# Instinctive shooting accuracy



## Lumis17 (Jun 9, 2003)

Here's a little description of different shooting styles.

http://tradmall.infopop.cc/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=255000875&f=545007185&m=415007276&r=415007276#415007276


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## ghostdog (Nov 23, 2003)

Deerdander, I recently did some measuring to find out how far I was shooting. At about 15 yards and under a pop can doesn't have a chance. About 18 to 22 yards I would say 75% of shots are within 3 inches of a target about 1 inch diameter. That would be a 6 inch spread.

At 30 yards and 35 yards my group is probably 12 inches to 16 inches across with maybe half being in the kill zone. But I am getting better.

And every now and then I have a flyer or if I lean my head in one goes low.

I have never had a "Robin Hood" yet but I do break nocks and I often am pulling 2 arrows out of the target at the same time because they are so tight to each other.

And every now and then I have a really bad day. That seems to happen if I shoot every day. If I take a day off every few days I seem to do better. But it is hard to take a day off. I would stay out there all day if I could. I really enjoy shooting.

I am shooting a Howatt/Martin Bushmaster longbow, 55 pounds @ 28 and I pull about 28.5. 

gd


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## Smoke (Feb 4, 2003)

I just started shooting trad about a week and a half ago so I'm still experimenting. I like the idea of gap shooting but my bow doesn't seem to want to tune with a 3 under release and for some reason I'm much more comfortable anchoring my forefinger rather than my index finger on my upper eye tooth. This makes gap shooting pretty dang near impossible (for me anyway).

So until my next bow arrives that will hopefully be tillered close enough to allow me to shoot 3 under I just concentrate as hard as possible on the spot I want to hit and make sure that as I draw the arrow is lined up with that spot even though once I reach full draw the arrow is so far under my point of concentration I'm not really aware of it. Seems that as long as I'm consistant with my form my mind is developing some sort of mental picture that allows the arrow to hit in the right ball park a fair amount of the time. Occasionally it's almost erie how well they hit, but not very often 

I'm happy with my progress so far with this method but I'm certain a more precise gap/split vision method would be better if I could comfortably get the arrow closer to my eye. Right now I shoot around a 190 on a good day on a NFAA single spot at 20 yards with a combination of some pretty good 5 shot groups and a lot of REALLY bad 5 shot groups. 

Of course when I can shoot in the 280's or better with trad barebow I'll be a lot better qualified to give advice!


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## Lumis17 (Jun 9, 2003)

Smoke, you don't necessarily need to go 3-under to gap shoot. You can go split-fingers and just move your anchor higher up. Here's one way to higher anchor:
Put your thumb knuckle in your ear lobe. Touch the cock feather of the arrow to the tip of your nose. If its not too awkward you can touch the string to your eyebrow. 

If I didn't have glasses on I'd try to use this since I prefer split to 3-under and touching the feather to your nose and the string to your eyebrow gives you good alignment each shot.


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## AJ008 (Nov 20, 2002)

I've seen a kid shoot a 3-spot like he was shooting a compound and then the kids bother out did all the compound shooters in a 3-D match.


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## Seymour (Aug 25, 2003)

A competent Turkish archer of the 14th century was expected to keep all his shots inside a three foot circle at 75 yards. That translates to a nine to ten inch circle at 20 yards, about the size of the proverbial pie plate. 

When you consider that the Turkish archer was typically shooting from horseback under combat conditions, it should come as no surprise that a competent traditional archer standing on the ground under relatively calm range conditions using modern tackle ought to be able to halve that precision at any given range. At times the groups can be halved again. A two inch group at 20 yards isn't unheard of. I've shot them myself pretty frequently and have a few busted nocks and shaved feathers to prove it.

Of course if you don't practice at longer ranges, chances are you won't realize the accuracy at those ranges that you exhibit at shorter ranges. Therefore, it's important to practice at a variety of ranges. 

In most instances the bow will shoot far more accurately than you can hold. Typically, two inches at 20 yards equals the mechanical accuracy of a traditionally manufactured longbow. Traditional bows of more modern manufacture will shoot a tad more precise usually.


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## 45-70cannon (Feb 10, 2004)

*instinctive shooting*

Once again you have me thinking about my own habits. Being not that technical I have to think about it. Deerdander, I have three great words for you.

