# First time setting up a new bow



## c_m_shooter (Aug 15, 2018)

Nock point may be a little high. You probably need to lower your your anchor to your chin to get the sight elevated. I see a plunger and rest, so you are using fingers, not a release?


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> I mounted the plunger and rest myself. *Then I had Cabela's do my peep and nock ring. Then I put my sight on* and tried to dial everything in.


Here's the problem. The peep needs to be set *after *the sight is on. The peep is put in the general area, but not tied. With the sight on (in the middle of it's vertical range for a slider), the shooter closes their eyes, draws back and obtains anchor. At that point they open their eyes. The peep and sight should be in alignment. If it is not it is adjusted so that it is. The shooter lets down and repeats the process. If the shooter draws and anchors with their eyes open they will unconsciously adjust head angle to line peep and sight up. With their eyes closed, it eliminates that tendency. If there is no sight on the bow, then there is nothing to align the peep and eye with. If the shooter isn't involved in setting the peep then it will also throw things off. There is no set place for the peep. It is all dependent on the shooter's body.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

c_m_shooter said:


> Nock point may be a little high. You probably need to lower your your anchor to your chin to get the sight elevated. I see a plunger and rest, so you are using fingers, not a release?


Correct, fingers. Anchor is thumb knuckle right at the point where jaw bone starts curving up towards ear. Would I need to lessen the draw length?


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> Here's the problem. The peep needs to be set *after *the sight is on. The peep is put in the general area, but not tied. With the sight on (in the middle of it's vertical range for a slider), the shooter closes their eyes, draws back and obtains anchor. At that point they open their eyes. The peep and sight should be in alignment. If it is not it is adjusted so that it is. The shooter lets down and repeats the process. If the shooter draws and anchors with their eyes open they will unconsciously adjust head angle to line peep and sight up. With their eyes closed, it eliminates that tendency. If there is no sight on the bow, then there is nothing to align the peep and eye with. If the shooter isn't involved in setting the peep then it will also throw things off. There is no set place for the peep. It is all dependent on the shooter's body.


I will try this once I get home to see where the peep lines up. Thank you!


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> I will try this once I get home to see where the peep lines up. Thank you!


And if possible, avoid Cabelas for any work done on your bow. Go to an actual archery shop. If they were willing to set your peep without following this procedure, then they prove yet again they don't know how to set up bows.


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## c_m_shooter (Aug 15, 2018)

Post a picture of what you are doing now. Index finger should be against lower jaw. You move the peep as described above after you have established good anchor. Just line the string up with the riser and shoot around the peep for now.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> And if possible, avoid Cabelas for any work done on your bow. Go to an actual archery shop. If they were willing to set your peep without following this procedure, then they prove yet again they don't know how to set up bows.


The issue was timing and my local Archery World having poor customer service so went to Cabela's mostly out of spite. As usual, I showed "them"... I do have a better shop about an hour away that I fully intend on going to when schedule allows.


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> The issue was timing and my local Archery World having poor customer service so went to Cabela's mostly out of spite. As usual, I showed "them"... I do have a better shop about an hour away that I fully intend on going to when schedule allows.


Where are you located?


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

c_m_shooter said:


> Post a picture of what you are doing now. Index finger should be against lower jaw. You move the peep as described above after you have established good anchor. Just line the string up with the riser and shoot around the peep for now.


When I get home in 3.5ish hours I'll get some picks up.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> Where are you located?


Lacey, Washington. Archery World about 15 minutes from the house. Skookum Archery about 50-60 minutes away. Only places I know of.


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> Lacey, Washington. Archery World about 15 minutes from the house. Skookum Archery about 50-60 minutes away. Only places I know of.


I thought so. O'Connell's Archery is a lot closer to you. Just north of Shelton, on Hwy 3. Just opened in July. And yeah, Archery World kinda sucks.

What bow do you have?









