the background noise and interruptions. Almost wondering if my 2712's with 150 grain tips are cut too short to really provide good results per some of the things I'm reading in another thread on here?


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## swwishooter

SonnyThomas said:


> If I'm understanding this correctly warming up won't help. So you're shooting, 3 arrows with first arrow high and 2 in. Of the next 3 the first arrow high and next 2 in? You said "end" and a end is 3 shots.


That is correct, the first shot on each end was going high. Then the next 2 shots on the same end would be in. Have any way to correct that besides working on feel?


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## Padgett

I had a weird day of indoor shooting, I put some gamma grip tape on my bow just before going to the range. I had taken it off 2 months ago and had been to lazy to go to academy and get some more so today I got it done. For the first 15 shots or so I was enjoying the feel of the grip tape which I absolutely love and can't believe I screwed around for 2 months without it on my bow so I really didn't notice until the last of my 15 warm up shots that all of them had been inside out 5-spot x's. I threw up a vegas target and shot a 26x round and I only missed one baby x on the first half but it wasn't a bad executed shot, it just missed by a 1/16 inch and I felt like it was a really good effort.

The second half of the round was different, I felt a certain amount of fatigue settle in for some reason and my rear hand locked up and I had a few let downs early in the second half and I mentally handled them well but the fatigue got worse and I was shooting way to deep into my shot and this is where the misses happened so I only had the 26x's in the end. I took a short break and talked to the shop guy and then shot for another 50 minutes at the vegas target and hit every stinking one of those little x's, I did make a mental effort to run a smooth engine to start out and the I just followed through into the baby x for the last 35 minutes and enjoyed the shooting.

To me these are the types of things that I have to learn to deal with quicker when they happen because I was shooting way to good today to have a 10 minute brain fart in the middle of a scoring round. I have thought about it a lot tonight and I really can't put a finger on why it happened, Yeah I had some fatigue settle in but it wasn't messing with my float, it was more of a numb feeling over my hand and forearm and back tension being used that made my shot just sit there doing nothing. I can honestly say that I wasn't feeling any stress or pressure because I was alone on the range, I can also say that by consciously thinking about my firing engine and running it smoothly for a few shots really fixed the problem and allowed my to finish up with a nice 45 or so awesome feeling shots.


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## sharkred7

I work nights and get done as the range opens in the morning. Today could not shoot until late afternoon due to other commitments and a kids broken down car. No sleep in 30+ hours. NOT conducive to shooting. I shot my first four of the year and only had 53X's. Soooo, does that mean it was a wasted day at the range? Nope. I tend to learn more from my mistakes ( I should be a freaking genius by now!) I learned what happens when I'm tired, focus not there. Had to force myself to focus on my shot process. Flinging arrows is never good practice. Another problem I have is eye focus. When my eyes get tired I tend to see 2 targets and I hate closing or squinting one eye. I'm much more relaxed when I have both eyes open. Today had a couple shos break beautiful and missed straight left, I then noticed that I was seeing 2 targets like a sideways 8.

The lesson that can be learned is ALWAYS take something from your shooting and learn from it. If you miss a X or shoot the wrong target at a tournament all is not lost. Take the opportunity to work on part of your game under pressure. You paid to be there, make the most of it.

John


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## jpotter

Had to go to back-up while my primary bow is getting new limb, using backtension w/wrist release is much easier after using BT release for 6 months. My float is steady now so dont have to pay so much attention to it now, more of a distraction while learning
so finally fully trusting the float is a big hurdle for me, much easier to slide into shot execution now, as mentioned above the trust is the thing that has to be developed through repetition, for me. Great new plateau to explore. And this forum has helped tremendously in that regard. Appreciate all of the opinions coming from experienced shooters. Time tested at that.


----------



## Shabbona

SonnyThomas said:


> Eye issues again....Don't understand what's going on. Wearing my last new glasses I'd get disoriented ever so often. Taken them off and come out of it. Started using the cheapo department store glasses for reading. Yesterday when shooting I was fine. Started go out for another practice session and had to take my cheapo glasses off. I could see perfectly. Got side tracked. Got on the computer and still had to take my glasses off. I could read everything perfectly. Got up the this morning and back to wearing glasses....Heck if I know what's going on.....


When your sugar levels are high you will have more swelling in your cornea and more problems with your vision.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Shabbona said:


> When your sugar levels are high you will have more swelling in your cornea and more problems with your vision.


I'm a diabetic. Watch my blood numbers. It's only been since I got my new glasses that I've had issues. Of all things, I donated my old glasses to the local Lion's Club they help the needy.


----------



## SonnyThomas

8 degrees out this morning. Took dad to therapy, got a hair cut, came home, sun shining on thermometer, 20 degrees....Tried to shoot, but 3 shots and I was headed for the house.....


----------



## Mahly

3 more than I got in! It's COLD!!! Maybe some hinge practice with big rubber band.


----------



## sharkred7

After yesterday's poor shooting I went and shot a couple Vegas round today. After having so much trouble staying strong in the shot I took 2 lbs off my draw weight. Also got some sleep today before I shot. 
The results, 300 23x and 300 28x (best ever for me) shooting the Eason X23's


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## Padgett

I finally got to the range at 4pm today and got to shoot for a hour, I felt awesome right from the first shot but in the 15 warm up shots that I took I missed two 5-spot x's out the top about a quarter inch. I was feeling very strong and just pulled into the wall way to hard those two misses, then I put up a fresh target and shot the last 50 minutes without missing again. After warming up I really think I only had one shot that I wasn't happy with, it hit dead center but just as I released the thumb peg my body shifted back on my heals and I had to try and recover and I went right past to the balls of my feet and the release fired. I should have let down but I didn't and that really was the only poor shot out of 80 or so shots after warming up.

The one thing right now that I am most excited about is my follow through, I haven't focused on it in a long time but during this effort that I am making right now to peak I am not thinking about training or form or anything else other than blasting the center of baby vegas x's. I am a good shooter most of the time but when I focus on following into the center of the baby x I am a very very good shooter.


----------



## Shabbona

SonnyThomas said:


> I'm a diabetic. Watch my blood numbers. It's only been since I got my new glasses that I've had issues. Of all things, I donated my old glasses to the local Lion's Club they help the needy.


Sometimes even if your vision isn't fluctuating, new glasses, especially if they are progressives take time to adjust to.


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## Padgett

I showed up to the range at 2:05 and they closed early so I didn't get to shoot, now that is a total failure not knowing they were going to close early on new years eve.


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## Mahly

Got to shoot at my new club (Tuesday actually) and continued to work on my draw, hold, and firing engine.
Assumed (Correctly) that my new grip may be effecting the tune of my bow. and began bare shaft tuning.
Also decided to finally throw a couple tied nocks under my arrow nock inside the D-loop....as long as we are tuning, might as well get all the changed in.
A friend wanted to "check out" my bow, and commented on the firm back wall, so I have to move the string stops back to match the Limb stops so he could feel a REAL solid back wall. Decided to go a round with it like that instead of moving it back....oddly, the size of my float was cut in half!
Guess maybe I HAVE been shooting too short of a bow after all!
Finally got it tuned to where I can shoot Xs with and without bare shafts, and they sit the same in the target.
Now I only have to decide if I should put a couple twists in the cables so I can move my string stops forward again (less let-off, softer back wall for my hinge), or leave well enough alone.
I have started coming to the conclusion that my plateau may not have come completely from lack of form, or anything else, but from a lack of practice.
I think my firing engine and hinge set-up are better, but if my new grip is changing the tune of the bow, maybe my old grip WAS better. I've decided to stop messing with it, and pick ONE grip, and practice the hell out of it until I am convinced it isn't my level of practice holding me back.

More shooting in the future.


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## swwishooter

Shot a tournament last night at a club by Madison. A lot of quality shooter, a few pros thrown in their also. Ended up shooting my personal best at a tournament, but was having grip issues that were holding me back a bit. Made it to a 1 arrow shootdown to decide my flight. Drilled the X, as it was probably my best shot of the night. Ended up shooting against Don Ward in the flights, and we were even through 4 of the 6 arrows. Fifth arrow I made a mistake and shot a 9. I knew it was over at that point, but still good shooting and fun times last night.


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## SonnyThomas

Shot bit of short practice, 30 or 40 shots. Cold, 32 degrees, overcast and a bit of a breeze that kept my eyes watering. Using a single spot and kept all in the X (kind of ugly) except 1 (I hammered it). Tried different back tension stuff I've read in here. Still in the X ring, but more lefts and more lows and I can't say I gave it a fair shake because of the weather.


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## jbeasleyshoot

I keep swapping stuff around then try to practice outside in horrible conditions. I gotta get settled and work on my form. Shot an indoor tournament this mornin and it was about average. More practice is needed to improve for indoor. Stick with something and practice is the ticket


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## SonnyThomas

Put up a new single spot. Both bows again, but 20 with the MarXman and 10 with the MX2. Another 30 shots for 150 / 29 Xs. One shot just low. Probably the same arrow I put in jail the other day. I was going to number all, but the ink pens in my bow case were to cold to write...me too.


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## Mahly

Continued working on draw and grip.
Back to using the limb stops (long story) so also trying different firing engines as well.
MUCH tighter groups today... Some unusual muscle tiredness between the traps and rhomboids.
Further down the rabbit hole we go.


----------



## ILOVE3D

Went up to northern AZ to visit the grandkids for the weekend and didn't bring the bow. WOW, it was 10 degrees outside this morning. I will admin I must be a wuss, I can't imagine shooting outside in this type of weather for anything other then hunting. I miss my weather in southern AZ for sure. I did bring up my string and did practice my hinge with the string a bit.


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## SonnyThomas

ILOVE3D said:


> Went up to northern AZ to visit the grandkids for the weekend and didn't bring the bow. WOW, it was 10 degrees outside this morning. I will admin I must be a wuss, I can't imagine shooting outside in this type of weather for anything other then hunting. I miss my weather in southern AZ for sure. I did bring up my string and did practice my hinge with the string a bit.


Your string, how do you have it set up? I had a hinge practice device made up as instructed by Doug Springer (Stanislawski), but no give and switching to the bow it was all different....


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## Mahly

I have a huge rubber band that I tie d-loop cord to. I can adjust the draw length and holding weight by grabbing more or less of the band.


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## SonnyThomas

Mahly said:


> I have a huge rubber band that I tie d-loop cord to. I can adjust the draw length and holding weight by grabbing more or less of the band.


Thought about a spring, but like the idea of it whacking hand. And then someone liked it, borrowed it and forgot to bring it back... Things are looking up though. Someone brought back my allen wrenches after two years....and they weren't wore out


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## Mahly

Sometimes your the windshield, sometimes your the bug.
LOL


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## SonnyThomas

Blah day. Woke up and raining. Thought about shooting in garage using 10 yards. Blah attitude, no sense in shooting... High point of the day, Crackers rode up to mail box with me. Tickled her to death. Oh, mail box is about 200 yards from the house...and then raining.


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## Padgett

I ended up having two days off because of new years but I got into the shot yesterday and today and I shot ok but it was amazing how just two days off really forced me to get back up and running on all 8 cylinders. My shooting was average for the first half of each day but by the end of the session each day I was back to banging x's and was able to leave the shot happy with my efforts.


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## possum trapper

shot the Iowa pro am this weekend.first tourney for me since march 2013


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## unclejane

worked through my first "trust" issue with my hinge technique through most of today. Started yesterday where I was virtually freezing up during the final phase right before the release was to fire, felt almost like an anticipation issue. I've been trying a lot of different variations on the technique that have been offered in the other threads, so I was probably on early-motor-skill "overload" (and was doing some other distracting experiments too). 

But I'm most of the way through it this evening; just putting the dot on the x in the bathroom and simply "trusting" that somehow, using at least one of the items I've tried, the hinge will go off. Sure enough, went off every time. 

So that indicates I'm sort of, -ish, starting to see the dawn of an automated release technique that I will eventually be able to rely on. The beginning of one anyway. Just need to stay on that roll...

LS


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## ILOVE3D

SonnyThomas said:


> Your string, how do you have it set up? I had a hinge practice device made up as instructed by Doug Springer (Stanislawski), but no give and switching to the bow it was all different....


I actually have about a16" piece of riser complete with the handle portion, arrow shelf and the mounting screws for a sight. I drilled two holes in it from front to back at both ends of the riser section then ran my d loop nylon material through each hole and secured it so it matches my draw length. I also have a loop in the end of it I hook my hinge in. I can practice just the firing mechanism or sometimes I attach a sight to it and practice sighting at a target. although there is no peep involved it still adds some reality to the practice.


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## SonnyThomas

It's 9 above with wind chill of 3 above. Terminator; "I'll be back." 

Back. My sub motor scooter skill conscious whatever couldn't take more than 10 shots....Snow flakes weren't helping either...


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## swwishooter

Shot a full round today at the shop. Shot a 309 out of 330, with 7 weak shots that resulted in 9's. 16x's is a good sign of improvement, but I need to focus the whole round.


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## nochance

possum trapper said:


> shot the Iowa pro am this weekend.first tourney for me since march 2013


Well? How'd you do?


----------



## Rick!

Over the last 4 days;
Helped rebuild 3 target butts,
Shot a couple 5 spot rounds at 20 yards - bow felt different after taking a week off.
Signed up a new club member.
Shot a 10yd vegas round and still felt long. Twisted up the string 1 1/2 turns, added 1oz on the front and now things feel real good.


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## montigre

yesterday: Gave a quick lesson to a new shooter at the shop and got her back on target. Then shot for about an hour working on some details--letting the bow talk to me.


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## SonnyThomas

What will I be doing? 5.7" of snow and not liking the idea of 4 above zero.....


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## cbrunson

450 Vegas warm up Shoot Saturday - Finished 5th with 447-30X
Leagues start back up for the new year tonight, and Thursday.
Another big 450 Vegas warm up in two weeks, then another 300 tournament the week after.

January is busy. I could hit two more shoots if I wanted to.


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## SonnyThomas

cbrunson, good luck... 450 Warm Ups? These state events? Member of the NFAA back to 2001 and not once has our state or even a Indoor range held a 450 Vegas. I can't even remember a 300 Vegas, period. Now, we have a 600 Vegas for the Aggregates, one per our 3 Zones, northern, central and southern. After this no one I know of shoots the Vegas face except like the Midwest Open and it's scored 1 for the X. NFAA 5 spot, followed with the Vegas. So 360 and 330 for 690. Chance B. holds the record with 689.


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## cbrunson

SonnyThomas said:


> cbrunson, good luck... 450 Warm Ups? These state events? Member of the NFAA back to 2001 and not once has our state or even a Indoor range held a 450 Vegas. I can't even remember a 300 Vegas, period. Now, we have a 600 Vegas for the Aggregates, one per our 3 Zones, northern, central and southern. After this no one I know of shoots the Vegas face except like the Midwest Open and it's scored 1 for the X. NFAA 5 spot, followed with the Vegas. So 360 and 330 for 690. Chance B. holds the record with 689.


450s are getting fairly popular around here. They are money shoots that draw a lot of interest for practice leading up to the Vegas shoot. A lot of the guys around here go to Vegas every year. Different clubs across the state host several of these "warm up" shoots. There are a few state shoots with the Vegas face as well. Lancaster is in a few weeks and they use the Vegas face with baby Xs as 11s. There are a few guys from here going to Lancaster. NFAA State is a ways off yet. We won't shoot the big X targets for a couple months except for leagues.


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## EPLC

The 450 round is very popular here as well.


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## cbrunson

EPLC said:


> The 450 round is very popular here as well.


I think it is because they extend the mental game. More 300s are shot when you are shooting for a 450. Good practice for Vegas.


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## jpotter

New bow specifically for spots. 5" longer than my hunting/3d bow, and Im completely in love with it. Tons of fun when you get a diff. bow.


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## possum trapper

nochance said:


> Well? How'd you do?


I didn't shoot very well shot a 300 57x on the 5 spot and a 300 21x on the vegas round but im back shooting


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## SonnyThomas

SonnyThomas said:


> What will I be doing? 5.7" of snow and not liking the idea of 4 above zero.....


Plowed out my 35 yard practice, but I got just a bit chilled. Drive turn around, 25 yards round, drive 150 yards long, plowed around the mail box so the mailman could get to it..... After I broke the frozen snow off my jacket I decided to stay in where it was warmer...6 degrees and wind chill of -3. I did think about fling a few arrows though.


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## 45 x

Worked...plowed snow
Finally home , I'm tired of being tired , good night.


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## Padgett

I got into the bow shop and shot for 15 minutes and a brand new shooter showed up with her bow, she is around 50 years old and she got the bow for x-mas. She has been in the bow shop two times lately shooting when I show up and as soon as I sit my bow down she puts her stuff up and leaves, tonight I made sure and talked to her and moved up to 15 yards and shot with her. After a few shots she needed help with her peep and I got it turning decent and then I helped her with her form and got her shooting her release with back tension, it was a 20 dollar cobra release but she liked how it felt to shoot back tension. 

I planned on just banging some x's but it was nice to just relax and work with someone.


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## unclejane

- just ended 2nd rest day and have decided to continue resting as I monitor soreness/aches/pains in my arms. Continuing shooting through innocuous pains until they became not innocuous pains but major damage is what halted my archery career the first time around. Not anxious to repeat that mistake again. And besides I haven't scored a target face in almost 15 years and am not in a hurry to right now. Fortunately, the old injury hasn't flared up; these are new pains. So I'm confident that I'm not reopening old wounds and resting till the pains heal up will do the trick.
- sent my defective backup Honey Do back to Carter today. It was new but had some of the strangest damage I've ever seen. Maybe it was an old, failed prototype model that left the factory by accident. When I called them, it sounded like they were going to take care of it right away (under warranty).
- having strange thoughts of shooting my Hoyt Tribute with finger release and a clicker when it comes in, IF it ever comes in (starting to have my doubts now lol). I was originally thinking it was going to be my indoor spot bow, but my PSE is turning out to work so well for that, it may be redundant to shoot the Tribute with a release aid. If it's comfy as a finger bow, I could shoot freestyle limited with it. I put a lot LOT of work into finger technique over the years; it'd be nice if I could preserve it with a bow that's comfy for me to shoot fingers with...

LS


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## SonnyThomas

Wind chill -17. Winds to pick up, 22, gusting 30. Tonight, wind chill forecast -30 to -35 below.

Have to see how it goes. Couple of us were meet up at Pekin to do some archery buy/swap.

Some guys are hanging it up. Cost of new bows? Not worth the cost to compete? $65 for NFAA membership here and $35 per Championship. Not really delightful to shell out $100 for your first shoot and a Made-in-China medal.....if you place. Dues, entry fees for the year, $170.00. Indoor Championship coming would be a overnight stay for me, two day Championship.


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## cbrunson

Finally cleaned my Vegas league handicap spot last night with a 300-24x. I decided to try a kisser button to help with some vertical issues I've been having. It took a game to get used to it. Moved some weights around and then settled in. I think I may leave the kisser on for a while.


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## SonnyThomas

cbrunson said:


> Finally cleaned my Vegas league handicap spot last night with a 300-24x. I decided to try a kisser button to help with some vertical issues I've been having. It took a game to get used to it. Moved some weights around and then settled in. I think I may leave the kisser on for a while.


I went through this, vertical issues. For me it more often than not it was peep height and sometimes just a hair difference makes the difference.


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## Brad5155

Shot my first league last night so I've spent the morning trying to figure out the scoring system and why it seemed different than what I've read on the internet. Apparently our league counts 6's instead of X's. I'm not sure what the reason behind that is but I'll find out. That being said I'd like to have an idea as to where I stand and then be able to guage my improvements. Counting the 6's apparently doesn't give you a true 300 round score am I correct? So for leagues sake its no big deal but I'll need to convert that to a true 300 round score to really gauge my improvements on a standard/national scale yes? Some observations from a newbie:

1. Shooting right next to someone is a whole new ballgame
2. Long stabilizers galore, i was beginning to get a complex what with my shorty
3. My small carbon arrows vs thick aluminums is a definite disadvantage that I'll embrace

Anyway, first post here in the forum. I hope I can learn a thing or two from you all


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## sharkred7

After a struggle at the IA proam I got with my coach to see what was going on. Had a hard time seeing in IA and could not get my release to go off. Felt like I was pulling through the shot and would end up creeping.

Tore my bow completely down and reset it up, the draw length had increased by almost 3/8". Shortened every thing back to where it was. Hands were softer on the release. Put my fiber back in and headed to league. Sighted it in and coasted to an easy 59X for the first league score. Never crept once and the only one I missed I heeled the bow a tad and shot just out the top. Feeling much better, just amazes me how critical draw length is.
John


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## Padgett

I did everything but make it to the range, I haven't hardly got to shoot this week and it is killing me.


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## unclejane

Tell me about it. I'm on rest day #4, haven't picked up the bow since Sun. have twinges/pains in both arms, but a little more on the right that are behaving like rotator cuff. So resting until I'm convinced whatever it is has healed up. A lesson of the past when I kept trying to shoot through pain, even if it seems innocent. Fortunately, doesn't appear that I've actually damaged anything, just strained it and it seems to be healing up. 

But I may be in for another slow buildup if I end up sitting out for a couple more days.

LS


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## sharkred7

Took the day off and head to league tomorrow


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## SonnyThomas

Well, we survived the night after all the power outages. Something new for me. I have a Dell computer, Windows 7 upgrade and some trick or power cell. Okay, I'm on Dial Up, out in the country. Power would go out, but I would get message "Save" whatever and I'd click it and then the computer would go down. I was replying to Holding thread, had not clicked "Submit Reply," but when I got back on line there was what I had started as a reply...Weird, I thought....


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## Padgett

I only have a hour and a half after school to shoot and today I had to feed and deliver my kid and then I only had 45 minutes to shoot and then deliver her to her ball game. Once I got to the shop another person was shooting which slowed me down and my best friend showed up to talk for a few and then I got two phone calls. I think I got to shoot for 20 minutes total.

As far as my shooting I started out just warming up and I got to shoot about 15 shots and I was all over the place and actually missed the 5-spot x probably 5 times just a little. After the phone calls and my buddy dropping in I pushed the mental reset button and there they were, my perfect executions and I finished up with maybe 20 awesome shots where almost all of them were dead center and then if they missed dead center they were still inside out.

All in all I was glad to get to shoot, I know that lately I have been throwing out a lot that I haven't hardly been missing any x's at all. To be honest it was a shock to actually miss 5 of them in such a short amount of time but it was a great reminder to me that when I run my shot with the intentions of perfect shots I am now getting them almost every time.


----------



## Lazarus

This morning I threw about three pounds more weight on the bow. Ok. It's was only about 6 more oz on the back and 4 more ounces on the front, but it felt like 3 pounds. And I immediately proved to myself (my opinion) what is the most common cause of the low hold, not building the muscles that hold the mass up. I'll work on it. May even throw some more weight on for good measure. If a little is good a lot is better, right?


----------



## cbrunson

Lazarus said:


> This morning I threw about three pounds more weight on the bow. Ok. It's was only about 6 more oz on the back and 4 more ounces on the front, but it felt like 3 pounds. And I immediately proved to myself (my opinion) what is the most common cause of the low hold, not building the muscles that hold the mass up. I'll work on it. May even throw some more weight on for good measure. If a little is good a lot is better, right?


Sure slows down the dot though doesn't it?


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## Lazarus

cbrunson said:


> Sure slows down the dot though doesn't it?


Sure does.......locks 'er down. Right about 1/2" below the intersection of the x. :teeth:


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## SonnyThomas

Don't hear of him much, but Bernie says; Add-on little at a time to build yourself up. Friend went too far. He got to hurting trying to copy one of the Big Boys. His bow now weighs less than mine and mine weighs right at 7 1/2 pounds.


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## Lazarus

I look at it a little different that most Sonny. (Big surprise.) Obviously I'd never do that the day before a tournament. But I'll throw a bunch of weight on a bow and discipline myself to shoot it. I've said it before, I tend to want to practice under stress. It's just something I toy with.


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## jpotter

Grip is good just working on follow through. Last 3 ends were perfect. Just have to start out that way.Patience and lots of good practice.


----------



## ILOVE3D

Went down to the pro shop and shot a vegas round today then a 5 spot but didn't keep score on the 5 spot. I changed around lenses and different dot sizes just playing then. I went back to my first setup I shot the Vegas round with. Targets 1 and 2 were all 10's or X's with the exception of a 9 on each. Target 3 on the other hand was a different story, I shot 3 10's and the other 7 were 9's at 3 oclock. I am thinking a weak shot on the third. I watched for hand placement and it was or at least seemed good all the way through. It seemed like when the shot went off I frequently called it a 3 o'clock shot and sure enough. Was bummed today after and just need to figure out what it was, perhaps tired, weak shot or??? Tomorrow is our pre-Vegas ABFAA shoot up the road 2 hours. Hopefully I can do better on the 3rd target. I always shoot 1, then 3 then move to the upper one for 3rd shot.


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## swwishooter

Playing around with my arrow build for 3d, but am still in spot mode. Shot a bit tonight, but was working more on my execution if anything. Ive been having issues lately where I will not be relaxing my release hand enough. Hopefully I can get a full round of Vegas in tomorrow night.


----------



## cbrunson

swwishooter said:


> Playing around with my arrow build for 3d, but am still in spot mode. Shot a bit tonight, but was working more on my execution if anything. Ive been having issues lately where I will not be relaxing my release hand enough. Hopefully I can get a full round of Vegas in tomorrow night.


I need to get my outdoor shafts ordered. As soon as Vegas is over I will start shooting my skinny arrows. I am going to change a few things this year, and shoot outside as much as the weather will let me, to get ready for Redding.


----------



## sharkred7

Followed up Wednesdays league score of 359 with a 358 at league tonight. Bow feels sooo much better, able to execute a good shot sequence. Need to build on this platform and get it mind numbingly repeatable! Have a 495 vegas shoot tomorrow so we will see how much I can transfer my league shooting to a tournament. Will update tomorrow night!


----------



## Padgett

Today I actually got to shoot for a full hour and 10 minutes after work and I did a few let downs when warming up and studied my float and then shot 15 or so arrows only missing 2 x's during the warm up and then I put up a fresh 5-spot target. I was only shooting 3 arrows so I shot the top two spots and the center for half the time and then the last 20 minutes I shoot the bottom two spots which are fresh and the center. I really like this way of using a 5-spot target because you get to develop holes on the top and shoot with them and then go to the bottom two and have fresh spots with no holes except for the middle spot that gets shot the whole session.

NOW FOR THE COOL PART

for the first time ever I shot for about 50 minutes and they were all inside out x's except for 3 shots that touched the line and I made holes in all 5 locations on the target. The three that did touch were solid and on the inside, none were on the outside looking in. That isn't the cool part, the cool part is that for the first 15 or so shots I was concentrating on squeezing my ring and middle finger and I was freezing up and going into the latter half of my shot and it sucked, so even though I was hitting dead center it just wasn't right and I wouldn't consider the shots perfect shots. So, I did one simple thing right before drawing the bow. I told myself to "Just Let It Go", I haven't used that exact phrase ever before. I have a similar one but for some reason this one came to mind and what it meant was to just let the arrow go to the center of the x, now that is to long of a phrase to say each shot so I shortened it to Just Let It Go. Holy crap did things tighten up when it comes to my float and my execution of the shot, this simple little phrase allowed me to have one of the tightest 40 minutes of shooting I have ever experienced. 

I have been talking about peaking my shooting for a couple weeks and debating on here with a variety of guys about things and the subjects we have been covering are really allowing me to move on to a new level.

Today was a good day.


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## SonnyThomas

Finally above 10 degrees. Guess what I'm going to do.....


----------



## unclejane

Got my Hoyt Tribute in yesterday, and just got done with the first stage of setup and tuning. Holy moly, what a bear this thing has been to tune. The fault of the Indian trying to do the tuning, mostly. I don't think I've ever been through more permutations of adjustments to get a nominal bareshaft than with this one. I darn near wore out the EZ press today.... The funny part is what I've ended up with is a totally plain-jane bow:

- 4 turns out on each limb bolt (I calculate approx. 35lbs on the peak weight here)
- knocking point right at level
- wheels positioned identically at brace height
- equal tiller
- rest centershot right down the "middle".

This gives me virtually perfect BS's at about 8 yards, so I'm calling it close enough for now.

The only oddity is a bizarre knock-high bareshaft when the peak weight is lowered all the way down. And that might have been because the wheel timing was off at the time, but I'm not touching it now that it's shooting a good BS.

But what a walk down Memory Lane shooting a 45" Hoyt wheel bow again. Everything else is all new, but it feels like back in the old days when Terry Ragsdale and Dee Wilde were winning all the tournaments lol...

LS


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## unclejane

PS: here's my bareshafts at approx 7-8 yards inside the apt. with the Tribute. Interestingly, the red and white knocked shafts were going knock high compared to the green knocked earlier on a very consistent basis. The last adjustment I made today was one turn in the bus cable for the lower wheel, which was advanced at brace height slightly more than the upper wheel. That brought them both to the same position at BH.

Now all 3 of my bares group together and seem to fly straight. Maybe there's something to this here tuning with way too dang stiff arrows LOL....

Next, is to go down to the shop and check it at 20 yards to see where I'm at.... 

LS


----------



## sharkred7

Well I went to my 495 vegas shoot today and walked out with not only my best score, but my best score in a tournament by far. 449 with 35 babies for a 484. Very happy with the way it went. Got sloppy in the middle third as I let my mind drift to thinking about a score. Shut that out to finish strong. I feel like I'm getting close to believing I can go to he next level. I know I can SHOOT at that level as long as I focus on the moment.

Today was a good day!

John


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## SonnyThomas

SonnyThomas said:


> Finally above 10 degrees. Guess what I'm going to do.....


Well, I sort of chickened out. It might have been 11 degrees out, but the wind sure made it feel like -11 degrees. So maybe the cold have something to do with my few shots. First two shots from my MarXman had both arrows hit high in the top of the 5 bull's eye. The next two banged the X. Knew I couldn't take much the wind blown 11 degrees, so I got out my MX2. Wow! First two shots had the both arrows hit low bottom in the 5 bull's eye. Next two banged the X. Yep, all I could stand were the 8 shots....I'm a pansy, I guess....


----------



## SonnyThomas

Forgot.... It's 4:36 am here in Central Illinois. Why am I up? The wife and I went to bed earlier than usual, around 9:30 last night. So about 3:00 am our Lab went roaring past the bedroom window. Crackers, female that she it, has a growl like a grizzly bear. What upset her is beyond me, ***** coyotes close by and more than deer wandering in the yard. They come close. One morning a doe was feeding just on the other side of chicken pen, 25 yards tops. Laying bed one more looking the window I watched a doe feeding right to between the clothes lines and Crackers dog house. Stupid dog never even woke up. The only thing that scared the deer off was it realizing where it was about 15 yards from the house. Yep, right out in the middle of deer country. Hunters complain of not seeing a deer and we've counted as high as 32 in the field next ours. ??? Yesterday I had 6 deer in our little field right next to the driveway. They just looked while I drove on. Still there when I came back 5 minutes later.
January, this around the time they herd up for whatever reason. Wife was out walking one snowy day and after a mile or so she decided to sit down for a break, two of our dogs with her, sitting right next to her. She then wonders about the big brown rocks all the way around her. Those brown rocks were deer curled up asleep. Wife said there were right at 30 of them and she walked right in to the middle of them...


----------



## Lazarus

Sonny......It got up to 32 here yesterday with a good stiff south wind so I shot for at least an hour outside just for you. :teeth: Was really kind of worried about the transition back to long distance after shooting inside for a month. No problem. Hold was rock solid. Really going to *work* on letting go (outside) a couple seconds sooner though.

Most of what I did aside from that was figuring out ways to induce stress into practice.


----------



## cbrunson

sharkred7 said:


> Well I went to my 495 vegas shoot today and walked out with not only my best score, but my best score in a tournament by far. 449 with 35 babies for a 484. Very happy with the way it went. Got sloppy in the middle third as I let my mind drift to thinking about a score. Shut that out to finish strong. I feel like I'm getting close to believing I can go to he next level. I know I can SHOOT at that level as long as I focus on the moment.
> 
> Today was a good day!
> 
> John


Good shooting! Congrats. 

I've got another one coming up. I'm very close to shooting clean. My last in practice was 449-34x. Last in competition was 447-30x. Around here they just do 450 with X tie breakers.


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## cbrunson

Lazarus said:


> Most of what I did aside from that was figuring out ways to induce stress into practice.


So many don't get the importance of this.


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## swwishooter

I shot a little last night, but I mainly finished up my 3d arrow build. Built some Victory X-ringers that should be at the stiff end of the shootable spectrum and yet still get me in the mid 280's for speed. I also noticed a trend last night as I had a bit more movement in my pin than usual, and I believe it cames down to my shoes. When I'm wearing my work boots (steel toes), I am able to hold a tight pin movement. When I wear my running shoes, I will always have a bit more movement in my pin and I feel I physically wobble. I believe it comes down to the weight of the shows holding me in place, but it also may be the difference in show design based on purpose of use. Anyone else wear steel toes for shooting or have a specific shoe for shooting?


----------



## Rick!

Lazarus said:


> Most of what I did aside from that was figuring out ways to induce stress into practice.





cbrunson said:


> So many don't get the importance of this.


I play loud country or rock when I shoot but that doesn't build much stress. Maybe if I played both at the same time? 

Had a full line of 12 shooters at league Friday night - that does the trick for me but that's only once a week.


----------



## Lazarus

cbrunson said:


> So many don't get the importance of this.


True, but right now it's fairly easy. 

I shot 32 shots @ 40 yards under the lights this morning before daylight. It was 32 degrees. :teeth:


----------



## NoDeerInIowa

swwishooter said:


> I shot a little last night, but I mainly finished up my 3d arrow build. Built some Victory X-ringers that should be at the stiff end of the shootable spectrum and yet still get me in the mid 280's for speed. I also noticed a trend last night as I had a bit more movement in my pin than usual, and I believe it cames down to my shoes. When I'm wearing my work boots (steel toes), I am able to hold a tight pin movement. When I wear my running shoes, I will always have a bit more movement in my pin and I feel I physically wobble. I believe it comes down to the weight of the shows holding me in place, but it also may be the difference in show design based on purpose of use. Anyone else wear steel toes for shooting or have a specific shoe for shooting?


I find that a shoe or boot with a wider sole helps a lot with stability.


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## erdman41

Watched this video lol

http://youtu.be/JbJO6u0mLJ8


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## possum trapper

watched the cowboys get hosed after the lions were hosed last week and then went and shot a solid vegas practice round...the Elite Victory is a aiming machine


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## possum trapper

And trying to add to my post count so it makes me look like I know something


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## Fury90flier

Still not shooting but did do one good thing today....helped rebuild the bails at X10 archery.


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## acesbettor

Shot a lancaster warm up 450 round with elimination brackets afterwards. Got to see up close just how effortless Braden G. makes shooting a bow look! I qualified well and placed 7th so had a first rd. bye and then got knocked out in the 12 arrow elims. I only dropped 4x's but unfortunately one was a 9. I definitely learned that when i tense up, I focus on relaxing my release hand. It was amazing how easily my shot broke and I finished with 2 x's afer throwing that 9 and the pressure was off of me.


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## acesbettor

possum trapper said:


> And trying to add to my post count so it makes me look like I know something


+1 Lol


----------



## unclejane

K got to shoot the Tribute down at the local shop at their 20 yard range. The tune was pretty close, but the bareshaft was still slightly knock high impacting below the fletched a good 4 to 6". Borrowed an allen wrench and cranked the bottom limb in a half turn. The bow did respond, now the bare is only a couple inches below. I left for the day without trying a half turn out on the upper limb to see if that would dial it completely in. D'oh....

Got to shoot on a busy line with lots of other folks, kids shooting balloons and arrows whacking into the walls all over the place. Also got to meet and shoot alongside our state NFAA director and another really high level shooter. But even with all that going on, I still felt snug as a bug in a rug, packed in a bit like sardines. Almost felt like home again. And I was keeping it in or near the gold on a Vegas 3-spot even though I couldn't see my pin well and my tune wasn't 100%.

The Tribute is kind of heavy mass weight-wise and with a higher holding weight due to the lower letoff, so I really started to feel that after 10 or so arrows. But the long ATA I really like.... The squishy wall I actually found really nice with the hinge too. It doesn't aim as well as the PSE, but for some reason the hinge felt a little easier to use with the mushy wheel back wall....

LS


----------



## SonnyThomas

Lazarus said:


> Sonny......It got up to 32 here yesterday with a good stiff south wind so I shot for at least an hour outside just for you. :teeth: Was really kind of worried about the transition back to long distance after shooting inside for a month. No problem. Hold was rock solid. Really going to *work* on letting go (outside) a couple seconds sooner though.
> 
> Most of what I did aside from that was figuring out ways to induce stress into practice.





Lazarus said:


> True, but right now it's fairly easy.
> 
> I shot 32 shots @ 40 yards under the lights this morning before daylight. It was 32 degrees. :teeth:


Yeah, sure, rub it in....

Up, my time, 3:25 am. Rain, sleet and a snow flake and the forecast not good. So I made a trip to town to collect what the wife thought necessary just in case. Coming home the highways were trying to get slick, iced. Before we went to bed it was snow. Just what you need on top of ice. Little thirsty, I got up to get me some ice water and then looked out the window....Grrrrrrr! We've got some snow.... So, a bit of snow plowing first and then my Monday take dad to therapy session. This has cut down, dad's therapy. It was 3 days a week and now 2 days. So when I get home I'll plow some more snow. By the time I get done....Yeah, no shooting time left....


----------



## Lazarus

possum trapper said:


> watched the cowboys get hosed



With statements like the above.........^^^^^



possum trapper said:


> And trying to add to my post count so it makes me look like I know something


This isn't working........^^^^^ :teeth: Sorry, just had to. 

No shooting this morning........didn't get an early enough start, raining anyway.


----------



## cbrunson

possum trapper said:


> And trying to add to my post count so it makes me look like I know something


With that steelers avatar, it will be a tough sell regardless of your post count. :lol:


----------



## possum trapper

looks like we have some zingers this morning....


----------



## SonnyThomas

possum trapper said:


> looks like we have some zingers this morning....


Think of it this way, your not a Cub or Bears fan....


----------



## possum trapper

oh im a cub fan and oh how i miss having summers off and watching WGN at 115....then i had to grow up and work....more post count


----------



## possum trapper

and i thought they dressed up the Bears in Steelers uniforms last weekend during the playoff game


----------



## SonnyThomas

:faint:


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## swwishooter

possum trapper said:


> watched the cowboys get hosed after the lions were hosed last week and then went and shot a solid vegas practice round...the Elite Victory is a aiming machine


The cowboys didnt get hosed. The rule became famous for when Calvin Johnson did something similar but in the endzone. Calvin had WAY more control of that football but it was still ruled incomplete. I will say this tho, their was a fix going on by the refs for the cowboys till NY called the refs out on misplacing the balls 2 yards forward on a Jason Written catch. I am a "Packers Fan" but I'm also a realist and believe all sport beyond high school are fixed in some way. 

