# Binary Cam Lock Up, Need Advice



## ELKhuntR (Feb 5, 2006)

PUlling back the bow, Tribute with Binary Cam, it felt like the peg was set at 65% so I moved it no more than two lines, less than a quarter of an inch up for a little more valley, less wall, and drew it back. 
It locked up on me. CAn I fix this in a Bowmasters Portable bowpress and what exactly do I need to do. 

Any help would greatly be appreciated.


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## Hemingway (Sep 7, 2005)

RUUUUUNNNNN!!!!!


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## Dodgedude (Jan 29, 2005)

*read Dave Nowlin's post*

www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=218697


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## goldtip22 (Oct 14, 2004)

I'd call Bowtech. It's too risky to just take a chance and hope for the best.


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## bowhnter7 (Dec 6, 2004)

I didn't think you could do this on the 06 models, because of the draw stops that are on the mods, hitting the cables. Hmmmmmmmmmmm.


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## bigbuck280 (Jan 23, 2006)

ELKhuntR said:


> PUlling back the bow, Tribute with Binary Cam, it felt like the peg was set at 65% so I moved it no more than two lines, less than a quarter of an inch up for a little more valley, less wall, and drew it back.
> It locked up on me. CAn I fix this in a Bowmasters Portable bowpress and what exactly do I need to do.
> 
> Any help would greatly be appreciated.




CALL BOWTECH FIRST BEFORE YOU DO ANYTHING . ITS TOO DANGEROUS !!!


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## LeesburgGamecoc (May 25, 2004)

ELKhuntR said:


> PUlling back the bow, Tribute with Binary Cam, it felt like the peg was set at 65% so I moved it no more than two lines, less than a quarter of an inch up for a little more valley, less wall, and drew it back.
> It locked up on me. CAn I fix this in a Bowmasters Portable bowpress and what exactly do I need to do.
> 
> Any help would greatly be appreciated.


Post a pic and we can help you out. You can't normally do this on the '06 bows because of the new draw stops that hit the cables and serve as a back up to the primary draw stop peg, so something is wrong with the bow. Post a pic and we'll see what is going on, but something is very wrong, because the '06 cam prevents this from happening.


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## ELKhuntR (Feb 5, 2006)

that's what I thought. 
It's just my luck. I love Bowtech's regardless but this happened to me on my first allegiance. That was definitely my fault. This one however, I thought the same thing as you all. I didn't think it could be done on the 06 models and I barely even moved the post. 

Kind of strange.
I'd take a picture but the thing is kind of like a time bomb waiting to go off.


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## Greg / MO (Nov 19, 2003)

e-mail Pat Dinan who handles all of BowTech's technical questions via the web at [email protected]


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## Dave Nowlin (May 21, 2003)

When these things lock up they can be very sensitive. You can bump one just right and it will dry fire. In order to use the Bowmaster and set it up your fingers will be very close to the cams. Should it dry fire while you are doing this you will definitely get hurt. You need to put it in a conventional press and be very careful in doing so as several have dry fired while attempting this. The usual end result is both limbs get destroyed and possibly damage to cams and cables. Proceed with extreme caution.
Dave Nowlin


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## NM_HighPlains (Nov 25, 2005)

Excuse my dumb question, but what is "lock-up"? I've never heard of this until I started reading these forums and haven't seen a good explanation yet. 

Can a Hoyt Cam/2 "lock-up"?


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## ZA206 (Oct 28, 2004)

*Yup!*

What Dave said. Get it in a bench top rest at your local dealer and stand back as you guys start cranking down on the limbs.... it could go off with the change in geometry during the press (if not locked down solid in the press). I would NOT reccommend doing it with a bowmaster for the reason Dave states above.

Good luck.

-ZA




Dave Nowlin said:


> When these things lock up they can be very sensitive. You can bump one just right and it will dry fire. In order to use the Bowmaster and set it up your fingers will be very close to the cams. Should it dry fire while you are doing this you will definitely get hurt. You need to put it in a conventional press and be very careful in doing so as several have dry fired while attempting this. The usual end result is both limbs get destroyed and possibly damage to cams and cables. Proceed with extreme caution.
> Dave Nowlin


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## deermaster (Feb 4, 2005)

could'nt somone hold the string, and another press it w/ the bowmaster, so when it releases, the other could ease down with the string?