O'Connell Archery, LLC


NOW OPEN!!!



www.oconnellarchery.com


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> Lacey, Washington. Archery World about 15 minutes from the house. Skookum Archery about 50-60 minutes away. Only places I know of.


I used to drive down to Lucky Shot in Chehalis before O'Connell's opened.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> I thought so. O'Connell's Archery is a lot closer to you. Just north of Shelton, on Hwy 3. Just opened in July. And yeah, Archery World kinda sucks.
> 
> What bow do you have?
> 
> ...


Oh I will check O'connell's out for sure! I have an Archery Republic Alliance bow. 44" ATA designed for finger shooters.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> I used to drive down to Lucky Shot in Chehalis before O'Connell's opened.


Lucky Shot is about 15 minutes closer to me, do you recommend O'Connell's more?


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> Lucky Shot is about 15 minutes closer to me, do you recommend O'Connell's more?


That's rough, I think that Lucky Shot is a great shop, and I've had a lot of work done there and bought several bows. They even have an indoor range that's open year round.

On the other hand, I actually help out at O'Connell's (because it's only 15 min from my house), so there's that. Really, though I wouldn't steer you away from Lucky Shot, but would love to even just have you check out O'Connell's.

I can say that neither of us carry Archery Republic bows.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> That's rough, I think that Lucky Shot is a great shop, and I've had a lot of work done there and bought several bows. They even have an indoor range that's open year round.
> 
> On the other hand, I actually help out at O'Connell's (because it's only 15 min from my house), so there's that. Really, though I wouldn't steer you away from Lucky Shot, but would love to even just have you check out O'Connell's.
> 
> I can say that neither of us carry Archery Republic bows.


Unless the universe dictates otherwise, I'll check out O'Connell's tomorrow after work. I'll be there probably around 4:30-5 depending on traffic. Kind of excited!

The only reason my group and I do anything with Archery World is it's location and indoor range. The guys at the pro shop are cool but very...anti fingers for lack of a better term. Maybe better to say they're kind of closed minded to what they aren't into? Awesome people to talk to at the range and hang out with while shooting. When I brought them my new bow, they wouldn't touch it without manufacturers instructions on how to adjust draw length. Others in my group have had issues with them too with simple things like getting into a release aid and what was charged for work.


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> Unless the universe dictates otherwise, I'll check out O'Connell's tomorrow after work. I'll be there probably around 4:30-5 depending on traffic. Kind of excited!
> 
> The only reason my group and I do anything with Archery World is it's location and indoor range. The guys at the pro shop are cool but very...anti fingers for lack of a better term. Maybe better to say they're kind of closed minded to what they aren't into? Awesome people to talk to at the range and hang out with while shooting. When I brought them my new bow, they wouldn't touch it without manufacturers instructions on how to adjust draw length. Others in my group have had issues with them too with simple things like getting into a release aid and what was charged for work.


It's tough. Most non-trad archers don't use fingers so that's an issue you may find every where. O'Connell's owner, Neal, just started doing trad himself, and has pretty much been a compound shooter, so finger shooting is not really a known quantity. It's a family owned business so the feeling there is a lot more casual.

As far as adjusting the bow itself, I would rather a shop say that without a manual they won't work on it, as opposed to assuming they know what they're doing and screwing something up. With all the different bow manufacturers we carry, we always refer to manufacturer instructions when we first work on a bow. Every one is different, and how you adjust one is not necessarily how you adjust another. The tough part is that you are dealing with a custom shop bow that has no dealers outside CA. Finding anyone that's going to know how to work on it without manufacturer instructions is going to be difficult.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> It's tough. Most non-trad archers don't use fingers so that's an issue you may find every where. O'Connell's owner, Neal, just started doing trad himself, and has pretty much been a compound shooter, so finger shooting is not really a known quantity. It's a family owned business so the feeling there is a lot more casual.
> 
> As far as adjusting the bow itself, I would rather a shop say that without a manual they won't work on it, as opposed to assuming they know what they're doing and screwing something up. With all the different bow manufacturers we carry, we always refer to manufacturer instructions when we first work on a bow. Every one is different, and how you adjust one is not necessarily how you adjust another. The tough part is that you are dealing with a custom shop bow that has no dealers outside CA. Finding anyone that's going to know how to work on it without manufacturer instructions is going to be difficult.


