# Congrats to ASA for moving and changing the pro ranges



## goofy2788 (Aug 14, 2005)

Their Pros for a reason....they didn't get there by cheating.


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## WDMJR3DBOWGUY (Dec 2, 2003)

goofy2788 said:


> Their Pros for a reason....they didn't get there by cheating.


Yes they are pros, but numbers are shared. It's a shame but it DOES happen. I personally liked what they did in Augusta. No one knew until after the rounds were over, next morning.


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## 3Dblackncamo (Jul 22, 2009)

I also like it, great surprise


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

goofy2788 said:


> Their Pros for a reason....they didn't get there by cheating.


When money involved and there a way to cheat often it happens. Best for ASSC. to do all they can to prevent any way they can.
DB


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

WDMJR3DBOWGUY said:


> Yes they are pros, but numbers are shared. It's a shame but it DOES happen. I personally liked what they did in Augusta. No one knew until after the rounds were over, next morning.


Talk to many and they were delighted with it. Just makes good sense!
DB


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## hrtlnd164 (Mar 22, 2008)

The IBO has started to switch the ranges before the last 10 on Sunday on the pro and semi courses. There are always going to be rumors when someone is winning. The pros are good enough to make comebacks on the last day and are prooving it even with the changes. Not trying to start anything but we should be applauding there effort instead of pointing fingers. JMO


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

hrtlnd164 said:


> The IBO has started to switch the ranges before the last 10 on Sunday on the pro and semi courses. There are always going to be rumors when someone is winning. The pros are good enough to make comebacks on the last day and are prooving it even with the changes. Not trying to start anything but we should be applauding there effort instead of pointing fingers. JMO



Take any doubt out of it. Only makes good sense. We all know pros are good but dont make it possiable to have it happen. 
DB


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## 3dfevr#1 (Dec 1, 2008)

Well said Dan. Yes it could happen, and if the perception is there, it isn't fair to the winners.


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

3dfevr#1 said:


> Well said Dan. Yes it could happen, and if the perception is there, it isn't fair to the winners.


For 3d to grow it got to be done with fairness and elimanant any chance of any one being able to cheat at all costs.
DB


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## cenochs (May 2, 2007)

Daniel Boone said:


> For 3d to grow it got to be done with fairness and elimanant any chance of any one being able to cheat at all costs.
> DB


I agree with 100% DB fair warning don't give your opinion on how other organizations may improve to promote the sport toward a level playing field or you may get bashed!!


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## KTMRacer (Dec 21, 2006)

goofy2788 said:


> Their Pros for a reason....they didn't get there by cheating.


Then it shouldnt affect them in the least bit.:wink:


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## Babyk (Jul 5, 2011)

Why post this now DB....do you have inside knowlege about this topic? We all know it happens. If it didn't you be seeing pros blowing up after the last 10 targets in IBO

changing the targets is only fair and real way to ensure it doesn't happen or can't happen. 

Good post DB


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## bhtr3d (Feb 13, 2004)

Don't need inside info....It's been happening throughout the year


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

Babyk said:


> Why post this now DB....do you have inside knowlege about this topic? We all know it happens. If it didn't you be seeing pros blowing up after the last 10 targets in IBO
> 
> changing the targets is only fair and real way to ensure it doesn't happen or can't happen.
> 
> Good post DB


Been a big topic among pro class this year and hopefully it can be corrected. Just discussion. Pro class should lead by 
example and want this and keep striving for rules for complete fairness.
DB
DB


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## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

this thread is like a visit from the ghost of OneBowTie...i know there's something going on here, but danged if i can figure it out. guess i'll have to turn pro to figure it out though.


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

carlosii said:


> this thread is like a visit from the ghost of OneBowTie...i know there's something going on here, but danged if i can figure it out. guess i'll have to turn pro to figure it out though.


Doesnt matter if pro or amatuers. If there a better way. Who said anything going on? But remove any doubt of it happening.
DB


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## keb73 (Oct 15, 2003)

if this is too cryptic,let's be more literal.."Chatter" among the PROs about Sam and Levi sharing..(Since the spirit of OBT was evoked,I just _had_ to capitalize P-R-O)..