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## Techy (Nov 8, 2004)

I would not reccommend this, but this is what someone I know did. His alliegance locked up (his mistake). He was all alone at home, so he held the string and put is foot on the handle (kind of like drawing a crossbow) and slowed rotated one of the cams. he said it was very easy, but he is a pretty big guy.


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## 383bull (Dec 30, 2005)

I had a new allegiance lock up on me but it was my fault, I was changing out the mods, between smooth and fast and different draw legths, anyways I put one mod in, I think it was the top and forgot to put in the bottom mod, and I drew it back and it locked up, I grabbed the bow by the string put it on the floor, put my foot on the riser and called my wife into the room and had her rotate the cam with out the mod as I kept pressure on the string, luckily it worked but it was pretty scary.


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## ELKhuntR (Feb 5, 2006)

a lock up is pretty much this, and forgive me if I don't have all the details but you'll understand at least what is happening. I drew the bow back and at full draw the cams seized up, or locked, limbs completely stressed beyond parallel, and me holding the string loosely in my hands. it's a wierd feeling, anyways, the bow is pretty much in a 100-percent letoff position. you have no holding weight yet, the limbs are bent beyond parallel, and the limbs are held pretty much together by the buss cable. 


this is a pretty tough job to handle with a portable bowpress and any press for that matter. bowtech recommended a sure loc bowpress but I don't hae one nor the shop i was going to And i'm not a small guy but this seemed a little too out of my league. I for one thought it was my fault and unfortunatley, this is my second time dealing with this. The first time was my fault I think on an allegiance, the second time, no mistake was made by me according to Bowtechs engineer. I simply made a minor adjustment to the draw stop which on the 06s, your able to do. 

I don't recommend it on a bow with a 30-inch draw length though or at least speak with a bowtech pro shop guy and make sure. My bow felt like it was 65%. By adjusting that draw stop pep it should adjust the letoff as well. I did that and it locked up. The key thing is I think, is that bow was a 30-inch draw length. I shoot 28.5. When I drew back, I possibly could have torqued the cam or string due to the lenght difference and caused it to over rotate or have a cable slip over. I've heard they've made revisions to the first modules on the cams.

The matter has been solved and I'll post some pics when i get a chance. The bow has been dismantled by request from Bowtech; I put it into a big plastic dog house and put a buck knife on a pipe and stepped to the side, and cut the string. The limbs didnt' crack or anything, the cams are still in tact, just the string and cable broken. The limbs and riser look great. Their was some cam leaning going on when the bow was strung and locked but they look alright. I wouldn't want to shoot them though, I bet the axles could be damaged. 

The bow is being sent back and I'm getting a new tribute in max-4. Looking forward to the new camo but I hate to see such a nice bow not used properly. I still love Bowtech's. I have my Diamond on standby until the new one comes. 



Pat, where are you buddy. I emailed you. Must be at another rodeo,


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## Myk (Nov 19, 2003)

NM_HighPlains said:


> Excuse my dumb question, but what is "lock-up"? I've never heard of this until I started reading these forums and haven't seen a good explanation yet.
> 
> Can a Hoyt Cam/2 "lock-up"?


No, it won't happen with your Hoyt.


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## Jorge Oliveira (Aug 13, 2004)

NM_HighPlains said:


> Excuse my dumb question, but what is "lock-up"? I've never heard of this until I started reading these forums and haven't seen a good explanation yet.
> 
> Can a Hoyt Cam/2 "lock-up"?


I understand lock up occurs only with the binary cams.
The cam rotates too much and moves to a way out position and 'locks' there.


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## BowKil (Mar 19, 2005)

Myk said:


> No, it won't happen with your Hoyt.