As someone who always seems to gravitate towards unique things I get that. Maybe I got lucky-ish at Cabela's as far as adjusting draw length goes. The guy was excited to tackle something new to him and he showed me a little bit of how it works so I can hopefully pass it on. Honestly if I had a bow press, I would do it myself. Never been afraid to dig in to something new and I'm more than confident in my hands to achieve greatness and more often to thoroughly screw something up and then learn how to fix.


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> As someone who always seems to gravitate towards unique things I get that. Maybe I got lucky-ish at Cabela's as far as adjusting draw length goes. The guy was excited to tackle something new to him and he showed me a little bit of how it works so I can hopefully pass it on. Honestly if I had a bow press, I would do it myself. Never been afraid to dig in to something new and I'm more than confident in my hands to achieve greatness and more often to thoroughly screw something up and then learn how to fix.


The Cabelas guys don't know enough to be worried about screwing stuff up. We get a lot of business from them, as well as Sportsman's in Silverdale and lately, Archery World. My first bow came from Cabelas, and 6 months later took it to Lucky Shot to get it properly tuned. They spend over an hour getting at shoot properly. The bow was massively out of spec, out of tune and massive cam lean. We ended up replacing the strings and cables and finally got it shooting bullets.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> The Cabelas guys don't know enough to be worried about screwing stuff up. We get a lot of business from them, as well as Sportsman's in Silverdale and lately, Archery World. My first bow came from Cabelas, and 6 months later took it to Lucky Shot to get it properly tuned. They spend over an hour getting at shoot properly. The bow was massively out of spec, out of tune and massive cam lean. We ended up replacing the strings and cables and finally got it shooting bullets.


Hopefully y'all aren't too busy tomorrow early evening. Maybe get me a little more dialed in.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

Here are some pics. One with my old bow and then one with my new one. Critique away!


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> Here are some pics. One with my old bow and then one with my new one. Critique away!


Not knowing finger style shooting, to an untrained eye it looks like your head is angled up to find the peep. Doesn't look natural. Also looks like you're holding the bow high. Should be able to run a straight line across the shoulder and to the bow.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

Totally nailed the peep misalignment! Drawing with eyes closed has the peep sitting at least a half inch low.


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## c_m_shooter (Aug 15, 2018)

When I shot finger compound I anchored my index finger under my jaw 3 under. ( I actually dropped the 3rd ring finger once at anchor, so 2 under] It was the only way to get enough sight elevation for long shots. Some of the split finger shooters will use middle finger under the jaw, which is basically the same. I still think you should ignore the peep for now.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

c_m_shooter said:


> When I shot finger compound I anchored my index finger under my jaw 3 under. ( I actually dropped the 3rd ring finger once at anchor, so 2 under] It was the only way to get enough sight elevation for long shots. Some of the split finger shooters will use middle finger under the jaw, which is basically the same. I still think you should ignore the peep for now.


I shoot 3 under as well. As far as anchor goes, I've been most comfortable tucking my thumb into my palm and then using the "shelf" part of the thumb between the knuckles to tuck under my jaw. Feels easy and very repeatable. Looking at my hand, if I tucked index finger, it would bring the rear of the arrow down another 1/8th inch or so witch is what I'm looking for as far as sight elevation so will try this as well. Thank you!


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

c_m_shooter said:


> When I shot finger compound I anchored my index finger under my jaw 3 under. ( I actually dropped the 3rd ring finger once at anchor, so 2 under] It was the only way to get enough sight elevation for long shots. Some of the split finger shooters will use middle finger under the jaw, which is basically the same. I still think you should ignore the peep for now.


