# Gillo ILF fitment issue



## LaurieC (Feb 27, 2017)

I just received a new Gillo GQ23 riser, and I'm having limb fitment issues. Getting my Uukha EX1 Evo2's to seat properly in the limb pockets is a real struggle, and once they are in all the way, I almost can't get them back off. These limbs fit easily on two other risers that I have, so I don't think the limbs are the problem. I can't tell if the problem is with the dovetail or the limb bolt, but something is obviously too tight. Has anyone else had a similar issue with a Gillo riser?


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## Dillinger1 (Aug 14, 2017)

Have had the same issue with Uukha limbs and Gillo risers. Not a big deal. On mine it was the part of the limb that sits around the limb bolt. What I did is sand lightly the slot on the limb until it just clears the limb bolt. I did this with an arrow shaft and some stick on 120gr sand paper. Stick the paper around the arrow shaft and sand evenly and test fit often.


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## buzzycos (Mar 31, 2016)

Someone posted this on the Facebook barebow group in response to the same issue. I’m Not a Gillo user but thought I’d pass it on


https://www.facebook.com/keith.macduff/videos/10156017973243794/



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## Bob Furman (May 16, 2012)

Remove limb bolts and see if you can slide it into the limb bolt slot of each limb.



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## reddogge (Jul 21, 2009)

I had the same issue but solved it with some judicious filing of the slot walls with a small file. When I measured the opening it was a few thousands too small. It's an easy fix. Take the fitting out of the bow first though.


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## stick monkey (Mar 9, 2015)

I'm just not sure that you should be sanding on the limbs ...unless you're going to reapply some clearcoat.


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## chrstphr (Nov 23, 2005)

The U in the limbs does not need clear coat. If its there and binding the limb in the tiller bolt, it is perfectly fine to sand it away.

Many limbs have been sanded there to fit into ILF risers with no issues. I personally have sanded 10-20 myself in our JOAD. 


Chris


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## stick monkey (Mar 9, 2015)

anywhere that can let in moisture is bad...if your taking it down to raw materials...that to me is bad especially if you have wood core limbs...the uukhas aren't...but this problem with the gillo bolts is ongoing and it isn't right...you shouldn't have to file or sand on your new bow to make it fit


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

String wax.


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

As said many times, ILF is everything but a real standard, so we use our own "average" standard , that is very similar also for other Italian makers.

Limbs bolts: 9.50 mm +0.05 -0.10
Dovetail slot: 11.00 mm +0.1 - 0.05 

If parts meet above measures, then you have ot look to limbs. 

Limbs in the market we have measured have U size going from 9.35 to 9.6
Majority of limbs dovetail bolts are <11.00, but some old ones can go up to 11.50
Some cheap limbs have the bolts not tall enough or not parrallel to limbs, to allow proper insertion.
Then, pin springs in some cases are really too stiff, making also difficult to extract and insert limbs (and damaging riser dovetail slot, so remove the spring and cut some part of it to solve) 

In this situation, we prefer to offer average tight couplings than loose ones. Tight coupling can be adjusted easily, while a loose one can generate a nightmare in use.


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## reddogge (Jul 21, 2009)

I agree. Tight is an easy fix. Loose would be horrible.


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## luckman88 (Nov 11, 2017)

FWIW I found my Gillo G2 had a very tight fit with some SF Archery limbs initially until I removed them several times. Now it’s a snug fit that feels secure. As above, I’d rather this scenario than too loose.


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## MartinOttosson (May 31, 2011)

A tight fit normally gets perfect after a period of wear. A sloppy fit stays sloppy and is hard to fix. As always, Gillo´s and Vittorios decisions are well motivated and it is for sure better to keep things to the tighter part of the ILF "standard interval". 

I would suggest that you first loosen all four alignment screws a turn each. Do not shoot with them loose however. This is just to test the fit. Then apply some lip balm or similar grease to the u slot of the limb and set and reset the limb a couple of times. Then retighten the aligment so you just lock the screws, but do not overtighten them. This should make things easier.


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## bobnikon (Jun 10, 2012)

It is always my concern with this particular issue. Everyone jumps on and says glowing things, and easy fix, just sand the u slot a little, or lubricate. But I have had a number of Gillo pass through my hands and all save one had a tight bolt. A couple only had one tight bolt. So obviously the spec is flexible. So sand the u slot... sure. But as the OP said, the limbs fit fine on 2 other risers. So I guess you have to risk sloppy (or sloppier) fit on your other two risers to get a good fit on one. Interesting. I found some emery cloth on the bolt fit my purposes better. Was surprised it was an issue given the rest of the riser. But we have been told it is "in spec" so all is good. 