I have seen it happen on a Hoyt bow, but it was with spiral cams. What had happened was that the draw stop peg rotated past the buss cable and locked up at full draw. It was an easy fix though, I just sat down, put one foot on the lower limb pocket and another foot on the other limb pocket, hed the strin back and had a buddy move the cable back around the draw stop. It was caused by the custom string/cable (vapor trail I think) being too thin. We just shimmed out the draw stop pin with a couple of very small washers and it fixed the problem.


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## ELKhuntR (Feb 5, 2006)

BowKil said:


> I have seen it happen on a Hoyt bow, but it was with spiral cams. What had happened was that the draw stop peg rotated past the buss cable and locked up at full draw. It was an easy fix though, I just sat down, put one foot on the lower limb pocket and another foot on the other limb pocket, hed the strin back and had a buddy move the cable back around the draw stop. It was caused by the custom string/cable (vapor trail I think) being too thin. We just shimmed out the draw stop pin with a couple of very small washers and it fixed the problem.



I couldn't talk my girlfriend into helping and honestly don't know if I have the huevos to try myself. 

Glad to hear you had better luck


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## Dave Nowlin (May 21, 2003)

Folks don't seem to understand what happens when these bows lock up. It's sort of like standing astraddle of a fence. The bottom cam breaks over center and the top cam is stopped by the draw stop. The bottom cam is trying to rotate in one direction and the top cam is trying to rotate in the other. If the bottom cam is just barely overrotated and you try to put it in a bow press and bump it just right in the process the bottom can can rotate just enough that both cams are going in the same direction. When this happens a dry fire is the result. Sometimes both limbs, the cams and the cables are ruined. All this is caused by ******ing the cam with the draw stop too much relative to the other cam. This is what puts them on opposite sides of the hill.
Dave Nowlin


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## Featherfletched (Jan 31, 2004)

why would you need eggs? (huevos):noidea: :noidea: :loco: :loco:


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## Bushman (Nov 25, 2003)

Now this worries me! I have just bought a 100# 2006 Tribute with the bianary cam system - I have a 30 inch draw on it and I adjusted the stopper slightly - I feel very uneasy after reading this thread - why would Bowtech make a bow that allows this "lock up" to occur? 

Surely this is dangerous and if so why are there no counter instructions on how to deal with this or no warning of this prior to purchase?


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## debowhunter (Jan 18, 2006)

the 06 draw mods were redesigned to prevent lockup.


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## ELKhuntR (Feb 5, 2006)

Bushman said:


> Now this worries me! I have just bought a 100# 2006 Tribute with the bianary cam system - I have a 30 inch draw on it and I adjusted the stopper slightly - I feel very uneasy after reading this thread - why would Bowtech make a bow that allows this "lock up" to occur?
> 
> Surely this is dangerous and if so why are there no counter instructions on how to deal with this or no warning of this prior to purchase?




Sorry to start the scare, but at least you know about it. And I agree, there really isn't a good answer or conclusion on what to do when it becomes locked. Maybe it's my slim bow tuning and mechanical skills, but it seemed a little too out of my league to want to do it myself. I'd recommend calling bowtech and explain to them the module that you have. Make sure you have the new and improved module so this doesn't happen to you. I'd hate to have a 100 pounder lock up on me. It was scary enough with the 70-pounder.


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## ELKhuntR (Feb 5, 2006)

Dave Nowlin said:


> Folks don't seem to understand what happens when these bows lock up. It's sort of like standing astraddle of a fence. The bottom cam breaks over center and the top cam is stopped by the draw stop. The bottom cam is trying to rotate in one direction and the top cam is trying to rotate in the other. If the bottom cam is just barely overrotated and you try to put it in a bow press and bump it just right in the process the bottom can can rotate just enough that both cams are going in the same direction. When this happens a dry fire is the result. Sometimes both limbs, the cams and the cables are ruined. All this is caused by ******ing the cam with the draw stop too much relative to the other cam. This is what puts them on opposite sides of the hill.
> Dave Nowlin



Thanks for all the great info Dave. Greatly appreciated.


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## bullrambler (Mar 11, 2006)

*Binary Cam lock-up*

Is this a problem for all the BT bows?, longer draws lengths?, particular models?


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