Took a bit to sink in...Are you saying I don't need a peep? It makes sense if I anchor the same every single time and the arrow is held like it is via nock ring that the peep would be obsolete. My brain is hung up on the need of a rear sight but if the rear of the weapon is held the exact same every time, I guess you don't really need it.


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## c_m_shooter (Aug 15, 2018)

You can add it later if you want. You will still need to be aware of the string blur to check alignment. Olympic recurves reach way out there without one. I assume with the level of bow you have, you are planning to shoot field, and will need enough sight elevation to get to the 80 yard bale.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

c_m_shooter said:


> You can add it later if you want. You will still need to be aware of the string blur to check alignment. Olympic recurves reach way out there without one. I assume with the level of bow you have, you are planning to shoot field, and will need enough sight elevation to get to the 80 yard bale.


Yeah more distance would be the eventual goal. Current range restraints keep me at a 30 yard max. The longer distance range is outdoor and being in Washington, means the group will only shoot there in the summer month or 2 when it's not wet.


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> Yeah more distance would be the eventual goal. Current range restraints keep me at a 30 yard max. The longer distance range is outdoor and being in Washington, means the group will only shoot there in the summer month or 2 when it's not wet.


Lucky Shot's indoor reaches 40. It's also a barn, so not as fancy and warm as Archery World's.


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## c_m_shooter (Aug 15, 2018)

Your next challenge will be arrow tuning. You will need arrows with about a 5 lb weaker dynamic spine compared to release shooters. Most shops have forgot this. You will need to bareshaft group tune at 20 yards with a solid plunger, then do a walk back to tune the plunger spring. Stiff arrows are going to further and further left as you back up.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> Lucky Shot's indoor reaches 40. It's also a barn, so not as fancy and warm as Archery World's.


In our group of 4, 2 live in Olympia, 1 in Tacoma, and myself in Lacey. We agreed to do Archery World during rainy days and Skookum during dry warmer days. Lucky Shot will happen a time or 2 I'm sure but we're trying not to have anyone driving too far as we are trying to keep our weekly shooting to the early Sunday mornings. Now beyond the weekly meet ups, I know I will go to other places by myself after work unless the honey do list gets a little long. Also for some reason unknown to me, my wife like to spend time with me, super weird! She owns a bow but got bored with it, not really for her.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

c_m_shooter said:


> Your next challenge will be arrow tuning. You will need arrows with about a 5 lb weaker dynamic spine compared to release shooters. Most shops have forgot this. You will need to bareshaft group tune at 20 yards with a solid plunger, then do a walk back to tune the plunger spring. Stiff arrows are going to further and further left as you back up.


All I've read on arrow tuning sounds like I first need to be able to put an arrow where I want it almost every shot? Still working on super consistency. I can still shoot a dozen arrows at the same target without damaging them so I don't think I'm quite there yet. I do fully intend on trying it out at some point though.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Sivi70980 said:


> Here are some pics. One with my old bow and then one with my new one. Critique away!


Arrow is pointing downhill.
You are leaning WAY backwards.
Head is tilted backwards, to get string to touch nose.
So, your head/neck is pointing UPHILL, chin is up SKY HIGH, while arrow is pointing DOWNHILL.

Need head/neck looking parallel to where arrow is pointing, so arrow DOWNHILL, get chin LOW enough, so HEAD is also pointing DOWNHILL.

WHY is chin up SKY HIGH?
So, you can get string to touch nose.

WHY is head pointing UP HILL, when arrow is pointing DOWNHILL?
cuz the draw is way WRONG, the draw length is WAY too long
and you are MASSIVELY out of position.










Get a form photo with the arrow DEAD LEVEL, parallel to the horizontal lines on your garage door.
THEN, with a DEAD LEVEL arrow, we can tell you how many INCHES to cut the draw shorter.