Cheers


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

A couple of years ago I tried to start a discussion with a manufacturer of both ILF limbs and risers about the need to reach agreement among makers to transform ILF in a real standard with published specs. But answer was immediately "our limbs fit our risers, we don't see any need to discuss about our internal standard". 
Manufacturer was one of those making bolts to the smaller limits and their limbs U was therefore much smaller than average in the market. Apparently they were not interested to the fact that as of this, their limbs were almost not selling at all to all those buying Italian made risers . Their choice. Can't imagine to discuss with ALL limbs and risers amnufacturers about establishing a real ILF standard ... impossible. 
So we have decided to publish our specs and stick with them, at least to offer a clear mechanical reference to all buyers (and other makers too, if they want to follow).


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## theminoritydude (Feb 11, 2013)

Someone needs to have some grease......to loosen up.


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## MariaF (Dec 28, 2018)

Really hoping you guys are still on here. Also having trouble with my new Gillo 23" riser and the limb fitment. Bottom limb is okay, but the top one is a real tight fit also to the point that the limb was totally stuck and my partner and I had to pull it apart. I am using SF foam/fibre limbs 28lbs. I have tried 2 sets of limbs both with the same problem, top limb too tight. I loosened the grub screws slightly as per the Gillo manual and shot with it just before Christmas. I had to stop after an hour as the bow was vibrating so much it didn't feel safe. All of the grub screws were loose when I removed the limbs and the limb plate was wobbling around. I also lost one of the screws (have now got replacements) I was reluctant to file down the "U" in the limbs as these are not a tight fit. My partner used feeler gauges to see where the fit was tight and it was just above the limb poundage sticker and below the limb bolt on the limb. In desperation my partner has filed this away and the "U", the fit is still tight, so we have now resorted to loosening off the grub screws and using Thread Lock (as per the manual). I'm now waiting for this to dry and will shoot it tomorrow. I'm really disappointed that we are having these problems. It is also not the only problem I am having. Brace height is questionable. I use short limbs so 64" bow. Manual says brace height 7.25" to 8". Totally impossible with a 64" string with no twists (just over 8") and the bow is vibrating all over the place, hence the grub screws coming out. 66" string too long. I have now found one of my old strings and we have managed to set the brace height to 7.75". I'm hoping tomorrow I won't have any vibration issues. I have used Hoyt 23", SF Forged+ 23" and Mybo Rio 23" risers and have had no problems with any of these risers and limb fitment or brace height of 8.5"). If I have problems tomorrow I think I'm going to give up and send it back  sorry this post is so long, just not sure what else I can do? reluctant to buy new limbs for this riser in case I have the same problem.


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## roman (Sep 28, 2014)

Vittorio said:


> As said many times, ILF is everything but a real standard, so we use our own "average" standard , that is very similar also for other Italian makers.
> [...]
> Some cheap limbs have the bolts not tall enough or not parrallel to limbs, to allow proper insertion.
> [...]


Hello Maria,
I think this is the problem in your case. With many cheap SF limbs the bolt simply is too short, I have also had this problem with SF limbs on a Hoyt GMX, they seem to have very poor tolerances for the cheap limbs. You can check this easily be turning the limb around so that the bolt is facing away from the bow. If it fits easily then the problem is not the width of the slot, but the bolt of the limb. The quick and dirty fix is to remove the screw, the spring and the pin from the bolt and push it out about 1mm (might need considerable force, I had to improvise a press with a vise), then reassemble. Good luck!


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## roman (Sep 28, 2014)

This is how it should look like after the modification


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## Crunch (Nov 28, 2002)

Curious. If the limb bolts are to short why is the lower limb fit fine and the top very tight?


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## Crunch (Nov 28, 2002)

I don’t know if this helps. There is a video on Facebook regarding loosening the lateral adjustment screws. Apparently not an uncommon problem.


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## Crunch (Nov 28, 2002)

Did you try mounting the lower limb in the upper limb pocket?
You may end up having to try the limb fitting fix.


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## MariaF (Dec 28, 2018)

Thanks all for your comments and help. If after my shoot in a little while, I still have a problem I'll try the limb bolt fix from Roman  . Also, I did try the bottom limb in the top and it fit with no problem. It's just odd that this is a problem only with the top limb pocket and I have tried 2 sets of SF limbs 26lb and 28lb and the bottom ones each fit the top limb pocket no problem. I'll get back a bit later after I had a test of it as hopefully the thread lock should be dry now. Thank you :smile:


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## MariaF (Dec 28, 2018)

Have had a bit of a shoot in the garden and the thread lock seems to be holding okay. Will be giving it a proper shoot later at the club (in the dry). Not too much limb wobble, certainly nowhere near what it was, so I'm hopeful that this has worked in the short term but will definitely do the limb bolt fix at a later date if it works itself free again. Thanks for the picture it is really helpful. Have to say it was really smooth to shoot so I really don't want to give up on this riser. Thanks Roman and Crunch for helping I really appreciate it. :nod:


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## Crunch (Nov 28, 2002)

MariaF,
Hope it works out. There's nothing more frustrating than a troublesome bow.