As you can tell I didn't shoot at all yesterday, but will be today.


----------



## Lazarus

swwishooter said:


> I will say this tho, their was a fix going on by the refs for the cowboys till NY called the refs out on misplacing the balls 2 yards forward on a Jason Written catch.


Bingo. X 1,000! They tried to steal the game with the whole world watching! Couldn't believe that. Also, the incomplete pass should have never even been called complete on the field. My 14 year old (who knows football) was standing in the living room screaming at the TV that it was incomplete before the challenge was even made. 

Back to topic. Can't wait to get home to shoot this evening. My muscles have rested for nearly 24 hours, I'm ready.


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## Padgett

I am 30 minutes from heading over to the range and shooting indoor for a hour or so, I am going to stop posting for a few minutes and write down a few things so that I can get off to a nice start.


----------



## Padgett

Here is my postie note for practice tonight:


Goals:

1. Enjoy the warm-up
2. Execute perfect shots 100% of the time
3. Bang inside out x's every time except for less than 4 arrows

Things to Remember:

1. "Just Let it Go"
2. Keep eyes off the target until I hit anchor.


----------



## Labs

Padgett said:


> Here is my postie note for practice tonight:
> 
> 
> Goals:
> 
> 1. Enjoy the warm-up
> 2. Execute perfect shots 100% of the time
> 3. Bang inside out x's every time except for less than 4 arrows
> 
> Things to Remember:
> 
> 1. "Just Let it Go"
> 2. Keep eyes off the target until I hit anchor.


Two quick questions... (sorry if I missed your explanation to this earlier)

1-why eyes off the target until anchor?
2-do you keep eyes off of 3D targets as well, until anchor.

thanks


----------



## swwishooter

Lazarus said:


> Bingo. X 1,000! They tried to steal the game with the whole world watching! Couldn't believe that. Also, the incomplete pass should have never even been called complete on the field. My 14 year old (who knows football) was standing in the living room screaming at the TV that it was incomplete before the challenge was even made.


The radio packer commentators started commenting on how each time the cowboys moved the ball, the refs would give them an extra yard and how the packers spots were dead on almost. The NFL would of had a lot of explaining to do had the cowboys completed the fix and someone even half watched the tape!


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## SonnyThomas

Just in....Don't shoot after you plowed snow, when your arms are tired and don't shoot when you hands are ice...


----------



## EPLC

Go PATS! Speaking of football refs. You couldn't have been a more lopsided game than the Pats/Ravens game. Pats won in spite of the bad calls, no calls and reversed catches.


----------



## possum trapper

swwishooter said:


> The cowboys didnt get hosed. The rule became famous for when Calvin Johnson did something similar but in the endzone. Calvin had WAY more control of that football but it was still ruled incomplete. I will say this tho, their was a fix going on by the refs for the cowboys till NY called the refs out on misplacing the balls 2 yards forward on a Jason Written catch. I am a "Packers Fan" but I'm also a realist and believe all sport beyond high school are fixed in some way.
> 
> As you can tell I didn't shoot at all yesterday, but will be today.


I didn't crawl out from under a rock and I know exactly what the rule is.He caught the ball.Who says you cant catch it one handed and who says you have to go to the body with the ball??No matter what fan you are if that would have happen to your team you would be complaining.3 feet down and a elbow trying to reach the goal line.

I have no dog in the fight common sense tells me it was a catch and a football move.Just like the tuck rule was a fumble.From what I seen the better team got sent home


----------



## possum trapper

Padgett said:


> Here is my postie note for practice tonight:
> 
> 
> Goals:
> 
> 1. Enjoy the warm-up
> 2. Execute perfect shots 100% of the time
> 3. Bang inside out x's every time except for less than 4 arrows
> 
> Things to Remember:
> 
> 1. "Just Let it Go"
> 2. Keep eyes off the target until I hit anchor.


where is your conscious mind gonna be thinking about?
why put 100% on anything?thats a lot of black and white.Why not tell yourself to make the best possible shot at that time no matter if its the 1st 15th or 30th arrow?
and if you miss one are you subtracting that from a perfect score or are you just adding up your 3 arrows(if its a vegas round)?say like I shot 3 good shots and I scored a 32.
Are you seeing yourself on the big stage while practicing?


----------



## cbrunson

possum trapper said:


> where is your conscious mind gonna be thinking about?
> why put 100% on anything?thats a lot of black and white.Why not tell yourself to make the best possible shot at that time no matter if its the 1st 15th or 30th arrow?
> and if you miss one are you subtracting that from a perfect score or are you just adding up your 3 arrows(if its a vegas round)?say like I shot 3 good shots and I scored a 32.
> Are you seeing yourself on the big stage while practicing?


That's kinda how I try to see it. Focus on the first shot. If that one went good. Move on to the next. If it went bad, let's not do that again..


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## possum trapper

there is no more important arrow than the one on your rest.its kinda like the time 6:58:53pm central time on 1\12\15...you will never get it back


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## Lazarus

possum trapper said:


> I didn't crawl out from under a rock and I know exactly what the rule is.He caught the ball.Who says you cant catch it one handed and who says you have to go to the body with the ball??No matter what fan you are if that would have happen to your team you would be complaining.3 feet down and a elbow trying to reach the goal line.
> 
> I have no dog in the fight common sense tells me it was a catch and a football move.Just like the tuck rule was a fumble.From what I seen the better team got sent home


Simple fact is, if he had simply caught the ball in the first place rather than trying to score a touchdown before he caught the ball he probably would have made the play. 1st and 10 at the 1. That's probably what his coaches need to be telling him. 

Kinda like....you have to shoot 1 perfect arrow 59 times before you can attempt to shoot a 60th for a perfect 5 Spot round. If you don't do that, how good you look on the 60th shot doesn't really matter. You still didn't get it done. And he didn't get it done because he was trying to shoot a 300/60 without completing the first step.


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## Rick!

I got my wife shooting at lunch, shot a few ends before helping the community ed intermediate youth archery class. Then the club had a meeting afterwards and I'm the new VP.


----------



## sharkred7

possum trapper said:


> I didn't crawl out from under a rock and I know exactly what the rule is.He caught the ball.Who says you cant catch it one handed and who says you have to go to the body with the ball??No matter what fan you are if that would have happen to your team you would be complaining.3 feet down and a elbow trying to reach the goal line.
> 
> I have no dog in the fight common sense tells me it was a catch and a football move.Just like the tuck rule was a fumble.From what I seen the better team got sent home


You are right, the better team got sent home LAST week. Cowgirls should never have been there.


----------



## sharkred7

Got a chance to get some practice in today. Shot 2 warm up ends on the Vegas target and then nocked out a 300 25x, 300 25x and a 300 21x. That is another personal best for me. Back to back to back 300's:shade: also a full day of shooting without a 9. The changes I made since the IA Proam seem to be working. Now I just have to get that feeling and the process down without to much conscious thought and TRUST the whole process

John


----------



## Padgett

Awesome, I am so glad that I got a couple responses to my post where I listed out the few things that I wanted on my mind for goals and things to remember. Right now i am trying to clean up my mental approach to beginning a shooting session and also manage the middle part of the session. Over the last few years I have had over a hundred 59x rounds where I had made it to the last shot and either failed to make that last x to get my 60x or got the 60x. I would say that I have only gotten 40 out of the 100 final shots to work out. Most of my misses happened in the beginning and I know that I probably had around 20 or so 59x rounds before I shot my first one, right now that final shot and the ability to mentally make it is not my issue. I have overcame that problem, right now is all about learning how to begin a round and manage the middle section of the round and be able to not have those freeze ups or mental wandering shots or issues that pop up that I force my self through. I want to be able to execute the same perfect shot all the time without having any small differences in them.

Just last week I had people talking to me and asking me questions at the beginning of my shooting session and I struggled to shoot perfect executions as they talked to me and I shot and then responded, last night I had the same thing happen and I was able to read my little postie note with my goals on it and I then cranked off many perfect executions right from the first shot of warm ups. So for me the little list of goals and things to remember really helped.


----------



## Padgett

One of my issues with high end shooting is that I find myself during a shooting session making very subtle changes in my mental outlook during the shooting and usually I find a sweet approach to rattling off many good shots. Then the next day it takes me a little while to get back to that point of remembering what little things I was doing that were really working, then the next day I am even quicker to respond mentally and be shooting awesome from the very first shot. Problem is when a couple days come where I can't make it into the shop to shoot and I seem to forget the little things, when I was just a average shooter I really couldn't see this happening but now that I am just not really missing anymore I can see it happening. I really need to just get a small 3x5 inch little note book and start writing down these little things at the end of my shooting sessions while they are fresh on my mind so that on the next day that I get to shoot I can start off right where I left off instead of wasting 20 shots getting there.


----------



## Padgett

Possum trapper, I really liked your Question

"where is your conscious mind gonna be thinking about?
why put 100% on anything?"

Last night here is where all of my conscious thought was at:

1. I consciously said to myself just before drawing my bow to Just let the arrow go to the center of the X, now the phrase I actaually say is "Just let it Go" I know what that shortened phrase means so I don't say the whole thing each shot.

2. Once to anchor the only conscious thing that I did was very smoothly ans slowly release the thumb peg to my index finger, and then the engine ran on its own.

I am currently on the fence on weather or not I should be thinking about anything at this point but it relaxes me and gives me something to do so I am not just standing there waiting for the shot to happen. I begin releasing the thumb peg right now as my pin starts settling on the x, I am not waiting for the pin to be perfect but as it comes to the x and begins to settle and then my engine begins running instantly without me telling it to. Neither the releasing of the thumb peg or running the engine has anything to do with the pin and what it is doing.

I can say that my pin is behaving itself right now and I am really not thinking about it hardly at all, it seems to be floating on the x 100% of the time and is not leaving the x. The only issue that I have been having is that my eyes blur on a regular basis.

In fact somebody asked why I am not looking at the spot during my pre shot process and during the draw cycle, Well the reason is that once I begin focusing on the x I don't blink anymore and after 10 or so seconds this is where I begin to blur and I need to blink to reset my vision and many times my engine has started and if I blink during the engine that is firing within 5 seconds it happens way to close to the blink. So last week when I was watching Terry Ragsdale shoot in his video I noticed that he didn't look at the spot until he had already gotten half way through the draw cycle and then he looked at the spot. So this week I have been working on this small change in my shot process and it is working just fine.

I haven't shot 3d yet this year so I don't know how I will handle focusing on the 12 ring or marker that I am using to make the shot, I am going to shoot a little local shoot this sunday and I have a feeling that this is when I will do it. More than likely I will do something very similar to last year where I focus on the spot with naked eye and though the binoculars and really nail down the spot that I want to aim at using markers. After I hook up my release to the d-loop I am going to spend 5 seconds or so focusing on the spot and then consciously blink a couple times to reset my vision and use this as my trigger to go ahead and draw. then during the draw cycle I will look watch the arrow on the rest about half way back and then find the spot that I have already nailed down as the spot to shoot.

When I have a big black pig at 45 yards in the shade this will be a shot where I spend a lot of time nailing down the spot to aim at probably without any markers and I will not take my eyes off the spot after hooking up the release to the d-loop and once I come to anchor I will do a blink after I settle in to reset my vision. I will already be on the spot that I want to hit when I take this blink and then after the blink I will release the thumb peg and begin my engine. I did this routine last year on very hard to see targets and it works really good for me on these few targets. I don't like doing this blink method on normal targets that have good markers or a visible 12 ring to aim at. I much prefer to do it like I shoot indoor.


----------



## Lazarus

Last night I shot 71 very strong shots of a 72 total. 

I have been really shooting hard the last week, averaging 75 or so shots a day which is not enough for me. But it's amazing to me how much improvement you can see by just getting back to a daily routine. It's huge, in just 10 days.


----------



## bseltzer

Well, I haven't shot one stinking arrow since last Friday :sad: I was just packing up to leave the range when a friend asked to have a look at my Stan MoreX Black Jack. As I handed it to him, it literally fell apart dropping the half moon, the pin it rotates around, and the screw security that pin onto the floor. So everything on the range comes to a screeching halt while 3 of us drop to our hands and knees looking for the stray pieces. Fifteen minutes of this yields the retaining screw and the half moon, but no pin. So I'm release-less until USPS gets the replacement pin Stan (Chris, actually) was kind enough to send out Priority Mail to me. Trust me... USPS has an entirely different idea of what "Priority" means, so here I sit.

Recognizing the potential mischief I could get into if left unengaged too long, I started reading the "Great Top Cam Advance Debate" thread elsewhere on the forum. Interesting read, but since I don't know beans about the topic, it of course motivated me to do a bunch of research, and one thing just led to another. Like the realization that I had no idea where the cam timing was on my recently re-strung PCE-XL. So that meant a trip to Ace Hardware to pick up the last few pieces needed to put the finishing touches on my miter saw stand draw board (Thanks you guys in the DIY forum). That done, I set about checking the bow's cam timing armed with more knowledge about the subject thnt I've ever had in my life. And WHOA!! what a revelation!! With the bow drawn to where to string stop on the bottom cam just barely make contact, the top control cable is a good 1/4 of an inch away from laying down straight on the flat part of the top cam. Serious top cam ******. So off I went for several iterations of press the bow, take one twist out of the control cable, unpress the bow, check ATA and BH, and recheck cam timing. Now I don't have a fancy shop set up, so this process took some considerable time. Long story short, 3 full twists out of the control cable, and the cams are now both hitting the stops dead nut simultaneously. ATA and BH are dead on Hoyt,s tuning spec's, and the DL is about 1/8" longer (shouldn't be an issue). Finally, the peak draw weight went up about a pound which also shouldn't be an issue. Since there was no clear conclusion about the advance/doen't advance the top cam after several pages of back and forth, I'm going to leave the cams synchronized for now, and see what other tuning points need attention far my cable tweaking. I'm thinking the nock point at the very least will need to be re-visited.

'Course I can't do anything about that until... yeah, wait for it... USPS shows up. So what did I do today? Same thing I've been doing since last Friday... Waiting

All because of one loose scew...

Note to self... Buy a backup release (*locally*) ASAP.


----------



## SonnyThomas

3 times out to day. Nice the first times and 12 degrees the 3rd time out. Still, trying to understand something I thought I did pretty good.


----------



## possum trapper

shot a couple vegas rounds last night 300 25x and followed it up with a 300 28x.pretty happy with that.think i have the new victory set up pretty decent


----------



## cbrunson

Shot Vegas league last night. 299-27x first game. One got away from me. 300-26x second game. I shot really solid with only 3 shots total outside my handicap which is a half shaft ten.


----------



## ride394

Haven't posted in a while, but last weekend I lengthened my draw length about 3/8" then went down to my local shop and shot at 10 yards just to get the feel for it. Tuesday I went to the local league and ended up shooting 18 points higher and 10 more x's then the previous week. I now know the detriments of having a DL that is too short and can now work on fine tuning and just general practice.


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## SonnyThomas

Weather better today. Just shot to have fun and relax...


----------



## Mahly

Went to my new club, retuned again with what I feel is my best grip.
Sighted back in after that and having only shot 8 yards.
Was GOING to start a new league (friend at the club suggested it, we ended up just not doing the league) so, tight on time, shot a score while sighting in.
299 41x
Not up to my normal yet, but was still sighting in ( and moved the sight the wrong way LOL! 3 rounds worth I kept moving farther away. Finally clicked, and started paying better attention LOL! Damage done), but my last 15 were 14 Xs.

Sighted in and feeling better, want to shorten my D loop a bit. But feeling confident I'll be in the lower 50s next time out.
We agreed to shoot twice a week, so now I'll get some practice in even in cold weather (haven't shot since my last report  ).


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## SonnyThomas

Went out again with purpose. Paying attention to letting the tension go. Pounded the X ring good.


----------



## ILOVE3D

Last night went down to the pro shop and shot a Vegas round run by the shop. Some of you guys should have been there and would have cleaned up. Highest score was a 297 and it wasn't me. I learned a valuable lesson though, if your shooting aluminum, check them regularly because I found out after 4 ends my number 1 arrow had a slight bend about midway leaving me with 4 9's on target 1. Finally wised up and changed out the arrow and started to hit 10's but damage had been done to my target and ego. Oh yeah, I ordered some Gold Tip Pro Triple X's this morning. Anybody want a good deal on ten 2712 Eclipse's that seem to be pretty straight and one that I know is bent!


----------



## cbrunson

Haha. A guy had a problem like that last night at 5-spot league. First arrow- X. Next four were 4s low right. A screw in his sight came loose. That hurts.

I shot okay. I was having some focusing issues with my right eye at the start and dropped a couple Xs. Then last end my dot dipped right as it fired and I dropped another X. Finished 300-57x


----------



## Padgett

Yesterday I had math tutoring after school and my daughters ball game after that so at 9:58 I went out in 29 degree darkness and set a bag at 15 yards under the light on the light pole and shot for 20 minutes. I really couldn't see my pin so I just lined up the scope on the bag and kind of shot the center, ended up being a little blank bale thing.


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## Padgett

Ilove3d, you are going to love the xxx's. I have shot them full length and at 30 inches of shaft and I think I like the 30 inch shafts better, I am not sure why so you could totally shoot them full shaft for now and then trim them later to 30 inches and go from there. I have always shot indoor with 150 grain pts in them when they were strictly indoor arrows.

I have shot full length feathers and blazers and 2 inch feathers on them during indoor and also really can't tell a accuracy difference. Right now it is the 2 inch shield cuts.

I would totally suggest that you cut them and install the points and the nocks and spend a day tuning your bow with the bare shafts first, then once you get them tuned then group tune the arrows. If you don't have a hooter shooter I would suggest just shooting at a 5-spot target and turning the nocks until the bare shaft hits the x and then also goes in straight. Once all of them are shooting x's and going in the target straight then you are pretty darn sure that they are group tuned and ready to be fletched.

I shot a 300 58x with my bare shafts the first night I ever shot them and if that isn't confidence in your arrows I don't know what it would take, then putting on fletching just made them even better.


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## SonnyThomas

Just in. Warm enough to say; 3D!
Swept off some of the snow of my old centers and started shooting. Little rusty, but got going. My normal practice is X number of arrows and all have be solid 10s and 12s or 14s with arrow touching. So 3 arrows and 3 solid 10s or mixture of 12s and a 14 has to be a 14. Started at 20 yards and backed up to 25, 30 and 35 yards (had to stomp the snow drift a bit for 35 yards). 
I used 4 arrows for 20 and 25 and good nailed center Xs on the roughest little center for a Rinehart skunk. More than 25 I couldn't see the center good enough, so used 2 arrows for 30 and 35 yards.

Other; I had been using a Bernie's rear mount and Mini Silencers, but removed it. Other a more forward balance there was not one bit of change in impact.

And, shooting 20 yards all the time sucks...30 yards looked like 45 and 35 looked like 50... Didn't take long to get back in the groove though. 

Try shooting a half wet black target in the shade. 12 and 10 on the first try and a pair of 12s on the 2nd try. Had to use 2 attempts from 25 also. From 30 yards I couldn't make out where the target center was, just nothing but black.


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## ThunderEagle

This is interesting, I wanna play too.

So, had an issue with my Supra Max a couple of months ago and I didn't have it to shoot for about 6 weeks waiting on new cams. Once I got things repaired, I was struggling really badly shooting. During one of my practice sessions at the shop, the owner was watching me and noticed that my elbow was way up in the air. I believe this was due to having tried a shorter draw length that was probably a mistake. Anyhow, back to 29.5 DL, cut the stupid tennis grip off of my riser and working hard on keeping my release shoulder down.

Fast forward to my first night of 450 Vegas league last Wednesday. Not at nearly the level of a lot of you guys, but I shot a 430 with 16 X's. I let down 4 or 5 times when things were not feeling right, still fought through a couple of shots, but this is progress. Also working on consistent release execution (shooting a hinge). Finally starting to feel comfortable again, now to work on consistency.

For some perspective, my best 450 round is a 434 in league, and lately I've been scoring in the low 420's. I still threw 3 8's I believe, so slowly working on the goal of a full round with nothing but yellow. Most of the bad shots were early in the game, I actually got stronger as I shot.


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## ILOVE3D

Padgett said:


> Ilove3d, you are going to love the xxx's. I have shot them full length and at 30 inches of shaft and I think I like the 30 inch shafts better, I am not sure why so you could totally shoot them full shaft for now and then trim them later to 30 inches and go from there. I have always shot indoor with 150 grain pts in them when they were strictly indoor arrows.
> 
> I have shot full length feathers and blazers and 2 inch feathers on them during indoor and also really can't tell a accuracy difference. Right now it is the 2 inch shield cuts.
> 
> I would totally suggest that you cut them and install the points and the nocks and spend a day tuning your bow with the bare shafts first, then once you get them tuned then group tune the arrows. If you don't have a hooter shooter I would suggest just shooting at a 5-spot target and turning the nocks until the bare shaft hits the x and then also goes in straight. Once all of them are shooting x's and going in the target straight then you are pretty darn sure that they are group tuned and ready to be fletched.
> 
> I shot a 300 58x with my bare shafts the first night I ever shot them and if that isn't confidence in your arrows I don't know what it would take, then putting on fletching just made them even better.


Wish I had a hooter shooter and not yet rigged up some type to shoot out of my bow press. I could shoot a 300 58x as long as I was maybe 10 yards from the target. I'll start closer then move back. I also ordered 50 grain weights to make them 200 tips. The 150 grain tips I had in the 2712's didn't group as good as the 300 grain ones did.


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## Padgett

Sounds good, I have shot awesome with my xxx cut to 27.25 inches of shaft and 100 grain points and actually shot most of my 60x rounds with those arrows two seasons ago and they shot really nice. I can say that most pro shooters do use a 250 grain point and I have never shot them with that much weight so I just can't tell you anything. I am getting some with 250 grain points here soon and will be able to shoot them and tell probably within a week if they shoot better than my current setup, right now I am shooting really solid so any little difference should be easy to see.


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## Padgett

Don't worry to much, the current batch of my xxx both in my x cutters and my xxx neither one needed group tuned because they were freaking perfect right out of the box. I glued in my points to my x cutters and they shot the same freaking hole at 20 yards in my hooter shooter regardless of how I turned the nocks. I really didn't think that was possible and had to see it to believe it. My xxx current arrows were not group tuned in the hooter shooter because I was lazy and I did the method I described above by just shooting x's with them and turning the nocks till they hit well and dead on and really I think only 2 out of the six really got turned just a little and they hit really good. I didn't keep track but I know I hit the x every time but once with the bare shafts that night and doing that kind of shooting is nothing but confidence building in your arrows because you know that the fletched ones are going to hit even better so if you can hit x's with the bare ones then you are going to be dead freaking on with the fletched ones.


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## Lazarus

What have I done today? Shot one arrow. Swiftly banked my first arrow off the roof of the garage at about half full draw. Stood around there in amazement for a couple of minutes. Got a line on the track in the frost on the roof, headed out into the pasture making circles. Found the arrow out about 150 yards. Went back to the house, put the bow away and there it sits.

I would venture the last time I did that was almost two years ago, two years of almost daily shooting. And I have no idea why I did it this time. The wife was talking to me right at the time so I can blame it on her. Least it wasn't in a tournament I guess. 

Maybe I'll shoot tomorrow.


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## montigre

I went to a local pro shop after work to use their range and ended up shooting 4 only arrows. 

During the beginning of my 2nd end, a father and his 2 very young sons came in to shoot a bit. The youngest son was playing some LOUD video game and dad and the older boy (maybe 6 years-old) began shooting their bows. Well, the dad was doing the ol' chicken wing to draw and shoot his bow and his son was gyrating so much to get the bow drawn back his arrow at times was actually pointing at the middle of my front stabilizer. I was 2 lanes down from him.

So, I suggested to dad that maybe his son was trying to pull back too much weight. He took maybe a 1/4 turn out of the limbs and set him back on the line. Gyrations and sky drawing continue, so I decided not to try to fight it and packed up my gear. 

Some days are just not good archery days....


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## ILOVE3D

montigre said:


> I went to a local pro shop after work to use their range and ended up shooting 4 only arrows.
> 
> During the beginning of my 2nd end, a father and his 2 very young sons came in to shoot a bit. The youngest son was playing some LOUD video game and dad and the older boy (maybe 6 years-old) began shooting their bows. Well, the dad was doing the ol' chicken wing to draw and shoot his bow and his son was gyrating so much to get the bow drawn back his arrow at times was actually pointing at the middle of my front stabilizer. I was 2 lanes down from him.
> 
> So, I suggested to dad that maybe his son was trying to pull back too much weight. He took maybe a 1/4 turn out of the limbs and set him back on the line. Gyrations and sky drawing continue, so I decided not to try to fight it and packed up my gear.
> 
> Some days are just not good archery days....


Last night at the PSE pro shop we had a Vegas shoot with the regulars, about 14 to 16 guys normally. They are usually open until 7 but until last night pretty much all the other shooters leave and go home. Last night was like your day Montigre, a family of 4, mom, dad, about a late teen early 20's kid and another one about 12 years old stayed around flinging arrows with traditional equipment. A few of us already had hunt Vegas target face's and had warmed up waiting for the fam to leave. One time while getting ready to shoot I noticed legs and shoes down under and behind one of the target butts. It was the 12 year old who had crawled behind the targets to get one of his arrows. most of the rest of his arrows were laying on the floor between the shooting line and the target butts. Some would hit the wall behind the targets and bounce back, others would hit the targets (spyder I believe) and bounce back as well. the rest of us quit warming up then just waiting for them to call it a night. When it was getting near 7 and the shop was getting ready to close down so we could shoot I noticed my target had arrows stuck in it. None of them had hit the actual scoring rings but there were 4 or 5 arrows in my target as well as another one my friend had hung up. these were shot by the 20 year old, again using traditional equipment. Boy were we glad to see that family roll out of there.


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## SonnyThomas

ThunderEagle said:


> This is interesting, I wanna play too.
> 
> So, had an issue with my Supra Max a couple of months ago and I didn't have it to shoot for about 6 weeks waiting on new cams. Once I got things repaired, I was struggling really badly shooting. During one of my practice sessions at the shop, the owner was watching me and noticed that my elbow was way up in the air. I believe this was due to having tried a shorter draw length that was probably a mistake. Anyhow, back to 29.5 DL, cut the stupid tennis grip off of my riser and working hard on keeping my release shoulder down.
> 
> Fast forward to my first night of 450 Vegas league last Wednesday. Not at nearly the level of a lot of you guys, but I shot a 430 with 16 X's. I let down 4 or 5 times when things were not feeling right, still fought through a couple of shots, but this is progress. Also working on consistent release execution (shooting a hinge). Finally starting to feel comfortable again, now to work on consistency.
> 
> For some perspective, my best 450 round is a 434 in league, and lately I've been scoring in the low 420's. I still threw 3 8's I believe, so slowly working on the goal of a full round with nothing but yellow. Most of the bad shots were early in the game, I actually got stronger as I shot.


Nothing wrong with 430 and 16Xs. I've shot some pretty shoddy scores on the Vegas target, we have at one time or another. You keep plugging.


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## unclejane

Watching the live feed for the LAS classic (going shooting myself tho soon as Im done with morning coffee). Sometimes just watching competitive archers is instructive:
- lots of folks visibly struggling. Overbowed is what I think I'm seeing in most cases. Others sit at full draw forever and ever, then let down over and over. My right shoulder/chest area just hurts more and more as I watch this lol...
- no compound finger shooters that I can see, even with the bowhunting setups? Has finger shooting with compounds finally died in the big tournaments?
- good to see oly recurve still well represented. Wish I could shoot one, but I can hit the rafters better with my compounds.

Shooting at the LAS classic is still a bucket-list item for me. Even if they ask me to leave because I can't hit the bale more than once I do still just want to go shoot and see the spectacle of it all.

That said on finger shooting, I'm strongly considering converting my Hoyt Tribute over to finger shooting with a clicker. My PSE is a much better release aid bow for me anyway, and it'd be fun to have a finger bow....

LS


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## ThunderEagle

Got over to the shop this afternoon for some practice. The kids 5 spot league was finishing up when I got there. They started late, and almost half of them had never shot a 5 spot round before. I think they had 19 kids shooting, so the future of the sport is looking bright.

After several ends of just shooting, I hung a Vegas face and decided to shoot a round. I shot another 430 with 14x this time. Felt fairly good. Had several let downs when things just didn't feel right, so that is a plus. Still threw 3 8's. Just keeping on trying for some consistency.


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## unclejane

Weeell, once I tallied up how much it was going to cost to convert the Tribute over to fingers, I went back to plan A (leave it alone, total cost: 0 dollars). I also decided I'm just not going to get a decent bare shaft out of that bow at the 30lbs I'm going to shoot it at. It's beautiful maxed at 40lbs, utterly perfect bullet hole, but I'm just not that strong yet. I need to get back to shooting and stop fiddling. I took out my 1816 XX75s, leftover from a recurve experiment, and they turn out to be spined just right. I even put fletchings on them, I have it on good authority that fletchings really help bareshaft flight. Cut em down, stuffed the NIBBs in em and presto I have a set of arrows for the Tribute.

I'm going to take it over to the shop tomorrow and get back to work on my release "engine". 

LS


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## Sasquech

Shot a 450 game yesterday. Have my bow back while I wait to get it right. Felt good to be back shooting my bow but scored only 434. However x count was up 22x much better I am feeling closer than ever to the break through. Need to get the let down on track.


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## Lazarus

Yesterday I shot a lot, with a lot of wind. Removed about 22.5 ounces from the bow and shot it in competition mode. How pleasant. Figured out why the misfire on arrow #1 the day before. Would have never believed the cause if I hadn't figured it out myself. All is good.


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## Padgett

Shot my first little shoot of the season and I had trouble with starting my shot, I haven't shot outside all winter and finding the 12 ring through my scope and then feeling confident that I was actually aiming at the 12 ring was a huge problem for me early on. I finally started remembering the little things that I do mentally as the day progressed and then I smoothed out considerably and was able to just execute the shot.

I did have one shot that was a easy 24 yard shot with a visible 12 ring to aim at and I ran my shot and towards the end of my shot window it hadn't fired and I was holding perfect so I added some pressure to my wall and it pulled my pin off the 12 ring and I missed, it was a great reminder to not be doing that and when it doesn't fire just let down and start over. Out of 40 shots I only had 3 arrows that were 8's and two of them were bad glance outs where I aimed at my buddys arrow already in the 12 ring and the impact glanced me out so that was promising.


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## SonnyThomas

Went over to the local archery shop and we had a good time. Shooting was shooting. The fun part was having bow hunter index finger customers trying Tim's and my thumb releases and my hinges. Lord! Arrows went everywhere. All got along with our thumb releases, but those wild hinge shots had them gripping the heck out of their bows 
Toughest problem was having them hold the hinge right and then them turning their hand and forgetting to hang on  We had to demonstrate everything, release in hand, draw, anchor, having understand to keep back tension going.
We got them going. Some liked the thumb releases, which Tim and I made sure our thumb releases didn't walk off. As for the hinges, they were pretty fearful even though we didn't let them hurt their selves. They saw how shot the hinges and were pretty impressed. Tim was best beings he had a light for his pin. I could see my yellow pin, but my red didn't want to show up so good. Tim's lighting had improved, but still needs work. 

Wildest shot. Tim has a thin blade on his rest. The one customer got to shaking just as he fired. The arrow fell off the rest, he fired, the Gold Tip arrow glanced off a divider (solid wood) for Tim's Chronograph and draw board. Amazing the arrow glanced into the target.

Ordered new longer mods for my Pearson MX2. We tried to let out the draw, but there just wasn't enough string tweaking to get what I wanted. 

Our mutts. I was gone 3 hours and the way they behaved I'd gone days. Yippy, jumping, tails liked to whipped my legs sore.


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## montigre

Just got back from the local shop and when I got there, a dad and his 2 young sons (different ones) were setting up to shoot their new bows--no rests, no nocking points....arrows literally placed between the pins on their sight :mg: Anyway, I walked dad into the shop and had him pick up a Hoyt plastic rest since the kids were shooting fingers, tied in a couple of quick nocking points and showed them how to get an arrow off. They were hitting the bale about 80% of the time, so I went into my stuff a little.

I just installed a .62 diopter lens with a circle and small dot to see if I could get a slightly better frame of the target without sacrificing perceived steadiness. The sight picture seems pretty good and I can use the .62 without a clarifier, so that's a boon. One of my retired veteran students came in before I got too involved with my shooting, so I helped him with maintaining dynamic tension through his execution. What started out as gunshot splatter ended up with his arrows regularly finding the yellow. We tweaked a couple little form issues and I set him off to shoot on his own. He ended the day with a smile on his face. 

I shot for about an hour and a half just to get used to the little extra movement the .62 was producing and felt pretty comfortable with it by the end of the session. So, in all, a very good archery day for me. Wish my new hinge (a Tru Ball Fulkrum) had been delivered before I headed out, but I will have to do that set up at a later date...


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## Deputy Archer

Got out and shot some distance, getting ready for outdoor season. First group of the year at 80, don't re member it being that far.


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## montigre

I don't remember 80 being quite that tiny...LOL!!


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## SonnyThomas

Cameras for you.... Does make it look longer than it is...And I ain't a gonna look at mine. It might be that long :mg:


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## Deputy Archer

Camera makes it look worse. It is so nice aiming at something other than a Vegas face.


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## unclejane

Well I can do that at about 30 yards, rather than 80. Not much to write home about for ya'll but for me it's absolutely outstanding. Well... if I'm not out hunting arrows in the weeds behind the bale at 30 yards, that's outstanding for me. So a group (pictured below) is *really* outstanding. Even one of the bareshafts grouped with the others..... 

But speaking of that, it was actually warm enough to go outdoors today so took the PSE with just the sight and 12" side rod stab out to our local outdoors range to work on form. In particular, as I add things back in like a target, other shooters around, distractions, etc., I've noticed something like a kind of anticipation issue in my release. It looks like a form breakdown, where I come to full draw lightly against the wall like usual. But then I start letting it creep, which of course stops the rotation of the hinge. I had this for a while too when I shot recurve, which is how I recognize it.

Today was practicing staying at the wall with back muscle pressure with slightly more relaxed ring/middle fingers as I draw, come to anchor and release the safety. More like the position you have with a traditional hinge when you come to anchor. Towards the end of the day, my groups were tightening back up and the shots were feeling more surprisey like they should.

Also, (Forrest) Carter repaired my other releases and I got em back today. They're perfect now, kudos to Carter enterprises!
LS


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## Deputy Archer

That's a solid group. I have had great experiences with carters repair department, everything I have sent them comes back fast and with a crisp release.


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## unclejane

Deputy Archer said:


> That's a solid group.


Yep, that's my Supra Max at about 30lbs. As long as I can keep up a good repeatable shot engine, I have some hope lol. 


> I have had great experiences with carters repair department, everything I have sent them comes back fast and with a crisp release.


Well I had two at a time that were both defective out of the box, and I mean they were a mess. I have no idea how they were so beat up right out of the box. But I talked to Forrest Carter himself on the phone last week and he said he'd repair them personally before leaving for Lancaster to go shoot at the classic. He just plain replaced one of them and repaired my other one. They're both great now. I'll probably never have to buy another release again now, now that I have 3 Carters lol.

LS


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## Deputy Archer

What releases were they? I bought a honey off AT that was in horrible shape. Emailed Forest, replaced all the guts 27$.


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## Fury90flier

Well I haven't been able to shoot much over the past month due to a jacked up shoulder...finally, I was able to get about 20 decent shots this past weekend during one session and about another 15-20 during another session later that day (Saturday).

Today, was just a backyard day--about 30 shots. All I'm doing is trying to get back shooting...didn't shoot that well but at least I was able to get out-- Shoulder feels good.

I'm chomp'n at the bit on shooting...the good thing is my new contract keeps me away from the range--lol.


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## unclejane

Deputy Archer said:


> What releases were they? I bought a honey off AT that was in horrible shape. Emailed Forest, replaced all the guts 27$.


One was a Honey Do I bought as a backup to my current Honey Do, and the other a Honey 2 I bought to try out a 3 finger. I bought them new from lancaster and they both looked like they'd been through a war zone. I have no idea what happened except maybe they were returns that somehow got into the new stuff rotation (seen that happen by accident). (Forrest) Carter replaced the Honey 2 and repaired the Do, both for free under warranty. 

I'm addicted to this style of release with the safety, so I decided I'd better stock up... 

LS


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## cbmac

Shot 5 spot today in prep for TN state indoor. Doing OK, satisfied with progress, but not there yet. Had a revelation today (happens occasionally) which has helped with quite a bit with vertical spread of grouping. Realized that I was slowly tilting my head while aiming, slight change in sight picture, subtle motion which was worse if the release (shooting a hinge) was a bit slow going off. I suspect I've always done this. Not difficult to control at all, once the issue is identified. Produced a small, immediate improvement! Funny how we have these "ah ha moments.":doh:


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## schmel_me

Today I shot 3 ends little different anchor point felt ok pulling out of peep a bit. Will work on that. 
Went to take off down angle disconnect bolt took out insert and 80% of the threads with it. Little tap/die work and some jb weld I have a bow for tho weekend we'll see about long term!doh!


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## Deputy Archer

unclejane said:


> One was a Honey Do I bought as a backup to my current Honey Do, and the other a Honey 2 I bought to try out a 3 finger. I bought them new from lancaster and they both looked like they'd been through a war zone. I have no idea what happened except maybe they were returns that somehow got into the new stuff rotation (seen that happen by accident). (Forrest) Carter replaced the Honey 2 and repaired the Do, both for free under warranty.
> 
> I'm addicted to this style of release with the safety, so I decided I'd better stock up...
> 
> LS


You and me both I shoot a honey 3 and 4. My honey 4 ' s safety is really hard to disengage thinking about sending it in. I tried the honey do and had a honey 2, wasn't confidante with the release safety thing.


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## Padgett

I went in to the shop yesterday and got in a little shooting, There was a extra guy there screwing everything up but I did get in some good executions and shots but in all reality I am just not shooting really well right now. I was dead on perfect just a couple months ago but right now I am not, I think I am just not dealing with coming in and having to wait around for people screwing around on the range very well. I am going to try and use this to my advantage and get back on top of my shooting even when people on the range aren't doing things right.


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## unclejane

Deputy Archer said:


> You and me both I shoot a honey 3 and 4. My honey 4 ' s safety is really hard to disengage thinking about sending it in. I tried the honey do and had a honey 2, wasn't confidante with the release safety thing.


Try a little TriFlow or silicone spray lube. My first Honey Do's safety got sticky after a while and eventually wouldn't come back out on its own. But a shot of triflow fixed it right up. But yeah I'm so used to the safety now, I think I'll just continue on with it....

LS


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## SonnyThomas

Woke up late, real late. Got some coffee to throw down my throat. Got my emails taken care of. Fired up a couple archery sites/forums. Looked in AT, Inter/Advan. Saw the argument in Draw Elbow. Stupid. I know we've got some state champs or higher level shooters, but coaches or national Champs of any kind? Attending a national doesn't count. I know people who've never seen the upper half the of score sheet, but still go. That is not competing. That's showing up. Still, those "showing up" is the only thing that keeps the organizations afloat... 