What's the big deal with leaning backwards, when shooting compound FINGERS?
Who cares if my head is tilted backwards, with chin sky high, when my arrow is pointing downhill,
when shooting FINGERS compound?

Cuz, your CURRENT form, you will NEVER hold steady, and will ALWAYS miss high or miss low.
Well, how do YOU know what works and what don't work for FINGERS compound?
I coached the senior womens barebow compound to a championship (she won) for fingers compound field archery.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

nuts&bolts said:


> Cuz, your CURRENT form, you will NEVER hold steady, and will ALWAYS miss high or miss low.
> Well, how do YOU know what works and what don't work for FINGERS compound?
> I coached the senior womens barebow compound to a championship (she won) for fingers compound field archery.


Completely true!! I fight to hold steady like crazy. Push through fatigue to shoot about 1.5 hours every Sunday morning. Thank you so much for your input!

How do I "train" my body to make the needed adjustments? I'm going to a pro shop tonight to see if they can help too and hopefully adjust some bow settings. I am currently holding a dumbbell outstretched several times a night to build strength to better hold this new heavier bow too.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Sivi70980 said:


> Completely true!! I fight to hold steady like crazy. Push through fatigue to shoot about 1.5 hours every Sunday morning. Thank you so much for your input!
> 
> How do I "train" my body to make the needed adjustments? I'm going to a pro shop tonight to see if they can help too and hopefully adjust some bow settings. I am currently holding a dumbbell outstretched several times a night to build strength to better hold this new heavier bow too.


Practice T-form. You don't need to hold a dumb bell outstretched.
SERIOUS.

If you wear sunglasses, drop your chin lower until the arm on the sunglasses are parallel to the arrow.
PRACTICE full draw, with a LEVEL bow arm, with a LEVEL arrow.
Get middle of target high enough, so bullseye is at YOUR shoulder height.

When the bow draw module is sized SHORT enough (go in the SHORTER direction),
your hands come closer together.

The string will move CLOSER to your bow hand, and when the bow module is SHORT enough,
you can have string touching nose, with head NOT TILTED backwards.

The bow weight wants to swing your bow arm DOWN, so your bow shoulder feels TIRED.
BUT, the string hand is pulling BACK on the bow. When the module size is SHORT enough,
the PULL on the string hand, balances out the weight of the bow pulling down on your bow arm.



You want to stand like this...just pretend he is shooting FINGERS.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Sivi70980 said:


> Completely true!! I fight to hold steady like crazy. Push through fatigue to shoot about 1.5 hours every Sunday morning. Thank you so much for your input!
> 
> How do I "train" my body to make the needed adjustments? I'm going to a pro shop tonight to see if they can help too and hopefully adjust some bow settings. I am currently holding a dumbbell outstretched several times a night to build strength to better hold this new heavier bow too.


1) drop the draw length module size 1-inch shorter than current.
2) with shorter draw module installed, stand like this.










3) have peep removed. It's in the wrong place.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

nuts&bolts said:


> 1) drop the draw length module size 1-inch shorter than current.
> 2) with shorter draw module installed, stand like this.
> 
> View attachment 7512316
> ...


Here is hopefully a better pic. Not as natural as I was focusing on getting the arrow level.

In other news, when the shop I visited tonight inspected and removed the peep…well here’s the pic of that. I guess we’ll revisit this when things get replaced and squared away.


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## nuts&bolts (Mar 25, 2005)

Sivi70980 said:


> Here is hopefully a better pic. Not as natural as I was focusing on getting the arrow level.
> 
> In other news, when the shop I visited tonight inspected and removed the peep…well here’s the pic of that. I guess we’ll revisit this when things get replaced and squared away.


Drop draw length module size 1-inch shorter.
Get string to tip of nose.
SWING hips away from the target, like this.