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

I got a G2 a year ago. My top limb was always very snug with my Win&Win Winact limbs, to the point that it was difficult to seat it fully. These limbs always fit perfectly fine on my other risers.

I tried the limb alignment grub screw re-tightening method from that Facebook video. It did nothing in my case. 

The upper limb fit too tightly in both limb pockets though, so it turns out in my case it was the upper limb groove. I put some sandpaper on a dowel and sanded only just enough to make it so that the limb fit properly. It took very little effort and very, very little sanding to resolve the issue. It's all smooth sailing now. I may put some string wax on the areas I sanded as theminoritydude suggests, but the sanding was so minimal I don't know that it'll be needed. 

Despite the limb fit issue, I really like my G2. It's not Gillo's fault that ILF limb manufacturers don't want to agree on an official standard.

- Kent W.


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## kinseduk (Mar 29, 2019)

My equipment is Gillo g2 and W&W Winex, and I have the same issue: limbs are fit and release correctly but with a bit of force.
The facebook video did nothing to me as well.



williamskg6 said:


> ... so it turns out in my case it was the upper limb groove.


Could you describe or share a photo of what kind of groove it is, please?


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## williamskg6 (Dec 21, 2008)

Perhaps the word "groove" is the source of confusion here. On ILF limbs there is a slot into which the limb bolt slides. I sanded the inside surface of the slot until the limb inserts with less force. I only took off just enough to make it so the limb goes in without excess force. It is still fairly snug but does not take a big push to insert or a big pull to remove. The sanding was very, very minimal. I would sand a tiny bit, then test it, then sand a bit more, then test it. You don't want to take off very much material. You also want to make sure you are sanding as close to perpendicular to the limb surface as possible, so you are taking uniform amounts of material off.

Here's a photo of an ILF fitting showing where I sanded: 









I hope this helps!


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Two fitment issues can be limb fork (pic above) and the dovetail pocket on the riser. I've seen and had both. Both are very simple to remedy. As above, a light sanding of the limb fork can fix that issue. I always follow up with string wax to seal the limb fork and to lubricate that joint. 

The dovetail pocket can be a bit trickier, but I used a small round metal file on the dovetail pocket on my Gillo risers and that problem was solved in less than 3 minutes. 

The ILF system - as noted - is not standardized. 90% of the time you won't have any issues and the other 10% of the time, the problems are easily solved by anyone with the least amount of mechanical skill. If a person can't fix these issues themselves or have someone readily available to fix it for them, they probably aren't going to get far in a sport that involves as much equipment as ours does.


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## stevelong (Jan 13, 2010)

williamskg6 said:


> Perhaps the word "groove" is the source of confusion here. On ILF limbs there is a slot into which the limb bolt slides. I sanded the inside surface of the slot until the limb inserts with less force. I only took off just enough to make it so the limb goes in without excess force. It is still fairly snug but does not take a big push to insert or a big pull to remove. The sanding was very, very minimal. I would sand a tiny bit, then test it, then sand a bit more, then test it. You don't want to take off very much material. You also want to make sure you are sanding as close to perpendicular to the limb surface as possible, so you are taking uniform amounts of material off.
> 
> Here's a photo of an ILF fitting showing where I sanded:
> 
> ...


your picture shows a limb butt slot....where you sanded...not an ILF fitting.....where you sanded.....there's another possible source of confusion.....


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## Vittorio (Jul 17, 2003)

limbwalker said:


> Two fitment issues can be limb fork (pic above) and the dovetail pocket on the riser. I've seen and had both. Both are very simple to remedy. As above, a light sanding of the limb fork can fix that issue. I always follow up with string wax to seal the limb fork and to lubricate that joint.
> 
> The dovetail pocket can be a bit trickier, but I used a small round metal file on the dovetail pocket on my Gillo risers and that problem was solved in less than 3 minutes.
> 
> The ILF system - as noted - is not standardized. 90% of the time you won't have any issues and the other 10% of the time, the problems are easily solved by anyone with the least amount of mechanical skill. If a person can't fix these issues themselves or have someone readily available to fix it for them, they probably aren't going to get far in a sport that involves as much equipment as ours does.