Errands to run and got that done. Stopped at two archery shops. Can't pass up them dang things. Sad news. After years on the market NAP is discontinuing their mechanical Shock Wave. I've used it to kill something of 35 deer since I returned to bow hunting back in 2000. I bought a 3 pack, almost offered to buy all he had, still might.

Came home to two boxes of arrows waiting for me in the mail box. One box for me and one box to test. Play Time, but will have to wait until I make a trip for components. Another package buried in the back of the mailbox, a like new Cooper John Evo 2 complete with 1.375" Maxxis scope housing and a .029" and .019" up pins. Also got a like new Stanislawski Shoot Off release. More Play Time, but getting dusk is rolling in. So maybe tomorrow. Like I really needed another sight frame and release... 5 sight frames, 3 hinges, 3 thumb releases, 5 index releases.

Phone call. My offer accepted...Like new, Apple arrow saw with original package of blades, Apple bow vice, JoJan Multi fletching jig, all vanes. May have to appease the wife some over this....

Checked email. Got tracking number for another box of arrows on their way. I'm going to have to get help Playing  3 fliers for some Indoor events. Note on one; "Come on, Sonny. You've got nothing better to do." Easy to delete....

Came back to AT...Inter/Advan....silence...can hear a pin drop.


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## acesbettor

Shot lancaster this past weekend. What a great event and experience! All I can say is what a difference for me shooting on the line there as opposed to local events. I struggled big time! I went from shooting high 630- low 640 lac scoring to shooting my worst score in over a year.. 623 34x. Between my nerves and having issues with lighting and seeing through my peep, I was a mess to say the least! 

I shoot a 4x lens with just a small aperture. Have any of you guys had to switch to a larger peep aperture for certain venues? and if so when you went larger did it mess with your sight picture as far as making it more blurry? I'm just hoping that if I need to go bigger for events like that, I won't need a verifier/clarifier( I always forget which ones which)?


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## Padgett

I got out of tutoring at 5pm and only got to shoot in my driveway for about 12 minutes but it was nice to get to shoot. For the second time though it was weird to hit about a inch or so high on the bag target with my indoor bow, I had it happen yesterday and thought it was just me but it was hitting a inch high again today and I know my hold was perfect. It is amazing how different the florescent lighting makes things hit from indoor to outdoor.


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## SonnyThomas

Padgett said:


> I got out of tutoring at 5pm and only got to shoot in my driveway for about 12 minutes but it was nice to get to shoot. For the second time though it was weird to hit about a inch or so high on the bag target with my indoor bow, I had it happen yesterday and thought it was just me but it was hitting a inch high again today and I know my hold was perfect. It is amazing how different the florescent lighting makes things hit from indoor to outdoor.


I get a buzz from the Indoor shooters come 3D season. They tuned or tweaked their bows for Indoors, usually warm, and 3D in February and March can be pretty cold. Peeps not behaving, arrows not going where they are supposed to go and like Padgett noted, indoor lights and natural outdoor light can mess you up.


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## stromdidilly

Made a couple of tweaks to my set up based on some of the stuff I've read in this sub forum and shot 298 16x to finish up my indoor league. Both significant bests...it's not all bad in here :thumbs_up


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## cbrunson

Congrats ^^^^ Good shooting.


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## DenCMSC

For starters, I am on the cusp of "intermediate" archery. I am as likely to shoot a 290 as I am a 299 indoors (still reaching for that elusive 300), and am just learning the outdoor field game. I am proficient at marked or unmarked 3D, and shoot bow hunter class for everything. I know that 99% of my issues are mental, my mind wanders off for a few shots each round.

So, today (and every day this week) I am shooting 10 yard 5 spot. Today was 300 55x, and before I quit I will be shooting 300 60x every time. Ultimate goal is same hole at 10 yards...

...any other tips or drills to help improve (please PM, so as not to clutter the thread).


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## SonnyThomas

Den, doing well as you are, just stay calm and collected and it will come....


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## SonnyThomas

Nothing goes to plan. Interruptions and all fell through, except I got to try the Stanislawski Shoot Off. Wow! Can't remember which of the couple I bought it off of, but just breathing on the pulling post made the release fire. Man! First, I had to reset the pulling post, much too far forward and too long. Fit to my hand I adjusted the tension. Pulling post set and tension set it felt hard to fire and I thought perfect. Went out and gave it a test hop. Found out real quick I didn't like the way I had to hook up. Guess you got to get use it to, but even then I wouldn't care for it in a speed event. Took a couple of shots to get the feel and it felt pretty good. Settled in and then I have jerked, but enough tension set and the Shoot Off didn't fire. Let down and regrouped. First shot on a spot hit half way between the X ring and edge of bull's eye at 3:00. 2nd shot dead centered the X ring. A couple more Xs and it was 3D time... The black target finally dried and I could see where to aim. Nice was a pair of X rings...almost flubbed on one, but relaxed and came right back for it. That 14 ring on the brown 3D center can be deceiving so I used my "hot" arrow to see the top of the ring and held/aimed until the release fired.
All in all I liked the Shoot Off for fit and getting the shot off, but that hooking up, closing the jaw leaves a lot to be desired... 

My releases and 3D centers shot with the Shoot Off.
left; Stans, Deuce, Blackjack, MagMicro Trio. Middle; TRU Balls, ST360 3 and 4 finger. Right; The Stan Shoot Off.


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## Fury90flier

This evening I was only able to fling about 30 shots...just got tired. The shoulder issues aren't as bad but I could tell that the time off has caused issues. While before screwing up my shoulder I was getting better with my torquing issue, for some reason today- it was back.

Oh, well...at least I'm able to shoot again. I'll be working on just stage one...drawing without bouncing off the blade....difficult at this time. Hopefully I'll be able to shoot at the next Hot & cold shoot at the end of the month.


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## ThunderEagle

450 Vegas League tonight. Another 430 score, that is 3 in a row. X count dropped a tad. 16x last week, 14x in a practice round on Saturday, and 13x's tonight. I guess I have some consistency going with 3 straight 430's. Let down a good many times again when things were just not right. Had a few people miss tonight, so it was only one line, and these guys were shooting fast. I tried slowing down, but there is something about that environment that ends up speeding you up too.

One positive, only shot one 8 tonight. Would have been nice if that resulted in a couple of more points, but hey, after what I had been doing over the last several months, I'll take it.

Have the Ohio 450 Vegas Mail-in this weekend, I shot a 433-10x last year, hopefully I can beat it.


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## unclejane

Went back to a pull-through release, my Carter Evo +. 
I've been unable to work through a strange anticipation issue with my hinges that has crept in recently and has finally taken a firm hold over about the last couple weeks. No matter what method I've used, the decent-shot rate has descended to only about 40%, the rest are these bizarre anticipatory freeze-ups, creeps and jerks. 

So back to the drawing board with the pull-through release and basic form work, since this is probably some kind of form breakdown. And I must say, I may never go back to the hinge. There's a dramatic improvement everywhere. I can now pick a little splotch, like a couple arrow holes, on my bale about 8 yards away and pinwheel it, whereas before with my hinges, the best I could do was a silver dollar sized area. And on purpose, not by accident or good luck like before. My float is better, the whole shot is a nice firm pull with no anticipation issues. Utterly no way to command the shot so there's just no way to anticipate it...

The Evo definitely forces you to have a consistent hand position at anchor (azimuth-wise) and absolutely precise management of your contact with the back wall when you release the safety. But if I could shoot like this all the time, I'm just going to keep using this thing and pack my hinges away LOL.

LS


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## Mahly

Got to shoot at the club today,
Questioning if I was still shooting the BEST release engine for ME, I decided to try a variation of one of Padgett's firing engines (index finger yielding).
I being me and not Padgett, do it a little different.
I don't like to leave my thumb hanging below the peg, or touching the peg (distracts me... Too much info), so I bring it up to my middle finger tip (very little if any movement there).
After a couple rounds of warm up, my buddy wanted to shoot for score.
Knowing I can put score out of my mind, we started keeping score.
My practice rounds were kinda "shotgunny" and to the right... Figured it was just me learning a new engine.
As the rounds went on, float got better and better, groups tighter, release smoother.
About now is when I notice that even though they are grouping smaller, they are still to the right... Then I put one in the lake LOL.
Kept going, but finally started dialing in my sight. By the time I was done, I got about 8-10 clicks in!!!
Now I won't say that would have made the bad arrow an X, but I'm betting it becomes a 5.
In the end, I found this new engine to be even better than the last one. More relaxing, and I did think of something he said that kinda stuck with me. The index just feels like your pushing the arrow to the X.
In time, just thinking of the engine, things really started to click, shots just happened. Didn't have to pull harder, didn't freeze, he'll, didn't even feel that finger moving after a while, just felt like Draw, Anchor, Aim, Engine, gone!
Ended up with a 299 50x, but even more confidence that after maybe a couple of days this will get even better very quickly.
Now I really dug my last engine, but this works even better for me... I think if the draw was longer, the opposite might be true, but I think I was adding tension to the shot, causing me to need my sight too be too far to the left.
This is all relaxing and hence less tension at the shot.
I had been stuck at 300 45x for a while, and wanted to break through to a new level.
This has me excited that I may have made that break through.
Picked up 9x from last week first day out with new engine, and yeah, I shot a few more rounds afterwards just to know that I got 300 in a row, even if the score card doesn't show it.
Feeling good about next time shooting!!!!


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## cbrunson

I shot my third straight 57x game on league night. It seems like I need to miss at least three times. I know the issue. Patience.


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## SonnyThomas

Shooting is a bit held up. Brother little bit hurt a few days ago. Pinned between wall and tractor trailer at work. Took a couple of men to get him out. Good size hernia on side where muscles were tore. Out of surgery and recovery as I type and he's just waiting to get released.

Did have time between hospital and stuff. The Stan Shootoff is feeling better and better, but hooking up has improved. I've been using hooks for so long I don't even think about hooking up. Closing that jaw....I'll get use to it. Did pick up some components for the arrows I got in. I'll see how my brother gets along first....


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## cbrunson

Best wishes for your brother and all those affected by the incident. ^^^^^

I’m going to do something I never do. I’m changing something on my bow right before a tournament without having time to get used to it. I don’t consider it a big issue though. I’m switching to a 10 deg down angle QD on the front from a straight one. I will have about 20 minutes before the shoot to change my mind, but I don’t think I will. I often move weight around to get the hold right, so it shouldn’t raise a mental issue. If anything, it should only help clean up some side to side stuff.


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## unclejane

SonnyThomas said:


> Shooting is a bit held up. Brother little bit hurt a few days ago. Pinned between wall and tractor trailer at work. Took a couple of men to get him out. Good size hernia on side where muscles were tore. Out of surgery and recovery as I type and he's just waiting to get released.
> 
> Did have time between hospital and stuff. The Stan Shootoff is feeling better and better, but hooking up has improved. I've been using hooks for so long I don't even think about hooking up. Closing that jaw....I'll get use to it. Did pick up some components for the arrows I got in. I'll see how my brother gets along first....


Holy smokes! Just don't let him do too much after all that, it's easy to overexert yourself so make sure he takes it easy and gets lots of rest - I know, from my spine surgery last year...

LS


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## SonnyThomas

cbrunson said:


> Best wishes for your brother and all those affected by the incident. ^^^^^
> 
> I’m going to do something I never do. I’m changing something on my bow right before a tournament without having time to get used to it. I don’t consider it a big issue though. I’m switching to a 10 deg down angle QD on the front from a straight one. I will have about 20 minutes before the shoot to change my mind, but I don’t think I will. I often move weight around to get the hold right, so it shouldn’t raise a mental issue. If anything, it should only help clean up some side to side stuff.


I have a 10 degree quick disconnect on my MX2. I really can't say what it does for the shot. I've shot the MX2 without the 10 degree to start and maybe a more stable feel with it. The bow shoots great either way.


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## Padgett

I only had 35 minutes to shoot right after school and I drew back in my back yard with my 3d bow and the glare was so bad from the sun i had to set a target up in the opposite direction. I shot freaking awesome for about 20 minutes and the sun changed so I turned around to shoot the normal target and holy crap the sun angle was causing every stinking shot to hit about 1.5 inches to the left. It was the worst I have ever seen my arrow hit because of the sun, I turned back around and on the other direction I hit dead on just like before.

This was a good reminder that on a asa course when switching sides of the course to make sure this doesn't suck the score out of my score card.


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## SonnyThomas

unclejane said:


> Holy smokes! Just don't let him do too much after all that, it's easy to overexert yourself so make sure he takes it easy and gets lots of rest - I know, from my spine surgery last year...
> 
> LS


Dang, you're probably right. He's sore this morning... I better cancel the bikini college girls to dance for him


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## unclejane

SonnyThomas said:


> Dang, you're probably right. He's sore this morning... I better cancel the bikini college girls to dance for him


Well now no don't out and out just cancel the girls, no... that'll probably do more harm than good. That's on the right track, just make sure he doesn't have *too* much fun until he's stronger.. 

LS


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## erdman41

Shot the Badger State Games. Hit my first 40x's then dropped 4 down the stretch (blue face). How confidence dwindles even though you just did it right 40 some times in a row is a mystery.

Anyway think I am on a good course. I tweaked my shot routine about a week and a half a go. Groups have tightened just need more reps with this routine to get ingrained a little better for crunch times.


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## SonnyThomas

Didn't get a lot done. Run, run, run...And then blew a brake line. It's plastic!!!! Called all over and no one has heard of it, even NAPA. Now have to wait until Monday to call GM dealer. Plastic brake line on a 1994 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme?!!! Yeah, I can squeeze it with my fingers. Even the gas line is plastic, labeled right next to the brake line where the brake line is leaking....

On good side, I got some more archery goodies in the mail. Like to scared me when I saw the arrow box. Corner rip off one end and every corner of the box smashed. Checked everything, pin bushings, pin nocks (I hate this), points and flexed the arrows and all was good...


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## Rick!

Shot a 300/42X last night at league and a 442/20X tonite at an inter league shoot across the state border. All this was done with weekly 10yd drills and mythical unicorn bt hinge firing.


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## unclejane

Shot the PSE at 20 yards today with a Stan Element instead of my hinges. My groups are approx. the same as with my hinge, but the difference is I can replicate them almost all day. Well... and I mean almost..... I attribute that to the much-enforced better form induced by using a pull-through style release. A pull-through seems to make it easier for me to concentrate on pulling with the back all the way through the shot.

Here was my last group of the day; the shadowed figure is yours truly snapping the pic. Note the bare shafts in the X (the consistency of the pull-through really helps maintain my tune). Most arrows, but not all, were in or near the white almost every end.

Baby steps......

PS: there were like 18 kids and three never-shot-before beginner adults on the line almost the whole time I shot today. For no apparent reason, it's a total blast packed in like sardines on a line with a bunch of kids with arrows going absolutely everywhere, running along the floor, bouncing off the targets, etc. I don't know why I love shooting in that kind of chaos, but I do.

LS


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## ThunderEagle

Well, shot the OAA 450 Mail-in last night. Step backwards from my string of 430's. Only was able to score a 425, with 4 8's. Not exactly sure what was off tonight, and feeling pretty discouraged about this whole target archery thing.


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## swwishooter

My shooting has been rough since new years. Don't know what is going on, and everything I try doesn't seem to help it 1 bit. I have new strings coming, so I hope that helps as this is getting frustrating. My float has opened a lot, I cant get comfortable at full draw, and I'm just plain loose confidence in my shooting.


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## Fury90flier

Today?
Today was a fantastic day- weather was beautiful for a change...we've had crap weather almost every day for over a month. 

I had a student's lesson today but it was more of a fun day. His brother has a b-day this week and wanted to shoot. So I gathered some arrows, a bow I know he could shoot and got him going.---really didn't need my help-- a little guidance but that was about it. 

The student...told him to just have fun today. He's looking to get new arrows and is at that point where we need to find the right spine...so some bare shafting and chrono tests. Can't wait to get him properly setup and well tuned.

for me. Great day. My shoulder wasn't bothering me at all so I decided to try my Oly rig with the heavier limbs (38# OTF)....great time shooting. I only managed to fling about 30 but was pleasantly surprised at how I did...only about 40% yellow, 50% red and a few blue # 30m...not too bad for not shooting recurve much.

great day...can't complain.


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## Padgett

Had a great saturday with my 3d group, we laughed and had a great time all day and everyone shot well. It was awesome to see 5 arrows either in the 12 ring or nibbling at the edge on many of the targets. Everyone in my group of friends have came a long way in the last couple years learning to be a hinge or thumb trigger shooter and right now my group is a really strong group and to put up the top score in the group is a tough job.

My shooting has improved a bunch this winter and I couldn't be happier, i am finding myself able to shoot in a bigger shot window because I am so confident in my shooting that I feel good firing from 2 to 9 seconds. Last year I wasn't as confident in my shooting and I felt like firing from 2 to 5 seconds was the key but I can already see that this year is going to be way better than last.


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## RCR_III

Last night I took an off night and decided to start building up some new arrows. Weighed all the shafts to set them in order from lightest to heaviest first. 2.6 grains difference between the dozen. Then got the points ready and weighed them. Got the variance down to 1.8 grains for the spread this way. Not too bad for some mid priced arrows if I say so myself. Arrow wraps put on and now just waiting on my PodiumX to arrive to get it set up and start bareshaft/index tuning and then it'll be time to fletch some arrows up. 

Decided to pay some respect for the business my dad started and ran, along with my mom and myself, for 27 years with this new bow. Putting together a little theme with the colors and wraps. Nothing too spectacular for the general population I'm sure, but to me I'm enjoying it.


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## nochance

been shooting longer draw length for 2 weeks, good at 1st but then the grouping seemed to grow. had my worse score of the year last night in 5 spot so went back to 1/2 inch shorter. Did some blind baling this afternoon then got on AT and sifted through a bunch of senseless dribble about what back tension is and who's right and who's wrong and who agrees with who and who don't.


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## Lazarus

nochance said:


> got on AT and sifted through a bunch of senseless dribble about what back tension is and who's right and who's wrong.


You could have just read the part about "back tension" as a firing method being a myth and you would have known all you need to know about that discussion. And you would have had the truth. :thumbs_up

This morning I shot 60 @ 15 to warm up inside. Then shot 30 @ 25 under the lights as the sun came up. Then shot 20 @ 50 after daylight. It was a good day. More of the same tomorrow. Hopefully less inside and more at 50.


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## nochance

Lazarus said:


> You could have just read the part about "back tension" as a firing method being a myth and you would have known all you need to know about that discussion. And you would have had the truth. :thumbs_up
> T.


Had geometry in high school and physics in high school and college, already knew the truth


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## Lazarus

nochance said:


> Had geometry in high school and physics in high school and college, already knew the truth


My kinda guy/gal........ :thumbs_up

Good shootin' to ya. :cheers:


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## grousegrove

Today: continuing a slow week. I slowed down and I'm taking a break from my hinge release due to a bad case of tendinitis in my release arm from overdoing it last week. But since I'm serving as my club's range officer tonight, and nobody else is here, I'll probably try some shooting at 3 spots with my strap hunting release. Sigh... hope it gets better.


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## cbrunson

My mid-game struggles moved to the end of the first game and the start of the second game on Vegas league night. First game last night I missed a couple Xs early but the last three were in the last two ends. Finished 300-25x. The second game my misses were in the first three ends, then I shot straight Xs the remaining 7 ends for a 300-26x. Feeling really good about my shooting right now, but I can tell the build up pressure is still affecting my decsision making. Getting really close to that 30x game.


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## Lazarus

Light day today. 30mph gusts @ 40 degrees kept me off the range. Shot 48 @ 15 to warm up, followed by 28 @ 25. Really disappointed I didn't get to go to 50. Shooting suffers with too much close work.


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## RCR_III

Today was an unusually warm day at nearly 80 so I got outside a while to shoot a Vegas round. Wasn't too bad considering the 20 mph winds. It was nice to be outside in some warmth. Ready for spring and summer!


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## ThunderEagle

Well, 450 Vegas league night tonight. I had been shooting 430 games until I did the Ohio State 450 Mail-in last Saturday, where I dropped to a 425-13x game. Very disappointed. I headed to the shop tonight intent on saying the hell with my hinge and going back to my Absolute 360. Well, after about 3 practice ends, that went out the window as I was all over the place. More practice with my hinge was better, but I wasn't feeling it.

Then we start, and I end up putting in a personal best 438-19x score together. Even better, I didn't shoot any 8's tonight, and no 27 ends, and only 4 28 score ends.

I did do a couple of things different tonight, first I was holding my HT Pro pretty deep in my hand and tonight made sure it was always perfectly between my 1st and 2nd knuckle. Next I counted to 10 between each almost each shot. This had me last on the line most of the night, to the point where was drawing my 3rd arrow after everyone had already shot theirs, but I don't care. I would have still finished faster than a lot of other target shooters, and this group was much more of a bowhunter group, so shooting really fast. On one end in particular, I had drawn my 3rd arrow after everyone else had finished, and couldn't get the release to go off, finally let down, I'm sure to the chagrin of other guys on the line. However I was rewarded with my only 30-3x end of the evening. I had a few other let downs when things were not right as well. I don't know what it was, but I did not fight the release nearly as much tonight as I usually do, in fact, there were a lot of times it went off while I was rock steady on the X and I didn't even realize I had done anything. It was a conscious relaxing of the whole arm/hand and not a deliberate yielding of the index finger.

We'll see how I do at the Pot shoot on Saturday.


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## Padgett

I screwed up and had my 3d bow in my truck instead of my indoor bow so I just shot it inside today and it was a fun little session to see that .19 pin floating inside the x. I was banging the 7'oclock position of the 10 ring on my vegas target which was weird but I just kept floating in the center and letting it hit there because the bow produced a awesome score this weekend on a 3d course.

After 20 minutes or so I did shoot a hand full of shots using pure back tension and then I shot a few where I yielded using back tension to just feel them and they felt really nice. What felt even better is when I got done shooting those 10 or so shots I went ahead and used my primary engine and the feel was just sweet. I like to do this on a regular basis and enjoy other methods because the moment I go back to my dominant choice it always reminds me why it is my good one.

I only missed a couple 10 rings, a young indoor shooter was there and was struggling with trying to control the shot and we decided to rhythm shoot for a little while and when we do this we release the thumb peg before we get to the x about 3 inches before and we start the engine as we are settling in on the x before the pin has had a chance to be perfect and then just continue running the engine and the shot fires so sweet. The problem is that sometimes the shot fires early in the engine before you have even gotten to the x and that happened to me twice for my two misses. It was worth it because the shots are so pure without any control over the pin float that you get to really feel what a truly disconnected shot feels like. Yeah it produces a few misses but to me this is the kind of shooting that taught me some really valuable lessons when I was learning just a couple years ago. the moment I went back to my normal shot sequence it felt so freaking good which is what made this session a good one because I got to feel good about my normal shot sequence on three different occasions because I used a couple different training tricks during the session which allowed me to go back to my normal shot sequence multiple times.


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## SonnyThomas

The pits of late. I've got a freak car. Yeah, a Olds with plastic brake lines and no one has ever heard of plastic brake lines. Yes, factory plastic brake lines. Even the gas line is all plastic. Yep, squeeze the line and you can squeeze the line shut. Let off and the line returns round.
Spent hours searching and asking. So the car goes to the garage tomorrow.

Rained all day one day. Cold and breezy yesterday and wind would blow you flat today..... Maybe Friday or this weekend. Hopefully my car won't set me back a small fortune... GM garage never heard of plastic lines either. And no fittings except at master cylinder and wheels. Looks like a 6" or 8" long plastic or rubber coupling where the lines join/split. Said maybe the whole brake line assembly may need replaced. My old car, 1994 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme and everything but a chauffer, well me. Kept in garaged mostly, just drove my trucks. Just turned over 50,000 miles, not quite 2400 miles per year. Got it out this year and the tires had went bad, separating. Had to special order tires! Yeah, 14" tires aren't used that much anymore. Fill the car up at the gas station and drive all week. Ran it until the gas gage showed below empty. Filled it up and it wouldn't take 15 gallons.


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## Fury90flier

My old cutlass supreme had similar brake/gas lines....more rubber than plastic. Like you say...you could squeeze them, stop the flow. While working on the brakes one time a buddy of mine saidl "look at this". As you pumped the brakes, you could see the line expand and contract--no wonder they were always mushy.

So today (yesterday), spent some time on the whole BT thing that's been going on. Just as I figured, I shoot best when I just give up the bow side--bow moves at the target, draw hand relaxes at the same time...arrow gone exactly where I look (unfortunatly I'm a bit cross-eye'd) so sometimes it's not a geat shot- lol.

too bad all I have is 15 yards in the back...I'm missing the 70m shooting.


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## Rick!

League last night; 299/47X - meh.
Regional for state indoor; 299/54X. New PB for X count. 
Good stress practice with lots of banter, babies crying and crowded shooting line.


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## grousegrove

I didn't shoot today. My big archery accomplishment today was presenting a new PSE Razorback Jr. to shootin' buddy#2.


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## schmel_me

Completely lost my shot for a couple days this weekend. Shot well last Friday, Saturday,Sunday. Very solid and felt good. This weekend just felt ugly. figured I must have been getting lazy with my bow arm and letting my forward shoulder back to much. Think I got it figured out well see. There's next weekend I guess.


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## ThunderEagle

Had a Pot shoot tonight. We shot a 5 spot round. I struggled tonight, and don't even remember my score, but it was not good. I got really bad after moving to bottom target after the half. Not sure exactly what that says.

I did hit my first draw at the pot for just a tad under my entry fee tonight, so there is that. I also had a shot at the end again, but my first arrow cut the X line, so never got to take my second shot.


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## grantmac

Getting a new to me bow set-up. Went from a 37.5" AE to 41.5" PE both with spirals. The PV is perhaps 1/2" long at the moment but damn if it doesn't hold like a rock compared to the AE. For the first time I can say my float was well inside the yellow on the Vegas face rather than touching the red each side and that is with a lot more extension then I usually use. Not sure I'll keep the extension all the way out since it did show a lot of movement and I wasn't able to shoot inside my float like usual but couldn't complain about the confidence level of that float. I'm shooting with zero weight to speak of on the stabs so I expect the bow to settle down a bit more over the next few sessions.
Trying a new hinge as well (medium HT3) which I'm REALLY liking a lot. Not exactly sure what I'm using for a firing engine at the moment but it's going very well. I think it's mostly relaxing the index while maintaining a deep hook in the other fingers. Definitely no rotation of the elbow, just a linear expansion from the back like I shoot my recurve.

Also spending some time watching Nimes. Seeing a lot of hand manipulation (bronze Male match both look to be squeeze and pull shooters) and no elbow rotation that can be seen with the camera anyway? Also the DL that a lot of shooters are using is longer than I'd think with perhaps slightly higher anchors. Time to play around with my camera I think.

-Grant


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## swwishooter

Shot a tournament today, and wasn't pleased with how I shot overall. The scores were up towards the top, but my overall shot quality was low. I had a lot of pin movement, and I would force a couple shots. We shot a team shoot and my team came in 2nd, so the 96 competive arrows I shot tonight were plenty for me. Hopefully I can get my mental game a bit sharper for next time.


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## ILOVE3D

Not today but yesterday tried some new carbons' GT XXX with 200 grain nibbs and they seemed to shoot much better than my old 2712's. Probably just a spine thing but my confidence soared shooting these things. Can't wait to shoot a Vegas round and see if I will shoot my personnel best with them. One can always hope.


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## ron w

ILOVE3D said:


> Not today but yesterday tried some new carbons' GT XXX with 200 grain nibbs and they seemed to shoot much better than my old 2712's. Probably just a spine thing but my confidence soared shooting these things. Can't wait to shoot a Vegas round and see if I will shoot my personnel best with them. One can always hope.


 yea, I hear ya,....
sometimes I wonder if our confidence goes up with something new, or whether we work a little harder on our shot execution, trying to establish if the new stuff actually does make an improvement !.....consequently, we shoot better with the new stuff. I think we reach a certain state of complacency as we get more used to our equipment, and getting something new catalyzes that effort to be as clean as we can again, for a while.


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## SonnyThomas

Ain't shot for I don't know how long. Car, errands to run, rain, now wet snow that my ATV has trouble handling. Left the car open enough for dome light to be on for two days and this morning, dead battery. Bath room sink decided to clog, so waiting on battery to charge up so I can get to town. Can't be clogged at the "S" trap or clean out, it has to clog some where under the house above 14" of floor insulation. Can't rod, "T" section somewhere. Muriatic Acid is the next step....Used it before and it can get hot....so sparingly and use bunch of safety...Supposed to be safe for plastic, but with my luck?


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## ILOVE3D

ron w said:


> yea, I hear ya,....
> sometimes I wonder if our confidence goes up with something new, or whether we work a little harder on our shot execution, trying to establish if the new stuff actually does make an improvement !.....consequently, we shoot better with the new stuff. I think we reach a certain state of complacency as we get more used to our equipment, and getting something new catalyzes that effort to be as clean as we can again, for a while.


I really didn't want to change things up so much right before Vegas but I was getting way too many wild shots with the 27's. I did find a small crease in my number one arrow where someone had shot an arrow into my target and hit mine going along side it. I didn't notice the crease at first but after 4 shots at target 1 after the mishap and 4 9's in a row at 9 oclock I knew something was wrong. The crease was on the bottom hitting my spring steel rest causing that. I've shot them two days now and so far good results, just hope it stays that way.


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## N7709K

went and put a few rounds through a couple guns, new strings on the pro comp before heading out the door at 4:30 am tomorra for vegas, finished packing... went into work for a little bit; went over some change orders for a project.


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## ThunderEagle

Vegas 450 League night tonight. Last week was a personal best 438-19x. Saturday at the Pot shoot was not great shooting.

Tonight, I met an archery coach before league. He observed what I was doing, took some video with coach's eye, etc. He did not point out anything glaring. He did mention that my release hand moved out away from my face at the shot a little, and that I *might* be gripping the riser a little on release, but didn't necessarily think I was doing anything until after the arrow was gone. The one thing he pointed out, which shocked me a bit, was that I might want to be a little more careful with what shirts I wear when I shoot. I tend to wear baggier shirts, as I'm a big guy and don't really like showing my gut off. Well he pointed out that sometimes (not every time) when I'm a full draw, my string gets into my shirt. He felt that might be enough to throw some shots off.

We did strip an arrow and look at the flight of a bare shaft, and I discovered I was a good bit nock high, corrected that.

Anyhow, on to the league night. Not as good as last week, 436-15x. While I was able to keep all 45 shots in the yellow last week, I did score one 8, and one 7. The 8 isn't standing out as to what went wrong, I believe it was too high with my wrist. The 7 I should have let down, it felt weird. It wasn't I couldn't get the release to fire and fought through it, it just didn't "feel quite right". I think I had my release shoulder high, as well as a little bit of a high wrist again.

The hinge is becoming a little easier to shoot. Good thing, I've only being fighting with it off and on for a year, and pretty steady for the last 6-7 months or so.


----------



## grousegrove

I shot a local pin shoot today, indoor 5-spot. Shot a 294/300, with 29x. Good enough for a second place pin in the adult male bow hunter freestyle class. There were male and female archers there much better than me, and I'm not bragging, but I am still pleased and I had fun. In fact it might be a personal best, I only just recently started keeping track and this was my first ever indoor pin shoot. I will be sure to holler here if/when I ever get a clean 300. 

On a gloomier note my tendinitis was/is terrible today. Icing my arm now and having a frosty beverage.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Still haven't shot. Family health issues, running errands. Fantastic outside, sun blazing, but snow melting making water stand all over the place. Wore out from being up all night with family health issues so too tired to shoot anyway.....


----------



## erdman41

300 59x
Let one go at about 7 o'clock good 1/4" from the x so at least it wasn't a cheap one.

State indoor is a week away here.


----------



## grousegrove

erdman41 said:


> State indoor is a week away here.


I'd say you're in pretty good shape! Good luck.


----------



## erdman41

grousegrove said:


> I'd say you're in pretty good shape! Good luck.


Thanks lot of good shooters in this state though.


----------



## ron w

erdman41 said:


> 300 59x
> Let one go at about 7 o'clock good 1/4" from the x so at least it wasn't a cheap one.
> 
> State indoor is a week away here.


 is it still held at the school in Wisconsin Rapids ?.


----------



## ron w

erdman41 said:


> Thanks lot of good shooters in this state though.


 there's 4 former state champs dating back into the 70's, in the club I belong to ! I think two of them are multiple year champs as well.


----------



## ThunderEagle

Did some practice today on 5 spot face. Was not a good session shooting. I'm starting to think there is something about the 5 spot face that is messing with my eyes. I'm much more comfortable on the Vegas face right now.


----------



## erdman41

ron w said:


> is it still held at the school in Wisconsin Rapids ?.


Yes


----------



## Mahly

Spent some time playing with a string bow.
Tried out a Carter Only... wierd set up, but works. Also used my HT3 with click.
Played with PBT, and 3 other engines... Not to pick one, but just to get a feel for the different nuances.


----------



## Rick!

Shot a round of 5 spot alternating ends shooting PBT and nonPBT.
Score: 300
PBT: 23X, 13 inners
NonPBT: 24X, 15 inners
I'll keep playing and see what shakes out. Both methods like a perfect fdp and proper breathing and relaxation, for me.


----------



## Fury90flier

WOO HOO!!!

As I've wrote before I've been dealing with a messed up bow shoulder since a couple weeks before Christmas and haven't been able to shoot much. I've been slowly building back up over the past month and finally had a good day. I was able to draw 6-10 times in a row without bouncing off the blade....WOOO HOOO!. There were more, just not in a row.

Today was spent just trying to get my anchor back (it's been floating lately) while paying attention to a slow, smooth draw. While most the shots were bouncing on draw, many shots were nice and smooth.

Sure is nice getting back to being able to pull a bow back. It will take a while to get back to where I was but it's nice knowing that my workout is helping.


----------



## Lungbustah

Tried shooting a whole 5 spot game today with my new thumb release. Been using my stan hinge for bout a solid year now. Anyways shot a 300 59x that's my second best score ever


----------



## SonnyThomas

Busy, busy. Cut 2 dozen arrows. Fletched some. Another dozen to cut and 2 dozen to fletch. 
New modules to install and will have to do some string twisting to get draw length.
Have to measure and adjust new strings for another bow and set up.
Get done and have load up all I bought and hand in key to shop.


----------



## Padgett

I shot some indoor after school and then once I got home from my kids basketball games I got to serve in my nose kisser and I served in a lower nock set. My bow was shooting dead on perfect without the nock set so I will probably have to tweek the sights a little to get it back dead on but I just love my little nock sets.


----------



## jbeasleyshoot

took padgetts advice and did the cardboard trick. Was shooting about a yard high so I made a little pointer adjustment. First asa qualifier this weekend and I hope all goes well considering I haven't done near enough work on yardage.


----------



## unclejane

Finally cracked the nut on the apparently incurable knock-high tune on my Hoyt Tribute. The problem was, with everything totally square and the wheels perfectly timed, the knock point had to be a little over *1" below level *to flatten out the bareshaft (regardless of rest type used). Way way goofy.... I couldn't quite figure out what was going on there, since I'd never had even my ancient wheel bows of old give me that type of grief in the tune. 

By trial-and-error I found that putting turns into the top yoke cable (bottom wheel to top limbs) nulled that out. It took about a hour of tweaking back and forth from the press on both the length of that cable and adjusting the yokes themselves (to adjust the wheel lean) to get the knock point "pretty". It now resides about 1/8" to 1/4" above level, mostly where I'm accustomed to having the knock point on a wheel bow. Finally I'm getting a good launch and the knock point adjustments are generating a response like they're supposed to.

I'm still not 100% positive what was goofed up and how/why backing off the timing of that bottom wheel fixed it. For all I know, that's how my old Hoyts from years ago were setup and I never knew it LOL.

So my faith in my Tribute has been restored; now it just needs a peep and a sight and I can resume finalizing a tune and shooting it.

LS


----------



## Padgett

I only had 15 stinking minutes to get in some shooting yesterday and I had a good time sending some arrows to the target, it seemed like my lower nock set had changed the point of impact about a half inch high left but my little dog kept running between me and the target so I really didn't get to shoot that many arrows in the 15 minutes of shooting that I had.

Tonight I am looking forward to working with a friend of mine, he is 15 years old and a indoor shooter. He has never shot 3d and only does indoor which is backwards but good, I am giving him my carbofast stabs tonight to try for a while and 5 of my 30 inch 150 grain point gold tip xxx arrows. n7709k set me up with some xxx arrows with 250 grain points and now I get to help out a buddy with my stuff, gotta love the circle of life and how it works out.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Doing today? Worrying. Woke up with left hand problems. Thumb, index and middle finger tingling bad. Carpal tunnel? Same hand I hand Carpal tunnel surgery on a few years back....5 hours, feels better, but still tingling.


----------



## ThunderEagle

League tonight. Some good shots, some bad shots.

434 with 16x. I did throw 2 eights tonight, and had a disappointing, 9-9-9 end. If you have been following along, my last 3 450 league nights were a personal best 438-19, then a 436-15 and now this 434-16. I should probably be happy with this, as a couple of months ago, I was lucky to be scoring in the mid 420's. I guess I'm getting a little frustrated after almost 5 years into this, and wanting to be at a higher level. I guess I can't expect to suddenly be good, especially with the time I can devote to the hobby currently.

I'm finding my self dropping out of the target a little, I don't know if that is my back shoulder being high, or maybe an adjustment needed to my stabs, or my grip not being optimal.


----------



## acesbettor

Shot league tonight after listening to Dudley's podcast yesterday when he talked about knowing how everything should feel at full draw. I really tried to focus on making sure everything was correct for every shot and just concentrate on making good shots. I ended up with 300 59x, beating my old personal best(besides in practice) by 1x. The shot I missed was only about a 1/4" out the bottom. Even though everything felt really good I still had about 10 shots that I struggled to get off and had to let down and start over. Hopefully I can build on this.


----------



## Rick!

Put in for a WY mule deer tag.
Received notice that I won my turkey lottery early season tag.
Put down a deposit for an early March pig hunt.
Oh, and shot a 5spot training round.


----------



## unclejane

Put the Hoyt back in the rotation. Spent some more time with it getting the wheel lean completely vertical; this was actually off on both wheels more than I'd thought. Several turns were involved on all 4 yoke ends, so it was pretty goofed up. Put a lizard tongue rest on it and did a final tune, sending a few into the Block in the bathroom. Nice virtually perfect bareshaft now. Now it's shooting like a Hoyt wheel bow should. Knock point is between 1/8" and 1/4" above level, which is basically what I'm accustomed to seeing on a 45" wheel bow. 

Shure-Loc and CBE scope, and specialty 45deg peep are back on him and he's ready to shoot again.... There's just something about a wall-shaking thumper wheel bow that's just loads of fun to shoot. Probably because of my highly advanced age LOL.