Could just be a case of sour grapes since he pretty much dominates..


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

keb73 said:


> if this is too cryptic,let's be more literal.."Chatter" among the PROs about Sam and Levi sharing..(Since the spirit of OBT was evoked,I just _had_ to capitalize P-R-O)..


Last time I checked the rules are for everyone. Buddies or anyone. I think there more than a few friends and buddies on these circuits. Could be a case of fairness as well. 
DB


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## field14 (May 21, 2002)

Just off the cuff, guys....BUT.....even with changing the ranges at the last minute...there is still the...>CELL PHONE ISSUE, iPod, texting.....?????

Not sayin'....but if they're available and can be turned on....somebody is gonna.... COMMUNICATION DEVICES of ANY kind should NOT be on the courses during competition, PERIOD.

field14 (Tom D.)


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

field14 said:


> Just off the cuff, guys....BUT.....even with changing the ranges at the last minute...there is still the...>CELL PHONE ISSUE, iPod, texting.....?????
> 
> Not sayin'....but if they're available and can be turned on....somebody is gonna.... COMMUNICATION DEVICES of ANY kind should NOT be on the courses during competition, PERIOD.
> 
> field14 (Tom D.)


Totally agree cell phones should not be allowed on the range.
DB


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## absolutecool (Mar 26, 2006)

I have seen people walking targets back too..don't know how all the cheating will ever be stopped...with that many shooters and that few of range officials things are gonna happen.

I have done my best to 'stare down' the person doing the walking back, I think the person knew I knew what was going on but it won't ever stop.


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

absolutecool said:


> I have seen people walking targets back too..don't know how all the cheating will ever be stopped...with that many shooters and that few of range officials things are gonna happen.
> 
> I have done my best to 'stare down' the person doing the walking back, I think the person knew I knew what was going on but it won't ever stop.


Walk back not a big deal. Targets all ready shot! Unless you can read minds there no way to enforce it. I dont think it should even be a RULE. But if there anything to do that garantee fairness its an easy option to do, then do it. Ask the archers to vote on it or have the rules committee make the call along with tournament director.
DB


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## absolutecool (Mar 26, 2006)

Daniel Boone said:


> Walk back not a big deal. Targets all ready shot! Unless you can read minds there no way to enforce it. I dont think it should even be a RULE. But if there anything to do that garantee fairness its an easy option to do, then do it. Ask the archers to vote on it or have the rules committee make the call along with tournament director.
> DB


I am talking about walking back after looking at the next target to be shot....judging and walking back then shooting it after you have walked back...not so cool...


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

absolutecool said:


> I am talking about walking back after looking at the next target to be shot....judging and walking back then shooting it after you have walked back...not so cool...


Pros swap ever other target that avoids this. Sometimes targets are so close together you would have to be a blind person to not see the one next to you. I really think shooting ever other target would be a good rule for everone. Those are just hard rules to enforce.
DB


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## t8ter (Apr 7, 2003)

If you and your spouse made a living at this how could the thought of discussing yardage not cross your mind.Sharing info on a target could be the difference between living in the in laws basement or a nice home.Just saying it would have to cross your mind.
Me myself I think that rumor is sour grapes.I could see other reasons the ranges were swapped.


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## Droptine (Feb 10, 2003)

Cell phones are the big problem. People on them all the time texting other shooters to see how they are doing. I dont take mine at all.


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## carlosii (Feb 25, 2007)

i guess the geezers aren't that up on technology. i have yet to see one of the folks in my class using a cell for anything while on the range.


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

Droptine said:


> Cell phones are the big problem. People on them all the time texting other shooters to see how they are doing. I dont take mine at all.