Ready? They are PRACTISE,PRACTISE, & PRACTISE.
When shooting instinctive, pay attention to where you are holding with each shot. that mental picture will take over until you are doing it automatically and you will remember where to hold AND you will know that the arrow is flying true as it leaves the shelf.

I always play a game when I set out to practise. I will shoot my first arrow and then I'll shoot my second arrow and wherever they hit on the target, I will shoot the remaining arrows between the first two. I used to do this at three D shoots to warm up and the criticisms I got because "I couldn't hit the heart lungs on the warm up target...ha-ha-ha" but they didn't understand what I was doing....until I went out and left them with their mouths open...having dusted their best scores by 60 odd points or so. THEN they understood. When I practise I shoot every arrow "on purpose" I don't just shoot them to see where they end up. Everything is done with a reason and the real game is putting the first arrow in the kill WITHOUT having to warm up to do it. then follow it with the second IF you need it. Do that at different yardages. You will hit everything you look at.

When you do things that way you take the "trying to hit the bull pressure" off yourself and can concentrate better on what you're doing. Also, you end up shooting tight groups.

I have Robin Hooded my own wood arrows using my sweetheart 70 Redman hunting bow. I still have the last one. I split it perfectly down the middle of the 11/32 shaft.
I chuckle when my compounder buddies tell me about their Robin Hooding arrows and i show them my perfectly split wood shaft.
I just let them know, whatever you can do, I can do (and usually better). Longbow shooters can outshoot compound shooters especially when the target is on the move.
Which brings up another story that I experienced some time ago, and i'll share with you at another time...if I remember!

Rich


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## Red dragon (Dec 23, 2003)

I do a lot of walk back shooting with my 21st Edge Longbow out to about 50yards, I use a Vegas face set on a black background, this helps me zone in (by the way I shoot split-vision) on a good day I can get them all on the Vegas face right back to fifty yards. It would be great if I could shoot that well in a tourney but with the pressure of competition and the unknown distances all starts to play a part in accuracy, still it's a great confidence booster to shoot that well in practice. It's shown me my own potential if nothing else.


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## dudley (Dec 10, 2003)

Deerdander,

I've been shooting since the middle of December. I went from shooting "shotgun" patterns to a consistant group. Out to about 25 yards, I'm grouping about 10-14". At ten yards I can only shoot one arrow at a time, and 15-20 yards I'm getting a 6-10" group almost all the time now. Practice is the key my friend! Shoot every day with a 56" Bear Grizzly, 55# @ 28". 

BTW, I shoot the "G. Fred Asbell" way... read his "Instinctive Shooting" book and watched Paul Brunner's "Instinctive Shooting" video. I also get a lot of advice from the fine folks here, www.tradmall.com, and www.tradgang.com, but the one on one with the guy's at the local club is, as Visa says, "PRICELESS"

Dudley


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## 45-70cannon (Feb 10, 2004)

Red dragon said:


> *I do a lot of walk back shooting with my 21st Edge Longbow out to about 50yards, I use a Vegas face set on a black background, this helps me zone in (by the way I shoot split-vision) on a good day I can get them all on the Vegas face right back to fifty yards.
> 
> 
> 
> It would be great if I could shoot that well in a tourney but with the pressure of competition and the unknown distances all starts to play a part in accuracy, still it's a great confidence booster to shoot that well in practice. It's shown me my own potential if nothing else. *


Actually, you can learn to do just that. You need to seriously concentrate on what you are doing and mentally "block" the others and the pressure out from your mind. Concentrate on you, because you know that you can do better. You know that you are a great shooter, and just disregard the other junk and the pressure associated with it. Think positive....think its a piece of cake, just like shooting back home. It will be, and you will do well.

45-70


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## Red dragon (Dec 23, 2003)

45-70cannon
It would be great if I could shoot at that level all the time, if I did I think I would out-shoot the Compounds. I'm happy with what I'm doing in tourneys, accepting that I wont shoot as well in torneys is just being realistic, still in 20 months of torneys I've picked up five National titles and out-shot the Recurves everytime, so I can't be doing too bad. I can still dream of beating the Componds oneday.
Good shooting


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## 45-70cannon (Feb 10, 2004)

beating the compounds is a well respected goal, and you already have the talent and ability to do it. It's what your brain is thinking at the time. If you have the belief in your mind and the feeling in your heart, you WILL beat them. if you have a small bit of doubt, then you won't. It is a worthy goal. 