LS


----------



## grousegrove

I shot league tonight, and not well. I was tired, hungry, thirsty, and rushed a bit, had been running late and had to start having not warmed up. So, I was not able to focus very well. The handicaps are going to crush me this week. 
Now on a much brighter note, my children shot very well, and after the ends were finished I spent some time getting to know my new longbow. I cannot yet shoot it well, but I slowed down and did much better than in my initial session two days ago, so a little confidence boost there.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Set up a couple of arrows I won in a drawing. German brand, Absolute 22. .350 spine is stiffer than I wanted, but, hey, free arrows. Using 47 gr insert and 100 gr Easton pointy points. Pin nocks, pin bushings, 1 3/4" Bohning shield cut vanes. Arrow weighed a even 380 grs. All totals up to 15% FOC. Colder than all get out and a bit of breeze and riser felt like ice, so didn't shoot but a 6 times. 20 yards, last 2 shots gave a evil slapping sound, but no damage. Had to pull both at the same time, that tight together. Pulled and got my butt inside....

Floated these arrows as I couldn't find a blemish mark to go by inside the shaft. All floated exactly the same label down. ??? Every so often I hear of people complain of having to turn the nock to so the arrow is "straight" in the bow for stiff side of spine. I turn arrow to bow so spine is up. For helical I rotate jig receiver (s) so spine is just a bit to the left. Vane than crosses the center line of spine. Look down the arrow from behind the bow string and you see "half" of the vane on one side and "half" of the vane on the other side. Split perfect with spine right down the bow string.


----------



## erdman41

Nerves got the better of me on day one of the state shoot. Plan on a better showing today.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Doing about nothing. Shot those arrows the other day and it's been 8 to 12 degrees ever since..... I still have the keys to closed archery shop, but the owner took down the lights and close to turning off the electricity. Shop just 6 miles away still has terrible lighting...so I ain't driving in this weather on a hit or miss proposition at the another shop....Leagues, 3D leagues, and whatever...


----------



## cbrunson




----------



## Buckster12

Shot my first 300 for the year, I've been hovering at 298-299 for awhile.


----------



## Ned250

cbrunson said:


> View attachment 2164163


kick ass, cb!


----------



## SonnyThomas

Congrats to the above.

This morning, 4 below zero...


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## cbrunson

Ned250 said:


> kick ass, cb!


Thanks!!!


----------



## Padgett

We have been out of school all week for snow so I have been going into the bow shop and just spending all day in there shooting and tuning my buddies bow.


----------



## rohpenguins

messed around set up my field bow


----------



## vito9999

Was practicing for the ASA shoot, cold and windy this morning 30yds.







I really hate that sound.


----------



## grousegrove

Shot in an indoor sectional today, didn't do as well as I'd hoped. Learned an important lesson though: playing around with the setting on your hinge in the middle of a competition is almost certainly a really bad idea! [emoji21] 
They take the best of two scores, so I can try again tomorrow, if I feel up to it after I shovel 10 inches of fresh snow off about four or five of the neighborhood driveways. 
Tonight, icing my arm, watching The Americans on DVR, and reading my new archery book.


----------



## grantmac

Shot a little 16 target WA Field round. PB of 250 and there are an easy 5 points in there that I know I can get.

Light played some major havoc with me on a few shots so I will be fabricating a sun shield for my scope in the near future.

-Grant


----------



## field14

Set up, gathered data, and tuned in my new Darton Vegas that is a gift from my brother. "Tuning" took all of ONE shot for paper testing and 5 more to confirm that the paper test was near perfect. Most are perfect thru paper, but if there is a tendency it is a very slight nock right tear (I'm shooting left handed). That took all of about 10 minutes.
So, I then took my Merlin Excalibur EX-40 and finally got it set to get near perfect paper tears, and again, any tendency is a tiny tad nock right.
Found out that it is all in "face contact" with the bowstring. Pull straight back with minimal face contact = "bullet hole"; slight contact = slight nock right tear. Tuning of the BOW is done....tuning of the person...a work in progress.

Love the new Darton Vegas...that bow came out of the box dead on spec, and I mean DEAD ON SPEC. It was supposed to be 28.5" AMO drawlength and I MEASURED IT and the bow came out spot on. 8" Brace height? MEASURED 8" brace height. 38 1/2" ATA? MEASURED 38 1/2" ATA. They said it bottomed out at 52# peak weight? My Easton scale says it is bottomed out at 50.1 Pounds.
Letoff says 70% (for the % letoff wedge I decided to use), and it is about 73% letoff...but that, I think is in the scale's margin of error.
Overall rating thus far for quality, fit, finish, and exactness to what is advertised would have to be a "10" out of 10. This new Darton Vegas is something else to behold.

Right on the money...now if I can get "me" to be on the money, it could be the start of something good!

field14 (Tom D.)


----------



## Pro1

There is NO BOW better than a DARTON NONE. Fit, finish, quality and customer service are second to none. You will love that Vegas it is a tack driver.


----------



## unclejane

Went back to my Stan Element a couple days ago as a debugging step - I was having another, distressingly common, "gray day" with my hinge and picked up the Stan to see what was going on - and have decided I'm not going back. I've gotten decent with the hinge, but I'm just that much better and more consistent with a pull-through style release. 

I've been kicking a hinge-divorce around for the last month or so, but after the last 2 days with the Stan, I think it's time to go ahead and file the papers.

The last 2 days have been full-time with the Stan (and some with my Evo +) and I can already see an immense improvement in my shot. So the trigger (so to speak) has been pulled....

LS


----------



## superdean00

300 57. State indoor. Very happy with my progress.


----------



## Mahly

:thumbs_up


----------



## Padgett

I had a week off of school because of snow and ice on the roads so I ended up shooting in the bow shop each day and having a great time tweeking things and just enjoying the shooting. Thursday night i actually got to go to my first indoor league and shoot with other people and I totally got my butt kicked by nerves, I was surprised that they jumped up and kicked my butt as bad as they did but I still had a good time.

I did learn a couple things about my shooting though that I think will help out a little, I always enjoy shooting but nothing compares being on the line with other people to let the truth about you shooting come out.


----------



## Mahly

Put my Vectrix XL back together,
Got an Alpine Concorde on the way
Fletched some of my XXX arrows with 4" Quickspins....cuz they have been sitting in my tackle box for YEARS LOL! Well that and fletching 27 series arrows with Kurly vanes IS a little labor intensive to get "perfect". My tools are made for a more "standard" size arrow.


----------



## RCR_III

Well, today was an "ice" day here in Texas so I started setting up my new Podium X Elite 37. Pretty sweet bow so far.


----------



## Fury90flier

not much the past few days.

Picked up a new dominator...well, new to me. I traded my shorter dom 3D for the 40". The setup is for a higher holding weight, different rotation so it has a completely different feel of my other Dom and Supra....So have spent the past couple days getting used to it. This one is going to keep me honest...little valley, if any. Oddly, my grouping is better- just feels weird right now.

I can't wait to get this dialed in for me...I can already tell it holds better than the other Dom


----------



## grantmac

Shot half a 720 today. Not really scoring just learning to shoot the wind.
I need to make up 30oz of weights sometime in March to get things dialed in.

-Grant


----------



## Rick!

Got my eyes checked including dilation. With fuzzy vision it's easy to work on "feeling" my draw hand. Discovered I've added tension during the draw to avoid twinges from an old injury. The extra tension was also being used to supplement my hold. Makes for a great hold and a "sticky" shot break. So, me, the blind bale, and the short game will get to be good friends, again.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Finally changed the modules on my MX2. Lord, did that make a difference and a little confusing. I don't know of a factory made bow that is exact for draw length, Hoyt, Martin, Bowtech, Pearson and whatever. My Martins were so long on draw length that it wasn't funny. Hoyt was kind of close, a hair to two long. Bowtech was over 1/2" too long. My Pearsons...My Marksman was long and needed shorter draw modules. My MX2 was order 28" and came 28 1/4" and I thought great, but with 27 1/2" mods. It felt short though it checked what I wanted. 

Now, new mods in and the draw long, checked long, 28 3/4", but actual drawing it felt pretty correct. Shot it and it felt correct. And a bigger plus was having more of a valley. Before it wanted to take off like mad bull.... I had this before about cams with short draw mods and longer made for better, but this was the first for me.

And peak draw weight changed. I had the limbs set for a nice 53 pounds because of the "wanna go" cams. Now, it runs up to 53 pounds, holds there right until the last inch or so of draw and then registers a tad over 55 pounds.

Gonna shoot the MX2 as is for awhile and see how things go.


----------



## Mahly

Messed around with my Moxie, and trying different arrow set-ups
Seems with the cable stops set to a lower let off, the bow is just a bit short, and I get a more busy float.
Move them back to get the draw length right, and the holding weight is way too low (10lbs) and torque of any kind is over magnified.
Waiting on longer mods to get the DL right without having a ton of let off.
Concorde is on the way, let them fight for the "spots" spot in my stable.


----------



## SonnyThomas

superdean00 said:


> 300 57. State indoor. Very happy with my progress.


Hey! Congrats!


----------



## Fury90flier

just some 20 yard practice today...with some release tuning. An awesome day of shooting. More X's than I've shot in a long time... I'm loving this new Dominator-- Much thanks to James getting it setup.

It's odd. The bow feels funny on draw, still feels a little long (know I was short before) but I'm drilling the center when I don't torque and bare shafts were where they should be and straight. Never had a bow feel odd and shoot well-- I'm guessing it fits.


----------



## ThunderEagle

League night. Shot a respectable 432-15x, which is about my average this year. 7 weeks, not a score below 430 and a personal best 438. I think I need to find this very positive and enjoy it, and continue to work on consistency. Just looked up my average from last year, 427, and I'm at 432 so far this year.

I think my grip may need some attention right now, high, low, medium wrist kind of thing.

It was also my first night shooting my new Carbofast Black X stabilizers. First impressions are favorable. All I did was set them up with the same weight on the front and side bar, and didn't bother to move my side bar angles at all. I'm going to these from Doinker Elite Supreme bars. I cannot make the claim that I felt them settle faster, however they are also 6" longer that my previous front bar. I was shooting a 24" bar with 2oz on the front and 11 or 12 on the rear. I originally had that short of a bar because I tended to pull too strongly into the wall and would have my stab bouncing all over the place. I've smoothed out some, but I need to smooth out some more. The way my bow reacted when the shot broke felt different tonight, I think it may have been a little more stable at the shot than previously.

I will say this though, I always count to 10 between each shot, and typically I'm by far the last one on the line at our league night. Tonight I still did the same thing, however I was finishing up a lot sooner than previously. Obviously everyone else could be slowing down, however I'm wondering if I was indeed getting to my shot sequence much quicker? Anecdotal at best, but it felt good, whether that be the extra length or not, I cannot really say. Regardless, quality stabs, at a pretty good price. I'll be at the Ohio State Indoor shoot this weekend, so anyone that would like to try them out for a couple of shots, just let me know.


----------



## Buckster12

I set up my new Elite Victory tonight. I only put about 8 arrows through it though. Tomorrow night I'll dial it in.


----------



## nochance

Buckster looks like we're on the same page. setting up my E35 with STOZ (thanks). through the rest on set to 13/16, paper tuned :thumbs_up
been shooting my Hoyt really well, but still gonna give the E35 a chance.


----------



## SonnyThomas

5 inches of snow last night and this morning. Guess what I'll be doing


----------



## lknchoppers

Been Tinkering with my draw length, dropped it to 28.5" from 29" (was at 29.5" the year before). I have shot a hinge with a very light click for the past 4 years. A new range opened up here so I have a nice place to shoot at that is not an hour away anymore. They have tournaments once a week. My time is very limited as I work full time and have a nearly full time side business that is physically demanding. I haven't shot an indoor league or spots in 20 years, I mostly shoot 3D indoor & outdoor. In the past month I have shot at the range only four times so I am not expecting anything just going to let it happen and see how it goes. They shoot a Vegas face 300 round at the range. I shoot a Specialist @ 54lbs with Faboy 500s 27" long 100 grains upfront with (3) 1.75" Vanetec Fita Vanes @ 276 fps. It's more of a 3D setup I know. First three rounds I shot a 284,282 and a 294. I was able to practice twice this week. The 28.5" draw feels pretty good and I am starting to get used to it. I'm going to shoot tonight one shot a time. I use the click to get set and then I use back tension, but very little BT makes the release fire usually as long as my index finger is somewhat relaxed. 80-90% of my shots go off at a good time but those other shots go when the pin is moving to the edge of the gold (not centered) and my float opens up a bit. If I set the release colder and use more BT my float gets too big and I have trouble getting the release to fire in a comfortable window. Concentrating on the "X" harder does seem to help.


----------



## unclejane

In my 2nd solid week after putting my hinges in the box and shooting my pull-throughs full time. It almost feels like I'm cheating - they're so easy to shoot with no target panic, no anticipation issues, no nothing. I just pull with the back and it's a total surprise shot every time. Even goes in the target butt sometimes now. Makes me wonder why pull-throughs are so unpopular? And why I didn't shelve my hinge sooner.

I've setup my Stan for use with the PSE and the Evo + with my Hoyt. The hoyt has lower letoff so I need a slightly heavier setting to shoot it, hence the two releases for each bow. I'm finally starting to forget about my shot so I can, er... concentrate on my shot LOL. 

LS


----------



## Padgett

I went into the shop and was wanting to do some specific training but there were to many people on the line so I just banged x's, I shot decent but my float was weird and I just executed good shots and let it do its thing. I only missed two x's so it wasn't a bad session and I had mostly perfect executions.

I did speed up my backspin two times during the session and by the time I was done I really freaking liked my speed, it was firing about 2 seconds into the shot window and it felt awesome. I set it where i can draw back with all my fingers equally and it never once misfired but when I come to anchor if I leave my index finger neutral and then take my thumb off the peg the release fired as my thumb left the peg without running my engine. So what this speed allows me to do is come to full draw and anchor up and then I make my index finger a little firm before I release the peg and the speed is absolutely perfect. I have done this method of finalizing my competition speed on my hinges for about a year and it works really good for me. I have talked about it before where I refer to it as safety slack, when I let off the peg with a neutral index finger I am letting out much more safety slack and when I keep the index finger firm as I let off the thumb peg very little of the safety slack is let out.


----------



## SonnyThomas

SonnyThomas said:


> 5 inches of snow last night and this morning. Guess what I'll be doing


I'm screwed... Man! All but through and caught a frozen ice chunk with corner of blade. Release arm took a beating, wrist, elbow and shoulder. So sore I can't lift it without help of left arm....Nothing broke or tore that I can determine, but dang. Will have to see how it is after a while...


----------



## SonnyThomas

unclejane said:


> In my 2nd solid week after putting my hinges in the box and shooting my pull-throughs full time. It almost feels like I'm cheating - they're so easy to shoot with no target panic, no anticipation issues, no nothing. I just pull with the back and it's a total surprise shot every time. Even goes in the target butt sometimes now. Makes me wonder why pull-throughs are so unpopular? And why I didn't shelve my hinge sooner.
> 
> I've setup my Stan for use with the PSE and the Evo + with my Hoyt. The hoyt has lower letoff so I need a slightly heavier setting to shoot it, hence the two releases for each bow. I'm finally starting to forget about my shot so I can, er... concentrate on my shot LOL.
> 
> LS


I take it "are" was to be "aren't?" Seems a few love them and many can't get along with them. Some pull throughs are a little temperamental getting adjusted and firing consistency has been a issue.... Couple of my friends never shot so good until they went with a pull through. I played with a prototype some time ago, even stamped as such. It worked and I didn't really get to play with it as much as I wanted. Staff person wouldn't let me set it for my bow, but I thought it had merits....


----------



## lknchoppers

unclejane said:


> In my 2nd solid week after putting my hinges in the box and shooting my pull-throughs full time. It almost feels like I'm cheating - they're so easy to shoot with no target panic, no anticipation issues, no nothing. I just pull with the back and it's a total surprise shot every time. Even goes in the target butt sometimes now. Makes me wonder why pull-throughs are so unpopular? And why I didn't shelve my hinge sooner.
> 
> I've setup my Stan for use with the PSE and the Evo + with my Hoyt. The hoyt has lower letoff so I need a slightly heavier setting to shoot it, hence the two releases for each bow. I'm finally starting to forget about my shot so I can, er... concentrate on my shot LOL.
> 
> LS



What releases do you use. I know nothing about pull through releases. Who make them and what model? How do they work?


----------



## ride394

Shot 60 arrows at 6yds with my thumb releases. Think I'm starting to realize I'm just not as consistent with with my hinges.


----------



## Mahly

Set up my hunting bow and shot some with it.
Forgot how well that grip fits compared to my target bow...


----------



## unclejane

lknchoppers said:


> What releases do you use. I know nothing about pull through releases. Who make them and what model? How do they work?


I use 2, the Stanislawski Element and the Carver Evolution +. They don't have a trigger or fire by rotation, they simply fire by themselves once you achieve a certain poundage. So their use couldn't be simpler, you just pull until they break...

PS: they sometimes go by the slightly odd names "pure back tension" (no, not the much-contested-and-fought-over firing engine) release or just "back tension" or "tension" release. 
LS


----------



## unclejane

SonnyThomas said:


> I take it "are" was to be "aren't?" Seems a few love them and many can't get along with them. Some pull throughs are a little temperamental getting adjusted and firing consistency has been a issue.... Couple of my friends never shot so good until they went with a pull through. I played with a prototype some time ago, even stamped as such. It worked and I didn't really get to play with it as much as I wanted. Staff person wouldn't let me set it for my bow, but I thought it had merits....


Well in my case, I kept going back to my Evo about every 3 to 4 weeks with my hinge. That's been going on for months now, actually. Even after I discovered PBT, not 3 weeks into it the wierd anticipation problem started to creep back in, just absolutely right on schedule. Only going to the pull-through for a few days seemed to "reset" whatever keeps going wrong in my brain with the hinge and then back roundey-round I would go for another month. But I never have that problem with the Evo or the Stan. So I decided that I was suffering more than I needed to and threw the towel in.

I don't notice any inconsistency in the releases themselves. For sure, inconsistency in me makes it feel that way, but I'm already getting used to that and my form is firming up. Now even the Evo feels very consistent...

The only thing I'm having to get used to is being really careful about being very light against the wall when releasing the safety. Obviously, you need to do that because you pull into the wall to build up the tension to fire the thing. And towards the end of a long shooting session, I may let down once or twice because I'm starting to get tired. 

But honestly, I get the best surprise releases with it than anything I've gotten with my hinge. And it shows at the target bail... So from a performance-based perspective, I think I need to stick with this style..

LS


----------



## ride394

Shot another close range practice session.


----------



## Buckster12

Shot this today, my best round ever. I'm really liking my Honey Badger release!


----------



## Rick!

Checked out flighting for the state indoor - I get to play with the CH SMFS boys. That was the plan for next year...


----------



## Mahly

Didn't get to shoot, but I fletched up a 1/2 doz lighter arrows with some aerovane IIIs
Hopefully we see how they fly tomorrow.


----------



## Padgett

I shot with my buddy, he is a ex student in my class and is only 15 years old. He shot awesome today and even had a few ends where he had all inside out x's.

I think that after a year of binge shooting he is close to getting on top of it, he has been getting a lot better lately and I think is close to making a big jump in his shooting.

Last week we really tweeked his target bow and got it set up like a solid indoor bow, since then along with some good training on his mental approach his shooting is getting solid.


----------



## nochance

The E35 is coming around. Finishing touches yesterday got the peep installed, threw the stabilizers on a couple tweaks of the site. shot 3 ends with 14/15 X on 5 spot. Looking forward to more tweaking and more time with this bow.


----------



## grantmac

Spent the last week packing and moving. My back and shoulders are done, we haven't even unpacked the van yet.

However the new domicile is within 30 minutes of two indoor ranges and a field range. So things are looking up for the summer.

-Grant


----------



## SonnyThomas

SonnyThomas said:


> I'm screwed... Man! All but through and caught a frozen ice chunk with corner of blade. Release arm took a beating, wrist, elbow and shoulder. So sore I can't lift it without help of left arm....Nothing broke or tore that I can determine, but dang. Will have to see how it is after a while...


Spent about 2 1/2 hours in ER. Not good. Left arm, possible partial muscle or tendon shred (second time for this),kind of a clunk in shoulder and a little burning sensation around edge of shoulder blade. Right arm, traumatized big time, wrist, elbow, shoulder and shoulder blade, possible rotor cuff damage..... Will have to see Orthopedic surgeon to determine how bad...So MRI...
They must have taken 20 X-rays, twisting my arms like crazy, shoving my bad shoulder just so. Oh yeah, it hurt....
Gave me a prescription for pain. Threw it away....


----------



## Garceau

I got contacts today - if these don't help then its off to the Champion style shooting glasses!

I have an astigmatism and usually have a very big burst on my pin. Hoping this helps!


----------



## ThunderEagle

Garceau said:


> I got contacts today - if these don't help then its off to the Champion style shooting glasses!
> 
> I have an astigmatism and usually have a very big burst on my pin. Hoping this helps!


I have one as well. Until recently, I could function without glasses for archery. I'm going to try contacts, waiting fur samples to come in, as I need then for distance, and apparently that isn't that common.


----------



## ThunderEagle

Had the OAA State Indoor this weekend. Didn't shoot add well as I hoped, but is an improvement over last year.

Had a flighted money shoot Saturday night, shot a vegas 330 as qualification, I had a 301 in that, put me in 3rd flight, but lost my first bracket. Still, I was in the 5th flight last year.

I'm struggling to find a consistent grip. I need to do a creep tune, now to find the time.

Ordered some sugru, still not sure if I'm going to try that route yet.


----------



## nochance

Shot the 1st round(blue face) with the new E35. Did stab work Sunday experimenting with weights and grouping analysis. Stuck with 4.5 front, 6 back (hunter class, i know its frowned upon by some). Shot 300 40 X not my best but no fours. After scoring, i kept jacking up the weights and it seemed to be helping with 13 out of 15x before I needed to back off the line and make room for other people.


----------



## SonnyThomas

SonnyThomas said:


> Spent about 2 1/2 hours in ER. Not good. Left arm, possible partial muscle or tendon shred (second time for this),kind of a clunk in shoulder and a little burning sensation around edge of shoulder blade. Right arm, traumatized big time, wrist, elbow, shoulder and shoulder blade, possible rotor cuff damage..... Will have to see Orthopedic surgeon to determine how bad...So MRI...
> They must have taken 20 X-rays, twisting my arms like crazy, shoving my bad shoulder just so. Oh yeah, it hurt....
> Gave me a prescription for pain. Threw it away....


So spent some time with Orthopedic Surgeon. Left arm, Doc; "wait and see how it comes out." Right arm, Doc; "You really banged it up." Hey, he's a good kid...Doc looks like a kid, but he's successfully overhauled me before. I guess muscle wrenches/strains, forearm something muscle, all muscles of the upper arm, shoulder and shoulder blade. He exampled by moving his arms as to how things get shoved when in a "wreck" like had with handle bars. The biggie though is I've a separated shoulder. Shoulder, that sucker is made of a bunch joints and one joint not spoke or wrote of that much and the Doc says; "Right here." Right on the top tip of the shoulder. Lord! Like to dropped me to my knees and he barely pressed there. 
So he wants me in therapy right now, starting Friday morning. Wants to see me every two weeks and at the end of 4 to 6 weeks if things aren't improving then MRI to see what's going on. 
I can put on a T-shirt if I have enough Ben Gay or Icy Hot rubbed in my shoulder and upper arm. Still hurts though... Aspercreme sucks...


----------



## ThunderEagle

League tonight. However, got there early as I wanted to tweak draw length. Took a couple twists out of string and moved peep as I felt I was leaning my head in.

Felt better, maybe a touch long, didn't shoot all that great, was throwing shots high. At the half, Checked timing and took a half twist out off buss. Felt even better still, and shoot pretty well. We'll leave it there for a bit. Also messed with stabilizer weights, probably shouldn't have.

I am getting bad bare shaft flight, concerned it is torque.


----------



## sharkred7

Shot my second 60X at league this year then got to play with my new outdoor rig (inside at 20), that needs some tweeking yet but only missed 2 tens on the vegas face with protours. Those just barely out also 
I cant wait until after nationals when we have a indoor 70M shoot. I want to see how this shoots at distance. Very excited!!

John


----------



## Padgett

I actually had something happen wednesday that hasn't happened in a long time, I shot really good for a hour or so and I stopped to take a break and talk to the owner of the shop for a good 35 minutes or so and I was going to shoot a vegas round after the break. I put up a new target and started shooting and missing the 10 ring almost every other shot and I just decided that I was done for the day. 

I never do that, ever.


----------



## acesbettor

Shot a vegas round with the A/C/G's I just picked up. Dropped the 28th arrow.. Not bad for not even moving the rest after shooting X27's


----------



## montigre

SonnyThomas said:


> So spent some time with Orthopedic Surgeon. Left arm, Doc; "wait and see how it comes out." Right arm, Doc; "You really banged it up."
> 
> I can put on a T-shirt if I have enough Ben Gay or Icy Hot rubbed in my shoulder and upper arm. Still hurts though... Aspercreme sucks...


Pick up some Arnicare and use on your shoulders, especially before going to therapy. It is some of the best natural anti-inflammatory stuff you can buy for external muscular pains/strains. Works so well that often the pain diminishes before you've finished rubbing it in. It does not interfere with other medications you may be taking and has no medicine smell or feel. I and some of my shooting buddies use it for shooting soreness. Really works well. 

Here's the link for it on amazon: http://www.amazon.com/Boiron-Arnica...ie=UTF8&qid=1425707393&sr=8-5&keywords=arnica


----------



## Armyof1

okay guys call me stupid but i dont care . i have been reading on here all the post you guys have made and i have 2 questions . 
1) what is blind bale shooting and whats its purpose


2) what is shot engen and what is its purpose 

ok maybe thats 4 questions


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> Pick up some Arnicare and use on your shoulders, especially before going to therapy. It is some of the best natural anti-inflammatory stuff you can buy for external muscular pains/strains. Works so well that often the pain diminishes before you've finished rubbing it in. It does not interfere with other medications you may be taking and has no medicine smell or feel. I and some of my shooting buddies use it for shooting soreness. Really works well.
> 
> Here's the link for it on amazon: http://www.amazon.com/Boiron-Arnica...ie=UTF8&qid=1425707393&sr=8-5&keywords=arnica


Thanks, Gail. Took therapy #1 yesterday. By the Therapist I'm not to over do it. So a little pain is telling of the safety factor.

The trouble with having a computer is able to Search for things. Separated shoulder is not what you want to read or see. By most all accounts someone who has a separated shoulder will eventually have to have surgery as in sutured or screwed together. Not so according to my Therapist. Graphic pictures of sutures, screws, how much you're cut open and lengths of recovery didn't go well with me. Oh, and the screw has to come out after 4 or 6 weeks because they will eventually break off! Lord! Yeah that part of the shoulder is flexible so working it breaks off the screw.
So for the present I'm looking at 4 to 6 weeks, if everything goes right, before I can start shooting again....


----------



## unclejane

Dang Sonny, be careful man. Us old folks can't fight like Bruce Lee out there anymore... you and Gail are my heros so dont want to see yall sidelined.... 

I will say tho that even a horrible, possibly permanent injury you can come back from. I started last summer with a Genesis Pro and now I shoot my Hoyt wheel bow for the most part indoors. Folks at the range can hardly believe I'm shooting only 30 lbs with wheels and a 12" stabilizer. That big ol wheel bow piles em up in the gold just like the heavy, aggressive cam freestyle rigs.... 

So when you come back, start off slow and light weight. Yeah you can still reinjure yourself even shooting light poundage (don't ask me why I know that), but it does help protect all the healing stuff....

LS


----------



## Mahly

Armyof1 said:


> okay guys call me stupid but i dont care . i have been reading on here all the post you guys have made and i have 2 questions .
> 1) what is blind bale shooting and whats its purpose
> 
> 
> 2) what is shot engen and what is its purpose
> 
> ok maybe thats 4 questions


Blank/blind bale shooting:
Shooting without a target... Just point at the bale.
Used to focus concentration on some other aspect (normally your firing engine) without dividing your attention by worrying about hitting the X

Firing engine: what you do to make the release go off. Be it back tension alone, or back tension along with some form of hand manipulation with a hinge or thumb trigger release. Technically, a slow squeeze on an index trigger is a firing engine.
The term engine used to emphasize that the process of firing the release must run, and isn't an instant action. I.e. most wouldn't consider punching a trigger to be a firing engine, just an instant action.
For something like Oly recurve, pulling through the click is part of the firing engine, even though there is an instant action at the click.
At least that's how I explain it, others may look at it differently or choose different words to describe it.


----------



## Armyof1

okay so now i understand better these are things i already do but didnt know i was doing them lol . thanks for clearing this up for me


----------



## montigre

SonnyThomas said:


> Thanks, Gail. Took therapy #1 yesterday. By the Therapist I'm not to over do it. So a little pain is telling of the safety factor.
> 
> The trouble with having a computer is able to Search for things. Separated shoulder is not what you want to read or see. By most all accounts someone who has a separated shoulder will eventually have to have surgery as in sutured or screwed together. Not so according to my Therapist. Graphic pictures of sutures, screws, how much you're cut open and lengths of recovery didn't go well with me. Oh, and the screw has to come out after 4 or 6 weeks because they will eventually break off! Lord! Yeah that part of the shoulder is flexible so working it breaks off the screw.
> So for the present I'm looking at 4 to 6 weeks, if everything goes right, before I can start shooting again....


Sonny, make sure your therapist knows your goals right form the outset. Too often they see an older man or woman walk into the office and tailor down their rehab based on the presumed age of the patient. Let them know you're a recovering athlete and that you're not just interested in gaining just enough strength and range of motion so you're able to pick up Fifi every now and again. I also took my fully loaded competition bow into therapy with me along with a no fire release and instructed them how to draw and hold a bow so that they were more aware of the exact muscle groups that needed to be focused on and what types of stressors those muscle groups would be placed under. 

Don't pay too much attention to the online stuff, without an MRI to know exactly what's going on, you'll just end up scaring the bejesus out of yourself. Focus on your recovery right now. When you're ready to get back to shooting, send me a PM and I would be very happy to offer my assistance. 

Sorry to hijack this thread, but.....


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> Sonny, make sure your therapist knows your goals right form the outset. Too often they see an older man or woman walk into the office and tailor down their rehab based on the presumed age of the patient. Let them know you're a recovering athlete and that you're not just interested in gaining just enough strength and range of motion so you're able to pick up Fifi every now and again. ...


Gail,  sort of my first words were; 3D starts this weekend. How fast can you fix me up? That young pup said; "You're on the disabled list, but we'll do the best we can to get you going." I don't know what this world is coming to, letting teenagers practice medical care. Don't they have older Doctors and Therapists?


----------



## sixstringer4528

I shot my first vegas classic 300 and scored 274 3x freestyle. I came in 3rd for bhfs for my age group.


----------



## N7709K

worked on the new UAF research vessel pulling a heat exchanger apart to see if some of the outlets were cracked and needed welding


----------



## unclejane

Now that my Evo and Stan have restored the fun to archery again, I took the Tribute and my Evo + outdoors today. At only 30lbs and shooting a 320-5 grain arrow, it's not an extraordinary outdoors bow. But it's so much fun to shoot, it's getting most of my time over my PSE's lately.

So even with a little wind I wanted to see how it did at 30 yards. Respectable even with the wind bobbling me around occasionally and the loooong graceful arc to the target. I have the bareshaft grouping with the fletched reliably now or just a hair knock low (it's the high right shaft in the picture). I am looking forward to the day when I can bump this sucker up to its mighty 40lb peak weight, though:

LS


----------



## Padgett

I got out yesterday and I put on my rubber boots because the yard is a mushy mess to say the least here in missouri, my buddies are at the missouri state indoor stuff and I am at home suffering not being there with them.

I just installed a d-loop on my bow last week and hadn't got to shoot it outside because of the pathetic weather here in missouri so i set up at 40 yards and began shooting, it was about a yard and a half hot so I got that taken care of but I kept hitting a inch and a half left and right with no pattern to get on top of why. After about a 45 minute shooting session it hit me what was different from shot to shot. On some shots I was anchoring really tight to my face sinking the string into my skin a little and on some shots I wasn't. So I stopped sinking it into my face and I came to anchor and just lightly touched my nose to the string and had a good anchor and sighted in my bow to that setting and I started drilling the 12 ring at 40 yards and things ended really well.


----------



## grantmac

Shot a 50 target Safari round for fun yesterday just confirming my marks, some were off a good bit on the long stuff.

Sure do love the long-range games. I'd rather shoot a safari or field round to 3D any day.

-Grant


----------



## cbrunson

acesbettor said:


> Shot a vegas round with the A/C/G's I just picked up. Dropped the 28th arrow.. Not bad for not even moving the rest after shooting X27's


Good shooting!!!

I was starting to think this post was turning into what everyone did at work or on the farm, rather than target shooting. A guy almost shoots a 300 Vegas with skinny outdoor arrows, and people are talking about skin cremes. :sad:


----------



## Mahly

Been warmer here the last couple of days, and I was able to do some shooting in the garage.
For the first time, I can say I actually did some true spectator shooting.
Very hard to virtually ignore the pin, but I finally got through it.
Not many arrows... A few each day. But they were honest spectator shots. It WAS nice in that they make shooting much more effortless!
Being in the garage, I can't say the POI was better or worse... Actually, isn't that the point?


----------



## acesbettor

cbrunson said:


> Good shooting!!!
> 
> I was starting to think this post was turning into what everyone did at work or on the farm, rather than target shooting. A guy almost shoots a 300 Vegas with skinny outdoor arrows, and people are talking about skin cremes. :sad:


LMAO! Thanks brother! I really think this thread took a down turn. Some of these guys just like to "hear themselves talk" so to speak. 

On an archery related topic, I won the NFAA MA state indoor with a 300 59x yesterday. Looking forward to sectionals in 2 weeks!!


----------



## Ned250

acesbettor said:


> LMAO! Thanks brother! I really think this thread took a down turn. Some of these guys just like to "hear themselves talk" so to speak.
> 
> On an archery related topic, I won the NFAA MA state indoor with a 300 59x yesterday. Looking forward to sectionals in 2 weeks!!


LMAO @ skin cremes. Congrats on the win!!!


----------



## Ned250

I shot 53x at sectionals this weekend. My shot has felt so fricken good lately, but I just can't seem to get out of my own way. 

Today I went to the club and focused on slowing myself down between shots. I've been working on shooting my shot aggressively, which has had a small negative side effect. I'm hammering through all of my shots without much of a break. So tonight I focused on taking a few breaths after a shot and trying to flip the switch off (thanks to a post from wolf44). This worked out very well. Shot a 300/21x and dare I say it wasn't very difficult/stressful. What an odd feeling....


----------



## cschwanz

Got my stabilizers mounted on my new-to-me MR8 for target shooting and played in the garage range (only about 15-20 feet long). I got my sight last week and we rough set it after league last week (shot my Creed for what I hope is the last time at spots, haha). Decided to hang a string today and play with the sight a bit. Took about 8 shots...


----------



## Rick!

Arrowed two pigs in 40 minutes on the last day of my hunt.  No hang up, no second thoughts, just draw, relax and voila - pork.


----------



## grantmac

Shot 18 more Safari targets today then went up to the club house and shot something called a Flint Round. I'd heard the name before but never shot one.
Fun little indoor game. I wouldn't have dropped any points if it weren't for forgetting that I had shot the 7yd target for 25 and then leaving the sight set for 25 when we moved back to 20.

The really good part was that my float was mostly inside the X on the 35cm at 20yds. Not like floating the X on a Vegas face but good progress for me.

-Grant


----------



## N7709K

Tigged up a bunch of gussets on some stainless outlets on a heat exchanger today and got another one to tear down and do tomorra... Kinda tuned my bow for outdoors; gotta wait for a day when it's not blowing 35mph outside so I can finish getting groups where I want them (can only do so much at 40yds), but that may be a bit as I'm leavin Saturday for 6weeks


----------



## montigre

N7709K said:


> Tigged up a bunch of gussets on some stainless outlets on a heat exchanger today and got another one to tear down and do tomorra...


t: Careful, 'ol grumpy puss will nail you for not keeping it 100% archery......lol!!


----------



## Padgett

After school I shot with my indoor buddy and shot awesome, I warmed up and then shot 10 inside out ends in a row and had a great time. Just as we left the shop I got a call from My local Pro shooter Sam Woltius and he asked me to come over to Seymour and shoot with him. I called my indoor buddy and we jumped in a truck and headed that way, there were only 4 of us shooting and I can't believe it but I was freaking nervous and it took me 40 minutes to get over it. Fortunately Sam was messing with some gold tip pro hunters and setting them up for a possible shoot down at indoor nationals so I had lots of warm up time to settle down. 

I just don't know why my nerves affect me so much indoor, last year it took me a good three weeks of shooting two league nights per week to get over it and actually enjoy my shooting. I suck.


----------



## Padgett

When Sam got done messing with his pro hunters we played my new indoor game and it was really fun, of course Sam won because he is freaking awesome but all of us scored at least one point. I am going to start a new thread and explain the game.


----------



## cbrunson

acesbettor said:


> LMAO! Thanks brother! I really think this thread took a down turn. Some of these guys just like to "hear themselves talk" so to speak.
> 
> On an archery related topic, I won the NFAA MA state indoor with a 300 59x yesterday. Looking forward to sectionals in 2 weeks!!


Congrats!!!


----------



## Wichhart

Tried tuning my bow. Bad left tear that won't change grr. Going to get some cam spacers and try that. So hoping that works other wise I'm stuck.


----------



## N7709K

hahahah oh well.. maybe he will... tigged up more stainless on more heat exchangers today lol


----------



## ride394

Shot league tonight after abandoning my hinge about a week ago. Made a few bad shots but ended up with a 433 15x. I know where my faults are, just need to keep working on them.


----------



## ktyre

put my new zbros light kit on my new cbe tek target blew my mind how big the difference is!!!!!


----------



## grantmac

Shot the first arrows out of my new to me Shadowcat. Boy does that bow hold well, don't even have the back stab on it yet. Got the cams timed together and set the let-off around 65% or so.

Can't get a bareshaft to fly worth a lick but a quick french tune in the yard had logical results. Perhaps that is just the nature of a bow without yokes?

-Grant


----------



## grantmac

Did some creep tuning with the Shadowcat today. Advanced the top cam 3 turns from my eyeball timing of yesterday and things are tightening up. Had to move almost all of the weight on my front stab to the rear to get the float to stop bobbing though. Also think I'm just a touch long on DL at the moment.

-Grant


----------



## JDZ

I shot my worst NFAA indoor round in over a year. 295, 25x. Two months ago I was trying to work on things that I thought would get me over the 299 hump. Now I'm struggling to shoot 25-point ends. I'm trying to do some selective reading here on AT. I like this section of the forum.


----------



## Rick!

Went back to short range training to address a decreasing X count. It's working out very well.