Belt buckle needs to swing towards right ankle, about 1.5-inches.
Instead of right leg vertical,
swing hips away from target, so legs are more like a pyramid.


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

Sivi70980 said:


> Here is hopefully a better pic. Not as natural as I was focusing on getting the arrow level.
> 
> In other news, when the shop I visited tonight inspected and removed the peep…well here’s the pic of that. I guess we’ll revisit this when things get replaced and squared away.


Glad we were able to catch that cut string before things went bad. I hope they take care of you. 

And it was nice to have you stop by. Cool getting to see bows we've never seen.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> Glad we were able to catch that cut string before things went bad. I hope they take care of you.
> 
> And it was nice to have you stop by. Cool getting to see bows we've never seen.


 Yeah what a great shop! Felt like home.

Yeah we’ll see what Cabela’s says tomorrow.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

Cabela's bought my string. Shipped yesterday so should have early next week. Busy and holidays the next 3 Saturdays. Man this sucks!! Going to be almost 2 months of not shooting my brand new bow because of my impatience and ****ty people doing ****ty work. Where's the time machine so I can slap my past self away from that stupid place? Venting a little, annoyed. Hope everyone has some great holidays, shoving this nugget into the depths of my brain so I too can enjoy time with friends and family.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

So I got everything all set up and first off, the bow is a dream to shoot. But when the sight is set to 20 yards, the riser interferes. The pin is behind where the riser splits as shown in the attached pic. It has to be me doing something wrong, I'll take some more form pics when I get a chance. Left the shop feeling like everything was set perfectly but when I got the the range yesterday and do the closed eyes draw, the peep is really high. I ended up adjusting the sight a bunch to try different ways to dial it in but always ran into the riser issue. Finally took the sight off and had an absolute blast shooting it barebow. The sight and peep issues with this bow have been the biggest headache to say the least. As it stands now, if I want to use the sight, I need to shoot at 40+ yards I think so the riser isn't blocking the pins view. I shot better without the sight than with it to include a bullseye. Not shooting groups with my new custom arrows so just a guesstimated grouping barebow of 18 inches or so. Not too bad for being the first time ever shooting without a sight.


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## DTrent90 (Dec 27, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> And if possible, avoid Cabelas for any work done on your bow. Go to an actual archery shop. If they were willing to set your peep without following this procedure, then they prove yet again they don't know how to set up bows.


I agree I'm completely new to this but the service I received at cabellas was absolutely terrible they measured me and said my draw length would be 30 inches which is not close. It was actually 26.5. when I got the an actual shop it was then I realized just how over priced and incompetent they were. Not saying this is the case everywhere just this particular location was pretty bad.


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## VeritasHunter (May 4, 2020)

DTrent90 said:


> I agree I'm completely new to this but the service I received at cabellas was absolutely terrible they measured me and said my draw length would be 30 inches which is not close. It was actually 26.5. when I got the an actual shop it was then I realized just how over priced and incompetent they were. Not saying this is the case everywhere just this particular location was pretty bad.


Rarely hear of good, competent work coming out of Cabela's/Bass Pro.


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## DTrent90 (Dec 27, 2021)

VeritasHunter said:


> Rarely hear of good, competent work coming out of Cabela's/Bass Pro.


Yea man. Like I said once I got to a shop and they started talking I immediately realized they don't care about the art. Just the sale and if they do shoot, they're not the ones to be taking advice from.


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## Sivi70980 (Oct 25, 2021)

DTrent90 said:


> Yea man. Like I said once I got to a shop and they started talking I immediately realized they don't care about the art. Just the sale and if they do shoot, they're not the ones to be taking advice from.


Lesson learned for sure. It's nice to have a shop I can trust now. All I need to do now is keep shooting like crazy. I will say it is very hard to put this thing down. So far my fastest 20 minute range day was 1.5 hours. Just one more end...okay last one...okay this is the last one...


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