John, more we explain this, and more objection and questions we get. And of course there are other tens of risers in the maket with same issues with tens of kinds of limbs, but no one wants to hear, no one wants to use a calliper to find out were the problem, if any, comes from, no one understands that 0.05 mm tolerance of warnish thickness may make limbs not fitting on any riser and viceversa. 
Another maker once told me that at a certain moment they have been so tired of these complains that to avoid them they have decided to change the size of the slot and the size of the bolt to in a way to be able to accept any limb in the market. Of course this was giving stability problem to many, but he said, if the market wants crap prodcuts, we give them crap products and everyone is happy. We don''t.


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## limbwalker (Sep 26, 2003)

Vittorio said:


> John, more we explain this, and more objection and questions we get. And of course there are other tens of risers in the maket with same issues with tens of kinds of limbs, but no one wants to hear, no one wants to use a calliper to find out were the problem, if any, comes from, no one understands that 0.05 mm tolerance of warnish thickness may make limbs not fitting on any riser and viceversa.
> Another maker once told me that at a certain moment they have been so tired of these complains that to avoid them they have decided to change the size of the slot and the size of the bolt to in a way to be able to accept any limb in the market. Of course this was giving stability problem to many, but he said, if the market wants crap prodcuts, we give them crap products and everyone is happy. We don''t.


I understand. Mine wasn't a complaint at all however. I would much rather have tight tolerances I can hand-fit if need be, than sloppy tolerances I can do nothing about.


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## tim.long (Jul 4, 2015)

Vittorio said:


> As said many times, ILF is everything but a real standard, so we use our own "average" standard , that is very similar also for other Italian makers.
> 
> Limbs bolts: 9.50 mm +0.05 -0.10
> Dovetail slot: 11.00 mm +0.1 - 0.05
> ...


This is the feedback I have:
If you have designed your bolts for some average spacing from the limbs you measured, and since you don't currently make limbs, then whose limbs do fit then? I think that would be useful to publish, so people aren't playing a guessing game each time they buy limbs for your risers.

Similar gripes for arrow shaft makers who don't make their own nocks, pins,points and then don't provide information on which ones you can use.


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## PNWMaker (Feb 7, 2019)

tim.long said:


> This is the feedback I have:
> If you have designed your bolts for some average spacing from the limbs you measured, and since you don't currently make limbs, then whose limbs do fit then? I think that would be useful to publish, so people aren't playing a guessing game each time they buy limbs for your risers.
> 
> Similar gripes for arrow shaft makers who don't make their own nocks, pins,points and then don't provide information on which ones you can use.


https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3153402 doing this from my phone so I hope the link works, but here’s an old post about the g1-27, Vittorio mentioned a short list of brands that explicitly work 


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## tim.long (Jul 4, 2015)

PNWMaker said:


> https://www.archerytalk.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3153402 doing this from my phone so I hope the link works, but here’s an old post about the g1-27, Vittorio mentioned a short list of brands that explicitly work
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Perfect


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## PaulME (Jun 11, 2014)

Interesting that people keep going back to the riser manufacture - as stated by Vittorio it’s not a true standard!
Mechanical bits have manufacturing tolerances that’s not going to change. Here is a potential solution to the issue, limb makers should supply bolts that fit with their limbs. Except now we could have different threads in some risers, different thread lengths or locking systems etc (frankly I don’t know the answer to these details). Riser makers could produce alternative bolts at plus minus tolerances to allow people to custom fit, but I have no idea if there is a real market for that, would not be that big a deal but minimum orders would be the initial issue.
Also as has been pointed out it seems like the comments are it’s to tight but no real measurements. If they are producing parts to .05mm tolerances (for the non metric inclined that’s about .002) you really need to measure with micrometers down in that range to get repeatable measurements.

So We are living with a sport that does not have a real standard - live with it.


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## ryan b. (Sep 1, 2005)

PaulME said:


> Interesting that people keep going back to the riser manufacture - as stated by Vittorio it’s not a true standard!
> Mechanical bits have manufacturing tolerances that’s not going to change. Here is a potential solution to the issue, limb makers should supply bolts that fit with their limbs. Except now we could have different threads in some risers, different thread lengths or locking systems etc (frankly I don’t know the answer to these details). Riser makers could produce alternative bolts at plus minus tolerances to allow people to custom fit, but I have no idea if there is a real market for that, would not be that big a deal but minimum orders would be the initial issue.
> Also as has been pointed out it seems like the comments are it’s to tight but no real measurements. If they are producing parts to .05mm tolerances (for the non metric inclined that’s about .002) you really need to measure with micrometers down in that range to get repeatable measurements.
> 
> So We are living with a sport that does not have a real standard - live with it.


Border archery makes various sized ILF dovetail limb bushings you can swap out if you need a different size for tighter/looser fit.


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