I have seen it in are classes. Not saying anyone using for that purpose but it would be nice to put them away during the shoot.
DB


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## CutTheLoop (Dec 26, 2007)

field14 said:


> Just off the cuff, guys....BUT.....even with changing the ranges at the last minute...there is still the...>CELL PHONE ISSUE, iPod, texting.....?????
> 
> Not sayin'....but if they're available and can be turned on....somebody is gonna.... COMMUNICATION DEVICES of ANY kind should NOT be on the courses during competition, PERIOD.
> 
> field14 (Tom D.)


Agree 100%


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## Bubba Dean (Jun 2, 2005)

This is what the ASA staff does at every shoot. On Friday after the team shoot the four ranges that are used for the team shoot are reset. On Saturday(or after the Pros first round) both the Pro ranges are reset. On the Pro range by reset I mean some targets moved, some stakes moved and sometimes additional yardage is cut to add to a lane. All this talk about Pro sharing yardages is great but knowing what I know I wouldn't want to shoot the second round for the yardage someone told me it is.


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## J Whittington (Nov 13, 2009)

And when/ if they do catch someone cheating (sharing yardages, FALSIFYING score cards,pinky swearing) they should be DQed, and suspended, regardless of who they are ( or who they think they are lol)


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## Daniel Boone (May 31, 2002)

Why would you not change the rules to give everyone a fair playing field. Rules have been changed alot sense 3d started and all to give archers a fair playing field. Needs to continue in the future. 
DB


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## Rush (May 16, 2005)

I'd have to agree, I think the targets should be moved around more on the last day.


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## VeroShooter (Jul 14, 2005)

J Whittington said:


> And when/ if they do catch someone cheating (sharing yardages, FALSIFYING score cards,pinky swearing) they should be DQed, and suspended, regardless of who they are ( or who they think they are lol)


I've seen a couple of your posts where you throw out innuendos like you know something that the rest of the world doesn't. Why don't you just say what you mean. This thread was about resetting yardages on the pro range.


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## shootist (Aug 28, 2003)

*...*



field14 said:


> Just off the cuff, guys....BUT.....even with changing the ranges at the last minute...there is still the...>CELL PHONE ISSUE, iPod, texting.....?????
> 
> Not sayin'....but if they're available and can be turned on....somebody is gonna.... COMMUNICATION DEVICES of ANY kind should NOT be on the courses during competition, PERIOD.
> 
> field14 (Tom D.)


In the Georgia ASA this year, they had us semis on the pro range on Sunday. I witnessed a range official give an official warning to a pro who had his cell phone out. I think he was showing somebody a photo of it, and he tried to claim it was a picture viewer, not a cell phone, but she pressed him on it until he admitted it and put it away with his warning. I was glad to see this, as I see multiple cell phones being used every tournament I attend. I have never suspected anyone I watched do anything as far as text yardages back and forth, but there is a rule in place and it should be enforced. It almost needs to be shooter enforced (at least with a courteous "please put that away") because it would be impossible for the range officials to see everything as it happens.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Well, seems everyone is agreeable about no use of cell phones, period. Now get on the ASA forum and submit it for a rule. Heck, I'll do it. Go look.

http://asaforum.com/index.php?topic=7110.0


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## XForce Girl (Feb 14, 2008)

SonnyThomas said:


> Well, seems everyone is agreeable about no use of cell phones, period. Now get on the ASA forum and submit it for a rule. Heck, I'll do it. Go look.
> 
> http://asaforum.com/index.php?topic=7110.0


I thought it was a rule already, when I was in Augusta they had signs posted reminding everyone that cell phones were NOT allowed.


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## shootist (Aug 28, 2003)

SonnyThomas said:


> Well, seems everyone is agreeable about no use of cell phones, period. Now get on the ASA forum and submit it for a rule. Heck, I'll do it. Go look.
> 
> http://asaforum.com/index.php?topic=7110.0


_"H. As a courtesy to fellow competitors there will be no talking to spectators or other groups while other competitors in the group are shooting. The use of cell phones is prohibited during competition and cell phones and pagers are to be turned off. A shooter will receive a warning from the group for the first offense. The penalty for the second offense is a deduction of five points from target score, and each subsequent offense will receive a score of zero."_

The quote above is from the ASA Rule book, so there is already a rule in place. Enforcement is the difficulty. The group is to enforce it, but that is rarely done.