----------



## unclejane

Took a break this week due to overdoing it last weekend with a recurve (failed experiment). Resuming today with my Hoyt wheel bow as a precaution, due to the easiest draw in the industry and wanting to be as easy on the meat and gristle in the right shoulder as I can. 

This will be about a month since putting the hinge in the parts box and going to a tension-style release all the time. No trace so far of a return of any strange anticipation issues; it's usually about this time that that happens with the hinge and I start cognitively working the release with the draw hand. So far I'm free of it and am having a surprise shot every time.

Also, still no trace of any inconsistency in the release poundage of either my Evo + or my Element. OTOH, I'm shooting extremely low poundage so both are nearly bottomed out. The Stan is backed off as low as it'll go at an estimated 9 or 10lbs. The Evo will go lower but it's near the lowest poundage it'll do with the lightest spring. But neither goes off early or late that I can tell, which is starting to cast doubt on the claims of inconsistency in these releases that you hear here and there.

My Hoyt is almost like shooting a recurve with a tension release, due to the extremely smooshy back wall. So it's an interesting bow to shoot with one of these, tho bizarrely fun for no apparent reason....

LS


----------



## Mahly

Spent more time with my new firing engine, just garage range, but truly enjoying what for me is a new way of shooting.


----------



## JDZ

I shot as good a round as I've shot in maybe a month. I reassessed a couple issues and it worked well.


----------



## montigre

JDZ said:


> I shot as good a round as I've shot in maybe a month. I reassessed a couple issues and it worked well.


:thumbs_up That's great to hear!! It's always a boost in the confidence department when something you've been working on finally starts to pan out.


----------



## Rick!

Shot my first 5 spot 300 in competition last night which is my 7th 300 round of the season. Now if I can marry it to a 54X by April 11 I could be competitive at State...


----------



## nochance

been shooting the E35 for about 3 weeks jumping through different stabilizer weight combos(BHFS), finally decided to stick with 7 front and 8 on the back. been doing a lot of short range work on shot timing and pure back tension(no intentional manipulation). Also went to a smaller peep aperture as i felt alignment issues sometimes cost me. Ran the kids league yesterday, then helped 2 youth shooters with a science experiment, then helped set up the 3d pop up league. Finally got to shoot a 5 spot round. The work has been paying off. Shot a 300 49X with 24 Inside X's. While not a worlds best, i was very happy with it, as it is a personal best. I attached a pic. thought i was doing a good job of aligning my stance for right vs left side. For whatever reason the upper left was my problem spot. I'm open to feedback as to why it seemed to have a larger vertical spread.


----------



## Sasquech

Came back from shooting the wrong target yesterday due to a spouse shooting flash photography after asking it to be stopped turned around and put an arrow inthe wrong target . Came back today with a 300 and 51x not a bad end to the tournament


----------



## pwyrick

I proved the axiom, "You can't win a tournament in the first five targets, but you can lose it in the first five." Went 7 down (3d shoot) in first five, then shot my way back to 1 up.


----------



## JDZ

nochance said:


> For whatever reason the upper left was my problem spot. I'm open to feedback as to why it seemed to have a larger vertical spread.


Do you shoot the upper left first. I do, and the last few weeks, it has been my weakest arrow. I think I haven't been getting my mind totally set before shooting that first arrow, and I tend to make mistakes there.

There have been stretches, where my last arrow tended to be the weakest, and I think it was because I just wanted to get that last arrow off the string so I could be done, instead of continuing to concentrate on making a good shot.


----------



## cbrunson

acesbettor said:


> Shot a vegas round with the A/C/G's I just picked up. Dropped the 28th arrow.. Not bad for not even moving the rest after shooting X27's


Shot one myself today after tuning them. I sailed one on the sixth end. I thought about shooting another one but decided to go outside and shoot out to 50.


----------



## elkbow69

finished making up some 2413's for indoors early this am. Will give em a test-fly in a vegas round later in the week.


----------



## nochance

JDZ said:


> Do you shoot the upper left first. I do, and the last few weeks, it has been my weakest arrow. I think I haven't been getting my mind totally set before shooting that first arrow, and I tend to make mistakes there.
> 
> There have been stretches, where my last arrow tended to be the weakest, and I think it was because I just wanted to get that last arrow off the string so I could be done, instead of continuing to concentrate on making a good shot.


Yes, I shoot the upper left 1st. Unfortunately my problem spot seems to change from round to round. I attached tonight's league target and the upper left isn't so bad. I shot another personal best 300 50x and 31 inside X but felt like my shot timing was much worse than it has been. I felt like the hinge kept hanging up, I'm sure it was me, and i let down often. On the flip side this hinge has 10 + years on it and it may be time for a new one or a rebuild. I appreciate your feedback.


----------



## acesbettor

cbrunson said:


> Shot one myself today after tuning them. I sailed one on the sixth end. I thought about shooting another one but decided to go outside and shoot out to 50.
> 
> View attachment 2185843


Nice shooting! You were killing that bottom right x!


----------



## JDZ

nochance said:


> Yes, I shoot the upper left 1st. Unfortunately my problem spot seems to change from round to round. I attached tonight's league target and the upper left isn't so bad. I shot another personal best 300 50x and 31 inside X but felt like my shot timing was much worse than it has been. I felt like the hinge kept hanging up, I'm sure it was me, and i let down often. On the flip side this hinge has 10 + years on it and it may be time for a new one or a rebuild. I appreciate your feedback.


I'm not sure what to say about that. Over time I've had changing problem spots, too. A couple weeks ago it was the center spot, which I could not explain at all, since it is the third spot I shoot. I hear people at league complain about certain spots, too.


----------



## cbrunson

acesbettor said:


> Nice shooting! You were killing that bottom right x!


Thanks.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Still on the side lines and about as depressed as I've ever been. Tried drawing my bow and couldn't draw halfway. Everything just stops, no horse power to draw farther. No pain to speak of.


----------



## grantmac

Couldn't shoot the last few days. Trying to develop my sight marks for Safari/field and things seem to be getting close. Bow might be a tad long on DL.

-Grant


----------



## montigre

SonnyThomas said:


> Still on the side lines and about as depressed as I've ever been. Tried drawing my bow and couldn't draw halfway. Everything just stops, no horse power to draw farther. No pain to speak of.


I truly feel your pain and understand where it is coming from. Would it help if I sent you a Genesis bow I have laying around from my early shoulder recovery days to borrow for a while? It's nothing like your target bows, but it will at least keep you in the game mentally and allow you to waft (yes, they really are that slow...haha) a few arrows down range. Let me know and I can have it out to you ASAP.

Cheers,
~Gail


----------



## montigre

Working on a lesson plan between practice sessions...Looks like I will probably be teaching the staff of a big box store how to instruct others to shoot archery. It's a very bold and positive move on their part and may be a big + for the sport at the grass roots level.


----------



## grousegrove

Did a multiple hour practice session at my clubs indoor range. Scoring myself, I shot personal bests in two 3-spot and one 5-spot timed rounds. I was pleased with that. Then I spent a long time shooting my longbow so I ended very humbly.


----------



## Deputy Archer

Recently took a half inch off my draw on the new podium 37, mind blown, some much more control over my shot, aiming and shot execution. This has given me much more confidence in up hill shots.


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> I truly feel your pain and understand where it is coming from. Would it help if I sent you a Genesis bow I have laying around from my early shoulder recovery days to borrow for a while? It's nothing like your target bows, but it will at least keep you in the game mentally and allow you to waft (yes, they really are that slow...haha) a few arrows down range. Let me know and I can have it out to you ASAP.
> 
> Cheers,
> ~Gail


Thanks, Gail, but I have 3 or 4 Pearson and Fred Bear kid compounds. Used them when I recovering from my bow hand rebuilt. They range from like 12, 18 and 30 pounds.
It's just that I can do just about everything kind of normal and then to draw my bow... If my shoulder was in a cast I could understand not drawing my bow.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Therapy this morning and seeing the Orthopedic Surgeon.

Okay, back tension as in Pure back tension (however anyone wishes to express it)....There is full back tension as in working both sets of rhomboids together, right and left. The Therapist has me doing this; back tension drawing the shoulders first back or squeezing together, then down and then up. Incredible was the Therapist's words when I seemed overly strong doing the exercises. And then I do each side independently. Full back, right back and left back, 10 sessions each. So hold time was first set to 2 seconds as to not over do it. So I asked of what was over doing it. While the therapist was giving his answer I held all the while and really bearing down. No pain and not what I call stressful. I went easily 20 seconds. And the question came; "Can all you archers do this?" 

Both say I'm doing great....That's their opinion...I have another :sad:


----------



## unclejane

SonnyThomas said:


> Therapy this morning and seeing the Orthopedic Surgeon.
> 
> Okay, back tension as in Pure back tension (however anyone wishes to express it)....There is full back tension as in working both sets of rhomboids together, right and left. The Therapist has me doing this; back tension drawing the shoulders first back or squeezing together, then down and then up. Incredible was the Therapist's words when I seemed overly strong doing the exercises. And then I do each side independently. Full back, right back and left back, 10 sessions each. So hold time was first set to 2 seconds as to not over do it. So I asked of what was over doing it. While the therapist was giving his answer I held all the while and really bearing down. No pain and not what I call stressful. I went easily 20 seconds. And the question came; "Can all you archers do this?"
> 
> Both say I'm doing great....That's their opinion...I have another :sad:


K,well the good thing there is... it sounds like you don't have any nerve damage or anything that's actually weakened the muscles pathologically? PT's and doctors can recognize instantly something like that - i.e. my right leg/calf after my spine surgery last year, so surely they'd have reported something bad like that right away.

Maybe all that's left is your mental game haha... 

LS


----------



## SonnyThomas

unclejane said:


> K,well the good thing there is... it sounds like you don't have any nerve damage or anything that's actually weakened the muscles pathologically? PT's and doctors can recognize instantly something like that - i.e. my right leg/calf after my spine surgery last year, so surely they'd have reported something bad like that right away.
> 
> Maybe all that's left is your mental game haha...
> 
> LS


I am perfectly happy with being insane, thank you


----------



## MiniJCW

Today i had my first go with a thumb trigger, Stan SX2 that i borrowed of a friend, WOW what a difference in hold i have experienced. I have been shooting a Stan hinge for nearly 2 years and struggled on and off with too much tension in my bow arm. No matter how i try to turn off the tension it just would not go some days.

I have found it very relaxing to shoot to the point that i had eaten out the whole centre section of 1 target face and now i am onto my second target face with a nice new black hole opening up. I think i am going to have to find one of these Stan SX2 releases for myself now the hinge might have to go into the spare parts box for a while.


----------



## grantmac

Shot our modified <20yd Flint round league for the second time tonight. Used the "yield" hinge engine which has been really tension free for me lately and working very nicely, for once I'm definitely floating inside the X most of the time. 
My shot sequence is the slowest on the line so I tend to feel a little pressure approaching the end of an end. Had one arrow that hung and let-down. Unfortunately it hung again and I did a squeeze instead of a let-down. Shot my only 4 of the night, bugger.
Still an improvement from last week where I shot a 137 17x, this week was a 139 25x (140 28x is max). Most of the Xs on the 35cm target were inside out which felt really good.

For the first time I feel like I could be a 58-60x shooter.

-Grant


----------



## SonnyThomas

MiniJCW said:


> Today i had my first go with a thumb trigger, Stan SX2 that i borrowed of a friend, WOW what a difference in hold i have experienced. I have been shooting a Stan hinge for nearly 2 years and struggled on and off with too much tension in my bow arm. No matter how i try to turn off the tension it just would not go some days.
> 
> I have found it very relaxing to shoot to the point that i had eaten out the whole centre section of 1 target face and now i am onto my second target face with a nice new black hole opening up. I think i am going to have to find one of these Stan SX2 releases for myself now the hinge might have to go into the spare parts box for a while.


I have the Stan Shootoff. I like the wide range of adjustment of the pulling post, nice tension setting, no springs to change, the way it fires, feels in the hand, but think closing the jaws sucks. Spoiled by my TRU Ball ST360s and then wish my ST360s had the adjustability of the Shootoff.


----------



## ThunderEagle

SonnyThomas said:


> I have the Stan Shootoff. I like the wide range of adjustment of the pulling post, nice tension setting, no springs to change, the way it fires, feels in the hand, but think closing the jaws sucks. Spoiled by my TRU Ball ST360s and then wish my ST360s had the adjustability of the Shootoff.


Sonny, it isn't quite the same, but the new Incredible trigger can give you a lot more adjustments. It should work on a st360, add it worked on my Absolute 360.


----------



## MiniJCW

Sonny could not agree more about the jaw closing bit, i felt like i had about 10 thumbs trying to work it at first. I got into a rhythm with it but i still look awkward. 

I did not play with the adjustment side of things because it was not my release but wow i just hammered the gold for hours. I am positive if was shooting my FITA indoor arrows and not my anorexic FITA outdoor arrows there would not of been to many misses on the 10 ring on a 3 spot face. I have never experienced a shooting session like i have today it was so much fun that i didnt want to stop, but the fading sun certainly put an end to that idea. Fingers crossed it was not just the "new equipment effect" and i can carry on some of todays shooting into the state comp on Sunday.


----------



## SonnyThomas

ThunderEagle said:


> Sonny, it isn't quite the same, but the new Incredible trigger can give you a lot more adjustments. It should work on a st360, add it worked on my Absolute 360.


I was relating of the thumb barrel, only forward of backwards, no out or turning barrel. I've got the release set like I want as for firing, heavy spring and set heavy.


----------



## ThunderEagle

SonnyThomas said:


> I was relating of the thumb barrel, only forward of backwards, no out or turning barrel. I've got the release set like I want as for firing, heavy spring and set heavy.


Me too, it replaces the thumb barrel with another one that has more adjustment to it.

http://truball.com/Triggers.html


----------



## Rick!

Stopped in at the range after lunch and shot a half a round with no warmup. 
150/28X, 13 inners. The two I dropped in the 5th end were from fooling around with the latest "yielding" craze. 
Made a mental and physical adjustment and ran another set of X's. That was fun.


----------



## grantmac

Shot 18 targets of Safari then decided to head indoors and see how the set-up would do on an NFAA round. Never shot NFAA with a compound before, only WA.
Turns out that I'm a 300-50x shooter with skinny-ish arrows. Maybe 2-3 of the Xs would have been in with fatter arrows. 
So not fantastic but something to build on.

-Grant


----------



## N7709K

Welded out a bunch of 5" and 6" pipe and fit some big (6'x16') hull inserts for a project at work...


----------



## acesbettor

SonnyThomas said:


> I have the Stan Shootoff. I like the wide range of adjustment of the pulling post, nice tension setting, no springs to change, the way it fires, feels in the hand, but think closing the jaws sucks. Spoiled by my TRU Ball ST360s and then wish my ST360s had the adjustability of the Shootoff.


I find it easiest to load the sx2 by pushing the movable jaw against the nock of the arrow after you have the loop in between the jaws.


----------



## cbrunson

N7709K said:


> Welded out a bunch of 5" and 6" pipe and fit some big (6'x16') hull inserts for a project at work...


Don't come across 5" pipe very often.


----------



## N7709K

It's a weird setup- 6" fore of the engine room bulkhead and then 5" aft to match the original hard plumbed stuff... For the most part it's all 5G/5G-R but there is some 2G stuff with flanges. Makes it tough to shoot when you're on a 6week hitch


----------



## cbrunson

I don't miss those days. I do miss building things though. I'm a CWI now.


----------



## elkbow69

did some of this....


----------



## N7709K

i'm not gonna miss some of it, but other parts i'm gonna miss when i hang it up... got some "fun" plate seams to do here in the next couple days and a bit more 5G-R piping


----------



## cbrunson

N7709K said:


> i'm not gonna miss some of it, but other parts i'm gonna miss when i hang it up... got some "fun" plate seams to do here in the next couple days and a bit more 5G-R piping


Yeah mostly the grinding. Not so bad building pipe spools. I actually enjoyed being a fitter. But back gouging plate seams on tank shells not so much. 


On topic - I shot at foam the first time this year yesterday. Did decent at 15 up. It took half a dozen shots to warm up and settle in. Typical me, removed a couple twists and no warm up before the start.


----------



## Wichhart

Walked around the 3d course with a little block target. Got some good practice judging. Was very happy on how it went. Out of the 40 stations there was prob only 3 or 4 that I was off by 5 yards or so. The rest I was on with in a yard or 2


----------



## SonnyThomas

February 26th until today, March 22. Down out with traumatized arm, wrist, elbow, shoulder, separated shoulder, and banged up and tore muscles. Kinda irked. All this time and not a word about the bicep tore more in my left arm. Last Wednesday and Friday the Therapist worked on massaging the knots out of my right arm and dang he found a bunch and then he felt maybe I had a slight tear in my right bicep. Felt okay after he was done, but sore. 
Slept on arm and shoulder wrong last night, I guess. Got up this morning hurting something awful. Aspirins, Extra Strength Ben Gay and Icy Hot never gave relief. Rubbed down when I got up, rubbed down after lunch. Rubbed down again a 3rd time and 3 aspirins had me zonk out. Set alarm to force me up. 
Ache and burning was a little less. Still, I was just plain mad. 6:30 pm and out the door I went with a attitude I was drawing my bow or ripping my shoulder so they had to fix it. I GOT IT DONE! Only just the one shot, but I got it done. Nice was there was no pain, just had to haul off and draw and when those cams rolled over I felt a world of relief, happy relief. Yeah, a little shaky, a little tough getting the pin to settle and think I was staring at the pin when the shot broke. Pretty sure the pin was exactly where the arrow went. Line cutter, but I'll take it..... Now the hard part, not pushing it...Seeing Therapist in the morning so I'll ask what he thinks.

So 25 days down and my 1st shot. That arrow is the last arrow of a dozen I bought from Bart when he first started up Harvest Time Archery....When was that, 2010?


----------



## pwyrick

Finished ASA Ft Benning and drove home. Had a good weekend finishing 9th in Super Seniors. Some of the old guys posted some very nice scores. Fun group, too.
I hope you keep getting healthier Sonny. Not nice to be out of commission for so long.


----------



## acesbettor

Shot 20 3d targets today with over a foot of snow still on the ground. Started off great, I was shooting my hunting setup with fixed pins from the open stakes. Cleaned first 6 targets and then ended with 186 out of a possible 200. Can't wait til this snow is gone!


----------



## montigre

SonnyThomas said:


> I was just plain mad. 6:30 pm and out the door I went with a attitude I was drawing my bow or ripping my shoulder so they had to fix it. I GOT IT DONE! Only just the one shot, but I got it done. Nice was there was no pain, just had to haul off and draw and when those cams rolled over I felt a world of relief, happy relief. Yeah, a little shaky, a little tough getting the pin to settle and think I was staring at the pin when the shot broke. Pretty sure the pin was exactly where the arrow went. Line cutter, but I'll take it..... Now the hard part, not pushing it...Seeing Therapist in the morning so I'll ask what he thinks.


That was the psych game I told you you'd have to face a while back.... Huge hurdle conquered; now your future shots will be mentally easier, but don't over do. Well played, Sonny!!


----------



## SonnyThomas

pwyrick said:


> Finished ASA Ft Benning and drove home. Had a good weekend finishing 9th in Super Seniors. Some of the old guys posted some very nice scores. Fun group, too.
> I hope you keep getting healthier Sonny. Not nice to be out of commission for so long.


Congrats, Phil. And thanks. Almost a month down and out felt like forever.


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> That was the psych game I told you you'd have to face a while back.... Huge hurdle conquered; now your future shots will be mentally easier, but don't over do. Well played, Sonny!!


Gail, it's been depressing. Just so many people telling of a year and a year and half to recover. At one point I thought about quitting, selling everything. I had never felt this way with all the other injuries and surgery I've had.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Exhausted and mentally drained. The Therapist gave me a work out and a lecture of the human body. Said is beauty is skin deep. Yeah, skin covers up the ugly. So I told the Therapist of shooting my bow the one time. He found no regression and I got the okay to build on my shooting, one shot at a time. Now for the ugly. Skin is our covering and covering up all the internal bruises and contusions I have. So the "wreck" aggravated the bicep muscle tear or tendon tear in my left arm or something tore more. So some measurements were taken. What the heck is your forearm called muscle wise, triceps? Yeah, pump up your arm to show off your muscles. These measured 14". My biceps, something of 15", but I couldn't make a good muscle. It burned like fire. Left arm, the bicep pumped up and sort of turned under the skin. Ugly! Worse, it didn't want to come down, remained a good lump (burning all the while) for a bit and finally went down. Right wasn't as bad, but sure burned and again I couldn't make a good muscle. Right arm, triceps burned a little. Around both shoulder blades there is a burning. This not the rhomboids. We have a slab of muscle that starts at the center of the back, extends up to the neck and shoulder and I don't know how far down the back and around our sides. I bruised this or strained this at the inner edges of the shoulder blades, both sides. What the heck is lats? These are okay. Like that made me feel good with the rest being "junk."

Now, other than the lats, all the muscles I've "wrecked" work to draw a bow. Okay, there is no such thing as back tension only drawing the bow. Helps, yes, but shoulder muscle plays a bigger part. Some "show off" muscle isn't really used for muscling, but helps stabilize, so why my biceps don't hurt when drawing the bow. 
Injure one muscle can give a domino effect. Yeah, our muscles are all tied together some how. Explained to me is having some short circuits. Great, I'm a house with some lights that work. So the Therapist is finding where the shorts are. How about feeling like a bull and a measly two pounds in the right spot turning you into a new born kitten and ouching?

Four hours after with the Therapist and I still feel wore out.


----------



## sharkred7

Shot a 70M fundraising event for the UW of La Crosse archery team. Was great, had 53 archers from the Midwest area. We shot a 60 arrow qualification round then went to an OR bracket shoot down. Won my first two matches then ran into some guy named Bridger Deaton?? 

Well after the first 6 arrows we were tied at 59, then he pulled away to a 119-115 victory. Was a great time with some really great shooting.

Congrats to Danny Button on the win and our own Jason Marek for the runner up!

John


----------



## SonnyThomas

Still trying. Sort of failure and a success yesterday. First shot, I couldn't roll the cams over and accidently touched off the release, good-bye arrow. Yeah, launched that arrow big time right over the backstop. Discussed, but I tried again and got to full draw. Full draw doesn't seem a problem. The shot was a twin of the pic above.
Today, got off two...Drawing the bow a 2nd time took everything I had and I was wondering. I did the "grrrrrrrrr." Both shots pretty decent, just touching the top of the X ring. So one of short circuits the Therapist related of in where I hold just a tad high on the target. Lower and it rolls over a bit easier.

And my Lab earned her place again. Went looking for the lost arrow. Here I am looking all over the place and she disappears. Well, I just didn't see her. She was laying down. So I gave up and started back. She sees me and sits up. So I get to her and give her good petting and just on the other side of her is my arrow. She got a better petting session and a big hamburger when we got to the house.


----------



## vito9999

SonnyThomas said:


> She got a better petting session and a big hamburger when we got to the house.



So that is all I need to do for my dogs to find my errant arrows. Off to the store I need about 20lbs of hamburger.


----------



## SonnyThomas

vito9999 said:


> So that is all I need to do for my dogs to find my errant arrows. Off to the store I need about 20lbs of hamburger.


LOL! Crackers, our Chocolate Lab, and Tinker, our Mexican Long Haired Chihuahua, has found maybe a half dozen arrows. Both females, both spoiled rotten, but they will find arrows. Our other two dogs are females, small, are spoiled rotten, but they just fight to get the front to be petted. I think my wife spoiled them. I wouldn't do that :embara:


----------



## JDZ

SonnyThomas said:


> LOL! Crackers, our Chocolate Lab, and Tinker, our Mexican Long Haired Chihuahua, has found maybe a half dozen arrows. Both females, both spoiled rotten, but they will find arrows. Our other two dogs are females, small, are spoiled rotten, but they just fight to get the front to be petted. I think my wife spoiled them. I wouldn't do that :embara:


My wife has been working on training our collie on obedience and agility. She said she wants to train the dog to find arrows.


----------



## Mahly

Started bare shaft tuning the new Concorde. 
I quit when my fingers got too cold.


----------



## SonnyThomas

JDZ said:


> My wife has been working on training our collie on obedience and agility. She said she wants to train the dog to find arrows.


Dogs can be trained to find things that are just unbelievable. Big for the last few years is antler finding. Personally, I'd like a dog that would find mushrooms


----------



## grantmac

Mahly said:


> Started bare shaft tuning the new Concorde.
> I quit when my fingers got too cold.


If I had new-bow money (I don't) I'd be getting a Concorde VE. Is yours the shoot through?

-Grant


----------



## Mahly

Alpine Concorde... $300 in classifieds  ( by new, I mean new to me LOL)


----------



## Fury90flier

yesterday...
Since I'm practice range manager I spent some time loading the target bins, placing targets, picked up a little trash

picked up some backup/field course (ok if get lost) arrows that are closer to the proper spine than what I had been shooting- for Oly rig.

Finally got my limbs somewhat close to being on plane...bottom wasn't too bad but top was out by about half a string width.

Worked on hook...having a lot of problems with consistent hook lately.

will be back at the range in an hour or so, tuning a little but mainly working on hook.


----------



## slimshady2

:mg: Today I went out and shot a practice 3D course. First I shot the 20 and 30 yard targets and noticed I was 2 to 3 inches right of the mark. I went and shot about 9 targets and felt tired so I went back to the range and shot a few 20 and 30 yard targets again. I was still 3 inches right so I got the allen wrench out and moved the pins right a smidge. Hope this does the trick for Saturday is a 3D tourny in Virginia and I would like to shoot it once again.


----------



## SonnyThomas

acesbettor said:


> I find it easiest to load the sx2 by pushing the movable jaw against the nock of the arrow after you have the loop in between the jaws.


BCY #24 isn't that flexible. Tried it....


----------



## SonnyThomas

Wore out yesterday. No steam to try after work out with Therapist. Today, felt gooder and gave it try. Put up a new target and fired two shots, the figure 8 on right side of X ring. I had to wait a bit and tried a 3rd shot. It took all I had and had the thought I wasn't going to make it, shaking bad, and then magic, the cams rolled. Think I better hold to 2 shots until it feels good and then work with a 3rd shot.


----------



## JDZ

Shot my first 300 on NFAA indoor at league tonight. 43x. I'm using a BHFS, true hunting setup. 68 lbs, 288 fps, 17/64 arrows, index finger trigger release, etc. I made a handful of bad shots that I need to work on, but kept them all in the white.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Still trying to get things working and found another ouch issue. Drawing has been my main concern and this morning I had shot that just didn't want to settle. Tried to let down and the burning came big time. Yanked back to full draw and I was okay. So just about to the point of hanging on for dear life I shot to get out of it problem. Arrow just stayed in the bull's eye at 3:00. Waited a bit and tried a 2nd shot and much better, split the X itself just above dead center.


----------



## erdman41

Tied my pb field half at 275. Some day I'll break that barrier. On a plus side my chart is good.


----------



## EPLC

erdman41 said:


> Tied my pb field half at 275. Some day I'll break that barrier. On a plus side my chart is good.


Hey, you got me by 1... although I haven't tied mine yet!


----------



## erdman41

EPLC said:


> Hey, you got me by 1... although I haven't tied mine yet!


I've tied mine 12-15 times. My field scores don't fluctuate much. 273-275 halves. It's usually the 50 yard 65 yard 80 WU, and one or two other on a rotating basis.

Today was [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], and the 60 on the 80 WU.[emoji35]


----------



## EPLC

I wish I was that consistent with the 270+ halves but I'm generally in the mid to high 260 range with an occasional 270+ sprinkled in. I'm hoping to improve on that this year.


----------



## montigre

Can we say work party at a 28-target field range situated on 52 acres of rolling wooded land in 30 degree weather?? 

Our 5 week long beginner archery classes start next Saturday, so we had to work on getting the range ready for the 105-140 munchkins and grups that will be attending. Also our first field shoot is only 3 weeks away... 

Why is it that only the competitive shooters attend these things???? Anyway, I'm a tired and chilled puppy....


----------



## nochance

I wish it got above 25 today. The outdoor range has to wait at our club\shop due to too much snow. Did get to coach the kids again and its so rewarding to see them smoking the target.


----------



## montigre

erdman41 said:


> I've tied mine 12-15 times. My field scores don't fluctuate much. 273-275 halves. It's usually the 50 yard 65 yard 80 WU, and one or two other on a rotating basis.
> 
> Today was [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], and the 60 on the 80 WU.[emoji35]


Agreed, the 65 yarder is a bear. The 80 WU I have recently been doing well until the 50 yard shot....that target has a magnet embedded in it on the 4 ring:embara: Oh well, the joys of field archery...


----------



## EPLC

montigre said:


> Agreed, the 65 yarder is a bear. The 80 WU I have recently been doing well until the 50 yard shot....that target has a magnet embedded in it on the 4 ring:embara: Oh well, the joys of field archery...


Have you tried scraping off the X-Repellent from your arrows. I found this can help.  The 30, 50 65 & 80 are most difficult from a target size perspective. I like to practice on the 30...


----------



## montigre

EPLC said:


> Have you tried scraping off the X-Repellent from your arrows. I found this can help.


I will give that a try this season...:teeth:


----------



## N7709K

prepped and hung a 15'x8' new piece of plate and got some of the stuff packed for a diff job starting monday; won't see my bow til june


----------



## DenCMSC

Today I made the discovery that I will very likely never be more than a slightly above average shooter. On the other hand, I discovered that my son absolutely loves to shoot and has taken quite well to the free style game. In his first year shooting FS he has managed a 296 36x average in league play, and shot his first 300 in a tournament. So, my "work" will be to continue with his archery progression. (as an aside, I shot a 300 54x at 15 yards with my bow hunter setup....20 yards still has a hex on me...)


----------



## PUGIDOGS

Shot a 3D round today.....came in 4th. Hey I took a 1st and 3rd last weekend. We will see what tomorrows shoot brings.....Pugi


----------



## SonnyThomas

PUGIDOGS said:


> Shot a 3D round today.....came in 4th. Hey I took a 1st and 3rd last weekend. We will see what tomorrows shoot brings.....Pugi


Hey, Congrats!


----------



## SonnyThomas

DenCMSC said:


> Today I made the discovery that I will very likely never be more than a slightly above average shooter. On the other hand, I discovered that my son absolutely loves to shoot and has taken quite well to the free style game. In his first year shooting FS he has managed a 296 36x average in league play, and shot his first 300 in a tournament. So, my "work" will be to continue with his archery progression. (as an aside, I shot a 300 54x at 15 yards with my bow hunter setup....20 yards still has a hex on me...)


Thumbs up for your boy! Practice, practice, practice for you and it'll come.


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> Agreed, the 65 yarder is a bear. The 80 WU I have recently been doing well until the 50 yard shot....that target has a magnet embedded in it on the 4 ring:embara: Oh well, the joys of field archery...





EPLC said:


> Have you tried scraping off the X-Repellent from your arrows. I found this can help.  The 30, 50 65 & 80 are most difficult from a target size perspective. I like to practice on the 30...





montigre said:


> I will give that a try this season...:teeth:


And people wonder why I carry a spray bottle of BS repellant with me


----------



## SonnyThomas

Still trying, still 2 shots and I'm done. 1st time drawing feels...easier, 2nd gets tough. Really perturbed. Going on 5 weeks and constant varying degrees of pain. 

The bow I'm using, my 2012 Pearson MarXman. I've shot a bunch since getting in August of 2012. I've used as much as 4 1/2 ounces on the 30" Cartel and nothing on the back. I've different weight up front and a Bernie set up on the back, V mount and Mini Silencers with no weight on the right and both weighted to the gills. I've used a 10" Stinger with 6 oz. on the back. Here in recovering I've been using just the Cartel and a couple ounces on the end. What, 8 ounces or so difference with and without back bars and I can't really say there is a difference.
So 8 shots in 6 days. Two days I was just plain too wore out to shoot after therapy. Dark, windy and raining right now and looking to freeze (32 degrees). 1 high of the X, 2 below the X, 4 to the left side of the X and the 1 way left where I couldn't let down....


----------



## montigre

SonnyThomas said:


> And people wonder why I carry a spray bottle of BS repellant with me


:thumbs_up


----------



## montigre

Something that went down a few years ago on the field archery forum..... http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=991649&highlight=ankle+bracelet

I can't begin to tell you how many PMs I received asking how to purchase one of these bracelets....:zip:


----------



## glennx

Went to the club and tuned in my bare shaft. My groups at 60 yards really tighten up .


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> Something that went down a few years ago on the field archery forum..... http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=991649&highlight=ankle+bracelet
> 
> I can't begin to tell you how many PMs I received asking how to purchase one of these bracelets....:zip:


Well, magnets have proven to help in certain things. Arthritis and painful joints/injuries. 2006, out of commission with back out of place and slipped discs (one ruptured) the hospital put one of those electrical things on my back. Didn't help. Friends of mine suggested magnets. So got some magnets and finally got a 3 magnet configuration that eased the pain. Problem was keeping them in place and the Therapists didn't care for them. Finally, the magnets didn't help, but I still have them and a spare package of them. Another friend wears a magnet bracelet 24/7 and he say it helps.
And then the copper bracelets abound. 

Fallacy; Copper bits do not keep mares from getting pregnant, neither does having their feed bunk copper lined.


----------



## MiniJCW

I dont want to wear magnets, i want them put into the X ring of the target butt.

To prevent others shooting with me from gaining the performance increase, the magnets will be reverse polarised to suit the polarity of my exclusive arrow tips. I shoot an arrow and it is attracted to the X, they shoot an arrow and it is repelled from the X. 

This archery game could become easy after all. No time for practice today i am off to find me some magnets.


----------



## grousegrove

Great 3-D shoot today. Perfect weather, and nearly 80 shooters across the classes showed up, more than my club has become accustomed to. My kids had been practicing a lot and took firsts shooting a compound and recurve, and they are justifiably pleased. I didn't shoot my best but tied for third in my class with my hunting bow. Me and that guy (who also was off his game) hope to have a friendly shoot off this Thursday. Was a nice way to spend Sunday.


----------



## grantmac

Played around with engines some this morning. My float is MUCH better with some sort of yield rather than any kind of squeeze or pull. Usually with the yield my problem is my outer fingers getting lazy and the shot starts running long, fixed that with the "cruise control" finger touch. That seems to keep me connected with what the ring finger is doing without it demanding much attention. Had to cool the release off a little as well.
Only issue is that it's tough to really anchor the pin in any sort of wind. It sits just lovely when things are calm but it doesn't have a very strong return to center (static vs. dynamic stability for you aviation folks).
I'm debating an increase in holding weight to try and get things settled. Easy enough to do with the cams I'm running.

-Grant


----------



## Padgett

I got out of my car after my shoot last night and I stripped down my cpxl and put all my stuff on my specialist, I have shot my cpxl since august and virtually everyday I have to sight it in. It tuned just fine and always seemed smooth but the fact is after being 100% committed to it since august as my 3d bow I had to take a serious look at it and it just didn't perform. I think saturday was probably the turning point because I was shooting at 40 yards with 5 arrows and I was shooting up to 4 arrows at one asa 12 ring and I shot for 2 hours and never rattled a arrow. It hit me that this had became normal lately where I was shooting multiple arrows at the same 123 ring at 40 yards and I reminded myself that I used to only shoot one arrow per 12 ring because I would smoke it from behind.

Well I stripped it down and put my rest and sight on the specialist and bumped the poundage of the specialist back to my 3d poundage and I shot 10 arrows to sight it in a little at 20 yards and I went back to 40 yards and shot my first arrow, it hit about 9'oclock on the 12 ring and I shot my second arrow and rattled it and then I shot my third arrow and rattled it shooting a quarter sized group. I put a couple clicks in the sight and nailed the center of the 12 ring on the next shot. This was a feeling I hadn't had since august.

I have a fresh set of limbs and string set for the specialist so I am going to put them on and get it dialed in.


----------



## pwyrick

Had a wild birthday today. Late breakfast and a matinee. Now for a nap. I guess wild becomes relative at some point.


----------



## Wichhart

Shot my first Open class 3d yesterday. Put more put in the five than I was expecting but was still pretty happy with the over all shooting. Had a had a couple runs where I was off by 4-6 yards. Be working on judging this week so hopefully clean that up before next shoot. After the shoot I came home and did a walk back and was happy with that. But I would still struggle with consistently shooting right out at 45 50 60 yards So I tweaked the 3rd axis on the sight a bit. Seemed to help but time will tell this week after more shots


----------



## Fury90flier

Did some more bare shaft tuning on my Oly rig...not going so well. I must have some kind of mental block, I've never had this much issue before....maybe this afternoon will be better.

Also, pulled the stabs off my Dominator (field rig) and just practiced grip placement, follow through and anchor...didn't do too badly. While some of the shots were a bit wild for my liking, towards the end everything tightened up.

Also tried a new (old) release- old fletchmatic....different design than I've seen or used--trigger is middle finger activated. I thought this would take a long time to get used to but it actually worked out quite well.


----------



## Buckster12

I shot my personal best last night on a 5 spot! 300 56x. I've shooting my Victory for about 2 weeks, so far I have shot 6 300 rounds with it. I shot 4 300s with my E 35 before I got my Victory. I switched to a Honey Bagger hinge about 2 months ago and I'm shooting better than ever before.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Something went wrong. while doing exercises. Arm caught straight up. Couldn't get it down through sheer pain. Jerked at spike of pain and my arm came down. You could have shot me through the shoulder and it couldn't have felt worse. Went to Therapist as scheduled, 10:00. Told him what happened. He worked with me and I felt a bit better, but both of us felt something wrong. Saw Surgeon at 1:40. Surgeon checked me over and thought possibly a torn rotor cuff. Just great... MRI scheduled for Monday.....


----------



## SonnyThomas

Up early, aching all night and all through the day along with a Therapist session and Surgeon appointment I was just totally wore out. Wife fixed some chow and done I just plain passed out. Up a few minutes ago and I'm still wore out.


----------



## Fury90flier

made up some arrows for a student, shot the dominator a bit--not so well, just an off night.


----------



## montigre

Tried to blow up my bow after having a "*senior moment*"....

Swapped out the GTX cams for Spirals since outdoors is getting ready to start, but did not notice that I had not placed one of the two cam spacers which must have adhered to the underside of the limb. While letting down, felt the cam slide on the axle....said a silent uh-oh and....Boom!! No damage to bow or body, but the new harness is toast....Thank goodness the bow maxed out at only 45# :embara:


----------



## SonnyThomas

So it looks like I'm done for the year...So looking over the up coming schedules of the two clubs I'm member of I find the last scores of the year from one club. Not a real big turn out, only two in my class and I won. I even shot high overall for all Adults, except Bow Novice , 30 yards max. 297 for a win and I'll take it. Might be my last win for a long while.


----------



## Mahly

Sorry to hear that Sonny! Hope you make a full recovery soon!


----------



## SonnyThomas

Thanks, Mahly.


----------



## Rick!

Took a twist out of each cable and working on removing drop outs. One week to the state indoor...


