# Sight pin dropping low with back tension release



## aread

A few possibilities:
- your release shoulder is too high. George Ryles has a couple of good videos. One is on Bowjunky the other on Last Chance Archery
- your nock is a little too low
- you are loosing back tension as you go over the drop-off. Don't relax your back as you anchor and settle in. 

There are more than a dozen reasons for the drooping pin. These seem to be the most likely from your description.

Allen


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## nuts&bolts

rsm7334 said:


> Need help keeping my sight pin on target during my release. My pin will be steady on the target but when I start pulling the hinge with my back muscles, the pin will drop low off of target. Continuously trying to correct up before the hinge releases. Played around with my stabilizer weights to try to remove weight, now I am at 24" front stab with 4oz and 12" back stab with 8 oz. I tried removing all the weight from the front stab with 12oz on the back stab, seemed to help a little. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gexDLptcios

GRIV Thing a Week #8.


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## rsm7334

Thanks Allen, I found the Last Chance video, good info. I have found if I pull hard against the wall I settle in pretty well and I don't have seem to drop low. My D-Loop in relaxed position you can see that it is angled up. One thing I had noticed is that my DL has increased about 1/4" and my D-Loop has stretched quite a bit. I tied in a new shorter D-Loop yesterday before I shot a tournament today, and shot pretty well until target 20, struggled to hold and shot low for my first 5. I am thinking it may be a DL problem and I need to untwist my buss cables to shorten about a 1/4".


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## rsm7334

Thanks nuts&bolts, after watching that video, if definitely not the bow, it me. I think that's why when I pull harder against the wall it is lowing my shoulder and I am not having the issue.


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## nuts&bolts

rsm7334 said:


> Thanks Allen, I found the Last Chance video, good info. I have found if I pull hard against the wall I settle in pretty well and I don't have seem to drop low. My D-Loop in relaxed position you can see that it is angled up. One thing I had noticed is that my DL has increased about 1/4" and my D-Loop has stretched quite a bit. I tied in a new shorter D-Loop yesterday before I shot a tournament today, and shot pretty well until target 20, struggled to hold and shot low for my first 5. I am thinking it may be a DL problem and I need to untwist my buss cables to shorten about a 1/4".


Excellent. Play with d-loop length. I tell all my students to make the d-loop OBVIOUSLY too long, and then, undo one knot, whack off the melted ball, make a new melted ball, and retie the d-loop knot. Keep doing this, and you will find your sweet spot for d-loop length. If your shots get better and better, as the d-loop gets shorter and shorter...this is a BIG hint that maybe, tweaking the cables (both cables) to drop the brace height up to 1/4-inch SHORTER than spec, may be a good thing. So, if you untwist the buss cable LONGER, to grow the ATA...make sure to test how much you also need to untwist the control cable, to get the BEST cam unsync amount (watch groups get smaller and smaller...less vertical miss pattern, when tuning the control cable longer as well). Then, after you dropped the brace height 1/8th inch LESS or dropped the brace height 1/4-inch less....this means your new draw length is also 1/8th inch less or 1/4-inch less. Then, we do it again. MAKE the d-loop obviously TOO LONG, and whack off one melted ball, undo one d-loop knot....retie that one d-loop knot and shoot groups. Yes, this is a lot of work, but when you get done, you will find your new sweet spot for d-loop length (yes, we are changing anchor) and your group size continues to drop smaller and smaller. You are on the correct track...to DIALING in your accuracy.


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## aread

rsm7334 said:


> Thanks Allen, I found the Last Chance video, good info. I have found if I pull hard against the wall I settle in pretty well and I don't have seem to drop low. My D-Loop in relaxed position you can see that it is angled up. One thing I had noticed is that my DL has increased about 1/4" and my D-Loop has stretched quite a bit. I tied in a new shorter D-Loop yesterday before I shot a tournament today, and shot pretty well until target 20, struggled to hold and shot low for my first 5. I am thinking it may be a DL problem and I need to untwist my buss cables to shorten about a 1/4".


Glad we could help. Like Alan said, it looks like you are beginning to see what small adjustments to your bow and small changes to your form can do to help you. Alan put together a great free download that you might want to take a look at:

http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1399457"

One thing is that you shouldn't let all this stuff confuse you. Sometimes something will help you today, other times it won't help you until next year. Good shooting is a lot like peeling an onion. There are layers and layers to it. Alan's download has a lot of great basic and more advanced information. It's definitely worth the read.

Allen


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## mike 66

D-LOOP angled up BINGO..you change one thing it seems to change everything ! those guys got you going...:wink:


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## doczerothree

nuts&bolts said:


> Excellent. Play with d-loop length. I tell all my students to make the d-loop OBVIOUSLY too long, and then, undo one knot, whack off the melted ball, make a new melted ball, and retie the d-loop knot. Keep doing this, and you will find your sweet spot for d-loop length. If your shots get better and better, as the d-loop gets shorter and shorter...this is a BIG hint that maybe, tweaking the cables (both cables) to drop the brace height up to 1/4-inch SHORTER than spec, may be a good thing. So, if you untwist the buss cable LONGER, to grow the ATA...make sure to test how much you also need to untwist the control cable, to get the BEST cam unsync amount (watch groups get smaller and smaller...less vertical miss pattern, when tuning the control cable longer as well). Then, after you dropped the brace height 1/8th inch LESS or dropped the brace height 1/4-inch less....this means your new draw length is also 1/8th inch less or 1/4-inch less. Then, we do it again. MAKE the d-loop obviously TOO LONG, and whack off one melted ball, undo one d-loop knot....retie that one d-loop knot and shoot groups. Yes, this is a lot of work, but when you get done, you will find your new sweet spot for d-loop length (yes, we are changing anchor) and your group size continues to drop smaller and smaller. You are on the correct track...to DIALING in your accuracy.


Wow! This is good stuff. A little background. .....I shoot cause it's fun. Started shoot outside at bags, block target etc. During the winter I've been going indoor. Indoors I've learned is a whole 'nother thing. Outside I hit well and am pretty darn constant. Inside at 20 I ran into the same issue this gentleman had......I could not keep the pin in the center. I'd float it, tried shooting quicker, literally went through a gambit of areas I thought was causing the problem of dropping out of x. I finally realized that my form was/is something I needed to work on. I did shorten my loop and worked release over and over again. 5yds then 10, then twenty and 30 with some success. I'm not perfect but I'm comfortable and my shots are consistant. I appreciate the input you have given here to the guy that started this thread and the questions he raised! You are a valued resource!


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## rsm7334

Hey, just wanted to thank you guys for the help. This is what this forum is supposed to be about, "Archers Helping Archers". I ended up shortening my DL a little over a 1/4" and have been working on lowing my back shoulder before reaching my anchor. I have been shooting about 100 arrows every day this week and can't believe how good my groups are now. Thanks again Alan and Allen.


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## muscles02

this video helped a problem I have been having .....thank u so much for posting it


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