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## reylamb (Feb 5, 2003)

shootist said:


> In the Georgia ASA this year, they had us semis on the pro range on Sunday. I witnessed a range official give an official warning to a pro who had his cell phone out. I think he was showing somebody a photo of it, and he tried to claim it was a picture viewer, not a cell phone, but she pressed him on it until he admitted it and put it away with his warning. I was glad to see this, as I see multiple cell phones being used every tournament I attend. I have never suspected anyone I watched do anything as far as text yardages back and forth, but there is a rule in place and it should be enforced. It almost needs to be shooter enforced (at least with a courteous "please put that away") because it would be impossible for the range officials to see everything as it happens.


Sandy does not take too much nonsense on her ranges, that is for sure.


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## SonnyThomas (Sep 10, 2006)

Then the talking spoken of was done within the group and no one in the group complained?


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## hrtlnd164 (Mar 22, 2008)

In my first post I was just saying that the IBO is taking some measures to prevent numbers sharing but the winners are still winning. I totally agree that there needs to be a level playing field but in my opinion until the IBO puts range officials out on the courses to enforce the already un-enforced rules, things won't be better. Few shooters will ruin their weekend of shooting by being THE ONE that calls a rule enfraction on their group. ASA's format and target layout allows officials to see alot of the action around the course, IBO's strung out courses really don't. I enjoy shooting any big venue shoot and want to see things move in a positive direction.


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## Babyk (Jul 5, 2011)

No cell phones on the range
i shot a 8 low and shot the target for 37yds and made a good soild shot and can tell my buddy whos behind me to shoot it for more than 37yds

not really fair there


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## VeroShooter (Jul 14, 2005)

There is already a defined rule of absolutely no cell phones on the ranges. If you see someone with a cell phone they are breaking a rule and at that point it becomes your responsibility to report it.


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## TAYLOR CO. (Jun 9, 2005)

WDMJR3DBOWGUY said:


> Yes they are pros, but numbers are shared. It's a shame but it DOES happen. I personally liked what they did in Augusta. No one knew until after the rounds were over, next morning.


You should know Mike! Good Job! LOL


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## J Whittington (Nov 13, 2009)

IBO needs to do more about a leveling the playing field with the ranges!!!! Why they wont set the ranges where everyone (semi's and all pros) start at the same time is beyond me. Nelsonville perfect example. My group shot at 8:30 am. first target was a turk...sun in your eyes, turkey in a dark hole, we're standing in a field...could not see anything, no lines etc. 

Why IBO refuses to start everyone at the same time is beyond me. dont say its not feesable, ASA does it at every event... and the numberof participants at the ASA (for semi and all pros) and IBO is about equal.


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## rhyno_071 (Feb 22, 2009)

Nice post. A real eye opener.


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## hrtlnd164 (Mar 22, 2008)

J Whittington said:


> IBO needs to do more about a leveling the playing field with the ranges!!!! Why they wont set the ranges where everyone (semi's and all pros) start at the same time is beyond me. Nelsonville perfect example. My group shot at 8:30 am. first target was a turk...sun in your eyes, turkey in a dark hole, we're standing in a field...could not see anything, no lines etc.
> 
> Why IBO refuses to start everyone at the same time is beyond me. dont say its not feesable, ASA does it at every event... and the numberof participants at the ASA (for semi and all pros) and IBO is about equal.



Our group shot this at 9:40 and still couldn't see it. Everyone can't shoot the same target at the same time so conditions are going to change regardless through a round. Really don't know what the answer is to this one. Outdoor shoots won't be the same conditions on every target.


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## 12sonly (Jan 6, 2007)

i will always carry my cell phone set on vibrate.i have a son shooting and my father in law has had some health prolbems in the past.i want either one of them to be able to contact me if something was to happen.i want answer any other calls while i am on the range.


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