----------



## SonnyThomas

Took in a bit of Pekin's 3D Saturday...Got my membership. I'm a member of two archery clubs. Watched some on the practice range. Got in on a couple BS sessions  Made couple of swap/trades of "this and that" and finished up another today. Pekin had a new McKenzie 3D deer raffle. Only 200 tickets to be sold and got 5 of them.


----------



## montigre

Got the new harness on the bow and did a basic tune. Now waiting for a break in the weather to fine tune and start getting my marks. Our first club field shoot is this Sunday, but judging by the weather reports, I'll probably not be able to get my marks dialed in by then. 

Also, made my hotel and plane reservations for the Senior Games and hotel reservations for Mids and the NFAA Field Nationals (hotels are already filling up in M-berg)--looks like it's going to be a busy summer!

So happy outdoor season is starting!!!


----------



## PSE Archer

After taking almost a month off, I shot my first Freestyle indoor round at League last night. Got 55 x's with ACE's. Pretty pleased. I think I'm going to like this Freestyle gig. Fixing to rig out a Elite Victory and give it a try. We will see.


----------



## mainehunt

SonnyThomas said:


> Eye issues again....Don't understand what's going on. Wearing my last new glasses I'd get disoriented ever so often. Taken them off and come out of it. Started using the cheapo department store glasses for reading. Yesterday when shooting I was fine. Started go out for another practice session and had to take my cheapo glasses off. I could see perfectly. Got side tracked. Got on the computer and still had to take my glasses off. I could read everything perfectly. Got up the this morning and back to wearing glasses....Heck if I know what's going on.....


Not sure if you figured this out or not.......

I'm hypoglycemic. If my blood sugar is a little low, OR, if I'm a little dehydrated, my eye sight gets slightly blurry.


----------



## mainehunt

erdman41 said:


> watched this video lol
> 
> http://youtu.be/jbjo6u0mlj8


excellent


----------



## SonnyThomas

mainehunt said:


> Not sure if you figured this out or not.......
> 
> I'm hypoglycemic. If my blood sugar is a little low, OR, if I'm a little dehydrated, my eye sight gets slightly blurry.


New glasses have the bifocals off to my other glasses.


----------



## SonnyThomas

MRI results in. "Mr. Thomas, you have multiple tears in your rotor cuff. How severe we can't tell until we get in there." So, by law, I have to see the surgeon next Wednesday for a full explanation of stuff. Surgeries are performed on Tuesdays and Thursdays.... Rotten news, but heard some good...Well, better than what I heard. Something of 6 months of recovery instead of 12 and 14 months I've heard. Still, the 3D season is done for.


----------



## Rick!

If u do some searching, you'll find that up to 70% of people have a tear in a rotator cuff. The surgeon will want to dive into your shoulder as that is their job. Since you've displayed a mechanical bind, your decision is pretty easy.

I have a tear in my bow shoulder that an mri showed but I just went to therapy after I dislocated it and worked it out to get my deltoid back. It takes very little time for deltoids to atrophy after shoulder trauma and it takes serious time to get them back.


----------



## SonnyThomas

I spent 3 weeks in therapy and recovery flattened out. Depending on what movement or exercise burning pain would come and go and move. Muscle that goes from top the shoulder down the upper arm will turn hard and pull at the tend to the elbow area to give what feels like the upper arm is broke. The front of the shoulder will burn. Straight through to the back will be burn. If by the Therapist there some disconnection as the shoulder and back will not work together under pressure. As such I can draw so much and all quits, no pain, just quits. I then proceed to draw with my shoulder. Once at full draw my back, rhomboids, will function. The severe lock up I guess was the tear pushed back/over lapped. My arm has not locked up again, but finding the right direction permits movement so move my arm.
The way some go on they are in such pain they can't do anything without severe pain. Today, the nurse asked if I needed anything. If fact, wondered why I wasn't taking any pain killers especially after reviewing the Therapist's two write ups. Hey, I'm dumb as a box of rocks when it comes to be hurt. So I don't want something masking the pain so I end up doing something stupid.


----------



## montigre

Draw shoulder heals much, much faster than the bow shoulder. The draw shoulder is supported by the mechanics of the bow when doing its job, but the bow shoulder has no such support and has to hold the bow without much assistance for shooting anything. 

About 6-8 months and you'll be able to draw your bow pretty well, if it is only your draw shoulder that is affected. :thumbs_up


----------



## SonnyThomas

The surgeon is going to get his ear bent. Shoulder separation and rotor cuff torn, but not one damn word about both my biceps torn. Right now my right bicep is burning and I ain't doing nothing but pounding on the keyboard....


----------



## erdman41

Cut 1/2" off my arrows.
Lowered point weight 20 grains.
Made a quick chart from a 35 and 65 yard marks
Shot new pb 276 half of field.


----------



## Deputy Archer

Changed the mods on the podium to 26.5, took the 5 month out to shoot 30 and 80 to run some marks. She was a trooper, loved every minute of it.


----------



## cbrunson

erdman41 said:


> Cut 1/2" off my arrows.
> Lowered point weight 20 grains.
> Made a quick chart from a 35 and 65 yard marks
> Shot new pb 276 half of field.


Haha. I went up 20. Now I'm going back down.


----------



## sixstringer4528

Deputy Archer said:


> View attachment 2205732
> View attachment 2205733
> View attachment 2205734
> 
> Changed the mods on the podium to 26.5, took the 5 month out to shoot 30 and 80 to run some marks. She was a trooper, loved every minute of it.


Lol quality pictures right there!


----------



## erdman41

cbrunson said:


> Haha. I went up 20. Now I'm going back down.


I had to try something. Arrows I used last year were a bit stiffer. I hadn't had to refletch an arrow this year yet. Averaged about 2-3 a week last year that needed new fletching.


----------



## cbrunson

erdman41 said:


> I had to try something. Arrows I used last year were a bit stiffer. I hadn't had to refletch an arrow this year yet. Averaged about 2-3 a week last year that needed new fletching.


Stiffer arrows losing vanes? 

Mine are not grouping at 70-100 as well with the heavier points.


----------



## erdman41

cbrunson said:


> Stiffer arrows losing vanes?


Field gotta shoot 4 arrow groups. I was piercing a vane with another arrow.

Basically the stiffer arrows were grouping better. Noticed the weaker were not by lack of arrows needing to be fixed. Scores were still pretty much the same though with the weaker ones.


----------



## nochance

went to the shop to finish setting up for 3D. Kids league was over but 2 showed up to practice anyways Awesome! Finished the walk back tuning out to 32 yards. double check my pins and ready to go!


----------



## cbrunson

erdman41 said:


> Field gotta shoot 4 arrow groups. I was piercing a vane with another arrow.
> 
> Basically the stiffer arrows were grouping better. Noticed the weaker were not by lack of arrows needing to be fixed. Scores were still pretty much the same though with the weaker ones.


Ok gotcha. I was thinking that would be about the only way.


----------



## Sasquech

Work bee at the club many years of over growth cut back amazing how much cleaner 3 chainsaws a large brush hog and a lot of burning can do to spruce up the ranges


----------



## erdman41

cbrunson said:


> Ok gotcha. I was thinking that would be about the only way.


Yeah it wasn't worded very well. But it was under 5 paragraphs lol.


----------



## cbrunson

erdman41 said:


> Yeah it wasn't worded very well. But it was under 5 paragraphs lol.


Ouch! :lol:


----------



## Rick!

Went to a little shoot in a hockey rink up north. Shot my season average and finished 5th (out of 15) in SMFS. Note to self: need a better season average to win hardware. 

Noteworthy Items:
Sometimes aggressive targets will stop the arrow shaft but not a 200gr tip. It still counted as an X. 
You can shoot the last two faces in 37 seconds with one let down and still have one second left on the clock. It also was one of my few clean ends.
Spotted new subject matter for Laz; a pro staff shooter towel.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Rick! said:


> Spotted new subject matter for Laz; a pro staff shooter towel.


Lord! Next will be degradation of target shooting by some one using a camo bow.


----------



## montigre

SonnyThomas said:


> Lord! Next will be degradation of target shooting by some one using a camo bow.


A camo-colored bow for target???? *Blasphemy* :chortle:


----------



## montigre

Built a half doz nanos. Went to a sister range range to tune the bow to them and get a set of working marks as we were hosting our first field tourney at my home range. Dropped by my home club to chat with those breaking at half-time and see what the turn out was like. From reports, we had nearly 50 shooters enjoying the fine spring day--not bad for this early in the season. 

Anyway, the little guys shot very well out to 50 yards and the bow was surprisingly fast with them. Now, have to build the remainder and print out some tapes. There's nothing like a cold beer and huffing vane glue on a Sunday afternoon....


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> A camo-colored bow for target???? *Blasphemy* :chortle:


I've got one :embara:


----------



## montigre

Update....had to put my arrow build on hold until I hear back from Perry at Archer's Advantage before I destroy a $350 set of arrow shafts.... Here's my problem:
My current bow is a 2011 Hoyt Alpha Elite that I did recently franken build by installing Hoyt's Z5 cams making it more like the current production Hoyt Pro Edge Elite in overall geometry and cam action (same limbs and same limb pockets are used between both bows).

AA is telling me if I build my arrows for a standard Hoyt Alpha Elite (that used Fuel and RKT cams), Nano Pro 650s would be optimum spine and Nano Pro 550s would be way too stiff (I have both sizes on hand). Just to be on the safe side, I ran my projected arrow build using the formula for a Hoyt Pro Edge Elite (that uses Z5 cams) and the results are that the 650s would be far too weak and 550s only slightly stiff. 

Would the franken build use the formula in AA for the Pro Edge or a standard Alpha Elite....?? 

One of the few drawbacks of running with a frankenbow...sigh....


----------



## N7709K

Had the weekend off after the first hitch; helped around a friends house felling trees and doing some spring cleanin- back to the salt mines tomorrow


----------



## 3rdCoastHunter

Shot my first ever SYWAT yesterday and slept in today (getting up at 430 am 5 days a week wears on you) so i didn't make the second day. I shot a 517 in BHFS class i was pretty happy with that. Today i worked in the yard with the wife planting flowers and cleaning out the shed and took a little time out to refletch some arrows and shoot my block in the back yard at 20 to work on my form.


----------



## acesbettor

Shot my first real 1/2 field round this past week, dropped 10 pts but was pretty happy with that. Also shot my first 70m round yesterday, shot a 344 first half and then a 338. I was hoping to be in the 680's before I started but am kind of disappointed in the end because I forced some bad shots after long holds and really feal like I could have easily been in the 690's.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Saw the Surgeon today....Lord... I guess the separated shoulder thing is healing. And then he gave me the bad news and bad news and then some better news. The bad news, I have multiple tears in my rotor cuff. One is a partial tear and the other a complete tear. And the other bad new, surgery is required. Explained to me is two manner of repairing the rotor cuff. A small incision to shave a scope in and take a look see. If not bad repair can be made through the small incision. If bad, then he has to open my shoulder. And the better news. Advances have been made. Depending on how the rotor cuff is tore, I guess, and it stitched up just so, 4 months. Worst case (not really), most all his patients have full recovery in 6 months.


----------



## montigre

Was able to get a rough set of marks for the PCE with spirals. First I had to remedy the infamous mysterious right tear known to these bows by inducing a tad of pre lean (plus a few other tricks in my pocket), then do a little arrow voodoo to get the right combination to shoot at my lower DW for distance and voila, a decent set of marks was finally forthcoming. Spent the rest of the afternoon teaching and now will work on completing the build of the remaining arrows. Sooo, I should be able to take the bow on a test field half tomorrow after work. Happy days!!


----------



## SonnyThomas

Can't shoot so catching up on my Facebook stuff...a real pain when you're on Dial Up. 
Just got this about a hour ago. Dave Cousins won the 1st leg at the Pro Archery Series at Fort Van Lier, Belgium. He also won the Beiter Accuracy Award for X counts, 21 ahead of 2nd place. And talk about angles! Lord! See Picture. They have ladders to the target?


----------



## SonnyThomas

Still Facebook stuff. Watched a clip of Matt Stutzman. Never really paid attention until today. He uses his left leg/foot to hold his left handed bow and aims with his right eye. He got off 3 arrows in 1minute, 30 seconds. Just got to think about FITA rules. Matt's aiming would be deemed illegal? Shooting and aiming like he does his bow is a sight blocker 

Other; Man! His stabs, front and one rear, is loaded with weights. I tried to compare with my own pics with 6 ounces. It looks like he has 4 times what I have, so 24 on the front and 24 on the back for 48 ounces. 3 pounds! Oh yeah. His back stab acts like a kick stand, angled down so his bow rests on the ground, cam, rear stab and front stab.


----------



## nochance

Been below par for me for the last few years in 3D, Shot my 1st outdoor 3D of the season and shot what I would call a very good round. More importantly I shoot with 2 of the kiis that have been shooting in the kids league at our shop and they did awesome. Very rewarding!!!


----------



## SonnyThomas

SonnyThomas said:


> Still Facebook stuff. Watched a clip of Matt Stutzman. Never really paid attention until today. He uses his left leg/foot to hold his left handed bow and aims with his right eye. He got off 3 arrows in 1minute, 30 seconds. Just got to think about FITA rules. Matt's aiming would be deemed illegal? Shooting and aiming like he does his bow is a sight blocker
> 
> Whoops! Meant he uses his right leg. Just seems backwards beings right handers use their left arm to hold a bow.
> 
> 
> Other; Man! His stabs, front and one rear, is loaded with weights. I tried to compare with my own pics with 6 ounces. It looks like he has 4 times what I have, so 24 on the front and 24 on the back for 48 ounces. 3 pounds! Oh yeah. His back stab acts like a kick stand, angled down so his bow rests on the ground, cam, rear stab and front stab.


.................


----------



## Earthroot

Woke up, fell out of bed, brewed a pot of coffee, and went to the basement and worked on sighting in my new nitrum34. Brand new to a left-handed bow so, also working on increasing strength in my left arm. Never realized how much weaker it is as compared to my right.


----------



## "TheBlindArcher"

Shot a hinge (a Longhorn Hex) for the first time today. Had about 4-5 hrs of "playing" with it on my "release practice bow" (an old Browning recurve I picked up at a yard sale I attached paracord to and installed a loop so I only get a few pounds DW at full draw... then dry fire the snot out of it). My best groups had always been with bow/stabs set up so I got a gentle forward pitch after the shot, thought this was a good indication of not "grip torquing" the bow... The hinge is a whole new reaction with the bow "jumping" straight forward into my relaxed fingers. I know I need to put more time into it (the Hex), but after the first 75ish shots the results are promising. No arrow slaps I occasionally got before [yet] but consistently smaller groups and my groups weren't migrating left and right from round to round. Haven't figured out that "back tension shooting by pulling through" thing with the wrist strap yet, but that's a topic I'll pose to the general population forum. Otherwise, pretty cool stuff [sorry, I tend to be easily amused]


----------



## SonnyThomas

GOT MAD!  My personal physician cancelled my surgery. Doctor; "Hey, you haven't had a Stress Test ever and you're 66 years old." Had to let them drain some more blood....Grrrrrrr. Did the cut off the circulation to your arm blood pressure torture. 122 over 80 and me inhaling a good 2 packs of cigarettes a day. Good thing they took my blood pressure before my doctor said he was cancelling my surgery. 2 damn months now and I'm tired of hurting, really tired of not shooting my bow...
He did prescribe some pain pills so I can sleep more than 2 to 4 hours. Yeah, about 2 to 4 hours is all the sleep I get and sometime later I'm so wore out I pass out.
Lack of sleep, drinking water, pop, tea and whatever else out of boredom I've lost 25 pounds since the accident. So the Water Diet must work.


----------



## kwboom

Still playing with my stab weights. Just shot my best 5 spot round with a 296 31X so I am getting close I might have to start playing with draw length by twisting cables and string.


----------



## Fury90flier

the past couple days I've been trying to get my Oly rig set up again...not going so well. Now that my shoulder is about normal I've put the heavier limbs back on. Unfortunately, since I've made plunger changes, different limbs, different arrows on this riser, now that I'm back to my older setup, I can't get tuned. So, I put the light limbs on my wife's riser- bam- can get bare shaft and fletched hitting together on a bare bow setup.... At least that's one setup I can shoot.

Today: So after being a bit frustrated with my oly rig I'm back to the compound (Supra)....Had some sight issues (2nd axis issues) and rest issues (still not exact but much better)- took a dozen shots or so but they're now reasonably resolved....back to flinging @ 70M so a decent day. I had fun flinging 3 different arrows (Fatboy, AC Navigator, ICS BOwhunter) trying to hold off as necessary to get them to hit within the red...was zeroed for Nav's-- had a lot of fun this afternoon.

back to the back yard release drills----having issues with my pull through (and as always- a little grip torque).


----------



## 3rdCoastHunter

installed a Limbdriver Micro on my Pro Edge and i love this thing. I was shooting a Trophy Taker Spring Steel and had issues with the arrow falling off during draw or having to draw super careful and it was making my arms tired.


----------



## Kwag

Repaired an old target.......with the expanding foam. We will see how this works...


----------



## Kwag

Here is another one.


----------



## Rick!

I mapped the fueling on my brother's Super Pro Engine. 950hp, 818ft-lbs on methanol, 1088hp, 846ft-lbs on a "100hp" shot of nitrous.


----------



## montigre

Bought a new bow....


----------



## SonnyThomas

Rick! said:


> I mapped the fueling on my brother's Super Pro Engine. 950hp, 818ft-lbs on methanol, 1088hp, 846ft-lbs on a "100hp" shot of nitrous.
> 
> More horse power than mine. Brings back old memories... My street machine, a 1962 Super Sport Impala, 2 door hardtop. Hopped up a 425 hp 409 to 500 hp. Best in 1/8 mile, 8:86 seconds.


----------



## SonnyThomas

montigre said:


> Bought a new bow....


You all bad, girl!


----------



## nochance

Its not the bow


----------



## montigre

nochance said:


> Its not the bow


I know, still keeping the others. Just wanted to have a new one that was made for me for the first time. :wink:


----------



## nochance

montigre said:


> I know, still keeping the others. Just wanted to have a new one that was made for me for the first time. :wink:


What'd ya get?


----------



## montigre

Podium X 37 with spirals in electric teal/black. 

All I need to do now is find a good Axcel Achieve sight in the classifides and I will have all the components for this bow's set up.


----------



## stromdidilly

Congrats...I've seen a few of those teals in person, they are sharp lookin'


----------



## montigre

Thanks, I'm really excited about it.


----------



## aread

montigre said:


> Bought a new bow....


Congratulations!

We all know that it's not the bow, but it sure is fun getting a new one!!


----------



## nochance

Most of the people at our shop that switched from the PCE to the Podium loved it.


----------



## SonnyThomas

Took the hospital Stress Test today. Survived it. No biggie. Set me up with a IV and shot some stuff in me. 20 minutes for the stuff to show up my heart for "picture" taking. 15 minutes for the "picture" taking session. Then to the tread mill. Shaved my chest and attached them sticky things for the electrodes and a blood pressure set up. A doctor came in to check readings and at a glance gave the okay to continue. Got on the tread mill and started. Nurse said something about some number had to be reached, 131, I think. So I was cruising along so the raised the tread mill and got up to 141. Still cruising and I was asked if I was feeling anything (pain I guess). Hell, I felt great other than my shoulder hurting. Numbers still good, the nurse asked if I could take going faster, Yep, I could and faster I went. Nurse asked if I could go another minute. Yep, no problem. So they shoot something in my IV as I walked right along and after a minute they started slowing down and lowering the tread mill. So the blood pressure unit quit working. So they used a regular the regular blood pressure procedure. Yeah, I was puffing a bit and my blood pressure was like 145 over 88. Still and recovering my blood pressure read 132 over 82. And they disconnected stuff, leaving 3 sticky patches on for electrodes for the last session of "picture" taking, another 15 minutes. All done, a little over 2 hours. 

And all the nurses and aids found out how bad my shoulder hurt. Laying on those flat beds, laying on my shoulder blade and shoulder my shoulder hurt bad and I couldn't move it when I tried. One of the aids slipped his hand under my bad shoulder to help me up and I let every one in the room know I hurt. Oh yeah, I let out a War Hoop. 

Now Prior to; No caffeine 24 hours before the Stress Test. Nothing by mouth 4 hours before the Stress Tess and no smoking for during the 4 hours. So I get 2 hours sleep and wake up from my shoulder hurting. Awake for so long and then I crash for another 2 hours. So I crash about 6:00 am and get up about 8:00. Nothing to drink, no breakfast because I'm too close to the Stress Test. So supper last night and only water from 1:00 PM the day before. 2:30 PM today, out of the hospital and anyone between me and Hardies is in deep do-do. Not even a Cop would have gotten me pulled over (pity the sucker if he did). I inhale the big Sourdough hamburger and half a large diet coke and two cigarettes by 2:45. Stopped at my dad's to give tell him how things went and then headed for home. Home right at 3:00. 
About 3:35 when I started this and now 3:53 and I have sucked down 2 diet Pepsis (on my 3rd) and on my third good size salmon patty.
I think I'll be alright


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## AzCharlie

Kwag said:


> Here is another one.
> View attachment 2215004


Good luck with that I hope it works for you! I did it once and it sounded like I shot into to wood and pulling the arrows was an adventure to say the least.


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## elkbow69

went and shot in the shop for a bit. short game 5 spot, was hitting all over the x, then it donned on me I was hittin in the same holes,,, HUH!! ya, same holes but not on the x. 
then I shot the next 10 shots with BOTH EYES open and shot 10 strait x's.... 

Oh ya,, I usually shoot with both eyes open or a slight squint in my left. Only took me about 20 shots to remember that...geeez :frusty:


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## Padgett

Got out and shot for about 45 minutes after supper with a full stomach and it was overcast so I just shot at 30 yards and enjoyed banging the 12 ring, my cardboard asa scoring rings are shot up really bad and each one of them had a distinct hole on them and each one is different so I got to glass them with the binos and then aim off the hole and try and bang the 12 ring dead on instead of just hitting the hole. Tonight i am going to make some fresh asa scoring rings on new card board and start fresh.


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## montigre

Getting over a bout of Montezuma's revenge following an otherwise nice Chinese dinner...decided to call my shop (*very* large national retailer) to get an ETA on the new bow's arrival and...GASP....was told about 9 weeks. Damn, it does not pay sometimes to be a self-sponsored amateur in this sport... :sad:


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## Mahly

Got the old hunting/3-D bow some new cables and did some bareshaft tuning


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## montigre

You missed a spot.....


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## rohpenguins

Shot 60 yards today played with my peep height and knocking point.... I think I have it close.... Tomorrow it's playing with stabilizers.....


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## LMacD

After lots of blank bale-ing last week, I'm working on some "close bale" aiming and releasing. While keeping my pin in the X, I'm using a combination of light back-tension [as in a *slight* increase of during the shot] along with the "griv" relaxation of the release hand. So far, I really like it. The release of the arrow is crisp, feels strong (when practicing with a string, it launches forward much like a pure back tension shot, just not as much) not nearly as long in duration as my pbt shots. Because it's a quicker process, I notice that I'm not expecting the shot as much as I do with pbt. What I've noticed so far is a general tightening of my groups at 40 yards and I've had to move my pin further right, closer to true centre, which tells me that I was doing something wrong - torquing something - when shooting pure back tension. For fun, I've also tried using only the right hand relaxation to activate the release and just "hanging out" at full draw [how I heard one well known pro describe his method], and it works, but I find I get a bit weak in the overall shot if I don't very slightly increase my back tension as well. I'm keeping the let-off at 70% with a fairly shallow valley which seems to help avoid weak shots. 

Overall, I'm very pleased with things. There's a tournament on May 24, so I'll get to see how things work in action.


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## Mahly

Took the old 3-D bow out and shoot some outdoors for the first time in a LONG time. Was actually pretty impressed with how we did.

Next up new vanes/tips, and shoot some 3-D tourneys.


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## montigre

Finally got the PCE tuned up for the spirals, Nanos, and stabs--brother, is that ever one finicky bow, but I feel I now have a pretty good handle on its idiosyncrasies--lol!!

Now I just have to get used to the 17# holding weight I'm getting out of it--pretty big jump up from the 14# I was shooting through the winter. Some fine adjustments to the release should have me settling in nicely in a couple of weeks. 

I may shoot a half this weekend to start working up my endurance for the season and to get a baseline on what I need to pay particular attention to over the next few weeks. MIDs is just 6 weeks away and will be shot on a range in the WV mountains. I doubt there will be very many level shots there.


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## Mahly

montigre said:


> You missed a spot.....


[emoji12]


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## grousegrove

Had fun making progress setting up a new-to-me target bow, lots of fine tuning tinkering and practice/training with it begins.


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## Sasquech

Family all got our level2 certs for grins. USA archery does not do much for compound definitely an after thought to the whole program kind of stinks considering the ratio of competition shooters


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## SonnyThomas

Sort of moped around until noon and then run, run for getting things in order for tomorrow's 9:00 am surgery.


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## NoDeerInIowa

I hope all goes well Sonny.


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## Deputy Archer

Been doing some tinkering with my new Spider side bar mount, so much nicer than the bee stinger strong arm I had on there. 

Shot redding had a goal of 1500, pretty weak goal after looking back on the shoot. Shot a 1503 missed a lot of easy points. Had a great time had a great group. Will cone back stronger next year! 

If you get a chance check out the spider side mount, you will be impressed!


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## SonnyThomas

Surgery complete. Proper way to say or spell sore? In capitol letters! Surgeon had to open me up some. Rotor cuff; repaired old tear, one partial tear and one full tear. Old tear, lived with for years. Only clunked mostly and would hurt if I threw a ball hard.

All the nurses were great. The Anesthesiologist was great. He and I spoke before surgery and he was with me when I woke. Not the least sick was I. God bless him. Those that have been under and woke up sick knows what I'm relating of.
Messed up as my rotor cuff was, if by the one nurse, the surgeon was quite pleased with how repairs looked.

Got to watched them put a nerve block in. Ultrasound? Some little white image and this darker thing going it. I heard; "You've got it." and; "This going to burn a bit." The next I knew, I was waking up.


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## TNMAN

Hey, that was me 15 weeks ago this coming Friday morning, except it was my bow shoulder. Hoping and praying for good results....for both of us.

edit: good gosh Sonny. your surgery was this morning!!! get off the puter and get some rest.


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## SonnyThomas

Hey, hope you're doing well. Actually, it was sometime around 12:30 this afternoon. Getting rest; Pain pills knocks down some of the pain and AT takes my mind off some of the discomfort


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## carlosii

SonnyThomas said:


> Took the hospital Stress Test today. Survived it. No biggie. Set me up with a IV and shot some stuff in me. 20 minutes for the stuff to show up my heart for "picture" taking. 15 minutes for the "picture" taking session. Then to the tread mill. Shaved my chest and attached them sticky things for the electrodes and a blood pressure set up. A doctor came in to check readings and at a glance gave the okay to continue. Got on the tread mill and started. Nurse said something about some number had to be reached, 131, I think. So I was cruising along so the raised the tread mill and got up to 141. Still cruising and I was asked if I was feeling anything (pain I guess). Hell, I felt great other than my shoulder hurting. Numbers still good, the nurse asked if I could take going faster, Yep, I could and faster I went. Nurse asked if I could go another minute. Yep, no problem. So they shoot something in my IV as I walked right along and after a minute they started slowing down and lowering the tread mill. So the blood pressure unit quit working. So they used a regular the regular blood pressure procedure. Yeah, I was puffing a bit and my blood pressure was like 145 over 88. Still and recovering my blood pressure read 132 over 82. And they disconnected stuff, leaving 3 sticky patches on for electrodes for the last session of "picture" taking, another 15 minutes. All done, a little over 2 hours.
> 
> And all the nurses and aids found out how bad my shoulder hurt. Laying on those flat beds, laying on my shoulder blade and shoulder my shoulder hurt bad and I couldn't move it when I tried. One of the aids slipped his hand under my bad shoulder to help me up and I let every one in the room know I hurt. Oh yeah, I let out a War Hoop.
> 
> Now Prior to; No caffeine 24 hours before the Stress Test. Nothing by mouth 4 hours before the Stress Tess and no smoking for during the 4 hours. So I get 2 hours sleep and wake up from my shoulder hurting. Awake for so long and then I crash for another 2 hours. So I crash about 6:00 am and get up about 8:00. Nothing to drink, no breakfast because I'm too close to the Stress Test. So supper last night and only water from 1:00 PM the day before. 2:30 PM today, out of the hospital and anyone between me and Hardies is in deep do-do. Not even a Cop would have gotten me pulled over (pity the sucker if he did). I inhale the big Sourdough hamburger and half a large diet coke and two cigarettes by 2:45. Stopped at my dad's to give tell him how things went and then headed for home. Home right at 3:00.
> About 3:35 when I started this and now 3:53 and I have sucked down 2 diet Pepsis (on my 3rd) and on my third good size salmon patty.
> I think I'll be alright


Sonny, with a diet like that (Big sourdough hamburger, half a large diet coke and two cigarettes? Then three diet pepsis and three salmon patties?

You are truly blessed to have a system that will tolerate that kind of abuse! :dead::dead::dead:


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## carlosii

Been working on my wrist strap release. Finally getting the hang, I think, of using BT on it. Got the big knuckle on the trigger and using it, instead of punching with the first knuckle.

Seems to be something I can work on and see some improvement.


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## SonnyThomas

Carlos, I shot some of my best with a Scott Mongoose. Still have it and use it for hunting....3 years ago I got took my 2000 War Horse out of retirement to shoot this Darchery (301) contest and used the Mongoose. Won that Indoor contest with just 7 shots. After the contest we shot 1/2 of a 5 spot and I won again.


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## elkbow69

Sonny, That reminds me of March 23, 1989. waking up in the hospital after getting a "Rebuild" on my thrashed right shoulder. First thing I said was,, Ohh man,,, Im gunna PUKE.

Having the heaves with a freshly rebuild shoulder REALLY REALLY SUCKED, I could barely even open my eyes. Felt like Id been run over by a MAC, then hit again by a Peterbuilt. 

Then they gave me that wonderful button for the morphine drip. Went through 2.5 drip tanks of that in 3 days. It was all a fog. Then the 4 hour ride home over the mountains later. UGH,, The agony!

Heal well!


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## SonnyThomas

elkbow, this is the 5th time I've been under. First time hospital dang near killed me. Only supposed to out little over a hour. 3:00 pm went under and at 9:00 they got me awake. Nurses switched I guess. Sicker than dog and she gives me a hypo to knock me out. 5:00 am doctor pulled me out of it. 2nd was from 1000 pound part whacking in the stomach, ruptured right across the belly button. Came out of it okay and they made me drink something. Just got home and heaved my guts up. Had this pillow on my stomach and hanging on got for dear life. Man! On my knees, hanging on that pillow and not letting go so my wife and dad could see if I ripped myself open..... 

Feeling better. Pain meds were making me sick, got off them. Had the heaves 4 times the same afternoon I took the stronger med. Sore, but nothing like that first day, 2 hours sleep in 36 hours.


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## montigre

Yesterday: Still working on ironing out a few kinks setting up the PCE for field while awaiting the Podium to arrive. I swear, this has been the most finicky bow I have worked with, but I am determined to learn its dirty little secrets. I discovered yesterday that it does seem to prefer more thumb on the grip than the other Hoyts I have shot and I may adjust the bow's grip a little more to make it easier for me to find that sweet spot during the course of a long field round.

I am also seeing an annoying slight vertical bob in the top half of the dot--may just be my heart beat transferring through the bow or I may still have a wee bit of stabilization work to deal with. Either case, it bounced 2 arrows just out of the dot. I'd post a pic of my 50yd target so you'd get a better idea of what I'm dealing with, but the link for pics is not showing up as active for some reason... sigh

All in all, it is starting to come together--just a lot slower than originally anticipated.


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## LMacD

This morning, I set my second and third axis. After noticing a progressively left miss as distance increased, I knew something was up. My vertical axis was off by a half bubble - yuck! - and my third axis was out by about a 1/4 bubble when the sight is tipped to 45%. Everything is looking really good now.

In terms of form, I'm working on a more open stance. I had been using a completely 90 degree stance and I'm now trying a "look over your left nipple" angle. It definitely feels more natural and more stable. I just have to re-adjust my release moon setting a wee bit. No biggie.


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## Fury90flier

Shot a Field shoot today though I didn't do very well- shot a 423. It was a last second kind of thing and didn't know my sight settings...many stages were a guess. Put it this way, first shot was into the wood frame- lol. But, I had a lot of fun.


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## subconsciously

Finished up the archery room. Sold my house and lost my man cave, but this will work.


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## Huntin Hard

Shot a Vegas round today. Shot a 295 today and I'm happy with that because I've jumped from a 270-275 shooter to 294-296 average now since February.


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## montigre

Fury90flier said:


> Shot a Field shoot today though I didn't do very well- shot a 423. It was a last second kind of thing and didn't know my sight settings...many stages were a guess. Put it this way, first shot was into the wood frame- lol. But, I had a lot of fun.


:thumbs_up That's not too shabby with you guessing many of your distances!! Glad to hear you had a good time.


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## Mahly

Got new strings on the Concorde, cams rough timed (awaiting creep tune), peep in, generic rest on, QDs mounted.
Hoping to do some tuning tomorrow.


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## Padgett

I worked on a couple distances last night and really nailed them down and made a sight tape. So tonight will be seeing if it is a good one shooting at a piece of black tape nice and horizontal.


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## V3505

I worked yesterday on bare shaft tuning.... for some background info, I'm not a pro at tuning. I've been shooting for more than 20 years and started working on my own equipment about 5 years ago. I can hold my own with bow setup and have very few issues. I've been slowly expanding my knowledge on super tuning. To say the least, I was overwhelmed yesterday and stood scratching my head after seeing my bare shafts fly. I was truly amazed, because my arrow flight has always been good (to the naked eye). My arrows were seriously hitting the target at a 30 degree angle. Holy $%*#!! 

At the end of the day, I need to know my bow is performing correctly and efficiently. With a little twist here and there, and micro adjustments on the rest itself, I think I'm back on track. For those out there who have never done this (bare shaft tune), get into it! "good enough" really isn't good enough. An un-tuned bow is still human error in my book.


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## montigre

Hung the PCE on the wall and brought out the ol' faithful Alpha Elite and got down to business. For me, shooting the PCE is like trying to ride a green broke horse in a competition--it can be done, and it can be done well, but you'll work your butt off. Because of its lowered geometry, I have to change too much of how I normally shoot to make it play well. With outdoor sectionals just a month away, I decided I did not have time to mess with it any longer--maybe after outdoor season is over (if I have not sold it by then).....

Crap, I still cannot upload pics....


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## Mahly

Got some marks for a sight tape on the new sight.
Found the range I was at was off by 2 yards.
Now I have marks for 18, 28, and 38 yards LOL!


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## cbrunson

Mahly said:


> Got some marks for a sight tape on the new sight.
> Found the range I was at was off by 2 yards.
> Now I have marks for 18, 28, and 38 yards LOL!


Always sight in to your own range finder.


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## Ned250

subconsciously said:


> Finished up the archery room. Sold my house and lost my man cave, but this will work.


Awesome room! Congrats on the bowls!!


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## subconsciously

Ned250 said:


> Awesome room! Congrats on the bowls!!


Thanks. I've won a few state and sectional shoots and 12th at nationals,but my wife is the real shooter. She shot a 600 with 105 x's at sectionals this year (BHFS). Wish we would have went to nationals. There would be 3 bowls up there.


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## erdman41

Bought a $42 sight so I could take the bubble level out of it because the ones I had on order didn't come today and have a shoot tomorrow.


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## Sasquech

Finally got consistently in the white at 60 yards was struggling for a while rest contact


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## sixstringer4528

I beat my personal best score of 281/300 (Vegas 300) and shot a 284. I'm just getting prepared to shoot at my shop's Vegas summer league next week in the adult division. Feels good because I'm finally starting to develop a solid and consistent foundation for my shot execution with my hinge.

I also set up my outdoor target with a 122 cm fita face to prepare for my first outdoor shoot.


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## Fury90flier

Shot the TOTS 1080 round this weekend. Though I didn't shoot that well (871), I had a great time as did the other shooters. For some reason was releasing a bit early, just couldn't shake it...should have been another 30 points just because of the surprise release.

I'll be spending the next few weeks fixing problems I noticed during the shoot.


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## Fury90flier

Today I decided to see if I could get a lens to work for me...have always had issues with a lens. Well I got closer than I ever had before. So I spent the afternoon seeing if my lens/peep combination will work. While it's not as good as I'd like, it's better than it ever has been...so will be tweaking this setup over the next couple weeks.


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## cbrunson

Picked up my new meat target bow.


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## subconsciously

cbrunson said:


> Picked up my new meat target bow.
> 
> View attachment 2230677


Sweet looking bow. The wife just picked up a Hoyt dealer spot and loves her new Podium X 37.


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## cbrunson

subconsciously said:


> Sweet looking bow. The wife just picked up a Hoyt dealer spot and loves her new Podium X 37.


That's going to be my next one. I "needed" a new hunting bow this year, so I waited on the new target bow.


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## Padgett

Can't believe it but it had been five days since I had shot so in the drizzle last night I got in two hours of shooting in the back yard and it felt good to be out there.


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## montigre

Shot in some preliminary marks for the GT Ultralights I just made up last evening. Then helped to set up the range for a 28 target safari round we're going to be hosting tomorrow--all vets, active duty and military retirees shoot free in honor of those who lost their lives protecting our freedoms. 

I'm a tired puppy....have to print out the sight tape now while my mind is still somewhat functioning.


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## Rick!

Shot a 12 on the Jackalope, pulled back on the spike buck and heard a crack. Inspected things, pushed the cams around, tightened my 15/16" socket stabilizer, checked tightness of all screws and proceeded to shoot a 5 from 28 yds. Went back to the practice range and shooting high and way left. Looked at the bow again and saw the upper left limb split. Looks like a call to the PSE rep tomorrow and gonna have to scurry to get marks for my field bow with 22's or Pro Hunters to shoot the local weekend 3D this weekend. Yee ha!


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## josephcsylvia

Received new bee stinger stabs today 24" and 10 out back for my katera went to shoot a 3d round with mike mfsco001 had to change my peep in the field and then a quick sight in and shot known 45 for the first time today right after messing with things still managed to shoot decent. Gotta start getting ready for a june 14 state qualifier new to 3d finished 2nd in my first circuit shoot and 1st in my last one at 16up in mens intermediate. Came home a and fount the post man delivered my new sword titan shooting a 7 pin twilight hunter now. Look forward to playing with it.


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## KenBry

I ordered a Hoyt Podium, axcel site set up, rest, arrows, stabilizers and some other minor items needed to start over.


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## erdman41

Shot my 30th field half this year. 277. Dang 50, 65, and a 70 yarder.


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## insane

Picked up a Diamond Infinite Edge LH for my now 7 year old son on Saturday. Got his draw length figured out and set just before he went to bed. I spent the next hour or so tuning it. His first shot Sunday morning was a solid 10x on my Rhinehart mule deer... The look on his face was worth every penny. He has shot a fiber recurve since age 3 but right handed. He is left eye dominate. So I switched him up. He is handling the switch better than expected. He also bagged his first critter ever today.. 12 of them to be exact,, but with his cricket 22. #Proud papa in MT.