45-70


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## Red dragon (Dec 23, 2003)

Thanks for the encouragement I will keep trying. 

I think it's important to shoot for yourself and not to try and beat your peers or even the class above you, that will only make you tense up, you can analyse that kind of thing after the tourney is over, I don't try and win, I just try and see if I can reach my potential on that day if I win, thats the icing on top, if I don't at least I did my best and was beaten by a better Man or the Course(these course builders are tricky over here).


I did beat the Compounds once, but I don't think it counts, it had more to do with the weather conditions, 40+mph winds on the North Yorkshire Moors, their arrows kept being blown off the rest, it was a challenge for everyone. I always keep a close eye on the weather conditions if I'm ever heading up that way again.


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## MontyFrank (Dec 11, 2020)

ghostdog said:


> Deerdander, I recently did some measuring to find out how far I was shooting. At about 15 yards and under a pop can doesn't have a chance. About 18 to 22 yards I would say 75% of shots are within 3 inches of a target about 1 inch diameter. That would be a 6 inch spread.
> 
> At 30 yards and 35 yards my group is probably 12 inches to 16 inches across with maybe half being in the kill zone. But I am getting better.
> 
> ...


Hey Ghostdog. How many arrows are shooting a day on average? Also, if you're comfortable how old are you? I used to shoot a #55 @28 in my 20s. Took a long break .. long story. Recently got a new bow again, it's #45. My draw length is 28.5 also. Gonna go up to #50. I'm 36 now. Just wondering how young you are pulling #55 repeatedly everyday. Cheers


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## Dartwick (Oct 28, 2019)

Um you just answered a 16 year old post,


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## 3D Archery (May 19, 2016)

How accurate can you be? Depends on what you call accurate?

As for aiming, there are "tricks" you can do that will help make shooting instinctive "easier". But like I said in the first line, doing some of those tricks my not be what you call instinctive.

As for me, I can shoot at 20 yards, using an NFAA target and average in the 250's and a high of 268. We shot in groups of five arrows. It has an eight-centimeter white five-ring – with a four-centimeter diameter X-ring. 

Now, the "big Boys' are in the 290's and compounds, if you miss the "X", you lost! The winners score 300 with 60 X's.


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## Yooper-travler (Feb 28, 2011)

Hey Monty, you better stay in 2004. 2020 isn't the best year to time travel to....................


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## lameduck (Jul 24, 2019)

Yooper-travler said:


> Hey Monty, you better stay in 2004. 2020 isn't the best year to time travel to....................


He only joined several hours ago, so he did not even exist back then.


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## MontyFrank (Dec 11, 2020)

Oh man! Yikes. So stupid. Sorry all.


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## Toxalot (Nov 17, 2019)

Back in the 60's and 70's we didn't think about our limitations as instinctive shooters, we worked on getting as good as we could out to field archery ranges, anywhere from the 20ft closest target to the 80 yard walkup. Our goal was to improve each shoot and the mark at that time for a good instinctive shooter was 400 points out of a possible 560. I did get to averageing over 400 and had a high of 480 in one shoot in 1978, and that was not string walking, it was one anchor and one hold on the string, that's all that was allowed in the bowhunter barebow class under PSAA rules. If you never shoot over 30 yards you will never get as could as you can be. After your form is solid it just becomes a mental game to maintain form and focus. I'm 74 years old, soon to be 75, and I routinely shoot sixty yards in my side yard to keep myself in shooting shape. You are only limited by you....nothing else. This was 3 years ago and with a 52" hunting bow.


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## ElederLyons (Dec 1, 2020)

All depends on how much you practice and what works for you. I've tried shooting gap but suck at it compared to instinctive.


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## 1canvas (Mar 29, 2009)

ghostdog said:


> Deerdander, I recently did some measuring to find out how far I was shooting. At about 15 yards and under a pop can doesn't have a chance. About 18 to 22 yards I would say 75% of shots are within 3 inches of a target about 1 inch diameter. That would be a 6 inch spread.


That‘s about where I’m at. I am a hunter and have no need to shoot over 20 yards.


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