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## "TheBlindArcher"

I've been trying to work through a draw shoulder issue that seems to only effect my draw. No issues climbing, kayaking, or in any other life activities, but that rotation during the draw lights it up like a ball of fire. Not deep like a rotator cuff, think it's a nerve impingement. Seeing the doc, chiro, and acupuncturist this week. 
[Only described it in case knows exactly what it is and can say "your career is/is not over..."] 

Also impulse-bought a bow, a Destroyer... Don't need it, won't hunt with it (other than the paper plates), but if newbies like me didn't buy things we really didn't need the industry would dry up . My first "speed" bow, real impressive after I drop the DW/DL into the realm of youth shooters and try flinging my husky overweight arrows through it.


----------



## Deputy Archer

Shot Nevada county Sportsmans June shoot, 42 target redding style 3d. Shot 911 out of 924, pretty solid for me, left about 5 easy points on the range, but nailed the 92 yards polar bear. Had a blast with the wilderness Archery crew


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## Rick!

Shot an unofficial FITA from 30 meters to 90 meters in 18mph wind gusting to 25mph on Saturday. Learned how to keep calm when blown off the bale; take two breaths and then resume. No lost or damaged arrows which is a bonus. Dropaway limb atttach needs a clamp. Scorpion Venom lube works really well. Made some new friends and wil see them again at the state 900 in two weeks.


----------



## mellen

This is a fun thread! I just joined AT, but I have been looking at it for some time when I had a question and got a lot of good information. I shot my first field tournament this past weekend, it was fun and I didn't lose any arrows. I bought a new fletching jig and ordered the vanes I like, later today after work, it is out to my backyard range and fling some arrows! Fortunately, most of my family is working later, so I don't have to worry about hearing "What's for dinner"!


----------



## Rick!

Tuned in my hunting/3D rig after replacing the limbs. Read tmorelli's tune up thread, reshimmed the bottom cam, _added_ more cam lean to the top cam and corrected a right POI, nock left bareshaft condition. Switched to a different bareshaft and it hit 9" low and the a little right. Twisted the nock and it hit in a different spot. Switched nocks in the BS and the inconsistency followed the "red" nocks. Found out that a large clearance in my nock sets causes bad bareshaft results with narrow nocks. "Screwed" my nock sets a little tighter, changed to standard GT nocks and then ruined another shaft at 30yds trying to drill a BS through it. Also finally figured out what grip this rig wants and stuck 3 arrows together at 50yds. Sure wish my PCE tuned this easy...


----------



## sharkred7

Shot a new PB for field on my home made course. 555 with 73 X's. First full round I have shot as I usually only have time to shoot a half after I wake up before I go to work. Been averaging 275 halves but my best half was only 276 until today when I shot 277-278. So my first goal of the year shooting my first 550 round ever (previous best full round was 548 at Nats last year) complete. So to shoot right to a 555 made my day to say the least! Now to do it in a tournament! I have 3 chances left this year.


----------



## "TheBlindArcher"

Shot the first day of the Wyo state target yesterday... It _ was horrible! Normal format was an American 900 (40, 50, and 60 yards 6shot 5 ends) but I shot 3 rounds at 40 yards using a 60, 80, and 122cm targets. Everyone (even the officials) suggested I just shoot the 122 face three times, but where's the fun in shooting 90 shots at the same target, so in the spirit of changing the difficulty I went with the different sizes. 

Third end of the first round I walked into my tripod and knocked a foot off it... Didn't take the equipment malfunction option and spent the rest of the round and most of the next trying to get it sighted back in (shot a lower score on the 80cm then I did with the 60cm face). It wasn't until the 122cm round I got my head back into the game. 

Ended up losing 6 arrows on the day... Missed the bale and they drove so deep into the soft ground even the vanes were buried. Considering FOBs for the next time I shoot outdoors... Undoubtedly not as accurate but then a $5 FOB is worth finding a $13 arrow. 

Despite all the problems an awesome, fun-filled day._


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## Rick!

Shot the state 900 this weekend, my first. About a 13 click wind with gusts on day one. Gapped out and dry-fired my new rig on the first end at 50yds on day 2. Transferred everything over to my old rig inside the 15 minute limit (that I had put up for sale). Shot a sight in end and finished the round. Ended up in 5th for the weekend. Had fun, made new friends and sunburned my feet.


----------



## Wichhart

Shot my best Vegas face to date. Through out the last couple days I've shot prob 40 maybe 45 arrows on this target. Never kept score just watched the groupings and can honestly say this is prob the first face I've been really happy with lol.


----------



## SonnyThomas

July 4, Pekin, Illinois. Observation, not what you think... Team Money Shoot - Draw for teammate. Hey, we had some tough shooters. They went after the 12 and 14 rings like hungry animals... 3 shooters right off the top of my head, Danny Evans (Hoyt), Kevin Koch (Elite), Shannon Gillette (Mathews). Danny Evans and Shannon Gillette were drawn as team mates and took the Open Shoot Off and 3D Shoot Off. Kevin and this team mate (Jake?) took 2nd. In the Open Shoot Off the targets were 38 and 43 yards and the 14 rings were hammered! Danny and Shannon shot solid 14s throughout the 3D Shoot Off... You know, Shannon is pretty good shot, but I think I could beat her...if she spotted me 20 points 

Now, all these shooters surrounding the Shoot Off course, I got to look over their bows, about 30 of them. I was looking for one thing, peeps and if they were straight with bow at rest. 30 bows and I found 4 that had peeps straight. All other bows had peeps slightly turned right, 2 turned about 1/3, and a couple turned left. One thing in common, d-loops were straight except for 2. In the nut shell, it doesn't matter how the peep is with bow at rest. What matters is the peep being straight at full draw....

Lot of hinges used. I tried my best to see if any outright rotated the hinge and couldn't. In some cases I know they where easing up on the index finger. One who shot great throughout used a hinge without a thumb post. I watched, he drew, anchored and let his hand relax so the release evened out. After that I couldn't see actual rotation. So, most let off the thumb post and were so close to firing I couldn't see rotation at firing. I only saw one person have a bag of releases and did see him alternate releases once.


----------



## Acepitcher

Today I shot but was hitting to the right as compared to yesterday at an outdoor range where I was shooting dead on. I am working on getting perfected for the Texas asa state shoot this coming weekend any ideas on how to correct my problem? I shoot a surloc scope with a 6x lens and a #2 clarifier. I use a Carter target 4 thumb trigger and I'm shooting the Hoyt nitrum turbo with the black eagle magnum 300 spine 150 grain tips.


----------



## sharkred7

Well I finally hit my goal of shooting 550 in both practice and a tournament this weekend. Shot a personal best of 553 on a challenging course and also shot a personal best of 71X. Hopefully can continue through our state shoot this weekend.


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## "TheBlindArcher"

Scored my best VIIR indoor round (blind, 18m distance 60cm face 10pt scoring) beating my best previous score from early in the year by over 100pts. [Yes, I'm so horrible I can increase my PRs by 100 pts and still have crappy scores  ] Think I've made a "self-discovery" method for keeping a more consistent "left-right" rotation of the bow by gauging string pressure on the nose and lip... Difficult concept for me to explain, but I think this was a major influence in shrinking the horizontal spread and numerous fliers in my groups... Will have to have the sighted look at the bow orientation for all I know it could be Xbow or "gansta" sideways. Just ecstatic about my score and "scoring shot percentage" (the percentage of how often I miss the scoring rings). 

Also shot my "new to me" HBC for the first time... Thing scares the [grawlix] out of me. Couple times it clicked during the draw and my heart stopped bracing for that sucker punch (it's set fairly hot from the previous owner). Sure I'm shooting it wrong, there felt like a lot of movement, rotation, of the thumb post mounting area against my throat... Not as I've read/heard it explained. I'll work on setting it up (speed wise) and start blank baling the snot out of it once I get a true description of where the adjustment and locking screws are... I can't find them (particularly the locking screw...), but I did get about 80 shots with it... Even got a couple slapper groups (at 20yds is good for me) so I'm happy. 

And that ladies and gentlemen is the blind report


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## montigre

Oh blind one, it is really good to hear that you're making such good progress. Keep up the fantastic work!! Now if I can only get the image out of my head of you shooting your bow gansta style...lol!!

You'll like the HBC once you get it set up. I recently picked one up on a trade and have really enjoyed shooting it. I really do not perceive very much travel the way I have mine set up, but I also do not use the thumb peg--I take them off all of my hinges.... 

I was going to post the instructions for adjusting the HBC, but realized they were pictoral and would probably not do you very much good. The locking screw is underneath the hinge head toward the back of the release (the part that rests over your 2nd finger)--loosen this before adjusting the speed screw which is located in back of the head (where the hinge opens and closes). Clockwise speeds things up and counter clockwise cools it down. Then tighten the locking screw back down. Both screws use a 5/64" allen if I remember correctly.


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## "TheBlindArcher"

montigre said:


> Oh blind one, it is really good to hear that you're making such good progress. Keep up the fantastic work!! Now if I can only get the image out of my head of you shooting your bow gansta style...lol!!
> 
> *** And this is why I leave the capture bars on my Ripcords...
> 
> You'll like the HBC once you get it set up. I recently picked one up on a trade and have really enjoyed shooting it. I really do not perceive very much travel the way I have mine set up, but I also do not use the thumb peg--I take them off all of my hinges....
> 
> -I actually bought it to see if I would like the HBX (yeah, sucked into the hype... maybe) and I think once I get use to it, and punch myself a couple times, I'm going to like it.
> 
> I was going to post the instructions for adjusting the HBC, but realized they were pictoral and would probably not do you very much good. The locking screw is underneath the hinge head toward the back of the release (the part that rests over your 2nd finger)--loosen this before adjusting the speed screw which is located in back of the head (where the hinge opens and closes). Clockwise speeds things up and counter clockwise cools it down. Then tighten the locking screw back down. Both screws use a 5/64" allen if I remember correctly.


-AAAHHH The choir is singing in the mountains. Wish I could post all my questions here and forego the general population altogether... This is exactly what I needed, thanks!


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## SonnyThomas

Come this Monday will 13 weeks after surgery and surgeon and therapist say I'm doing great, better than a lot of people. They won't let me try shooting my bow though. Doing so good the therapist cut my therapy back twice and now down to once every two weeks, more or less to see how I'm doing. I did get the therapist to set up a rubber band to simulate shooting. It was first set for 7 pounds and a piece of cake. Upped to 10 pounds and felt virtually the same. Went back to my original rubber band set up (blue and yellow together proved too much, but only used the blue rubber band. Scaled it at my draw length just short of 25 pounds. Felt that! So to build myself up, 2 to 3 shots every so often.

Next time I see the surgeon I'm going to see if I can get copies of the pictures that were took. All the pictures are round and about the size of a silver dollar. Two pictures of blackish holes that look the size of a nickel in a white silver dollar size circle, one shredded looking nickel size hole in another picture, one picture of the new partial tear and a picture of the old partial tear.


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## SonnyThomas

Went to the Pekin 3D Sunday, 8/2/15. Can't shoot, but sure can B.S. We got to talking about releases and I just happened to take along my Stan Shootoff and my rubber bands, so I went to the car and got both. Lord! The fun started then. Told those who tried the Stan how grip it and get a good feel on the thumb barrel. Didn't take them long to get the hang of it and all were stunned. First, the rubber band went flying. They couldn't believe it. They couldn't believe the Stan Shootoff either. It was going off like magic. Older gentleman tried it. Never shot a thumb release before. Got him settled in on how grip it, anchor, good feel of the thumb barrel and sheer disbelief filled his face. I have the Shootoff set pretty heavy, but all said the release went off like magic or a complete surprise or "I wasn't expecting that." 

One spoke up of using the rubber bands at a shop for people to try releases before buying. Others gave practicing with their releases without shooting arrows in the house. Awesome said some one about blind baling, getting their execution down pat.

As I was getting ready to leave a couple had to try the rubber band and release one more time...well, more than one time. Asked about the Stan being so great I replied; "It's no better than my TRU Ball ST360s other than a bigger range of adjustment of the thumb barrel." 

Yep, now practicing with my hinges.


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## jmclfrsh

Today with the help of a 2x lens in my new CBE Vertex 3D I was able to choose the correct sight tape finally! I first went with 8, then 4, then with the lens I was able to narrow down to #9. 

You shoot at 30 yards, then 60, mark where they both are on the blank sight tape then compare them to a supplied template that allows you to choose the correct sight tape for that particular bow. The engraved aluminum plates are numbered 1 thru 14.

After confirming my setup at 20, 30 and 40 yds, I'm pleased to report that process is finally now over. After four solid shooting nights.


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## Mahly

Mainly a spot guy, I finally started shooting outdoor 3-D.
Set up my old hunting bow, and save for an arrow that had lost it's tip (DOH) I was shooting pretty well for a first time.
Ended up only 5 points, but was happy with where my arrows went.
This is the only form of Archery, where I KNOW I can "buy" some points. A GOOD set of binoculars would have gotten me quite a few points as some of the targets I was the first to shoot, if they were dark, I had no idea where the 12 ring was. Arrows went where I wanted them to go....just didn't happen to be aiming at the 12 ring LOL!.

My biggest fear was my sight. VERY small adjustments for yardages (1/8" from 20-30 yards 3/16" from 30-40), but it worked out alright. My "cutting for up and downhill shots was very good (one station had 4 targets shot from a tall platform, at anywhere from 25-35 yards. Scored 12,12,12,10).

Started with the thumb trigger, but the wind was negligible so I went to my hinge....Thinking I'm gonna save the thumb trigger for only windy shots. POI was identical.

I'll be shooting more of these, but spots is still "my" game.


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## SonnyThomas

Mahly, you using a sight tape? Magnifier? One of the reasons I went the "cheat sheet" route so I can dial in to the click needed and no lines to mess with, no magnifier. Just the steel grid scale on the side of my Sure Locs and CJ ANTS 2s and the numbers on the knobs.

I have two pair of binoculars, 10X48 and 10X50. Too much shake with 12 and 15X.


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## SonnyThomas

Getting close to seeing the Surgeon. Lifting straight out and straight to the side to build up strength so Surgeon will release me. Set up rubber bands to hit 30 and more pounds. Draw and anchor pretty decent. Therapist had me "drawing" on the weight machine. Shoulder held up good with "drawing" up to 60 pounds, but it ain't the same as drawing my bow. Wow! I thought standing at the weight machine and mimicking drawing and 60 pounds fairly easy I could draw my 55 pound without any strain. Wrong! So training with more poundage with the rubber bands, therabands they are called. Have my cheapo arm bicycle tightened to the max and doing counts of 60 "peddling" forwards and 60 counts backwards. Does make my arm tingle when I stop - feels good, like I'm gaining ground every day. Yep, shoulder still gets sore, but it moves where I want it. 
Oh, forgot. The Therapist released me. Said all it was going to take was time. Said it was just outstanding that I was doing good as I am with my rotor cuff so badly tore.

So there was Joe closing down Zenith Archery and Joe just one of the good guys I sent off a order for a Comfort 3 hinge just this morning. Be a while yet, but Joe is going to have some discounts to finish closing out. Should be some good buys.


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## SonnyThomas

Might have pushed it yesterday. Did my regular exercises and then doubled up my exercises. 7 times 5 times 5 drawing 40 pounds twice. Twice peddling the arm bike. 240 reps. Little sour today............


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## Mahly

SonnyThomas said:


> Mahly, you using a sight tape? Magnifier? One of the reasons I went the "cheat sheet" route so I can dial in to the click needed and no lines to mess with, no magnifier. Just the steel grid scale on the side of my Sure Locs and CJ ANTS 2s and the numbers on the knobs.
> 
> I have two pair of binoculars, 10X48 and 10X50. Too much shake with 12 and 15X.



I just set up my old hunting bow with a cheaper Viper slider sight.
Just bought a CBE sight from classifieds (and a sight magnifier) to help with that.
I have the CJ ANTS 2 on my field bow.... Guess it's gonna stay there and I'll need ANOTHER sight for my spot bow LOL!
I think I'm gonna stick with the 10x50 binocs, Just need a higher quality pair than my $50 Simmons LOL!
thinking a midrange ($300ish) set of Vortex binocs.

How did you set up your "cheat sheet"? Did you use a program?


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## SonnyThomas

Think I posted of it before. Richard C Brown Xsight, free just Google. Same has program to print targets. 
You shoot in 3 different yardages and you get a chart (cheat sheet) or you can print a tape - 15 to 54 yards. 
You can shoot in more yardages, 4 or more. The thing is the more accurate you are the more accurate the calculation. 
I use indoors I used 15, 20, 25 and 30 yards. Real accurate out to 40 yards and to the yard. Outside I used 15, 25 and 35 and was dead on out to 50+ yards.
Beings my max in ASA is 40 yards....
Write down what yards you're going to use. You will need this.
Okay, you use the scale of a Sure Loc or the Copper John ANTS 2. Shoot in 20 and see what the scale and dial gives and write it down. If 23.02 is 20 yards, write it down. Shoot in 25 yards and see what the scale and dial gives, like maybe 25.13, write it down. Shoot in you next longer yard, like 30, see what the scale and dial give and write it down.
The program will have black entry block on the left for yards and grid mark/clicks. So yard, 20 - Grid mark, click, 23.02. Once in enter 3 entries go the bottom and click on Calculation. Print out chart or sight tape.
My printer prints just right to fold down the chart to credit card size. And you can select colors.....
Found it http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2449349&p=1072725952#post1072725952

I was at the Vortex Open years back. Tried all their binoculars, just outstanding. Sidekick I rode with won a set of 8X binoculars and talk about clarity. Wow! And the Vortex Open is all a fun shoot, 3D and target.


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## SonnyThomas

Add to above; The year I was at the Vortex Open they used the Vegas face from 20 to 50 yards! Chad Byers thought I had 3rd high score. Again, all is a fun shoot. It's mainly a big, big promotion shoot with thousands of dollars of optics given away. You have to sign up early now as a limit of 275 shooters in now in place.


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## Mahly

Thanx 1,000,000. Sonny!


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## SonnyThomas

FIRST SHOTS TODAY! Man! Weight machines are different than drawing a bow, period. 60 pounds on the weight machine was a breeze. The other day I couldn't draw my bow and after a few days using my rubber bands beefed up I finally rolled the cams over on the MarXman, set to 55 pounds. First shot was high from forgetting I had moved the sight to measure how much I moved it for 20 yards (stup-d Post thing). 2nd shot just missed the center X ring by a hair on a Rinehart Skunk replacement center. Lord, was I shaking and a little anxious to get off the shot. I wasn't pushing my luck and stopped. Officially, I'm not released yet. Still, there was no pain, just tough rolling over the cams.

Probably will down again. My computer came with Windows 7 with the option of Windows 10 free. Man, if you're on Dial Up you don't want Windows 10. Slower than Windows 7, has some Fix thing within the Brain box and will fix something right now and this means you lose everything you're doing/working on. Everything is in a different place or called a different name. I remember when I use click the little icon to get on line and the click to dial. Not now. Now, you click the little icon in the lower right, get another block you have to click, then click Connect and then you finally get to dial... Windows 10 had a Photo you click on. Mine doesn't do anything but show a picture or two and it's gone. Uploading pictures, at first the upload worked and not five minutes later it quit....And one of my Anti Spy programs won't update because. It keeps saying that Windows FireWall is stopping it. Turned off FireWall and I still get the same message.
So as soon as the computer tech gets time I'm having him put Windows 7 back in. The tech saved Windows 7 in Recovery.


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## SonnyThomas

For my last entry. Finally got this dang Windows 10 to upload a picture.....


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## Fury90flier

the last couple outings I wanted to push the distance back a bit so I decided to go out to 90m. One, just for fun, two- see how my sights are and wanted to tweak my grip (90 gives me a better idea of what's going on than the closer distances)

Well, suffice to say, I didn't do very well but did have some fun...
2nd group fist was to get zero'd no pic but wasn't pretty








3rd group- only 3 shots fist few groups (only arrows I pulled)








typically what I was shooting









While the groupings weren't very impressive I was having a lot of fun, it was a nice day to shoot and I'm getting better on fixing my grip issues. Oh, and figured out that I shoot decently without a stab-- though will be working on a good stab setup the next couple weeks


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## SonnyThomas

Fury, I have one of those targets in my garage. Back when the shop was going good we though about setting one up across the pond for long distance shooting. Ranged it once, 147 yards. 

The archery shop I worked at. Many years back the owner's father ran the shop and made money. He had a 3D range around the pond that was ran every day and weekend. He had the indoor range. He had a double wide cooler for packaged goods like meat, milk and packaged liquor. He also had a class III firearms license. Yep, order any firearm you wanted and ammunition to no end. When Old Gary ordered arrows he ordered some $5000.00 a crack. Now figure 1980 up to 1990 and $5000 worth of arrows was a ton of arrows. He was also the largest seller of PSE bows. And the pond right next to the shop was also used for competition. It was stocked with huge carp and buffalo. There was a walk way built across the center of the about 10 or 12 deep pond. Yep, fish shooting contests.


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## SonnyThomas

Saturday morning. Hoping the I get a couple of items in the mail. I order the Zenith hinge Monday so just maybe it will arrive. Another item wanted greatly was to be sent this week, that of a extension mounting block for a very nice black Copper John ANTS 2 sight frame I have. I just so happened to be working a deal with a gentleman and he just so happened to have a CJ extension mounting block. Hopefully it's the right mounting block.

Sort irks me some, a CJ sight frame and no mounting block. I bought it from a friend who got in management at a big department store chain. He quit archery because of wanting to go up the line in management of the chain of stores and he has gone up the line and still wanting to climb. He called me when as he collected up his hoard of stashed archery tackle to sell. He moved and still called me to sell stuff. So I bought the Copper John sight and that it missing the mounting block I called and his wife said they get it to me. Well, it didn't come. I emailed and asked so many times and even offered to pay the shipping. Tons of calls unreturned, emailed so many times and messages through Facebook and not once since I bought the sight last year has he contacted me. I don't believe I can call him a friend any more.....


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## Fury90flier

147 yards? Wow, that's a stretch....sounds like fun. 

Those are the bales from our FITA field--have about 13 scattered at different distances out to 90m. I'll have to see how far I can get at that field...I think 120 is about max from the line- maybe 130 if no one is there and step back behind the line.

Sounds like your place was a one stop shopping for everything--- I'd like to have access to a place like that. Wait- no I wouldn't. Between the wife and myself we'd be broke....lol


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## SonnyThomas

I don't know what's happening. My Posts are getting doubled a lot, so I go back and delete one. I missed the one above.

Fury, yes, when old Gary ran the shop it was a archery/firearms shop haven. Now, old Gary was also the owner of the biggest aluminum and glass shop in Fulton County, still is under his son, Gary. When the shop was thriving, and old Gary in good health, old Gary had his wife running the aluminum and glass shop.
I've just about bought out young Gary for archery equipment to work on bows and do arrows. I lack a bow press that will cover more of today's bows. My old press is good for the old standard limb configuration. The other press does so-so good on some parallel limb bows if not overly long on ata. 

Come to think about it. I better unload my car. I had a Bitzenburger jig in the back seat when I went to this 3D last month and someone offered enough green stuff to talk me out of it. Now, I have a like new Apple arrow saw and Apple bow vice and a like new Jo-Jan multi fletcher in the back seat. Lord! And filling up the back of my car is boxes of power pistons. Ran into a guy the other day that had cleaned a old woman's house. She gave him, yes, gave him thousands upon thousands of new 12 ga Double AA power pistons. I bought 11 boxes, 250 per box, for $25.00 for all. And he says he has a truck load yet. Wife is going to kill me and then, a little over $2 per box and I sell them for $5.... They sell for about $9.00 at the gun store. And I know a couple of Trap clubs


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## SonnyThomas

Climbed up and down a ladder every few feet to clean out 70 feet of eve trough. Finished, I figured I deserved some R&R. So grabbed my bow and went to see if I could get off 3 shots. How do I spell happiness? With 2 center X rings and a 14. Hey, and I thought cleaning out 70 feet of eve trough was tough. The two 12s came kind of easy, but still tough rolling over the cams. Took a break and did some looking. The once green pin was a little tough seeing. So I found a red pin. Well, ole Coop, banned a ways back, had told me to clean my lens. Well, it did look a little hazy and spotty. So I cleaned it. Man, everything was so clear. So I wanted one more shot, but had to find a center that wasn't shot out. So I found a center with a 14 ring. Hey, third time drawing was really tough and nothing was really feeling all that right at full draw, so I let down. I did a couple of test draws and the draw just felt short and then I was using my Stan Shootoff... So I re-grouped. Got to full and tweaked me a bit and tried to get on the 14 ring. Hey, shake city, but I got off the shot. I know I was on, but how the arrow got there is beyond me. If it had been 25 or more yards no way would it have found the 14.
So I'm going shoot every day, just not push it.....


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## superdean00

Started working on my indoor game. Hoping to shoot at least once a week. We will see how much I shoot once hunting season starts. For the first time shooting since this spring I take it. 297 22x. Now to keep my mind in it for all 30 arrows. I found my mind wondering a lot tonight.


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## SonnyThomas

Still shooting, but dropped back. Over did it. Feeling good I decided to a few of my releases including a hinge. Used my Stan hinge, the MagMicro Trio. I hit pretty good with it. And I got tired after a dozen or so shots. Later, the shoulder with the rotor cuff repair got to feeling sore. It's been sore and lingering, but doesn't get worse. Actually, I loosen and I can get off 2 and 3 really good shots. And I stop. Doctor says I'm going to feel this for quite awhile. So 2 and 3 shots until things smooth out I guess. 

Got Windows 7 back in my computer. Slow as ever on Dial Up, but just a 1000 times better than Windows 10. And the horror stories of Windows 10. I submitted a list a page long to my Server after they told me of people reporting it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Even gave them the link where there's a list as long as my leg of the troubles people are suffering....


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## jim p

Sonny, I am one dial up and my computer is slow. I installed adblock and it has really helped.

Good to hear that you are pulling your bow again.

I built a string yesterday. The first fury string that I have ever made. I just may like fury.


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## SonnyThomas

Still wore out this morning from yesterday. Lord! Wore out from setting up a Copper John ANTS 2 sight frame. Had the tech manual right before me and the thing is outdated....Never messed with one, just slapped it on my bow to see they worked (got 2 of them, Alum. and black). Yep, you start out setting up a ANTS 2 just like any other sight and then "How do you adjust 2nd and 3rd axis?" Hey, both are built into the Copper John MaXXis scope housing. Had to go back to Square #1 as the 3rd axis didn't want to respond. Yep, all the way back to Square #1. I had to shim the mounting plate to get the extension bar true. Then reset the elevation block so it was true to extension bar (and dang little adjustment and why I had to shim the mounting plate). 

Ahh the 2nd and 3rd axis....The scope housing is mounted to a block and the block secured by the scope rod in the scope mounting block. Too many blocks, but Copper John tech manual calls them that. Two tiny allen bolts are on the top and side of the scope housing. Loosen theses and the scope can be swung for 3rd axis. Under the scope housing there are two tiny allen bolts for the bubble level. Yeah, for 2nd axis you move the level to center the bubble. Got 2nd axis set (miserable critter wanted to creep when I tightened the allens and you can imagine the pain in the butt it was). 3rd came in the second time around, but again when tightening the allen bolts the scope would creep (miserable...). Copper John doesn't make the ANTS 2 anymore, but Copper John still backs their sight frame with a overhaul, $82.00. 

Guessed for windage and elevation and took the first shot. The arrow hit a little right and down a mile. ???!!!! Just me. I had the machinist scale right there and didn't measure from the top of arrow to the pin. And then I didn't want to loosen the cord to the Vapor Trail Limb Driver...Heck, I was wore out as it was. Anyway, I adjusted and shot as best I could with my draw shoulder far from 100%. My last two shots piled into the same hole at 15 yards. I by-passed 20 yards and went to 25 yards. Already had a Cheat Sheet for my MarXman and a bit of converting numbers had 25 yards sighted in right quick. Went back 30 yards and was just a tad high. 35 yards proved the same, a bit high. Really confused me as I'm pretty good with numbers. And then I wasn't using a lens, just the stand up .019" fiber optic pin. So maybe... So if I get up the strength (more of desire) I'll give another go today and fine tune the sight settings.

Hey, wore out from setting a sight frame? Yeah, it was hot yesterday, pushing into the 90s. And finding out how to adjust the 2nd and 3rd axis and then re-doing the whole thing all over again. Now, I started around noon and other than breaks I didn't stop until near dusk. I was one tired puppy....

Other than a pain in the butt to set up the ANTS 2 is a pretty good sight frame. Polished aluminum sure looks good on a all black bow. I believe the 2 Copper John sight frame are going to a 3D Sunday. Someone makes a offer they just might own them. I stick with my old Sure Loc 400s.

I thought my shoulder would fall after yesterday, but it's still there and not a bit more sore than usual.


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## Mahly

Took off the Viper slider I had, and put on a CBE sight I picked up in the classifieds here.
Adjusted my yokes for cam lean, moved the rest to match (eyeballed), put on a new string and loop (eyeballed position) and put the peep in.
Set (eyeballed) the scope where I though it would be close, and fired an arrow at close range. Adjusted for elevation then fired 2 fletched and 1 bare shaft at 10 yards to start tuning....








Not too shabby!

Took the bow to the outdoor range, and checked tune at 20 yards. Spun the D loop around the string twice, and was done :dancing:
Could only shoot to 40 yards, made my marks, and slapped on a premade sight tape

Went to a 3-D shoot today (My 2nd outdoor 3-D ever) and shot 17 up! Not a winning score, but as I learn where to shoot the targets, my scores will improve....that or better binoculars LOL! Some targets I just couldn't see the scoring rings. That and at longer ranges I noticed I was consistently right...a couple of clicks later and I shot 166 for the 2nd 1/2. Had I done that the first 1/2, I would have been up 32 for the day (woulda, coulda, shoulda). THAT would have been a very competitive score for that course!

Ended the day with a Novelty shoot for raffle tickets $2=3 arrows @ 50 yards (Lion) (6 for a12, 4 for a 10, 3 for an 8, 1 for a 5) I was worried about the remade sight tape, but set it for 50 and banged out 2 12s and a 10 (JUST out).
Had great time, and introduced a good friend of mine to shooting 3-D, and I think I have him hooked as well!

Still not my favorite game, but had a great time (even though I lost my cable stop 1/2 way through the course! ZERO impact on where the bow hit....whew!)
Can't WAIT for indoor season!!!!


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## SonnyThomas

Mahly, looks like you have things going your way. Nice.

Went to the 3D at Pekin. The regular 3D was as it always is, but the Money shoot brought out the Aces. Those with fixed sights shot better that what average movable sight shooters do and those in the Open Class were blood thirsty animals.

Had it with the Stanislawski Shootoff release. Sold that sucker. Nice as it is it sucks for hooking up. Got part of the hooking up solved by flipping the jaw open and cocking the release - this holds the jaw open. A major issue is the index section "traps" my index finger, so a medium is too tight? I don't think so, just the index section curls around my index finger too much. Someone said to push the jaw shut by pressing the jaw to the bow string. Well, that doesn't work with a #24 BCY loop material, not with having a proper length d-loop.
Someone asked me how much, told him, no arguing and he owns it...Me, no regrets....


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## carlosii

Sonny, I'd keep a massage therapist on speed dial for that shoulder...if it is sore it needs massaging...some expert guy told me.


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## SonnyThomas

carlosii said:


> Sonny, I'd keep a massage therapist on speed dial for that shoulder...if it is sore it needs massaging...some expert guy told me.


Chuck, Therapist and Surgeon said I'd experience soreness for up to year. Just stretching all back to normal, I guess. Actually, I feel better after shooting than before. Today I got off 2 shot for 15, 20, 25, 30, 35 and 40 and no soreness other than usual, just got tired. Man, that 11th and 12th time was rough rolling them cams over. Once at full draw, piece of cake. 

For my Post #745, at the Pekin range and their practice range, I was surprised how well things looked without a lens and just a .019" pin. Dang! My shoulder heals all up and I might turn Pro....:lol3: Or get a fake ID and shoot in the Master's class :set1_rolf2:


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## Fury90flier

One of those bad days....

I was flinging at 90m and had a hard time keeping them in the red....felt like hitting the bale was an accomplishment...lol


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## superdean00

Played with front stab weight. Found something I liked. Shot 30 arrows. Finished with 299 22x. Im so close. I feel a 300 coming my way soon.


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## SonnyThomas

Test of will power and eyeballs just a few minutes ago. Mercy! I've had this .010" up pin for a while and decided to install it. First, was threading that tiny fiber nothing into the darn near unseen .010" hole! Threading a needle ain't near as hard... Got it in and took a look. Man! Tiny ain't the word for it. I put in the green and I could hardly see it was green until I went outside. I have some blue and it ain't blue until you have some good light on it. Incredible.... And they say someone has .007"!!!!!!


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## cbrunson

Bought another bow.


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## SonnyThomas

SonnyThomas said:


> Test of will power and eyeballs just a few minutes ago. Mercy! I've had this .010" up pin for a while and decided to install it. First, was threading that tiny fiber nothing into the darn near unseen .010" hole! Threading a needle ain't near as hard... Got it in and took a look. Man! Tiny ain't the word for it. I put in the green and I could hardly see it was green until I went outside. I have some blue and it ain't blue until you have some good light on it. Incredible.... And they say someone has .007"!!!!!!


Just in from playing with the .010" pin. Surprisingly, it stood out for getting towards dusk and then there's a lot of fiber wraps around the MaXXis scope housing. Never leveled the Copper John ANTS 2, just threw it on and started sighting in just for up close. Will get to leveling tomorrow.
And yeah, getting a bit blind setting up sight frames. Did 3 just this week. So #4 tomorrow. 

Still, no matter how close I stood, 10 yards to start, that .010" pin virtually covered up the X ring of a NFAA 20 yard Indoor target. At 15 yards there was no way on God's green earth I could see that .010" pin inside the X ring. Maybe, just maybe, if I had a 4X lens then maybe the .010" pin would make it inside the X ring. Farther back and I'm doubtful...... Was fun playing with the little pin. Killed some Xs 
And I just might get a 4X lens for the old Copper John. 

I just had my eyes checked and the eye doc says I have 20/20 and better for distance and bit lopsided for close up (175 bifocal for my left eye and 150 for my right eye).

Seems I'm getting stronger by the day...or I should say when I think I could shoot a bit with aggravating my shoulder. I get done, tired as my shoulder is, it only takes a few minutes and my shoulder feels good. So it's improving.


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## montigre

cbrunson said:


> Bought another bow.


What new toy did you get? The Podium??


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## cbrunson

montigre said:


> What new toy did you get? The Podium??


Ya I've been putting it off but now it's getting close to indoor season, I decided if I was going to do it, I might as well start out the season with it. Going to try the short one this year.


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## SonnyThomas

Man! Woke up around 3:00 am. Cold as all get out, that much of a temperature change. Yeah, two days ago the air conditioner was running near constantly and this morning the furnace kicked on. Two bit, worthless LED flashlights. Can't see the outside thermometer only 8 feet from the kitchen window.


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## SonnyThomas

Just finished leveling up and shooting in the above note Copper John ANTS 2 sight frame. This is my 4th sight frame this week for leveling from scratch. Kind of rough with only able to shoot so many shots, but all shots are one the folded target as is. The only thing I have to do is reset the scope block. The ANTS must have a half inch adjustment each way from center and I used it all up.

4th sight frame set to the same bow. Two Sure Locs with 4X lens and .019" and .029" pin. A Copper John ANTS 2 FITA model with just a .019" pin and the black CJ above with just a .010" pin. This is what happens when you're bored to death and too many sight frames laying around.

Yeah, laid up from the accident and then surgery I forgot about my bales. The wind carried off the canvas and there were soaked from the vast amount of rain we had. They rotted big time, even the one inside it's own canvas cover and then they were new back in 2008, so 7 years old and pounded a bunch at the shop and at home. 

1st picture after 35 yards set. 2nd picture (luckieeee), from 20 yards, is the 1st shot using my new Zenith Comfort 3 hinge. Tensed up tighter than a drum it took a bit to relax and especially my draw hand. Heard the click and just applied a bit of back tension and aimed all the while waiting for the shot to happen (again just plain lucky). Seemed forever, but the arrow went in and I was about a half heart beat from letting down.


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## grousegrove

Was a good weekend. Finished a two-day USA Archery Level II instructor course at my club. It was well taught, with an interesting mix of students included scout leaders, an archery pro shop owner, some collegiate level athletes and former champs, and a former coach on the Korean national team. Learned a few tricks and teaching principles, and I figure it's a step toward my being a bit more useful.


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## SonnyThomas

Had some sight and drive-by shooting issues today. Worked on both and got the sight issue gooder and the drive-by shooting so-so. Pulled the orifice out of Super Ball peep and got daylight around the 1 3/8" scope housing. The red colored bezel actually looks red, imagine that when it looked black from the time I set up the black CJ 2. Could have been some of my drive-by shooting issue. I shot quite a bit today, maybe 40 shots or more. Finally let the pin settle, did the back tension thing and when I got the rhomboids to work that dang arrow went in the X. I thought I was engaging back tension, but I caught myself drawing. I had to slow down big time and make my back tense/work, related to the scapula re-attachment thing maybe. Worked on it from up close to the farthest I can shoot for the walk up range between the house and garage, 40 yards. Felt good, shot good when my back worked, but I know I've got some big work to do.

Built my Deer Crossing Archery arrows way back when. Can't remember when, but got them out today. I have the Target Series in .500 spine. A little bit of measuring and whatever, same Bohning Shield cut 1 3/4" vanes, pin bushings, pin nocks and a 100 gr glue-in point gave a weight of 322 grs, the same weight as my Virtue .400 spine with 80 gr glue-in point. Besides the spine the only difference is the diameter. The Virtues mic .354" and the DCAs mic .350" as advertised. 
.004" difference is diameter is actually .002" difference at the arrow rest, so not much to worry about and if anything that supposedly little bit of "make the arrow repeat the same each time." Those that know of old days knows what I'm talking about  Figured what shots came should be my last for the day. I wasn't overly tired and my shoulder wasn't hurting, but more shots than ever I better stop somewhere. Anyway, same setting for the .400 Virtues for 20 yards and a dead X for the .500 DCA. Not that I didn't believe it, but I reshot the arrow and just a tad low in the X. I called it good and quit for the day.....


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## SonnyThomas

$17.50 right down the drain........ So I'm practicing with my Zenith Comfort 3 and I trying both back tension and a bit of finger manipulation and a toss in of information from several sources, Padgett being one them.... Shot one of my regular arrows using back tension and it looked pretty good. Walked back, forgot to pull the #$#%%^ arrow. Just reached and pulled a arrow and didn't realize it was a arrow I had made earlier today for another Thread. It's cut a tad short, not squared, not spine index, point bent and no vanes. Started to draw and noticed the arrow and said "what the heck." Got to full draw, relaxing some, made sure I'm was on the wall and then just easing off the index finger and pulling with my middle and ring finger. I yelled (yeah, right) before the arrow hit. And then I was wondering at the funny sound. Yeah, I've heard Robin Hoods, but this one was "Tha!!!! thack." And then I saw what happened and still didn't realize what happened. The pin nock gone, the pin bushing gone and it wasn't in the arrow. Pictures don't really show all, but the end of the shaft to the vanes is separated from the rest of the arrow and split down the middle. Pin bushing exploded? I couldn't one piece of it.
So after taking pictures and calming down while chewing my butt I decided to shoot another finger manipulated of the hinge , 3rd pic. Pretty darn close to where the Robin Hood took place I'd say. Oh, the 2nd picture, I had go on the back side and shove out some. Yep, just about buried to the vanes.

Now, I had been practicing and took a good cigarette break or two and downed some ice tea. I'll say this, you can't be overly bowed, the bow has to fit period. Manipulating the hinge takes some thinking, horse (man) power and restraint. Yeah, you just don't up and sling a arrow down range. Yeah, learning to manipulate takes some doing and learned it surely comes easier, but for sure, I was one tired puppy after working the hinge with my fingers. To me it takes control, not let it get away from you, or rush it.


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## mattawamkeag

What did I do? ...I realized that I'm getting older but my equipment is still demanding the youthful me. Concessions to age suck.


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## superdean00

Well not today but Thursday night. Practice Vegas face again. 299. Dern it. I swear I will never shoot a 300. I was in the 7th end and the 3rd arrow when I shoot a 9. On a good note, I did shoot 24 X's.


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## SonnyThomas

superdean00 said:


> Well not today but Thursday night. Practice Vegas face again. 299. Dern it. I swear I will never shoot a 300. I was in the 7th end and the 3rd arrow when I shoot a 9. On a good note, I did shoot 24 X's.


Be positive.


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## cbrunson

superdean00 said:


> Well not today but Thursday night. Practice Vegas face again. 299. Dern it. I swear I will never shoot a 300. I was in the 7th end and the 3rd arrow when I shoot a 9. On a good note, I did shoot 24 X's.


The one arrow syndrome kicked my butt for a while. It is 100% mental. I shot two 299-27x games in our Vegas league last year before I finally cleaned it. 

Just keep shooting Xs and it will come. 

One thing that helped me was shooting 450 games in practice. It takes away the 7th end anxiety.


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## cbrunson

cbrunson said:


> Bought another bow.





montigre said:


> What new toy did you get? The Podium??





cbrunson said:


> Ya I've been putting it off but now it's getting close to indoor season, I decided if I was going to do it, I might as well start out the season with it. Going to try the short one this year.


After a quick an dirty paper tune, I stepped over to a dirty 5-spot someone left up and shot a 58x game while I moved weight around to get the right balance. I must say, this bow holds really, really well. It doesn't want to drop out the bottom like the pro comp did.


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## SonnyThomas

I really don't know how you guys that shoot the Vegas face can get all wound up over shooting the Vegas face. We have one event coming up, the Midwest Open, where the Vegas face will used. I looked at the upcoming IAA schedule and the first Vegas face event (60 shots) isn't until December. Man, 3 events all year long....


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## montigre

Went out to the range to prepare for the beginners' class this morning and this is what greeted us.....









Can we say unplanned work party....LOL!!


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## SonnyThomas

Have a chainsaw party


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## montigre

That's a huge birch branch--we'd need at least a 30" saw to make a dent in it....


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## SonnyThomas

GAIL! DANG! Just started into the 3D range and stopped to make sure my cell phone was on. Just finished and here was this long drawn out c-r-a-c-k! Looked around and didn't see a thing and the out of the corner of my was this tree I was standing next to falling towards me! Grabbed my bow and jumped. Tree was held up other trees, but fell just enough it would have thumped my head some.


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## montigre

Wow, Sonny. Glad you did not get hit by it!! What is it with these trees lately; probably all of the rain we've had this summer.


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## SonnyThomas

One tired puppy here. Went to the Bushnell 3D for first go at a 3D since last year and shoulder all messed and surgery. Bushnell, the course is virtually all in a gulley. No matter how much of it seems down hill you're walking up hill and then walking up hill to the targets. I passed on the moving target and passed on some targets where you're shooting into the sun. Hey, shooting up hill is a bit rougher on the worked on shoulder than shooting on flat ground. Mercy. And getting your 3D eyeballs back to working after a year off, whew! Like where did that dang 5 come from? Yeah, couple of those and I had a couple of 8s, both high. Just plain tuckered at the last and skipped over 4 or 5 targets. Shot a couple targets with my Zenith hinge and shot the last target with the Zenith (drilled that sucker). All in all, not to bad and not using a lens, just a scope with a stand up .010" pin. 
Got home, got some grocery shoved down my throat and that covey feeling came of heavy eye lids. Yep, sleepy time.
Got some work ahead of me yet.


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## "TheBlindArcher"

Prepping for indoor paper leagues (mix of 450 Vegas, 300 Blueface, and VI rounds when I can "get away with it"). Think I shot a decent [for me] 300 yesterday (have to confirm that the 80cm "10" ring is the same size as the 40cm "5" ring before I feel good about the score). Stepped outside and shot my first true 720 VI round (30m, 80cm target)... Still a long way from the current world record but a score that wouldn't have ranked me last at the recent Para Worlds, so content. 

Lengthened the DL on the D350 by half an inch and rotated shooting between the 28" DL bow and 28.5" DL until I realized that changing DL changes my foot locator positions by about [you guessed it...] half an inch. Also cut a couple shafts down from 28.5" [cut to nock throat] to 27.0" [carbon to carbon]. If the math is right they are now about an inch beyond the rest on the D350... If not I'm about to shoot myself in the hand  

Finally [it's been a busy weekend] I've started to incorporate "20 second shot" drills. Ever watch World ARchery finals? Twenty seconds a shot. So I set a timer to repeat 20 seconds and first tried to loose every twenty seconds... FAIL! Then tried every other segment... About 10 minutes of FAIL! Took the capture bar off the rest (faster load), remembered to set the head of the HBC during the "off" segments, and finally got into a rhythm and put 22 consecutive shots into the 10yrd blank bale (and 2 into the back wall 40yrds away... Panicked). 

Long [winded] weekend.


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## SonnyThomas

shootingBlind, keep practicing and you'll make good. Oh, and don't have to be blind to miss up close. Been there, done that :embara:


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## SonnyThomas

Woke up a little stiff this morning. Legs ache some and my shoulder also, but it's loosening up. Those hills are something else and so is shooting uphill.


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## superdean00

SonnyThomas said:


> I really don't know how you guys that shoot the Vegas face can get all wound up over shooting the Vegas face. We have one event coming up, the Midwest Open, where the Vegas face will used. I looked at the upcoming IAA schedule and the first Vegas face event (60 shots) isn't until December. Man, 3 events all year long....


For me the Vegas Face is the most challenging face. So if I can get dialed in on that all others seem easier. But that's just me.


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## SonnyThomas

Just in to take a break...Mercy... Setting up my Pearson MarXman differently....Of course the best laid plans go in the trash. Just got in my new lens and it's the wrong power, too powerful. Thought it was me, thought the lens had something on it and it did, but that wasn't it. Moved the sight in, and in and in and got something of something of clarity, but not enough. Put in a #1 (yellow) clarifier and all was about perfect. Tried moving it back and it got worse. Thought I'd need a #2 clarifier (green) to clean it up. Finally gave up, just plain too powerful. So I sent out a email stating all I went through. The guy is a good guy and I reckon he'll correct it.

So I went with another 4X lens. So I seemed to have the shakes or the wandering here and there thing and found myself rushing the shot. This had to stop. I went to my Bee Stinger set up. The difference between one bow and another and I ended up keeping the same 2 ounces up front (31" front stab including the 1" quick disconnect) and for the two 13" back stabs (including 1" disconnects) I added to make 4 ounces on the right and added 3ounces to make 6 ounces on the left. And the bow still wants to tip forward almost too much or it's just me. 
Made another change. Still seemed I was rushing the shot. Said heck with it and pulled the orifice out of the Super peep. Yep, open peep housing. Took a couple of shots to settle down and then I shot Xs right in a row. What's going with my eyes? I think it's due to using a small housing and a larger peep orifice and I somehow got use to it or got to liking it.
So I'll nurse a RC for a bit, regroup and give it another try. 

Oh yeah, try to shoot when some crazy crop duster is grazing the top of the trees 50 yards from you.


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## SonnyThomas

Shoulder a little sore this morning. Fully mobile, just tender. Shot a bunch yesterday after the break. Got to hammer Xs and just couldn't stop. Still, I was getting use to the more open peep and seeing so much more. And then I got to drifting right. For the life of me I couldn't figure out why. The sun was changing more to the west so I thought it maybe the cause. Still I realized I was centering the scope housing more precisely. Bull headed me fought for a while, but surrendered to moving the windage. Housing centered, windage adjusted the X ring was once more dead meat. So if the shoulder will go I'll give the new bow set up and sight set up another test hop today....

Whoops. Bow is just short of 8 pounds now....

Really, just rattling. Sort of high. I truly feel blessed. All the people I've spoke with who had rotor cuff surgery are amazed at my path of recovery, especially so when the rotor cuff was so badly torn and bicep and scapula detached.


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## SonnyThomas

Went to the last 3D of the year for our area. Forgot it was also the Illinois FFA State Championship. This Championship began several ago and Black Diamond Archery has hosted it every year since it began and at no charge. 60 and as high as 85 FFA members (high school kids) compete. This Championship doesn't interfere with the club's regular 3D. I think the new FFA leader said 4 and 5 to a group and groups, so 60 kids plus. One group was signing while I spoke with ???? I forget his name now. 

So I figured 40 targets was a bit too much to handle and just shot the practice range. We have a pretty nice practice range, V shaped. 60 yards is the apex, center. On the left side the range has even yards, 10 thru the 60. On the right side it's 15, 25, 35, 45, and 55.

I went to the practice range and all those kids shooting and there were lots of school kids that came to watch the FFA kids. Concessions was a hard pressed for hot dogs, I can tell you that. Anyway, some kids cleared out to go shoot the Championship and I stepped to the line. Got all set and heard one girl tell her friends; "Look at that bow!" Yeah, stabilizers sticking out, sight frame. Drew back on the 20 and dead Xed that sucker and I said; "Close enough." These kids went nuts. Don't know where the club got the 5 spot yellow center covers, but the X has a black dot and my arrow was right in the black dot. So I adjusted for 30 yards, reached for a arrow and my belt quiver fell over. I said; "Stupid quiver." Picked the quiver up and the arrows fell out. And I said; "Stupid arrows." Of course the benches had to filled with kids then. Finally, nocked a arrows, drew and nailed the black dotted X at 30 yards. The kids went wild again. And I got to chuckling and half laughing that I had to quit. Later, after the kids thinned out I went back and tried 50 yards. Missed than dang X ring just a tad high and again just a tad low. My 3rd shot went in and I called it a day. 

Really wasn't all that bad, the kids. I was put in worse position years back. I was practice at the local indoor range. Doug, the owner, forgot it was school archery day. I finishing out a 5 spot when all these PE girls show up. Must have been 15 or 20 of them. Doug sees I'm about to finish out and tells the girls; "This is Sonny, he'll be done in a minute. He's one of the better shooters." Yeah, right, him saying that and 15, 20 girls all watching. The last 5 shots, my damned arrows couldn't find the X ring to save my save my butt.....


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## fanio

Shot my first Vegas 300. Very, very nervous and shaky on the last couple of ends, but somehow managed 5x out of those 6 shots. So pretty happy with shooting today!


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## cbrunson

fanio said:


> Shot my first Vegas 300. Very, very nervous and shaky on the last couple of ends, but somehow managed 5x out of those 6 shots. So pretty happy with shooting today!


Great job! They come easier now.


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## cbrunson

Just got another new bow to tinker with. I've been wanting to spend some time behind an Elite Victory. I've got the Podium shooting very well, so the Victory is going to have to be something special to impress me. That's 3 new bows this year. I think I have an archery problem.


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## SonnyThomas

Waiting on Pearson's 2016 line up. 
.
.
.
Man! I broke down today and bought more stab weights. Them things don't go down in price. Bought the stacks so I could add to them. I think it might be due to being still weak in the draw shoulder. Still, more weight is taming things. My MarXman always tipped forward quite a bit and no issues. Now, I've got 8 and 4 on the back bars and it's slow down the tipping. Bubble staying where it should. Seems well balanced as it doesn't feel heavier when at full draw.


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## SonnyThomas

One of those "Bad Day at Black Rock" days. Wash machine went to pot. God help those who buy wash machines with computer control. There won't be another in my house and pity the poor salesman should he try to convince me otherwise. Oh yeah, our computer @#$#%[email protected]# has to check to see if the door is closed 1, 2 many times. To reset confuses the $$%#%%%^#@ thing. So it got confused to the point it locked up in the rinse/spin cycle. Only 2 years old it is headed for the junk ditch or to the appliance scrap dealer (I haven't made up my mind yet). If the scrap dealer, a well placed bullet to make sure it's dead. 

New Maytag washer, push desired buttons and it runs, is in place. Talk about one heavy wash machine. 

Wore out. New weights came in for my stabs. Put on and felt so-so. Shooting proved rotten. Just too wore out. Wife shopping tomorrow and I will "play."

Got out scooter for blast up the road and it wouldn't light up (did cough some). Checked spark plugs and found one that won't fire period and the other dang weak. The scooter came with NGK spark plugs and I've never really liked NGK plugs except the racing NGK spark plugs (made differently - no gap to be checked and set). Tested these back in my younger racing days. The test NGK 9 racing spark plug went 45 short track races before it began to make my iron sputter. 

My scooter. Old, but you best hang on. 1991 Yam Virago, 750cc, 5 speed. Will lay rubber and does nice wheel stands. Kind of loose at super low speeds, like in the yard and up to about 30 mph, but tightens up nicely when at highway speed...and faster


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## Mahly

Got some work done on my new (to me) indoor bow. And used up the last of my old 4" "Quik spin" vanes.
Can't wait to get this one dialed in. Never been so excited to shoot a new bow. Just love the tech on this bow (Alpine Concorde)


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## SonnyThomas

Worked with my bow and new weights. Hard to believe that my MarXman shot so well with a 30" stab with 2 ounces on front and 10" back bar with 6 ounces on the end and switch to a nice set of Bee Stinger front and back stabs and none really seemed right. With the new weights I was to 8 pounds and though it felt good it just wasn't right. Figuring in quick disconnects front and rear (2), 4 oz on the 31" front stab, 10 oz. on the left stab and 6 oz. on the right stab. Arrows just plain fell or I couldn't get up or something. Took all the weights off. My bow wanted to fall over to the right. So I added a solid 8 oz weight. That proved a bit too much. I added 2 oz to the front and then 4 oz to the back right. Things improved immediately. Yep, draw, aim, fire and my shot began falling like they should. Still, the bubble seemed to show a bit too much on the right and I removed 1 oz. Shots came better, but then I noticed 1 oz removed from the right was maybe too much. They make 1/2 oz weights? . No, I don't want to know and besides, one good day does not mean all is gooder. So I plan to shoot for a while and see how things go and shoot from some distance. So end up with 2 oz on the front, 8 oz on the back left and 3 oz on the back right. I like to finish on a good note. I knocked off a couple of 12s and a 14 and called it quits for the day.


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## SonnyThomas

Well, started out rotten today and finished up feeling pretty good. Still having issues with my back halves working together. It's like my left half is out of sync with the right or the right too strong....Heck if I know, but I'll work it out... 

My 2012 MarXman.
Just a front stabilizer to start and this was late 2012 and the bow shot well. In 2013 I went with Bernie's V bar and Mini Silencers (both fully weighted) and the bow shot well. In 2014 I switched to a 10" Stinger back bar with 6 ounces on the end and I think it shot better. Just this past week I went with my Stingers front and back. Today, from 35 yards I ran three 14s and fell short by a 1/4" with my 4th shot. So on the 4th stab setup and the bow still shoots good...


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## SonnyThomas

Rotten today. Attitude, sore, I don't know. And again it seems my back halves aren't synced. Lucky to keep shots in the bull's eye at 20 yards. Did find seeing the top of my scope housing from time to time. Peep moved? Could be beings I've tried different size scope housings and peep orifices. Maybe moved it 1/16" or so as it took 1 grid mark on the Sure Loc scale to bring to zero at 20 yards....


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## SonnyThomas

Just in and it is w-i-n-d-y. First, got new Autolite spark plugs for above scooter. Holy Hanna! This bike has never ran this good. Just turning around in the yard was like doing a Bat Turn, if you remember the old comedy Batman on television. Started out the drive and cranked it a little and the rear tire broke loose. Put in 2nd to the county road and then into 3rd to down play the horse power if I decided to crack the throttle. Well, it fishtailed a little. Turned around at the corner (another Bat Turn) and got down the concrete bridge (temptation got me). 1st gear and handful throttle lite up the rear tire big time. The smoke was still blowing down through the corn field. Decided that was enough and put the scooter in the garage. I'm safer that way.

Well, I've banged and de-vaned quite a few arrows of late and got those fletched last night. What I like about my Jo-Jan fletching jigs is you don't have to remove all the vanes to put on the one missing or tore up. My old Martin and Bitz suck for doing this.

Arrows ready, but the old wind is doing it's number. Got my sight setting figured and wrote down and began. Again, right off the bat my shooting sucked. Tried to analyze what I was doing wrong. Still struggling to draw I wasn't paying attention to my grip. I wasn't getting that full feel from web to off the palm of my hand. Got that going and much better. The right shoulder was next. It seemed to over power my left shoulder. Brain dead me figured it out. My repaired shoulder is stiff enough that it wasn't allowing me getting alignment to the power stroke of the bow/arrow. That stopped the right and lefts real quick. So now to work on loosening up the shoulder so I don't have to think about making my release arm line up.
Going, I ran off shots from 20 to 30 yards and did it good job of nailing the X or scaring it to death. All talk about tough. That wind was blowing me all the place I didn't even want try 35 or 40 yards. 
Between the bike ride and shooting I think my face is wind burnt....


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## SonnyThomas

Got my new target stops in yesterday. Not what I really wanted, but...supposed to stop crossbows up thru 400 fps. So gave 1 a test hop. Yep, stopped my arrows, but really disappointed. First shot and I thought I screwed up big time. Went to look and I was pretty much dead in the tiny black dot, just that my arrow was angled and badly. Shot 2 more arrows and same thing in the dot and what would be the X ring and arrows so cocked I thought I was messing up. The more I shot the more the severe angled arrows bothered me. So I put up cardboard and a 5 spot. The cardboard didn't help one bit. Those arrows angled all over just warped my brain. Wishing now I hadn't accepted the order. Will shoot more to see if "breaking in" helps.


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## stromdidilly

After reading through the "My dot disappears" thread, I went home and messed around with my lens. Was running the crosshair from Spott Hogg for 3D last year and really liked it. Wasn't doing much for me for indoor though as it took up a lot of the target. Ran a dot last year but threw on a hoop and am liking it so far. Way more of a relaxing sight picture which has led to smoother/more consistent execution. Shooting a round for score tomorrow so we'll see how the new set up goes.


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## ILOVE3D

I have been mostly using a 3 or 4X for 3d as well as 900 rounds so yesterday late I went to the range and toyed with 3 different lens powers as well as different size spots on them. Most of our 900 rounds out here are done on a 122cm face so that is what I used. I figure I can find something that works best for me and then roll over that information for the Vegas or 5 spot targets. Shooting at a 122cm face at 60 yards and about 1/8" dot the 3X did ok. I went to a 4X with the next size dot which is about 3/16 and it seemed too big for the gold and I had trouble with groups. I then went to a 6X and the same size dot, about 3/16 and shot pretty good with that setup. Great groups at 60 but I had to change the clarifier to a 2x and shot better than the yellow or 1x. I went back to the 4x just to try it again and again results were not as good. Surprisingly with the 6X my hold was pretty steady or seemed so however I moved my scope in all the way close to the riser. Next week going back to play with changing the distance of the scope to the riser and see what difference if any that makes. Just for kicks going to also use a chubby circle on a set of lenses to see if they are as good as the 6X


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## SonnyThomas

Well, my shooting has sucked for the last few days. Dang blood bottoming out is about like having target panic. Couldn't even kiss a X from 20 yards, dang lucky to stay in the 5. Today I started out kind of good and quickly went bad. Checked my blood and again low, 59. Only people with diabetes knows what the number means. 130 is good.


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## Rick!

I created a series of simulations of a GT XXX arrow at 31" long with a wide range of tip weights. Found some interesting effects regarding how the shaft vibrates and the nodes migrate for each of the tip weights. I need to twang one of my arrows and measure its natural frequency and then I can correlate the model and share the results.


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## Mahly

Modified my Moxie. Left the string stops in the position for 80% let off for 31.5" mods... Then put in 32" mods, ending up with my needed 31.5" draw but only 65% let off.
Valley is obviously short, but still quite manageable.


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## SonnyThomas

Since getting to shoot again after recovering I've had so many good days and so many bad days or I should say minutes. I am shooting more and more, gaining strength. Got over a bump in the road a couple of days ago. Deer season and I got out my hunting bow. Jumping from 55 pounds to 62 pounds is quite a jump considering my shoulder and I ain't getting any younger. First draw and I was wondering if I get my bow back. Got it back and 75% let off gave relief. Struggling like I was sure pulled me out of shape, bent me good. Good thing I had a good size target stop or I'd been looking for my arrow. After a few shots I was pretty much back in the swing of things and pounding the 10 rings of my old 3D centers. I even pounded them good from 30 and 35 yards, which just about my imposed limit for deer hunting. 
The next day I practiced with my target bow and lo and behold it was so much easier. I must have aligned something using my hunting bow.

Still, I wasn't shooting consistently and really falling apart. I just said it in another thread in here, is words different, you can't expect something to get better if you don't change or find out what the problem is. Of course, eventually we all blame the bow and bows do change over time, strings stretch, something comes loose, wear, some movement. Checked out my bow. Not one dang thing different or off. Ata, brace height, draw length, draw weight, peep location and timing and draw stops perfect and arrow rest giving the same exact bubble reading as before. The only thing I could find was my string nocks had closed up, but not pinching the nock. Regardless, I tested with a arrow shaft without a point. No weight up front and nock pinch will make a arrow bounce or come off the rest. Didn't happen. I slammed to full draw and I shook the bow and the arrow stayed on the rest. I rule out the bow.
So I break down my shot and finally I started catching glimpses of the top of my scope housing through the peep at full draw. The more I shot the more I paid attention and there was the top of the scope. And then it really showed when I went back to 35 and 40 yards. Well, that could explain my low and high shots. Never have I had this before and the peep is exactly where it's always been. Man, you hate to change something when you know it's right. Thing is, if you move something you can always put it back. I moved my peep a bit down, figured a good grid mark on my sight frame. Sight set and from 25 yards I fired two arrow and heard them clashing. And that dang new target stop. My arrows clashed alright, but looking at the white nocks I thought I was off some, so some sight adjustment yet. Went to the target and both arrows were touch and both solidly in the X ring. Wind picking up I tried a shot from 30 yards and another X ring hit. I was going to try 35 yards, but the wind was enough I couldn't hold still. So today I'll give it another go....
The only thing that has changed is me and I really don't know. Shoulder operated on, the top of my shoulder has a groove where the I was cut into. Muscle effected? There is a near constant burning sensation at the point of where my shoulder was separated from the accident. And then part of my collar bone was removed. Could this give me a different head position or head tilt? It just seems I had to raise my head some to rid the scope showing in my peep. When I raised my head it didn't feel right and then I had to adjust my anchor....


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## DedDeerWalking

I shot my first five spot scoring round. Scored a 298 33X. I was pleased with the result. 
Half way through the round had an a-ha moment where I could feel the transfer of force to my back on my bow side. Combined with my back involved on the release side felt like the bow was weightless. 
Also found that I was gripping my release too deep. Moved it back out to right behind fingertip knuckle and my release now breaks cleaner with less force.


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## pastorjosh

Got some practice in with the shot trainer. Then my daughter wanted some practice time too.


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## SonnyThomas

Finally shot a full 5 spot round, 300 and my X count sucked, 25. First time I've still had some strength to shoot that much in one setting. At least that felt good. Worked out some issues as I shot (I should know what I was/am doing wrong). Biggest hurdle was not rushing the shot, let the pin settle. Another big hurdle, getting my back to work each time. Try harder and my release side just plain rips a shot. Do it just so and the bow tips forward (maybe too much) and a solid X results. Still just a bit of up and down. There's a hint of wobble sometimes, but when it does the arrow still catches the X ring. Swore a couple times the pin was to the left, me looking right at the X ring and the arrow plopped right in.
All my problems seem to be me, but then thinking more weight would have the bow settle down.


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## SonnyThomas

Added another 6 ounces on my stabs. Made a difference. Front stab; 30" plus 1" quick disconnect, 4 ounces up front. Back bars; 12" plus 1" quick disconnects, 10 ounces on left, 5 ounces on right. Total bow weight; 7 pounds, 12 ounces.


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## SonnyThomas

Man! It's been a long time since I've been wind burnt. Face still hot. Wind howling like a mad wolf. It got worst after dark. Thought the house was going to go, house popping. Trees bent over. And then rain came. Just flat pelleted the house.

When I was out practicing...practicing, poor choice of words. Wind blowing so sight pin was all over the target. Shot...Flung a couple dozen arrows. Only took 10 shots to get 4 in the X ring at 20 yards. Tried the big black Rinehart insert and hit it twice out of 4 shots, but then I had the worse case of glitches ever. Yeah, bow arm was trying to do something, release hand was pulling out from my face. And hinges are said to cure that dreaded disease? I ain't saying that dang two word disease. Calmed down...some. Through the hinge in the bow case and picked up my ST360 and went back to 30 yards. First arrow caught the 14 ring of a Rinehart insert. Second arrow and that "flaming" glitch got me and off high and left went the arrow. Just made up my mind I was going to end this practice session on a good note and bore down, mentally. 3rd and 4th arrow caught the 14 ring. Went to the target and retrieved arrow #2 (yeah, have them numbered). Bore down and drove in arrow #2. The original #1 arrow is somewhere buried in a near knee deep thick grass of the dividing drainage ditch our 2 1/2 acre field and maybe in the neighboring 26 acre field. It took the trip to somewhere when attempting to set one of my hinges. That particular arrow was the last of the Harvest Time Archery arrows I got from Bart well before he sold to Muddy Outdoors, whenever that was.... 
5 shots to get 4 catching the 14 ring, wind howling, I called it good and quit for the day.


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## SonnyThomas

Trying to use a hinge and having a swelled index finger is not a happy affair. It took one draw...attempted draw to say; "This ain't happenin".


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## montigre

Can't use a hinge with that sausage...lol!! What happened...spider bite??


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## dmacey

Geez, poor Sonny......
DM


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## SonnyThomas

Banged it trying to start a chainsaw. Yep, got about a 1/4 draw with the two finger Stan and said, enough practice today :embara:


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## Rick!

Rick! said:


> I created a series of simulations of a GT XXX arrow at 31" long with a wide range of tip weights. Found some interesting effects regarding how the shaft vibrates and the nodes migrate for each of the tip weights. I need to twang one of my arrows and measure its natural frequency and then I can correlate the model and share the results.


I virtually compared the XXX with a 2715 and the similarity is uncanny. I need to doublecheck my models and then I'll put up some data for node positions and vibration frequencies.


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## superdean00

Finally shot a 300. Matter of fact I shot 2 of them tonight. 300 25 and 300 26. I knew I could, for me it is just a matter of staying focused. I find my mind wondering while I'm at full draw. Last night I had a few moment but overall I was able to really focus on my goals. Once I had finished both rounds I felt like I still have something in the tank. Felt like I knew why I dropped a few X's. I am very pleased with my progress. Far exceeding my expectations. Next goal 300 28.


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## cbrunson

superdean00 said:


> Finally shot a 300. Matter of fact I shot 2 of them tonight. 300 25 and 300 26. I knew I could, for me it is just a matter of staying focused. I find my mind wondering while I'm at full draw. Last night I had a few moment but overall I was able to really focus on my goals. Once I had finished both rounds I felt like I still have something in the tank. Felt like I knew why I dropped a few X's. I am very pleased with my progress. Far exceeding my expectations. Next goal 300 28.
> View attachment 3375441


Congratulations!! Good shooting.


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## SonnyThomas

Congrats, superdean00


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## superdean00

Very anxious to shoot another round. Need to see if this was a fluke night or am I capable of repeating this performance.


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## montigre

Doin' a little building....'nuff said.....:wink:


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## SonnyThomas

Gail, :thumbs_up


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## sharkred7

Shot a new PB on the Vegas target. 300 with 29X. I missed my first X by a sliver and then jokingly told my coach and shooting partners "Well, there goes my 30X!" Little did I know how right that was as I rattled off the next 29 straight:tongue:


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## SonnyThomas

Glad someone is having good results....


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## montigre

Okay, I am finished constructing for a while....arrow building station done!! Whew!!!!


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## vito9999

I took my Christmas present (metal detector) out and found 4 arrows. Darn near paid for the thing.


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## ILOVE3D

Snowed again today and expecting more the rest of the week. Moved to northern AZ back in May to be close to the grand-kids as they also moved. Bummed that the closest indoor range is 60 minutes away. That's leading to a lot of shooting in the garage at 8 yards to get ready for Vegas with snow, rain and wind outside. Shot almost 4 Vegas rounds today throughout the day at 8 yards. Trying to keep all the arrows inside the x but still getting lazy from time to time and thinking I can force one back up after holding too long. Finding out for me at least that if I really concentrate on not coming down too soon to the x and trying to stop just above my pin settles just a bit and concentrating on the x I can put it in there.


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## SonnyThomas

Well, rain this winter and decent enough (for me) to shoot outside...was. Day before yesterday is was near 45 degrees. Yesterday it snowed all day to have about 4 or 5 inches this morning. And this morning, 4 degrees above zero. I think I'll continue to think about archery


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## SonnyThomas

I lied, but just a little. I went out and tried. Bow and stuff out in the garage. Bow grip like ice, release like ice, I shot 3 shots. First wandered a bit and the last 2 licked the X ring. I said good enough and ran for the house...


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## pastorjosh

Went and shot a local 3D course that's open all year. Shot a 192. Pretty happy with that!










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## SonnyThomas

Not today, but the past few days.... I was stringing arrows up and down something awful. Couldn't figure out why to save my life. Like be dead on and drop one out the bottom 2, 3 and 6 inches! I thought my peep slipped, but that wasn't it. Checked the timing and draw stops and that wasn't it. Thought my release arm was wrong and that wasn't it. Thought I was creeping and that wasn't it. So my mother-in-law needed a new car battery. Got her going and on the way home I thought how my arrows were dropping like 3 years ago in the Qualifier rounds at Presley's First Annual Indoor 3D. I be dead on and then hit low. No one could figure out what was wrong until this kid (can't remember his name) got braver than me and pushed my arrow down while I was at full draw. The damn arrow didn't come back up.... Tightened the spring and shot 2nd high score of the shoot off round when we shot ours as a practice. Eric and I were put together to shoot a practice for our by rounds. Eric shot 92 and I shot a 88. No one shot any higher, even Eric when he went on to take 2nd in the Trophy division. Mark, running things while Kevin was out, decided Eric and me shooting together counted in the shoot off and I was mistakenly eliminated. Took 2 years before the damn mistake was realized.

Anyway, on the way home that low arrow stuff during that Presley Qualifier popped in my mind. Got home and the first thing I did was grab some super light oil and tore into my Limb Driver arrow rest. Removed the draw cord, the launch arm seemed sticky and slow. Oiled the heck out of it and worked the launch arm until smooth. I looked at the spring tension piece and the set screw seemed wrong. Seemed that I had it all the way up so I could just tighten it. So I put all the tension on the spring I could and the set screw was back like it was. 3 years of use from Presley's evidently had the spring tension knob creep so the rest lost tension. Back like it was supposed to be I promptly started hammering the X ring. First few shots I just used one bull's eye and slapped arrows and busted a pin nock (no damage to pin bushing)... 
One of those dang "little things" had me going nuts.... And so hard to believe the tension knobby thing crept when the set screw was so tight.


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## SonnyThomas

After correcting the spring tension yesterday shooting proved quite nice, too nice. I shot and shot. Got up this morning about 5:00 am from aching. Still, my shoulder doesn't hurt while shooting. I do have pain when shooting, but in the lower back, about kidney height. Tension builds something awful and I never had this before the accident. Stop for a bit and it eases up only to return after so many shots. 

My cheek got pounded today though, that hurt. Shoot long enough and stuff happens that always happens to the other guy. The bottom know of my d-loop came loose. Wham! A grazing blow to the cheek, but nothing compared to when I first tried a hinge. Now, I draw pretty much dead on target, but with the d-loop coming loose (maybe due the bottom knot giving) my bow shot up a bit. Even with this I thought I heard the arrow hit almost immediately. Could find that sucker anywhere. So maybe it glanced and cleared our 85 yard wide field. I checked the next field and nothing. Coming back I was looking up and saw my arrow. Stuck in a tree limb about 7 feet up. I was shooting from 35 yards and where the arrow hit was about 25 yards.
Arrow was not damaged....

3rd pic. 40 yards. Hole effect and lots of distractions, but shade in the summer time.


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## SonnyThomas

Shooting good for about a week and my back quit again. Tension is there, but slips a gear and I end up pulling and hard. Well, that makes a good miss. Decided to go another route with firing my thumb release. Easy up on the index finger works, but dang... After a day of this I went with pulling with my ring finger and so much gooder. 
40 degrees and the wind howling at a said 37 mph. Yeah, right. So strong was the wind it'd tear the target off the back stop. I remembered I had some Saunders Sure-Lok face pins, new. Hey, these things works and I know where a box of them are at....
Target on pretty secure with the Sure-Loks I proceeded to go with a 1 and 2 shot drill. Went longer than I thought, 60 some shots. Imagine 60 shots in howling wind, even from 20 yards, 30" stab catch every bit of wind. Patience is required...or just being dumb. I had six 4s, two jar licker 5s, three solid 5s, two jar licker Xs and the rest solid Xs. So 294 with 49Xs. If just luck, I'll take it. I will be practicing this pulling with the ring finger until it proves or disproves and right now it's looking good....


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## ILOVE3D

My physical therapist said I could graduate to my cane and get rid of the walker. Total knee replacement on the 16th and not able to do much as you might guess. Went outside and shot 5 arrows with my 3d bow. Things were going good until my nurse/wife came out and saw me told me that walking through the gravel to retrieve my arrows while using a cane wasn't the smart thing to do in my condition. Asking her to retrieve my arrows didn't make any brownie points either. Guess I'm going to have to wait until the DR. removes stitches on March 10 and says it's ok.


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## SonnyThomas

Then nurses and therapists can rain on your cloud....


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## SonnyThomas

Helpful tip maybe. Two days of playing around with this. Already sighted in, used Jesse's instructions, re-stalled peep and came within a hair of impact. Made a hair of a adjustment and checked to my yardage card (Richard C. Brown - X sight program). Shot dead X at 15 yards and then moved to 100 yard range and tried max distance of yardage card, 54 yards. Center punched the bull's eye. Luck? 

If anything like me there is that little scrunch (?) you do when you get into execution mode.

I thought using Jesse's sighting procedure at something of my longest 3D average distance would give better results, but I don't a thing wrong, not when I got a match up as I did.....

Richard C. Brown Xsight program; Says to use at least 3 distances. I last used 20 yards as my shortest, then 25, 30, 35 and 40. Like any program the more accurate information in the more accurate information out. Dial in 54 yards and center punch 54 yards, the programs works for me.


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## ILOVE3D

SonnyThomas said:


> Helpful tip maybe. Two days of playing around with this. Already sighted in, used Jesse's instructions, re-stalled peep and came within a hair of impact. Made a hair of a adjustment and checked to my yardage card (Richard C. Brown - X sight program). Shot dead X at 15 yards and then moved to 100 yard range and tried max distance of yardage card, 54 yards. Center punched the bull's eye. Luck?
> 
> If anything like me there is that little scrunch (?) you do when you get into execution mode.
> 
> I thought using Jesse's sighting procedure at something of my longest 3D average distance would give better results, but I don't a thing wrong, not when I got a match up as I did.....
> 
> Richard C. Brown Xsight program; Says to use at least 3 distances. I last used 20 yards as my shortest, then 25, 30, 35 and 40. Like any program the more accurate information in the more accurate information out. Dial in 54 yards and center punch 54 yards, the programs works for me.


Thanks for sharing the tip


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## Padgett

On sunday at the asa I got a different click moon for my honey badger, I got the faster one and I put it in my hinge at school. I love the honey badger and the ht3 because you can take them apart and it doesn't change the speed of the hinge at all. I did go out and shoot with it at home just before dark and it was a very nice feel.

The farmer that owns the property of my rental house came over when I was shooting and asked what kind of release I was shooting and I got to hear him explain why punching a trigger was a way better choice than not knowing when the release is firing. Priceless.


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## SonnyThomas

???? Triggers, hooks, hinges, punching.... You know....Guns & Ammo....Bob Milek was still alive so 25 years ago or more....Mike and his son were shooting Thompson Contenders I believe...Bob was using a regular trigger and his son had his Contender with electric trigger. Yep, all sighted in press a button to fire his. Hold the gun and have the button where you could press the button. Long enough wire and you could have the button in your pocket. I don't recall it ever taking hold. Now if they'd make one for a release you couldn't punch, I don't think......Be legal under present rules. You holding the bow at full draw is only the requirement.


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## superdean00

So close, all it takes is that one moment of a lack of focus and that 5 will jump up and bite you. Not gonna lie I started thinking about a 60X game. I knew I needed to stop and focus on each arrow, but I couldn't. All that was running through my mind was I'm gonna shoot 60 x's last night. Should I leave the target at the range or take it home? Should I get everyone to sign it? Oh well another lesson learned. Good news is I recovered and finished with 59. Not to long ago I would have let that one shot ruin the last 2 ends.


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## SonnyThomas

:thumbs_up


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## NoDeerInIowa

That's some good shooting there


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## SonnyThomas

Tried practicing, but the Winds of March have arrived. Makes good practice for not "blowing" a shot with a hinge. Stepped back to 25 yards for some protection from the wind and "some" was about it. Still, I shot pretty decent target wise, nailing the 5 when the wind didn't catch the arrow. I watched some arrows corkscrewing and some, the wind just right, would have the arrow jump up. How they caught the 5 was amazing...


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## 3rdCoastHunter

Today I bought my first back tension release. Scott halo. Going to give this a whirl. I have been shooting a Carter too simple since I started target archery 2 years ago


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## slimshady2

:wink: Just got back from Atlanta last night around 11:30. Wanted to go to Sage Creek and shoot a ASA qualifier but just too tired from the ride. Georgia to North Carolina took all the wind out of my sails. Hope for another qualifier in the next month or too.


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